The Baptism of the Holy Ghost-Part 1 of 4

[vlbwell]

God gives 40 spiritual blessings at the moment of salvation. The baptism of the Holy Spirit is one of them. Baptism means "'to place in union with and the new believer is placed in union with Jesus Christ or identified with Jesus Christ through the power of the Holy Spirit the moment he believes on the Lord Jesus Christ.

[vlbwell]

The original language does not say Ghost. God is not like Casper the Ghost. The antiquated language used in the 16th century does not reflect accurately what the scripture expresses in the original language. The Koine Greek and Hebrew are far superior languages then the 16th century English language translations. The Greek and Hebrew are accurate languages not like the English. Our American language is weak in itself to express what the Greek and Hebrew expresses. But Pastors can become educated

[BrothaMinister]

@vlbwell so in all this whats your point.. are you saying for me not to use GHOST anymore.. thats its error to use HOLY GHOST ?

[vlbwell]

God is not a ghost He's the Spirit omnipotent Omnipresent and Omniscient creator not a Ghost.

[BrothaMinister]

@vlbwell only reason i say ghost is because THE BIBLE SAYS GHOST.. IT USES GHOST AND SPIRIT INTERCHANGEABLEY...

[TriuneGForce]

@BrothaMinister kjv says ghost and spirit for the same greek and hebrew word and modern translations only use spirit because the meaning of some words have changed over the years. like the word unicorn in 1611 meant  rhinocerous not so now. THE MEANING OF WORDS CHANGE. In my opinion spirit is a better word because the meaning of the word ghost has changed over the years and we should use a more accurate word describing the original languange. HOWEVER IF YOU READ KJV THATS COOL JUST EXPLAIN

[BrothaMinister]

@TriuneGForce i dont think i should have to explain why i say HOLY GHOST rather than HOLY SPIRIT even though i do use that too interchangeably.. point is if i say HOLY GHOST a person who hears it may say why does he say ghost.. then they can go back and see THE BIBLE SAYS IT... so why should i what supposedly more accurate when the bible clearly says GHOST.. thats accurate enough..

[TriuneGForce]

@BrothaMinister Brother the bible was written in hebrew and greek as you well know NOT IN 17th CENTURY ENGLISH!

If you want to call a rhinocerous a unicorn just because the kjv bible uses the word unicorn thats fine with me

but don't use the excuse: "thats the word the bible uses."

No thats the word a 17th century english translation of the original hebrew/greek bible uses.

And at THAT TIME it would have made sence but in 300 or so years english has changed alot. nothing wrong with ghost tho

[vlbwell]

Hey BrothaM, at salvation God gives the believer 39 Irrevocable Absolutes and one Revocable Absolute and to read the list of them visit rbthieme.org Download the Plan of God booklet. in the back is the list. The Baptism of the Holy Spirit is an Irrevocable Absolute given at Salvation and that means the Holy Spirit places us in union with Christ. There is only one Baptism and its the Holy Spirit placing the believer in union with Christ and that at salvation not separate from it. Eph 4:5.

[vlbwell]

Every believer has weaknesses from the old sin nature that resides in our body. We were born in sin and received that sin nature or flesh from Adam. We have lust, evil and sin, sin puts us out of fellowship. We should cite our sins to God daily. Blind arrogance is a sin to acknowledge daily and many times in the day, to make sure we stay in fellowship daily. We all have mental attitude sins that we commit and don't even know it, we have studied the Doctrine of Hamartiology the study of sin.

[reslifebr]

not convinced still think it's subsequent

[BrothaMinister]

@reslifebr lol YOU THINK.. show me where i am wrong... i just showed you with scripture the truth.. ITS UP TO YOU TO RECIEVE IT. if cant show me error WITH THOSE SCRIPTURES I USE then its not me who you disagree with ITS THE WORD...

[RTillis1]

BrothaMinister...Hope all is well, Man of God...Hey, I had tried calling you a while back...The number was no good...I'm out here in Houston though and I just wanted to chat with you briefly...I'm in agreement with you about the Baptism of the Holy Ghost being regeneration...

If you time permits, I would love to chop it up with you...Let me know...

