@TheOldElement 1. no you can not use aluminum, it will react with the koh/naoh and will decompose.
2. by dry cell it is meant that the cell is not in a bath, that the plates are not just in a jar or other container. the inside is wet, but the outside is dry.
i have just started getting my material together i am wondering if you have heard the new studies that are out. they are saying to use titanium instead of stainless steel due to the hex crom it produces as a by product of the process. Your cell looks great and i was going with a submerged design till I saw you put your together. Iwill do some more research on the titanium plates but they say they run clean and dont get the foam build up whick contains the hexivaliant cromium.
dry cells are much more efficient, they produce more hho for every consumed watt, so yes they are more productive for the amps they use. Their form factor is also very nice since they water can be remote mounted in any shape needed. The HUGE added bonus is that NO electrical connections are exposed to the hho, a bad connection can be a very bad thing, and ss is not a good conductor so all ss conections get hot. All in all the dry cell is far superior imho.
You are exactly correct sir, Im looking at going dry, no matter what I do, my SS my anode/cathode connections get hot enough to melt plastic on my wet cells at or above about 15A. Also the bolt connections seem to MAGNIFY this problem when you spann them across several plates.
Was wondering why dry cells dont get AS hot at the plates/connections etc.. Is it plate thickness? lack of bolts due to spread out connections via muliple wires? Fluid movement through cell/bubblers or all above? Mmmmm
it is usually because dry cells are setup as series stacks (n plates) which cuts the voltage of each plate pair down, which reduces the amp draw from each stack. SS is a very poor conductor, more like a heating element really, it has such high resistance, so as more amps get drawn through a single terminal it heats up very fast. A 1/4 bolt shouldn't get more than around 7-10 amps max. And since there are normally multiple connections on a dry cell it spreads the amps out over a greater area.
U are right about the 1/4" bolt and amps. I Upgraded to 3/8" for the Anode/Cathod bolt connections, Now instead of connecting the cells below the SS extensions, using 5/16 bolts and washers Im Using the plates extenders which connect the ANODE and CATHODE to the 3/8" bolt at the top with the single 3/8" bolt ea. So, I eliminated the 2 5/16 bolts altogether. Huge difference in heat production at the anode/cathode Still does heat up when it reaches 30 amps. but not as fast (takes about hour) .
In your vids you sound like u might be an eledctrician, 4 u job, I might pick your brain via PM sometime if you dont mind..
Was reading about amps/heat and read HEAT is generated by FRICTION at a molecular level? Caused by the electrons colliding due to imperfections in the steel which is trying to carry the current. More current on smaller metal/connections, and collisions increase = heat. Therefore larger connections and wire (larger bolts, maybe thicker plates?) do heat up slower? agree?
One last comment about spreading the connections ou with dry cells, something you cannot do (safely) using wire, esp for submersed cells.. I bet it also spreads the CURRENT more EVENLY across the plates vs starting out at one end, and using a bolt or other connection device to try and carry the current down the line to each plate?
Either way cannot wait for your 12V 30 amp tests on this guy.. will check your other vids. Cell looks GREAT!
Can u document heat buildup at say 30amps/12v DC?
The basic answer on the heat thing, is yes a "friction" of sorts. And yes among other things I am an electrician, hit me up anytime. And sure, I can do a series including temp increase over time.
did you use any special technique to cut the gaskets? like a template or did you just do it freehand? also the black gaskets. where did you pick up the material for those. the plates, did you use a template for the holes? i have 60 8x6 plates and i dont want to mess up thanks for your reply.
wow I can't believe I missed this comment, sorry about that. The material is neoprene, and the gaskets were custom made, from a dye one of the guys had made. the previous dry cell setup I hand cut the gaskets using a cardboard template. To simplify and save money I would suggest that u use shower pan pvc material from home depot for gasket material, and put the bolts on the outside of the cell. This would proly be the best solution for the time being.
I threw the chemicals I had at it, this thing was 100x worst when I started, and I got tired of messing with it. It will clear out, but yes I could have gotten it a bit better, but then would always be some in then, its pretty small particles. The "good enough for me" rule kicked in, and I was tired as hell.
I am new to this and a have a few questions.
1. can I use aluminum instead of stainless steal
2. Why is he putting water when it is a dry cell.
TheOldElement 1 year ago
@TheOldElement 1. no you can not use aluminum, it will react with the koh/naoh and will decompose.
2. by dry cell it is meant that the cell is not in a bath, that the plates are not just in a jar or other container. the inside is wet, but the outside is dry.
d3adp001 1 year ago
What about using drain cleaner? You can get one at walmart with only Potassium Hydroxide and Sodium Hydroxide in it @ 7 bucks per 2 liters.
jdtrickster 2 years ago
so long as it has only sodium or potassium, then its fine.
d3adp001 2 years ago
According to the bottle its both. Has a warning saying it contains concentrated lye. There has to be water added too right?
jdtrickster 2 years ago
i have just started getting my material together i am wondering if you have heard the new studies that are out. they are saying to use titanium instead of stainless steel due to the hex crom it produces as a by product of the process. Your cell looks great and i was going with a submerged design till I saw you put your together. Iwill do some more research on the titanium plates but they say they run clean and dont get the foam build up whick contains the hexivaliant cromium.
