I think the points shoud be clear enough now. If the discussions here continues with alway the same beeing said more times, i may consider to block!
Anyway .. I think i've made clear, that i personally don't like everything in the universe of Desteni. But for me it's still a big source of Inspiration!
@RoterMax Ah, let the children play. Besides, those who are deceptive will always be exposed by the light of truth and simple mathematics. Thanks for the video and the place for intellectual discourse.
RoterMax, seems to have a vendetta against Desteni and voices himself widely, though that is purely of his and Desteni's accord. I've heard the Hitler references he's citing and see them to be misinterpreted(mainly through bias and ego) and misrepresented because of ignor(e)ance. They've referred to Hitler as the greatest activist because he saw a world that he could change, envisioned the way he wanted it and then obtained it(to a certain degree). I've never heard them condone WHAT he did.
@seraphimra There is also a mentioning that 'we', as each individual, are worse than Hitler--This is accredited to the social apathy or further ignor(e)ance which is willfully perpetuated. Gandhi influenced the world through non-violent peaceful resistance, Hitler through genoncide and dogma, then it naturally follows that each one has the same potential. Taking responsibility for self, directing self, and honoring life is ancient knowledge/wisdom which predates Desteni.
@seraphimra Poolman claims Hitler "acted out of love for his people": - /watch?v=cQj6qHkk6FE
"Hitler had it. He showed, and have a look, Hitler’s fight was not with the Jews as persons, but with the 'Jewish nature of Man' as a 'Jewish Principle', that is not here, Best for Man, but it here 'best for greed', at a personal level. So, we have to take out the 'Jewish Principle of Profit' from the Human Nature." - Bernard Poolman, "The Jew in Every Man is a Zionist" - /watch?v=HeL0vCsviZc
@0rdoTempliAurora Yes, I've seen this video. I believe you are convoluting what is intended. To quote Johann van Goethe, "People in society would not talk so much if they knew how often they misunderstood one another." Though I don't agree that this is a 'Jewish Principle' persay, it is an invitation to have a look at the stereotypical associations between Jewish people and frugal money tendencies.
@0rdoTempliAurora You are making projections as to what he should've said, to suit your ears, and saying that combating the principle of greed is anti-Semitism..this is one interpretation, quite frankly, your interpretation. Blatant would be Mel Gibson, this is more akin to telling a mother her child is on fire, because she doesn't pay attention, to bring her back to the now and out of the mind, which says "I am Jewish. I am Christian. I, me, mine." Doesn't matter if tru, just if it's effective
@seraphimra No, Poolman has very clearly identified greed with the Jewish people. There is no need for me or anyone else to interpret or 'project' as you put it. That is what he actually said:
"He showed, and have a look, Hitler’s fight was not with the Jews as persons, but with the 'Jewish nature of Man' as a 'Jewish Principle', that is not here, Best for Man, but it here 'best for greed', at a personal level."
@0rdoTempliAurora Exactly, 'He showed, and have a look, Hitler's fight was not with the Jews as persons...' This is not associating greed to a specific people but to the principle that was, albeit poorly dubbed "Jewish nature of man or Jewish Principle". Referring to a subjective aspect of the consciousness system which has been perpetuated through people using the 'Jewish Principle'--perhaps better stated as the 'Greed Principle'. In the context of Hitler it would be the 'Jewish Principle'.
@seraphimra To call the Jewish 'principle' the 'greed principle' is antisemitic, obviously. To do so in the context of a discussion whereby it has already been stated that 'Hitler was the only one with any common sense' only underlines that fact.
To pretend otherwise, as you are doing, suggests you wish it weren't so. Sorry, but Poolman's statements are antisemitic, and to call for the redemption of Hitler as Poolman has done is also antisemitic.
@0rdoTempliAurora The Jewish principle is not the greed principle, I said it should've been called the Greed Principle to avoid confusion, not to alledge that all Jews are greedy-that is an insane critique. Common sense, in that context, refers to one having the sense to know how to change his reality. Once again, not condoning the genocide or stereotyping of a specific race so much as an quality that Hitler associated with Jews. When in this realm, Hitler was corrupt, after death you're 'awake'
@seraphimra At the risk of repeating myself, according to Poolman the Jewish principle is the greed principle, as he's said himself.
You have made a poor attempt at excusing Poolman's admiration for Hitler by pretending he's said something else. He wrote a book called 'I Am Hitler', theme of which is Poolman redeeming Hitler in the afterlife.
Let's not forget, even without Poolman's fawning over Hitler, Desteni is still a fascist organisation.
@0rdoTempliAurora I seek not to excuse nor justify Poolman's comments, just to provide another view point and interpretation. Explain, if you will, how is Desteni fascist? If there is any discrimination, I would find myself morally opposed to it. But, I've interpreted nothing in the way of racism or promoting racist mentalities. They espouse equality-that none are inferior or superior- in this way your accusations fall apart because, practical applications of equality would prevent this.
@seraphimra Racism is not a prerequisite for fascism or totalitarianism. Desteni is a dictatorship. No free speech is allowed. They try to censor opposition and use propaganda for their antidemocratic cause. They support microchipping. They condemn non-Desteni people as unworthy of life. Need I go on? It's in the videos on 0rdoTempliAurora. Desteni has nothing to do with equality, it is a thought reform cult run as a hierarchy. 'Equality' is just a hook.
@0rdoTempliAurora To an extent, Hitler did act out of 'love' but this sentiment is more akin to the current paradigm surrounding love, which is really 'I love you if...'. Circumstantial love is not love at all. Perhaps Poolman could've worded it to be less enigmatic, for those unfamiliar with linguistics, however, it is also possible that it was perfectly worded as he's provoking investigation and introspective self-inquiry about the connotations surrounding words like 'Love, Hitler, Jews, etc.'
@seraphimra Taking his people into a war against the rest of the world to destroy Jews was 'love for his people'? Funny kind of love.
In relation to Hitler, Bernard Poolman seeks to redeem him. He has written reams of text about it. He also recommends Hitler's economic policies.
To abstract the issue to make it seem like Poolman is suggesting some enigmatic method of 'self-inquiry' which can only be understood by linguistics experts is grasping at straws.
@0rdoTempliAurora Surely, you would believe so, but none-the-less, those without knowledge of syntex, semantics, semiotics would easily dismiss the message, as you have, and not seek any 'hidden' meaning. I've already stated that his 'love' isn't actual love but a distortion of reality manifested through his opinions, beliefs, thoughts, ideas, etc. Everyone deserves a chance for recitivism and catharsis, even Hitler~he is a product of this world and his potential lives in us all for good or ill.
@seraphimra Anyone with any knowledge of basic grammar can see that Poolman is incapable of speaking or writing grammatically and is misusing basic concepts of the English language to suit his agenda, which is as I said to redeem Hitler.
There is practically not one single sentence on the Desteni website that is written in the correct grammar, and you are talking about 'linguistics', as though Poolman was some genius when it comes to language. That is a joke.
