strike three: your definition of idolatry doesn't jive with the idolatry mentioned in the bible or the dictionary for that matter. idolatry is concerned with graven images or statue effigies to other gods. it's not concerned with people and ideas. and what a silly argument to make! of course if i don't believe in a thing, other things take precedence. you're out!
strike 2: atheism itself offers nothing. it is simply a lack of belief in something that is not supported with sufficient evidence. it is a default position on a claim. everything else is subjective. most atheists are grateful for the clarity they get when they've done away with the shady veil of religion and are better able to see, understand, and accept the world on it's own terms but that's just a side effect, really.
strike 1: most people (including christians) don't base their morals on the bible- otherwise the pre and extramarital sex stats in this country would be much lower and the killing rate for deadly sins would be much higher. your morals are presumably mostly based on an evolved sense of secular humanism that tells you that killing those of other faiths or killing people who work on sunday is a bad thing
Dude filming while driving is worse then texting. And I hate that argument you can't prove God's not there!!! Well you also can't prove Unicorns aren't real.
Morals HAVE decided their own morals. Men wrote the book you claim discusses your morals. The very god you see as wonderful is guilty of the worst horrors ever conceived. He had Jephthah sacrifice his own daughter as payment for victory in battle. He slays children for no real reason. Lot gave his daughters to a mob who raped them again and again while he sat in his home listening to 2 angels tell him what a good guy he is. Tell me I'm wrong.
This is just so so so completely wrong, what was moral yes is decided by the people, but no what ever "god" (if there even is one) deems to be moral will also change over time and god is very very inconsistent.
Your thoughts also make god out to be some sort of fascist dictator, what he says goes even though many people do not agree on it. you also make atheism out to be like democracy, and i would much rather be in a democratic society than one run by a dictator.
Your argument for a moral absolute given by god breaks down with even a small amount of scrutiny. The bible that you so highly regard has an ever changing morality applied differently to different people at different times. The morality of the Old Testament is akin to that of a serial rapist, mass murderer, enslaving, child stoning, animal sacrificing cretin. The entire concept of original sin is immoral and ridiculous. Our morality of today is FAR superior to your god's.
That's awesome. Slavery, genocide, racism, patriarchical society, etc.+ are still on the 'good' book's side today - phew! And for a moment, I had thought it has since been externally censored on some of its more questionable claims; As to what, constituted, as moral edorsements.
For me the reason I have such an interest still in religion as an atheist is because it is everywhere in my life, whether I want it to be or not. I spent the first 19 years of my life being Christian. And a lot of it was spent deny my own personality and who I truly was. So I suppose the feeling of wasting so much of my life has left a sour taste in my mouth on religion and makes me want to speak out against it. That along with religious groups wanting to impose their beliefs in our government.
Atheism it's self does lack a "moral compass". But that is simply because atheism is the lack of belief in a god. It's not a religion, it doesn't contain any sort of dogma or philosophy on life. All of that is based solely on the individual atheist. And if you really look at society, no one bases all of their morality out of religious text alone. If we did we would still have slaves, we would stone homosexuals and other "sinners" to death. Our morality does not come from religion.
@CorkPhop Our morality comes from what we see as beneficial to society. Morality is better to NOT be set in stone, but flexible. Our history shows us doing some horrible things and seeing it as moral. If we had some never changing morality there would be a lot more injustice in the world. Yet we are able to learn and adapt to make our society better. Like today slavery is immoral, stoning homosexuals is immoral. Eventually homophobia will become immoral. It already has for some people.
If all atheism is, is people being rebellious you would find that atheists would then be most likely to be involved in crime. Like drug abuse, and alcohol abuse. We would probably all have an interest in Satanism if we were truly rebelling against Christianity. We atheists would mostly be the losers of society. Yet most of us are not.
@CorkPhop Most atheists go to college, most scientists are atheist, percentage wise the population of atheists in prison is less then population of atheists outside of prison. (where as with Christians is it roughly the same percentage.) It just doesn't make sense. If we are these "rebellions" type of people, most of us wouldn't be were we are. It seems quite the opposite.
This is so bullshit. Most atheists die as atheists. The reason why some may convert on a death bed is simple fear of death. It's wishful thinking that there is something after death. And really what do they have to lose? They are about to die, they have already lived their life. THAT's why they convert. It's not some too little too late revelation.
What i like about the video is you actually have something to base your argument off of even though I think it is flawed. I think it is a failure to understand the atheist mentality. It isnt hard to understand the morality of us, at least me. Treat others as you are treated. Yes, the golden rule is better but it is hard in our human nature to follow.
You prove god to me and I will believe in god. It isnt my job to disprove you because you have numbers, it doesnt make your point more valid.
@CurryCobra He can't prove God to you, you of to go at God for yourself, all he can do is point or lead you to God. so if you really want to find out if there is a God, then look up videos like "how to get to know God" and you will see for yourself, just have faith an follow what the videos say,If you keep saying its santa or tooth fairy then that tell me you dont really want to find out. how will you know if you dont try? give God a try. love you man.
@classiq876 I used to be a christian, that is why I am where i am. If people are making the claim god exists they should be able to back it up, it is not my responsibility to prove or disprove your claim. If you are comfortable living as a christian that is fine with me, these are just my thoughts.
@CurryCob All the glory to God, well sometimes people last thier faith because of the so call christian that they associate with at church, and sometime we never develop a relationship with God, so its hard for us to have a testimony of our own, sometimes when you are young and your parent or family force God on you, you reject him and accept wat orther people say.i dont know why you turn your back on God, but you know God you know he is real deep down in your heart pls try God agaim
@classiq876 I remember I was in my teens when I ultimately decided god didnt exist. I know the feeling of having a relationship with god. I think the case here is that you do not understand how we think. Im not trying to be insulting either. I just think that for someone who may have grown up believing all their life it is hard to conceive of how we feel about it. I genuinely feel in my heart that god does not exist. This is from many variables that I got this view, not just one.
@CurryCobra Well i think its safe 2 say if you dont, believe in God you dont believe in satan, the only thing i can say is that satan have a strong hold on you, and u need to be free, there are more people that believe in God than there are people that dont, so that alone should tell u something, if you were in a relationship with God u wouldv'e seen,feel,smell,dream God, so you need to try again, because anyone that truly come in contact wit God, will never be the same, love you man
as a christian i dont think the humanity is not capable of enforcing a strict moral code washes i was moral before i became a christian. though he has a point that morals are sliding
I honestly believe deep down that you want to worship the flying spaghetti monster, you can't help the hunger you feel for him! kneel down and repent so you may be touched by his noodley appendage! Ramen brother!
The morality argument is self contradictory. You acknowledge yourself that morality is historically fluid. Then you say that God's moral standard is unchanging. What could this possibly mean? Is God constantly out of touch with the standards of our time or is slavery ok by you? It is condoned in the Bible, so supposedly condoned by God. How do you know what God's moral standards are anyway? Because it is in the Bible? How do you know that the Bible is true? Because it says si in the Bible?
Its immoral to drive and make shitty youtube videos at the same time....sayeth the laaaawd!
God told me this so I guess you're breaking one of gods rules...shame shame. And if you question the authenticity just look at what I wrote. I clearly wrote God told me it is wrong make a video for youtube and drive at the same time. Sinner...repent !!
Your claims to moral and immoral are a false dichotomy. I think you worked yourself into a corner in the first minute of your video but I will watch the rest
When you say "fixed source of morality," do you understand what morality is? Morality is the product of HUMAN values and social standards which are inborn. In a hospital nursery, newborns cry in sympathy for one another. Our parents teach us their own moral standards and the rest are common sense. Humans are the ones who invented god, and morality. Anthony: neither I, nor anyone else needs an imaginary figure to tell us right from wrong. The god of the Bible is an immoral monster.
Well were the ultimate judge of humanity, yea. The bible is s'posedly the word of God. Yet ya' don't do everything in the bible. Personaly I don't find it refreshing that somthing will stay EXACTLY THE SAME throughout however thousands of years we exist. Not that Gods morals were REALY there throughout all of humanity... after all, Man was around for quite a while before Jesush or the Jews. The sin thing... its not consistent. We don't stone people to death now. I like our way ^ _ ^
if you think gods morality does not change you should go read your bible again.Atheism has nothing to do with morals AT ALL.Remove god from the equation slavery is immoral rape victims don't have to marry there rapists,stoning to death people for committing well just about any infraction.If those things are moral why did Jesus say stop doing it?To your alst point I think chrisitans are the one that feel threatened someone is making them question there faith.We make you wonder that scares you.
@jezuzfreek777 The Bible God isn't even consistent nor completely clear on morality. Everything can be summed up to "what God says is right is right" and you can clearly see that with all kinds of barbaric old testament laws.
If God told you to kill your son, you'd have to do it. If God told you to kill every man, woman, child AND animal in a zone, (or just spare the young girls to "marry" them aka RAPE) you'd have to do it.
You don't have good model of morality, it's an illusion.
"Our heavenly father who is the ultimate source of fixed morality is consistent. What was Moral a thousand years ago will be moral a thousand years from now... God is consistent, God judges sin the same from the beginning to the end..."
