070306-1 Church going atheist!?

[romperstompist]

Haha I go to church every now and then. Just to laugh.

[NixonisLord]

UUs-NPR at prayer. Unitarian-Universalism: Making New Hampshire look integrated for over 50 years. Unitarianism-for when the Episcopalians are just not flaky enough.

[ElCubanoConguero]

Every member of the UUC cult is a LEFT-WING tree-hugging abortion-demanding porno-free-speech-promoting-AC­­LU-clinging perv. They are all whiter than a snowflake and middle to upper class.

[NixonisLord]

If offered the choice of root canal or ritual, I would choose root canal every time.

Religion is so boring. Mainline church services are about as vibrantly colorful as cream cheese. For a group that claims to "Celebrate diversity!", you've managed to stay over 95% White and middle/upper middle class and overwhelmingly from one side of the political spectrum. Quite the feat!

[bigshawn419]

@gbvegeta Unitarian Universalism is about the 'free and responsible search for truth and meaning' so for some God is in the church for others they may not feel that way so to say it is a church without God isn't true in fact it is in my opinion that it is the Quest for truth that unites us all.

[YOUnitygosp3l]

my concern is 'dualism'. how do we mitigate 'dogmatism' on the part of those whose 'practice' either embraces tradition or as in UU, should not? anotherwords, would "god as defined by tradition" encounter its "fundy" twin in this UU paradigm?

[wolfgar50]

oppose the decievers .there is but one god and the way to him is through his son jesus.yeshua.you dont sound fulfilled to me .you are sadly lacking something and your not convincing.when in doubt call on him he will show you way and the light .dont deny yourself true happiness

[joyville2]

Dogma is liked by some, disliked by others. There's nothing wrong with having different beliefs. Why let someone else's beliefs take away from your own? Our minds and hearts are different, obviously, just go with your own heart and respect that others do this too. We all don't have to sign up for the same club to be valued by others, do we?

[furybones]

The church is a word that Should only be used for the followers of Jesus Christ AKA God. Romans 12:5 So we, being many, are one body in Christ, and every one members one of another.

[yamahaeleven]

It is a word in our language, and I'll use it as I see fit, and will not take instruction from a dogmatist. So there.

[daarong3]

I'm an atheist, and I also attend a UU church... of course calling these places "churches" is a rather liberal use of the term.

UU's are humanists... they believe in helping others out, learning about others, experiencing life, improving the state of humanity, and having a caring community.

Those (like the poster "gbvegeta" before me) that criticize this sort of environment probably have not come to the point in their life when they start asking the question: "what is truly important?"

[gbvegeta]

wow. Church can be boring but a Church with no God would be pointless. Singing in a room for nothing. You people are sad.

[joyville2]

we can sing to each other, sing to our earth, to our universe, we can sing to every sentient being , we can sing to every molecule? What's the problem????? Those things hold an awesome value!

[bilgreen713]

Thanks for posting this! You pretty much much spoke for me.

-a fellow church going atheist

[bilgreen713]

minus 1 much

[boomac62]

the fact that religion in any form exsists is proof to me that God does as well. What is it that is in us that makes us spiritual? Unlike our animal friends food,p[rotectiona dn sex are not enough...like it or not we are made in the image of God.....

[hippiejessie]

This is what I've been looking for. I am an atheist, but I miss the community if going to church. Unfortunately I live on the East Coast, AKA Bible Belt, so IDK.

[n0m1c]

Really interesting video. The minster of First UU in Austin, TX actually gave his sermon on the "very good critiques" of Dawkins, Dennett, Hitchens, and others last Sunday. As an atheist, it's certainly interesting to hear a religious leader who is as honest about the failings of religion and fundamentalism, and willing to agree with (parts of) direct attacks that even extend to the UU type of liberal religion.

[HumanistFireman]

I can understand that you believe spirits exist, opinionator. But of course there are others who do not hold such a belief. And for those who do not, "spirit" means something other than what you mean. And that is fine. I would guess that there are many things that people believe in that you do not. That's the nature of the beast (no pun intended).

[MikaylaStarstuff]

In a congregation that mostly identifies as agnostic or other sort of spiritual label, I wear my name badge on an American Atheist lanyard. My personal form of self expression :) (I love the badges--you don't have to remember everyone's name all the time, and I think that helps knock down some social barriers).

It's a great community. I love my church :)

[Humanist12345]

MikaylaStarstuff, My UU Congregation is primarly Humanist, but I also belong to the UU Humanists and a local humanist group that conducts meetings at the church. Evidently Humanists are being marginalized in many UU congregations.

[RobinEdgar]

Really? I would expect that there is more actual evidence that Theists of various kinds are being marginalized in many U*U "Unwelcoming Congregations". . .

[MikaylaStarstuff]

Nice. I stumbled on the UU's nearly by accident a couple years ago, joined last year. My congregation isn't quite as secular as yours. I'm an atheist, but I can deal with the occasional god-talk at church. People ususally are at least pretty clear about what they mean by the three-letter word and usually at that point the only disagreement I have with them at that point is their choice of terminology. But I've gotten to the point where that doesn't even bother me any more.