@0rdoTempliAurora I doubt that english is Poolman's native tongue, judging by the way he speaks, so certain inadequacies will arise. However, this does not diminish the poetic use of phrases and words. You have an obvious personal bias and stake in this which is bleeding over into your interactions with others. Redemption for Hitler as an aspect of ourselves-the desire to pursue our own agenda at the cost of others- is a worthy agenda(i.e. self-forgiveness)
@seraphimra Now you're saying Poolman speaks in poetic phrases. That's even more of a joke. The man is a philistine who's read too many New Age books. He's from South Africa by the way, plenty of South Africans are quite capable of speaking and writing perfect English. I fail to see how in order to redeem yourself you have to apologise for Hitler and be antisemitic.
Hitler is not an 'aspect' of anyone, he was himself.
@0rdoTempliAurora Your inability to comprehend is disconcerting. Your bias seems to stem from a belief that some beings are promoting anti-semitism and you've a personal stake in whether they do or not. Seems that you're searching to see what you want rather than use the other references to gain perspective. The Hitler Aspect=Pursuing ones agenda at the cost or with disregard for others. This quality is in us all, whether you admit it or not, we all have the potential to be Hitler or Jesus
@seraphimra I comprehend everything you say, don't try and patronise me. Some "beings" are promoting antisemitism. Last time that was done on a mass scale, millions of people got murdered and you're suggesting one should not have a personal stake in the matter. Hitler was not just someone who selfishly pursued an agenda at the cost of others. He was a genocidal, racist maniac. That quality is in very, very few.
We do not "have the potential to be Hitler or Jesus", we ARE ourselves.
@0rdoTempliAurora Then you are caught in feedback loops and delusion. Let me ask you this, who are you? Who am I? but series of informational packets squeezed into a body and into the span of a lifetime. Everything you know is given to you, as it was given to Jesus, Hitler, Gandhi, etc. We are the produces of this world. Granted each may have a specific blueprint, but you can read astrological horoscopes to see the inherent qualitative aspects that each sign represents in each of us.
@0rdoTempliAurora Claiming that we are unique is a frivolous and erroneous statement. You and I and everyone else have been conditions through social hypnosis to be who we are today. The only variations come, when these simplistic patterns converge, creating more 'sophisticated or complex' patterns. Meaning, Hitler + Society + Life Experiences = the Hitler that you know. Replace Hitler with you or I and we could've been the exact same, but this is purely speculative.
@0rdoTempliAurora That we are not these figures, in specific, is irrelevant and deters from the intended meaning. We all have the potential to be anything, good or ill, supportive of life or destroyers of life. I see what you mean, regarding the heirarchical structure of Desteni and have wondered, myself, if their motives are less than geniune or merely disguised a nefarious agenda....this has yet to be fully realized. I shall investigate further your claims, but never-the-less (part 1)
@seraphimra (cont.) Find that the stance of RoterMax, is akin to my own. If it is a hook, then it is a damn persuasive one and a respectable one. If they prove to be insidiously influencing people to...say, kill themselves or others, I would never partake and would, in fact, oppose them. But this is all speculation, pending further review. It would be non-sense to take you at your biased word. Philosophically, Desteni iterates principles which are admirable and necessary for a Utopian society.
@0rdoTempliAurora Put off, initially, by the microchip I wondered what motive could be there to promote this 'solution'. The more I look at those in this world who will not stand up for life, the more I consider it a viable option. Wouldn't you implant Hitler with a microchip if it could've prevented the atrocities?
@seraphimra Enforced microchipping is totalitarian, it could not stop Nazi atrocities. "Stand up for life" is jargon indicating loyalty to the lies of charlatan and bigot, Bernard Poolman and the "microchip solution" one of his stupid opinions. Those who do his pseudoscientific SRAT courses have to hand over their ID cards. He wants total control over anyone who joins his "Desteni". If you want to be dominated by a trickster like Poolman that's your problem, just don't recommend it to others.
@0rdoTempliAurora There would be no enforcing of anything, that is not already kin to the current judicial system. One would undergo tests to determine if they 'qualify' for and desire a microchip. This tool could send electrical stimuli to the centers of the brain which would inhibit production of certain 'anger' chemicals, thereby diffusing the threat to life. Whether you wish to belittle the philosophy or not is none of my concern. What about being forced to get ID cards in the first place?
@Goldkehlchen20 Perhaps it could be used to curb the hostile nature of all beings on the planet...this is a possibility. Or using the H.A.A.R.P. military facility, in Alaska, to release energetic vibrations(LFV and HFV) to disrupt the biochemical processes which create hostility and anger. Though this should be a absolute last resort. People have 'awoken' before and stood in the face of adversity, to push humanity further, there is no reason we cannot control ourselves, as we should.
@Goldkehlchen20 Animals are much more conscious than we give them credit for. Their entrainment with nature is uncanny and could be a definitive particular in 'returning to nature'. Also, who knows what technology will yield in the coming centuries.
@Goldkehlchen20 Simple, animals brains operate on a frequency which is 'in harmony' with natural rythyms(eat, sleep, shit, etc.). Within this function, the animals primal brain has access to various forms of what we call reality(bat=sonar, snakes=infrared). Technology could and probably will play a massive role in developing better and safer methods of assistance. Use your imagination and creativity, I'm sure you can answer your own question.
@Goldkehlchen20 Wrong, one asks questions of others because they've given up on ascertaining the truth for themselves. Your mind has infinite potentiality and all the answers you could require. Differences are few except in size and function. Humans have a frontal cortex which is larger than other animals, which enables such things as contemplation, directive action, vast communications, technological savvy-ness, etc. Assistance is assistance- the definition is sufficient.
@seraphimra I ask questions because answering them myself is terribly onesided. My way of seeing things is not the only way and that of others is always to be considered as equal.
The definition of assistance is not sufficient just because you stated it. What is assistance for one might be overbearing for another.
How comes you tell me I am 'wrong' if you said before I should answer the questions myself... if I have the authority given by you to determine reality how can I be 'wrong' then?
@Goldkehlchen20 'Wrong/Erroneous' Is the belief that you do not have sufficient means by which to ascertain answers outside of collaborative efforts. If all are equal then you possess equal faculties to be able to properly decipher reality. Assistance is assistance, one's perception of where assistance becomes interference is subjective and does not sully the original definition. There is no 'authority' as an outside influence. You either maintain self-directive principles within whats best 4all
@seraphimra Well you just created your own backdoor there... 'IF all are equal'. Either they are or they are not. You said I was wrong.
If there is no objective force to decide what assistence is, the definition of it is subjective and therefore the statement 'assistence is assistence' becomes meaningless for the definitions might alter.
What is your definition of 'all' I'm curious if it's only a selfish 'everyone who thinks like me' or rather 'everyone regardless of what they believe or do'?
@Goldkehlchen20 Equality exists beyond dualities, such as wrong/right, when lived as a principle. It is something that must be lived and realized. Assistance would be up to the individual, whom is educated in the ways of self-honesty, self-forgiveness, and self-directiveness, living as life to do what is best for all. Facing self and uncovering the deception of conditioning and ego, so that we can actively pursue creating a 'Heaven' on earth. With our hand, each one who chooses to stand, we can.
@seraphimra You could as well just have said 'I only mean those who think and act like me'...
Why does equality need to have conditions? How is it a principle that exists beyond dualities, if it has to be bought by the use of certain phrases and behaviourpatterns?