Rashid

[BrothaMinister]

@kingdomcoming7 haha. lol.. foolishness house is in order.. and you talk to God about that he baptizes with theholy ghost.. but she will be filled.. so what your going say when she is? we have faith in GOD.. did you get the holy ghost ASAP.. dont be mad cause we following GOD and we blessed in all areas of our lives.. haters haters haters.. you need make sure you got holy ghost and not no fake TONGUES.. lol

[AchreousD]

It is written, those who are lead by the Spirit of God, are the sons (children) of God. Not those who are filled (influence, or empowered) for purposes of God. It is written the manifestation of the Spirit to every man. Do you know why? To profit all who believe. Thus, the Spirit is poured on all flesh, and not every one who appears in the flesh on whom the Spirit is poured is His sons, but those who follow the lead of the Spirit.

[AchreousD]

The error is obvious to anyone who believes and understands the truth. The carnal minded say the great commission is to preach. Yet, Jesus said love you one anther It is written love is the greatest of the commandments. Yet, the carnal minded preacher says, preaching is the greatest. Jesus said those that believe on Him are not condemned because they believeth. You teach those how have receive the Holy Spirit, dwelling in them are saved. Why do you not believe the words of Christ?

[AchreousD]

Jesus prayed for the Disciples (us) to be filled with the Spirit, which is the promise; Acts 2:16-18, Joel 2:28-29. He prayed the Holy Spirit would dwell in us as it dwelled in Him; not like it dwelled in Him, but as it dwelled; St. John 14:17. The LORD acknowledging He has given us the glory the Father gave Him. What is the glory of the Father? The Holy Spirit, His Truth (the word) and the Father Himself (Love, life eternal)! Study the Lords Prayer; St. John 17:8, 11, 14, 17, 19-22,

[AchreousD]

There is a difference between being filled with the Spirit and receiving the Spirit. That is why John, Elizabeth; Luke 1:15, 41, and Simeon, Luke 2:25-26 were filled with the Holy Spirit. They had not received the Holy Spirit but He was on them. If you read these texts carefully you will see being filled of the Spirit happens when the Spirit of God comes on you, just as in days of old.

[BrothaMinister]

so i ask you to answer this question. was the 120 disciples at pentecost ALREADY RECIEVED THE HOLY GHOST and in acts it WAS JUST THE FILLING not the reception.. can you use acts chapter 8, 10 and 19 to show the difference of reception and filling. you already know in each instance you would have to PROVE that each group ALREADY HAD THE HOLY SPIRIT.. can you do that.

[AchreousD]

Im not agreeing or disagreeing with your point. I would like to ask you a question, and say I like your enthusiasm and statement about the Holy Spirit teaching us all things.

Base on your statements how do you explain or understand what is written about John (Elijah); Luke 1:11-15 (15).

[BrothaMinister]

im not sure what your really asking. are you asking me if him being filled with the spirit is possible because of me saying that Jesus said no man can recieve the holy spirit until he goes away. (John 16:7). is that what your asking.. when you respond back then i will answer that very easy if thats what your asking... i noticed you said you dont agree or disagree with my point.. so i ask you is my point THE TRUTH OR NOT THE TRUTH?

[AchreousD]

No, Im asking you to explain how John, Elisabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit (Ghost); base on your understanding of the subject. Yes, Jesus said they would not receive the Holy Spirit until He goes away. I do not agree with your expressed understanding of the text or the subject, because of what the LORD should me about the subject and what happen to John and Elisabeth, both were filled with the Holy Spirit (Ghost) Luke 1:15, 41. Before Jesus was born. Your point is partly true.

[BrothaMinister]

you say my point is partial true. then what part is it that is not. you say you dont agree with my expressed understanding of the text or subject (which subject or text) the luke 1:15 or the subject of video? as far as me explaining on HOW john was filled based on my understanding he was filled like the bible said. now if your asking how he was based on my VIDEO UNDERSTANDING i will say many were filled before Jesus death all through old testament.. but NOW new convenant is SPIRIT IN YOU

[AchreousD]

Okay, Jesus ascended into Heaven before He meet His Disciples in Galilee, after his resurrections. St. John 20:17. Base on what Jesus said they where his brethren, God was their father, thus they were born again. Other wise how could they be sons? Do you remember Jesus told Mary to tell his brethren that He ascend unto my Father and your Father?

