Science is not a substitute for god. Science does what god can't, reveal the nature of the cosmos as it really is, not as wish hinking humans want it to be. God is fantasy, science is reality -so, there is no way science could replace god. Gandalf the Grey could replace god, their both works of human imagination, both patriarcs(Gandalf being the more benevolent), both have nothing to do with physical reality.
I could go on about the evidence for God, but that is pretty much what my entire channel is devoted to. But I will say this: The Bible is loaded w/ prophecy. I have 2 links in my channel description that list hundreds of prophecies. Also, the apostles willingly died for their witness of Jesus' resurrection. They were w/ Him for 3 years. They shouldve known whether or not He was the Messiah.
If God is the result of wishful thinking then why would people create a God who hates the sins they love to do? Why would they create a God who sends people to hell? You yourself say that God isn't benevolent, despite the fact that He was willing to bear the full, infinite penalty for your sin while He was on the cross. You really couldn't ask Him to something more benevolent. Please don't waste such a priceless gift.
@personEks I see, but if you say that the God of the Bible is "sadistic" you are judging God. But what standard do you judge God by? If there is no God then what is the standard by which you base morality? What makes something right or wrong? What is the difference between sadism and righteous indignation?
Also, what would you consider to be convincing evidence of a particular God / religion / holy book? What do you expect out of a true religion?
@ggcage I am speaking of the authors of the bible and I judge them as ignorant shepherds which is obvious by their works of fiction. That they have mixed in some historical settings is no more convincing than the real life settings of Oliver Twist. Get this straight, I judge the psychology of Dickens based upon his writtings(a very humanitarian one) just as I judge the psychology of the bible's authors(a perverted, power thirsty and sadistic one). Oliver Twist, like god of judeo-christian...
@ggcage ...tradition are fictional constructs of the human imagination and being such it would be absurd to say I am judging them(they are not real!). Moral behaviour is ingrained into our biology just as in the feeding frenzy, piranha do not devour each other. Social animals developed on this principal. I'm not here to relieve you of your ignorance on this; I suggest you take the time(I know you won't) to educate yourself on the womder of evolutionary biology(a huge umbrella term-it's not...
@ggcage ...as simple as judeo-christian myth) and find out for yourself. Social animal behaviour is a well understood natural phenomenon.
"True religion" is an oxymoron, so I expect exactly nothing but confused ramblings of men ignorant of the nature of reality -and that's what you get when you open a book like the bible.
Christianity put an end to barbaric and anyone else for that matter that did not believe as they do with their nifty club called The inquisition,read the witches hammer.
I see, but that doesnt prove anything. Christianity does change humanity for the better, but even if it didn't - even if every professing Christian was a psychopath, that would still have absolutely no affect on the validity of Christianity. Christianity stands or falls on whether or not there really was a man named Jesus about 2000 years ago who was God's Son and who died for our sin. If that is true, then Christianity is true, regardless of what "Christians" may do
There's nothing that we can do today that will put Jesus in the grave. The validity of Christianity does not rest on what "Christians" do. It rests on the resurrection. Since it's a religion from God, it ought to be judged by what God (not man) does. I highly recommend you look at material by William Lane Craig. He has some very, very good material (books, a YouTube channel, and a website) on the resurrection. It's very interesting, and it might lead you to salvation
Liked the music. But thatsabout it Im afraid. I would say religion and God are mutuallly exclusive. Try apllying thescientific theory to any god and see what you get.
I see, but that doesn't disprove any religion. That just shows that people can abuse religion. There are power hungry people who will twist good causes (including religion) for their own greedy purposes and there always will be. But those people cannot change what is true. Even if every professing Christian was highly immoral, that would have no affect on whether or not Jesus Christ was the Son of God and resurrected.
Theres nothing that human beings can do that will put Jesus back in the grave. Theres nothing that we can do that will make God not exist. Christianity stands or falls on whether or not Jesus resurrected. A lot of the other issues that are brought up do not make Christianity false. It doesn't matter if Evolution is true, or Noah's flood occurred or if people use/abuse religion for immoral purposes. Those things do not put Jesus back into the grave
The important thing is to focus on the resurrection. If Jesus Christ really did resurrect, then those other things don't matter. If religion can cause good people to do bad things, then that sucks, but that doesn't mean that Jesus never resurrected. That just shows a flaw in human nature. When deciding if Christianity is true, you need to focus on the resurrection.
The resurrection is whats important. Most of the other topics are distractions. There is a man named William Lane Craig. He has a website called ReasonableFaith(dot)org and a YouTube channel called “DrCraigVideos”. He has some really good stuff on the historical evidence of the resurrection. You should really look at it
watch?v=H5wWnPK7tiY
watch?v=JYdzUYyIKMM
watch?v=fhNHuRkWEhs
I highly recommend you look at those. They have some very good information on the resurrection
@tomwiddv2 My response is too long to post in the comments. I have sent it to you via private message. YouTube has changed their layout so I'm not 100% sure that it has been sent. Please let me know if you didn't get.
@tomwiddv2 I sent it through again. I sent two messages. If it doesn't go through this time, I may try to post it in the comments. Please let me know if you get it.
@tomwiddv2 Ok, I will send it through one more time. Let me know if you don't get, because if you don't get it this time, I'll have to try to put it in the comments.
@ggcage Got it! Finnaly haha. It will probably be a few days for my response as its a detailed message you sent there! Going to take some time to read it over etc. Thanks :)
Assertions of fulfilled prophesy are not credible evidence of a God. It is pretty plain to the unbiased scholars that the written fulfillment of Bible Prophesy was written with the Old Testament prophesy books laid out in front of the writers. I could make up fulfilled prophesy all day long with that kind of help. I've asked my believing friends to ask God to meet me in the parking lot after work for years. I'd like to ask Him some questions. He never shows. I'm willing. He seems not 2 B.
About willing to die if they knew it was a lie. The problem with that idea is that just because someone was willing to die for a cause, doesn't add credibility to their cause or make it more true. Humans are willing to die for all kinds of beliefs all through human history. I am fairly certain that you yourself aren't persuaded that Allah is the true and great really, real God just because a few believers were willing to die for that God and did die, and took a lot of other people with them.
We are all Thomas's, Make a big claim, bring some big evidence. Simple. The story God understood the deal and took steps to remedy the situation. The Gods of today's Christians, Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Hari Krishna's, Mormons, Witch Doctors, VooDoo Kings, Scientology and all the rest of thousands of gods humans worship and love have not deemed it important to show any creditable evidence of their existence. Certainly not the level of evidence the story says that Thomas got to examine.
Doubting Christianity isn't because so many other creeds are better. It's because of the no evidence thing. In the story in the Bible, Thomas doubted the words of his friends about the risen Jesus. He said he needed some very specific evidence to make an informed decision about the resurrection. As we all know from the story. He was given concrete, verifiable evidence. So the God of the Bible story isn't beyond giving evidence, It just seems out here in our reality, He doesn't show it to us.
Having no God doesn't necessarily mean the universe is out of nothing. We just don't exactly know right now. But we are working on that. Just saying "God did it" has been used for explanation for many eons to try and explain the unknown. We humans have studied and found out the Why of a lot of things since the dark ages. Demons, the unseen supernatural and ghosts were not the answers we found and proved. The God did it hypothesis becomes a less needed statement with every new finding.
The question, why is there something instead of nothing, doesn't indicate some god god did it, or multiple gods for that matter. And certainly not someone's particular god either. Humans have postulated many, many gods. I'm not ruling out all gods for sure. Zeus or some cult's pet rock might be the true and real Creator God, but I consider it highly unlikely. It's the verifiable evidence Labowski! Talking snakes aren't just weird, they don't exist. Existence is here and we can touch it.
I see, but the apostles are different from other martyrs. The apostles died for what they saw, not for what they were taught. People die all the time for all sorts of causes, but they always die for what they were taught. The apostles, on the other hand, saw Jesus face to face. They would've known whether or not they actually saw, spoke with, ate with, and touched Jesus after He resurrected.
Also, the apostles had no political motives for their witness, nor could they get any worldly gain from it. Many martyrs die for political reasons as well as religous.
Let me ask you this, just out of curiosity. What would constiture a legitimate prophecy? What would you expect the Bible to say? Or more specifically, what would you consider as convincing proof for God, a particticular religion, or the Bible as Divinely inspired? What would cause you to convert?
Why do people always make comparisons between Atheism and really stupid concepts. You try to use logical reasoning... but who said logic explains everything?... pretty sure the idea of a deity is hugely illogical.
@tomwiddv2 What is so illogical about religion? Why is there something instead of nothing? I know that talking snakes and parting seas may seem crazy but when you really think about it existence is extremely bizarre. If there is no God, then the universe would've had to come from not hing. When you think about the fact that the universe is governed by very particular laws that can sustain complex life, I really don't see how there cannot be a God.
