CHECK YOURSELF BRO!!!!!! HIS LIFE IS BETTER THAN YOURS CAUSE MOST OF AMERICA KNOWS HIM.............................YOUTUBE IS THE ONLY WAY I EVER WOULD HAVE KNOWN YOU EVEN EXSITED!!!!!! You come across like a wannabe white hating your own color black guy!! I have spent too much of my life even responding to your video because you are not worth it I just hate to see a brother lost and hating the skin he was born in!!
@TheGeezey So popular means he has a better life? sorry I'd rather be me then ignant ass steve harvey any day of the week. My goal is not to be famous. And what does race have anything to do with it. YOUR the racist. I'm responding to another man. If you look at my channel I respond TOO ALL IDIOTS REGARDLESS OF THEIR SKIN. So i suggest you "check yourself" and stop kissing celebrities aholes. let me giv eyou a tip being a celeb is not the only way to have a rewarding and great life.
WOW!!! You believe what you believe and Steve believes what he believes, Yet you spent 10 whole minutes downing what another man believes because he is famous ANOTHER BLACK MAN AT THAT!! Thats whats wrong with our race is brothers like you!!! Crabs in a bucket!!! Your moral barrameter is broken because if you treated people like you want to be treated you would respect his views (doesn't mean you have to agree with them)
@TheGeezey Apparently steve is so famous that you didnt here him pedal his nonsense in the first place. So when SH writes a book and goes on TV and radio saying people have no moral barometer and dont deserve to be in a relationship thats ok. But if you respond and say how idiotic he is and his views are I'm pulling him down? Thats good reasoning. He you moms a slut whore. Oh dont respond to that bc i'm allowed to have my views and you responding is pulling me down.
I would assume you don't celebrate much before new years. See the problem with ignorant hipocritical atheists is they don't want too be left out when gifts are being past around, however christmas trees and nativitys must be banished, you non belivers want so badly for people to not have faith, it's simply evil, otherwise you would keep your fat lips from flapping all your frustrations on this pointless channell
@mikeyt619 I assume you don't put a christmas tree up in your home since it's forbidden in your own bible. Jeremiah 10:2-4. The ritual of bowing to the evergreen tree to place gift under it and then bowing down to the tree again to recieve your gift is a pagan ritual who worshipped the evergreen because it remained green throughout the winter and brought hope of new life in the spring. so keep worshipping our pagan god. oh while your at it look up your easter egg hunt and gift basket as well.
@philosophyman76 Just remember hot shot who puts all of his life's efforts in trying to argue with people of faith, you will live in hell when you die.
@mikeyt619 Yeah and if you are bad santa won't bring you any gifts and the boogey man will get you in your sleep. Sorry the threats of hell don;'t convince me of a ALL LOVING and GOOD deity. you don't see the hypocrisy there huh. Here you want to know how much your threat scares me. If you don't beleive in Alllah then you will burn in hell. Does that make you scared? Are you converting now to another nonsense religion? No? Good now you see how stupid your argument is.
@mikeyt619 is that your home page? Nice tell your preacher and reverend they probably don't need it bc they have you and the rest of the flock to take care of their needs. Maybe thats why christians are so against abortion. Less little boys to molest.
@philosophyman76 It's obvious that a high horse comes with a philosophy major, you did major in philosophy, correct, o wise one, who needs no god but himself and worships the ground that hi feet feather, and has sex with a flickering screen of frustration.
@mikeyt619 you are very ingrossed in sex and sexual comments. you've made three already. you know what they say the people who are most homophobic are usually gay themselves. Don''t hate yourself dude. It's ok. take solace in the fact that your GOD made you that way. It's not your fault. but you should release that sexual tension u have. They probably hv some nice little tykes at that church u go to. Just scare them a little with the hell stuff and you can get them to take care of you
you have no other choice but to belive in GOD thats why you disagree with him ,because no other GOD has ever said I am the creator thats one line that cant be cross, fill how you fill and back it up ,we dont have to keep telling you about us so you can find something wrong so you can think your right,Dont worry About GOD if you dont belive in him talk about what you are about,the work of the devil, and you dont even see it, your just thinking to hard and think your to smart.
@charlie21698 Yes I have another choice. Its called not believing. remember that whole "freewill thing you christians trot out everything you cant explain the stupidy of god. Ok No other god has said I am the creator? you havnt read enough. But here you go. "I AM THE CREATOR" - lord she-ra. see there you go another god named she-ra said it so therefore she must be true. Oh by the way there is no devil either. No santa, unicorns, fairies and no god. i know religion hates smart. sorry
While I understand where the video poster is coming from, I don't agree with his arguments based on the questions he's asking it to justify his own argument. I will leave you @philosophyman76 with with another Philosopher on the topic of Theism/Atheism. watch?v=qVallWIA4G8. The only advice I can give is to hurry, come back to Christ. Don't wait till your time runs out. Be blessed and if you have questions for me, feel free to pm.
@JepMaster8 more from Dr lennox. i've hear dhis arguments before and his debate with dawkins and says some ridiculous things. But I'll watch his Hour and a half or video If yo watch the last 10 videos from philhellenes and we'll see who makes more sense. i envy you though beacuse at least his videos are entertaining. One other question to all you 'better beleive until its to late" How could I ever enjoy heaven if I knew my loved friends and family burned and were eternally tortured in hell?
@philosophyman76 - I think Dr. Lennox's arguments are very valid. It touches on many common topics with very valid answers and questions. It's really a shame if you would get nothing from the interview. It would show that you're not really into understanding the truth, in my humble opinion of-course. Some questions I always ask Atheists are: What validates your personal experience? e.g. Peer review? or Peer experience? e.g. A dream.
@JepMaster8 Fine I'll respond to each argument in a video. good will give me a reason to make a muli-parter. What validates my personal experience. nothing. thats why personal experience is not used as a high form of evidence. we have to use logic, induction and the most reliable sources so to come up with truth. Now answer my question How could any1 enjoy heaven if I their loved ones burn eternally in hell?
@philosophyman76 - "What validates my personal experience. nothing." Exactly. So then, from an Atheist's point of view, since your personal experiences (such as dreams) cannot be validated through scientific evidence nor logic, but only by experience, it's not valid and therefore it's a fairytale, and you're a liar just like Theists are about God? It's not about winning an argument We're really trying to help everyone we can make it. It's really up to you.
@JepMaster8 I'm trying to follow your "logic". so my dreams cant be validated yeah,,,and so therefore its a fairytale TOO others yeah correct U can't Know if I have dreams or thoughts or anything expect through your senses. so that means I'm a liar and god is true? nice leap. this is more lennox bs huh? Knowing and believing are 2 separate issues. if you want to go on knowledge alone we only KNOW we exist. thats it. and We meaning I only KNOW MY personal thoughts exist.
@philosophyman76 i have a video explaining this bc I get the occasional theist who wants to go down this road. it on my channel called "Defining the relious debate" it 15 minute not 93 and i'll cut it down even more for you and say start the video at the 8 min mark bc thats the relevant to the convo section.
@philosophyman76 - ? That was a question. Not a jump. It's based on the same logic that Atheists use. The "If you can't prove it scientifically, it's not true or it's a fairytale" argument. Well, no one can prove what you had a dream about so in essence, using the Atheist argument, dreams must not exist. You only don't know of God's existence because your lack of EXPERIENCE which is derived from lack of faith. If you had the experience, like you have had dreams, you would know.
@JepMaster8 Well scientifically we can look at the brain activity of a dreaming brain and a conscious brain. they actually have people who study dreams and brains and functions all the time. Again not my field of expertise but I'm sure if we dug into the research we can find that we know a lot about brains dreaming, dream states, etc.
@philosophyman76 - I definitely understand that there is scientific study on dreams, but my argument is, current science cannot prove to you "what" you had a dream about. Only you can reveal that. Because you had that experience and it cannot yet be proven by science, does it make your experience invalid? A planet was recently found by NASA. Prior to that finding, did the planet not exist?
@JepMaster8 the planet did exist and once again belief vs knowledge. things can exist outside of our finding them or having evidence. this is why science calls it's highest grade of knowledge a theory. With a dream you are claiming something that everyone else in the world also claims they have. and with extrodinary claims you need extrodinary evidence . Me claiming to dream about my cat does not require same evidence as an all powerful creator existing
@philosophyman76 - So now we are talking about two different levels of evidence? Why? That's not fair argument in my book. You see, the reason why you probably don't see the experience of dreaming as an "extraordinary claim" is because most people including yourself already had "the dream experience". If you're only going to count on science as your sole method of understanding or validating existence, then every claim should be regarded the same way.
@JepMaster8 Why? your kidding right. so if someone says I have $1000 in my wallet is the say level of evidence as you taking their wallet and counting $1000? Of course there is different levels of evidence and colaborating independent evidence is event stronger then that? That doesnt seem like a hard or arguable point.
@philosophyman76 - We're talking about experiences that cannot be proven by sight or by science. Money in your wallet can be seen and counted, dreams on the other hand cannot. That is in the same ballpark as Theism/Atheism argument. Many experienced the Holy Spirit, but these experiences cannot be scientifically proven, just like dreams so what validates your dream but not the experiences with God? You cannot be biased if you're truly seeking truth.
@JepMaster8 because we know dreams arent real. they are cojurations from our brains. just like gods. I dreamt I won 1 milllion dollars. I didn't. Because YOU preceive something doesnt make it real. It only makes it real to you. If I dreamt that I won a million dollars and went to the store and tried to buy rolex with no money and tried to convince them I had the money because I dreamt it and who are they to tell me that I didnt dream it and its not real! I would be called delusional
@philosophyman76 I'm not sure i'm understanding your point. Personal experiences are not evidence of truth. If so everything would be considered true. Purple dinosaurs with top hats, etc. Your saying because we cant see peoples dreams but we belief they have dreams somehow equates to people have experiences with god therefore god is real?
@JepMaster8 my example was sayingt tha counting money is better evidence then you saying you have money. You saying you had a personal experience with a god isnt as strong as god showing up and shaking my hand. You said all evidence should be regarded equaly and I gave you an example to show you it is not. one is more beleivable
@philosophyman76 - you left out the context of our argument though. Again we were on the topic of things that cannot be proven by claim. Each claim in that sense should be equally regarded. My argument is on the truth of experience. You said, personal experience is not truth. I understand what you're saying in one sense, but disagree on another. If you experience something, anything, you may not understand the experience, but the experience is indeed true. -
@JepMaster8 your experience may be true to YOU. but not true. if you take a drug and hallucinate then you had a real experience of your teeth growing to touch the floor. Doesnt mean your teeth actually did that.
@philosophyman76 - "Doesnt mean your teeth actually did that." on that fact you are absolutely right. I'm afraid it's more complex than that. Perhaps we'll continue another time. For now, thanks for debating your points in a professional manner. Have a good one sir.
@philosophyman76 - Right now you're experiencing cognitive activity based on what you're reading, be-it negative or positive etc. The experience you're having is real is it not? Our experience is in existence therefore it is real to you and I. If you disagree to the previous statements, please let me know.
@JepMaster8 two ways I can go that answer. if you beleive there is a world that exists beyond our experience of it then I would say no. our experience doesnt exist. Our experience is just a rising property of our brain state. For example wetness doesnt exist. it's just a rising property of water. no water no wetness. thats the same way i see "experience or thoughts" they dont exist. they are just how our brain comprehends input
@philosophyman76 - Interesting, but I disagree with your argument on "existence". You see, one definition of existence is: "Reality as presented in *experience". One definition of experience is: "the fact or state of having been affected by or gained knowledge through direct observation or participation*. Properties exist just as much as attributes. For instance, the sun is a source of heat, the property which exists due to the reality presented in our experience.
