Bigmouth strikes again - Morrissey's Norway comments & militant vegans

[dariowestern]

"Violence towards animals is directly linked to war. It might sound ridiculous but if you look at it, the implications are there. When there is a complete lack of sensitivity where any form of life is concerned, there will always be war." - Morrissey (1985).

[chalicexox]

like crying irish

[Hossmatross]

By the way, I also eat meat, but chicken! I would never touch it. Production of chicken for food can never be defended. Or can you?

[Hossmatross]

Sorry man. You have nothing to say to me besides a need to express some undeveveloped thougts. The world dont need this view. Remember, freedom of speach is not an obligation to speek. Im Norwegian and Im in great pain after 22/7. Morrissey provoked a few of us. But he wa not wrong. He was just cynical enough to use the moment to focus on another grand issue that has been neglected for too long. Cynical yes. Wrong no.

[dariowestern]

@Hossmatross if everybody stopped exploiting animals starting from today, our world would be in much better shape within the space of a year. Cruelty should not be a choice, it should be a crime.

[Hossmatross]

@theantinatalist Agree

[kat9213]

not jim morrissey????

[GrouchoMarxist22]

@kat9213

Ahahaha.

[GrouchoMarxist22]

@theantinatalist

You there... get the fuck out of here.

[Hossmatross]

@GrouchoMarxist22 theantinatalist is right. And you GrouchoMarxist22 , you are just as ignorant as I feared. Your arguments are just utterly stupid and reveals fright to admit that you are not as important on earth as you would like to be. Eat your steak and stay blind, as you keep on going backwards in evolution. Bye Bye.

[IdaMiaDot]

Most people would be of the opinion that locking billions of 2-3 year old humans (who share the approximate intelligence of adult pigs) in cages and torturing them horrifically for years (where many are liable to die from the conditions or go insane) is worse than killing less than 100 people. If you believe that the suffering of pigs is greatly inferior to that of human children (i.e. if you are a human bigot), then I can see why factory farming would appear as such a diminished crime to you.

[IdaMiaDot]

Intelligence is irrelevant in determining the severity of suffering imposed upon an organism. It is no less evil to impose suffering on a person with an IQ of 60-80 (approximately the IQ of an educated great ape) and a person with an IQ of 100, for example. Provided the intensity of suffering inflicted is the same in both contexts, there is no logical way to distinguish between the suffering imposed upon a stupid pig and the suffering imposed upon a smart human.

[ramshaka]

@IdaMiaDot Intelligence isn't the issue, conscious awareness is. I'm not one to agree with factory farms either, but there seems to be this misnomer of how bad they are on the animals. Bad animal treatment equals bad product, so this is not usually the case. Frankly it boils down to a blue pill red pill question, and if some animals are even aware there is a pill to begin with. How cool would it be to be constantly provided with everything that you are aware you need?

[IdaMiaDot]

@ramshaka Mammals as developed as pigs can suffer just as much as humans. The most developed social organisms such as the other great apes and elephants can suffer like humans in every way... from severe depression at the loss of a loved one to physical pain. Also generally the companies just pay the fines associated with animal cruelty and environmental damage rather than reforming their methods. It's cheaper.

[ramshaka]

@IdaMiaDot As I said I'm not one to agree with Factory Farms, in general at least. But, if your case is purely on pigs, which I suppose is debatable to a degree. What do you then propose? You do realize that domesticated pigs have been a huge shock to every ecosystem they've ever been released into. Anyway, my position is still the same, I don't like a lot of management issues but I feel the process is necessary. Check the work of Temple Grandin. That'd be my ideal.

[IdaMiaDot]

@ramshaka Not just pigs. No animal capable of suffering should be factory farmed. The animals in the livestock sector are also artificially bred. They do not breed naturally, and will not be released into the wild. If you do not pay to artificially impregnate the females then there will be no animals to care for. Also the process is most certainly not necessary. It is hugely unproductive economically, and extremely damaging environmentally.