@ggcage take on board your comment, but tell me then, If God has created the Universe.. then he must have come from nothing also.... if not, then he has always been there? Therefore why cant the universe have always been there in some way, or have been created from nothing?. Still i am not saying 100% that i know there is no God, its just his massive absence in everything, that tends to make me feel its alot of man-made crap, to explain the unkown. On the first day, man created God ;) .
@tomwiddv2 God has always existed. The universe cannot have always existed because as time goes by, heat spreads out (hot things cool down; cold things warm up). If the universe were infinitely old, then the temperature across the universe would be perfectly even, which it obviously isn't. Therefore, the universe has a finite age. There's tons of evidence that the Bible is God's word. There are prophecies, the apostles' martyrdoms and so much more. If you truly seek God, then you will find Him.
@ggcage Truly, you have proven yourself silly by attempting to explain the laws of thermodynamics.. (at least i thinks that what you were doing..?). The universe as far as we know, and with our best evidence, began with a bug bang... we do not know what happened before this point.. It could be that the universe, contracts over time and re-ingites (as such). Now, i am literally just a ordinary guy, my knowledge on this is very limited and resides to pseudo-intellectualism. But hey i respect you
@tomwiddv2 I see, but I still don't see how the universe could "re-ignite" without still decaying. The Second Law of Thermodynamics applies to any closed system. Since the universe is a closed system it must decay. If it were infinitely old, then it would have completely decayed an eternity ago. Anyways, I'm not super-educated on this subject either, but I do try to keep myself informed. I appreciate your input :)
@ggcage hey, im really not clued up on the laws of thermodynamics at all, but ill take your word for it. Tbf i dont think we can answer the question either way, but we tried! :)
The second law of thermodynamics says that potential energy in a closed system can only go down. It can never go up. The only way it can go up, is if it receives potential energy from another system, and then its not closed. For example, a fireplace with wood only has so much energy. If the wood burns, or if it rots then the energy goes down.
The only way the energy can go up is if you put wood in the fireplace, but then the fireplace is not a closed system. Creationists are bad about abusing the 2nd law, but it does show the universe has to have a finite age. The universe is a closed system, so if it were infinitely old then it would have used up all its potential energy by now.
@ggcage so then, how, as far as we know, is there not some other unknown source of potential energy somewhere? Im thinking multiverse or string theory... but again im like pre-school educated on these subjects.. so i probably sound incredibly stupid.
Actually, that's one of the most popular theories. However, if there were an outside source of potential energy, then it would also be subject to the same natural laws and would also decay, so this energy would still have a finite age. You have to have something that is timeless, does not age, and is not bound by the laws of nature, and I believe that something is God. There is also a lot of evidence that it is in fact the God of the Bible, who sent His Son to die for our sin.
The Bible has hundreds of accurate prophecies, and it's only book to have them. Also, the apostles were with Jesus constantly, and would've known whether or not they actually saw / ate with / touched the resurrected Jesus after He was crucified. Either Jesus was the Son of God, or the apostles willingly died for a lie. There's a lot of evidence out there. If you seek God, then you will find God.
Jesus died for you. He died for all of us. We've all rebelled against an infinite God and deserve an infinite penalty. We have a fallen nature and cannot redeem ourselves, but Jesus paid our infinite penalty while He was on the cross, so that if we accept Him and give our lives to Him, we will be forgiven and spend eternity with God in joy. Please don't waste the priceless gift of eternal salvation. It's the greatest gift ever and it would be a great tragedy if it were wasted
Jesus died for you. He died for all of us. We have all rebelled against an infinite God and deserve an infinite punishment. We all have a fallen nature and cannot redeem ourselves, but Jesus paid our infinite penalty while He was on the cross, so that if we accept Him and give our lives to Him, we will spend eternity with God in joy. Please don't waste the priceless gift of eternal salvation. It's the greatest gift ever, and it would be a great tragedy if it were wasted.
@ggcage Ok, depending on how much i have to return with, i may split mine into parts. First of all, why, would a god, need to test us upon this planet, only for us to spend erternity with him anyway? Why not skip out the middle man, dont create all the evil stuff that goes down and bring all the good souls straight to eternal peace? Second, why would i believe in the bible vs any other religious text and/or belief.... second comment,,,,
@ggcage Part II: Can you please explain to me the massive absence of any evidence over the past... ever? Since we have had means of permnanet and re-callable evidence (im talking recording devices).. No miracles (as such), no proof, no signs, absolutley nothing. Now you'd think an all loving, all powerfull god, wouldnt overlook our need to have proof. If hes mad that we are rebelling, why not prove himself? The only proof Christians and such have is 'faith', personal experince and 'the bible'..
@ggcage Part III: On the first day, man created God (dont know who's quote it is but i love it). Pre-scientific era man has no means of explaining the unknown... he looks at the sky and wonders what the lights are and mean... without sufficient evidence he gets scared and fills in the gap with something he passes onto everyone. Man advances: man realises he can explaing the lights in the sky with evidence. Now im sure you will tell me this changes nothing and in fact further proves gods glory ..
@ggcage (carried on).. with the sheer complexity of life and the stars.
Now im currentley studying Biology and chemistry (no suprises there... typical Atheist lol!).. and i will admit.. the structure of the cell.. the way in which it works... the make up of chemicals... is incredibly amazing... but thats because its just so... it could have been any other way and it wouldnt have been just so... we just dont know any better... theres no need to say it just cant be without a god.. made = maker?
@ggcage But we DONT know all of this. We dont know if the universe is a closed system. No one has been or ever can be at any "end" of the universe if there even is an end. Multiverse is possible, a creation by multiple gods is possible. And also, the 2nd law may break down at about the time of the big bang. Isnt it possible that the universe has sort of a rubber band effect whereby it has always existed and just expands and detracts after a certain amount of "time?"
I hear that all the time - from Christians that appear to not know their own bible:
Matthew 18:19 "If two of you on earth agree about anything you ask for, it will be done for you by my Father in Heaven."
Notice the lack of caveats ggcage? Notice there is no "Forsaking medicine and *only* praying is foolish"? Unless you think you, or your interpretation, know better that the divine word of your god.
I like how you're are unwilling to allow a like or dislike vote on your completely inaccurate retelling of history. God can suck my left testicle and you can suck on the right one. Nice choices of music though it almost makes you think that you are learning something, kind of like how Glenn Beck uses a chalkboard to sell his propaganda.
So, you really think that threatening little children with eternal, burning torture is somehow enhancing and promotes the betterment of mankind? I recommend that you pick up a Bible of your choice, sit quietly and read it, slowly, thinking about what it actually is presenting. Just read it. For me. Please.
@hyoidbone54 I have. There are some hard things in the Bible, but what you have to realize is that God takes sin *very* seriously. In fact, this is probably the most important theme of the Old Testament. People try to sugarcoat it all the time, but the truth is that people are sinful and God hates sin. This is why Jesus had to die. Sin cannot go unpunished.. Christ's crucifixion not only shows how much God loves us, but how seriously He takes sin.
@ggcage Dang! that was 8 months ago? God personally kills many, many human beings and animals in the Old Testament writings. Seems like He's pretty down with killing and blood and ripping women open. Is this not what He calls sin and yet He is allowed to get a pass if He does it, but not humans? He's not too serious about it or He wouldn't be doing it Himself.
What you have to realize is that there is a difference between murder and justice. Murder is the unjustified, unauthorized killing of an innocent person. Self-defense, justified warfare, and justified capital punishment are not murder. I go over this in more detail in "Old Testament Troubles" but the point is that God did not murder or command to murder, because God is just. That was the point of the earlier comment. God is just and will punish sin which is why what Christ did was so important
@ggcage do you ever notice how a lot of the time people do the killing for God and not God Himself? I wonder how come God kills people to punish them. Seems like He'd want them alive to feel the punishment and learn from the experience to not do it again. Why does God let the ones he knows are going to be tortured in hell forever and ever be created in the first place? Seems pretty sadistic to me. "Well Rickey, I least I gave you a chance. Now burn forever you evil spawn!"
@hyoidbone54 I see, but what you have to realize is that God created us to love Him. Love requires free will, so if God had created it so that we could do no wrong, that would defeat the entire purpose of creation. We have all used our free will to sin against God, and deserve God's holy and righteous punishment of hell. But through Jesus, God has offered to take our sin and punishment from us. Christ's sacrifice was the greatest gift ever, and it would be a great tragedy if it were wasted.
@ggcage The real tragedy is me having wasted 50 years of my only life subjagating my intellect and bowing prostrate before a non-existent thing. I would assume that you feel the same way about the poor Muslims when they spend 5 times a day for their entire life bowing before their idea of a God. Yes or no. I also assume you are atheist when it comes to believing in Allah or Buddah or Zeus? Well, that's how it is with me too, I just go one god further and put the God of Abraham on the list too
I see, but when you take away *all* gods that leads to why is there something instead of nothing? Talking snakes may be weird but when you really think about it, existence itself is extremely bizarre, and if there is no God at all then that means that the universe came from nothing.