What on earth??!
Even if you believe that God was justified in doing so, different covenants or whatever, the fact remains the bible proposed a very different moral code 2000yrs ago than Christians follow today.
Morality is simply an individuals opinion based on empathy and experience. We seek out others who's opinion is similar to ours and form a society.
Morals according to the bible are some of the most evil fucking things I have ever heard so don't for one second think that because you carry the label christian you can claim a "moral highground" If someone truly followed the morality suggested by god of the bible they would be considered more evil than hitler.
@jezuzfreek777 I got past the 7 minute mark, then could take no more. I am not a rebellious teenager, I don't believe in god because I see no evidence to support it's existence. Oh and your objective morality, how is it you can see that morality changes over time, yet you cannot see, that would just go to show that it's humans that determine right and wrong. Same with muslims who really irritate me with wanting shariah law not man made law. IT'S ALL MAN MADE!!!
Face it! You are scared to die, and become dirt and FOOD for other organisms. There is no evidence to suggest that there is an afterlife. But, there is strong factual evidence that proves people die and allow for the continuation of life. YOU aren't living anymore, but you allow for life to thrive off the nutrients your decomposing body gives back to the soil. In fact when you and I die there will definitely be more daisies on your grave than mine, considering you are so full of bullshit!
God is consistent? Okay how about you try and read the bible one time. The bible is the most inconsistent book ever written especially on morals. The bible says not to kill... Then it says things like stone your wife to death for adultery.
Also if the bible is your source of morals then.... When you see fags why don't you try to kill them? If your wife cheats on you then why not stone her to death? Some morals this evil book of yours teaches.
MrJaydee827 makes the best point. and when christians today bend over backwards to excuse the morals of their god as expressed in the bible, condoning stonings and slavery, they are proving jezuzfreek777 wrong. god is condoning something immoral. christians, out of our own human innate understanding of what is wrong and right have decided these things are wrong expressly contradicting Him.
I am an atheist, but I am also buddhist. All religions are manmade, therefore we are always judging morality and always will be. I don't see a problem. I think that morals are subjective.There is no comparison between Christianity and atheism. Atheism is not exactly a system of belief, it's only the idea that one does not worship god. What of the zealous nature of Christianity? I don't try to convert anyone- why would I ? You also mistake atheist- for non-religious.
Actually, in an objective sense, Atheism as a system has no flaws, but as any other "ism" we have different views on the matter. I do, to some extent believe in an objective morality that is in humans at their very core e.g. The Golden Rule. It can be fund in the Bible, but it has been encountered long before in China and Babylon. But even if morality's objective it can only be applied subjectively and no God can change that. Even Christians differ on Biblical morality which proves my point.
That's a good point you bring up, Sir. What was moral a thousand years ago (selling your children to slavery or stoning your wife to death if it was discovered that she wasn't a virgin on the night of your wedding) is still as moral today as it was then. It's so refreshing that that bitch'll pay in this life and the next! :)
Your version of a god is a horrific source of morality. . . Your version of a god was made up by man and christianity mythology cames from the an ancient book written by men. . Grow up
Atheist is the rejection of a notion of a version of god . .including your version of a god/gods. . Hitler was a christian. . Bin laden was a muslim. . Saddam Hussain was a muslim. .You need to read other books besides your ancient text.
yes i've seen a dead before. i dont know anything about those vids but i think a god could find a much better way to prove it's existence (infinitely more believable ways really).
@fudgeyoulop i watched the Bernadette video.. i don't get it though, sorry. As for what I believe when a person dies: I believe nothing happens. Death is not a process. Death is "moment" an animal ceases to live... life in our case being brain and heart working simultaneously.
@fudgeyoulop nooo. the word atheist is someone who doesn't believe that any gods/deities exist [not Yahweh, not Christ, not Vishnu, et cetera]. and human bodies leave their skin?? i dunno what that means, mate.
@fudgeyoulop and as i said these so called atheists you mention are, indeed, very bad people. The problem there is that these evil men ordered killings and these orders were carried out mostly by thousands-millions of religious people. ps. If Bin Laden was an atheist, 9/11 was a sham. My point is that not believing in god doesn't make anyone bad.
@fudgeyoulop umm.. The topic i raised was the first one raised in this video [maybe you forgot]. -MORALITY i say my bit.. you then reply to my comment saying you can list 1000 atheist murderers. fine. i respond to this then you go all hostile on me. what's the problem? And what does the info on my account have to do with anything. enough bollocks.. stay on point or don't bother.
@fudgeyoulop Yeah.. insults will make what i said be apparently wrong, won't it. take it easy with the trash and say why you're right or why i'm wrong.
@DDazzle1 you asked me to name one jew or christian...... the bible is very clear when it commands to terminate homosexuals, disobedient brats and kaffirs. respond intelligibly
@fudgeyoulop Just understand... I'm not saying that the religious are less moral than atheists. I'm saying that we definitely don't get our morality from a book.
@fudgeyoulop know what, mate? you can keep your list. Yahweh murdered loads of gays and bad kids. Oh.. and then he killed everyone on earth! Bring the Stalin-Hitler argument. Neither Hitler (probably a Christian scumbag) nor Stalin (a clearly atheist scumbag) never killed a single person. However, the scumbags ordered the deaths of bakillions of people. These orders were followed by religious people. Oh yeah! That Satan guy went on a murder spree and killed 7 people!TOTAL! Now that's outrageous!
So stoning an unruly child at the edge of town is moral? Forcing a woman who has been raped to marry her rapist is moral? Slavery is moral? Killing your neighbor, friend, or family member who works on the sabbath is moral? These were all laws found in your filthy book and according to you, they should be moral now. The bible is filled with some of the most immoral and vile "laws" and actions and here you are trumpeting that they were moral then and should be moral now. Open your eyes.
God is consistent . .(Deuteronomy 22:28-29 NLT) If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father. Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her. . . . This is gods law and it is horrific . . Man has advanced morality . . . Your version of god laws are straight up evil. . . Deut 22:20-21 . . . Exodus 31:12-15 . . 2 Kings 2:23-24 . . Just to name a few.
of course the morality you get from your god is unchanging... which is why the jews, christians and islamics of today still kill magicians, disobedient children, non-believers(each other) and homosexuals. let's go start a genocide ma christian brotha!
@JSernProductions That what I'm saying 10 and 2 MF'er. Besides the flawed arguments the part that offends me is the lack of attentive driving. Yes biblical morality is nonexistent and contradictory at best but we can all agree that texting while driving is bad and filming PSAs while driving is punishable by eternal damnation.
Where is this objective morality? If it exists in the mind of God then it is subjective, it is not a property of the universe. Point out to me where or what an objective morality would be like, or what it is. I can describe to you an atom, and objectively it exists outside of me. But what is this morality you say exists? Where is it? Woven into the fabric of the universe?
Just because one calls himself a christian doesn't mean he is one. You see a so called Christian kill someone, you can definitely question him. Do you understand the Bible? Have you actually read it? Ugh, people......ITS IN THE TEN COMMANDMENTS!!! Thou shall not kill. I mean you don't even have to dig that deep. We call these people hypocrites NOT Christians.
Don't be surprised if it's going to be like sodom and gomorrah all over again, because it will.
It's going to be like the movie "Salo" all over, no rules, no law, just perversion. No, I'm not even saying atheism leads to... I'm saying many different things including atheism will lead to it. Even "trivial" things like the internet are part of why. Just look at "recent" progression, what was pornography in the 1920's would be normal streetwear nowadays, actually quite conservative street wear.
@coffeeandsugar20 Atheists don't like religions infringement on other peoples rights... I myself like all people, it's just when people start using religion to project their insecurities i.e calling homosexuality a sin.
@TheBiddleMan One thinking homosexuality is wrong does not portray that person as being insecure. Most of those people who suggest homoism is wrong simply base their conclusion / logic of homosexuality as simply being not-natural. On the contrary, U, automatically assuming someone's "insecurities" being an example of them for thinking homosexuality is a "SIN" is U religiously infringing on other people's RIGHTS. And if U R an atheist? Which seems U R. Doing such, as U did. Makes U a hypocrite.
I'll give you credit to some degree; clearly you've thought some of these things through. Unfortunately, your argument fails on account of the fact that belief in God isn't a necessary condition for moral behavior. Evolution gives us a thorough understanding as to why it is that human beings have the moral sentiments that we do. The only reason that these things change is because of social contracts that have liberated groups of people, thereby taking them into our spheres of moral consideration
Atheism is a lack of belief in gods. It includes no positive beliefs. It doesn't impose any guidelines for morality, self-worship, proselytizing or fealty to atheism.
Wow, you disabled the like/dis like on this video, what surprise judging from the fact that christians dont like being shown how wrong they are. Atheists are moral with no threat of eternal damnation, ergo, Atheists are more moral then any christian, end of story.
Cry out to your god for what? "Please, let me be your slave for the rest of my existence, even though you need nothing and it would make no difference to you either way?" "Please, keep me drugged with happiness in heaven while other people I love may be suffering below?" No thanks. Even if you could prove your god exists to me, that wouldn't make me want to be anywhere near him. If this life isn't enough for you, then who's heart is truely empty?
