80 Years Later: Parallels Between 1929 and 2009 | Walter Block

[macroman52]

The standard argument of free-market fanatics, as opposed to reasonable free market people (i.e. virtaully everyonr) is "There has never been a free market, so don't blame x, ot y or Z on the free market". Pathethic

[Burdell22000]

@macroman52 Hello! Could you please explain why you find "pathetic" that "standard argument"? Thanks in advance

[polevaultrockstr]

@macroman52 I've not heard one educated free-market person say something that stupid. While their might not be any complete, total free markets. We have countless different industries that have very little, if any government regulation, and they run just fine.How would any "fanatic" make any argument ever, if there has never been such a thing. When was the last time you had a shampoo crisis? What about the last time you couldnt go to the store and get cereal? Thank the free market.

[tothatextent]

How about the Jew Depression?

[chefshitpiece]

Read the Economist. Even before this crash (waaayyyyyy before) commentators were noting that entrepreneurs, after expenditures, were not making much more than they were when they worked for someone else. Like, what IS your point man? Are you trying to say that my generation (20-40) has it as good as our fathers and grandfathers did?

[circusboy90210]

@chefshitpiece I'm in your genration , we have it way better than anyone ever before, we have plenty of leisure time & money to spend doing frivolous things like frisby golf & hackey sack. before the 50's every body worked for just living. I listen to my family when they tell me about how things were instead of the brainwashing lies the television pushes. I"m an entrepreneur and can tell you my income has not fluctuated but has actually gone up. we also have cars that go past 50 mph are safe.

[chefshitpiece]

@circusfagOU812: I know exactly what my parents were doing at this age, working good paying jobs that allowed each of them to pay for a home seperately, just like every else they worked with. You are talking about gas prices and cars when the ultimate standard of living is the home.

Just at your gas ratio:

14/3 = 4.66

1.75/.35 = 5

Big deal! NOw look at the housing ration

1972 Wage=11800/yeat Home = $27800

2008 Wage =32000/yearHome = $329000

So gas got a little cheaper, so what?

[circusboy90210]

@chefshitpiece your numbers are way off. 2010 home value usa 170k mean average mean income 48k if houses were barely worth 36k in mid 80's usa . canada has allways been an expensive proposition. yes home prices are one indicator of sol, however quality of life such as type & volume of food is even better indicator. everything we have today by volume two car familly multiple computer etc... is far better than anythingn our parents had and work less for it than grandad did on the farm.

[chefshitpiece]

@circusboy90210 My numbers come from Stats Canada, so argue with them. If your numbers about America's housing and wages are dead on, I will head stateside once I finish my law degree. Where are you getting your numbers from, I notice your are using mean, I prefer median.

[circusboy90210]

@chefshitpiece note that the 1.75 was referencing a minimum wage job  (only refeerence material I know about as my grandfather was a multi millionare ) never been poor myself & don't know anything about minimum wages in the modern sense. for the average person though in the us everything is cheaper by copmarison than it was 50 -70 years ago. 40 dollars feed a family all month but average wages were $2 a day @ times & rent was $20 did not leave mutch for discretionary funds. as today.

[circusboy90210]

@chefshitpiece land out west or montana can be gotten for less than $100 per acre I suppose the same could be said for the northern provinces in canada but could you really live there??? joke hahahaha deserts are actually sustainable living if you can drill down to the aquifers.

[circusboy90210]

Respond to this video...ask your parents what they were doing in your point in life right now. they were working hard , we are in the most prsoperous time ever. gas cost $3 but most people make @ least $14 \whhen gas was .35 cents most people were lucky yto make $1.75per hour. most people I know make @ lelast 20 $ per hour in regular jobs (manufacturing field) this is low ball pay . even if it were true ent make less they are free and answer to nobody. but it's not true.

[circusboy90210]

we are not in a depression.20% reduction in gdp is not nearly as bad as what happned inthe 20's. people are still spending money. keeping peoples mind in the negative sphere only perpetuates this myth.

[chefshitpiece]

@circusboy90210 I guess that's why so many educated young people are living at home, cuz times are so good, right? I guess that's why we had a credit crunch, becuz when people have so much money who needs credit, right? This is going to be WORSE than the 20's...bcuz back then when the worst was over we still had manufacturing jobs. What have we got now...the 'service economy'? What, are we all going to go to massage school and rub each others asses?