@Goldkehlchen20 Equality comes down to mathematics and conditions necessary to produce and effective application of a 'preferred state'. When lived as a principle, each other life form is considered equally, thereby creating a system of checks and balances and accountability. Thus, for 'things' that live, life is a preferred state, given that there is not mental delusions(melancholy, bliss). Heaven is not innately a dualist concept but a preferred state where all are treated with dignity.
Life is the preferred state of flesh-eating bacteries, even though you might not want them on your face they need to be considered equally. Who wins you or them?
Heaven is a word relating to a mind-construct that you used on purpose to create a certain image in me on reading it. So examine: what was your intention to use the word in the first place??
@Goldkehlchen20 At the moment, life is in a system where the practicality of equality is impossible, as some must consume others to survive. Though this predicament exists, that should not deter us from seeking a world that does not abuse life or at the very least, reduces abuses to the minimum='Heaven/Utopia'. Subtract Poolman, myself and any other and the equation is still 1+1=2. You are life, and as life you are considered equally. The abuse must end, not individuality.
@seraphimra The last people treating me as an equal have been desteniproductions and their rabid followers. You indeed should subtract poolman he's the first to gas people. The views of most members on the pros of genocide make me doubt the whole pro-life-thing.
@Goldkehlchen20 The pros of genocide? That is indeed contrary to any idea of equality(who chooses who dies) and dignity(life without abuse). There does seem to be quite a dogmatic adhearance to the philosophy for some. Though the projections onto Poolman as to his future action and motives can only be known in time through action. In the manner that one might approach a tiger, one should approach philosophy, with harsh scrutiny and great care.
@Goldkehlchen20 Either, ones' actions produce life affirming qualities, i.e. 1+1=2, or they produce destructive qualities, i.e. 1-1=0. Certain qualitative aspects of reality do maintain duality, but equality is a principle which is lived as the being making a self-directive choice to consider what is best for all(if all are supported = I am supported). So, I put it to you, pantheism or panentheism?
@Goldkehlchen20 Agnostic or not, that doesn't dismiss the philosophical question of pantheism or panentheism. Those are the only 2 states upon which the multiverse can exist, to my current understanding. I'm investigating the Desteni source material, not espousing it as infallible-that has yet to be seen as it continues to manifest. Mathematics is precise and it follows that if I(1) treat life with dignity,(+) as do you(1), so on and so forth. Dignified for all would be the innate correlation.
@seraphimra That's weird, you're using conspiracy theory to promote ideas that to most conspiracy theorists would be abhorrent. Bizarre, but of course Poolman is already doing that himself by promoting a "New World Order".
@0rdoTempliAurora Conspiracies? Elaborate on this. And, Poolman, as others, are calling for a New World in Order, not your biased conspiracy of the infamous NWO.
@seraphimra More to the point re: equality and leadership, microchipping according to Desteni would be enforced because Poolman regards free choice as "evil". Equality by definition requires free choice. Fortunately, however, Desteni is a marginal small esoteric group on the lunatic fringe and not some world-changing mass movement as the credulous believers of Bernard Poolman's lies imagine. Good night!
@seraphimra Inhibition of anger chemicals? Come off it. Now you're talking science fiction, mate. There would be enforcement of microchipping. It's the Desteni ethos, there is no free choice, Poolman says it himself in several of his videos. He regards it as "evil". He wants people's ID cards and every bit of info about them he can get, which is extracted in SRAT sessions. Why? So he can control and exploit them of course.
@0rdoTempliAurora Science fiction is science fact now. The neuropeptides released in the brain can be tracked to a fraction of a second of their manifestation. These transmitters are emitted from specific locations of the brain which correlate to various aspect of human nature(i.e. anger, joy, fear). I've spoken of my stance on microchipping, not on Desteni's. Still, what about having to get IDs in the first place. Is this not also totalitarian? Of course it is. You are picking and choosing=bias
@0rdoTempliAurora I would suggest to study the work of Dr. Christopher Hills. (Rise of the Phoenix, Supersensonics) Our brain has evolved over a period of time and during this, the brain has accumulated more complex but interconnected 'facilities'. This is science fact, mate.
@0rdoTempliAurora Poetry is a subjective art form and changes from person to person, much as does musical preferences. Although I'm glad I could make you laugh. What is a Philistine? Aside from that, you cannot legitimately categorize all South Africans as being capable of reading and writing perfect English as this is the reverse stereotyping--supposedly a trait you condemn.
@0rdoTempliAurora I've just watched your channels video and see the correlations between the Desteni 'cult', as they've been deemed, and other psuedo-mystical religions which claim absolute dominion over truth...to this extent, I cannot pretend to represent Desteni nor would I condone anything like the Jim Jones and Charles Manson 'cults'. I would also impress that the rhetoric or venacular of Desteni, predates Desteni and they've merely re-introduced it with a 'vulgar' spin.
I enjoyed this video and find similar qualities which surface in myself, as well. I've studied, albeit rather briefly, the concepts and theories of quantum physics, with that, it is possible that 'portals' exist, however I tend not to subscribe to such 'non'-sense unless I verify it experientially. Also, I too maintain the perspective that those outside of Desteni can and have 'woken up' and are living the principle of equality, yet are muddled by all the 'negative' or results of others who dont
(2) therefore i don't like this Video very much. But there's no point, where Poolman justifies the facism of Hitler. He forgives him after death, like Jesus forgives. So i'm not a Christ .. i'm not religious at all. And i don't like the exclusivity Poolman claims for Desteni. So i just spread some Principles of Desteni and i don't favourite Portalvideos or something of this mysticism-things.
But to conclude Poolman is a Hitler-worshipper is simply taken too short. U should take a deeper Look!
@RoterMax Alright, I see you are not a blind disciple of Desteni, luckily. But as far as I am concerned to take "a deeper look", that must also really apply to you, because you still don't want to see he hero-wroships Hitler. It is obvious if you go into his made-up stories about meeting Hitler in "the dimensions", helping good old Adolf to "forgive himself" for his crimes. Isn't this outrageous/haarsträubend enough? You know, even playing down the Holocaust is a sign of affinity towards Hitler.
2) I suggest you to read the following for starters at the Desteni website: Search "Hitler and forgivenesss" by Bernard Poolman. I can give you links, as they cannot be posted here. A little excerpt by the psychotic Poolman: "Hitler is presenting this experience as a help, as a gift. Unwrap yourself, forgive yourself. Ask Hitler questions." "Hitler is each one of us. Hear Hitler. He has been here on earth. He forgave himself. He saw and sees who you really are."
3) As I said, if you are interested, I can give you links. But the whole madness is to be found at the Desteni website. "I AM HITLER" though is a book which was available for purchase on time. I got the text, if you want it. Oddly enough, a certain "Donald Heman" published the exact same text on "God forum". Because Poolman, always demanding total openness and "real names for real people" from his members, very certainly operates under various nicknames. He called himself "Eagle" earlier on.
3)To accentuate and illustrate what I'm trying to say to you:“I represent divine principles - total EQUALITY! A society where people own all things in common – where there is no rich or poor - where there are no races - wherever there’s people struggling for justice and righteousness, there I am!” Sounds familiar? Not Bernard Poolman this time, but Jim Jones, leader of the infamous Peoples Temple CULT, also admiring Hitler, instigating a mass suicide causing 918 victims in 1978 in Guyana. So?