I can see why people doubt Christianity because there are so many other religions, but there is a lot of evidence out there unique to Christianity, such as prophecy. The Bible has hundreds of prophecies (I have a couple of links in my channel description if you're interested). Also, the apostles risked their lives over and over to spread the gospel. If Jesus wasn't the messiah, then they would've known it and they would've willingly died for a lie.
Of course religion impedes progress. It is OBVIOUS if you went to school for your history lessons. The church said the Earth was flat, the Sun revolves around Earth, etc, which was proven wrong by astronomers and scientists of that age, and the Church wanted to shut their mouth.
Not only that, but it is now illegal to create an animal on a laboratory, and to clone human beings, because crhistians say that they are playing 'God'.
Religion HAS impided progress, and it will impide it again.
You shouldn't judge Christianity by the deeds of power hungry leaders who may or may not be Christians, but by Christ, who was willing to die for your sins.
The church didn't push a flat-earth-theory. Dante's Divine Comedy (written around 1300) portrayed a round earth.
Cloning has ethical issues in the secular realm. Can you imagine how it would change our society (not for the better) if human reproduction was done primarily by cloning? It simply is unnatural, and chances are society will never be ready for it. Human beings were meant to have families.
Also, which is more important, that people go to heaven, or that we have some new modern convenience?
@ggcage Of course I can imagine the consecuences of cloning, but if cloning humans is fully developed, it should be used as a medical purpouse, not for reproduction.
@sonic8005 Forsaking medicine and *only* praying is foolish. That's not how prayer works. Medicine does not really rely on evolution (at least not macro) but that's a different topic. The thing is that God gave us minds to cure diseases. Yes, it is extremely important that we acknowledge that it's ultimately in God's hands, and ask for His help, but it is *not* taught in scripture to only pray when the problem is perfectly solvable by earthly means.
@ggcage Is it really so "foolish"? According to the Bible God is capable of healing diseases and everything, all you have to do is ask, he should technically be better than any doctor on Earth yet you're still gonna go to the hospital and pray even though there are human doctors doing more for your diseases than God has.
Humans came up with these solutions yet an all knowing god who knew we were going to develop them decided to let the centuries go by first instead of giving knowledge first?
Well, there is something very important to realize. That is that humanity has sinned against God. Sin is the reason why there is disease and death and suffering in the first place. Because we have all polluted this world with sin, it is separated from God, because He is so holy. If God were to just snap His fingers and heal everything then He would be supporting sin, and eternally discarding His holiness.
@ggcage I already know what you believe. Sins don't make you sick, germs do. If God is just he would never punish your children for your crimes or blame them for the crimes they never committed, yet the world shows us otherwise.
That's a pathetic excuse. It's not "unholy" to heal somebody. By that understanding all of medicine is "supporting sin".
Then again... you still haven't given a clear answer on prayer. Perhaps you simply believe your prayers won't do anything?
That is why Jesus had to die. If God were to simply forgive sin without any kind of sacrifice, he would be endorsing it, and giving up His holiness. By dying on the cross, God was able to bear the penalty for our sin so that it would not go unpaid, and He would not lose His holiness. The cross not only shows how much God loves us, but how seriously He takes sin. It is the greatest gift ever, and it would be a great tragedy if it were wasted.
@ggcage He doesn't NEED to sacrifice himself to himself to save us from a sacrifice he demanded in the first place to keep being holy. There's no rules God is under, he's God, he's supposed to be the one who wrote them, he's the only one who can break them and matter of fact he does break a few as Jesus.
I don't know what kind of re-writing of the Bible you're working under but God isn't capable of losing anything, he's GOD. The authority, nobody takes anything away, you should know that!
@sonic8005 I never said that healing was "unholy." Jesus healed people. What I was saying was that death and disease are the consequences of mans' sin. Yes, germs cause disease, but the underlying cause; the reason the universe isnt in perfect harmony with man; is sin.
The problem is in what "omnipotent". The fact is that there are certain things that God cannot do. For example, God cannot lie or deny Himself. (Heb 6:18; 2 Tim 2:13).
Also, what was your original question about prayer?
@ggcage "If God were to just snap His fingers and heal everything then He would be supporting sin, and eternally discarding His holiness"
That's where the "unholy" part comes from. It's just a conclusion of the premises you introduce.
He didn't have to make it so ALL would be punished by the actions of two naked people who didn't know good or evil. The fact that they were naked should raise more questions as when they do get the knowledge, is it bad or good to be naked?
@ggcage Actually, as far as the christian Bible says, Satan was the one to give a proper 'mind' to humanity by giving Eve the fruit of the forbidden tree, the fruit of knowledge. God wanted to keep humanity ignorant. So, we are able to actually save lives thanks to Satan.
Of course, this is an idiotic story made by man an acient time ago, when he had nothing better to do.
@tiolocmcgrock Satan gave man the knowledge of how to commit evil, which has led to death, rather than saving lives. Everything that is truly good (including good knowledge) ultimately comes from God.
@ggcage And how would Adam and Eve know that eating the fruit was a sin? They had no understanding of good and evil, how would you expect them to do the right thing? And if God was so omnipotent, all-mighty and know it all, then he KNEW that Eve and Adam would eat the fruit. He KNEW that Cain would kill Abel. He KNEW every bad thing that was going to happen. Is this a stupid game for him or what?
Also, on the bible appear more deaths commited by God, or influenced by God, than Satan.
God told them not to eat of that tree in Gen. 2:16-17.
The problem is that if God never put the tree there then Adam and Eve would not truly have free will. Free will by definition requires that there be potential to do wrong. If there was no tree, then Adam and Eve would essentially be slaves to God, and that's not what God wanted. He wanted true love, not forced love.
@ggcage If he did not want to have them as slaves (which God supports) and wanted 'true' love, why make ALL their descendants mortal, for a sin the PARENTS did? Why MURDER millions of people because they did not believe in him, commited 'sins', etc, and make them FEAR him? I don't think making your creations fear you will make them have true love for you. That's forced love.
And forbidding them to eat from the tree would make them slaves too, wouldn't it?
@tiolocmcgrock The King James word "fear" is different from the modern word "fear". Today's word "fear" means that one tries to avoid that which he fears, and God certainly doesn't want us to avoid Him. The real thing the Bible means is respect/revere.
Also, Adam, Eve, and all of us are not slaves. We chose to sin. Everyone has chosen to sin. Everyone needs Jesus. Christ's sacrifice is the most precious gift ever, and it'd be a great tragedy if it were wasted.
@ggcage I don't care what interpretation the King James gave to fear. I know what fear means, and it has little to none relation to what you stated as "fear".
fear n.
a. A feeling of agitation and anxiety caused by the presence or imminence of danger.
Extreme reverence or awe, as toward a supreme power.
And how would Adam and Eve chose to sin when they did not know what 'sin' was?
I don't need Jesus, neither do you. And he didn't entirely sacrifice, since he 'resurrected' 3 days later.
@tiolocmcgrock I see, but the word fear has changed since King James, just like the word "gay" means something different today than it did 70 years ago. If you dont adjust for changing words, youre going to get the wrong meaning
God told them not to eat of the fruit, and they did it anyway. Weve all offended God & we all need Jesus. And yes, it was a sacrifice because on the cross, God bore the punishment of all the sins of all mankind. The actual visible crucifixion was the tip of the iceberg.
@ggcage How would it be a sacrifice if Jesus revived anyways? And if God forgave all of our sins, then why do we still die? As far as I know, the bible states that human mortality is a punishment of the sin Adam and Eve commited, so, if God did actually forgive all of our sins and freed us from the punishment for commiting those sins, we would be inmortal.
God, being an infinite being was able to pay for our sins as Jesus in a finite amount of time. Nevertheless, it was a sacrifice because there was suffering on God's part.
Even though Christ paid the penalty for our sins we still die because He has not returned. Sin has been defeated, but not completely, yet. People still must die because of their sins, but Christ has given us the chance to escape the eternal consequences of sin.
@ggcage He's GOD, he's not under any obligation to make the tree, he's not under any obligation to do it that way. He's not under any obligation to do any of that. He could have given them the knowledge that eating from the tree was supposedly wrong.
In short, you literally believe that Eve eating a fruit from a tree that God supposedly had to put there, even though Eve had no knowledge that it would be wrong or bad... is exactly why we have children's hospitals
@zipitup75 We will have free will in heaven, but what we won't have is a sin nature. In other words, we won't have any desire for anything that is sinful, so there will still be no sin. Jesus Christ came not only to save us from the punishment of sin, but the sin itself, and that is exactly what will eventually happen, which is why Christ's sacrifice was such a precious gift and it is of all importance that it not be wasted.
@ggcage thank you for your respectful reply, i understand what you are saying, but here is the problem, remember Adam and Eve were perfect and i'm sure God didnt make them with sin nature, but they still ended up sinning, also Lucifer was made perfect and was considered God's favorite but he too also sinned in a sinless environment and i dont think God put sin nature in Lucifer based on scriptures God made all things and God would never create inperfection so what changed Lucifer.