[circusboy90210]

@chefshitpiece the statement we have "no" manufacturing jobs is just like saying we were selling "no" cars before the bailout. that is & was a gross overgeneralization . the us auto makers were selling 10million instead of 12 million units per year domestically. the us still leads in production of many commodoties & products. we are far from a service economy in reality. we produce the most semiconductors, airplanes, high tech materials (carbon fiber composite core), & many other things.

[chefshitpiece]

@circusboy90210 Ever heard of China? We dont have to lose ALL our manufacturing jobs to start the downward plunge, a large enough chunk will do. Let me ask you a pointed question: Are times in the USA as good as they used to be? I have the stats for Canada that show they are not. If your answer is NO, I will listen to your arguments. If your answer is YES, then you are nobody's fool but your own.

[circusboy90210]

@chefshitpiece both in some place the economy is surging past what it has ever been in others (minority of places. Keep in mind that I travel almost constantly & see these things in action) less or dramatically worse, or even see sawing .however for the most part the economy has never really faltered . the 1980's were far worse than now. keep in mind that the media is not for our nation but against & will do it's best to fullfill our demise. we are also leading he tech field in discovery.

[circusboy90210]

Respond to this video...  the us produces 27 % of world goods, china is currently #2 @ 11% nowhere near, japan has been the nation to have lost the most manufacturing base not the us, Germany has been flat for the last decade. don't believe statements that are not backed by numbers do research. those statements are designed to be a self fulfilling prophecy. one of the biggest problems is the short term fix of saving a few pennies @ wall mart while you put your neighbor out of biz.

[circusboy90210]

@chefshitpiece largely (myself included )educated people who have lived @ home are a victim of their own circumstance not anything to do with the economy. I've been able to pick myself up with help from family , remember charity starts @ home. in olden times the term family was a klan & uncles cousins grandparents all lived in the same compound or home. the "cellular " family has caused much of todays problems as we no longer depend on eachothers talents. nothing wrong with being home .

[chefshitpiece]

@circusboy90210

CANDA: 1972: Average Median Income=$11800/annum after tax Average Median Home Price: $27000.00 2008: Average MEdian Income=$32000/annum after tax Average Home Price: $329000.00

So the wage to home price ratio went from 1 to 2.28

up to 1 to 10.28

IN other words, it is now 4.5 times harder to buy a home

VICTIMS OF THEIR OWN CIRCUMSTANCE? They got this invention, its called a calculator!

[circusboy90210]

@chefshitpiece canada never has been what you would call a very big economy this is not the usa. as far as calculating devices , I'm aware of many forms of them charles babbage, alan turin, have installed ony one mainframe computer, owned several texas instruements graphinc calulators, my great uncle is a famous mathematician, those numbers are not very accurate or applicable to the statement @ hand here. average us income 48k$ average home price 160k$ and falling 2.8% per year.incomes rising

[pn2543]

this guy is a bit of a simplistic know-nothing, especially regarding his understanding of the minimum wage, he assumes everything is linear and proportional, but economic systems are nonlinear feedback systems and have various stability points, including that of widespread slavery for the working class, which is the whole point of why we need a minimum wage, since the rational capitalist will always want to pay 0 for labor, i.e. slavery. how convenient for us that china condones slavery.

[pretorious700]

@pn2543 No, the rational capitalist will always want to pay a wage that is proportional to the value said employee's services provide to that wage. That proportion varies, but it is never 0. And you know less than nothing about China.

[pn2543]

This is the Third Republican Great Depression, the first being late 1880's. Yet we have just voted the responsible party back in power. Perhaps this Third Republican Great Depression will finally be the end of America, and the Republicans can finally get the pure form of plutocracy they have been working so hard for for the last 100 years.

[3rdwitness]

but capitalists DO exploit workers.take CEO wages, which, in the case of ATT &California, the CEO makes more than the entire work force in that state! I am libertarian, but if left in the hands of the corporations, our people would be like the Nike employees in Mexico, making a below subsistence level wage while the hierarchy all live in mansions w/yachts parked in the bay outside their 7th beach house.We ALL need to start from zero.w/out employees, there is no production. we need an equalizer

[GaminHasard]

@3rdwitness I don't agree on what you say about the wages. If we all be working below subsistence level, and a couple of owners are living in the big houses, who is going to buy the stuff that the factory they own produces? Who has the money to buy nike shoes? Maby the wages are very low but also the prices of nike shoes is going to drop and will cost almost the same as the production cost. So the factory workers earn not a lot, but they will be able to buy more for one dollar then they do now

[fasteddie847]

I like the spooky music at the beginning

[JohnScott700]

Block is one well-informed guy. Impressed.