@RoterMax Leadership and equality are incompatible concepts, but Desteni are developing so-called "political leaders", Poolman calls himself a "life instructor" and the only one who defines what Desteni is, apart from Sunette Spies who has been thoroughly instructed by him. He proclaims Desteni as the only truth and everything else as worthless. The idea that Desteni is a group of equals is false. The group itself aims to lead others.
@0rdoTempliAurora There is a difference within leading versus assistance. The path must be walked by yourself. No one can lead you nor should they. However, it is through other that we challenge our concepts of reality and find kindred in those whom see reality as it is. You must work within the system to change the system, thus the current heirarchy and jargon of 'political leaders'. The grandiose proclaimation of the one truth has yet to be proven, but it's premise is worth the investigation.
@RoterMax Gut wenn du das so siehst... ich erkenn nen Nazi wenn ich einen sehe, der typ ist definitiv einer. Von wem aus Deutschland hätte ich mehr Weitblick erwartet, ich bin sehr enttäuscht.
Du glaubst die haben dich nicht unterm Pantoffel?
Ich schlag dir mal ein kleines Experiment vor. Widersprich Berhard, einmal, egal bei was. Oder wem anders, der in der Hackordnung über dir steht bei denen.
@Goldkehlchen20 Du erkennst nen Nazi, wenn Du einen siehst? tolle Fähigkeit! Vl. ist es aber besser nicht auf den ersten Blick zu urteilen, sondern sich auch mal mit jemanden zu beschäftigen, bevor mein ein Urteil abgibt :o)
Im übrigen hab ich schon einigen Destenimitgliedern widersprochen. Nicht alles gefällt mir immer. Zum Bsp. finde ich die Idee mit dem Mikrochip für alle nicht besonders tolle etc. .. Außerdem erkenne ich gar keine "Hackordnung" an!
@RoterMax Jaja 'mich informieren'... hab ich, war trotzdem Stuss.
Nach dem fünften Video mit antisemitischem Inhalt von dem Kerl ist mir ein Licht aufgegangen, und glaub mir ich prüf mein Urteil genau bevor ich es abgebe.
Ob du die Hackordnung anerkennst ist doch an und für sich egal, sie existiert trotzdem. Vielleicht glaubst du zu leichtfertig den Worten und achtest nicht auf die Taten.
Sag mir: Wie kann eine Gruppe, die elitäres Denken lebt, Gleichheit für alle kreieren?
and yet a man who does not follow, as you claim to be, follows the desteni idea,
not as a member, yet, but still the united ideas of commonsense as desteni would describe, your kin to them, your guided by such ideas, and desteni as primary source, thus your part of their following but not mainstreamer, desteni lite,
@RoterMax no, your a grey shade with a darkness that could place you next to desteni as easily as in desteni, and if no border exists between black and white then your admitting your more like them than not, equality is good but not at the cost of all other things.
no limits, just the desteni and you next to them, as if a follower of their ideas
@RoterMax Do you really want to support a Hitler-worshipping cult leader? Do you support dishonesty? Are you really, really sure? Are you really really sure you don't want to know the truth behind this cult? Come on, be brave, be courageous, we advise you not to support a LIE, that's all.
Dear RoterMax, seriously: You have to know that Desteni has nothing to do with Equality, as I told you. Bernard Poolman is a fascist really. He dictated everything in the cult of Desteni. "Equality" and "Equal money" are just mere sentiments to appeal to the idealism of actual or future members. Sorry, but is it so hard to understand? Desteni is simply a cult. Your choice to like them or not, but I can show you that in fact, Desteni is a hierarchy with a Hitler-worhipping leader on top! Grüsse.
@RoterMax Yeah, block and ban me, RoterMax, you are just a cult follower, sadly. If you really don't understand the following words (now reays s l o w l y, take your t i m e): Destei is a hierarchy with a Hitler-worshipping leader on top with absolute say over everything. Do you follow me? Do you support this shit? Do I need to make a painting for you to understand? There is plenty of nonsense and absurd on the Desteni website. Read "I AM HITLER" by Poolman for instance. Total insanity.
@SimulacronX Have U really read what Poolman says about Hitler? I can't find "I am Hitler", but other Texts and Videos about him. For Example "The Love of Jesus and Hitler Changed the World". I don't think it's too clever what Poolman says here from a point of Communication. But he doesn't say Hitler was right in a point. He demonstrates that Hitler exluded everone, who didn't belong to his/the german people, and that was his mistake.
It's a little bit too short Argumentation i think ...(2)
GREAT
mistaAnthonyWilson 1 year ago
OMG! what a discussion here!!!
I think the points shoud be clear enough now. If the discussions here continues with alway the same beeing said more times, i may consider to block!
Anyway .. I think i've made clear, that i personally don't like everything in the universe of Desteni. But for me it's still a big source of Inspiration!
RoterMax 1 year ago
@RoterMax Ah, let the children play. Besides, those who are deceptive will always be exposed by the light of truth and simple mathematics. Thanks for the video and the place for intellectual discourse.
seraphimra 1 year ago
RoterMax, seems to have a vendetta against Desteni and voices himself widely, though that is purely of his and Desteni's accord. I've heard the Hitler references he's citing and see them to be misinterpreted(mainly through bias and ego) and misrepresented because of ignor(e)ance. They've referred to Hitler as the greatest activist because he saw a world that he could change, envisioned the way he wanted it and then obtained it(to a certain degree). I've never heard them condone WHAT he did.
seraphimra 1 year ago 2
@seraphimra There is also a mentioning that 'we', as each individual, are worse than Hitler--This is accredited to the social apathy or further ignor(e)ance which is willfully perpetuated. Gandhi influenced the world through non-violent peaceful resistance, Hitler through genoncide and dogma, then it naturally follows that each one has the same potential. Taking responsibility for self, directing self, and honoring life is ancient knowledge/wisdom which predates Desteni.
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra Poolman claims Hitler "acted out of love for his people": - /watch?v=cQj6qHkk6FE
"Hitler had it. He showed, and have a look, Hitler’s fight was not with the Jews as persons, but with the 'Jewish nature of Man' as a 'Jewish Principle', that is not here, Best for Man, but it here 'best for greed', at a personal level. So, we have to take out the 'Jewish Principle of Profit' from the Human Nature." - Bernard Poolman, "The Jew in Every Man is a Zionist" - /watch?v=HeL0vCsviZc
0rdoTempliAurora 1 year ago
@0rdoTempliAurora Yes, I've seen this video. I believe you are convoluting what is intended. To quote Johann van Goethe, "People in society would not talk so much if they knew how often they misunderstood one another." Though I don't agree that this is a 'Jewish Principle' persay, it is an invitation to have a look at the stereotypical associations between Jewish people and frugal money tendencies.
seraphimra 1 year ago 2
@seraphimra It is not an invitation to examine stereotypes at all. If it was that's what he would've said.
Poolman is claiming that Hitler did not fight against the Jews as a people but as a 'principle' which he says is that of greed.
