The Definitive Roland TB-303 vs Adafruit x0xb0x shootout

[djphineart]

Why not let the xoxbox age for a few decades the compare....!!?_ these comparison videos are like trying to choose between miss Brazil and miss Venezuela in miss world.

Dumb asses we'd all take either home

[thisisyaren]

nothing sounds like a 303.... just buy one

[JVGmidi]

i have bought an adafruit x0xbox today sounds very good.

i have a question:

how do i sync the xox with my korg er1?

thanks

[xisotopex]

the difference is the same as if you had two tb303's side by side. the original no two sounded exactly alike.

[phono1337]

@xisotopex its not, the differences between 303's is not the same as the difference between a x0x and a 303

[mistaecco]

Where did you purchase your x0xb0x? (anyone that can reply would be appreciated =D thanks)

[DCYx]

I've just built my x0xb0x (in an aluminium enclosure). It was my first DIY project and it really sounds fantastic. It sounds close enough compared to a 303 for me. All new electronics, MIDI, CV, gate, easier pattern programming (although some people might disagree), all this for nearly 1000 $/€ cheaper than a 303. Personally I never would buy a 303 over a x0x, but that's just me.. Oh yeah, and don't forget that no 303 exactly sounds the same either.

[M3sslah]

Why is there like a clipping/snapping sound in the xox that can't be right, it's like the filter is set in a way it leaves only artifacts of sound after. Is that just the video or you mean the xox sound that shitty beacuse I never heard it sound like that before?

[phthalocyanine4]

thanks for the good comparison! on some settings they sound quite the same, on some there is a huge difference. whenever there is a difference, i like the 303 better :) it has more character in my opinion. nonetheless i'm thinking of getting a xoxbox, because the 303 is way to expensive. greetings from germany. acid!

[kiDchemical]

@broomas1 I'm not either. My interest in this is purely from a academic standpoint, in regards to synthesis and reverse engineering. I don't listen to acid music at all, and even though I like the sound of the 303 I think it's way overrated and overused. My perspective is more features is better thing than some "golden tone"

[SonofDavidMusic]

the xoxbox sounds really suffocated to me. i just want that to open up and breathe a little more. 303 ftw

[kiDchemical]

Commenting on an iPad is a freaking nightmare! Apologies...

[kiDchemical]

Arch, keep accidentally sending the message early! Would be to remove the pots for resistors, but to me that's not worth the trouble by a long shot, unless you are a synth dev that is. Later, Matt

[kiDchemical]

Nice video btw. I'm not knit picking, I just find the subject iof emulation/reinterpration/rever­se enginering nteresting. In the beginning of the video you do mention the analog pots thing. The best way to do an a/b wou

[kiDchemical]

Yeah, but that requires a mod, I'm referring to a stock 303. Since completed x0x's are now sold regularly, you can now make "stock" comparison for people who are purely musicians and never touched a soldering iron. Having midi capabilities by defualt is a huge difference afaic. The USB I almost didn't mention, I hear you on that, but it could maybe be made useful with software updates (not sure, that is speculation, you could probably answer that better). Also the x0xb0x software is FOSS and

[kiDchemical]

Different I was trying to write ; ). The x0xb0x is clearly superior regardless of price IMHO because of the superior I/O and enhanced digital section (midi, USB, etc.)

[phono1337]

@kiDchemical

If you fit a sequentix midibass II then you have the same I/O, the x0x USB is all but useless tbh.

For me it's all about the sound, the xox is a lot more stiffer sounding and the sequencer isn't quite right. In the mix you wouldn't notice.

[broomas1]

@kiDchemical I'm not anal about whether it is' better' than a 303 and if I heard it in a track I wouldn't notice, half of the old 303 acid house tracks used sh101s (as told by Richie Hawtin) but I can clearly hear the difference.

The x0x appears to be 'clipping' and is no where near as rounded as the 303 which seamlessly changes tone, pitch and filter. Surely using some kind of audio analysis or EQ would show this.