[BrothaMinister]

your ERROR has just been seen.. i see where your mistake is (i say that in good way). the scripture tells her HE HAS NOT YET ASCENDED. we know he was with them for 40 days BEFORE HE ASCENDED INTO HEAVEN.. acts 1:8-11. then read JOHN 16:7.. thats when he could send the holy ghost.. then read ACTS 1:4. wait FOR THE PROMISE.. what was the promise? why wait for something they already got? look at ACTS 2:33 the PROMISE was the HOLY GHOST.. do you see that.. this is where you error

[AchreousD]

It would be better to question before you correct. If you notice Jesus told her not to touch Him because He had not yet ascended and tells Marry to tell His brethren that He ascend. Not that He will in future, but that He ascend, present. Jesus did ascend, came back and tells Thomas to touch Him. St. John 20: 17-28. Thats the truth, not error.

As far a The Holy Spirit, that text shows Jesus received authority to send the Spirit from the Father. As He said all power is given unto Him.

[BrothaMinister]

if Jesus ascended in heaven BEFORE acts 1;11 that means he ALREADY CAME BACK for the 2nd coming. secondly you would have to say that at PENTECOST was not the FIRST TIME THE CHURCH WAS BORN AND BEGIN AS SPIRITUAL BODY OF CHRIST.. do you believe that? lastly ON THE PHONE you said that a person CAN BE SAVED (WITHOUT) THE HOLY SPIRIT.. wow thats really error. do you want to stick with that.. a person CAN BE SAVED WITHOUT THE SPIRIT.. wow... i hope you change that belief.. without the spirit? wow

[AchreousD]

How do you determine how many times Jesus can leave and come back? It is very clear Jesus told Mary to tell His brethren He ascends to the Father, not that He was going to, but present going to ascend before coming to them. Mary was not allowed to touch him, because He had not ascended, Thomas was allowed to touch Him after He ascended and came back. I do not consider that a second coming, or appearing. Pual seen His glory and it blinded him, I don't consider that the "second" coming either.

[AchreousD]

He said when He comes back, He would come in His own Glory. Are we now believe when He appeared to Paul in Glory that was the second coming? No. His second coming is what He says it is. Not base on logic of mans ability to count. How many times He did or did not leave and come back before His Ascension in Acts, don't not mandate that must be His second coming. John 14:18-19; clearly shows He would go away, and come unto them. St. John20:17 show Him saying He was ascending. Yes before Acts 1:11

[AchreousD]

Your second question. I believe what is written, we are grafted in to the holy nation of Israel, and the church was in the wilderness when the Angel of God spoke to the children of Israel about the coming of Christ (That Prophet) to whom we are to hear (obey). Acts 37-38. They are one Body (The Church) Jews and Gentile believers, who are led by the Spirit of God.

[AchreousD]

I said people are saved without the Baptism of the Holy Spirit. That does not mean they are without the Holy Spirit. Just that they have not received the power which comes only by Him coming upon a person. Not without the Spirit, without Baptism of the Spirit. God said He would pour His Spirit on all flesh, even none believers will be baptized and empower to prophesy, see visions and dream dreams. Acts 2:17. Do you believe all are born again, have the Holy Spirit in them?

[BrothaMinister]

wow you just said that he would pour his spirit out on NON BELIEVERS.. COME ON MAN ARE YOU SERIOUS.. you getting deeper and deeper into error.. i just ask are you saying that the FIRST COMING OF THE SPIRIT TO MAKE THE BODY OF CHRIST HAPPENED BEFORE PENTECOST? every denomination teaches that the CHURCH BEGIN AT PENTECOST.

[AchreousD]

Read Act 2:17-18, when the LORD speaks of all flesh, does that not mean all? When it says on your sons and daughter, does that not point to the fact they are not consider His? When God speak of His, He called them "My servant" and on My handmaidens.

[AchreousD]

Key to the reason they are all wrong is because they are denomination. Is it not written Is Christ dived"? They who confess such thing are carnal, thus in error. Not my words, but I agree and believe them. We are the Body of Christ, and the Bible says the church was in the wilderness at Sian or Zion, not me; I do agree and reiterate what is written. I gave you the text you should have read it and believed it, because you are the one professing denominations.1 Cor 1:10-13; 3:2-4;

[AchreousD]

Jesus ascended before He breathed on them and said receive you the Holy Ghost. John 20:22; which they did at that time Jesus breathed on then and said receive. Because what Jesus says is, it happens when he says it. On the day of Pentecost they were all filled (empower, influence) receive the promise of the Father, which was the out poring of The Holy Spirit (Baptism of the Spirit). Acts 2:16-18