This succeeded to give me a good laugh. Great job, buddy. You have proven to me that religious dumbasses like you are the most ignorant people in the world.
My problem with christianity is that it assumes that humans are inherently sinful without religion. Why did I become an atheist and I have no desire to fornicate and wreak devilish havoc? I'm the same person. I think I actually have better morality since renouncing religion. I think you are just afraid of enjoying life.
@CarolAnnMclean You are not correct. Christianity assumes that people are inherently sinful without religion OR with it. Humans are sinful. Becoming a Christian does not mean that someone no longer desires the things of the flesh. Trust me, it would be nice. Becoming a true believer simply means that one's sins are forgiven, but it is still a constant struggle.
Atheism does have a fixed source of morality. Through evolution, man the ape developed a moral code, common today in most cultures, that allowed groups to work together and thrive. This has been developing since man walked upright and is still developing, Because our moral code evolved, to our surprise :0 atheists are mostly very moral people. This is because morality never actually came directly from religion. Religion has been a way to justify our already existing morality as a social animal.
Hey your right. I was wondering how to deal with my wife sleeping with another man. Now I know I'll bring her into the town square and me and the citizens can stone her to death. I would do it myself because my wife is kinda've shy but I need to go chop off my hand for masturbating earlier today. Thank god morality is a constant that never changes.
No Jezuzfreek I don't have a hunger for god. I do however; have a problem with people who WANT to desperately believe a god exists to force their beliefs onto me. To force me to live how they want me to live which I don't agree with. That is what I hunger to get rid of because it is a blight on humanity and stifles society from progressing.
Ahh crap we need to bring back slavery because it was moral a thousand years ago when god decided it was moral. I guess humanity coming to terms with slavery as being immoral must be disobeying gods moral decision making. Does Jezuzfreek even think at all before he speaks? I can't believe that someone would be this ignorant unless they were trying to be satire.
Wow, just watched the rest of the video. You are a complete dick, your own god commands you not to mock and here you are mocking atheists. Nearly every minute if this video is you insulting others for daring to have an opinion that differs from yours. I have to tell you, if we were face to face and you were insulting me like this, I would put my fucking fist through your fucking face.
I could not get beyond the first 18 seconds before seeing your first strawman. If you are going to make claims, at least make honest claims, atheists will always define themselves, we don't need you to tell us anything about what you think we are, or are not. There is no "ism", it is a misnomer. You claim there is a god, the burden of proof lies with you and all your tired arguments and dumb arguments do nothing to prove it.
Morals are different for everyone. And don't tell me Christians are morally superior. "God" will forgive you no matter what you do. Making the 10 commandments pointless.
Morality is absolute. Not absolute because God made it so. Just absolute, period. Humans have endeavored, throughout their history, to determine what that absolute morality is. Reality is not black and white, but grey. Sometimes we believe we are in the right when we are wrong. Sometimes there is no right, but only lesser and greater evils. But morality is still absolute. Christian morality, however, has changed over time, as it is a human construct. "God" once approved of polygamy, did he not?
Morals were here long before man created your god. Even way back before belief in Zeus. That is where the men who wrote the bible got them from. God is a cartoon like Sponge Bob. A man made fictional character from a man made fictional book. Theists just have no interest in the truth. Content with their beliefs they are. They cry out for truth but can't seem to find it. You have been well conditioned by your religious cult. Too bad it is not true. If you think it through you to can find truth.
Is it not better for humanity to judge? To observe, rationalise, and the golden rule is the ultimate way to judge what is moral. If we did not have that, slavery would still be perfectly fine according to exodus and Leviticus. Also, is long hair for a guy immoral? Paul says so (ironic with Jesus), same for girls with short hair. Read your bible, then you'll understand the "great morality" your bible promotes. We only don't want our position misunderstood, sorry if you take offence in that.
You can let some perceived 'authority' do the judging if you like but you can't escape the fact that YOU made the decision to do so. YOU are the ultimate authority responsible for your morals whether you like it or not.
Listen to what you are saying: "Whenever we ALLOW humanity to judge what is right and wrong." 'Allow'?? Have a think about what this word means.
3. Are you seriously arguing that proselytizing is wrong? Religions do not bother me. "Moral Laws" that religious people try to create bother me. Religious people telling others that they are worthless unless they believe this crap; telling children and the dying that they will go to hell unless they believe bothers me.
4. Name some of these (and link that video)or drop this. I know not of a single non-believer who does this. Clearly you have not seen Hitchens.
1.Fixed morality is not what you want, nor is it what you have in Christianity else you would still promote slavery and oppression of women. Morals change over time as we refine our understanding of what causes suffering in the world. This is what you want, not dictated absolutes. You need only look to Muslim theocracies to see that.
2.Assumes your god exists, in order to argue that it is wrong to do something that your god supposedly thinks is bad. You would first have to prove your god.
You are right about why Atheist truly spend so much time bashing what they call nonsensical. They truly have a rebellious spirit. Speaking as someone who looked at God as a being that wanted my praise and wanted to make me a servant only praising and worshiping 24/7. I actually believed this. But thank God for the wake up call.
@kennethhennig That's an ad hominem. How is it nonsense? Objective morality and subjective morality are two different things. Go grab a philosophy book. As for Thor, there is evidence of the Christian God, there is no evidence for Thor. PM me and I'll send you some links. :)
@kennethhennig I'm sorry if you are having trouble understanding. Objective and subjective morals are two different things. By your logic humans disobeying God in The Bible proves that God doesn't exist, which is a non sequitur.
@kennethhennig I'm pretty sure that whether or not God exists humanity could still decide what is moral and what isn't. It is just that with atheism no objective standard of morality exists.
@blondetrumpetboy what you are asking for is actually an absolute standard. This is an important distinction. An objective standard that is not a god would be that which causes suffering in conscious creatures.
This is not absolute however since our understanding of what causes suffering will change as we understand other creatures more.
Secondly, when calling a god the standard; one must address the Euthyphro dilemma. Which I have yet to see a theist take a shot at.
@AndreisEntaro If you do a google search of the Euthyphro dilemma then you will see that theists have already responded and resolved the supposed issue.
@blondetrumpetboy I will apologize for the lack of clarity, as soon as I posted that first one I realized the vagueness but naively hoped you would catch my meaning. I do not ask you to rehearse the standard arguments with me. What I ask is, which response do you take to be valid (there are several) and in any case, how do you justify your god as an objective standard when the moral commands given in the monotheistic holy books turn out to be clearly immoral as we learn more about the world?
@blondetrumpetboy One must also consider whether we want an absolute standard?
Would you ever think it right to kill one innocent to save 1 million? Is there a conceivable situation under which you might think it immoral to let so many die just to avoid violating "thou shalt not kill"? What do you say for the popular Trolley problem under absolutism?
If you are going to argue for Absolutist Ethics on YouTube, I suggest you begin at Euthyphro and then demonstrate the value of absolute claims.
@blondetrumpetboy One must also consider whether we want an absolute standard?
Would you ever think it right to kill one innocent to save 1 million? Is there a conceivable situation under which you might think it immoral to let so many die just to avoid violating "thou shalt not kill"? What do you say for the popular Trolley problem under absolutism?
If you are going to argue for Absolutist Ethics on YouTube, I suggest you begin at Euthyphro and then demonstrate the value of absolute claims.
Ha ha, "Whenever we allow humanity, human kind, I should say, to judge what is right and what is wrong, we leave alot of leeway for mistakes." Yea, right. Taking moral judjement from your bible is still allowing human kind to judge what is right and what is wrong. It's just one of many systems that are made by humans. Everything you're talking about is made by humans, it's just that in your mind something else wrote the bible.
Your argument is interesting but doesn't stand up. The Bible is full of conflicting messages about morality. The Bible says "Thou shalt not kill" but is full of passages like "Thus saith the LORD of hosts... Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass." (I Samuel 15:2-3)
This is only representative. There are many other examples. Please explain this 'unchanging' morality.
To summarize. You list a bunch of things that Christians "have". But it is only things you BELIEVE you have (support in time of crisis from God etc.) . If there is no God, it does not matter how many people think humanity is not sufficient or not, it is just not there. These are not flaws in atheism. You cannot use your need for God to exist as an argument for it to exist. I wish I was Tom Cruise but it's not going to happen even if I think my life is empty without Katie Holmes :-)
I think your point is completely moot. An atheist doesn't believe there's a God (let's not argue semantics) so if she's right, then the Bible and all the morality you take for absolute and love is only the work of men. Since you can't prove the existence of an absolute morality (even roman catholics and protestants disagree on many things), you can only say that it'd be nice for an absolute morality to exist. But that does not prove or disprove anything and is certainly not a flaw in Atheism.
Came here to thumb this bullshit down. Why do these crazy friggin religious people disable comments all the time? They afraid of being wrong so they cover their eyes and ears so it isn't true?
your "fixed" source of morality is an old book. how is that a better source than my source ? remember: the percentage of atheists in prison is very low. now who has the better source ?