@zipitup75 Hmm. That's a very difficult question to answer. I can't say that I can answer it fully, but my idea would be that origin of sin was in free will. God created angels and people to love Him, which required a choice, and hence free will, which by definition means there is a potential to do wrong. If God created sentient beings that were incapable of sinning, than their entire purpose would be defeated.
@ggcage "Satan gave man the knowledge of how to commit evil, which has led to death"
It's the knowledge of good and evil. It's not Satan doing it either. It's a snake. A serpent. God punishes the serpents, not Satan, to crawl on their bellies.
It did technically come from God, he made the tree supposedly. He just asked Adam not to eat from it. That's it. That's the story.
Adam ate off the fruit and that's why God is never going to heal people according to your faith.
Wars have been fought over religion. MILLIONS have died as a direct result of religion. You defend the most vicious and argued falsity of mankind. Religion has and always will impede progress. You simply cannot play make believe when you don't have the answer to something and expect to advance. Not having the answer is simply not having the answer. Why must we substitute not knowing with "well it must be god?" Why can't we just hold out for the truth?
@jab0805 People twist perfectly good causes for their own selfish reasons all the time. Its been going on forever, it isn't limited to religion, and it doesn't change the cause. Jesus said "Love thy enemies" which even to this day is considered radically peaceful (and I consider it as evidence it's from God). You can't let the deeds of sinful men distract you for what God, through His amazing love, was willing to do for you.
@ggcageI don't understand how anyone can claim that the christian god is loving?The diseases, children that suffer starvation, genocide, pain, murder, rape, torture, death. This god has to be the most sinister malevolent and evil god. If this god created everything, knows everything, and loves everyone, then why do this to us? Is this some test? Free will isn't free if everything is decided in advance. Fear will never persuade love. Only compliance to survive. Truth and reason sets us free.
I see, but those things arent from God. Theyre from a lack of God. Because this world has been polluted by all our sin, it has been separated from God and His blessings. Since everything that is good ultimately comes from God, everything that is bad is the result of a lack of God. But God sent His Son to pay the penalty for our sin, so that we would not have to be completely separated from God for all eternity. It is the greatest gift ever given and it would be a great tragedy if it were wasted.
@ggcage I have heard before that the lack of god is the reason for all the bad in the world. So how does one explain the good that happens to those who do not believe in a god? If the bad things are a result of not having a god in your life, then surely all good things must come from having a god in your life. Why then are non religious persons, or countries prosperous? How does this apply to a baby born with a debilitating disease, suffering a painful death without even knowing of a god?
It's not really that people are punished for their individual sin, at least not in this life. What I meant was that humanity has polluted this world with its collective sin, and because of this God has separated Himself from the universe, and the laws of nature don't work quite like they should. The universe is not in perfect harmony with man. Bacteria, weather, and many other things can be harmful to him.
You can argue that many people are innocent, but sadly, that's simply the way sin is. It hurts innocent people too. Innocent people get killed by drunk drivers. Innocent people get murdered, raped, robbed, ect. Sin is very harmful to God's creation and that is just one of the many reasons why it is so evil.
@ggcage If you accept micro evolution than there's nothing preventing macro nor should we disregard the facts which lead to the conclusions of evolutionary biology.
If there was a god then they probably have no problem accepting evolution as it's true by any and all means discovered. Considering the stuff we've found in recent years it's almost as if a god would prefer we make these conclusions from the demonstrably true facts that we already have.
rejecting god because of science is not like rejecting water becasue of air. science and religion make contrary calims about reality. Science has disproven many of these as impossible.
@spaceghost1313 Yes, there are certain things in the Bible that are physically impossible, but what needs to realized is that if God could not do things that were physically impossible, then He really wouldn't be God. God by definition is not bound by the laws of nature.
44% of the American people believe that the world was made in six days less than ten thousand years ago. Please don't try to tell us that Christianity is not at odds with science. Have you been to the creation museum? Animatronic dinosaurs walking with animatronic children.
By the way.... Einstein ACTUALLY said "The only miracle is that there ARE no miracles." He was very clear on his position of a universe that operated WITHOUT a prime mover.
@jazzyazz "44% of the American people believe that the world was made in six days less than ten thousand years ago." that's interesting because Genesis doesn't say this lol
@kristophershaun Psalms 90:4 gives an idea of how time is subject to God. . i for one definitely do not believe in a relatively recent creation of the universe i believe that things took time to be prepared for life and then also there was preparation just for us to be here. . Later in John 14:2 we find the King Yeshua states that He is leaving but He will return, notably He goes to "prepare" a place for us in Heaven. . so there was a preparing just for us to exist just as there is a preparation
My father recently passed away and according to the Christian belief, because my father never came to know this Christ of yours, he is burning in an eternal hell fire. Do you believe that Kristopher? This is sickening and immoral to teach to children and just like all other religions and cults, you haven't got a shred of evidence. The bible even says he will be punished to his third or fourth generation for using the lords name in vain. JESUS FUCKING CHRIST! Your "god's" an ASSHOLE! lol
@jazzyazz personally do i believe that? i believe in Psalms 44:21 "Shall not God search this out? for he knoweth the secrets of the heart." Shred of evidence? evidence of the Christ? be aware you commented on a GGCage video and has related videos to "shreds of evidence". you say He's a a-hole, but look how you speak to me.
If God created this all, why was he so wasteful? 99% of all of the species that have ever lived are now extinct. What kind of a plan is that?
Also, if God created everything, why did he decide that the best way to present himself to his people would be a dirty, bloody sacrifice in a remote and supersticious part of the middle east? Word of Christ didn't hit China for 1000 years! The story is hardly enough to keep the mind alive.
@jazzyazz I think i covered that in saying that if Jesus had to leave to prepare a place for us in Heaven then why wouldn't it take time to prepare a place for us here on this earth? Chrisitianity cannot be man made as it has proof of it's messiah walking the earth.
Science is not a substitute for god. Science does what god can't, reveal the nature of the cosmos as it really is, not as wish hinking humans want it to be. God is fantasy, science is reality -so, there is no way science could replace god. Gandalf the Grey could replace god, their both works of human imagination, both patriarcs(Gandalf being the more benevolent), both have nothing to do with physical reality.
personEks 1 week ago
@personEks
Part I
Nothing to do with physical reality?
I could go on about the evidence for God, but that is pretty much what my entire channel is devoted to. But I will say this: The Bible is loaded w/ prophecy. I have 2 links in my channel description that list hundreds of prophecies. Also, the apostles willingly died for their witness of Jesus' resurrection. They were w/ Him for 3 years. They shouldve known whether or not He was the Messiah.
ggcage 4 days ago
@personEks
Part II
"not as wishful thinking humans want it to be."
If God is the result of wishful thinking then why would people create a God who hates the sins they love to do? Why would they create a God who sends people to hell? You yourself say that God isn't benevolent, despite the fact that He was willing to bear the full, infinite penalty for your sin while He was on the cross. You really couldn't ask Him to something more benevolent. Please don't waste such a priceless gift.
ggcage 4 days ago
@ggcage Part 1:Vague biblical prophecies impress me no more than the daily horoscope.
Part 2:The sadistic aspect of the judeo-christian god is a reflection of the psychology of the authors and the social zeitgeist when it was recorded.
personEks 3 days ago
@personEks I see, but if you say that the God of the Bible is "sadistic" you are judging God. But what standard do you judge God by? If there is no God then what is the standard by which you base morality? What makes something right or wrong? What is the difference between sadism and righteous indignation?
Also, what would you consider to be convincing evidence of a particular God / religion / holy book? What do you expect out of a true religion?
ggcage 1 day ago
@ggcage I am speaking of the authors of the bible and I judge them as ignorant shepherds which is obvious by their works of fiction. That they have mixed in some historical settings is no more convincing than the real life settings of Oliver Twist. Get this straight, I judge the psychology of Dickens based upon his writtings(a very humanitarian one) just as I judge the psychology of the bible's authors(a perverted, power thirsty and sadistic one). Oliver Twist, like god of judeo-christian...
personEks 1 day ago
@ggcage ...tradition are fictional constructs of the human imagination and being such it would be absurd to say I am judging them(they are not real!). Moral behaviour is ingrained into our biology just as in the feeding frenzy, piranha do not devour each other. Social animals developed on this principal. I'm not here to relieve you of your ignorance on this; I suggest you take the time(I know you won't) to educate yourself on the womder of evolutionary biology(a huge umbrella term-it's not...
personEks 1 day ago
@ggcage ...as simple as judeo-christian myth) and find out for yourself. Social animal behaviour is a well understood natural phenomenon.