[BrothaMinister]

again your in error and you would cause the scritpures to contradict.. you say they "recieved" in John 20;22 well go back and see that THOMAS WAS NOT THERE.. and also the other 110 was not there that recieved at pentecost.. then YOU WOULD BE SAYING JESUS WENT BACK TO HEAVEN CAME BACK, THEN WENT BACK AGAIN A SECOND TIME in acts 1:8-11. JESUS said if i go not away you CANNOT recieve holy ghost (john 16;7). thats why he promised them to RECIEVE IN acts 1:4. your error can cause false conversion

[ChristMyRedeemer]

With all due respect, the Baptism in the Holy Ghost IS separate from Salvation. It's the Infilling of the Holy Ghost that occurs at Salvation. The Baptism occurs after we tarry (wait in prayer) for it and it's evidenced by Speaking in other Tongues as the Spirit gives utterance (Acts 2:4)

[BrothaMinister]

so are you saying that the 120 were already saved? are u saying the group in acts 8, 10 and 19 were ALREADY SAVED, before the baptism of holy ghost.. i see u agree that the bapitsm of holy ghost is followed by tongues.. so i ask you can you PROVE WITH SCRIPTURE that cornelius in acts 10 was saved Before baptism? can u show in acts 19 they were saved? remember rom 8:9-10. thanks for the comment .. im excited to hear from u after u research the scriptures.. God bless.

[ChristMyRedeemer]

I had two replies to your comment, but I removed them because the Word of God needs no defense. I believe what I believe and you believe what you believe

[BrothaMinister]

i figured u would say that. thats the problem with christians once they cannot answer their own beliefs with scripture they say beleive what u want.. as if there isnt absolute truth. u erased ur responses cause u know u see truth now.. you CANNOT be saved WITHOUT holy ghost.. period.. those in acts 19:2 did not have holy ghost yet, even thought they beleived. they got saved in verse 6.. so if u beleive one can be saved without holy ghost then YOU MUST NOT HAVE HOLY SPIRIT.. i hope u repent

[Romanian97]

amen

[BrothaMinister]

the gospel needs no defense? what bible you reading. its christians like you who give us bad name cause your not equipped enough to defend the faith and people go to and fro cause they dont have doctrine. paul ALWAYS defended the doctrine. book of JUDE say to contend for the faith... read 2 cor 10:4-5. eph 6 spiritual warfare.. THE WORD is the SWORD.. how can we fight off satan without word if we dont stand for truth.. you need to repent.

[ChristMyRedeemer]

@BrothaMinister Why can't you just let me believe what I believe and stop telling me i need to repent. I've already done that, otherwise my username would not be ChristMyRedeemer. I believe that the Baptism of the Holy Ghost is separate from Salvation and it is evidenced by Speaking in Tongues

[BrothaMinister]

i also just noticed you said in your comment that the "INFILLING" of holy ghost OCCURS AT SALVATION.. thats my point.. IN in this key word.. when the holy spirit comes IN aperson thats when they are saved. Jesus taught on the INFILLING OF HOLY GHOST.. so another words your not saved until THE INFILLING RIGHT? so i ask when did people finally get INFILLED.. acts 2, 8,10,19. are u trying to say that in acts 8,10,19 they were already INFILLED? that would be complete error..

[Romanian97]

i agree with you..

[Romanian97]

so in acts 2 ... atheists were tarrying for the baptizm power of the holy spirit? nonsense.. once you accept Jesus as your saviour, you already got the spirit of regeneration and your saved if you submit to Jesus to be your lord from your heart . the thief on the cross was not baptized in the holy spirit but was saved by believing in Jesus and he received the holy spirit but not the infilling of it .. but it did save him.

[BrothaMinister]

wow. you said the person received the spirit but not the INFILLING. your own words shows your error. your saying a person can be saved without the INFILLING OF HOLY SPIRIT..wow.. please read romans 8:9-10. if you dont have the spirit IN you your NONE OF HIS.. that proves it right there.. and just merely believing is NOT SAVING FAITH.. James 2:19.. i pray you read your bibles and repent so you can be filled with the HOLY GHOST. NO HOLY GHOST NO SALVATION. wow..

[BrothaMinister]

and who said they were atheists? the theif on the cross couldnt recieve the infilling because Jesus was not yet glorified up in heaven.. John 16:7, 7:37-39; acts 1:4-8. please read your bible my friend your error is terrible. this is exact reason why we NEED to defend gospel. its not nonsense its just people like you talk without knowing.. you have zeal without knowledge. its people like you who give christianity a bad name. talking without backing it up with scripture..