After all the years on youtube Jezuzfreek777 still don't grasp what the word "atheist" means he still think it's a whole belief system who need's to evangelise. It's truly sad how blind this man is. It's like "monkey see no evil, monkey hear no evil, monkey speak no evil"
You said "What was moral a thousand years ago will be moral a thousand years from now". You're speaking in Theistic terms of course and I presume you think the same applies 2+ thousand years ago, when the God Yahweh was ordering rape and ethnic cleansing, as well as extreme punishment like stoning for gathering firewood on the Sabbath. Is that preferable to reasoned atheistic morality? Let alone Christianity's bloody history: the Albigensian Crusades, the Inquisition, treatment of heretics etc.
Believing in something with no proof, that was written about thousands of years ago, by people who weren't even present during the events (New Testament was written at least 30 years after the supposed events occurred), is a little to me, like believing in Unicorns or fairies. If someone believed in this, and were trying to get it taught in schools, wouldn't that bother you? Or if "One nation under unicorns" was read out by children? Try and think critically.
Morality. I know that it is wrong to hurt people, because when I get hurt, I don't like it. So, I treat people the way I want to be treated - I know it is 'wrong' to physically, as well as emotionally hurt people. I am capable of being a good person because it's the right thing to do, not because of any reward I'm going to get. Attributing morality to a Christian god is ridiculous, considering the violence of the old testament. Try reading it.
My atheism is an extension of my curiosity, that puzzled look on people's faces when something just doesn't make sense; impossible to rebel against something that isn't there. Atheism's necessary ideas that make up the fundamental basis for its conclusions have positive impact: rationalism and an honest appraisal of our existence. So how can we ever be truly honest about something if we cannot confirm it? I don't 'know' if there is a god but I know I'm a good person. I'm content.
"you don't listen and you don't care what we say or think."
Hear hear!
And it isn't just JF repeating himself over and over. It's the churches. I sneak in every once so often just to see what" they have to say now."
But one thing is different.....they don't get the same herd reaction from the adherants as it once was several years ago. I believe, I can safely say, more than few adherants are starting to think about " those hell bound atheists who have no morals".
As a moral realist, I don't think morality is "decided" by anyone, men or gods, but is discovered by reason. Objective facts, like the size of the moon, can't be decided upon, but only discovered.
Of course, our reasoning isn't perfect, but as we discuss and argue about morality, and reach something like a growing consensus, our moral beliefs are better refined. Our beliefs change, but the facts don't.
Trusting this process isn't idolatry, we don't worship ourselves or think we're infallible.
You're aware that Christians proselytize and evangelize, as you perceive atheists as doing. Is it reasonable to conclude that Christians are trying to disabuse the people they evangelize to of already held religious or philosophical beliefs? Or that Christians are intimidated or threatened by non-Christian religious or philosophical beliefs? If not, then why conclude from atheistic evangelism that atheists want to tread on the beliefs of Christians, or are intimidated by Christianity?
I'm surprised that you perpetuate in this video the trope that atheists "cry out to god" in times of crisis or on their deathbed. I'd like to know if you've actually seen atheists genuinely do this, or personally know any that have done this, or if you've heard that they do this from other people. Many claims have been made to the effect that famous atheists recant at or near death, but these claims turn out to be untrue or unjustified (Darwin, Sartre, Darrow, etc).
Dude, you need to pay attention to the road by not talking to yourself in the car, because one of these days you're gonna cause an accident and that would be, you guessed it, immoral. You can take your arguments about moral relativism to the judge.
strike three: your definition of idolatry doesn't jive with the idolatry mentioned in the bible or the dictionary for that matter. idolatry is concerned with graven images or statue effigies to other gods. it's not concerned with people and ideas. and what a silly argument to make! of course if i don't believe in a thing, other things take precedence. you're out!
bencamp18 2 weeks ago
strike 2: atheism itself offers nothing. it is simply a lack of belief in something that is not supported with sufficient evidence. it is a default position on a claim. everything else is subjective. most atheists are grateful for the clarity they get when they've done away with the shady veil of religion and are better able to see, understand, and accept the world on it's own terms but that's just a side effect, really.
bencamp18 2 weeks ago
strike 1: most people (including christians) don't base their morals on the bible- otherwise the pre and extramarital sex stats in this country would be much lower and the killing rate for deadly sins would be much higher. your morals are presumably mostly based on an evolved sense of secular humanism that tells you that killing those of other faiths or killing people who work on sunday is a bad thing
bencamp18 2 weeks ago
Dude filming while driving is worse then texting. And I hate that argument you can't prove God's not there!!! Well you also can't prove Unicorns aren't real.
ElDuderino165 3 weeks ago
HUUURRRRR DUUURRRRRR DDDDUURRRRRRR
Dylan20121 3 weeks ago
The Bibles the reason i'm an atheist, if you use it as a moral compass then i'm very worried.
'Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.”: Voltaire
AndyCielecki 1 month ago
Morals HAVE decided their own morals. Men wrote the book you claim discusses your morals. The very god you see as wonderful is guilty of the worst horrors ever conceived. He had Jephthah sacrifice his own daughter as payment for victory in battle. He slays children for no real reason. Lot gave his daughters to a mob who raped them again and again while he sat in his home listening to 2 angels tell him what a good guy he is. Tell me I'm wrong.
druidic6 1 month ago
This is just so so so completely wrong, what was moral yes is decided by the people, but no what ever "god" (if there even is one) deems to be moral will also change over time and god is very very inconsistent.
Your thoughts also make god out to be some sort of fascist dictator, what he says goes even though many people do not agree on it. you also make atheism out to be like democracy, and i would much rather be in a democratic society than one run by a dictator.
RoboticBirdPlanes 1 month ago in playlist Uploaded videos
Your argument for a moral absolute given by god breaks down with even a small amount of scrutiny. The bible that you so highly regard has an ever changing morality applied differently to different people at different times. The morality of the Old Testament is akin to that of a serial rapist, mass murderer, enslaving, child stoning, animal sacrificing cretin. The entire concept of original sin is immoral and ridiculous. Our morality of today is FAR superior to your god's.
ultim4t32 1 month ago
That's awesome. Slavery, genocide, racism, patriarchical society, etc.+ are still on the 'good' book's side today - phew! And for a moment, I had thought it has since been externally censored on some of its more questionable claims; As to what, constituted, as moral edorsements.
7hart2 1 month ago
For me the reason I have such an interest still in religion as an atheist is because it is everywhere in my life, whether I want it to be or not. I spent the first 19 years of my life being Christian. And a lot of it was spent deny my own personality and who I truly was. So I suppose the feeling of wasting so much of my life has left a sour taste in my mouth on religion and makes me want to speak out against it. That along with religious groups wanting to impose their beliefs in our government.
CorkPhop 1 month ago in playlist Uploaded videos
Atheism it's self does lack a "moral compass". But that is simply because atheism is the lack of belief in a god. It's not a religion, it doesn't contain any sort of dogma or philosophy on life. All of that is based solely on the individual atheist. And if you really look at society, no one bases all of their morality out of religious text alone. If we did we would still have slaves, we would stone homosexuals and other "sinners" to death. Our morality does not come from religion.
CorkPhop 1 month ago in playlist Uploaded videos
@CorkPhop Our morality comes from what we see as beneficial to society. Morality is better to NOT be set in stone, but flexible. Our history shows us doing some horrible things and seeing it as moral. If we had some never changing morality there would be a lot more injustice in the world. Yet we are able to learn and adapt to make our society better. Like today slavery is immoral, stoning homosexuals is immoral. Eventually homophobia will become immoral. It already has for some people.
CorkPhop 1 month ago in playlist Uploaded videos
If all atheism is, is people being rebellious you would find that atheists would then be most likely to be involved in crime. Like drug abuse, and alcohol abuse. We would probably all have an interest in Satanism if we were truly rebelling against Christianity. We atheists would mostly be the losers of society. Yet most of us are not.
CorkPhop 1 month ago in playlist Uploaded videos
@CorkPhop Most atheists go to college, most scientists are atheist, percentage wise the population of atheists in prison is less then population of atheists outside of prison. (where as with Christians is it roughly the same percentage.) It just doesn't make sense. If we are these "rebellions" type of people, most of us wouldn't be were we are. It seems quite the opposite.
CorkPhop 1 month ago in playlist Uploaded videos
This is so bullshit. Most atheists die as atheists. The reason why some may convert on a death bed is simple fear of death. It's wishful thinking that there is something after death. And really what do they have to lose? They are about to die, they have already lived their life. THAT's why they convert. It's not some too little too late revelation.
CorkPhop 1 month ago in playlist Uploaded videos
What i like about the video is you actually have something to base your argument off of even though I think it is flawed. I think it is a failure to understand the atheist mentality. It isnt hard to understand the morality of us, at least me. Treat others as you are treated. Yes, the golden rule is better but it is hard in our human nature to follow.
You prove god to me and I will believe in god. It isnt my job to disprove you because you have numbers, it doesnt make your point more valid.
