Alan Watts: Essential Seminars- Birth, Death, and the Unborn

[elchafa]

where is the rest of this talk? this is awesome

[szmako]

"What was your true nature before your father and mother conceived you? Who are you?"

[szmako]

First, I did not watched the clip, sorry for that! I would like to comment on reincarnation. To my way of thinking, there's no evidence that such an event takes place. In addition, this is the eastern version of the western version of"heaven, hell etc." I assume it is our children who bring on the fire of life after we die! We are trying to imagine what it would be like after we die but how can we think of nothingness with our brain which has no experience if nothingness!

[OMFGallusernamesgone]

this edit is very misleading, he's trying to debunk the claim which he presented. Very bad edit, I am the one downvote.

[apsreine1]

rofl ... I love the last line in this clip, "you have the privilege of appearing in human form".

seems more like a curse than a privilege.

nonetheless, great clip from Alan Watts! Thanks for posting it.

[Hashishin13]

Could you think of any other animal that would TRUELY be better? Ignorance isn't bliss, its endless fear.

[phobosx12]

Im sure all forms, human and otherwise, have thier ups and downs, same goes for ignorance and enlightenment

[holm81]

@Hashishin13 The Universe it just a taaaad bigger than Earth ;) How would you know there's not superior beings throughout it? Assuming there's not is almost arrogant.

To comment the clip, I don't really believe in reincarnation. How can the population increase with the same amount of souls in circut? Also, the essence of the soul is conciousness including the subconcious processes and experiences since birth. So any newborn baby can't have the soul of any former individual.

[GregoryBretton]

your first argument concerning reincarnation is not valid; who says that reincarnation happens in a chronical time order? You could die now and be reborn in ancient Egypt. The idea of linear time is a human construction that has little to do with reality.

Also, what you describe as "the essence of the soul", is merely the coating of a person, the mental material that forms concentrical layers around a hole, a no-thing-ness that is the real you.

[holm81]

@GregoryBretton I agree that we're nothingness in essence, but I wouldn't label that the 'soul'. But isn't a rebirth then automatically not a single soul bieng reborn repeatedly, but in fact just the Universe multiplying itself constantly? That we all come out of the same core conciousness, not our individual ones in circut.

About time, I'm not saying that what you're proposing isn't true, but that hypothesis would mean that lifes already lived would be relived, thereby changing history.

[jonh013]

@holm81 Assuming there aren't some superior being is almost arrogant? If youre implying some deity or higher intelligence, a creator or creators creating if you will, you yourself are intertwining, then directly misconstruing the ideas of western philosophy and reincarnation. To come to the thought that there are greater beings other than the conscious we see here on Earth, is to then ask the question, well who made them if they're around? You lead into an infinite questioning holding belief in

[holm81]

@jonh013 Firstly, where did I mention deities? I'm saying it is very propable that a creature, like a human, exists somewhere in the universe that's more evolved than us. Assuming that humans are the most evolved being in the entire (infinite) universe is arrogant. If they exist, nobody "made them" as nobody made us.

Secondly where is your evidence for your claims? It doesn't make sence. If we stick to newtonian mechanics the most likely is that we are dead, then alive then dead again for

[jonh013]

@holm81 "higher" or superior, creating or governing being(s), and infinity is the idea that is all encompassing of Eastern Philosophies (i.e. Buddhism, Reincarnation etc). think in the scientific sense, matter cannot be created or destroyed. Now it may be picking a fight with the overanalyticals with antimatter, dark matter, and string theory, but holding that idea held as Newtons Law, a law we rely on, reincarnation is all the more likely. Not a religious or metaphysical "soul" is being

[jonh013]

@holm81 transferred, but our energy, the matter that is embodied and thrived on as our consciousness, is what is remanifested and reused

[holm81]

@jonh013 ...eternity. How does the matter my brain consists of mystyically fly over into a newly impregnated uterus? And futhermore IF that was the case, how on earth does the atoms that my brain consisted of create my own conciousness once again? It would surely just be a new conciousness with reused atoms...

It's totally psuedo science my man.

Also, eastern philosophy saysthat conciousness is the core of the universe - not matter. And there's something to that. It's a duality, but...

[holm81]

@jonh013 ... logically conciousness is more likely to be the "first" between the two, because matter alone without conciousness (waves in vacuum) can't experience itself thus can't exist.

I don't think there's any basis to believe that reincarnation is real. As mentioned before, we are the universe and the universe is constantly multiplying it's own conciousness so in that way we can say reincarnation is real, not otherwise imo.

[jonh013]

@holm81 well if you are interested in seeing the viewpoints on reincarnation check out the Bardo Thodol . You might consider it to be a pseudo science, and I cant lie Im skeptical about the validity of it myself, but comprehending the fact that there is and all encompassing cycle of consciousness and energy continually manifesting and deteriorating is all that really needs to be grasped...

[jonh013]

@holm81 ... Our opinions viewpoints are all relative as we are only our individualizing of the parts of the system. But hey great discussion!