Occupy Wall St.: The True Motives Behind This Movement

[Jestercorp]

Okay so first of all, the OWS movement...

/gulp...

okay so about your video dude...

/fumble/fumble

sorry I'm taking my supplements, not being rude on purpose just didn't think before I started...

*AHEM*

[ruderevival]

@Jestercorp shut up please

[Jestercorp]

@ruderevival I didn't say I wasn't on your side homie, just pointing out how obnoxious that is. I won't make bullshit comments if you aren't obnoxious. What would it have cost you to wait 1 minute, drink your nonsense, and then make a video uninterrupted? Do you often call people and then eat while you're trying to tell them stuff? douche

[ruderevival]

@Jestercorp It was just absentmindedness.  my bad

[Jestercorp]

@ruderevival its cool man. It wasn't rly a big deal til u told me to shut up. I was mostly giving u shit (I did say u werent being rude on purpose)

take care bro

[Beachbug1vw]

plus, news from NY city Occupy is that the food preparers are kind of going on strike as they are pissed that so many homeless and street people are showing up and the Occupiers are pissed because they feel the supplies they have belong to just the ones they feel are justified to be there. The movement has said it is all about the poor and people who need help, but it seems not if it comes from "their" stuff. Sounds like the 1% they claim to be fighting. The rich feel the same about "their"!

[Beachbug1vw]

I just liked the video. Hard to Imagine I broke a 5-5 tie to make it 6 like, to 5 dislike. I totally think this rage which Occupy is morphing into on the streets is horrible. The ideas are good, but in a civil society, no one wants this violence so many of the groups have launched into. It is just turning more and more people off as it seems to get worse everyday. The news is full of stupid occupy people advocationg for anarchy, socialism, and communism. They need to weed the bad apples out

[GeneralDomination]

I think the corporations do have more of a right to influence in the country than the average man because without corporations there would be no jobs. The occupy movement is a nice thought but it isn't productive. It expresses a feeling that the government was already aware of. The government is doing what it can to fix the economy and one way you can help is to get off the streets and either find a job, make a business, or find some other way to produce something to actually aid the economy.

[xaniphir]

@GeneralDomination I agree, corporations are basically individuals and can petition the gubment like everyone else but the government can't fix the economy! they are the ones that fucked it up!

[ruderevival]

@xaniphir Im going to have to respectfully disagree with that notion. Corporations are not "basically individuals". Corporations are mass amounts of people, and not necessarily the average joes either. Corporations are insanely rich and can lobby the government to do whatever they want, because they have so much money. This is a corrupt partnership, corporations bribe the government. The average working person cannot do that. They wont make the tiniest bit of influence. This has to stop.

[xaniphir]

@ruderevival you are wrong sir. when a corporation files taxes they file as an individual entity. furthermore a corporation can be just one person. you can be a corporation. also anyone can bribe anybody. just like anyone can lobby the govt. You seem to forget that YOU are the govt. if you don't like the way things are going mabye you're voting for the wrong people to represent you.

[ruderevival]

@xaniphir I dont really care about the minute technicalities behind the term "corporation". When I say corporation I am referring to the extremely rich and powerful conglomerates that are able to influence the government much more easily than the average citizen. Unfortunately our system is broken and no matter who I vote for, it wont make one bit of difference. Just because our government is supposed to be representative doesnt mean it really is. We need massive civil disobedience.

[GeneralDomination]

@ruderevival It's interesting that people in the US should make such a big fuss when things go wrong like this. Have you ever thought of what it would be like to live in a third world country? The USA has such a stupid high standard of living it's insane. In most middle eastern countries the average american would be as rich as a prince. And the corporations do have more sway with the government for a reason. They make jobs for the average joe.

[GeneralDomination]

@ruderevival And if the corporations are indeed bribing the government then why is the government always running so low on money? Where does it go? There is no evidence that any major corporations have used their money to influence the government. And whatever may have caused the economic crisis, there's still no reason to protest without having a plan B to present to the government. Just saying "we want more income" Isn't going to work. Protests don't help and eventually lead to riots.

[GeneralDomination]

@xaniphir I agree that the government can't fix the economy. But they aren't the ones who screwed it up. The people who screwed it up are mostly banks. They gave loans that they knew couldn't be paid back and then sold those loans to investors. They were pretty much making tons of fake money by putting everyone else into major debt. The government had no way of controlling or even knowing about this until the economy suddenly started to dip.

[xaniphir]

@GeneralDomination Dude! really? you have been misinformed and led astray, check out this hearing from 2004, the republicans were trying to warn of this impending disaster caused by govt. programs that forced banks to give bad loans. search this term and see for yourself;

Shocking Video Unearthed Democrats in their own words Covering up the Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac loan program.

[GeneralDomination]

@xaniphir That doesn't prove that the government screwed it up. It proves they could have stopped it if more of them had seen the danger. It proves that hindsight is 20/20. The banks were not government run, they're only government-regulated as a safety to keep things like the current economic crisis from happening but their regulations weren't tight enough. Either way I don't see how protesting is going to help the economy in any way. It just wastes police, money, time, and manpower.