@JepMaster8 yeah I dont have to be a "beleiver" in dreams to have a dream. it happens. I don't see any instances or evidence of a god happening. All i see is people claiming that there is a god, and aliens, and psychic powers, and voodoo. If someone claims they had a dream I belief them bc it doesnt matter. If they claim they had a dream about me giving them $20 I say yes you had a dream but Im not giving you $20 and if they claim if you don give me $20 you go to hell I would say prove that.
@JepMaster8 i have a video explaining this bc I get the occasional theist who wants to go down this road. it on my channel called "Defining the relious debate" it 15 minute not 93 and i'll cut it down even more for you and say start the video at the 8 min mark bc thats the relevant to the convo section.
@philosophyman76 - Well laid out argument. I enjoyed watching it, even though there are a few major points that I disagree on. There are also a few points that I feel that contradicts your own arguments. Especially the part where you spoke on human testimony. You see, you cannot just pick and choose your own (1) definition of something to supplement your argument. There are many definitions on each topic that goes hand in hand and can become quite granular.
@JepMaster8 i haven't got around to doing all my epistomological videos. however one will be on reliablity of evidence. In the case for a god all the evidence combined in my opinion and many others does not fulfill the criteria for belief. Personal experience as evidence for anything is low on the pole bc no one else can experience it. If you tell me your dog can talk but only to you and when no else is around. will i believe you? no and without further evidence I'm gonna say ur delusional
@philosophyman76 - I understand where you're coming from. But drawing from this, what if (please pardon me for the "what if") the dog spoke to you after I told you my dog can talk? Would we... both be delusional? Would our experiences be valid if the dog chose not to speak to anyone else? What validates experience?
@JepMaster8 it would be true to me and you but no body else. bc we know the natur of dogs , studied their brains and anatomy and all the evidence says they cant talk. If we see it talk to us then to us then we have a higher beleif in talking dogs bc we would have more evidence of such a thing. the only thing that matters is can the dog talk or not. If it can then we would have a higher justification for believing then others but others would not be justified in sharing our belief.
@philosophyman76 again this is all epistomology. . And with all the evidence against dog speech if me and you were the only ones hearing the dog speak then I would question both of our sanity and so would the rest of the world justifiably so. But if this dog was all powerful and wanted everyone to follow his rules Just announcing himself to me and you would not be a great way to convince people that he could talk and his rules were real. no matter how many books about it we wrote about it
@philosophyman76 - "How could I ever enjoy heaven if I knew my loved friends and family burned and were eternally tortured in hell" - In the presence of God in heaven there will be no sorrow.
@JepMaster8 ok so I won't be me and god will erase my knowledge of self and I will forget my loved ones and family. but they are what made me me. So what you are saying is god will brain wash us into forgetting the people we cared about and loved our entire life. what else will he block. and how am i me if he erases all my memories. Well if I cant remember or see my loved one what kind of heaven is this?
@philosophyman76 - Please, don't twist my words. All I said was there will be no sorrow in the presence of God in heaven. If you had the holy spirit within you through faith, if you were born again, your beloved friends would be getting an earful from you to re-consider their Atheism. There is greater understanding than Human Logic and a wealth of yet unknown scientific knowledge. Don't be deceived into thinking you're smarter than the creator of it all.
@JepMaster8 really this is you idea of heaven having your memories erased. sorry not for me. i'd rather burn with my family then forget that they existed
@patetarr I heard he came back like a thousands times in south america. There are Jesus's everywhere. And I've been ready every time. But I'll go to the gym and save some money so I'm SUPER ready when God's Mini me comes back
@philosophyman76 I would love to have a chat with you about all this. Really! Without an audience for obvious reasons! Is that possible? How do i contact you?
"The natural man perceiveth not the things of the spirit, for they are foolishness to him, neither CAN he know them for they are spiritually discerned."
Seriously... arguing with Christians is pointless. They simply cannot see the hypocrisy in "picking and choosing" the parts of the bible (the very holy book they base their entire reason for existence on) that are convenient for them to "believe in".
Watching Steve Harvey spew his nonsense made it painfully clear that he has not read the bible (something common among "christians")... or at least, he refuses to read the parts that make Christianity look very very immoral.
@Mr2weak Simple question: (As per you're "father's rules" analogy) Is murder a proper punishment for trivial disobedience? If you're idea of God's justice is to eradicate all petty acts by killing everyone within a five-mile radius, what makes your argument even pragmatically feasible? You're God, who could easy just make people stop "sinning", decides to kill them, instead. He even sends other people to do it for him. But even you know killing is bad, so who are you following?
@namtesyalp simple minded huh. simple minded enough to get off our knees and actually find out whats behind the curtain instead of just groveling to the great OZ. go listen to steve harvey and his 'morphues clod" and then go listen to neil tyson degrasse (director of the hayden plantarium in the museum of natural history) talk about the universe and you tell me who's a dumbass. But i know you wont do that because you have more praying to do and it's hard to get anywhere on your knees
@iiidol How would that explain it all. I would love to hear your logical jump from homosexual to atheist or vice versa? Oh right your a theist and beleive in magic. you dont use logic. Ok well that makes sense then
@namtesyalp Ok so All atheists are now homosexual? First I'm not homosexual but if I was what would that have to do with me beleiving in god. I guess all those kid rapers in your church didn't really beleive in god? Oooor you don't think its ok for homosexuality if ppl are older but you feel ok with your habit of molesting children? I get it now. You know point the finger at others to hide your own problems. Thats cool I wont tell anyone. but you should get some help.
@namtesyalp no your invisible man is EVERYWHERE. He is the sky. He's daddy touching u all over. Punishing you when your bad and giving praise when your good. "Thank you daddy. Was I a good boy?" WHY YES YOU WERE. GET DOWN ON YOUR KNEES AND TAKE MY BODY INTO YOUR MOUTH" lol and you have the nerve to call others gay.
@namtesyalp yes very witty retort. Am i a poopyhead, and dummy and well? Are you going to stick your tongue out at me and put your thumbs in your ears? Let me lower my arguments to your level. Your a stupid head, and jerky jerk. dumbface.
@philosophyman76 so instead of God I should believ in darwin that said you may be the missing link,that you have low intelligence,naturally engage in sloth and lazyness,that you actually are going in reverse evolution?your comments and attempts to prove darwin right may succed if you keep going
@namtesyalp pk well you can believe in darwin because for 1 darwin ACTUALLY existed. kind helps. secondly the rest of your comment is just stupid and makes no sense. It's amazing to me how creationists and theists really don't even take the time to figure out what the opposing argument even is. When I argue an idiot um I mean theist I at least hear what they are saying and then show them why its stupid. You guys just make sh*t up and attack that.
@philosophyman76 guess your dull mind doesnt realize these are stereotypes of black people in darwins time.he said blacks probably were the missing link,"science of his time also said blacks may be going in reverse of evolution,not made up, facts.I know you will block me soon as do other atheist because you cant fence with me
@namtesyalp I'm sure your insane intellect has baffled soooo many people. an even if that statement was true (which I don't remember reading that statement in the origin of species so I'd love for you to site your source) so what. Isaac newton thought he could change lead into gold. Bc he was wrong about that does that mean gravity isnt true? We dont think evolution is true bc "Darwin" said it. We KNOW evolution is true because thats what all the evidence confirms is true.
@philosophyman76 not in origin of a species,in his writings.books like "the inferiority of the negro" were common as political correctness today.if a white wrote that it was possible that a black was intelligent without mixed blood he would be blackballed.I have a sense you can be likeable and have intelligance.Maybe a personal experience made you think this way.if you look at history,I am right in many ways,I believ my brother is an atheist but wont admit it,ILL CUT THE INSULTS, LETS CONVERSE
@namtesyalp What you don't seem to understand is I don't care what darwins personal beliefs or actions were. all i care is what is true. this isnt a court of law where you try and discredit the witness and that makes the testimony questionable. Isaac newton could have been a cannibal and it wouldnt discredit gravity. Darwin could have shot Martin luther king, it wouldnt do anything to the validity of evolution. I'm not atheist bc of an experience. Im an atheist for the lack of evidence of a god
It's 100000000% moral to offer people the option to avoid hell, then provide the way out of hell FREE of charge by sacrificing your own Son. It's the first mistake of the person who isn't really familiar with the Bible. Every story is a picture of God trying to draw ALL people into his bosom. But THEY....aren't having it. You talk about Christianity as if from experience. You haven't tried Jesus and found him wanting. HE might not be convenient but HE it ain't lacking. Faith seeks understanding.
@soulseul 1000000% huh. So if I make a torture chamber and have a child and tell him that b4 he came along I had another child who had magic powers and healed people and could walk across the pool but I had him brutally killed to pave the way for you. And you have to believe this story to make me happy. I dont care if you murder, rape, and steal as long as you apologize all will be forgiven except you must believe this story or I will torture you everyday. NICE MORALITY, NICE LOVE
you vaguely references some things in the Old Testament. I'd like to know if your moral barometer means you can quote what Jesus said is "the law" ? You can't criticize him because you fakin religion
@soulseul No it doesnt. my moral barometer has nothing to do with the bible, jesus, or skydaddy. you point to one place where jesbus says some good things and I can point to another place where things jesbus and his daddy say some really immoral things. Let me ask you this mr. moral. How moral is it to torture someone for eternity? No matter what your child did would you ever torture him/or her everyday? Oh yeah and hell isnt in the bible until "gentile jesus meek and mild" is introduced. thanks
Philosophyman76. LOL whatever dude somethings just require that you go through it in order to learn . But a eternity in hell to learn is plenty of time . And though you are as clueless As can be I will still pray that you don't end up there . May God show you the true path before its all over
@MrDovahkinn well first how are you learning in hell? I mean eternal punishiment is eternal right. I mean that seems a little excessive for a loving god don't you think? After like 1000 years of torture every single moment that maybe a caring and forgiving god would say ok thats enough. Not ur deity. He is going to burn u for 10000000000000000000 years and then smile laugh and do it again. Why? well bc you dont belief this story about a guy 2000 years ago. this is what u believe huh? interesting
@MrDovahkinn stop being a child. hell is childrens story. do u still believe that santa wont bring you gifts if your naughty? This deity torturing people for eternity is where I'm supposed to get my "moral compass" from. It's childrens story and hopefully eventualy you will see the "light" and give it up.
While you sit there with that ugly smirk on your face denying God those devils around you are laughing at how much of a fool you are to believe he does not exist . You are the parasite , you and all those like you are the scourge of the earth not us . The way you feel toward us I assure you we feel even stronger about you . Atheism is nothing but the SCUM FROM HELL
All of your knowledge all of your degrees all of your accomplishments and money will mean nothing in hell . Watch yourself boy your mouth will get you in a world of trouble . God will humble the arrogant and proud . Repent and turn to God whom you have blasphemed before you send your soul down to the corners of the pit
@MrDovahkinn lmao. Which god are you talking about? Zeus, krishna, allah? Your funny. you seem really angry. where is your love. God say love all those even those you dont agree with you. Psalms Luke Perry 14:10. look it up. I know you want your imaginary friend to beat me up for making fun of your silly beliefs but sorry heshe it will not. Bad stuff will happen to me and you bc thats called life and we both end up decomposing and our conscious will end. No magic happy or sad place exists. sorry
@nickclass13 i think i was pretty clear in my video. you only here mad bc you think you imaginary friend is helping steve. so what about george clooney atheist and prospering. What about bill gates? athiest what about the propering in japan, hoolland finland etc who are atheist. wha tabout the prosperous who follow the "false gods" in india? I'm not upset bc he is prosperous. I am upset bc he's an ahole, uneducated, bigot, spreading hatred.
@philosophyman76 Yes good point, to counter his arguement you simply name every successful person of every denomination and cultual background. Horrible retort.
Steve Harvey much like most Christians are wrong when they say things like this, dont get to happy atheist because there are a multitude of people on your side as well who do nothing but say anti religious bs all day.