[opinionatorX]

We can't have spiritaulality without the spirit. The spirit is what drives the body. And once the bodies dies our spirit leaves our body. So the G word is very much needed. God does exist! He puts the spirit in us...

[HumanistFireman]

Good video!  Quite informative. My family goes to a UU Church and we are atheists, too.

Spirit is elation; emotion; feelings. As there is no empirical nor reasonable proof or evidence for a "spirit" of the kind that is, or will be, separate from the human body, many of us do not believe in such a thing. The same thing goes for the "god" concept.

But "spirit" in the sense that I mentioned above can be experienced by everyone.

[opinionatorX]

Spirits do exist....Check out interview with a poltergeist....This is not about spiritualality but about sprirts that exist.

[yamahaeleven]

Nope, I'm talking about a feeling. I do not claim that "spirits" exist at all.

[Eworannod]

"I haven't heard of any "faith" community where the ministers quote Sam Harris."

LOL

Welcome to UU, Yamahaeleven!

I love the great variety of beliefs within the UU faith. I like being able to discuss religious and spiritual ideas at the forums without anyone having a "my way is THE way" mentality. My church tends to be mainly humanist, with quite a few agnostics and atheists in the mix, so we don't use the God-talk old-school Unitarians use unless it's one of the hymns we're singing.

[yamahaeleven]

Most of the atheists/humanists are strong in our community, and can bear a few mentions of the G-word, without too much undue stress and bother.

A fun, nutty bunch of caring folks. Now if I can only get them to keep their pitch forks down when I rant about global warming....

[Eworannod]

So can ours, but, since we're lay led (we have a minister who comes from a sister church once a month), God doesn't get brought up because whichever lay leader is in charge of the particular service just doesn't think about it.

[meowcom]

actually you are left with all the love, kindness and peace of Christianity without all the B.S.

[djemil5]

Hey Yamahaeleven,

That's cool that you're a teacher. I bet you're a good teacher and

very funny in class.

It's good to have a connection/sanctuary with others.

I agree with you that we all have spiritual desires inside us. Why do you think that is?

Why do you think people regardless of faith long to be with others of their own faith?

How did those desires come into being? Where do desires come from? Would you say it's a mystery?

[yamahaeleven]

No mystery, humans are social animals and need the connection with others. I don't have "faith," I simply just like being with these folks. Many UU's call the UU church a faith, but it really isn't. It is based on principles which are commonly accepted, and those principles are subject to change as time goes on. Faith, to me, is rather immutable, and that is why I think where its appeal comes from.

[babri62]

Go play chess You get more.

[yamahaeleven]

Too hard, easier to hang out and drink coffee with my UU friends. Everyone I play chess with wipes me off the board in a few minutes.

[yamahaeleven]

Hey there Josephdorf03, I have a son serving with the Marine Corp, stationed in North Carolina. He gripes about the same thing! Had the pleasure to meet the only UU chaplain in the military a few months ago, she said 4 more are going through training.

[Josephdorf03]

As a Unitarian Universalist with atheist beliefs living in an US Air Base in Japan, I feel severely deprived. The US military is almost exclusivly Christian (Pace, anyone?), and it is the only onbase (or off, for that matter) religion offered. There are about 8 churces. I'm just expected to be Christian. Thankfully, I'm moving to (liberal,yay =3) California, with many UU churches.

[Ruckgesicht]

Sheds some light on the UU denomination (well, denomination of sorts.) I knew they accepted most of all different philosophical persuasions but didn't quite know how diverse it was until now. I guess thats a cue to hit wikipedia on the subject for more info.

[solitudejay1]

Fortunately enough my intellect is growing daily with devotion to God's Word. I'm merely pointing out the fact that you are seeking something outside of yourself...which means your admitting something that is "there" that most athiests say is not.

[solitudejay1]

interesting how you feel like you "need" spirituality yet, you are an "athiest". You seem to be really seeking out after something outside of your natural self. I pray that God will reveal Himself to you.

[yamahaeleven]

I'm not seeking. "Spirituality" is a basic human need, like taking a piss. The UU's provide the ritual and tradition without any dogma to drag your intellect down.

You should try it some time. Seriously.

[meowcom]

taking a piss? lol, well I recently joined a UU fellowship for all the reasons you mentioned in your video. All the members are free thinkers, I love that.

[viewfromearth]

Atheism and spirituality are not exclusive of each other. Atheism is the absence of a belief in god - nothing about the term requires a person to be non-spiritual. Christianity is but one choice out of many - this may be shocking to learn, but other forms of spirituality and religion do exist that do not have anything to do with your god. Atheists can be religious, spiritual, non-religious... the only thing that can be assumed about an atheist is that they have an absence of belief in god.

[solitudejay1]

Simply put: just because you have an absence of belief in God doesn't inherently mean there is no God. Truth is Truth regardless of belief. An athiest who says there is no god would essentially be claiming that they have full/infinite knowledge. There are no such things as atheists.