There's nothing convoluted about it. That's what he said. It's blatant anti-Semitism.
0rdoTempliAurora 1 year ago
@0rdoTempliAurora You are making projections as to what he should've said, to suit your ears, and saying that combating the principle of greed is anti-Semitism..this is one interpretation, quite frankly, your interpretation. Blatant would be Mel Gibson, this is more akin to telling a mother her child is on fire, because she doesn't pay attention, to bring her back to the now and out of the mind, which says "I am Jewish. I am Christian. I, me, mine." Doesn't matter if tru, just if it's effective
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra No, Poolman has very clearly identified greed with the Jewish people. There is no need for me or anyone else to interpret or 'project' as you put it. That is what he actually said:
"He showed, and have a look, Hitler’s fight was not with the Jews as persons, but with the 'Jewish nature of Man' as a 'Jewish Principle', that is not here, Best for Man, but it here 'best for greed', at a personal level."
0rdoTempliAurora 1 year ago
@0rdoTempliAurora Exactly, 'He showed, and have a look, Hitler's fight was not with the Jews as persons...' This is not associating greed to a specific people but to the principle that was, albeit poorly dubbed "Jewish nature of man or Jewish Principle". Referring to a subjective aspect of the consciousness system which has been perpetuated through people using the 'Jewish Principle'--perhaps better stated as the 'Greed Principle'. In the context of Hitler it would be the 'Jewish Principle'.
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra To call the Jewish 'principle' the 'greed principle' is antisemitic, obviously. To do so in the context of a discussion whereby it has already been stated that 'Hitler was the only one with any common sense' only underlines that fact.
To pretend otherwise, as you are doing, suggests you wish it weren't so. Sorry, but Poolman's statements are antisemitic, and to call for the redemption of Hitler as Poolman has done is also antisemitic.
0rdoTempliAurora 1 year ago
@0rdoTempliAurora The Jewish principle is not the greed principle, I said it should've been called the Greed Principle to avoid confusion, not to alledge that all Jews are greedy-that is an insane critique. Common sense, in that context, refers to one having the sense to know how to change his reality. Once again, not condoning the genocide or stereotyping of a specific race so much as an quality that Hitler associated with Jews. When in this realm, Hitler was corrupt, after death you're 'awake'
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra At the risk of repeating myself, according to Poolman the Jewish principle is the greed principle, as he's said himself.
You have made a poor attempt at excusing Poolman's admiration for Hitler by pretending he's said something else. He wrote a book called 'I Am Hitler', theme of which is Poolman redeeming Hitler in the afterlife.
Let's not forget, even without Poolman's fawning over Hitler, Desteni is still a fascist organisation.
0rdoTempliAurora 1 year ago
@0rdoTempliAurora I seek not to excuse nor justify Poolman's comments, just to provide another view point and interpretation. Explain, if you will, how is Desteni fascist? If there is any discrimination, I would find myself morally opposed to it. But, I've interpreted nothing in the way of racism or promoting racist mentalities. They espouse equality-that none are inferior or superior- in this way your accusations fall apart because, practical applications of equality would prevent this.
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra Racism is not a prerequisite for fascism or totalitarianism. Desteni is a dictatorship. No free speech is allowed. They try to censor opposition and use propaganda for their antidemocratic cause. They support microchipping. They condemn non-Desteni people as unworthy of life. Need I go on? It's in the videos on 0rdoTempliAurora. Desteni has nothing to do with equality, it is a thought reform cult run as a hierarchy. 'Equality' is just a hook.
0rdoTempliAurora 1 year ago
@0rdoTempliAurora To an extent, Hitler did act out of 'love' but this sentiment is more akin to the current paradigm surrounding love, which is really 'I love you if...'. Circumstantial love is not love at all. Perhaps Poolman could've worded it to be less enigmatic, for those unfamiliar with linguistics, however, it is also possible that it was perfectly worded as he's provoking investigation and introspective self-inquiry about the connotations surrounding words like 'Love, Hitler, Jews, etc.'
seraphimra 1 year ago 2
@seraphimra Taking his people into a war against the rest of the world to destroy Jews was 'love for his people'? Funny kind of love.
In relation to Hitler, Bernard Poolman seeks to redeem him. He has written reams of text about it. He also recommends Hitler's economic policies.
To abstract the issue to make it seem like Poolman is suggesting some enigmatic method of 'self-inquiry' which can only be understood by linguistics experts is grasping at straws.
0rdoTempliAurora 1 year ago
@0rdoTempliAurora Surely, you would believe so, but none-the-less, those without knowledge of syntex, semantics, semiotics would easily dismiss the message, as you have, and not seek any 'hidden' meaning. I've already stated that his 'love' isn't actual love but a distortion of reality manifested through his opinions, beliefs, thoughts, ideas, etc. Everyone deserves a chance for recitivism and catharsis, even Hitler~he is a product of this world and his potential lives in us all for good or ill.
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra Anyone with any knowledge of basic grammar can see that Poolman is incapable of speaking or writing grammatically and is misusing basic concepts of the English language to suit his agenda, which is as I said to redeem Hitler.
There is practically not one single sentence on the Desteni website that is written in the correct grammar, and you are talking about 'linguistics', as though Poolman was some genius when it comes to language. That is a joke.
0rdoTempliAurora 1 year ago
@0rdoTempliAurora I doubt that english is Poolman's native tongue, judging by the way he speaks, so certain inadequacies will arise. However, this does not diminish the poetic use of phrases and words. You have an obvious personal bias and stake in this which is bleeding over into your interactions with others. Redemption for Hitler as an aspect of ourselves-the desire to pursue our own agenda at the cost of others- is a worthy agenda(i.e. self-forgiveness)
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra Now you're saying Poolman speaks in poetic phrases. That's even more of a joke. The man is a philistine who's read too many New Age books. He's from South Africa by the way, plenty of South Africans are quite capable of speaking and writing perfect English. I fail to see how in order to redeem yourself you have to apologise for Hitler and be antisemitic.
Hitler is not an 'aspect' of anyone, he was himself.
What is my 'obvious personal bias'?
0rdoTempliAurora 1 year ago
@0rdoTempliAurora Your inability to comprehend is disconcerting. Your bias seems to stem from a belief that some beings are promoting anti-semitism and you've a personal stake in whether they do or not. Seems that you're searching to see what you want rather than use the other references to gain perspective. The Hitler Aspect=Pursuing ones agenda at the cost or with disregard for others. This quality is in us all, whether you admit it or not, we all have the potential to be Hitler or Jesus
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra I comprehend everything you say, don't try and patronise me. Some "beings" are promoting antisemitism. Last time that was done on a mass scale, millions of people got murdered and you're suggesting one should not have a personal stake in the matter. Hitler was not just someone who selfishly pursued an agenda at the cost of others. He was a genocidal, racist maniac. That quality is in very, very few.
We do not "have the potential to be Hitler or Jesus", we ARE ourselves.
0rdoTempliAurora 1 year ago
@0rdoTempliAurora Then you are caught in feedback loops and delusion. Let me ask you this, who are you? Who am I? but series of informational packets squeezed into a body and into the span of a lifetime. Everything you know is given to you, as it was given to Jesus, Hitler, Gandhi, etc. We are the produces of this world. Granted each may have a specific blueprint, but you can read astrological horoscopes to see the inherent qualitative aspects that each sign represents in each of us.