"True religion" is an oxymoron, so I expect exactly nothing but confused ramblings of men ignorant of the nature of reality -and that's what you get when you open a book like the bible.
personEks 1 day ago
Christianity put an end to barbaric and anyone else for that matter that did not believe as they do with their nifty club called The inquisition,read the witches hammer.
philosophicalreason 3 weeks ago
@philosophicalreason
Part I
I see, but that doesnt prove anything. Christianity does change humanity for the better, but even if it didn't - even if every professing Christian was a psychopath, that would still have absolutely no affect on the validity of Christianity. Christianity stands or falls on whether or not there really was a man named Jesus about 2000 years ago who was God's Son and who died for our sin. If that is true, then Christianity is true, regardless of what "Christians" may do
ggcage 2 weeks ago
@philosophicalreason
Part II
There's nothing that we can do today that will put Jesus in the grave. The validity of Christianity does not rest on what "Christians" do. It rests on the resurrection. Since it's a religion from God, it ought to be judged by what God (not man) does. I highly recommend you look at material by William Lane Craig. He has some very, very good material (books, a YouTube channel, and a website) on the resurrection. It's very interesting, and it might lead you to salvation
ggcage 2 weeks ago
Good tunes but content is propaganda!
TheMuskokaman 3 weeks ago
Liked the music. But thatsabout it Im afraid. I would say religion and God are mutuallly exclusive. Try apllying thescientific theory to any god and see what you get.
RapeJesusWithAStick 3 weeks ago
All i have to say to show that religion is harmful is one quote (which mind you has been backed up by plenty of evidence).
"Good people do good things and bad people do bad things. But for good people to do bad things, it takes religion."
Im too lazy to look up who said it.
crackerkiller89 1 month ago
@crackerkiller89
Part I
I see, but that doesn't disprove any religion. That just shows that people can abuse religion. There are power hungry people who will twist good causes (including religion) for their own greedy purposes and there always will be. But those people cannot change what is true. Even if every professing Christian was highly immoral, that would have no affect on whether or not Jesus Christ was the Son of God and resurrected.
ggcage 3 weeks ago
@crackerkiller89
Part II
Theres nothing that human beings can do that will put Jesus back in the grave. Theres nothing that we can do that will make God not exist. Christianity stands or falls on whether or not Jesus resurrected. A lot of the other issues that are brought up do not make Christianity false. It doesn't matter if Evolution is true, or Noah's flood occurred or if people use/abuse religion for immoral purposes. Those things do not put Jesus back into the grave
ggcage 3 weeks ago
@crackerkiller89
Part III
The important thing is to focus on the resurrection. If Jesus Christ really did resurrect, then those other things don't matter. If religion can cause good people to do bad things, then that sucks, but that doesn't mean that Jesus never resurrected. That just shows a flaw in human nature. When deciding if Christianity is true, you need to focus on the resurrection.
ggcage 3 weeks ago
@cracerkiller89
Part IV
The resurrection is whats important. Most of the other topics are distractions. There is a man named William Lane Craig. He has a website called ReasonableFaith(dot)org and a YouTube channel called “DrCraigVideos”. He has some really good stuff on the historical evidence of the resurrection. You should really look at it
watch?v=H5wWnPK7tiY
watch?v=JYdzUYyIKMM
watch?v=fhNHuRkWEhs
I highly recommend you look at those. They have some very good information on the resurrection
ggcage 3 weeks ago
Also please ignore the awful spelling... i wrote very fast.. i am actually good at English i promise haha!
tomwiddv2 3 months ago
@tomwiddv2 My response is too long to post in the comments. I have sent it to you via private message. YouTube has changed their layout so I'm not 100% sure that it has been sent. Please let me know if you didn't get.
ggcage 3 months ago
@ggcage hey, i seem to log on just at the right time each time! I didnt recieve it no, sorry! send it through again
tomwiddv2 2 months ago
@tomwiddv2 I sent it through again. I sent two messages. If it doesn't go through this time, I may try to post it in the comments. Please let me know if you get it.
ggcage 2 months ago
@ggcage Didnt get it again sorry! however it 'added you as a contact'.. wether this means you can send me stuff now i dont know :/
tomwiddv2 2 months ago
@tomwiddv2 Ok, I will send it through one more time. Let me know if you don't get, because if you don't get it this time, I'll have to try to put it in the comments.
ggcage 2 months ago
@ggcage Got it! Finnaly haha. It will probably be a few days for my response as its a detailed message you sent there! Going to take some time to read it over etc. Thanks :)
tomwiddv2 2 months ago
Assertions of fulfilled prophesy are not credible evidence of a God. It is pretty plain to the unbiased scholars that the written fulfillment of Bible Prophesy was written with the Old Testament prophesy books laid out in front of the writers. I could make up fulfilled prophesy all day long with that kind of help. I've asked my believing friends to ask God to meet me in the parking lot after work for years. I'd like to ask Him some questions. He never shows. I'm willing. He seems not 2 B.
hyoidbone54 3 months ago
About willing to die if they knew it was a lie. The problem with that idea is that just because someone was willing to die for a cause, doesn't add credibility to their cause or make it more true. Humans are willing to die for all kinds of beliefs all through human history. I am fairly certain that you yourself aren't persuaded that Allah is the true and great really, real God just because a few believers were willing to die for that God and did die, and took a lot of other people with them.
hyoidbone54 3 months ago
We are all Thomas's, Make a big claim, bring some big evidence. Simple. The story God understood the deal and took steps to remedy the situation. The Gods of today's Christians, Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Hari Krishna's, Mormons, Witch Doctors, VooDoo Kings, Scientology and all the rest of thousands of gods humans worship and love have not deemed it important to show any creditable evidence of their existence. Certainly not the level of evidence the story says that Thomas got to examine.
hyoidbone54 3 months ago
Doubting Christianity isn't because so many other creeds are better. It's because of the no evidence thing. In the story in the Bible, Thomas doubted the words of his friends about the risen Jesus. He said he needed some very specific evidence to make an informed decision about the resurrection. As we all know from the story. He was given concrete, verifiable evidence. So the God of the Bible story isn't beyond giving evidence, It just seems out here in our reality, He doesn't show it to us.
hyoidbone54 3 months ago
Having no God doesn't necessarily mean the universe is out of nothing. We just don't exactly know right now. But we are working on that. Just saying "God did it" has been used for explanation for many eons to try and explain the unknown. We humans have studied and found out the Why of a lot of things since the dark ages. Demons, the unseen supernatural and ghosts were not the answers we found and proved. The God did it hypothesis becomes a less needed statement with every new finding.
hyoidbone54 3 months ago
The question, why is there something instead of nothing, doesn't indicate some god god did it, or multiple gods for that matter. And certainly not someone's particular god either. Humans have postulated many, many gods. I'm not ruling out all gods for sure. Zeus or some cult's pet rock might be the true and real Creator God, but I consider it highly unlikely. It's the verifiable evidence Labowski! Talking snakes aren't just weird, they don't exist. Existence is here and we can touch it.
hyoidbone54 3 months ago
@hyoidbone54
Part I
I see, but the apostles are different from other martyrs. The apostles died for what they saw, not for what they were taught. People die all the time for all sorts of causes, but they always die for what they were taught. The apostles, on the other hand, saw Jesus face to face. They would've known whether or not they actually saw, spoke with, ate with, and touched Jesus after He resurrected.
ggcage 3 months ago
@hyoidbone54
Part II
Also, the apostles had no political motives for their witness, nor could they get any worldly gain from it. Many martyrs die for political reasons as well as religous.
Let me ask you this, just out of curiosity. What would constiture a legitimate prophecy? What would you expect the Bible to say? Or more specifically, what would you consider as convincing proof for God, a particticular religion, or the Bible as Divinely inspired? What would cause you to convert?
ggcage 3 months ago
Why do people always make comparisons between Atheism and really stupid concepts. You try to use logical reasoning... but who said logic explains everything?... pretty sure the idea of a deity is hugely illogical.
tomwiddv2 4 months ago
@tomwiddv2 What is so illogical about religion? Why is there something instead of nothing? I know that talking snakes and parting seas may seem crazy but when you really think about it existence is extremely bizarre. If there is no God, then the universe would've had to come from not hing. When you think about the fact that the universe is governed by very particular laws that can sustain complex life, I really don't see how there cannot be a God.
ggcage 4 months ago
@ggcage take on board your comment, but tell me then, If God has created the Universe.. then he must have come from nothing also.... if not, then he has always been there? Therefore why cant the universe have always been there in some way, or have been created from nothing?. Still i am not saying 100% that i know there is no God, its just his massive absence in everything, that tends to make me feel its alot of man-made crap, to explain the unkown. On the first day, man created God ;) .
tomwiddv2 4 months ago
@tomwiddv2 God has always existed. The universe cannot have always existed because as time goes by, heat spreads out (hot things cool down; cold things warm up). If the universe were infinitely old, then the temperature across the universe would be perfectly even, which it obviously isn't. Therefore, the universe has a finite age. There's tons of evidence that the Bible is God's word. There are prophecies, the apostles' martyrdoms and so much more. If you truly seek God, then you will find Him.