CurryCobra 1 month ago
@CurryCobra He can't prove God to you, you of to go at God for yourself, all he can do is point or lead you to God. so if you really want to find out if there is a God, then look up videos like "how to get to know God" and you will see for yourself, just have faith an follow what the videos say,If you keep saying its santa or tooth fairy then that tell me you dont really want to find out. how will you know if you dont try? give God a try. love you man.
classiq876 1 month ago
@classiq876 I used to be a christian, that is why I am where i am. If people are making the claim god exists they should be able to back it up, it is not my responsibility to prove or disprove your claim. If you are comfortable living as a christian that is fine with me, these are just my thoughts.
CurryCobra 1 month ago
Comment removed
CurryCobra 1 month ago
@CurryCob All the glory to God, well sometimes people last thier faith because of the so call christian that they associate with at church, and sometime we never develop a relationship with God, so its hard for us to have a testimony of our own, sometimes when you are young and your parent or family force God on you, you reject him and accept wat orther people say.i dont know why you turn your back on God, but you know God you know he is real deep down in your heart pls try God agaim
classiq876 1 month ago
@classiq876 I remember I was in my teens when I ultimately decided god didnt exist. I know the feeling of having a relationship with god. I think the case here is that you do not understand how we think. Im not trying to be insulting either. I just think that for someone who may have grown up believing all their life it is hard to conceive of how we feel about it. I genuinely feel in my heart that god does not exist. This is from many variables that I got this view, not just one.
CurryCobra 1 month ago
@CurryCobra Well i think its safe 2 say if you dont, believe in God you dont believe in satan, the only thing i can say is that satan have a strong hold on you, and u need to be free, there are more people that believe in God than there are people that dont, so that alone should tell u something, if you were in a relationship with God u wouldv'e seen,feel,smell,dream God, so you need to try again, because anyone that truly come in contact wit God, will never be the same, love you man
classiq876 1 month ago
Well, this was bullshit.
SvartEld 2 months ago
as a christian i dont think the humanity is not capable of enforcing a strict moral code washes i was moral before i became a christian. though he has a point that morals are sliding
LONGFELLOW1483 2 months ago
Is it immoral to talk on your cell phone or make shitty apologetics videos while driving a motor vehicle along a public road?
dingodavid 2 months ago
Yahweh or the highway.
MoNsTeRHoGGeR 2 months ago
I honestly believe deep down that you want to worship the flying spaghetti monster, you can't help the hunger you feel for him! kneel down and repent so you may be touched by his noodley appendage! Ramen brother!
satanisthetruegod666 2 months ago
The morality argument is self contradictory. You acknowledge yourself that morality is historically fluid. Then you say that God's moral standard is unchanging. What could this possibly mean? Is God constantly out of touch with the standards of our time or is slavery ok by you? It is condoned in the Bible, so supposedly condoned by God. How do you know what God's moral standards are anyway? Because it is in the Bible? How do you know that the Bible is true? Because it says si in the Bible?
MrMonkeyInk 2 months ago
Its immoral to drive and make shitty youtube videos at the same time....sayeth the laaaawd!
God told me this so I guess you're breaking one of gods rules...shame shame. And if you question the authenticity just look at what I wrote. I clearly wrote God told me it is wrong make a video for youtube and drive at the same time. Sinner...repent !!
lemmegoski 2 months ago
Your claims to moral and immoral are a false dichotomy. I think you worked yourself into a corner in the first minute of your video but I will watch the rest
IzzySpeaks 2 months ago
When you say "fixed source of morality," do you understand what morality is? Morality is the product of HUMAN values and social standards which are inborn. In a hospital nursery, newborns cry in sympathy for one another. Our parents teach us their own moral standards and the rest are common sense. Humans are the ones who invented god, and morality. Anthony: neither I, nor anyone else needs an imaginary figure to tell us right from wrong. The god of the Bible is an immoral monster.
Christheatheist1 2 months ago
"Whenever WE allow humanity to judge what is right and what is wrong, WE leave a lot of leeway for mistakes"
Who exactly is this great "WE" who 'allows' such things?
Humanity by any chance??
Hufflewaffle 2 months ago
Well were the ultimate judge of humanity, yea. The bible is s'posedly the word of God. Yet ya' don't do everything in the bible. Personaly I don't find it refreshing that somthing will stay EXACTLY THE SAME throughout however thousands of years we exist. Not that Gods morals were REALY there throughout all of humanity... after all, Man was around for quite a while before Jesush or the Jews. The sin thing... its not consistent. We don't stone people to death now. I like our way ^ _ ^
Satankitteh 2 months ago
if you think gods morality does not change you should go read your bible again.Atheism has nothing to do with morals AT ALL.Remove god from the equation slavery is immoral rape victims don't have to marry there rapists,stoning to death people for committing well just about any infraction.If those things are moral why did Jesus say stop doing it?To your alst point I think chrisitans are the one that feel threatened someone is making them question there faith.We make you wonder that scares you.
alltiedup217 2 months ago
i was hoping the comments here were unjust.
But they are well warranted.
The bible is NOT consistent at all.
Weather it was his plan all along it isn't consistent.
sailornaruto39 2 months ago
@jezuzfreek777 The Bible God isn't even consistent nor completely clear on morality. Everything can be summed up to "what God says is right is right" and you can clearly see that with all kinds of barbaric old testament laws.
If God told you to kill your son, you'd have to do it. If God told you to kill every man, woman, child AND animal in a zone, (or just spare the young girls to "marry" them aka RAPE) you'd have to do it.
You don't have good model of morality, it's an illusion.
DogmasDemise 2 months ago in playlist Uploaded videos
funny, God's morality does not change? it is consistent? why is there a new testament than?
imnodog 2 months ago in playlist Uploaded videos
"Our heavenly father who is the ultimate source of fixed morality is consistent. What was Moral a thousand years ago will be moral a thousand years from now... God is consistent, God judges sin the same from the beginning to the end..."
What on earth??!
Even if you believe that God was justified in doing so, different covenants or whatever, the fact remains the bible proposed a very different moral code 2000yrs ago than Christians follow today.
No excuse me whilst I go and beat my slave. ^_^
SAHBfan 2 months ago
Morality is simply an individuals opinion based on empathy and experience. We seek out others who's opinion is similar to ours and form a society.
Morals according to the bible are some of the most evil fucking things I have ever heard so don't for one second think that because you carry the label christian you can claim a "moral highground" If someone truly followed the morality suggested by god of the bible they would be considered more evil than hitler.
VeritasLuxMea100 2 months ago
THE FACT THAT YOUR RECORDING IN A FUCKING CAR TELLS EVERYTHING...PISS OFF CUNT
Kingwadesky 2 months ago
@jezuzfreek777 I got past the 7 minute mark, then could take no more. I am not a rebellious teenager, I don't believe in god because I see no evidence to support it's existence. Oh and your objective morality, how is it you can see that morality changes over time, yet you cannot see, that would just go to show that it's humans that determine right and wrong. Same with muslims who really irritate me with wanting shariah law not man made law. IT'S ALL MAN MADE!!!
Bornofbadger 3 months ago
it doesn't matter if your religion offers a moral code, mine offers cookies but that doesn't make it any more fact.
SongsByTheBeatles 3 months ago
"Ratings have been disabled for this video" because he's afraid of the results: 99% THUMBS DOWN.
LaVraiVerite 3 months ago
my christian mom and dad believed totally in "spare the rod, spoil the child".
wp4866 3 months ago
Why the hell is he driving while filming?
OhreallyGolly 3 months ago
Do you know the term "Jesus freak" is pejorative? Why would you embrace this?
SiGhast 3 months ago
Face it! You are scared to die, and become dirt and FOOD for other organisms. There is no evidence to suggest that there is an afterlife. But, there is strong factual evidence that proves people die and allow for the continuation of life. YOU aren't living anymore, but you allow for life to thrive off the nutrients your decomposing body gives back to the soil. In fact when you and I die there will definitely be more daisies on your grave than mine, considering you are so full of bullshit!
harryharryman1 3 months ago
God is consistent? Okay how about you try and read the bible one time. The bible is the most inconsistent book ever written especially on morals. The bible says not to kill... Then it says things like stone your wife to death for adultery.
Also if the bible is your source of morals then.... When you see fags why don't you try to kill them? If your wife cheats on you then why not stone her to death? Some morals this evil book of yours teaches.
I had to end this nonsense at 1:48 lol.
100101010101010100 3 months ago
MrJaydee827 makes the best point. and when christians today bend over backwards to excuse the morals of their god as expressed in the bible, condoning stonings and slavery, they are proving jezuzfreek777 wrong. god is condoning something immoral. christians, out of our own human innate understanding of what is wrong and right have decided these things are wrong expressly contradicting Him.
castelgandalf 4 months ago
I am an atheist, but I am also buddhist. All religions are manmade, therefore we are always judging morality and always will be. I don't see a problem. I think that morals are subjective.There is no comparison between Christianity and atheism. Atheism is not exactly a system of belief, it's only the idea that one does not worship god. What of the zealous nature of Christianity? I don't try to convert anyone- why would I ? You also mistake atheist- for non-religious.
ubiquitousfacts 4 months ago
Actually, in an objective sense, Atheism as a system has no flaws, but as any other "ism" we have different views on the matter. I do, to some extent believe in an objective morality that is in humans at their very core e.g. The Golden Rule. It can be fund in the Bible, but it has been encountered long before in China and Babylon. But even if morality's objective it can only be applied subjectively and no God can change that. Even Christians differ on Biblical morality which proves my point.