[kiDchemical]

I think the differences have more to do with the fact your dealing with analog circuitry.  If you compare 2 303's in the same way you would probably get the same subtle differences. Also, a new 303 just purchased in 1982 may have sounded slightly d

[AMVST]

The 303 produces less clicks imo then the x0x. Amp envelope sounds slightly different to me. I want one, but I got two left hands when it comes to electronics. :-(

[greenturmalin]

the pattern @ 5:01 sounds damn nice, would you mind sharing it, if u still got it :D

[synth77]

Why can't they make a cheap replica cause i bought my 303 for 200 euro.

The 606 you can get on ebay for 350 to 500 now that's about double the price.

But not nearly the amount the 303s priced ..oh yeah the comparison..the x0xb0x sounds better.

[naturecollision]

the filter of the xoxbox seems to have a little different range, so they dont phase, otherwise they would phase way more.

[sikdelphi303]

close enough to be saving close to a grand, i see your are english phono would it be possible to enlighten me. I have x0x from x0xsource number 79 so quite early . I would like to change my q11 transistor to a 945 is there anything else i should change with this or is it ok just straight change of one transistor. Appreciate all the helpful videos keep up the good work!!!!!!

[phono1337]

@sikdelphi303

in my tests i found the lower beta 945s to work best at q11

[firehandszarb]

1:54 the difference is clearly audible, even with my crappy little speakers.

[MaXiMiZoR2008]

TB-303 still sounds better. Seems like it has an extra edge to the sound. Xoxbox sounds much dryer...

[dusp2k]

If it's sitting in some acid mix you definitly can not tell them apart.

[kaf666]

nice demo thanks

where can i find a skin like yours for my xoxbox??

[tranquillkid]

Hi there dude! Good demo of both units! Which firmware are you using on your x0x?

[pomfrit93]

watch this in 480 or you wont hear any difference

[acriked]

Your filter has less quality transistors and the resonance is limited to lower level.

However using alternative sanyo transistors that has better hfe and lowering the resonance limiters will give wider control area over your effects.

x0xb0x is perfect clone of TB-303 if you know how to build it. =)

My own version of x0xb0x was build with extremely high quality parts and therefore has higher resonance value and better filter than the original TB-303. =)

[phono1337]

@acriked

no, my x0xb0x has all the original parts except the vca, and yes i know how to build it, i repair synths for a living and also you might notice i help moderate the x0xb0x forums.

[Tetsuoha]

@acriked  so different ;S

[jtopland]

How many hours did you spent making the x0xb0x?

[phono1337]

@jtopland first one about 4 days and the second one took me 3 days

[jtopland]

Did you make the x0xbox yourself, mate? Can the original x0xbox make any sound different from the 303?

[phono1337]

@jtopland

no its the 303 circuit so unless you mod it ;)

[noxgenus]

thanks for this vid..

although I've heard TB303's sound very different from eachother...a quite used one sometimes sounds more raw and bright than a less used one...so I guess these subtle differences with the x0xb0x are so minor, nobody can heard the difference between that and a 1982 303

[44eelz]

did you make that XoxBox?

[phono1337]

@44eelz I did indeed

[noxgenus]

@phono1337 where did you get those silver knobs from mate? I want those instead of black ones ;)

[phono1337]

@noxgenus they were part of a group buy on the x0xb0x forums, bascially they are from korg, you can try to contact korg in your country and ask for the electribe mkII knobs

[noxgenus]

@phono1337 sweetness, thanks for the tip!

[subclonk]

x0xb0x sounds drier... less sustained 'wettness'. I own a x0xb0x. I'been in love with the 303 since I was 13 back in 1988.

[VacTrooper]

can the x0xb0x run on batteries?

[f115Recs]

@VacTrooper

'Out of the box', no. Some builders have modded it to handle batteries though.

[slackdave]

Nice video, thanks!