[Nintendomanwill]

It would be better if he hadn't implied that tariffs must cause unemployment. Of course they will create (relatively inefficient and expensive, capital consuming) jobs and will shift employment to producing what is not bought from abroad after the tariff was imposed, because Auseconomists should ALWAYS say that employment can theoretically be 100% whatever the level of spending or wealth or trade even if there aren't the savings necessary for wages, to be consistent with Say's Law/attack Tariffs

[Nintendomanwill]

Because Tariffs exploit labour and make us poorer as well as compelling force to gain what would otherwise be more affordable in international trade i.e. Mercantilism is bellicosity between nations making their borders ban certain capital and labour movements as much as Mercantilist interventionism is destructive zero-sum economic gaming between individuals as all people profit by political expropriation (tax) rather than production for mutual benefit ("do ut des")

[katsfanman]

the MEDIA depression

[globbo100]

I hearby propose that AntiDallard be the only one to live under a totalitarian fascistic state, so as to protect us from the ravages of unbridled Anti Dallards (which should be Pro-Dullards).

[Seano71]

How about the dark depression

[ANTIDALLARD]

it was unrestrained , unregulated, free mkt free for all economics, that imploded. we need a big state to prtect us from the ravages of unbridled capitalism

[Stussy88776655]

Fannie, Freddie, the CRA and the Fed pumping out fiat money at almost zero cost and governments running record deficits were unregulated and unrestrained free market economics eh?

I think not

[D0g63rt]

Are you willfully ignorant or just plainly so?

[ANTIDALLARD]

FUCK OFF. ya right wing fuck.

[D0g63rt]

I'm an anarchist, but keep being unbelievably uneducated. It's good amusement for the rest of us.

[pretorious700]

lol......cretin

[ANTIDALLARD]

YEAH ! JA CALL ME ?

[redrockerdude]

This post and all comments were very educational, thank you.

[Shadyhunter04]

Call it the "Grrrrreat!" depression. A little something from Tony the tiger.

[thomaserossi]

Sounds like a Michael Scott impression.

[ericclaptonismygod31]

Love this stuff! Finally a group of thinkers who actually use their brains. If only Krugman and the FDR authoritarians had a listen.

[nikbearbrown]

I listened to this but don't understand any point to the talk ... he characterizes any non-libertarian as "bad" and "wrong" ... and states that no president in the past 100 years has "truly" been "free market" (including Regan, Bush, etc.) ... so his argument what? That "true" laissez faire has never been tried but if it had been tried then what?

[Wormtail81]

I find Austrian ideas appealing, but think that calling Fractional Reserve Banking unnatural. Seriously, it evolved naturally and is referenced in the common law. And if it really is fraud, then why is it that people freely choose to have their demand deposits held fractionally?

[Shadyhunter04]

I agree with you, but unfortunately, people choose to hold deposits fractionally because either they're stupid or like the return, or at least that's the case when there was free banking.

I wonder how bank deposit returns would be like under free banking in comparison to other investments. I bet they would be relatively higher due to higher risk premium in comparison to what we have today where FDIC guarantees deposits.

[Wormtail81]

I meant to say that fractional reserve banking is OK. (How else to deal with inflation in this system?) As I've said, it evolved naturally in the common law to the point that deposits were held fractionally unless otherwise specified. I listened to few lectures by George Selgin on free banking and he said that reserve ratios in that system can be lower because it is naturally very stable. The FDIC does create a moral hazard, I agree.

[jaffijoe]

Um, we wouldn't have inflation if it weren't for the fractional-reserve banking system. If we had 100% reserve and had our money backed by a relatively stable commodity such as gold, you would see prices continually decreasing as the market becomes more efficient over time (production, service, etc).

[Wormtail81]

I'm pretty sure that as long as the monetary base (in the case of gold, that is a fixed-quantity species standard) doesn't expand, the money supply won't, at least in the long term.