SimonSays288 4 months ago
That's a good point you bring up, Sir. What was moral a thousand years ago (selling your children to slavery or stoning your wife to death if it was discovered that she wasn't a virgin on the night of your wedding) is still as moral today as it was then. It's so refreshing that that bitch'll pay in this life and the next! :)
MrJaydee827 4 months ago
god is a cunt ALLAH FOR EVA
upgradecheese 4 months ago
@upgradecheese allah is Arabic for god
seanfleming2 4 months ago in playlist More videos from jezuzfreek777
Your version of a god is a horrific source of morality. . . Your version of a god was made up by man and christianity mythology cames from the an ancient book written by men. . Grow up
0019josh7100 4 months ago
@fudgeyoulop
Atheist is the rejection of a notion of a version of god . .including your version of a god/gods. . Hitler was a christian. . Bin laden was a muslim. . Saddam Hussain was a muslim. .You need to read other books besides your ancient text.
0019josh7100 4 months ago
yes i've seen a dead before. i dont know anything about those vids but i think a god could find a much better way to prove it's existence (infinitely more believable ways really).
DDazzle1 4 months ago
@fudgeyoulop so where's the body now?
DDazzle1 4 months ago
@fudgeyoulop i watched the Bernadette video.. i don't get it though, sorry. As for what I believe when a person dies: I believe nothing happens. Death is not a process. Death is "moment" an animal ceases to live... life in our case being brain and heart working simultaneously.
DDazzle1 4 months ago
@fudgeyoulop nooo. the word atheist is someone who doesn't believe that any gods/deities exist [not Yahweh, not Christ, not Vishnu, et cetera]. and human bodies leave their skin?? i dunno what that means, mate.
DDazzle1 4 months ago
@fudgeyoulop and as i said these so called atheists you mention are, indeed, very bad people. The problem there is that these evil men ordered killings and these orders were carried out mostly by thousands-millions of religious people. ps. If Bin Laden was an atheist, 9/11 was a sham. My point is that not believing in god doesn't make anyone bad.
DDazzle1 4 months ago
@fudgeyoulop umm.. The topic i raised was the first one raised in this video [maybe you forgot]. -MORALITY i say my bit.. you then reply to my comment saying you can list 1000 atheist murderers. fine. i respond to this then you go all hostile on me. what's the problem? And what does the info on my account have to do with anything. enough bollocks.. stay on point or don't bother.
DDazzle1 4 months ago
@fudgeyoulop Yeah.. insults will make what i said be apparently wrong, won't it. take it easy with the trash and say why you're right or why i'm wrong.
DDazzle1 4 months ago
@DDazzle1 you asked me to name one jew or christian...... the bible is very clear when it commands to terminate homosexuals, disobedient brats and kaffirs. respond intelligibly
DDazzle1 4 months ago
@fudgeyoulop Just understand... I'm not saying that the religious are less moral than atheists. I'm saying that we definitely don't get our morality from a book.
DDazzle1 4 months ago
@fudgeyoulop know what, mate? you can keep your list. Yahweh murdered loads of gays and bad kids. Oh.. and then he killed everyone on earth! Bring the Stalin-Hitler argument. Neither Hitler (probably a Christian scumbag) nor Stalin (a clearly atheist scumbag) never killed a single person. However, the scumbags ordered the deaths of bakillions of people. These orders were followed by religious people. Oh yeah! That Satan guy went on a murder spree and killed 7 people!TOTAL! Now that's outrageous!
DDazzle1 4 months ago
So stoning an unruly child at the edge of town is moral? Forcing a woman who has been raped to marry her rapist is moral? Slavery is moral? Killing your neighbor, friend, or family member who works on the sabbath is moral? These were all laws found in your filthy book and according to you, they should be moral now. The bible is filled with some of the most immoral and vile "laws" and actions and here you are trumpeting that they were moral then and should be moral now. Open your eyes.
FrozenTacoMeat 4 months ago
Very, Very wise words. True wisdom on many KEY controversial topics where you hit the nail on its head. God Bless!! :)
rewilkins2 4 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Jezuzfreek777
God is consistent . .(Deuteronomy 22:28-29 NLT) If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father. Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her. . . . This is gods law and it is horrific . . Man has advanced morality . . . Your version of god laws are straight up evil. . . Deut 22:20-21 . . . Exodus 31:12-15 . . 2 Kings 2:23-24 . . Just to name a few.
0019josh7100 4 months ago
Well, I made it to 6:03 before bailing.
drumrnva 4 months ago
of course the morality you get from your god is unchanging... which is why the jews, christians and islamics of today still kill magicians, disobedient children, non-believers(each other) and homosexuals. let's go start a genocide ma christian brotha!
DDazzle1 4 months ago
Yes, and God teaches you to make a video and drive at the same time. Yeah right
JSernProductions 4 months ago
@JSernProductions That what I'm saying 10 and 2 MF'er. Besides the flawed arguments the part that offends me is the lack of attentive driving. Yes biblical morality is nonexistent and contradictory at best but we can all agree that texting while driving is bad and filming PSAs while driving is punishable by eternal damnation.
itscrazycock 4 months ago
@itscrazycock tl;dr
JSernProductions 4 months ago
Where is this objective morality? If it exists in the mind of God then it is subjective, it is not a property of the universe. Point out to me where or what an objective morality would be like, or what it is. I can describe to you an atom, and objectively it exists outside of me. But what is this morality you say exists? Where is it? Woven into the fabric of the universe?
TheBiddleMan 4 months ago
As much as it sometimes bugs me to debate with christians, I have been betrayed and stabbed in the back more by Atheists
hoogys 4 months ago
Gods system of Morality : Blind and idiotic faith. thats why you can moralise the mass killing of "witches" and other non-christian minorities.
ItsSnottyBee 4 months ago
@ItsSnottyBee
Just because one calls himself a christian doesn't mean he is one. You see a so called Christian kill someone, you can definitely question him. Do you understand the Bible? Have you actually read it? Ugh, people......ITS IN THE TEN COMMANDMENTS!!! Thou shall not kill. I mean you don't even have to dig that deep. We call these people hypocrites NOT Christians.
ScScruzer831 4 months ago
USE THE ELLIOTT ARGUMENT WHEN CONFROTED WITH ATHEISTS!!! NEVER FAILS!!!!
fivethirty 4 months ago
I was just posting this to say what happens if the higher moral ground is flawed humans.
RealTrueTarget 4 months ago
Don't be surprised if it's going to be like sodom and gomorrah all over again, because it will.
It's going to be like the movie "Salo" all over, no rules, no law, just perversion. No, I'm not even saying atheism leads to... I'm saying many different things including atheism will lead to it. Even "trivial" things like the internet are part of why. Just look at "recent" progression, what was pornography in the 1920's would be normal streetwear nowadays, actually quite conservative street wear.
RealTrueTarget 4 months ago
My issue with atheism... atheists say christians promote hatred, when they themselves are hating on every single religion.
coffeeandsugar20 4 months ago
@coffeeandsugar20 Atheists don't like religions infringement on other peoples rights... I myself like all people, it's just when people start using religion to project their insecurities i.e calling homosexuality a sin.
TheBiddleMan 4 months ago
@TheBiddleMan One thinking homosexuality is wrong does not portray that person as being insecure. Most of those people who suggest homoism is wrong simply base their conclusion / logic of homosexuality as simply being not-natural. On the contrary, U, automatically assuming someone's "insecurities" being an example of them for thinking homosexuality is a "SIN" is U religiously infringing on other people's RIGHTS. And if U R an atheist? Which seems U R. Doing such, as U did. Makes U a hypocrite.
rewilkins2 4 months ago
All religions have their UPS and DOWNS...especially YOURS!
rebelholic07 4 months ago
I'll give you credit to some degree; clearly you've thought some of these things through. Unfortunately, your argument fails on account of the fact that belief in God isn't a necessary condition for moral behavior. Evolution gives us a thorough understanding as to why it is that human beings have the moral sentiments that we do. The only reason that these things change is because of social contracts that have liberated groups of people, thereby taking them into our spheres of moral consideration
LucCole88 4 months ago
Yes slavery GOD LAW was moral then obviously it's moral now thats why as a black person in America i'm still a slave today.
JBrantleyMusic 4 months ago
I was raised in a very devout,mormon household.
I was raised by extremely kind,charitable,kind,moral parents.
I'm now an atheist,but under your theory,all the morals that I was taught growing up,suddenly vanish?
I don't need to believe in god to know not to kill people.
I don't need to believe in god to know to help people,to donate to charities,to be nice to people.
Believing in god doesn't make you any more moral than a nonbeliever.
That way of thinking is just stupid.
Politicallyactive101 4 months ago
"...whereas Christianity offers God"
Yes, but it does not actually DELIVER any god, which is why Christians' morals have changed just as much as atheists'.
djhalling 4 months ago
Atheism is a lack of belief in gods. It includes no positive beliefs. It doesn't impose any guidelines for morality, self-worship, proselytizing or fealty to atheism.