ggcage 3 months ago
@ggcage Truly, you have proven yourself silly by attempting to explain the laws of thermodynamics.. (at least i thinks that what you were doing..?). The universe as far as we know, and with our best evidence, began with a bug bang... we do not know what happened before this point.. It could be that the universe, contracts over time and re-ingites (as such). Now, i am literally just a ordinary guy, my knowledge on this is very limited and resides to pseudo-intellectualism. But hey i respect you
tomwiddv2 3 months ago
@tomwiddv2 I see, but I still don't see how the universe could "re-ignite" without still decaying. The Second Law of Thermodynamics applies to any closed system. Since the universe is a closed system it must decay. If it were infinitely old, then it would have completely decayed an eternity ago. Anyways, I'm not super-educated on this subject either, but I do try to keep myself informed. I appreciate your input :)
ggcage 3 months ago
@ggcage hey, im really not clued up on the laws of thermodynamics at all, but ill take your word for it. Tbf i dont think we can answer the question either way, but we tried! :)
tomwiddv2 3 months ago
@tomwiddv2
Part I
The second law of thermodynamics says that potential energy in a closed system can only go down. It can never go up. The only way it can go up, is if it receives potential energy from another system, and then its not closed. For example, a fireplace with wood only has so much energy. If the wood burns, or if it rots then the energy goes down.
ggcage 3 months ago
@tomwiddv2
Part II
The only way the energy can go up is if you put wood in the fireplace, but then the fireplace is not a closed system. Creationists are bad about abusing the 2nd law, but it does show the universe has to have a finite age. The universe is a closed system, so if it were infinitely old then it would have used up all its potential energy by now.
ggcage 3 months ago
@ggcage so then, how, as far as we know, is there not some other unknown source of potential energy somewhere? Im thinking multiverse or string theory... but again im like pre-school educated on these subjects.. so i probably sound incredibly stupid.
tomwiddv2 3 months ago
@tomwiddv2
Part I
Actually, that's one of the most popular theories. However, if there were an outside source of potential energy, then it would also be subject to the same natural laws and would also decay, so this energy would still have a finite age. You have to have something that is timeless, does not age, and is not bound by the laws of nature, and I believe that something is God. There is also a lot of evidence that it is in fact the God of the Bible, who sent His Son to die for our sin.
ggcage 3 months ago
@tomwiddv2
Part II
The Bible has hundreds of accurate prophecies, and it's only book to have them. Also, the apostles were with Jesus constantly, and would've known whether or not they actually saw / ate with / touched the resurrected Jesus after He was crucified. Either Jesus was the Son of God, or the apostles willingly died for a lie. There's a lot of evidence out there. If you seek God, then you will find God.
ggcage 3 months ago
@tomwiddv2
Part III
Jesus died for you. He died for all of us. We've all rebelled against an infinite God and deserve an infinite penalty. We have a fallen nature and cannot redeem ourselves, but Jesus paid our infinite penalty while He was on the cross, so that if we accept Him and give our lives to Him, we will be forgiven and spend eternity with God in joy. Please don't waste the priceless gift of eternal salvation. It's the greatest gift ever and it would be a great tragedy if it were wasted
ggcage 3 months ago
@tomwiddv2
Part III
Jesus died for you. He died for all of us. We have all rebelled against an infinite God and deserve an infinite punishment. We all have a fallen nature and cannot redeem ourselves, but Jesus paid our infinite penalty while He was on the cross, so that if we accept Him and give our lives to Him, we will spend eternity with God in joy. Please don't waste the priceless gift of eternal salvation. It's the greatest gift ever, and it would be a great tragedy if it were wasted.
ggcage 3 months ago
@ggcage Ok, depending on how much i have to return with, i may split mine into parts. First of all, why, would a god, need to test us upon this planet, only for us to spend erternity with him anyway? Why not skip out the middle man, dont create all the evil stuff that goes down and bring all the good souls straight to eternal peace? Second, why would i believe in the bible vs any other religious text and/or belief.... second comment,,,,
tomwiddv2 3 months ago
@ggcage Part II: Can you please explain to me the massive absence of any evidence over the past... ever? Since we have had means of permnanet and re-callable evidence (im talking recording devices).. No miracles (as such), no proof, no signs, absolutley nothing. Now you'd think an all loving, all powerfull god, wouldnt overlook our need to have proof. If hes mad that we are rebelling, why not prove himself? The only proof Christians and such have is 'faith', personal experince and 'the bible'..
tomwiddv2 3 months ago
@ggcage Part III: On the first day, man created God (dont know who's quote it is but i love it). Pre-scientific era man has no means of explaining the unknown... he looks at the sky and wonders what the lights are and mean... without sufficient evidence he gets scared and fills in the gap with something he passes onto everyone. Man advances: man realises he can explaing the lights in the sky with evidence. Now im sure you will tell me this changes nothing and in fact further proves gods glory ..
tomwiddv2 3 months ago
@ggcage (carried on).. with the sheer complexity of life and the stars.
Now im currentley studying Biology and chemistry (no suprises there... typical Atheist lol!).. and i will admit.. the structure of the cell.. the way in which it works... the make up of chemicals... is incredibly amazing... but thats because its just so... it could have been any other way and it wouldnt have been just so... we just dont know any better... theres no need to say it just cant be without a god.. made = maker?
tomwiddv2 3 months ago
@ggcage But we DONT know all of this. We dont know if the universe is a closed system. No one has been or ever can be at any "end" of the universe if there even is an end. Multiverse is possible, a creation by multiple gods is possible. And also, the 2nd law may break down at about the time of the big bang. Isnt it possible that the universe has sort of a rubber band effect whereby it has always existed and just expands and detracts after a certain amount of "time?"
crackerkiller89 1 month ago
"That's not how prayer works"
I hear that all the time - from Christians that appear to not know their own bible:
Matthew 18:19 "If two of you on earth agree about anything you ask for, it will be done for you by my Father in Heaven."
Notice the lack of caveats ggcage? Notice there is no "Forsaking medicine and *only* praying is foolish"? Unless you think you, or your interpretation, know better that the divine word of your god.
Intiom 1 year ago
Between inaccuracies and non-sequiturs this was the worst 6:34 minutes I will have spent this week. Thank you very much.
Afontanez1962 1 year ago
I like how you're are unwilling to allow a like or dislike vote on your completely inaccurate retelling of history. God can suck my left testicle and you can suck on the right one. Nice choices of music though it almost makes you think that you are learning something, kind of like how Glenn Beck uses a chalkboard to sell his propaganda.
tripwilliams2 1 year ago
So, you really think that threatening little children with eternal, burning torture is somehow enhancing and promotes the betterment of mankind? I recommend that you pick up a Bible of your choice, sit quietly and read it, slowly, thinking about what it actually is presenting. Just read it. For me. Please.
hyoidbone54 1 year ago
@hyoidbone54 I have. There are some hard things in the Bible, but what you have to realize is that God takes sin *very* seriously. In fact, this is probably the most important theme of the Old Testament. People try to sugarcoat it all the time, but the truth is that people are sinful and God hates sin. This is why Jesus had to die. Sin cannot go unpunished.. Christ's crucifixion not only shows how much God loves us, but how seriously He takes sin.
ggcage 1 year ago
@ggcage Dang! that was 8 months ago? God personally kills many, many human beings and animals in the Old Testament writings. Seems like He's pretty down with killing and blood and ripping women open. Is this not what He calls sin and yet He is allowed to get a pass if He does it, but not humans? He's not too serious about it or He wouldn't be doing it Himself.
hyoidbone54 7 months ago
What you have to realize is that there is a difference between murder and justice. Murder is the unjustified, unauthorized killing of an innocent person. Self-defense, justified warfare, and justified capital punishment are not murder. I go over this in more detail in "Old Testament Troubles" but the point is that God did not murder or command to murder, because God is just. That was the point of the earlier comment. God is just and will punish sin which is why what Christ did was so important
ggcage 7 months ago
@ggcage do you ever notice how a lot of the time people do the killing for God and not God Himself? I wonder how come God kills people to punish them. Seems like He'd want them alive to feel the punishment and learn from the experience to not do it again. Why does God let the ones he knows are going to be tortured in hell forever and ever be created in the first place? Seems pretty sadistic to me. "Well Rickey, I least I gave you a chance. Now burn forever you evil spawn!"
hyoidbone54 5 months ago
@hyoidbone54 I see, but what you have to realize is that God created us to love Him. Love requires free will, so if God had created it so that we could do no wrong, that would defeat the entire purpose of creation. We have all used our free will to sin against God, and deserve God's holy and righteous punishment of hell. But through Jesus, God has offered to take our sin and punishment from us. Christ's sacrifice was the greatest gift ever, and it would be a great tragedy if it were wasted.
ggcage 5 months ago
@ggcage The real tragedy is me having wasted 50 years of my only life subjagating my intellect and bowing prostrate before a non-existent thing. I would assume that you feel the same way about the poor Muslims when they spend 5 times a day for their entire life bowing before their idea of a God. Yes or no. I also assume you are atheist when it comes to believing in Allah or Buddah or Zeus? Well, that's how it is with me too, I just go one god further and put the God of Abraham on the list too
hyoidbone54 4 months ago
@hyoidbone54
Part I
I see, but when you take away *all* gods that leads to why is there something instead of nothing? Talking snakes may be weird but when you really think about it, existence itself is extremely bizarre, and if there is no God at all then that means that the universe came from nothing.
ggcage 4 months ago
@hyoidbone54
Part II
I can see why people doubt Christianity because there are so many other religions, but there is a lot of evidence out there unique to Christianity, such as prophecy. The Bible has hundreds of prophecies (I have a couple of links in my channel description if you're interested). Also, the apostles risked their lives over and over to spread the gospel. If Jesus wasn't the messiah, then they would've known it and they would've willingly died for a lie.
ggcage 4 months ago
Of course religion impedes progress. It is OBVIOUS if you went to school for your history lessons. The church said the Earth was flat, the Sun revolves around Earth, etc, which was proven wrong by astronomers and scientists of that age, and the Church wanted to shut their mouth.