@philosophyman76 PART2: I have done my research on atheistic thinking and although I do not agree with them I CAN SEE THERE POINT. And many real atheist will say the same thing about religion, Most will tell you it is a Noumea, which is something we CANT know. Everything both sides say is strictly based on personal opinion and belief because WE CANNOT KNOW THE ANSWER. or even if there is an answer to be known. All we can do is take it on good faith that what we believe is true.
@Mr2weak see the problem is not in "knowing" in the pure sense of the word and to take solice in the fact that we can't KNOW either way therefore both conclusions are equally correct. I can't KNOW anything other then I exist. The point of the debate is to show which belief is more credible. The way we make that determination is with evaluating the evidence of the claim. Check out my "defining the terms..." vid. good to see you back. I'm finally in gold league on all my SC2 accounts
@philosophyman76 PART1: I disagree with your "Terms" an Athiest is making a stand in saying I do not believe in god, while an agnostic is like asking someone if libia has a president, they say they dont know, there could be and there could not be but I dont know, while the athiest strickly says there is No God. I am not going to watch the full video because its basic stuff that any person having this convo should already know. If they dont then just ignore them for being ignorant.
@Mr2weak P1 then i suggest u watch the full video bc i address this in the vid. one is about beleif and the other is about knowledge. I believe there is no god just as much as theist belief there is one. neither of us have knowledge of the fact. thats why agnostic to me is meaningless term
@philosophyman76 PART2: The main issue on evaluating the evidence is that its truth lies within the eye of the beholder. It is intangible, sufficient evidence for person A may not be for person B.
I like agnostics more than athiest because they are taking a more leniant all be it cowardly stance on the issue. They admit that they dont know for sure and basically just plead the 5th. But for someone to say that god doesnt exist is simply too big of a leap for someone to take...
@philosophyman76 PART3: Why is why alot of atheist like Hitchens and James have alot of trouble debating the matter.
Remember that science is mere observations, it cannot contradict god in anyway because they are on opposite spectrum. I am going to skip a bit because were both smart and say this, and let me know if you disagree.
There is nothing science or an anyone can do to disprove gods existence, it is impossible. A Noumena, We both know that. So....
@philosophyman76 PART4: All that lies is to show some falicies in the concept of god. You poke and prod at the bible, christian beliefs and mistakes made by people who CLAIMED to be Christians although they didnt practice it (crusades).
You bring up observations like gravity, theory, btw i like how you brought up Descartes who had very athiestic views with his so called meditations. And I think therefore I am, haha. The man is a failed philosopher who has been given too much credit.
@Mr2weak P3-4 no you can't disprove anything accept all the claims that are made. The HONEST stance is exactly what descarte did and said what if I am being tricked and cant trust my senses bc sometimes my senses are wrong. so what do I KNOW and the only thing we KNOW for sure is that I exist. it's most profound philosophical statement ever so to say he is a failed philosopher is just asinine.
@philosophyman76 PART5: So to rap this up you are fighting not against god or his ideals but the concept, the idea of him. A belief, and you fight this with observations. Giving insight on things you perceive to disprove his existence BUT this comes back around because that may not be perceived that may to someone else, especially unlikely if they are christian.
So what we have here is a stalemate. 2 sides fighting for something they cannot prove. So that leaves 1 test. Balance..
@Mr2weak PART6: Which side leaves the world in a better place, you ofcourse would say the world is better off without religion and would bring up terrorist and war and how living in a lie is bad. I on the other hand would say religion teaches peace and anyone who does not practice that isnt truly religious. I would say some if not MOST of the world greatest minds were religious. And that religion strenghtens morality and the sense of community. (read "bowling alone" it goes in on this)
@Mr2weak p5 no it doesnt. the problem is you are doing something called special pleading. you have criterias of evidence you require to beleive everything else excpet you god . Bc you want to beleif your god. you tell me what your standard of evidence are and I'll give you examples of either how your god doesnt meet them or how your standards are so low that you have beleive all kinds of nonsense that fullfill the same standard. that is why i dont BELIEVE in a god
@philosophyman76 Part1: your part 1 basically just confirms what I already said, and in my Part8 I said that I did go ahead and finished your video. and yes agnostic is pretty much meaningless.
Really? The phrase "I think therefore i am" is philosophically flawed in many ways. I expect you to already know that. The hint to its flaws lies within the " I "
Descartes had very atheistic ideas, one being that we are god since without he cannot exist or something like that.
@philosophyman76 You forget the rest of Descartes's thoughts on the sense, he says although his sense my be tricked it serves no purpose in disregarding them. (referring to sight and how something look bigger or smaller through different perspectives)
Again, you cannot know that the " I " exist especially when you base that knowledge on the idea that you are thinking.
@Mr2weak You disprove (since you love disproving) to me that I exist. Descarte tried to get out of his only concrete stance for knowledge of I exist and failed. and that leave i exist as the only true knowledge one can have. EVERYTHING else is from inference, induction and perception. I know i exist bc in order to have that thought I have to exist to think it. I meaning my thought process not my physical body.
@philosophyman76 PART4: I believe immanuel kant said it best when he said " Experiences must verify what we say about the world, What experience can verify I think therefore I am”"
All "I think therefore I am" says is that All this says is that " I the (psychological ego) thinks" therefore "I the (transcendental ego) am." the Noumenal self remains as unknown as ever.
@philosophyman76 PART5: Now when it comes to my standards of evidence it is obvious that when made you can easily replace god with idk the Pastafarian god or godly alien and it would meet those same criteria. So then it becomes less about the evidence and more about what we think/feel the evidence represents. which just goes back around to what i said earlier about it being in the eye of the beholder. Evidence A doesnt look like evidence to Person B.
@Mr2weak well no. i can substitute in random stuff based on your standard of evidence and therefore you have 2 choices accept everything that fits the criteria and be ...well foolish. Or say your standard of evidence is not high enough. Option 3 where you just arbitrarily pick what you want is not a path to knowledge or truth. Its a way to delusion. the way you find truth is u start with doubting everything not picking wht you want to be true and finding evidence that supports your case
@philosophyman76 PART6: So rather than dispute the evidence you try to dispute our perception of said evidence which is pretty silly if you ask me lol. It would be like trying to convince a football fan that football is meaningless.
You trying to convince me that god isnt real would be a easy as me convincing you that he is real. Were fighting over how we perceive the world and are frustrated that the other person doesn't see it the same way. Truly a pointless endeavor..... I plead the 5Th. :)
@Mr2weak so when people shoot, kill and bomb, and try to control other people in the name of the "perception" of god they think exists according to you it's pointless to debate. Obviously everyones percetion is true. wrong. again we come back to standards. we as a society have to interact with each other and just saying everyone is right about everything aint a good way to interact. science and logic is the best we have. Old books, feelings and perceptions don't really cut the mustard
@philosophyman76 PART 3: Now my reasons for believing may and do only apply to me whether they may seem like outrages coincidence or chance.
What your saying is "THERES NO EVIDENCE SO YOU SHOULDNT BELIEVE IN HIM" and what i am saying is "EVEN IF THERE ISNT ANY EVIDENCE THAT DOESNT DISPROVE HIM"
How can you possibly argue? What point can you make. Even if you shoot down all my evidences it wont change anything. How can you disprove a feeling I have, or how I look at things? You cant win.
@Mr2weak P3 look i'm not interested in what people believe. I'm interested in the actual truth. if you want to belief your a millionaire thats fine. But if you have no money you can't buy anything what good does beleiving your a millionare do you. Now if you started hiring people to work for you and told people what to do based on you being a millionaire then we have a name for those people. It's called delusional. Believing and acting on something you have no evidence for.
@philosophyman76 PART 2: Thats what I mean, you can substitute it for anything BUT that thing must exist on the same plain as GOD. hence me saying pastafarian or a 'godly' alien. God cannot be substituted by a unicorn unless you give that unicorn the same qualities as good.
I did doubt everything, I used to be an atheist. Now if you want me to say there isnt sufficient evidence for gods existence ill say that, because its true. But that doesn't mean he doesn't exist.....
@philosophyman76 PART4: At the same time I cant win either, But I know better than to think I can win.
I love how you bring up terrorist, i knew youd do that, they arent christians. If the bible says dont kill, and someone else says kill, how can you say that the killer is a christian? wheres YOUR evidence. What because he sat in the back of church?
Hmm, so with your logic happiness, compassion and hope dont exist? Feelings and perceptions dont cut the mustard.
@Mr2weak p4 you think that there are no christian terrorists? Lets go back oh say 60 years when they were burning crosses and terrorizing blacks all across this nation. But of course those aren't "true" christians right?
Logic, happiness, compassion, dont exist based on the definition of existence. these are rising properties of our brains. Does "wetness" exist? No it's just a property of water. again now your getting into a language and definition issue of the word existence
@philosophyman76 PART5: It all comes down to making sense, I think it makes sense. That sense comes from what I feel and perceive. You dont agree? you dont have to agree. But others do. Now what gives you the right to say your reality is any more real than ours? Is it because we dont meet your standards of reality?
Are vegans wrong as well? There reality of eating meat being wrong doesn't match ours, there fore they are psychopathic and mentality deranged? No!, there just see things differently
@Mr2weak right and wrong don't exist. Its a concept created by man. if a vegan wants to say eating meat is "wrong" fine. If they try to impose that on others then we will decide if society deems it as "wrong". But if the person has a personal belief then they are entitled to think and act however they want as long as it doesnt impact someone else. This method ur talking about would be great if we didnt have to interact with each other. but we do. so we have to agree on standards of truth
@philosophyman76 PART6: When you take an agnostic stance its ok, you admit that there may be a possibly .000000009% chance he is wrong. To say he doesn't exist is insane, but to say you dont believe is weird? You dont confront the question, instead you dance around it. Its ingenious.
How you can justify saying that an educated man who is no better or worse than you yourself is any less because the way he see's reality differs from yours.
And you say Christianity is controlling and manipulative
@Mr2weak again definitions.agnostic is a meaingless term becasue we are all agnostic about everything. except that we exist. But we cant live our lives that way. so we have to accept some things and standards of belief that we agree on. like induction. Do we KNOW the sun will rise nope. We believe it will and we base that on the fact that always has. There is the world and then there is our perception of the world. we have a shared reality and hv to agree on some level of evidence to coexist.
@philosophyman76 PART1: You keep repeating yourself and what I said. So ill say it again to clear the air.
Crusaders and terrorist are christians... Just like a guy who eats mean isnt a vegetarian. That makes more than perfect sense, how can you detest that?
Yes Agnostic is a frifilous term, meaningless as well, we both already agreed to that... so why bring it up.
@Mr2weak "Crusaders and terrorist are christians... Just like a guy who eats mean isnt a vegetarian. That makes more than perfect sense, how can you detest that?" i'm guessing you meant "aren't" so i'll answer it that way. false analogy the meaning of the word vegetarian is "too not eat meat." the crusaders could point to your holy book and say we are following the words of god. and you would point to the same book and say no your not. it's debateable vegetarian is not.
@philosophyman76 PART2: "We share a world... we agree on some level of existence..." agreed.
I am going to give in... you got me sir, well played. So now what do I do. I have this overwhelming feeling that god exist and that what I perceive is reality. Do you have pills prescribed for me?Should I just wake up from this matrix like delusion?
By saying I have no reason/evidence to believe in god what are you really saying? What are you really proving?
@philosophyman76 PART3: You would ask that throw away my principles, my faith, my belief which are just as strong as your beliefs if not stronger, my lifestyle. All on the basis of you saying "You have no reason not to/ no evidence not to".
How can you possibly think I would buy that. How could you think it would be that easy?
You think that if you can tarnish my reasons for believing you will shake my faith? But the only problem is that it isnt that easy.