[nocomprehendere]

You idiot... people don't freely choose that option it's the only option!!! Do you have a brain...try using it

[Wormtail81]

No it is not, Sir. People were historically and are presently, I would expect, able to ask for their money to be held in 100% reserves, with no interest. Most did not, and the precedent in free banking under customary law was to hold loose deposits without specific instructions fractionally. Insults are inferior to evidence in a discussion.

[Visfen]

Not entirely true, look at the Scottish banks in the earl 19th century and the Bank of Holland. They had to be destroyed from the inside because of their success, and they had a FR-system.

[Wormtail81]

Ah, but you see my point at least.

[jaffijoe]

That is not unlike the New England banks in the early 19th century in the run up to the crisis of 1819. Sure, FR banking can be done without significant problems. But, the tendency of the bankers is to expand more and more credit, and it is this that has caused every downturn in our history. By its very function, FR banking is a fraudulent system due to the fact that they money isn't there. FDIC only compounds the problem by removing some of the risk thus allowing the banks to inflate more.

[jaffijoe]

Every downturn is characterized by a contraction of credit. This is impossible without credit having been expanded in the first place. You cannot expand credit in this way without FR banking. In a free market, borrowers would borrow from savers, and the interest would reflect the supply and demand of money. In FR banking, there doesn't need to be savings in the same terms. Banks can lend as long as they keep 5-10% in reserve. This is where credit expands (past the pool of savings).

[jaffijoe]

Also, in regard to the interest rate, it is not a reflection of the supply and demand of money in today's world. Rather, it is a tool used by a central bank in order to expand credit more or pull it back a bit. Since 1913, the dollar has lost over 95% of its purchasing power, so it is clear that the banks have been expanding credit consistently. While that is great for banks and govs, it isn't good for the people. Because, they are constantly battling a depreciating dollar.

[Wormtail81]

P.S. Just look at George Selgin's work if you want proof.

[LumberJackSteve]

Great Depression II

[DarthKazi]

Walter is such a happy guy. Amazing how he can speak about such grim things, and still sound hopeful.

It gives ME hope that free-markets are the answer and are worth fighting for!

Go, Professor Block!!

[TeslaGenius]

There are definite parallels between Germany in the prewar years and now, most obviously the economic crisis that sparked mass unemployment. The Wall Street crash took place in 1929, but it wasnt until January 1933 that Hitler became chancellor of Germany

David Kynaston, research fellow at Kingston University

[ftorresgamez]

Total self sufficiency, or economic autarky, is the very antithesis of division of labor, which makes economic growth possible. If you have to make things yourself, you will have to devout your entire life to make just those things that sustain your life and have time for little else - Light to Dusk work, like in the old-OLD times. The Division of Labor and Capitalism is what made FREE TIME or Leisure POSSIBLE! Yet there are some that advocate autarky...

[ForTehNguyen]

blaming greed?  lol thats like blaming gravity for plane crashes

[razlika]

if "lefty" is so bad, why Norway and Sweden are doing so well now in economic crisis???

[RaymondDundas]

They had minimal international investments. Your economy can't go down if you're not up in the first place.

[bulldogger]

Socialism can work, but it's a Utopian system that seldom works, if you can keep special interests or a tyrants from taking complete control of the system, it can be very successful and beneficial for the citizens in that society. Sweden is an example of how Socialism can work, education is better, health care is better, etc.

[RaymondDundas]

Socialism can never work. The premise of socialism is inherently utopian; that is how Robert Owen established it. It is never successful and always causes a decrease in the living standards of citizens. Sweden is an example of how socialism failed. Sweden used to be heavily socialistic until Carl Bildt came to power and decreased the size of government. That was when the living standards in Sweden rose. But Sweden still has much state intervention which makes for a very sluggish economy.

[bulldogger]

Exactly, and it works, a greed based economy that doesn't give a shit about it's citizens is a country that will always corrupt.

[RaymondDundas]

No, I just illustrated that it doesn't. Socialism is a greed based economy, inherently corrupt, and it cares nothing about its citizens.

[ftorresgamez]

"Sweden used to be heavily socialistic until Carl Bildt came to power and decreased the size of government."

And to put things in further perspective, Sweden used to have a free market back in the XIX Century, when all the great Swedish companies (that still exist today) were created. The government became really "socialistic" (or rather, fascistic) from the 30's onward. There have NOT been any NEW Swedish big companies appearing since THEN (except maybe Ikea.)