[xaniphir]

@GeneralDomination you only see what you want to see, gov't regulation not tight enough? don't you see that it was a gov't reg. that caused this? and when responsible representitives tried to warn of the impending catastrophy they were berated and chastised by the scumbags in control (dems). Now you think that MORE regulation will fix it? 

[GeneralDomination]

@xaniphir That's what the "responsible representitives" were saying in the video you sent me and it makes sense. Look at Canada. The economy in Canada is doing great relative to the US and the biggest reason is because Canadian banks have much tighter regulations. Of course another reason why Canada is better off is because it doesn't have nearly as much debt but that's besides the point.

[xaniphir]

@GeneralDomination ahh the old Canada card!...they have a miniscule defense budget and California has a larger population! A market driven economy (as ours is) does so much better without govt. getting in the way. 

[GeneralDomination]

@xaniphir You have it exactly backwards. The government needs to keep greedy corporations from knocking over the economy like they have done so recently. The bankers who gave loans to people who couldn't afford them and then sold those loans were told to do so by their manager who was probably told to do so by the CEO of that particular bank. They were making a crazy amount of money until the housing market collapsed making it impossible for people to make payments on their loans...

[GeneralDomination]

@xaniphir So the banks took the homes of people who couldn't pay the loans anymore. But those houses were pretty much worthless in comparison to the loan they handed out so they lost money and when that happened the government bailed them out (which was stupid, they should have bailed out the home owners before they had to give their homes to the banks). And the ever growing deficit didn't help any. The government could have prevented this with regulations on who can and can't receive loans.

[xaniphir]

@GeneralDomination what I'm trying to get you to understand by showing you proof is that GOVERNMENT REGULATION STARTED THIS!!!! and why should the govt. bail out a home owner that should not have been a home owner in the first place! When my house lost half it's value I didn't run to the govt. for help. I went to the bank and we modified and re-negotiated the loan. No govt. involved. how it should be.

[GeneralDomination]

@xaniphir and you were lucky. A lot of people simply couldn't afford any kind of payment to the bank. Lots of people lost their job around the same time their house became worthless. And it makes sense to bail out the home owners because then they can pay their debt which is pretty much the same thing as bailing out the banks like they did except the money goes into the regular budget instead of being used to give huge bonuses to CEOs.

[GeneralDomination]

@xaniphir what government regulation started this anyways? You keep talking about how the government did it but it was lack of action on their part that they are to blame for.  Why would a government intentionally sabotage its own economy? Do you think they're financial retards? Most of them are a fair bit smarter than you when it comes to the economy. And this is off topic of my point. My point is that the protests are absolutely useless and wastes lots of money and time.

[xaniphir]

@GeneralDomination ever heard of fannie mae or freddie mack? these are the programs that started this.

why would the govt. do this? for votes!----btw I totally agree with you about the occupy bullshit.

[GeneralDomination]

@xaniphir Those program are not government run. They are government sponsored. The government has a little say in what they do but they don't run it. The FHFA was putting a bit more control on it around the time the market crashed but it's not their fault. If a ship is sinking and some random passenger grabs the wheel did he sink the ship? The fact is that more regulations on who can have loans and who can't and dealings with large loans in general could have stopped this depression.

[infinitywon]

Darned if I know why you have 2 thumbs down. Your's is one of the best explanations of what's wrong in the world that I've ever heard...go figure. Maybe it was all the fidgeting around at the beginning of your vid lol

[ruderevival]

@infinitywon Thank you! Lolol maybe it was all the fidgeting, I done that later haha.

[ruderevival]

@ruderevival *should have done

[Mars2O84]

Not making an 'exclusive' ideological statement, but anarchism is a key tenet of Occupy. It is based on leaderless, non-hierarchical consensus democracy - it is "anarchic" (no ruler).

Self-interest is natural. Greed is irrationally selfish. The current economic & political system based on competition encourages greedy behavior.

The community at OWS based on mutual aid & cooperation encourages enlightened self-interest & altruism.

If OWS was a great experience, make it part of your daily life!

[ruderevival]

@Mars2O84 Your right that the occupation in the park is anarchic. Thats very true, but I dont believe one of the goals of the movement is to see that happen to the country, or at least not immediately.

And thank you for pointing out that greed is irrationally selfish! I was talking to my good friend who insisted that greed is a natural human emotion and can never be abolished, such a pessimist! Now I can rebuke him! Thanks for the comment! I love to discuss anything further.

[Mars2O84]

@rr

Yeah, I think it's a good argument!

Above all, humans are adaptable - that's why we populate so widely and live in nearly any climate. We're capable of selfish greed or selfless altruism, and society will reward one set of behaviors while discouraging the other.

A system built on greed is destructive and unsustainable. We must realize that to truly act in our own best interests (self-preservation), we need to look at the whole picture instead of short-term gain and narrow self-interest.