Why do you think it should?
robtbo 4 months ago
humans dont need a god for their morals.
they need each other.
god has no place in morality.
aylictal 4 months ago
Wow, you disabled the like/dis like on this video, what surprise judging from the fact that christians dont like being shown how wrong they are. Atheists are moral with no threat of eternal damnation, ergo, Atheists are more moral then any christian, end of story.
loyin 4 months ago
Cry out to your god for what? "Please, let me be your slave for the rest of my existence, even though you need nothing and it would make no difference to you either way?" "Please, keep me drugged with happiness in heaven while other people I love may be suffering below?" No thanks. Even if you could prove your god exists to me, that wouldn't make me want to be anywhere near him. If this life isn't enough for you, then who's heart is truely empty?
Staunts 4 months ago
This succeeded to give me a good laugh. Great job, buddy. You have proven to me that religious dumbasses like you are the most ignorant people in the world.
IFUCKINGLOVEYOUTOO 4 months ago
Pre emptive comment: This better be good...
-----------
I am so dissappointed.
Alexc3217 4 months ago
My problem with christianity is that it assumes that humans are inherently sinful without religion. Why did I become an atheist and I have no desire to fornicate and wreak devilish havoc? I'm the same person. I think I actually have better morality since renouncing religion. I think you are just afraid of enjoying life.
CarolAnnMclean 5 months ago
@CarolAnnMclean You are not correct. Christianity assumes that people are inherently sinful without religion OR with it. Humans are sinful. Becoming a Christian does not mean that someone no longer desires the things of the flesh. Trust me, it would be nice. Becoming a true believer simply means that one's sins are forgiven, but it is still a constant struggle.
cincyninja 4 months ago
Atheism does have a fixed source of morality. Through evolution, man the ape developed a moral code, common today in most cultures, that allowed groups to work together and thrive. This has been developing since man walked upright and is still developing, Because our moral code evolved, to our surprise :0 atheists are mostly very moral people. This is because morality never actually came directly from religion. Religion has been a way to justify our already existing morality as a social animal.
CarolAnnMclean 5 months ago
Hey your right. I was wondering how to deal with my wife sleeping with another man. Now I know I'll bring her into the town square and me and the citizens can stone her to death. I would do it myself because my wife is kinda've shy but I need to go chop off my hand for masturbating earlier today. Thank god morality is a constant that never changes.
olelumpy 5 months ago
I now realize that I do have a hunger, for Dorito's.
distantlightning1968 5 months ago
No Jezuzfreek I don't have a hunger for god. I do however; have a problem with people who WANT to desperately believe a god exists to force their beliefs onto me. To force me to live how they want me to live which I don't agree with. That is what I hunger to get rid of because it is a blight on humanity and stifles society from progressing.
Relativisticism 5 months ago
Ahh crap we need to bring back slavery because it was moral a thousand years ago when god decided it was moral. I guess humanity coming to terms with slavery as being immoral must be disobeying gods moral decision making. Does Jezuzfreek even think at all before he speaks? I can't believe that someone would be this ignorant unless they were trying to be satire.
Relativisticism 5 months ago
this is ironic, right?
Moppy1988 5 months ago
Wow, just watched the rest of the video. You are a complete dick, your own god commands you not to mock and here you are mocking atheists. Nearly every minute if this video is you insulting others for daring to have an opinion that differs from yours. I have to tell you, if we were face to face and you were insulting me like this, I would put my fucking fist through your fucking face.
whanethewhip 5 months ago
I could not get beyond the first 18 seconds before seeing your first strawman. If you are going to make claims, at least make honest claims, atheists will always define themselves, we don't need you to tell us anything about what you think we are, or are not. There is no "ism", it is a misnomer. You claim there is a god, the burden of proof lies with you and all your tired arguments and dumb arguments do nothing to prove it.
whanethewhip 5 months ago
goooooood little jezuzfreek! the cult of christianity has spawned another good seed! spread the word of god they need more gold!!!!
billythethinker 5 months ago
You argue everything from your point of view with absolutly no proof your view is correct.
TheEarthFirst 5 months ago
Morals are different for everyone. And don't tell me Christians are morally superior. "God" will forgive you no matter what you do. Making the 10 commandments pointless.
johnnyboy2537 5 months ago
Morality is absolute. Not absolute because God made it so. Just absolute, period. Humans have endeavored, throughout their history, to determine what that absolute morality is. Reality is not black and white, but grey. Sometimes we believe we are in the right when we are wrong. Sometimes there is no right, but only lesser and greater evils. But morality is still absolute. Christian morality, however, has changed over time, as it is a human construct. "God" once approved of polygamy, did he not?
Aphradonis 5 months ago
and the simple way to refute all you have said is to point out no prove exist for god to begin with.
god also thinks drowning innocent babies is moral.
noliesundead 5 months ago
I don't even have to watch a nanosecond of this retard. He is making a vid while driving? ? I know he is a brainwashed retard. I kinda wanna watch it hoping he wrecks. Jesus must b his Co pilot lol..... I want to know why you made this vid while driving ? Are you like sum Christ cop handing out fake tickets lol ahhh I'm totally making that TV series. Christ Cops©
toolarmysniper 5 months ago
Morals were here long before man created your god. Even way back before belief in Zeus. That is where the men who wrote the bible got them from. God is a cartoon like Sponge Bob. A man made fictional character from a man made fictional book. Theists just have no interest in the truth. Content with their beliefs they are. They cry out for truth but can't seem to find it. You have been well conditioned by your religious cult. Too bad it is not true. If you think it through you to can find truth.
residentatheist 5 months ago
@jezuzfreek777 seriously jezufreek, your points don't make since.
as csbair points out here:
/watch?v=ZjrNYE_iOgo
nyyght7 5 months ago
honestly, whats wrong with atheists? they are good people too.
killertaco97 5 months ago
Is it not better for humanity to judge? To observe, rationalise, and the golden rule is the ultimate way to judge what is moral. If we did not have that, slavery would still be perfectly fine according to exodus and Leviticus. Also, is long hair for a guy immoral? Paul says so (ironic with Jesus), same for girls with short hair. Read your bible, then you'll understand the "great morality" your bible promotes. We only don't want our position misunderstood, sorry if you take offence in that.
DMAN123223 5 months ago
So what was moral during bible ages is moral now? So then I suppose I can stone my disobedient children and fuck my daughter. I love the bible.
iheartu32123 5 months ago
You can let some perceived 'authority' do the judging if you like but you can't escape the fact that YOU made the decision to do so. YOU are the ultimate authority responsible for your morals whether you like it or not.
Listen to what you are saying: "Whenever we ALLOW humanity to judge what is right and wrong." 'Allow'?? Have a think about what this word means.
Hufflewaffle 5 months ago
3. Are you seriously arguing that proselytizing is wrong? Religions do not bother me. "Moral Laws" that religious people try to create bother me. Religious people telling others that they are worthless unless they believe this crap; telling children and the dying that they will go to hell unless they believe bothers me.
4. Name some of these (and link that video)or drop this. I know not of a single non-believer who does this. Clearly you have not seen Hitchens.
AndreisEntaro 5 months ago
1.Fixed morality is not what you want, nor is it what you have in Christianity else you would still promote slavery and oppression of women. Morals change over time as we refine our understanding of what causes suffering in the world. This is what you want, not dictated absolutes. You need only look to Muslim theocracies to see that.
2.Assumes your god exists, in order to argue that it is wrong to do something that your god supposedly thinks is bad. You would first have to prove your god.
AndreisEntaro 5 months ago
Hating those Atheists and there pesky logical ways
hakaboy6924 5 months ago
You are right about why Atheist truly spend so much time bashing what they call nonsensical. They truly have a rebellious spirit. Speaking as someone who looked at God as a being that wanted my praise and wanted to make me a servant only praising and worshiping 24/7. I actually believed this. But thank God for the wake up call.
GoT1 5 months ago
@kennethhennig That's an ad hominem. How is it nonsense? Objective morality and subjective morality are two different things. Go grab a philosophy book. As for Thor, there is evidence of the Christian God, there is no evidence for Thor. PM me and I'll send you some links. :)
blondetrumpetboy 5 months ago
@kennethhennig I'm sorry if you are having trouble understanding. Objective and subjective morals are two different things. By your logic humans disobeying God in The Bible proves that God doesn't exist, which is a non sequitur.
blondetrumpetboy 5 months ago
@kennethhennig I'm pretty sure that whether or not God exists humanity could still decide what is moral and what isn't. It is just that with atheism no objective standard of morality exists.
blondetrumpetboy 5 months ago
@blondetrumpetboy what you are asking for is actually an absolute standard. This is an important distinction. An objective standard that is not a god would be that which causes suffering in conscious creatures.
This is not absolute however since our understanding of what causes suffering will change as we understand other creatures more.
Secondly, when calling a god the standard; one must address the Euthyphro dilemma. Which I have yet to see a theist take a shot at.