[highonhayek]

von Mises defines Socialism as the abolition of the private means of production(MoP) and the subsequent transfer of the MoP to the government -- and I think that the left can agree with that definition.

Sweden is not a socialist country, no matter how many times you or Swedish politicians may say it is, it isn't. True socialist countries are China in the 40's, the USSR, Germany under the Nazi's.

Socialism won't work based on its own principles and it's not a matter of public cooperation.

[ftorresgamez]

"if you can keep special interests or a tyrants from taking complete control of the system [Socialism]."

You cannot achieve this, because any system that requires coercion (such as Socialism) cannot be populated by angels with lady-like demeanor, but by bullies.

"Sweden is an example of how Socialism can work, education is better, health care is better."

This is a subjective issue - begs the question: Better, compared to what? Compared to whose? In what way, cost? Results? Customer Service?

[strawspulled]

I loved the "Yes we Can Depression" as a title for this crisis.

[NerdHerdStudios]

I'm sorry to keep the focus on this 'wage slavery' business DarthKazi, but you really need to think about giving up this Marxist dogma.

Or, at least endeavour to keep an open mind.

[NerdHerdStudios]

"...deny the capacity of the common man to escape from wage-slavery..."

Marxist gibberish. People are generally not forced to work, and any attempt to argue otherwise will end up with you presenting a false dilemma fallacy. The story is always the same.

So, if you dont want to work, you can quit.

As William Lloyd Garrison once said, use of the term "wage slavery" is an "abuse of language."

[DarthKazi]

Garrison was in idiot.

You completely missed my point, because you were so preoccupied with "wage slavery".

It should be equally as easy for a person to start their own business and attain the same proportional resources, as a corporation. One is a business existing on the behest of a person, the other is that of the government. Regardless, all people should have the OPPORTUNITY to rise above "earning a wage someone else dictates you are worth" and decide for yourself what you are worth.

[DarthKazi]

The "opportunity" would be in the form of vouchers that might be bonded with government. This way, just like corporations, the small business not only has the protection legally a corporate entity does (being, itself a "person"), but is subject to investigation if the person is corrupt.

No, you don't have to work for a wage. You could always leech off the government or live off of credit... right? What other choice do most people have? This is why the VALUE of money is so important.

[NerdHerdStudios]

"The opportunity would be in the form of vouchers that might be bonded with government."

First of all, taxation of any kind is inherently immoral; theft, if you will.

Of course, you would be throwing away any money that you gave them. Know why they were a small business in the first place? Because they did not have what it takes to grow, or perhaps, the large businesses were already recieving subsidies. Why use a flamethrower to put out a fire? Douse them both and let the free market work.

[coreytex]

That's why we need to end the Federal Reserve!

[NerdHerdStudios]

"a wage someone else dictates you are worth"

You're still wrong. You need to study real exonomics. A wage is a price, just like any other service. In the free market, it's a meeting place between what the employer is willing to pay, and what the employee is willing to accept. If it was true that the employer simply dictated the wage, then everyone would work for $1 per hour. But they dont. They would all leave, work for someone else, and put the other employer out of business.

[Fruerik]

"PolishAmericanDC", I'm from Denmark - our economic model, The Scandinavian Model, is more or less identical with my nabour contries, Sweden and Norway, - hence the name. Actually, there are cases where (mostly) entrepreneurs have been forced to pay more in tax than they acutally earned. We have a whole variety of taxes and and it happens to be so ludacrisly idiotic that several taxes can be combined, why, techinacal speaking, it can result in a 100+ percent taxation bitch slap.

[PolishAmericanDC]

Sweden never had %110.00 tax I do not line if the speaker does not check well

[randyguitarman13]

Walter Block is definitely one of my favorite people from the Mises Institute.

[mrzack888]

these guys are delusional. Privatize roads?? the only real "free market" market is the illegal drug market. and if you get screwed, you don't hire a lawyer, you get your boys and guns.

[ftorresgamez]

"the only real "free market" market is the illegal drug market. "

If it's illegal, it ain't a free market. You can see a free market at work just going to a flea market - there is no government there to regulate prices, just straight trade, as it should be everywhere. There are many instances of private roads in the US and they work just fine.