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra Yes, and ...?
0rdoTempliAurora 1 year ago
@0rdoTempliAurora Claiming that we are unique is a frivolous and erroneous statement. You and I and everyone else have been conditions through social hypnosis to be who we are today. The only variations come, when these simplistic patterns converge, creating more 'sophisticated or complex' patterns. Meaning, Hitler + Society + Life Experiences = the Hitler that you know. Replace Hitler with you or I and we could've been the exact same, but this is purely speculative.
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra I haven't claimed that we are unique, simply that we are ourselves as opposed to some historical or religious figures.
0rdoTempliAurora 1 year ago
@0rdoTempliAurora That we are not these figures, in specific, is irrelevant and deters from the intended meaning. We all have the potential to be anything, good or ill, supportive of life or destroyers of life. I see what you mean, regarding the heirarchical structure of Desteni and have wondered, myself, if their motives are less than geniune or merely disguised a nefarious agenda....this has yet to be fully realized. I shall investigate further your claims, but never-the-less (part 1)
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra (cont.) Find that the stance of RoterMax, is akin to my own. If it is a hook, then it is a damn persuasive one and a respectable one. If they prove to be insidiously influencing people to...say, kill themselves or others, I would never partake and would, in fact, oppose them. But this is all speculation, pending further review. It would be non-sense to take you at your biased word. Philosophically, Desteni iterates principles which are admirable and necessary for a Utopian society.
seraphimra 1 year ago
@0rdoTempliAurora Put off, initially, by the microchip I wondered what motive could be there to promote this 'solution'. The more I look at those in this world who will not stand up for life, the more I consider it a viable option. Wouldn't you implant Hitler with a microchip if it could've prevented the atrocities?
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra Enforced microchipping is totalitarian, it could not stop Nazi atrocities. "Stand up for life" is jargon indicating loyalty to the lies of charlatan and bigot, Bernard Poolman and the "microchip solution" one of his stupid opinions. Those who do his pseudoscientific SRAT courses have to hand over their ID cards. He wants total control over anyone who joins his "Desteni". If you want to be dominated by a trickster like Poolman that's your problem, just don't recommend it to others.
0rdoTempliAurora 1 year ago
@0rdoTempliAurora There would be no enforcing of anything, that is not already kin to the current judicial system. One would undergo tests to determine if they 'qualify' for and desire a microchip. This tool could send electrical stimuli to the centers of the brain which would inhibit production of certain 'anger' chemicals, thereby diffusing the threat to life. Whether you wish to belittle the philosophy or not is none of my concern. What about being forced to get ID cards in the first place?
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra So would the chip be for animals too?
Goldkehlchen20 1 year ago
@Goldkehlchen20 Perhaps it could be used to curb the hostile nature of all beings on the planet...this is a possibility. Or using the H.A.A.R.P. military facility, in Alaska, to release energetic vibrations(LFV and HFV) to disrupt the biochemical processes which create hostility and anger. Though this should be a absolute last resort. People have 'awoken' before and stood in the face of adversity, to push humanity further, there is no reason we cannot control ourselves, as we should.
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra Who was it who said we should?
Goldkehlchen20 1 year ago
@Goldkehlchen20 Who, indeed. Surely, you have the same desire to survive as others do. Is it pantheism or panentheism?
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra Does that have anthing to do with my assumed desire to survive?
Goldkehlchen20 1 year ago
@seraphimra And how could animals 'wake up'?
Goldkehlchen20 1 year ago
@Goldkehlchen20 Animals are much more conscious than we give them credit for. Their entrainment with nature is uncanny and could be a definitive particular in 'returning to nature'. Also, who knows what technology will yield in the coming centuries.
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra How are animals more conscious than we give them credit for and what does technology have to do with this?
Goldkehlchen20 1 year ago
@Goldkehlchen20 Simple, animals brains operate on a frequency which is 'in harmony' with natural rythyms(eat, sleep, shit, etc.). Within this function, the animals primal brain has access to various forms of what we call reality(bat=sonar, snakes=infrared). Technology could and probably will play a massive role in developing better and safer methods of assistance. Use your imagination and creativity, I'm sure you can answer your own question.
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra If I was of the mind to answer my own questions I would not ask you would I?
What is different between a human brain and an animal brain? They show the same behaviourpatterns and have the same desires.
What is 'assistance' to you specificly?
Goldkehlchen20 1 year ago
@Goldkehlchen20 Wrong, one asks questions of others because they've given up on ascertaining the truth for themselves. Your mind has infinite potentiality and all the answers you could require. Differences are few except in size and function. Humans have a frontal cortex which is larger than other animals, which enables such things as contemplation, directive action, vast communications, technological savvy-ness, etc. Assistance is assistance- the definition is sufficient.
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra I ask questions because answering them myself is terribly onesided. My way of seeing things is not the only way and that of others is always to be considered as equal.
The definition of assistance is not sufficient just because you stated it. What is assistance for one might be overbearing for another.
How comes you tell me I am 'wrong' if you said before I should answer the questions myself... if I have the authority given by you to determine reality how can I be 'wrong' then?
Goldkehlchen20 1 year ago
@Goldkehlchen20 'Wrong/Erroneous' Is the belief that you do not have sufficient means by which to ascertain answers outside of collaborative efforts. If all are equal then you possess equal faculties to be able to properly decipher reality. Assistance is assistance, one's perception of where assistance becomes interference is subjective and does not sully the original definition. There is no 'authority' as an outside influence. You either maintain self-directive principles within whats best 4all
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra Well you just created your own backdoor there... 'IF all are equal'. Either they are or they are not. You said I was wrong.
If there is no objective force to decide what assistence is, the definition of it is subjective and therefore the statement 'assistence is assistence' becomes meaningless for the definitions might alter.
What is your definition of 'all' I'm curious if it's only a selfish 'everyone who thinks like me' or rather 'everyone regardless of what they believe or do'?
Goldkehlchen20 1 year ago
@Goldkehlchen20 Equality exists beyond dualities, such as wrong/right, when lived as a principle. It is something that must be lived and realized. Assistance would be up to the individual, whom is educated in the ways of self-honesty, self-forgiveness, and self-directiveness, living as life to do what is best for all. Facing self and uncovering the deception of conditioning and ego, so that we can actively pursue creating a 'Heaven' on earth. With our hand, each one who chooses to stand, we can.
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra You could as well just have said 'I only mean those who think and act like me'...
Why does equality need to have conditions? How is it a principle that exists beyond dualities, if it has to be bought by the use of certain phrases and behaviourpatterns?
How can 'heaven' exist if dualities do not?
Goldkehlchen20 1 year ago
@Goldkehlchen20 Equality comes down to mathematics and conditions necessary to produce and effective application of a 'preferred state'. When lived as a principle, each other life form is considered equally, thereby creating a system of checks and balances and accountability. Thus, for 'things' that live, life is a preferred state, given that there is not mental delusions(melancholy, bliss). Heaven is not innately a dualist concept but a preferred state where all are treated with dignity.
