Re: Brian McLaren's Attack Against Hell and Jesus Atonement

[devonbiker]

Jesus said himself many times there will be people, even believes, who don't make it to heaven because of their sin and they would be outside where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth. Salvation is unconditional so long as you remain in Jesus and consequences if you don't. It's a simple message really!

[nmreich]

HERESY IN THE HIGHEST!

[wonderosity]

If you listened to the video you'd get answers to about 95% of the above questions folks. The main point being there are 30,000 christian denominations all quoting different scriptures about what is true or not, saying 'they have the truth'. Until some real humility comes down the pike, conflict and 'hell on earth' will escalate.

[shineshadow]

It is True, that God loves Humankind. But its also true, that we have a choise.

If we hadn`t the Choise of Choose either God or the World, we wouldn`t have the free will to do, what we want to do. God has a Plan with this World, but unfortunantly we cant experience it. Just like Eterity we cant think of. If God wouldn`t love us, we would be his Toys he plays with, but we aren`t. Is this so bad?

[st3sflower]

Have we just thrown out the countless COUNTLESS scriptures from Jesus Himself that talk about a very real hell, and very real conditions for salvation? How 'bout Jesus saying not to fear man who can only kill the body, but to fear God who can kill the body and then throw your soul in hell? Was Jesus "just kidding"? How bout all those who call on the name of the Lord shall be saved. Saved from what? A pretend hell? Is Jesus lying or bluffing? Jesus died for the sake of Justice, because of Love

[mensamaterial]

The emergent/eastern mysticism/humanist attack on true Christianity will never change who God really is,but it will lead millions astray and to an actual hell.

[mensamaterial]

Jesus died as a payment for our sins, NOT to teach US self-sacrifice. He was NOT trying to be relevant. He died in our place, but without repentance, we will be seperated from God forever. Instead of accepting that God is uniquely supreme, you have given Him conditions and attributes that suit you. He has every right as THE creator to do as He pleases with His creation, otherwise He's not GOD!

[aguywithakeyboard]

I find this belief in an entitled ruler to be a little disturbing. Don't perceive my using the word disturbing as an attack on your beliefs, but acknowledge that is my natural reaction. Do you believe it is right to create life and hold it to standards which directly contradict its nature? Standards, which if not met, will damn the creature. If a human behaved this way wouldn't we question their benevolence?

[aguywithakeyboard]

Saying God can do as he pleases makes sense, but if the Bible contains an accurate description of God, then he does operate within conditions -- he is limited by his unconditional love for us. If he is not, then we have to question the substance of the Bible, which is damnable offense. It's to much of a paradox to say god is benevolent, but omnipotent; kind, but wrathful; all knowing; but our fates are indeterminate.

[aguywithakeyboard]

And, where paradoxes exists, there is humanity at work. God may or may not exist, and his will may or may not be that of the description provided by the bible, but to try and articulate god's will, as if you truly understand god, is an impossible feat. Even if you are simply making the statement "he can do as he pleases." For, god does as he pleases, and does not work within the added limitations of your, or my, logic.