[DarthKazi]

Well, not everything this government makes illegal is immoral or bad, by any standard.  The Bill of Rights and latter Amendments up to the 15th, actually GAVE rights to people. From the 16th on, they TOOK THEM AWAY, on some level. This government has been in criminal violation of the Constitution for many, many decades and "illegal drugs" have been their bread and butter racket to keep Wall Street afloat, understanding fully the repugnance of the money system.

[NerdHerdStudios]

DarthKazi,

the Bill of Rights did not purport to give people rights, but protect them. The idea was that the rights existed, but needed legal protection.

In any case, the constitution cannot hold any real authority until it has explicit informed consent from the people, rather than assumed consent. (see: Lysander Spooner's 'No Treason.')

[DarthKazi]

Do you REALLY think the 16th Amendment got the "consent of the people"? If you really believe that the needs and wants of The People are so met by Congress and whatever Congress does, is what the people order... you are pathetically clueless.

[NerdHerdStudios]

'Do you REALLY think the 16th Amendment got the "consent of the people"? '

Would I have made refference to Lysander Spooner If I did?

[Harpakhrad11]

"If it's illegal, it ain't a free market"

That is just stupid, why draw an arbitrary line like that? Have you ever looked into Agorist revolutionary strategy?

[ftorresgamez]

"That is just stupid, why draw an arbitrary line like that [that if it is illegal, it is not a free market]"?

There is nothing arbitrary about the conclusion, Harpak... if you take into account the arbitrary way such a market is deemed "illegal" by the State. We're not talking about a "free market" of slaves, but of something as innocuous as personal drug use. It is the arbitrariness of the State that makes the market of drugs one that is NOT free, even if it is a black market.

[Harpakhrad11]

I agree with every sentence except the last one. What makes the "black market" inherently contra-free market?

[ftorresgamez]

"What makes the "black market" inherently contra-free market? "

Very simply, a black market can only exist in an environment unfriendly to human freedom. The black market requires the existence of a thread of violence from a State. The transactions cannot be done freely, the price system is not efficient, nor can the supply be assured by binding contracts (unless assurances can also be obtained by threat). Cost of entry is VERY high. Thus, a black market is not a free market.

[myheadhurtsnow]

we have much bigger issues than roads.

[DarthKazi]

Well, in truth, black markets are the only true "free markets".

Gigantic corporations, on the other hand, need to be watched, or small businesses and entrepreneurs can never get a foothold and if we deny the capacity of the common man to escape from wage-slavery, we deny free markets in general.

Unfortunately, the "trusts" and "monopolies" of the 19th century ruined free markets from every being truly free. If you regulate Rockefeller, you have to regulate mom and pop.

[ftorresgamez]

On this point, it is important to consider that every time the government sets up itself to "watch" over corporations, the results are always w/o exceptions, a higher cost of entry for smaller companies due to excessive regulations. Big Corporations LOVE regulations - blocks their competition.

I would argue that in a truly free market, monopolies would not exist. Monopolies exist through Gov. fiat, by issuing rules that make it more costly for competitors to afford competing.

[DarthKazi]

We'd all like to go back to being agrarian farmers and trade goods for goods... I mean, ideally, I'd be fine with that.

It's an unfortunate problem that, until the Fed Act and the National Banking Act are repealed, no amount of tinkering, removing or placing new regulations, will do much of anything.

And frankly, I can't trust a gold standard anymore than a debt-fiat standard. This country is too broke to buy gold, so it would just be a borrow-for-credit/Bank of England scam as usual...

[ftorresgamez]

"And frankly, I can't trust a gold standard anymore than a debt-fiat standard."

People can use whatever they can agree on as money. If not gold, then silver. The issue is not trusting gold or silver or even cows for payment, but legal tender law. The fact that fiat currencies are made mandatory to settle all debts and purchases is what makes people vulnerable to the currency's manipulations by the Fed/Central Banks. Get rid of Legal Tender laws, and people will use gold, silver, whatever.

[DarthKazi]

I know this might be a rarity on "YouTube comments" but i totally agree with you. ;)

[ftorresgamez]

His example about inventing a cure of tooth decay is excellent - gives everybody an insight on what is wrong with the Keynesian view that SPENDING is good for the economy and that keeping people employed is a must (regardless of the productivity of the employed, it seems). Instead, invention makes people richer even if some lose their livelihoods, because resources can now be released for more productive endeavors.