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra If it's math give me the formular.
Life is the preferred state of flesh-eating bacteries, even though you might not want them on your face they need to be considered equally. Who wins you or them?
Heaven is a word relating to a mind-construct that you used on purpose to create a certain image in me on reading it. So examine: what was your intention to use the word in the first place??
Goldkehlchen20 1 year ago
@Goldkehlchen20 At the moment, life is in a system where the practicality of equality is impossible, as some must consume others to survive. Though this predicament exists, that should not deter us from seeking a world that does not abuse life or at the very least, reduces abuses to the minimum='Heaven/Utopia'. Subtract Poolman, myself and any other and the equation is still 1+1=2. You are life, and as life you are considered equally. The abuse must end, not individuality.
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra The last people treating me as an equal have been desteniproductions and their rabid followers. You indeed should subtract poolman he's the first to gas people. The views of most members on the pros of genocide make me doubt the whole pro-life-thing.
Goldkehlchen20 1 year ago
@Goldkehlchen20 The pros of genocide? That is indeed contrary to any idea of equality(who chooses who dies) and dignity(life without abuse). There does seem to be quite a dogmatic adhearance to the philosophy for some. Though the projections onto Poolman as to his future action and motives can only be known in time through action. In the manner that one might approach a tiger, one should approach philosophy, with harsh scrutiny and great care.
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra destilogic: opinion=abuse=no right to live. Fact.
Though Berny thinks locking people up will do as well. Charmingly liberal isn't he.
Goldkehlchen20 1 year ago
@Goldkehlchen20 Either, ones' actions produce life affirming qualities, i.e. 1+1=2, or they produce destructive qualities, i.e. 1-1=0. Certain qualitative aspects of reality do maintain duality, but equality is a principle which is lived as the being making a self-directive choice to consider what is best for all(if all are supported = I am supported). So, I put it to you, pantheism or panentheism?
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra 1+1=2? Poolman speaking there?
So... you can count apples congratulations. 1 apple + one banana does make two types of fruit still, they are not the same thing.
Btw that last part of your post doesn't resemble the formular you gave in the slightest.
'All' aka your team? I'm not in your gang I don't count as 'all'.
Idon'tcareism. Agnostic here.
Goldkehlchen20 1 year ago
@Goldkehlchen20 Agnostic or not, that doesn't dismiss the philosophical question of pantheism or panentheism. Those are the only 2 states upon which the multiverse can exist, to my current understanding. I'm investigating the Desteni source material, not espousing it as infallible-that has yet to be seen as it continues to manifest. Mathematics is precise and it follows that if I(1) treat life with dignity,(+) as do you(1), so on and so forth. Dignified for all would be the innate correlation.
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra My philosophy? We're all equal before death. Pick which one you want for that but boxing me in won't do anything here.
So you're not a member? Leaves two options: a) you're lying or b) you will be bitchslapped soon for disobedience.
1 Hypocrite + 1 Hypocrite = 2 Hypocrites supporting each others dishonesty. Awesome formular indeed.
Goldkehlchen20 1 year ago
@Goldkehlchen20 Ad hominem, nothing more.
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra Ad hominem?
Goldkehlchen20 1 year ago
@seraphimra That's weird, you're using conspiracy theory to promote ideas that to most conspiracy theorists would be abhorrent. Bizarre, but of course Poolman is already doing that himself by promoting a "New World Order".
0rdoTempliAurora 1 year ago
@0rdoTempliAurora Conspiracies? Elaborate on this. And, Poolman, as others, are calling for a New World in Order, not your biased conspiracy of the infamous NWO.
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra More to the point re: equality and leadership, microchipping according to Desteni would be enforced because Poolman regards free choice as "evil". Equality by definition requires free choice. Fortunately, however, Desteni is a marginal small esoteric group on the lunatic fringe and not some world-changing mass movement as the credulous believers of Bernard Poolman's lies imagine. Good night!
0rdoTempliAurora 1 year ago
@seraphimra Inhibition of anger chemicals? Come off it. Now you're talking science fiction, mate. There would be enforcement of microchipping. It's the Desteni ethos, there is no free choice, Poolman says it himself in several of his videos. He regards it as "evil". He wants people's ID cards and every bit of info about them he can get, which is extracted in SRAT sessions. Why? So he can control and exploit them of course.
0rdoTempliAurora 1 year ago
@0rdoTempliAurora Science fiction is science fact now. The neuropeptides released in the brain can be tracked to a fraction of a second of their manifestation. These transmitters are emitted from specific locations of the brain which correlate to various aspect of human nature(i.e. anger, joy, fear). I've spoken of my stance on microchipping, not on Desteni's. Still, what about having to get IDs in the first place. Is this not also totalitarian? Of course it is. You are picking and choosing=bias
seraphimra 1 year ago
@0rdoTempliAurora I would suggest to study the work of Dr. Christopher Hills. (Rise of the Phoenix, Supersensonics) Our brain has evolved over a period of time and during this, the brain has accumulated more complex but interconnected 'facilities'. This is science fact, mate.
seraphimra 1 year ago
@0rdoTempliAurora Poetry is a subjective art form and changes from person to person, much as does musical preferences. Although I'm glad I could make you laugh. What is a Philistine? Aside from that, you cannot legitimately categorize all South Africans as being capable of reading and writing perfect English as this is the reverse stereotyping--supposedly a trait you condemn.
seraphimra 1 year ago
@seraphimra I have not categorised all South Africans as capable of reading and writing perfect English, I said plenty of them are, which is a fact.
0rdoTempliAurora 1 year ago
@0rdoTempliAurora I've just watched your channels video and see the correlations between the Desteni 'cult', as they've been deemed, and other psuedo-mystical religions which claim absolute dominion over truth...to this extent, I cannot pretend to represent Desteni nor would I condone anything like the Jim Jones and Charles Manson 'cults'. I would also impress that the rhetoric or venacular of Desteni, predates Desteni and they've merely re-introduced it with a 'vulgar' spin.
seraphimra 1 year ago
I enjoyed this video and find similar qualities which surface in myself, as well. I've studied, albeit rather briefly, the concepts and theories of quantum physics, with that, it is possible that 'portals' exist, however I tend not to subscribe to such 'non'-sense unless I verify it experientially. Also, I too maintain the perspective that those outside of Desteni can and have 'woken up' and are living the principle of equality, yet are muddled by all the 'negative' or results of others who dont
seraphimra 1 year ago
(2) therefore i don't like this Video very much. But there's no point, where Poolman justifies the facism of Hitler. He forgives him after death, like Jesus forgives. So i'm not a Christ .. i'm not religious at all. And i don't like the exclusivity Poolman claims for Desteni. So i just spread some Principles of Desteni and i don't favourite Portalvideos or something of this mysticism-things.
But to conclude Poolman is a Hitler-worshipper is simply taken too short. U should take a deeper Look!
RoterMax 1 year ago
@RoterMax Alright, I see you are not a blind disciple of Desteni, luckily. But as far as I am concerned to take "a deeper look", that must also really apply to you, because you still don't want to see he hero-wroships Hitler. It is obvious if you go into his made-up stories about meeting Hitler in "the dimensions", helping good old Adolf to "forgive himself" for his crimes. Isn't this outrageous/haarsträubend enough? You know, even playing down the Holocaust is a sign of affinity towards Hitler.