[viewfromearth]

"There are no such things as atheists." Really? LOL. Wow, that's great. Your arrogance is very impressive. I guess underneath it all we're all really suppose to be Christians?? It doesn't really matter to me or to any of the atheists that you're dismissing here what *you* believe. And your "truth" is only YOUR "truth". It isn't THE truth for millions of other people, sorry.

[solitudejay1]

again, just beecause it "isn't THE truth for millions of other people" doesn't NEGATE TRUTH itself. Truth is NOT relative.

Also, atheists would have to have complete knowledge of all things (Infinite knowledge) in order to say "there is no God". Point being, there are no atheists because nobody can full know everything to infinity. Not arrogance. Just reason my friend.

[viewfromearth]

*ABSENCE* of belief. I didn't write "there is no God". Try reading it again: Atheists find NO EVIDENCE of god and no compelling reason to have a belief in god. You can tell yourself whatever you need hear but truth is VERY relative when it comes to religion. Also, you have a misguided understanding of reason. And now I'm done with this because it's pointless.

[solitudejay1]

Again, an *ABSENCE* doesn't disprove Truth. You want evidence? Tell me how the world came into being. Tell me how in the heck its possible that if we were any closer to the sun we would fry. If we were any further away, we would freeze. How is it that there is the EXACT amount (all of this using Science of course) of oxygen in the air for human life to be sustained.

[viewfromearth]

You really don't see the huge errors in logical reasoning in your statement? It'd be fruitless discuss any of these "points" because they're all based on fallacious assumptions. That pretty much eliminates all chance for a rational conversation. Pray for me all you want, it's your time and energy. C-ya.

[solitudejay1]

Coincidence? What about the claims of Scripture?  I could go on from there as well, but since you're done, I'll just pray for ya I guess.

[GwenAYF]

I had composed a comment on your comment, but decided it is pointless. It seems that you simply don't "get it." Listen, carefully, to what the man is saying--all the way. I hope you can hear what he is saying. Blessed be!

[viewfromearth]

It's interesting that you assume spirituality is "outside" of our natural selves. Again, it would be helpful to remember that not everyone thinks or feels or beliefs like you. Spirituality is part of our very nature - and the seeking to know one's place in the universe is another very natural, normal thing that does imply a need or a desire to "know god". It's arrogant of you to assume it means someone needs your brand of religion. I hope rational thought will reveal itself to you.

[solitudejay1]

Welcome to the conversation 9 months ago. Now, spirituality is a natural propensity. I agree. Where I differ is that my God, creator of all, revealed in Jesus Christ the GodMan chose to reveal himself. Therefore I use rational thought to understand that God revealed himself, I simply believe.

[yamahaeleven]

Greetings solitudejay1! A true atheist does not say that there is no "God," they say if you claim there is a "God," an extraordinary claim, you must provide extraordinary evidence. Nothing so far presented by any religion has met the standards of evidence for their claims. It is not required of an atheist to prove the non-existence of "God." Believers are the ones on the hot seat, and faith is insufficient as evidence.

[solitudejay1]

I don't agree with your presupposition that saying there is a God is "an extraordinary claim". We'll have to deal with that remark first if we are going to further the evidence.

[yamahaeleven]

I see, so the "theory" that there is a creator of everything and that creator is intimately interested in what we are doing as individuals is not an extraordinary claim. We have nothing further to discuss.

[solitudejay1]

I was going to end the conversation but you sparked my curiosity again. You tell me something then. I want to know "how" or maybe even "why" we are who we are and how earth came to be and life as we know it. Make a video if you like. I'll watch it.

[yamahaeleven]

My pleasure! The seven principles UU's follow are largely derived from the Humanists. There are times when some UU's are a little to credulous, but they are willing to listen to reason. It can also be a sanctuary for secular fundamentalists, and they can be difficult to deal with, just like any fundie.

[Humanist12345]

I know UU Humanists, Christians, Pagans and Buddhists. Most members of the three congregations I've attended are atheists. I find the meetings to be more positive and uplifting that the Free-thought and other Humanists groups I've attended. The Unitarians spend more time running philosophy workshops, film and literature discussion groups and even volunteering for social service projects such as working at the local soup kitchen.

[Humanist12345]

Thanks for the video. I attend a Humanist UU Congregation. As you said, UUs are all over the map, but even UU Christians are low key and do not considered Jesus to have been "God" - but more of a role model. I also like the fact that the speakers are open to questions and their ideas are often challenged.

[yamahaeleven]

Suits me just fine.

[xild]

Well no kidding. I've heard of these...I think I would go there in times of feeling persecuted, if anything ever happened to me or another atheist. Thanks teach!

[cjunk351]

It sounds more like an agnostic church. I was christian for 20 years,atheist now for 12+months. I have recognised the good that the church experience actually brings. Meeting new people with common beliefs,singing songs together. So I have missed some aspects. Its the usual 'hidden' organisation practices that keep its enemy. So what are the aims etc of this church?

[yamahaeleven]

Agnostic is a good description. UU's are all over the map, they are like herding cats when it comes to deciding what they are all about and what to do.  Completely harmless.

[yamahaeleven]

Congrats on being freethinking for 12+ months. Resist the temptation to revert, there could be times when that may seem desirable, be strong!