[theominousthey]

A great deal of these transformative inventions, especially in this era beyond simple machines, were developed by public universities, the military, DARPA, NASA, NREL, etc. GPS, the Internet, higher efficiency solar panels -- these things don't have market incentives because they require a colossal expenditure and don't pay off for a long time.

This isn't the 20s. Rearden steel isn't the next big breakthrough. Great breakthroughs demand collaboration that capital can't deliver.

[ftorresgamez]

"Great breakthroughs demand collaboration that capital can't deliver. "

You have no way of knowing that. The fact is, people had made their own rockets before NASA, people made their own networks before the Internet. Just because the government spent money on these systems FIRST does not mean it would not have been done by private capital if a need existed for them. There is nothing really special about the Internet, or GPS systems, and Solar Panels are still very inefficient and costly.

[mpolzkill]

Great comments, "ftorresgamez".

"Great breakthroughs demand collaboration that capital can't deliver."

Where & how do the scores who chant this mantra think the government gets the resources to fund these projects?

[ftorresgamez]

"Without [business people], the people become self sufficient and independently wealthy."

I have yet to see how people can become "wealthy" by creating everything themselves. As much as I can try, I cannot build a plasma TV myself without neglecting that time for more immediate needs like gathering food! It is DIVISION of LABOR that creates the wealth, not self-sufficiency. The wealthy are WEALTHY because they seek opportunities (possible allocations) and INVEST in fulfilling them.

[ftorresgamez]

One thing to remember when an anti-market ideologue says that "the rich become wealthy in the backs of others", that this red herring stems from an ignorance of actual economic process: people become employees because they SELL their services to a buyer, the employer. The relationship is entirely voluntary - if the employer does NOT offer a good deal to employees, he will not be able to produce. Instead, the GOVERNMENT makes its money on the backs of EVERYBODY, through coercive taxation.

[soliloqy]

@ftorresgamez well spoken and along the same lines, private interests focus on providing the most people with the most goods at the right price to maximize profit. It's not like the owners of companies are hording all the goods, money and are holding their workers at gun point....

[chefshitpiece]

@ftorresgamez ENTIRELY VOLUNTARY!? That's like mafia hit man asking where d'ya want it...head or gut? I agree with you about the Gov't, but when the only jobs open to someone are shitty min-wage doo-fors, then where is the choice?

[ftorresgamez]

@chefshitpiece, I am not sure where you go to have job interviews as it is interesting you equate a job offering with having a gun in your head, but in the real world where gravity still holds us to the ground, a job offer is not the same as an act of aggression or violence. YOU might think it is, but your hangups and peculiar prejudices are YOUR problem, not the market's.

[chefshitpiece]

@ftorresgamez You misread me, good sir. When your choice is work at Mc Donalds or work at Burger King, the choice is illuiary and superfluous. If you lived in the real world istead of Chez Head-Up-Ass you would realize that my assesment does indeed nicely summarize the state of job hunting today. In US there are 300,000 waiters with university education. I will not wait for your response to brand you a simple minded fool.

[ftorresgamez]

@chefshitpiece, even if those two choices were all you have, how can that equate to having a gun on your head? Your scenario is childishly simplistic, as there's also Taco Bell and Denny's, just an FYI. Your summary is worth bupkis.

The fact that there are 30,000 waiters with a college degree tells more about the lousy choice of career they made, not necessarily a problem with the market. Just how many Liberal Arts majors do you think the job market needs?

[chefshitpiece]

@ftorresgamez So if they look in the job adds, and all they see is minimum wage crap, I guess they made lousy choices, right? If they sent out resumes to Dubai, Asian firms, and gov't job, but only Denny's replied to them, I guess they were just a bunch of unmotivated idiot's, right? Fuck off, bullshit artist.

[ftorresgamez]

@chefshitpiece, if all they see is minimum wage jobs, then perhaps they should look a different classified. Again, you're describing a very simplistic scenario. If a person does not have working experience, he or she has to start with a lower paying job until he or she garners marketable skills. A college deg. is not enough.

And I don't understand your obsession with Dubai or Asian firms. If a person sends resumes & only Denny's replies, maybe the reason is the person lacks marketable skills

[chefshitpiece]

@ftorresgamez

1) The classifieds means...the classifieds

2) Sure a degree is not enough. Not anymore. But if the middle management jobs are gone a'la Peter Drucker, then how do you get from mailroom to upper management

3) What's your obsession with Denny's?