@Mr2weak " You would ask that throw away my principles,...." in short yes. I didnt say it was easy or would be easy. it has taken me a long time to overcome my fear of hell. Isnt it funny that religion plays upon the only 2 motivating emotions humans have , fear and desire. and then makes Faith a grand thing? If you listen great rewards if you don't eternal punishment and the greatest thing you can have is faith. (bc i have no evidence) sounds like a great con job to me
@philosophyman76 PART4: My dad had a dream something happened to my sisters plane and woke up screaming about it. 2 days later when she landed we found out her plane was hit by lighting 3 times.
I personally have been in 5 extremely near death experiences and on top of that I had sleep apnea as a kid. When I look at these things among a lot of other I see a divine plan of some sort, I may not be able to prove that divinity, but I do feel it. And to not act upon ones sense is truly unreasonable.
@Mr2weak and what about the other thousands of dreams your dad has had? . Humans look for meaning. thats what we do. we try and figure things out. you had some near death exps. great so have i. everyone does. you drive a car and have them once or twice a year. so if we just miss the car thank god, if we hit but no one is hurt thank god, if we're hurt but not bad thank god, if hurt bad but dont die thank god if we die thats just gods plan thank god. Do u see the problem?
@philosophyman76 PART1: The bible says strictly "Thou Shalt Not Kill", to counter you I will simply the millions that atheist has killed. Being a christian is vague since it only means believing in Jesus/god and not living by the terms they set. With that being said many Christians can be bad people. So can atheist, Christianity does not provide a stabler environment for terrorism though.
@Mr2weak part 1: i hate quoting the bible but just to make my point here are some verses that directly tell people to kill. (Deuteronomy 17:12, Exodus 22:17, Leviticus 20:13, Exodus 21:15, 2 Chronicles 15:12-13,Numbers 1:48-51, etc... I can give you at least 10 more if you'd like where the bible says strictly to kill these people who do ____. And YOU might say well dont look over there, look over here but it's all in the same book. Athiests don't claim to follow any book or texts
@philosophyman76 PART2: Sorry when I say things like that I keep on trying to stress to you the limits of science, which is things like emotions, feelings, ideas, etc. But you must be one of the few scientist that dont believe science has its limits.
As for eternal punishment in your regards the same can be said for out society. A murderer goes to jail for life just as a sinner goes to hell for eternity.
@Mr2weak life is 100 years tops if they are put in jail at birth. And even we lowly humans don't torture criminals daily during that imprisonment. Your god's punishment lasts for 1000000000000000000000 years time 10 and every moment is filled with torture. no rest, no sleep, no food. just eternal punishment. THIS is a god of love and forgiveness??? this is where I'm supposed to get my moral barometer from? Do as i say or eternal puishment. And not for killing. For not believing. ?
@Mr2weak emotions feelings ideas. Why can't science explain these things? They are properties of a brain. they aren't special. We have drugs that can create emotions and we know what kind of emotions and feeling in a person. We what is it that we won't be able to explain one day about the human condition that you think is so mystical?
@philosophyman76 PART1: No i dont say dont look here look there, I didnt even look it up. Like I said before the bible was written by men and in there times that was perfectly acceptable. I dont see your point for saying those verses?
So your arguement is that someone who murders someone should be punished. Just not punished equally to the life they took. Interesting. And your view on Hell is flawed, no food no sleep? what do you know about hell??
@Mr2weak Revelations 20:10... thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever. My point of the verses is u said "The bible says strictly "Thou Shalt Not Kill"" So i was countering that point with 15 places where it strictly says "THOU SHALL KILL" so u are picking the parts you like and ignoring the parts you don't. I'm not just pulling stuff out of my arse. I'm commenting on what u say
@Mr2weak it's not hard to find this stuff. just read your damn bible. like how I brought that full circle right. So equal punishment for killing someone who might have lived 100 years tops, is 100billion years of torture? you call that equal? MAybe god after 1000 years or so of constant agony and torture would say hey EVERYONE is going to die eventually anyway. 1000 years of torture is enough for you to learn your lesson. NOPE ETERNITY. If thats ur moral barometer I don't want it
@Mr2weak oh by the way that eternity of torture is not just for killers and rapist. Its for everyone who doesnt repent. All muslims, jews, chinese, atheists, buddahist, Jane's (who aren't allowed to kill even bacteria) and everyone who does except that jesus died for them. I am love. I am forgiveness. You don't beleive that well eternity of torture for you. again this doesnt seem wrong or weird to you huh?
@philosophyman76 PART1: See your choosing parts of my arguement that you want to comment on and completely ignoring the rest.
Yes well if you had watched the god delusion you would have heard lennox's arguement that religion actually promoted science, so your "well i cant figure it out so i..." statement is completely wrong.
Your giving mankind alot of credit for living that long...
@Mr2weak yeah science had to come out of religion bc religion came first. And the only way to learn and read was through the church. And for quite some time they kinda KILLED you if you didnt beleive in what they said. So if you held an ax to my head sure I'll beleive in your god all day long. just dont kill me. Oh and because "lennox" says something doesnt make it correct. He spouted so much nonsense... wait for my videos their coming soon.
@philosophyman76 PART2: Once again your picking what you want to hear, I obviously said and already stated that the 10 commandments are from god, everything else is more or less from man and pertained to there time. And I have said time and time again that the bible isn't the main staple of Christianity, it is for reflection on faith and not for strict modern day application. AND the new testament supersedes the old as the old testament was barbaric, including human sacrifices etc...
@Mr2weak ok sa why do the 10 commandments (which are like 4 commandments about just love only one skydaddy. the REAL thing but everything else isnt? How did you dechipher that? and if the NT supercedes the old I guess it doesnt matter that Adam ate the apple and original sin is not relevant and henceforth no need for jesus. Oh and remind me again where the 10 commandments are again? The OT or the NT? i forget which half of the book has what and what is important and what is made up.
@philosophyman76 PART3: You didn't bring it full circle, you just wasted my time. You arguments on hell are mute/moot since no one knows what hell is like. Also I am pretty sure revaluation was written by man, peter also wrote his version because it says that god will let people out of hell if the people in heaven want him to, obviously this version wasn't except. Once again written by man = less credible.
@Mr2weak Dude i'm sorry but THE ENTIRE THING WAS WRITTEN BY MAN. it's all made up. You are picking a choosing what you want to beleive just like your claiming others do and that the bible does itslef. Why don't you see that? Yeah your right people don't know what hell is like bc its make beleve, so is heaven god and the rest of the magic. again How are u deciding what is true? And how do yo know ur right when others are just picking what they want to see using the same system you are
@philosophyman76 Your asking questions that.... What ever ill answer them.
Yes we are all quite aware of Christianities muddy past, and apparently you love it because you always stay there using it to try to prove one thing or another. NT supersedes OT because it was inferred by jesus. The OT was based on appeasing god through sacrifices and rituals to attest for sin. jesus came in the NT and died for our sinces making the OT practices unneeded.
@philosophyman76 PART2: oh my god your... dude what are you talking about.
God told moses the 10 commandments. and to my knowledge it is one of the few parts of the bible that comes directly from god, OFCOURSE i am speaking from a christian point of view so you pointing out it was all made it is irrelevant. Make an argument please or admit you cant make one but dont waste my time.
@Mr2weak My argument AGAIN is no your not making it from a CHRISTIAN point of view. your making it from YOUR point of view. Because I can find hundreds of christians who would say YOU arent a TRUE christian just by this comment. And they would point to other parts of the bible to make their point just as you are trying to make yours. SO MY POINT IS... why is anything your saying any more true then what OTHER CHRISTIANS say is true. I think your all nuts but thats coming from an outsider
@philosophyman76 Part4: Yes, and these people if you didnt read the bible will be given a chance at the end to repent when they are confronted by god... everyone will... Come on mr.IReadthebible. You already know this so stop cherry picking.
@Mr2weak oh right repent. So how do the people who live their entire life and never hear or see a bible repent? How do children repent? How do people who say lusting after an evil woman and then instantly get killed in a car accident repent? Oh right god has loop holes for those ppl somehow. why does god need to Kill and massacre his son to forgive his creations? Why not just forgive them? Seems like something that IS love and forgiveness should be able to do without a blood sacrafice
@philosophyman76 PART2: Because sin just like crime isnt something you can just be let off the hook for, if I killed you kid even if you didnt care and said it was ok I would still have to answer to the law. By jesus dying the worst possible death in the worst possible way he boar the punishment for us.
Dude seriously, WHY ARE YOU ASKING ME THIS STUFF. You questioning me on the bible?? really?? What is the point of this? Stop wasting my time. Dont talk just to talk, make a point or gtfo........
CHECK YOURSELF BRO!!!!!! HIS LIFE IS BETTER THAN YOURS CAUSE MOST OF AMERICA KNOWS HIM.............................YOUTUBE IS THE ONLY WAY I EVER WOULD HAVE KNOWN YOU EVEN EXSITED!!!!!! You come across like a wannabe white hating your own color black guy!! I have spent too much of my life even responding to your video because you are not worth it I just hate to see a brother lost and hating the skin he was born in!!
TheGeezey 1 day ago
@TheGeezey So popular means he has a better life? sorry I'd rather be me then ignant ass steve harvey any day of the week. My goal is not to be famous. And what does race have anything to do with it. YOUR the racist. I'm responding to another man. If you look at my channel I respond TOO ALL IDIOTS REGARDLESS OF THEIR SKIN. So i suggest you "check yourself" and stop kissing celebrities aholes. let me giv eyou a tip being a celeb is not the only way to have a rewarding and great life.
philosophyman76 1 day ago
WOW!!! You believe what you believe and Steve believes what he believes, Yet you spent 10 whole minutes downing what another man believes because he is famous ANOTHER BLACK MAN AT THAT!! Thats whats wrong with our race is brothers like you!!! Crabs in a bucket!!! Your moral barrameter is broken because if you treated people like you want to be treated you would respect his views (doesn't mean you have to agree with them)
TheGeezey 1 day ago
@TheGeezey Apparently steve is so famous that you didnt here him pedal his nonsense in the first place. So when SH writes a book and goes on TV and radio saying people have no moral barometer and dont deserve to be in a relationship thats ok. But if you respond and say how idiotic he is and his views are I'm pulling him down? Thats good reasoning. He you moms a slut whore. Oh dont respond to that bc i'm allowed to have my views and you responding is pulling me down.
philosophyman76 1 day ago
I would assume you don't celebrate much before new years. See the problem with ignorant hipocritical atheists is they don't want too be left out when gifts are being past around, however christmas trees and nativitys must be banished, you non belivers want so badly for people to not have faith, it's simply evil, otherwise you would keep your fat lips from flapping all your frustrations on this pointless channell
mikeyt619 2 days ago
@mikeyt619 I assume you don't put a christmas tree up in your home since it's forbidden in your own bible. Jeremiah 10:2-4. The ritual of bowing to the evergreen tree to place gift under it and then bowing down to the tree again to recieve your gift is a pagan ritual who worshipped the evergreen because it remained green throughout the winter and brought hope of new life in the spring. so keep worshipping our pagan god. oh while your at it look up your easter egg hunt and gift basket as well.
philosophyman76 2 days ago
Some good points though.
ashleylintez1 2 days ago
Oh! my Prophecy will be fulfilled. Just don't blaspheme against the holy ghost please.
ashleylintez1 2 days ago
If his moral barrameter came from the 10 commandments, slavery,rape, child molestation, cruelty to animals, ect., ect, is fine with him.
donntruj 3 days ago
Sky Daddy is the coolest name I've ever heard for God.
nasmoe 3 days ago
@nasmoe I can't take credit I stole it from either the atheist experience show or tunderf00t. Thanks for watching though.
philosophyman76 3 days ago
I'll keep it simple. Good video!