Lately I've been thinking of getting a .. Acidlab Bassline 2. Anyone know how it compares to a 303?

[corri303]

which machine does mizzy prefer?

[jdrukman]

Interesting comparison. I have a Future Retro 777 which is close enough for my purposes.

One thing - I noticed in this and your other videos that there is really bad interlacing when the camera moves. You need to set deinterlacing on in your video editor program when you are rendering.

[phono1337]

thaks for the interlacing tip, ill check that out, i thought it was the camera itself :)

[phono1337]

turns out its the field order, setting to progressive scan pretty much eliminated it, so i'll be using that for future videos and we'll see how it turns out

[praevius]

Great video, I always wondered about this. I have a TB-303 and would like to add an x0xb0x to my gearlist. Just for convenience and the fact that I don't want to lug my 1982 darling around too much.

To my ears the TB-303 has a bit more brightness and broadness to it, but as you point out the differences are small...

[emerography]

Btw, it's a pity that the VCF freq is set so differently on the two machines throughout most of the clip, making it hard to judge other differences. Pots are not perfect, transistors differ, and a VCF freq offset like this is expected (and trimmable by TM3). The player tweaks the freq to whatever she wants, so it's not really interesting to compare exact knob settings. The interesting point is if they can sound the same or not. Which they almost could.

Thanks for the serious work, though! :-)

[phono1337]

very true, however it TM3 was set up as per roland spec on both machines

[emerography]

Wow, those two machines were really close in sound. Much closer than the 2 TB-303s and the 3 x0xb0xes we compared here recently. Individual differences between TB303s and x0xb0xes are quite large, so people shouldn't consider a test like this as the one and only truth.

[mfiske1]

This is not "The Definitive" of anything. I have taken 2 x TB-303's and heard similar differences. No two 303's sound identical.

[phono1337]

if you actually took a moment to read the thread on the blog where this was posted you'll see i wrote that already.

[Llitsor]

@phono1337 Indeed!

They don't really sound any different to 303 'A' vs 303 'B'

Which is a good thing for the x0xb0x, as it means there is no reason to pay silly inflated prices for a real 303 any more.

Plus the x0x has midi, usb and cv etc, plus its easier to program.

Win win I say :)

Good video..

[xisotopex]

@Llitsor

exactly. its funny that people think that because the xoxbox doesnt sound exactly like this particular 303 that it doesnt sound like a 303.

they wouldnt beable to pick out 2 different 303's with a xoxbox listening blindfolded.

and in a mix, no contest.

no 2 303's sound the same.

[mfiske1]

@phono1337

Nice job then. bravo.

[Superlortenar]

Good test, never had a 303, but ill take a x0xb0x over it anytime. Thats maybe why i got 2 of em allready =)

[plasmaforce11]

Sweet :D

[Mithrastolemybirthda]

I agree with the previous comment by ProtocellDnB - sounds like the x0xb0x filter cut-off is slightly lower than the 303. What steps did you take to ensure that both are calibrated the same before the comparison, particularly trimpot TM3 adjustment?

[phono1337]

both have recently been tuned and TM3 was adjusted with an oscilloscope as per the tb303 service manual procedure.

[Mithrastolemybirthda]

OK, so was there a deliberate attempt to get the ringing frequency as 'close as practicable' between the two units - the calibration setting of 2ms +/- 25% gives a very wide margin for differences...?

[phono1337]

indeed, the differences could be down to simple component tolerance, though the 303 seq feel is a little more loose in my ears

[telesynth]

I thought the cutoff was very similar but the decay on the x0x was either faster or had a more exponential slope. So adjusting the cutoff wouldn't make them match.

Of course, the point isn't that you can match a 303 and x0x, but that they both can get that famous sound into a track. And I think that point is clearly won, both of them can sound right in a track.

[ProtocellDnB]

Maybe it's just YouTube, but the x0xb0x sound like it has more mids and less high end.