Are you a liberal by any chance? That would explain your retatrded position.

[ftorresgamez]

@chefshitpiece, oh, so you mean looking at all possible classifieds there are (a full time job in itself) would still yield only table-waiting jobs, in your scenario?

How does one get from mailroom clerk to upper management? Easy: Start your own business.

I ask YOU What's YOUR obsession with waiter jobs? College grads can always enter internships or apprenticeships. No, I am a libertarian and I *know* economics (from the Austrian School of economics). Don't confuse me with statist fucks.

[grraadd]

20:30

In USSR democracy demanded to vote over almost everything but never in secret ballot! First question was: KTO PROTIV? Who oppose?

And always there was nobody opposing - simple and proven method used by all socialists/communists/fascists

[gotrootdude]

Oil, water shortage, food shortage, bankers and tax policies, are to blame for the present economy in order of prevalence. Taxes DO NOT greatly affect GDP. While trade is needed, it is not always beneficial. Take oil exploitation in Nigeria and/or banking in Argentina. The wealthy do not generate wealth. Throughout history, their wealth has been built upon the backs of people. Without them, the people become self sufficient and independently wealthy.

[mpolzkill]

A great explanation for anyone who doesn't know how SO many like "gotrootdude" here can be SO extremely wrong; just Google:

"Reisman" + "The Myth that Laissez Faire Is Responsible for Our Present Crisis"

[gotrootdude]

You're incorrect.  I understand that Government intervention is responsible. It was Government intervention that placed subsidies on meats, dairy and oil and misplaced restraints on beneficial trade. Trust me, my friend, not all is black and white in the world. Some things are shades of gray.

[bwp505]

What are you talking about?  Where did you put Government intervention on your list of causes? What is the current economic effect of supposed water shortages and where are these shortages that are destroying our economy.

[Mrhuh]

I think that government bans against bottled water migt be a major cause of water shortages.

[mpolzkill]

"gotrootdude" said: "The wealthy do not generate wealth. Throughout history, their wealth has been built upon the backs of people."

He then followed up this gem with: "not all is black and white in the world. Some things are shades of gray."

[kdawg860]

the wealthy DO build their wealth upon the backs of people when there are regulations which restrict competition and prop up their wealth. when there is free trade however, voluntary cooperation allows for all parties to mutually benefit. this is called the principle of comparative advantage.

[blummedia]

Lets call it the "Planned Chaos Depression"

MAybe people will read Ludwigs book.

[suereed]

My suggestion for Walters book would be

"Here we go again"

[SuperAtheist]

good video

fast 34 minutes

[Alderon714]

Yeah the Union issues are pure id10T without really thinking about our free trade in America.

Man you are right on with this video.

Thanks for posting,

dsc

[Jaycephus01]

The Centrally Planned Depression

[Alderon714]

I am like'n this name.

[MooseOfReason]

So when does this Block-Woods book come out?

XD

[megawavez]

How about "We saved all the bankers and pissed everybody off and still had a depression"?

[Y3rMawm]

TGD 2.0? America's Demise?

[abskebabs]

Walter Block's a legend. Great speaker, as well as economist, I find him very easy to understand.

[Panpiper]

I would go for "The Greater Depression", as that's what I think we're up for this round. It will end when the older generations die out and the younger 'Ron Paul' generation starts to come into it's own. I'm 50 years old now and 'hoping' to see it.

[RichardRoy2]

Hmmm, yes "The Greater Depression" does give context as it relates this one to the previous one. But I think "The Great Depression II" gives more hope, as it leaves room for the possibility we may survive long enough to have an infinite number of depressions, rather than only one more after this, called "The Greatest Depression". ;)

[JEHeer6231]

I'm really excited that Walter Block is writing a book on privatizing roads. I can't wait to see his arguments, as everything I've read on the subject so far has been unconvincing.

[modelmark]

looking for a name for the crisis:

"You could still call it the credit crisis" in that wrong people got the 'credit' for it. This way every one can be happy with the name. The ignorami would think it meant 'a deficit of fiduciary media', the austrians that the wrong people were held responsible.

[Mannekino]

Walter Block is great! There are many Walter Block audio files on the Mises website worth listening to. Especially his talks about libertarianism are very good. I want to thank him for introducing me to libertarianism, he is the reason I'm a libertarian today. Keep up the good work Dr. Block, and everybody else at The Mises Institute!