F8sassassin 3 days ago
@F8sassassin thank you. it's an old one but it keeps getting view. appreciat ethe comment though
philosophyman76 3 days ago
@philosophyman76 Just remember hot shot who puts all of his life's efforts in trying to argue with people of faith, you will live in hell when you die.
mikeyt619 4 days ago
@mikeyt619 Yeah and if you are bad santa won't bring you any gifts and the boogey man will get you in your sleep. Sorry the threats of hell don;'t convince me of a ALL LOVING and GOOD deity. you don't see the hypocrisy there huh. Here you want to know how much your threat scares me. If you don't beleive in Alllah then you will burn in hell. Does that make you scared? Are you converting now to another nonsense religion? No? Good now you see how stupid your argument is.
philosophyman76 4 days ago
Philosophyqueer76@lilboys.gov
mikeyt619 4 days ago
@mikeyt619 is that your home page? Nice tell your preacher and reverend they probably don't need it bc they have you and the rest of the flock to take care of their needs. Maybe thats why christians are so against abortion. Less little boys to molest.
philosophyman76 4 days ago
@philosophyman76 It's obvious that a high horse comes with a philosophy major, you did major in philosophy, correct, o wise one, who needs no god but himself and worships the ground that hi feet feather, and has sex with a flickering screen of frustration.
mikeyt619 4 days ago
@mikeyt619 you are very ingrossed in sex and sexual comments. you've made three already. you know what they say the people who are most homophobic are usually gay themselves. Don''t hate yourself dude. It's ok. take solace in the fact that your GOD made you that way. It's not your fault. but you should release that sexual tension u have. They probably hv some nice little tykes at that church u go to. Just scare them a little with the hell stuff and you can get them to take care of you
philosophyman76 4 days ago
you have no other choice but to belive in GOD thats why you disagree with him ,because no other GOD has ever said I am the creator thats one line that cant be cross, fill how you fill and back it up ,we dont have to keep telling you about us so you can find something wrong so you can think your right,Dont worry About GOD if you dont belive in him talk about what you are about,the work of the devil, and you dont even see it, your just thinking to hard and think your to smart.
charlie21698 4 days ago
@charlie21698 Yes I have another choice. Its called not believing. remember that whole "freewill thing you christians trot out everything you cant explain the stupidy of god. Ok No other god has said I am the creator? you havnt read enough. But here you go. "I AM THE CREATOR" - lord she-ra. see there you go another god named she-ra said it so therefore she must be true. Oh by the way there is no devil either. No santa, unicorns, fairies and no god. i know religion hates smart. sorry
philosophyman76 4 days ago
While I understand where the video poster is coming from, I don't agree with his arguments based on the questions he's asking it to justify his own argument. I will leave you @philosophyman76 with with another Philosopher on the topic of Theism/Atheism. watch?v=qVallWIA4G8. The only advice I can give is to hurry, come back to Christ. Don't wait till your time runs out. Be blessed and if you have questions for me, feel free to pm.
JepMaster8 5 days ago
@JepMaster8 more from Dr lennox. i've hear dhis arguments before and his debate with dawkins and says some ridiculous things. But I'll watch his Hour and a half or video If yo watch the last 10 videos from philhellenes and we'll see who makes more sense. i envy you though beacuse at least his videos are entertaining. One other question to all you 'better beleive until its to late" How could I ever enjoy heaven if I knew my loved friends and family burned and were eternally tortured in hell?
philosophyman76 4 days ago
@philosophyman76 - I think Dr. Lennox's arguments are very valid. It touches on many common topics with very valid answers and questions. It's really a shame if you would get nothing from the interview. It would show that you're not really into understanding the truth, in my humble opinion of-course. Some questions I always ask Atheists are: What validates your personal experience? e.g. Peer review? or Peer experience? e.g. A dream.
JepMaster8 4 days ago
@JepMaster8 Fine I'll respond to each argument in a video. good will give me a reason to make a muli-parter. What validates my personal experience. nothing. thats why personal experience is not used as a high form of evidence. we have to use logic, induction and the most reliable sources so to come up with truth. Now answer my question How could any1 enjoy heaven if I their loved ones burn eternally in hell?
philosophyman76 4 days ago
@philosophyman76 - "What validates my personal experience. nothing." Exactly. So then, from an Atheist's point of view, since your personal experiences (such as dreams) cannot be validated through scientific evidence nor logic, but only by experience, it's not valid and therefore it's a fairytale, and you're a liar just like Theists are about God? It's not about winning an argument We're really trying to help everyone we can make it. It's really up to you.
JepMaster8 4 days ago
@JepMaster8 I'm trying to follow your "logic". so my dreams cant be validated yeah,,,and so therefore its a fairytale TOO others yeah correct U can't Know if I have dreams or thoughts or anything expect through your senses. so that means I'm a liar and god is true? nice leap. this is more lennox bs huh? Knowing and believing are 2 separate issues. if you want to go on knowledge alone we only KNOW we exist. thats it. and We meaning I only KNOW MY personal thoughts exist.
philosophyman76 4 days ago
@philosophyman76 i have a video explaining this bc I get the occasional theist who wants to go down this road. it on my channel called "Defining the relious debate" it 15 minute not 93 and i'll cut it down even more for you and say start the video at the 8 min mark bc thats the relevant to the convo section.
philosophyman76 4 days ago
@philosophyman76 - ? That was a question. Not a jump. It's based on the same logic that Atheists use. The "If you can't prove it scientifically, it's not true or it's a fairytale" argument. Well, no one can prove what you had a dream about so in essence, using the Atheist argument, dreams must not exist. You only don't know of God's existence because your lack of EXPERIENCE which is derived from lack of faith. If you had the experience, like you have had dreams, you would know.
JepMaster8 4 days ago
@JepMaster8 Well scientifically we can look at the brain activity of a dreaming brain and a conscious brain. they actually have people who study dreams and brains and functions all the time. Again not my field of expertise but I'm sure if we dug into the research we can find that we know a lot about brains dreaming, dream states, etc.
philosophyman76 4 days ago
@philosophyman76 - I definitely understand that there is scientific study on dreams, but my argument is, current science cannot prove to you "what" you had a dream about. Only you can reveal that. Because you had that experience and it cannot yet be proven by science, does it make your experience invalid? A planet was recently found by NASA. Prior to that finding, did the planet not exist?
JepMaster8 4 days ago
@JepMaster8 the planet did exist and once again belief vs knowledge. things can exist outside of our finding them or having evidence. this is why science calls it's highest grade of knowledge a theory. With a dream you are claiming something that everyone else in the world also claims they have. and with extrodinary claims you need extrodinary evidence . Me claiming to dream about my cat does not require same evidence as an all powerful creator existing
philosophyman76 4 days ago
@philosophyman76 - So now we are talking about two different levels of evidence? Why? That's not fair argument in my book. You see, the reason why you probably don't see the experience of dreaming as an "extraordinary claim" is because most people including yourself already had "the dream experience". If you're only going to count on science as your sole method of understanding or validating existence, then every claim should be regarded the same way.
JepMaster8 4 days ago
@JepMaster8 Why? your kidding right. so if someone says I have $1000 in my wallet is the say level of evidence as you taking their wallet and counting $1000? Of course there is different levels of evidence and colaborating independent evidence is event stronger then that? That doesnt seem like a hard or arguable point.
philosophyman76 4 days ago
@philosophyman76 - We're talking about experiences that cannot be proven by sight or by science. Money in your wallet can be seen and counted, dreams on the other hand cannot. That is in the same ballpark as Theism/Atheism argument. Many experienced the Holy Spirit, but these experiences cannot be scientifically proven, just like dreams so what validates your dream but not the experiences with God? You cannot be biased if you're truly seeking truth.
JepMaster8 4 days ago
@JepMaster8 because we know dreams arent real. they are cojurations from our brains. just like gods. I dreamt I won 1 milllion dollars. I didn't. Because YOU preceive something doesnt make it real. It only makes it real to you. If I dreamt that I won a million dollars and went to the store and tried to buy rolex with no money and tried to convince them I had the money because I dreamt it and who are they to tell me that I didnt dream it and its not real! I would be called delusional
philosophyman76 4 days ago
@philosophyman76 I'm not sure i'm understanding your point. Personal experiences are not evidence of truth. If so everything would be considered true. Purple dinosaurs with top hats, etc. Your saying because we cant see peoples dreams but we belief they have dreams somehow equates to people have experiences with god therefore god is real?
philosophyman76 4 days ago
@JepMaster8 my example was sayingt tha counting money is better evidence then you saying you have money. You saying you had a personal experience with a god isnt as strong as god showing up and shaking my hand. You said all evidence should be regarded equaly and I gave you an example to show you it is not. one is more beleivable
philosophyman76 4 days ago
@philosophyman76 - you left out the context of our argument though. Again we were on the topic of things that cannot be proven by claim. Each claim in that sense should be equally regarded. My argument is on the truth of experience. You said, personal experience is not truth. I understand what you're saying in one sense, but disagree on another. If you experience something, anything, you may not understand the experience, but the experience is indeed true. -
JepMaster8 4 days ago
@JepMaster8 your experience may be true to YOU. but not true. if you take a drug and hallucinate then you had a real experience of your teeth growing to touch the floor. Doesnt mean your teeth actually did that.
philosophyman76 4 days ago
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@philosophyman76 - "Doesnt mean your teeth actually did that." on that fact you are absolutely right. I'm afraid it's more complex than that. Perhaps we'll continue another time. For now, thanks for debating your points in a professional manner. Have a good one sir.
JepMaster8 4 days ago
@philosophyman76 - Right now you're experiencing cognitive activity based on what you're reading, be-it negative or positive etc. The experience you're having is real is it not? Our experience is in existence therefore it is real to you and I. If you disagree to the previous statements, please let me know.
JepMaster8 4 days ago
@JepMaster8 two ways I can go that answer. if you beleive there is a world that exists beyond our experience of it then I would say no. our experience doesnt exist. Our experience is just a rising property of our brain state. For example wetness doesnt exist. it's just a rising property of water. no water no wetness. thats the same way i see "experience or thoughts" they dont exist. they are just how our brain comprehends input
philosophyman76 4 days ago
@philosophyman76 - Interesting, but I disagree with your argument on "existence". You see, one definition of existence is: "Reality as presented in *experience". One definition of experience is: "the fact or state of having been affected by or gained knowledge through direct observation or participation*. Properties exist just as much as attributes. For instance, the sun is a source of heat, the property which exists due to the reality presented in our experience.
JepMaster8 4 days ago
@JepMaster8 yeah I dont have to be a "beleiver" in dreams to have a dream. it happens. I don't see any instances or evidence of a god happening. All i see is people claiming that there is a god, and aliens, and psychic powers, and voodoo. If someone claims they had a dream I belief them bc it doesnt matter. If they claim they had a dream about me giving them $20 I say yes you had a dream but Im not giving you $20 and if they claim if you don give me $20 you go to hell I would say prove that.
philosophyman76 4 days ago
@philosophyman76 - Better question. What literal evidence would you consider to prove the existence of God?
JepMaster8 4 days ago
@JepMaster8 i have a video explaining this bc I get the occasional theist who wants to go down this road. it on my channel called "Defining the relious debate" it 15 minute not 93 and i'll cut it down even more for you and say start the video at the 8 min mark bc thats the relevant to the convo section.
philosophyman76 4 days ago
@philosophyman76 - I'm watching it right now.
JepMaster8 4 days ago
@philosophyman76 - Well laid out argument. I enjoyed watching it, even though there are a few major points that I disagree on. There are also a few points that I feel that contradicts your own arguments. Especially the part where you spoke on human testimony. You see, you cannot just pick and choose your own (1) definition of something to supplement your argument. There are many definitions on each topic that goes hand in hand and can become quite granular.
JepMaster8 4 days ago
@JepMaster8 i haven't got around to doing all my epistomological videos. however one will be on reliablity of evidence. In the case for a god all the evidence combined in my opinion and many others does not fulfill the criteria for belief. Personal experience as evidence for anything is low on the pole bc no one else can experience it. If you tell me your dog can talk but only to you and when no else is around. will i believe you? no and without further evidence I'm gonna say ur delusional
philosophyman76 4 days ago
@philosophyman76 - I understand where you're coming from. But drawing from this, what if (please pardon me for the "what if") the dog spoke to you after I told you my dog can talk? Would we... both be delusional? Would our experiences be valid if the dog chose not to speak to anyone else? What validates experience?