Not only that, but it is now illegal to create an animal on a laboratory, and to clone human beings, because crhistians say that they are playing 'God'.
Religion HAS impided progress, and it will impide it again.
tiolocmcgrock 1 year ago 2
Part I
You shouldn't judge Christianity by the deeds of power hungry leaders who may or may not be Christians, but by Christ, who was willing to die for your sins.
The church didn't push a flat-earth-theory. Dante's Divine Comedy (written around 1300) portrayed a round earth.
ggcage 1 year ago
Part II
Cloning has ethical issues in the secular realm. Can you imagine how it would change our society (not for the better) if human reproduction was done primarily by cloning? It simply is unnatural, and chances are society will never be ready for it. Human beings were meant to have families.
Also, which is more important, that people go to heaven, or that we have some new modern convenience?
ggcage 1 year ago
@ggcage Of course I can imagine the consecuences of cloning, but if cloning humans is fully developed, it should be used as a medical purpouse, not for reproduction.
tiolocmcgrock 1 year ago
A belief in a god is not a substitute for the many things secular science has given us.
Perhaps you would rather pray instead of seeking medicine that relies on evolutionary biology for whenever you are sick?
sonic8005 1 year ago
@sonic8005 Forsaking medicine and *only* praying is foolish. That's not how prayer works. Medicine does not really rely on evolution (at least not macro) but that's a different topic. The thing is that God gave us minds to cure diseases. Yes, it is extremely important that we acknowledge that it's ultimately in God's hands, and ask for His help, but it is *not* taught in scripture to only pray when the problem is perfectly solvable by earthly means.
ggcage 1 year ago
@ggcage Is it really so "foolish"? According to the Bible God is capable of healing diseases and everything, all you have to do is ask, he should technically be better than any doctor on Earth yet you're still gonna go to the hospital and pray even though there are human doctors doing more for your diseases than God has.
Humans came up with these solutions yet an all knowing god who knew we were going to develop them decided to let the centuries go by first instead of giving knowledge first?
sonic8005 1 year ago
Part 1
Well, there is something very important to realize. That is that humanity has sinned against God. Sin is the reason why there is disease and death and suffering in the first place. Because we have all polluted this world with sin, it is separated from God, because He is so holy. If God were to just snap His fingers and heal everything then He would be supporting sin, and eternally discarding His holiness.
ggcage 1 year ago
@ggcage I already know what you believe. Sins don't make you sick, germs do. If God is just he would never punish your children for your crimes or blame them for the crimes they never committed, yet the world shows us otherwise.
That's a pathetic excuse. It's not "unholy" to heal somebody. By that understanding all of medicine is "supporting sin".
Then again... you still haven't given a clear answer on prayer. Perhaps you simply believe your prayers won't do anything?
sonic8005 1 year ago
Part 2
That is why Jesus had to die. If God were to simply forgive sin without any kind of sacrifice, he would be endorsing it, and giving up His holiness. By dying on the cross, God was able to bear the penalty for our sin so that it would not go unpaid, and He would not lose His holiness. The cross not only shows how much God loves us, but how seriously He takes sin. It is the greatest gift ever, and it would be a great tragedy if it were wasted.
ggcage 1 year ago
@ggcage He doesn't NEED to sacrifice himself to himself to save us from a sacrifice he demanded in the first place to keep being holy. There's no rules God is under, he's God, he's supposed to be the one who wrote them, he's the only one who can break them and matter of fact he does break a few as Jesus.
I don't know what kind of re-writing of the Bible you're working under but God isn't capable of losing anything, he's GOD. The authority, nobody takes anything away, you should know that!
sonic8005 1 year ago
@sonic8005 I never said that healing was "unholy." Jesus healed people. What I was saying was that death and disease are the consequences of mans' sin. Yes, germs cause disease, but the underlying cause; the reason the universe isnt in perfect harmony with man; is sin.
The problem is in what "omnipotent". The fact is that there are certain things that God cannot do. For example, God cannot lie or deny Himself. (Heb 6:18; 2 Tim 2:13).
Also, what was your original question about prayer?
ggcage 1 year ago
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@ggcage "If God were to just snap His fingers and heal everything then He would be supporting sin, and eternally discarding His holiness"
That's where the "unholy" part comes from. It's just a conclusion of the premises you introduce.
He didn't have to make it so ALL would be punished by the actions of two naked people who didn't know good or evil. The fact that they were naked should raise more questions as when they do get the knowledge, is it bad or good to be naked?
sonic8005 1 year ago
@ggcage Actually, as far as the christian Bible says, Satan was the one to give a proper 'mind' to humanity by giving Eve the fruit of the forbidden tree, the fruit of knowledge. God wanted to keep humanity ignorant. So, we are able to actually save lives thanks to Satan.
Of course, this is an idiotic story made by man an acient time ago, when he had nothing better to do.
tiolocmcgrock 1 year ago
@tiolocmcgrock Satan gave man the knowledge of how to commit evil, which has led to death, rather than saving lives. Everything that is truly good (including good knowledge) ultimately comes from God.
ggcage 1 year ago
@ggcage And how would Adam and Eve know that eating the fruit was a sin? They had no understanding of good and evil, how would you expect them to do the right thing? And if God was so omnipotent, all-mighty and know it all, then he KNEW that Eve and Adam would eat the fruit. He KNEW that Cain would kill Abel. He KNEW every bad thing that was going to happen. Is this a stupid game for him or what?
Also, on the bible appear more deaths commited by God, or influenced by God, than Satan.
tiolocmcgrock 1 year ago
@tiolocmcgrock
God told them not to eat of that tree in Gen. 2:16-17.
The problem is that if God never put the tree there then Adam and Eve would not truly have free will. Free will by definition requires that there be potential to do wrong. If there was no tree, then Adam and Eve would essentially be slaves to God, and that's not what God wanted. He wanted true love, not forced love.
ggcage 1 year ago
@ggcage If he did not want to have them as slaves (which God supports) and wanted 'true' love, why make ALL their descendants mortal, for a sin the PARENTS did? Why MURDER millions of people because they did not believe in him, commited 'sins', etc, and make them FEAR him? I don't think making your creations fear you will make them have true love for you. That's forced love.
And forbidding them to eat from the tree would make them slaves too, wouldn't it?
tiolocmcgrock 1 year ago
@tiolocmcgrock The King James word "fear" is different from the modern word "fear". Today's word "fear" means that one tries to avoid that which he fears, and God certainly doesn't want us to avoid Him. The real thing the Bible means is respect/revere.
Also, Adam, Eve, and all of us are not slaves. We chose to sin. Everyone has chosen to sin. Everyone needs Jesus. Christ's sacrifice is the most precious gift ever, and it'd be a great tragedy if it were wasted.
ggcage 1 year ago
@ggcage I don't care what interpretation the King James gave to fear. I know what fear means, and it has little to none relation to what you stated as "fear".
fear n.
a. A feeling of agitation and anxiety caused by the presence or imminence of danger.
Extreme reverence or awe, as toward a supreme power.
And how would Adam and Eve chose to sin when they did not know what 'sin' was?
I don't need Jesus, neither do you. And he didn't entirely sacrifice, since he 'resurrected' 3 days later.
tiolocmcgrock 1 year ago
@tiolocmcgrock I see, but the word fear has changed since King James, just like the word "gay" means something different today than it did 70 years ago. If you dont adjust for changing words, youre going to get the wrong meaning
God told them not to eat of the fruit, and they did it anyway. Weve all offended God & we all need Jesus. And yes, it was a sacrifice because on the cross, God bore the punishment of all the sins of all mankind. The actual visible crucifixion was the tip of the iceberg.
ggcage 1 year ago
@ggcage How would it be a sacrifice if Jesus revived anyways? And if God forgave all of our sins, then why do we still die? As far as I know, the bible states that human mortality is a punishment of the sin Adam and Eve commited, so, if God did actually forgive all of our sins and freed us from the punishment for commiting those sins, we would be inmortal.
tiolocmcgrock 1 year ago
@tiolocmcgrock
God, being an infinite being was able to pay for our sins as Jesus in a finite amount of time. Nevertheless, it was a sacrifice because there was suffering on God's part.