915greenhornet 2 years ago
over driven cells leak hex if not passivated. But Ti cells wont leak at all ever, they are just damned pricey
d3adp001 2 years ago
Since you are building a HHO torch, you can answer this,
I assume, you can weld MANY materials together using the torch.. but can you weld SS to each other, using SS rods with the HHO gas?
moreoverunity 3 years ago
Are the dry cells more productive than submerged plates?
dreamwhileyousleep 3 years ago
dry cells are much more efficient, they produce more hho for every consumed watt, so yes they are more productive for the amps they use. Their form factor is also very nice since they water can be remote mounted in any shape needed. The HUGE added bonus is that NO electrical connections are exposed to the hho, a bad connection can be a very bad thing, and ss is not a good conductor so all ss conections get hot. All in all the dry cell is far superior imho.
d3adp001 3 years ago
You are exactly correct sir, Im looking at going dry, no matter what I do, my SS my anode/cathode connections get hot enough to melt plastic on my wet cells at or above about 15A. Also the bolt connections seem to MAGNIFY this problem when you spann them across several plates.
Was wondering why dry cells dont get AS hot at the plates/connections etc.. Is it plate thickness? lack of bolts due to spread out connections via muliple wires? Fluid movement through cell/bubblers or all above? Mmmmm
moreoverunity 3 years ago
it is usually because dry cells are setup as series stacks (n plates) which cuts the voltage of each plate pair down, which reduces the amp draw from each stack. SS is a very poor conductor, more like a heating element really, it has such high resistance, so as more amps get drawn through a single terminal it heats up very fast. A 1/4 bolt shouldn't get more than around 7-10 amps max. And since there are normally multiple connections on a dry cell it spreads the amps out over a greater area.
d3adp001 3 years ago
U are right about the 1/4" bolt and amps. I Upgraded to 3/8" for the Anode/Cathod bolt connections, Now instead of connecting the cells below the SS extensions, using 5/16 bolts and washers Im Using the plates extenders which connect the ANODE and CATHODE to the 3/8" bolt at the top with the single 3/8" bolt ea. So, I eliminated the 2 5/16 bolts altogether. Huge difference in heat production at the anode/cathode Still does heat up when it reaches 30 amps. but not as fast (takes about hour) .
moreoverunity 3 years ago
In your vids you sound like u might be an eledctrician, 4 u job, I might pick your brain via PM sometime if you dont mind..
Was reading about amps/heat and read HEAT is generated by FRICTION at a molecular level? Caused by the electrons colliding due to imperfections in the steel which is trying to carry the current. More current on smaller metal/connections, and collisions increase = heat. Therefore larger connections and wire (larger bolts, maybe thicker plates?) do heat up slower? agree?
moreoverunity 3 years ago
One last comment about spreading the connections ou with dry cells, something you cannot do (safely) using wire, esp for submersed cells.. I bet it also spreads the CURRENT more EVENLY across the plates vs starting out at one end, and using a bolt or other connection device to try and carry the current down the line to each plate?
Either way cannot wait for your 12V 30 amp tests on this guy.. will check your other vids. Cell looks GREAT!
Can u document heat buildup at say 30amps/12v DC?
moreoverunity 3 years ago
The basic answer on the heat thing, is yes a "friction" of sorts. And yes among other things I am an electrician, hit me up anytime. And sure, I can do a series including temp increase over time.
d3adp001 3 years ago
did you use any special technique to cut the gaskets? like a template or did you just do it freehand? also the black gaskets. where did you pick up the material for those. the plates, did you use a template for the holes? i have 60 8x6 plates and i dont want to mess up thanks for your reply.
delvis11 3 years ago
wow I can't believe I missed this comment, sorry about that. The material is neoprene, and the gaskets were custom made, from a dye one of the guys had made. the previous dry cell setup I hand cut the gaskets using a cardboard template. To simplify and save money I would suggest that u use shower pan pvc material from home depot for gasket material, and put the bolts on the outside of the cell. This would proly be the best solution for the time being.
d3adp001 3 years ago
Nice rig D. Turn it on, turn it on!!
CarbideTip 3 years ago 2
you can get that oxide off with Oxalic acid.
maybe CLR
m3sca1 3 years ago
I threw the chemicals I had at it, this thing was 100x worst when I started, and I got tired of messing with it. It will clear out, but yes I could have gotten it a bit better, but then would always be some in then, its pretty small particles. The "good enough for me" rule kicked in, and I was tired as hell.
d3adp001 3 years ago
yeah i know that "it'll do" rule gets me too-
what do you think of my latest vid using carborundum abd oxalic acid in the water?
lookin forward to seeing that "Dry" cell run...
m3sca1 3 years ago