JepMaster8 4 days ago
@JepMaster8 it would be true to me and you but no body else. bc we know the natur of dogs , studied their brains and anatomy and all the evidence says they cant talk. If we see it talk to us then to us then we have a higher beleif in talking dogs bc we would have more evidence of such a thing. the only thing that matters is can the dog talk or not. If it can then we would have a higher justification for believing then others but others would not be justified in sharing our belief.
philosophyman76 4 days ago
@philosophyman76 again this is all epistomology. . And with all the evidence against dog speech if me and you were the only ones hearing the dog speak then I would question both of our sanity and so would the rest of the world justifiably so. But if this dog was all powerful and wanted everyone to follow his rules Just announcing himself to me and you would not be a great way to convince people that he could talk and his rules were real. no matter how many books about it we wrote about it
philosophyman76 4 days ago
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@philosophyman76 - "How could I ever enjoy heaven if I knew my loved friends and family burned and were eternally tortured in hell" - In the presence of God in heaven there will be no sorrow.
JepMaster8 4 days ago
@JepMaster8 ok so I won't be me and god will erase my knowledge of self and I will forget my loved ones and family. but they are what made me me. So what you are saying is god will brain wash us into forgetting the people we cared about and loved our entire life. what else will he block. and how am i me if he erases all my memories. Well if I cant remember or see my loved one what kind of heaven is this?
philosophyman76 4 days ago
@philosophyman76 - Please, don't twist my words. All I said was there will be no sorrow in the presence of God in heaven. If you had the holy spirit within you through faith, if you were born again, your beloved friends would be getting an earful from you to re-consider their Atheism. There is greater understanding than Human Logic and a wealth of yet unknown scientific knowledge. Don't be deceived into thinking you're smarter than the creator of it all.
JepMaster8 4 days ago
@JepMaster8 really this is you idea of heaven having your memories erased. sorry not for me. i'd rather burn with my family then forget that they existed
philosophyman76 4 days ago
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JepMaster8 5 days ago
Whether you believe or not Jesus is coming back. Will you be ready?
patetarr 6 days ago
@patetarr I heard he came back like a thousands times in south america. There are Jesus's everywhere. And I've been ready every time. But I'll go to the gym and save some money so I'm SUPER ready when God's Mini me comes back
philosophyman76 6 days ago
@philosophyman76 I would love to have a chat with you about all this. Really! Without an audience for obvious reasons! Is that possible? How do i contact you?
nicetiga 6 days ago
@nicetiga i'm not understanding you. but you are more then welcome to send me a PM.
philosophyman76 6 days ago
Well spoken, and nice suit, too.
Xoletta 1 week ago
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"The natural man perceiveth not the things of the spirit, for they are foolishness to him, neither CAN he know them for they are spiritually discerned."
iiidol 1 week ago
Seriously... arguing with Christians is pointless. They simply cannot see the hypocrisy in "picking and choosing" the parts of the bible (the very holy book they base their entire reason for existence on) that are convenient for them to "believe in".
Watching Steve Harvey spew his nonsense made it painfully clear that he has not read the bible (something common among "christians")... or at least, he refuses to read the parts that make Christianity look very very immoral.
MatthewRider1 2 weeks ago
@Mr2weak Simple question: (As per you're "father's rules" analogy) Is murder a proper punishment for trivial disobedience? If you're idea of God's justice is to eradicate all petty acts by killing everyone within a five-mile radius, what makes your argument even pragmatically feasible? You're God, who could easy just make people stop "sinning", decides to kill them, instead. He even sends other people to do it for him. But even you know killing is bad, so who are you following?
TheOkami1113 3 weeks ago
you mean atheist idiots,simple minded people that think there is no God.suit does not change you are a dumbass
namtesyalp 3 weeks ago
@namtesyalp simple minded huh. simple minded enough to get off our knees and actually find out whats behind the curtain instead of just groveling to the great OZ. go listen to steve harvey and his 'morphues clod" and then go listen to neil tyson degrasse (director of the hayden plantarium in the museum of natural history) talk about the universe and you tell me who's a dumbass. But i know you wont do that because you have more praying to do and it's hard to get anywhere on your knees
philosophyman76 3 weeks ago 7
@philosophyman76 you are a simpleton,a stooge.Pretending there is no God to justify your homosexuality is just nonsense
namtesyalp 1 week ago
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@namtesyalp IS this guy a homosexual? If so then that explains ALL. LOL.
iiidol 1 week ago
@iiidol How would that explain it all. I would love to hear your logical jump from homosexual to atheist or vice versa? Oh right your a theist and beleive in magic. you dont use logic. Ok well that makes sense then
philosophyman76 1 week ago
@namtesyalp Ok so All atheists are now homosexual? First I'm not homosexual but if I was what would that have to do with me beleiving in god. I guess all those kid rapers in your church didn't really beleive in god? Oooor you don't think its ok for homosexuality if ppl are older but you feel ok with your habit of molesting children? I get it now. You know point the finger at others to hide your own problems. Thats cool I wont tell anyone. but you should get some help.
philosophyman76 1 week ago
@namtesyalp good christian thing to say but so typical
michaelflorida56 1 week ago
@michaelflorida56 christians all admit they sin,you clown
namtesyalp 1 week ago
@namtesyalp you believe in an invisible man in the sky and I'm the clown?
michaelflorida56 1 week ago
@michaelflorida56 dont believe in an invisable man in the sky stupid
namtesyalp 1 week ago
@namtesyalp no your invisible man is EVERYWHERE. He is the sky. He's daddy touching u all over. Punishing you when your bad and giving praise when your good. "Thank you daddy. Was I a good boy?" WHY YES YOU WERE. GET DOWN ON YOUR KNEES AND TAKE MY BODY INTO YOUR MOUTH" lol and you have the nerve to call others gay.
philosophyman76 1 week ago
@philosophyman76 you are sick,a weirdo,a pedophile
namtesyalp 1 week ago
@namtesyalp yes very witty retort. Am i a poopyhead, and dummy and well? Are you going to stick your tongue out at me and put your thumbs in your ears? Let me lower my arguments to your level. Your a stupid head, and jerky jerk. dumbface.
philosophyman76 1 week ago
@philosophyman76 so instead of God I should believ in darwin that said you may be the missing link,that you have low intelligence,naturally engage in sloth and lazyness,that you actually are going in reverse evolution?your comments and attempts to prove darwin right may succed if you keep going
namtesyalp 1 week ago
@namtesyalp pk well you can believe in darwin because for 1 darwin ACTUALLY existed. kind helps. secondly the rest of your comment is just stupid and makes no sense. It's amazing to me how creationists and theists really don't even take the time to figure out what the opposing argument even is. When I argue an idiot um I mean theist I at least hear what they are saying and then show them why its stupid. You guys just make sh*t up and attack that.
philosophyman76 1 week ago
@philosophyman76 guess your dull mind doesnt realize these are stereotypes of black people in darwins time.he said blacks probably were the missing link,"science of his time also said blacks may be going in reverse of evolution,not made up, facts.I know you will block me soon as do other atheist because you cant fence with me
namtesyalp 1 week ago
@namtesyalp I'm sure your insane intellect has baffled soooo many people. an even if that statement was true (which I don't remember reading that statement in the origin of species so I'd love for you to site your source) so what. Isaac newton thought he could change lead into gold. Bc he was wrong about that does that mean gravity isnt true? We dont think evolution is true bc "Darwin" said it. We KNOW evolution is true because thats what all the evidence confirms is true.
philosophyman76 1 week ago
@philosophyman76 not in origin of a species,in his writings.books like "the inferiority of the negro" were common as political correctness today.if a white wrote that it was possible that a black was intelligent without mixed blood he would be blackballed.I have a sense you can be likeable and have intelligance.Maybe a personal experience made you think this way.if you look at history,I am right in many ways,I believ my brother is an atheist but wont admit it,ILL CUT THE INSULTS, LETS CONVERSE
namtesyalp 1 week ago
@namtesyalp What you don't seem to understand is I don't care what darwins personal beliefs or actions were. all i care is what is true. this isnt a court of law where you try and discredit the witness and that makes the testimony questionable. Isaac newton could have been a cannibal and it wouldnt discredit gravity. Darwin could have shot Martin luther king, it wouldnt do anything to the validity of evolution. I'm not atheist bc of an experience. Im an atheist for the lack of evidence of a god
philosophyman76 1 week ago
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Mr2weak 4 weeks ago
It's 100000000% moral to offer people the option to avoid hell, then provide the way out of hell FREE of charge by sacrificing your own Son. It's the first mistake of the person who isn't really familiar with the Bible. Every story is a picture of God trying to draw ALL people into his bosom. But THEY....aren't having it. You talk about Christianity as if from experience. You haven't tried Jesus and found him wanting. HE might not be convenient but HE it ain't lacking. Faith seeks understanding.
soulseul 1 month ago
@soulseul 1000000% huh. So if I make a torture chamber and have a child and tell him that b4 he came along I had another child who had magic powers and healed people and could walk across the pool but I had him brutally killed to pave the way for you. And you have to believe this story to make me happy. I dont care if you murder, rape, and steal as long as you apologize all will be forgiven except you must believe this story or I will torture you everyday. NICE MORALITY, NICE LOVE
philosophyman76 1 month ago
you vaguely references some things in the Old Testament. I'd like to know if your moral barometer means you can quote what Jesus said is "the law" ? You can't criticize him because you fakin religion
soulseul 1 month ago
@soulseul No it doesnt. my moral barometer has nothing to do with the bible, jesus, or skydaddy. you point to one place where jesbus says some good things and I can point to another place where things jesbus and his daddy say some really immoral things. Let me ask you this mr. moral. How moral is it to torture someone for eternity? No matter what your child did would you ever torture him/or her everyday? Oh yeah and hell isnt in the bible until "gentile jesus meek and mild" is introduced. thanks
philosophyman76 1 month ago
Philosophyman76. LOL whatever dude somethings just require that you go through it in order to learn . But a eternity in hell to learn is plenty of time . And though you are as clueless As can be I will still pray that you don't end up there . May God show you the true path before its all over
MrDovahkinn 1 month ago
@MrDovahkinn well first how are you learning in hell? I mean eternal punishiment is eternal right. I mean that seems a little excessive for a loving god don't you think? After like 1000 years of torture every single moment that maybe a caring and forgiving god would say ok thats enough. Not ur deity. He is going to burn u for 10000000000000000000 years and then smile laugh and do it again. Why? well bc you dont belief this story about a guy 2000 years ago. this is what u believe huh? interesting
philosophyman76 1 month ago
@MrDovahkinn stop being a child. hell is childrens story. do u still believe that santa wont bring you gifts if your naughty? This deity torturing people for eternity is where I'm supposed to get my "moral compass" from. It's childrens story and hopefully eventualy you will see the "light" and give it up.
philosophyman76 1 month ago
Your a clown in a suit . You are a FOOL to believe there is no God . An uneducated FOOL
MrDovahkinn 1 month ago
While you sit there with that ugly smirk on your face denying God those devils around you are laughing at how much of a fool you are to believe he does not exist . You are the parasite , you and all those like you are the scourge of the earth not us . The way you feel toward us I assure you we feel even stronger about you . Atheism is nothing but the SCUM FROM HELL
MrDovahkinn 1 month ago
All of your knowledge all of your degrees all of your accomplishments and money will mean nothing in hell . Watch yourself boy your mouth will get you in a world of trouble . God will humble the arrogant and proud . Repent and turn to God whom you have blasphemed before you send your soul down to the corners of the pit
MrDovahkinn 1 month ago
@MrDovahkinn lmao. Which god are you talking about? Zeus, krishna, allah? Your funny. you seem really angry. where is your love. God say love all those even those you dont agree with you. Psalms Luke Perry 14:10. look it up. I know you want your imaginary friend to beat me up for making fun of your silly beliefs but sorry heshe it will not. Bad stuff will happen to me and you bc thats called life and we both end up decomposing and our conscious will end. No magic happy or sad place exists. sorry
philosophyman76 1 month ago
wtf are you talking about...dude i feel like you just mad cuz this dude is actually prospering from the blessings that God has given him
nickclass13 1 month ago
@nickclass13 i think i was pretty clear in my video. you only here mad bc you think you imaginary friend is helping steve. so what about george clooney atheist and prospering. What about bill gates? athiest what about the propering in japan, hoolland finland etc who are atheist. wha tabout the prosperous who follow the "false gods" in india? I'm not upset bc he is prosperous. I am upset bc he's an ahole, uneducated, bigot, spreading hatred.
philosophyman76 1 month ago
@philosophyman76 Yes good point, to counter his arguement you simply name every successful person of every denomination and cultual background. Horrible retort.