Even though Christ paid the penalty for our sins we still die because He has not returned. Sin has been defeated, but not completely, yet. People still must die because of their sins, but Christ has given us the chance to escape the eternal consequences of sin.
ggcage 1 year ago
@ggcage He's GOD, he's not under any obligation to make the tree, he's not under any obligation to do it that way. He's not under any obligation to do any of that. He could have given them the knowledge that eating from the tree was supposedly wrong.
In short, you literally believe that Eve eating a fruit from a tree that God supposedly had to put there, even though Eve had no knowledge that it would be wrong or bad... is exactly why we have children's hospitals
sonic8005 1 year ago
@ggcage ok i have a question for you will we have free will in heaven or will we be like robots doing only what God tells us
zipitup75 1 year ago
@zipitup75 We will have free will in heaven, but what we won't have is a sin nature. In other words, we won't have any desire for anything that is sinful, so there will still be no sin. Jesus Christ came not only to save us from the punishment of sin, but the sin itself, and that is exactly what will eventually happen, which is why Christ's sacrifice was such a precious gift and it is of all importance that it not be wasted.
ggcage 1 year ago
@ggcage thank you for your respectful reply, i understand what you are saying, but here is the problem, remember Adam and Eve were perfect and i'm sure God didnt make them with sin nature, but they still ended up sinning, also Lucifer was made perfect and was considered God's favorite but he too also sinned in a sinless environment and i dont think God put sin nature in Lucifer based on scriptures God made all things and God would never create inperfection so what changed Lucifer.
zipitup75 1 year ago
@zipitup75 Hmm. That's a very difficult question to answer. I can't say that I can answer it fully, but my idea would be that origin of sin was in free will. God created angels and people to love Him, which required a choice, and hence free will, which by definition means there is a potential to do wrong. If God created sentient beings that were incapable of sinning, than their entire purpose would be defeated.
ggcage 1 year ago
@ggcage "Satan gave man the knowledge of how to commit evil, which has led to death"
It's the knowledge of good and evil. It's not Satan doing it either. It's a snake. A serpent. God punishes the serpents, not Satan, to crawl on their bellies.
It did technically come from God, he made the tree supposedly. He just asked Adam not to eat from it. That's it. That's the story.
Adam ate off the fruit and that's why God is never going to heal people according to your faith.
sonic8005 1 year ago
Wars have been fought over religion. MILLIONS have died as a direct result of religion. You defend the most vicious and argued falsity of mankind. Religion has and always will impede progress. You simply cannot play make believe when you don't have the answer to something and expect to advance. Not having the answer is simply not having the answer. Why must we substitute not knowing with "well it must be god?" Why can't we just hold out for the truth?
jab0805 1 year ago
@jab0805 People twist perfectly good causes for their own selfish reasons all the time. Its been going on forever, it isn't limited to religion, and it doesn't change the cause. Jesus said "Love thy enemies" which even to this day is considered radically peaceful (and I consider it as evidence it's from God). You can't let the deeds of sinful men distract you for what God, through His amazing love, was willing to do for you.
ggcage 1 year ago
@ggcageI don't understand how anyone can claim that the christian god is loving?The diseases, children that suffer starvation, genocide, pain, murder, rape, torture, death. This god has to be the most sinister malevolent and evil god. If this god created everything, knows everything, and loves everyone, then why do this to us? Is this some test? Free will isn't free if everything is decided in advance. Fear will never persuade love. Only compliance to survive. Truth and reason sets us free.
jab0805 1 year ago
I see, but those things arent from God. Theyre from a lack of God. Because this world has been polluted by all our sin, it has been separated from God and His blessings. Since everything that is good ultimately comes from God, everything that is bad is the result of a lack of God. But God sent His Son to pay the penalty for our sin, so that we would not have to be completely separated from God for all eternity. It is the greatest gift ever given and it would be a great tragedy if it were wasted.
ggcage 1 year ago
@ggcage I have heard before that the lack of god is the reason for all the bad in the world. So how does one explain the good that happens to those who do not believe in a god? If the bad things are a result of not having a god in your life, then surely all good things must come from having a god in your life. Why then are non religious persons, or countries prosperous? How does this apply to a baby born with a debilitating disease, suffering a painful death without even knowing of a god?
jab0805 1 year ago
Part I
It's not really that people are punished for their individual sin, at least not in this life. What I meant was that humanity has polluted this world with its collective sin, and because of this God has separated Himself from the universe, and the laws of nature don't work quite like they should. The universe is not in perfect harmony with man. Bacteria, weather, and many other things can be harmful to him.
ggcage 1 year ago
Part II
You can argue that many people are innocent, but sadly, that's simply the way sin is. It hurts innocent people too. Innocent people get killed by drunk drivers. Innocent people get murdered, raped, robbed, ect. Sin is very harmful to God's creation and that is just one of the many reasons why it is so evil.
ggcage 1 year ago
@ggcage If you accept micro evolution than there's nothing preventing macro nor should we disregard the facts which lead to the conclusions of evolutionary biology.
If there was a god then they probably have no problem accepting evolution as it's true by any and all means discovered. Considering the stuff we've found in recent years it's almost as if a god would prefer we make these conclusions from the demonstrably true facts that we already have.
sonic8005 1 year ago
science is the study of gods creation, through accumulation of knowledge and logical interpretation of it
longfootbuddy 1 year ago
rejecting god because of science is not like rejecting water becasue of air. science and religion make contrary calims about reality. Science has disproven many of these as impossible.
spaceghost1313 1 year ago
@spaceghost1313 Yes, there are certain things in the Bible that are physically impossible, but what needs to realized is that if God could not do things that were physically impossible, then He really wouldn't be God. God by definition is not bound by the laws of nature.
ggcage 1 year ago
44% of the American people believe that the world was made in six days less than ten thousand years ago. Please don't try to tell us that Christianity is not at odds with science. Have you been to the creation museum? Animatronic dinosaurs walking with animatronic children.
By the way.... Einstein ACTUALLY said "The only miracle is that there ARE no miracles." He was very clear on his position of a universe that operated WITHOUT a prime mover.
jazzyazz 1 year ago
@jazzyazz "44% of the American people believe that the world was made in six days less than ten thousand years ago." that's interesting because Genesis doesn't say this lol
kristophershaun 1 year ago
@kristophershaun Psalms 90:4 gives an idea of how time is subject to God. . i for one definitely do not believe in a relatively recent creation of the universe i believe that things took time to be prepared for life and then also there was preparation just for us to be here. . Later in John 14:2 we find the King Yeshua states that He is leaving but He will return, notably He goes to "prepare" a place for us in Heaven. . so there was a preparing just for us to exist just as there is a preparation
kristophershaun 1 year ago
cont. for us to exist after we leave this earth and until then we are only "asleep".
kristophershaun 1 year ago
My father recently passed away and according to the Christian belief, because my father never came to know this Christ of yours, he is burning in an eternal hell fire. Do you believe that Kristopher? This is sickening and immoral to teach to children and just like all other religions and cults, you haven't got a shred of evidence. The bible even says he will be punished to his third or fourth generation for using the lords name in vain. JESUS FUCKING CHRIST! Your "god's" an ASSHOLE! lol
jazzyazz 1 year ago
@jazzyazz personally do i believe that? i believe in Psalms 44:21 "Shall not God search this out? for he knoweth the secrets of the heart." Shred of evidence? evidence of the Christ? be aware you commented on a GGCage video and has related videos to "shreds of evidence". you say He's a a-hole, but look how you speak to me.
kristophershaun 1 year ago
@jazzyazz Christians created god in their image & he is an ASSHOLE!
TABOOVSKNOWLEDGE 1 year ago
@TABOOVSKNOWLEDGE
Great point! Love it.
jazzyazz 1 year ago
@kristophershaun
There are lot's of references to this on the interweb. See for yourself.
jazzyazz 1 year ago
@jazzyazz doesn't make it true just because half of the people haven't done proper research
kristophershaun 1 year ago
If God created this all, why was he so wasteful? 99% of all of the species that have ever lived are now extinct. What kind of a plan is that?
Also, if God created everything, why did he decide that the best way to present himself to his people would be a dirty, bloody sacrifice in a remote and supersticious part of the middle east? Word of Christ didn't hit China for 1000 years! The story is hardly enough to keep the mind alive.
Like all other religions.... man made.
jazzyazz 1 year ago
@jazzyazz I think i covered that in saying that if Jesus had to leave to prepare a place for us in Heaven then why wouldn't it take time to prepare a place for us here on this earth? Chrisitianity cannot be man made as it has proof of it's messiah walking the earth.
kristophershaun 1 year ago