SimulacronX 1 year ago
2) I suggest you to read the following for starters at the Desteni website: Search "Hitler and forgivenesss" by Bernard Poolman. I can give you links, as they cannot be posted here. A little excerpt by the psychotic Poolman: "Hitler is presenting this experience as a help, as a gift. Unwrap yourself, forgive yourself. Ask Hitler questions." "Hitler is each one of us. Hear Hitler. He has been here on earth. He forgave himself. He saw and sees who you really are."
SimulacronX 1 year ago
3) As I said, if you are interested, I can give you links. But the whole madness is to be found at the Desteni website. "I AM HITLER" though is a book which was available for purchase on time. I got the text, if you want it. Oddly enough, a certain "Donald Heman" published the exact same text on "God forum". Because Poolman, always demanding total openness and "real names for real people" from his members, very certainly operates under various nicknames. He called himself "Eagle" earlier on.
SimulacronX 1 year ago
3)To accentuate and illustrate what I'm trying to say to you:“I represent divine principles - total EQUALITY! A society where people own all things in common – where there is no rich or poor - where there are no races - wherever there’s people struggling for justice and righteousness, there I am!” Sounds familiar? Not Bernard Poolman this time, but Jim Jones, leader of the infamous Peoples Temple CULT, also admiring Hitler, instigating a mass suicide causing 918 victims in 1978 in Guyana. So?
SimulacronX 1 year ago
@RoterMax Leadership and equality are incompatible concepts, but Desteni are developing so-called "political leaders", Poolman calls himself a "life instructor" and the only one who defines what Desteni is, apart from Sunette Spies who has been thoroughly instructed by him. He proclaims Desteni as the only truth and everything else as worthless. The idea that Desteni is a group of equals is false. The group itself aims to lead others.
0rdoTempliAurora 1 year ago
@0rdoTempliAurora There is a difference within leading versus assistance. The path must be walked by yourself. No one can lead you nor should they. However, it is through other that we challenge our concepts of reality and find kindred in those whom see reality as it is. You must work within the system to change the system, thus the current heirarchy and jargon of 'political leaders'. The grandiose proclaimation of the one truth has yet to be proven, but it's premise is worth the investigation.
seraphimra 1 year ago
@RoterMax Gut wenn du das so siehst... ich erkenn nen Nazi wenn ich einen sehe, der typ ist definitiv einer. Von wem aus Deutschland hätte ich mehr Weitblick erwartet, ich bin sehr enttäuscht.
Du glaubst die haben dich nicht unterm Pantoffel?
Ich schlag dir mal ein kleines Experiment vor. Widersprich Berhard, einmal, egal bei was. Oder wem anders, der in der Hackordnung über dir steht bei denen.
Mal sehen ob die dir zeigen, wer die Hosen anhat.
Lass sie dir zeigen wie 'gleich' du bist.
Goldkehlchen20 1 year ago
@Goldkehlchen20 Du erkennst nen Nazi, wenn Du einen siehst? tolle Fähigkeit! Vl. ist es aber besser nicht auf den ersten Blick zu urteilen, sondern sich auch mal mit jemanden zu beschäftigen, bevor mein ein Urteil abgibt :o)
Im übrigen hab ich schon einigen Destenimitgliedern widersprochen. Nicht alles gefällt mir immer. Zum Bsp. finde ich die Idee mit dem Mikrochip für alle nicht besonders tolle etc. .. Außerdem erkenne ich gar keine "Hackordnung" an!
Vl. solltest Dich ma informieren!
RoterMax 1 year ago
@RoterMax Jaja 'mich informieren'... hab ich, war trotzdem Stuss.
Nach dem fünften Video mit antisemitischem Inhalt von dem Kerl ist mir ein Licht aufgegangen, und glaub mir ich prüf mein Urteil genau bevor ich es abgebe.
Ob du die Hackordnung anerkennst ist doch an und für sich egal, sie existiert trotzdem. Vielleicht glaubst du zu leichtfertig den Worten und achtest nicht auf die Taten.
Sag mir: Wie kann eine Gruppe, die elitäres Denken lebt, Gleichheit für alle kreieren?
Goldkehlchen20 1 year ago
and yet a man who does not follow, as you claim to be, follows the desteni idea,
not as a member, yet, but still the united ideas of commonsense as desteni would describe, your kin to them, your guided by such ideas, and desteni as primary source, thus your part of their following but not mainstreamer, desteni lite,
diet desteni, just like desteni with less sugar
Threeedgedsword1 1 year ago
@Threeedgedsword1 har har! U should become a comedian!!
Are U not able to imagine, which are able to see more than black or white. Sometimes there are shades of grey.
For U there is only the choice to follow someone blind or denie him totally??
poor man!
RoterMax 1 year ago
@RoterMax no, your a grey shade with a darkness that could place you next to desteni as easily as in desteni, and if no border exists between black and white then your admitting your more like them than not, equality is good but not at the cost of all other things.
no limits, just the desteni and you next to them, as if a follower of their ideas
Threeedgedsword1 1 year ago
@RoterMax Do you really want to support a Hitler-worshipping cult leader? Do you support dishonesty? Are you really, really sure? Are you really really sure you don't want to know the truth behind this cult? Come on, be brave, be courageous, we advise you not to support a LIE, that's all.
SimulacronX 1 year ago
Dear RoterMax, seriously: You have to know that Desteni has nothing to do with Equality, as I told you. Bernard Poolman is a fascist really. He dictated everything in the cult of Desteni. "Equality" and "Equal money" are just mere sentiments to appeal to the idealism of actual or future members. Sorry, but is it so hard to understand? Desteni is simply a cult. Your choice to like them or not, but I can show you that in fact, Desteni is a hierarchy with a Hitler-worhipping leader on top! Grüsse.
SimulacronX 1 year ago
@SimulacronX OMG! If U continue to tell these things U'll have the honour to be the first user i have to block on my channel!!!
If U got some proofs for Your Allegations i will always be open to listen to them! Otherwise: Shut up!
have a nice day!
RoterMax 1 year ago
@RoterMax There is plenty of proof, it's on the Desteni website.
0rdoTempliAurora 1 year ago
@RoterMax Yeah, block and ban me, RoterMax, you are just a cult follower, sadly. If you really don't understand the following words (now reays s l o w l y, take your t i m e): Destei is a hierarchy with a Hitler-worshipping leader on top with absolute say over everything. Do you follow me? Do you support this shit? Do I need to make a painting for you to understand? There is plenty of nonsense and absurd on the Desteni website. Read "I AM HITLER" by Poolman for instance. Total insanity.
SimulacronX 1 year ago
@SimulacronX Have U really read what Poolman says about Hitler? I can't find "I am Hitler", but other Texts and Videos about him. For Example "The Love of Jesus and Hitler Changed the World". I don't think it's too clever what Poolman says here from a point of Communication. But he doesn't say Hitler was right in a point. He demonstrates that Hitler exluded everone, who didn't belong to his/the german people, and that was his mistake.
It's a little bit too short Argumentation i think ...(2)
RoterMax 1 year ago