Steve Harvey much like most Christians are wrong when they say things like this, dont get to happy atheist because there are a multitude of people on your side as well who do nothing but say anti religious bs all day.
Mr2weak 1 month ago
@philosophyman76 PART2: I have done my research on atheistic thinking and although I do not agree with them I CAN SEE THERE POINT. And many real atheist will say the same thing about religion, Most will tell you it is a Noumea, which is something we CANT know. Everything both sides say is strictly based on personal opinion and belief because WE CANNOT KNOW THE ANSWER. or even if there is an answer to be known. All we can do is take it on good faith that what we believe is true.
Mr2weak 1 month ago
@Mr2weak see the problem is not in "knowing" in the pure sense of the word and to take solice in the fact that we can't KNOW either way therefore both conclusions are equally correct. I can't KNOW anything other then I exist. The point of the debate is to show which belief is more credible. The way we make that determination is with evaluating the evidence of the claim. Check out my "defining the terms..." vid. good to see you back. I'm finally in gold league on all my SC2 accounts
philosophyman76 1 month ago
@philosophyman76 PART1: I disagree with your "Terms" an Athiest is making a stand in saying I do not believe in god, while an agnostic is like asking someone if libia has a president, they say they dont know, there could be and there could not be but I dont know, while the athiest strickly says there is No God. I am not going to watch the full video because its basic stuff that any person having this convo should already know. If they dont then just ignore them for being ignorant.
Mr2weak 1 month ago
@Mr2weak P1 then i suggest u watch the full video bc i address this in the vid. one is about beleif and the other is about knowledge. I believe there is no god just as much as theist belief there is one. neither of us have knowledge of the fact. thats why agnostic to me is meaningless term
philosophyman76 1 month ago
@philosophyman76 PART2: The main issue on evaluating the evidence is that its truth lies within the eye of the beholder. It is intangible, sufficient evidence for person A may not be for person B.
I like agnostics more than athiest because they are taking a more leniant all be it cowardly stance on the issue. They admit that they dont know for sure and basically just plead the 5th. But for someone to say that god doesnt exist is simply too big of a leap for someone to take...
Mr2weak 1 month ago
@philosophyman76 PART3: Why is why alot of atheist like Hitchens and James have alot of trouble debating the matter.
Remember that science is mere observations, it cannot contradict god in anyway because they are on opposite spectrum. I am going to skip a bit because were both smart and say this, and let me know if you disagree.
There is nothing science or an anyone can do to disprove gods existence, it is impossible. A Noumena, We both know that. So....
Mr2weak 1 month ago
@philosophyman76 PART4: All that lies is to show some falicies in the concept of god. You poke and prod at the bible, christian beliefs and mistakes made by people who CLAIMED to be Christians although they didnt practice it (crusades).
You bring up observations like gravity, theory, btw i like how you brought up Descartes who had very athiestic views with his so called meditations. And I think therefore I am, haha. The man is a failed philosopher who has been given too much credit.
Mr2weak 1 month ago
@Mr2weak P3-4 no you can't disprove anything accept all the claims that are made. The HONEST stance is exactly what descarte did and said what if I am being tricked and cant trust my senses bc sometimes my senses are wrong. so what do I KNOW and the only thing we KNOW for sure is that I exist. it's most profound philosophical statement ever so to say he is a failed philosopher is just asinine.
philosophyman76 1 month ago
@philosophyman76 PART5: So to rap this up you are fighting not against god or his ideals but the concept, the idea of him. A belief, and you fight this with observations. Giving insight on things you perceive to disprove his existence BUT this comes back around because that may not be perceived that may to someone else, especially unlikely if they are christian.
So what we have here is a stalemate. 2 sides fighting for something they cannot prove. So that leaves 1 test. Balance..
Mr2weak 1 month ago
@Mr2weak PART6: Which side leaves the world in a better place, you ofcourse would say the world is better off without religion and would bring up terrorist and war and how living in a lie is bad. I on the other hand would say religion teaches peace and anyone who does not practice that isnt truly religious. I would say some if not MOST of the world greatest minds were religious. And that religion strenghtens morality and the sense of community. (read "bowling alone" it goes in on this)
Mr2weak 1 month ago
@Mr2weak p5 no it doesnt. the problem is you are doing something called special pleading. you have criterias of evidence you require to beleive everything else excpet you god . Bc you want to beleif your god. you tell me what your standard of evidence are and I'll give you examples of either how your god doesnt meet them or how your standards are so low that you have beleive all kinds of nonsense that fullfill the same standard. that is why i dont BELIEVE in a god
philosophyman76 1 month ago
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Mr2weak 1 month ago
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@philosophyman76 Part1: your part 1 basically just confirms what I already said, and in my Part8 I said that I did go ahead and finished your video. and yes agnostic is pretty much meaningless.
Really? The phrase "I think therefore i am" is philosophically flawed in many ways. I expect you to already know that. The hint to its flaws lies within the " I "
Descartes had very atheistic ideas, one being that we are god since without he cannot exist or something like that.
Mr2weak 1 month ago
@philosophyman76 You forget the rest of Descartes's thoughts on the sense, he says although his sense my be tricked it serves no purpose in disregarding them. (referring to sight and how something look bigger or smaller through different perspectives)
Again, you cannot know that the " I " exist especially when you base that knowledge on the idea that you are thinking.
Mr2weak 1 month ago
@Mr2weak You disprove (since you love disproving) to me that I exist. Descarte tried to get out of his only concrete stance for knowledge of I exist and failed. and that leave i exist as the only true knowledge one can have. EVERYTHING else is from inference, induction and perception. I know i exist bc in order to have that thought I have to exist to think it. I meaning my thought process not my physical body.
philosophyman76 4 weeks ago
@philosophyman76 PART4: I believe immanuel kant said it best when he said " Experiences must verify what we say about the world, What experience can verify I think therefore I am”"
All "I think therefore I am" says is that All this says is that " I the (psychological ego) thinks" therefore "I the (transcendental ego) am." the Noumenal self remains as unknown as ever.
Mr2weak 1 month ago
@philosophyman76 PART5: Now when it comes to my standards of evidence it is obvious that when made you can easily replace god with idk the Pastafarian god or godly alien and it would meet those same criteria. So then it becomes less about the evidence and more about what we think/feel the evidence represents. which just goes back around to what i said earlier about it being in the eye of the beholder. Evidence A doesnt look like evidence to Person B.
Mr2weak 4 weeks ago
@Mr2weak well no. i can substitute in random stuff based on your standard of evidence and therefore you have 2 choices accept everything that fits the criteria and be ...well foolish. Or say your standard of evidence is not high enough. Option 3 where you just arbitrarily pick what you want is not a path to knowledge or truth. Its a way to delusion. the way you find truth is u start with doubting everything not picking wht you want to be true and finding evidence that supports your case
philosophyman76 4 weeks ago
@philosophyman76 PART6: So rather than dispute the evidence you try to dispute our perception of said evidence which is pretty silly if you ask me lol. It would be like trying to convince a football fan that football is meaningless.
You trying to convince me that god isnt real would be a easy as me convincing you that he is real. Were fighting over how we perceive the world and are frustrated that the other person doesn't see it the same way. Truly a pointless endeavor..... I plead the 5Th. :)
Mr2weak 4 weeks ago
@Mr2weak so when people shoot, kill and bomb, and try to control other people in the name of the "perception" of god they think exists according to you it's pointless to debate. Obviously everyones percetion is true. wrong. again we come back to standards. we as a society have to interact with each other and just saying everyone is right about everything aint a good way to interact. science and logic is the best we have. Old books, feelings and perceptions don't really cut the mustard
philosophyman76 4 weeks ago
@philosophyman76 PART 3: Now my reasons for believing may and do only apply to me whether they may seem like outrages coincidence or chance.
What your saying is "THERES NO EVIDENCE SO YOU SHOULDNT BELIEVE IN HIM" and what i am saying is "EVEN IF THERE ISNT ANY EVIDENCE THAT DOESNT DISPROVE HIM"
How can you possibly argue? What point can you make. Even if you shoot down all my evidences it wont change anything. How can you disprove a feeling I have, or how I look at things? You cant win.
Mr2weak 4 weeks ago
@Mr2weak P3 look i'm not interested in what people believe. I'm interested in the actual truth. if you want to belief your a millionaire thats fine. But if you have no money you can't buy anything what good does beleiving your a millionare do you. Now if you started hiring people to work for you and told people what to do based on you being a millionaire then we have a name for those people. It's called delusional. Believing and acting on something you have no evidence for.
philosophyman76 4 weeks ago
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@philosophyman76 PART 2: Thats what I mean, you can substitute it for anything BUT that thing must exist on the same plain as GOD. hence me saying pastafarian or a 'godly' alien. God cannot be substituted by a unicorn unless you give that unicorn the same qualities as good.
I did doubt everything, I used to be an atheist. Now if you want me to say there isnt sufficient evidence for gods existence ill say that, because its true. But that doesn't mean he doesn't exist.....
Mr2weak 4 weeks ago
@philosophyman76 PART4: At the same time I cant win either, But I know better than to think I can win.
I love how you bring up terrorist, i knew youd do that, they arent christians. If the bible says dont kill, and someone else says kill, how can you say that the killer is a christian? wheres YOUR evidence. What because he sat in the back of church?
Hmm, so with your logic happiness, compassion and hope dont exist? Feelings and perceptions dont cut the mustard.
Mr2weak 4 weeks ago
@Mr2weak p4 you think that there are no christian terrorists? Lets go back oh say 60 years when they were burning crosses and terrorizing blacks all across this nation. But of course those aren't "true" christians right?
Logic, happiness, compassion, dont exist based on the definition of existence. these are rising properties of our brains. Does "wetness" exist? No it's just a property of water. again now your getting into a language and definition issue of the word existence
philosophyman76 4 weeks ago
@philosophyman76 PART5: It all comes down to making sense, I think it makes sense. That sense comes from what I feel and perceive. You dont agree? you dont have to agree. But others do. Now what gives you the right to say your reality is any more real than ours? Is it because we dont meet your standards of reality?
Are vegans wrong as well? There reality of eating meat being wrong doesn't match ours, there fore they are psychopathic and mentality deranged? No!, there just see things differently
Mr2weak 4 weeks ago
@Mr2weak right and wrong don't exist. Its a concept created by man. if a vegan wants to say eating meat is "wrong" fine. If they try to impose that on others then we will decide if society deems it as "wrong". But if the person has a personal belief then they are entitled to think and act however they want as long as it doesnt impact someone else. This method ur talking about would be great if we didnt have to interact with each other. but we do. so we have to agree on standards of truth
philosophyman76 4 weeks ago
@philosophyman76 PART6: When you take an agnostic stance its ok, you admit that there may be a possibly .000000009% chance he is wrong. To say he doesn't exist is insane, but to say you dont believe is weird? You dont confront the question, instead you dance around it. Its ingenious.