AndreisEntaro 5 months ago
@AndreisEntaro If you do a google search of the Euthyphro dilemma then you will see that theists have already responded and resolved the supposed issue.
blondetrumpetboy 5 months ago
@blondetrumpetboy I will apologize for the lack of clarity, as soon as I posted that first one I realized the vagueness but naively hoped you would catch my meaning. I do not ask you to rehearse the standard arguments with me. What I ask is, which response do you take to be valid (there are several) and in any case, how do you justify your god as an objective standard when the moral commands given in the monotheistic holy books turn out to be clearly immoral as we learn more about the world?
AndreisEntaro 5 months ago
@blondetrumpetboy One must also consider whether we want an absolute standard?
Would you ever think it right to kill one innocent to save 1 million? Is there a conceivable situation under which you might think it immoral to let so many die just to avoid violating "thou shalt not kill"? What do you say for the popular Trolley problem under absolutism?
If you are going to argue for Absolutist Ethics on YouTube, I suggest you begin at Euthyphro and then demonstrate the value of absolute claims.
AndreisEntaro 5 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@blondetrumpetboy One must also consider whether we want an absolute standard?
Would you ever think it right to kill one innocent to save 1 million? Is there a conceivable situation under which you might think it immoral to let so many die just to avoid violating "thou shalt not kill"? What do you say for the popular Trolley problem under absolutism?
If you are going to argue for Absolutist Ethics on YouTube, I suggest you begin at Euthyphro and then demonstrate the value of absolute claims.
AndreisEntaro 5 months ago
Ha ha, "Whenever we allow humanity, human kind, I should say, to judge what is right and what is wrong, we leave alot of leeway for mistakes." Yea, right. Taking moral judjement from your bible is still allowing human kind to judge what is right and what is wrong. It's just one of many systems that are made by humans. Everything you're talking about is made by humans, it's just that in your mind something else wrote the bible.
charlesfloyb 5 months ago
Atheists dont even think bout christians at alllllllllll stop being so fucking modist ya dick!
MrJellyGhosty 5 months ago
stop talking pish.
MrJellyGhosty 5 months ago
Your argument is interesting but doesn't stand up. The Bible is full of conflicting messages about morality. The Bible says "Thou shalt not kill" but is full of passages like "Thus saith the LORD of hosts... Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass." (I Samuel 15:2-3)
This is only representative. There are many other examples. Please explain this 'unchanging' morality.
deanosumo 5 months ago
To summarize. You list a bunch of things that Christians "have". But it is only things you BELIEVE you have (support in time of crisis from God etc.) . If there is no God, it does not matter how many people think humanity is not sufficient or not, it is just not there. These are not flaws in atheism. You cannot use your need for God to exist as an argument for it to exist. I wish I was Tom Cruise but it's not going to happen even if I think my life is empty without Katie Holmes :-)
deadcanard 5 months ago
I think your point is completely moot. An atheist doesn't believe there's a God (let's not argue semantics) so if she's right, then the Bible and all the morality you take for absolute and love is only the work of men. Since you can't prove the existence of an absolute morality (even roman catholics and protestants disagree on many things), you can only say that it'd be nice for an absolute morality to exist. But that does not prove or disprove anything and is certainly not a flaw in Atheism.
deadcanard 5 months ago
Came here to thumb this bullshit down. Why do these crazy friggin religious people disable comments all the time? They afraid of being wrong so they cover their eyes and ears so it isn't true?
Typhoonbladefist 5 months ago
if a christian god told me that i should stone gay people to death for their harmless way of life and i told him go fuck off, would that be immoral ?
CaptainObvious0000 5 months ago
your "fixed" source of morality is an old book. how is that a better source than my source ? remember: the percentage of atheists in prison is very low. now who has the better source ?
CaptainObvious0000 5 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@kennethhennig
""Morals will always have to be decided by humanity". You fucking proved the argument against god. Its in YOUR words. You are an idiot"
No you jackass. He's saying that's one of the flaws within atheism.
7ees 5 months ago
After all the years on youtube Jezuzfreek777 still don't grasp what the word "atheist" means he still think it's a whole belief system who need's to evangelise. It's truly sad how blind this man is. It's like "monkey see no evil, monkey hear no evil, monkey speak no evil"
maax82 5 months ago
You said "What was moral a thousand years ago will be moral a thousand years from now". You're speaking in Theistic terms of course and I presume you think the same applies 2+ thousand years ago, when the God Yahweh was ordering rape and ethnic cleansing, as well as extreme punishment like stoning for gathering firewood on the Sabbath. Is that preferable to reasoned atheistic morality? Let alone Christianity's bloody history: the Albigensian Crusades, the Inquisition, treatment of heretics etc.
jamey55lee 5 months ago
Why Christianity bothers me:
Believing in something with no proof, that was written about thousands of years ago, by people who weren't even present during the events (New Testament was written at least 30 years after the supposed events occurred), is a little to me, like believing in Unicorns or fairies. If someone believed in this, and were trying to get it taught in schools, wouldn't that bother you? Or if "One nation under unicorns" was read out by children? Try and think critically.
BrightenUpEmoBoy 5 months ago
Morality. I know that it is wrong to hurt people, because when I get hurt, I don't like it. So, I treat people the way I want to be treated - I know it is 'wrong' to physically, as well as emotionally hurt people. I am capable of being a good person because it's the right thing to do, not because of any reward I'm going to get. Attributing morality to a Christian god is ridiculous, considering the violence of the old testament. Try reading it.
BrightenUpEmoBoy 5 months ago
Youre delusional man.
ttgator2003 5 months ago
You blocking b*stard
drfoxcourt 5 months ago
An atheist knocks on your door and does what? hands you a blank book and asks you to consider its contents? Asks you to not come to a meeting?
drfoxcourt 5 months ago
Jesusfreek's god is a small god, unable or unwilling to keep all souls from Hell.
An atheist knocks on your door and does what? hands you a blank book and asks you to consider its contents? Asks you to not come to a meeting?
drfoxcourt 5 months ago
My atheism is an extension of my curiosity, that puzzled look on people's faces when something just doesn't make sense; impossible to rebel against something that isn't there. Atheism's necessary ideas that make up the fundamental basis for its conclusions have positive impact: rationalism and an honest appraisal of our existence. So how can we ever be truly honest about something if we cannot confirm it? I don't 'know' if there is a god but I know I'm a good person. I'm content.
vryc 5 months ago
@SamNoble89
"you don't listen and you don't care what we say or think."
Hear hear!
And it isn't just JF repeating himself over and over. It's the churches. I sneak in every once so often just to see what" they have to say now."
But one thing is different.....they don't get the same herd reaction from the adherants as it once was several years ago. I believe, I can safely say, more than few adherants are starting to think about " those hell bound atheists who have no morals".
BrightStaroftheDawn 5 months ago
As a moral realist, I don't think morality is "decided" by anyone, men or gods, but is discovered by reason. Objective facts, like the size of the moon, can't be decided upon, but only discovered.
Of course, our reasoning isn't perfect, but as we discuss and argue about morality, and reach something like a growing consensus, our moral beliefs are better refined. Our beliefs change, but the facts don't.
Trusting this process isn't idolatry, we don't worship ourselves or think we're infallible.
logician360 5 months ago
You're aware that Christians proselytize and evangelize, as you perceive atheists as doing. Is it reasonable to conclude that Christians are trying to disabuse the people they evangelize to of already held religious or philosophical beliefs? Or that Christians are intimidated or threatened by non-Christian religious or philosophical beliefs? If not, then why conclude from atheistic evangelism that atheists want to tread on the beliefs of Christians, or are intimidated by Christianity?
logician360 5 months ago
I'm surprised that you perpetuate in this video the trope that atheists "cry out to god" in times of crisis or on their deathbed. I'd like to know if you've actually seen atheists genuinely do this, or personally know any that have done this, or if you've heard that they do this from other people. Many claims have been made to the effect that famous atheists recant at or near death, but these claims turn out to be untrue or unjustified (Darwin, Sartre, Darrow, etc).
logician360 5 months ago
TheMundaneMadcap OWNS you
retrogamerist 5 months ago
@retrogamerist God owns me. No one else.
jezuzfreek777 5 months ago
@jezuzfreek777 Nope, he owns you. And so does FPSRussia
retrogamerist 5 months ago
@jezuzfreek777
A fictional character cannot own you.
Atharkas 5 months ago
@Atharkas Indeed.
retrogamerist 5 months ago
@jezuzfreek777 Clearly that isn't true, TheMundaneMadcap owns you now.
theUSER101 5 months ago
@jezuzfreek777 and do you think that's a good thing?
Moppy1988 5 months ago
@jezuzfreek777 But god doesn't exist. How can he own you
AroundSun 4 months ago
Who the hell wants a fixed morality? I want a morality that is reasoned and argumented
iRobii 5 months ago
You know, the morals in the old testament differs from the new testament. So..
LinneavV 5 months ago
Dude, you need to pay attention to the road by not talking to yourself in the car, because one of these days you're gonna cause an accident and that would be, you guessed it, immoral. You can take your arguments about moral relativism to the judge.
Upstreamswimmer 5 months ago