How you can justify saying that an educated man who is no better or worse than you yourself is any less because the way he see's reality differs from yours.
And you say Christianity is controlling and manipulative
Mr2weak 4 weeks ago
@Mr2weak again definitions.agnostic is a meaingless term becasue we are all agnostic about everything. except that we exist. But we cant live our lives that way. so we have to accept some things and standards of belief that we agree on. like induction. Do we KNOW the sun will rise nope. We believe it will and we base that on the fact that always has. There is the world and then there is our perception of the world. we have a shared reality and hv to agree on some level of evidence to coexist.
philosophyman76 4 weeks ago
@philosophyman76 PART1: You keep repeating yourself and what I said. So ill say it again to clear the air.
Crusaders and terrorist are christians... Just like a guy who eats mean isnt a vegetarian. That makes more than perfect sense, how can you detest that?
Yes Agnostic is a frifilous term, meaningless as well, we both already agreed to that... so why bring it up.
Mr2weak 3 weeks ago
@Mr2weak "Crusaders and terrorist are christians... Just like a guy who eats mean isnt a vegetarian. That makes more than perfect sense, how can you detest that?" i'm guessing you meant "aren't" so i'll answer it that way. false analogy the meaning of the word vegetarian is "too not eat meat." the crusaders could point to your holy book and say we are following the words of god. and you would point to the same book and say no your not. it's debateable vegetarian is not.
philosophyman76 3 weeks ago
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Mr2weak 3 weeks ago
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@philosophyman76 PART2: "We share a world... we agree on some level of existence..." agreed.
I am going to give in... you got me sir, well played. So now what do I do. I have this overwhelming feeling that god exist and that what I perceive is reality. Do you have pills prescribed for me?Should I just wake up from this matrix like delusion?
By saying I have no reason/evidence to believe in god what are you really saying? What are you really proving?
Mr2weak 3 weeks ago
@philosophyman76 PART3: You would ask that throw away my principles, my faith, my belief which are just as strong as your beliefs if not stronger, my lifestyle. All on the basis of you saying "You have no reason not to/ no evidence not to".
How can you possibly think I would buy that. How could you think it would be that easy?
You think that if you can tarnish my reasons for believing you will shake my faith? But the only problem is that it isnt that easy.
Mr2weak 3 weeks ago
@Mr2weak " You would ask that throw away my principles,...." in short yes. I didnt say it was easy or would be easy. it has taken me a long time to overcome my fear of hell. Isnt it funny that religion plays upon the only 2 motivating emotions humans have , fear and desire. and then makes Faith a grand thing? If you listen great rewards if you don't eternal punishment and the greatest thing you can have is faith. (bc i have no evidence) sounds like a great con job to me
philosophyman76 3 weeks ago
@philosophyman76 PART4: My dad had a dream something happened to my sisters plane and woke up screaming about it. 2 days later when she landed we found out her plane was hit by lighting 3 times.
I personally have been in 5 extremely near death experiences and on top of that I had sleep apnea as a kid. When I look at these things among a lot of other I see a divine plan of some sort, I may not be able to prove that divinity, but I do feel it. And to not act upon ones sense is truly unreasonable.
Mr2weak 3 weeks ago
@Mr2weak and what about the other thousands of dreams your dad has had? . Humans look for meaning. thats what we do. we try and figure things out. you had some near death exps. great so have i. everyone does. you drive a car and have them once or twice a year. so if we just miss the car thank god, if we hit but no one is hurt thank god, if we're hurt but not bad thank god, if hurt bad but dont die thank god if we die thats just gods plan thank god. Do u see the problem?
philosophyman76 3 weeks ago
@philosophyman76 PART1: The bible says strictly "Thou Shalt Not Kill", to counter you I will simply the millions that atheist has killed. Being a christian is vague since it only means believing in Jesus/god and not living by the terms they set. With that being said many Christians can be bad people. So can atheist, Christianity does not provide a stabler environment for terrorism though.
Mr2weak 3 weeks ago
@Mr2weak part 1: i hate quoting the bible but just to make my point here are some verses that directly tell people to kill. (Deuteronomy 17:12, Exodus 22:17, Leviticus 20:13, Exodus 21:15, 2 Chronicles 15:12-13,Numbers 1:48-51, etc... I can give you at least 10 more if you'd like where the bible says strictly to kill these people who do ____. And YOU might say well dont look over there, look over here but it's all in the same book. Athiests don't claim to follow any book or texts
philosophyman76 3 weeks ago
@philosophyman76 PART2: Sorry when I say things like that I keep on trying to stress to you the limits of science, which is things like emotions, feelings, ideas, etc. But you must be one of the few scientist that dont believe science has its limits.
As for eternal punishment in your regards the same can be said for out society. A murderer goes to jail for life just as a sinner goes to hell for eternity.
Mr2weak 3 weeks ago
@Mr2weak life is 100 years tops if they are put in jail at birth. And even we lowly humans don't torture criminals daily during that imprisonment. Your god's punishment lasts for 1000000000000000000000 years time 10 and every moment is filled with torture. no rest, no sleep, no food. just eternal punishment. THIS is a god of love and forgiveness??? this is where I'm supposed to get my moral barometer from? Do as i say or eternal puishment. And not for killing. For not believing. ?
philosophyman76 3 weeks ago
@Mr2weak emotions feelings ideas. Why can't science explain these things? They are properties of a brain. they aren't special. We have drugs that can create emotions and we know what kind of emotions and feeling in a person. We what is it that we won't be able to explain one day about the human condition that you think is so mystical?
philosophyman76 3 weeks ago
@philosophyman76 PART1: No i dont say dont look here look there, I didnt even look it up. Like I said before the bible was written by men and in there times that was perfectly acceptable. I dont see your point for saying those verses?
So your arguement is that someone who murders someone should be punished. Just not punished equally to the life they took. Interesting. And your view on Hell is flawed, no food no sleep? what do you know about hell??
Mr2weak 3 weeks ago
@Mr2weak Revelations 20:10... thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever. My point of the verses is u said "The bible says strictly "Thou Shalt Not Kill"" So i was countering that point with 15 places where it strictly says "THOU SHALL KILL" so u are picking the parts you like and ignoring the parts you don't. I'm not just pulling stuff out of my arse. I'm commenting on what u say
philosophyman76 3 weeks ago
@Mr2weak it's not hard to find this stuff. just read your damn bible. like how I brought that full circle right. So equal punishment for killing someone who might have lived 100 years tops, is 100billion years of torture? you call that equal? MAybe god after 1000 years or so of constant agony and torture would say hey EVERYONE is going to die eventually anyway. 1000 years of torture is enough for you to learn your lesson. NOPE ETERNITY. If thats ur moral barometer I don't want it
philosophyman76 3 weeks ago
@Mr2weak oh by the way that eternity of torture is not just for killers and rapist. Its for everyone who doesnt repent. All muslims, jews, chinese, atheists, buddahist, Jane's (who aren't allowed to kill even bacteria) and everyone who does except that jesus died for them. I am love. I am forgiveness. You don't beleive that well eternity of torture for you. again this doesnt seem wrong or weird to you huh?
philosophyman76 3 weeks ago
@philosophyman76 PART1: See your choosing parts of my arguement that you want to comment on and completely ignoring the rest.
Yes well if you had watched the god delusion you would have heard lennox's arguement that religion actually promoted science, so your "well i cant figure it out so i..." statement is completely wrong.
Your giving mankind alot of credit for living that long...
Mr2weak 3 weeks ago
@Mr2weak yeah science had to come out of religion bc religion came first. And the only way to learn and read was through the church. And for quite some time they kinda KILLED you if you didnt beleive in what they said. So if you held an ax to my head sure I'll beleive in your god all day long. just dont kill me. Oh and because "lennox" says something doesnt make it correct. He spouted so much nonsense... wait for my videos their coming soon.
philosophyman76 3 weeks ago
@philosophyman76 PART2: Once again your picking what you want to hear, I obviously said and already stated that the 10 commandments are from god, everything else is more or less from man and pertained to there time. And I have said time and time again that the bible isn't the main staple of Christianity, it is for reflection on faith and not for strict modern day application. AND the new testament supersedes the old as the old testament was barbaric, including human sacrifices etc...
Mr2weak 3 weeks ago
@Mr2weak ok sa why do the 10 commandments (which are like 4 commandments about just love only one skydaddy. the REAL thing but everything else isnt? How did you dechipher that? and if the NT supercedes the old I guess it doesnt matter that Adam ate the apple and original sin is not relevant and henceforth no need for jesus. Oh and remind me again where the 10 commandments are again? The OT or the NT? i forget which half of the book has what and what is important and what is made up.
philosophyman76 3 weeks ago
@philosophyman76 PART3: You didn't bring it full circle, you just wasted my time. You arguments on hell are mute/moot since no one knows what hell is like. Also I am pretty sure revaluation was written by man, peter also wrote his version because it says that god will let people out of hell if the people in heaven want him to, obviously this version wasn't except. Once again written by man = less credible.
Mr2weak 3 weeks ago
@Mr2weak Dude i'm sorry but THE ENTIRE THING WAS WRITTEN BY MAN. it's all made up. You are picking a choosing what you want to beleive just like your claiming others do and that the bible does itslef. Why don't you see that? Yeah your right people don't know what hell is like bc its make beleve, so is heaven god and the rest of the magic. again How are u deciding what is true? And how do yo know ur right when others are just picking what they want to see using the same system you are
philosophyman76 3 weeks ago
@philosophyman76 Your asking questions that.... What ever ill answer them.
Yes we are all quite aware of Christianities muddy past, and apparently you love it because you always stay there using it to try to prove one thing or another. NT supersedes OT because it was inferred by jesus. The OT was based on appeasing god through sacrifices and rituals to attest for sin. jesus came in the NT and died for our sinces making the OT practices unneeded.
Mr2weak 3 weeks ago
@philosophyman76 PART2: oh my god your... dude what are you talking about.
God told moses the 10 commandments. and to my knowledge it is one of the few parts of the bible that comes directly from god, OFCOURSE i am speaking from a christian point of view so you pointing out it was all made it is irrelevant. Make an argument please or admit you cant make one but dont waste my time.
Mr2weak 3 weeks ago
@Mr2weak My argument AGAIN is no your not making it from a CHRISTIAN point of view. your making it from YOUR point of view. Because I can find hundreds of christians who would say YOU arent a TRUE christian just by this comment. And they would point to other parts of the bible to make their point just as you are trying to make yours. SO MY POINT IS... why is anything your saying any more true then what OTHER CHRISTIANS say is true. I think your all nuts but thats coming from an outsider
philosophyman76 3 weeks ago
@philosophyman76 Part4: Yes, and these people if you didnt read the bible will be given a chance at the end to repent when they are confronted by god... everyone will... Come on mr.IReadthebible. You already know this so stop cherry picking.
Mr2weak 3 weeks ago
@Mr2weak oh right repent. So how do the people who live their entire life and never hear or see a bible repent? How do children repent? How do people who say lusting after an evil woman and then instantly get killed in a car accident repent? Oh right god has loop holes for those ppl somehow. why does god need to Kill and massacre his son to forgive his creations? Why not just forgive them? Seems like something that IS love and forgiveness should be able to do without a blood sacrafice
philosophyman76 3 weeks ago
@philosophyman76 PART2: Because sin just like crime isnt something you can just be let off the hook for, if I killed you kid even if you didnt care and said it was ok I would still have to answer to the law. By jesus dying the worst possible death in the worst possible way he boar the punishment for us.
Dude seriously, WHY ARE YOU ASKING ME THIS STUFF. You questioning me on the bible?? really?? What is the point of this? Stop wasting my time. Dont talk just to talk, make a point or gtfo........
Mr2weak 3 weeks ago