[ramshaka]

@IdaMiaDot Is, is, is, sure of it much, are you? The question is what do you do with the live ones? I'm aware they are largely (not always) breed artificially, but that does not mean they can't, and/or won't breed. Also, you talking about a potential extinction. Now while I would agree that the process is not being used to its potential, to say its not necessary is vastly ignorant. Lastly, environments are just as equally or more impacted by crop farming, due to land usage, fertilization ect

[IdaMiaDot]

@ramshaka "Lastly, environments are just as equally or more impacted by crop farming, due to land usage, fertilization ect"

This is a grossly inaccurate statement. I would advise reading the articles and studies published by the FAO and other environmental and food related organizations on this topic. Livestock's Long Shadow is probably the most famous study, although it is now slightly out-dated.

[ramshaka]

@IdaMiaDot No, I understand what your saying, and the studies, thats largely why I agree that a lot of mismanagement does exist (like the early cattle industry), but you can't account that to the process globally. Now, what I'm saying here is that its just not often mentioned just how much land must be used for crop farming, and not a lot of studies have been done to show that impact (displaced environment). But, just imagine if everyone became a vegetarian tomorrow, the impact that would have.

[ramshaka]

@IdaMiaDot I don't know if your aware of the work of Temple Grandin, but if not, you should really look into it. Frankly, shes the closest thing to an animal interpreter the world has ever known.  And Her work to improve, the cattle industry is absolutely incalculable. Also, she gives a pretty damn good argument for what animals actually think like, and of.

[IdaMiaDot]

@ramshaka The process wouldn't end immediately. The number of animals in the livestock sector would gradually decrease as fewer and fewer people pay to breed them. If for some reason humans wanted to protect a species it could be done on a small scale, but I personally see no reason to do this.

[GrouchoMarxist22]

@apumpkinful

"I agree, the olso killer should have killed the people as quickly and painless as possible to ensure quality of life until their death."

Wow... your comments are even worse than what Morrissey said.

[GrouchoMarxist22]

@apumpkinful

Like I said, people have been eating animals since the dawn of time.. and I agree that animals should be kept in good conditions and at least to have a quality of life. If humans were eating an endangered species then I could understand the urgent need for vegetarianism.. and I still support those that do live that lifestyle.

[Tazz77]

Not surprising that some animal rights idiot like Morrisey would make a callouse comment like that. They value animals over people.

[GrouchoMarxist22]

@Tazz77

Indeed... such a stupid insensitive comment.

[TheLifthrasir]

I hope he never sets foot on Norwegian soil, that's all I can say really. Everyone I know has pretty much said the same, Norwegian or not.

He's shown he's a callous ideologue who belittled the deaths of innocent people. Fuck Morrissey and every idiot defending these comments.

-Juuso

[GrouchoMarxist22]

@TheLifthrasir

Oh I really don't think he would ever be allowed to play in Norway again or Scandinavia for that matter. His, err, goose is cooked.

[JamieAndLTTB]

Oh fuck you all, you Morrissey haters. Can't you see what Morrissey is trying to say? How come we all condemn the killing of people yet the murder of animals is completely left out? We should be condemning both the murder of humans and animals.

[GrouchoMarxist22]

@JamieAndLTTB

why would he bring it up on stage and also compare it? Why not pay respect to those killed in tragically awful circumstances and then at a separate stage make your point about McDonalds et al?

[squalidshake]

the problem is not on what he said its that he brought it up at the wrong time. He made a connection between both animal killing and the Norway incident which is completely insensitive to the matter. If he wants to bring up the matter about animal slaughter then bring it up without the Norway incident. btw im a vegetarian.

[GrouchoMarxist22]

@squalidshake

Yes, and why would he bring it up on stage and also compare it? Why not pay respect to those killed in tragically awful circumstances and then at a separate stage make your point about McDonalds et al?

[BuddahUK]

Agree. I am tired of Morrissey's attention seeking. I loved the Smiths but I haven't cared for anything he's done for ten years and these kind of comments just alienated me even more. Still think you're über cute btw x

[GrouchoMarxist22]

@BuddahUK

Yeah, I mean I haven't even bought any of his recent albums... I've been to a few of his solo concerts.. but at the last one a couple of months back there was only a handful of Smiths tracks... which is what I go and see him for! And thanks!

[thestreetsempty]

How many animals had to suffer for your hair to look so dumb?

[GrouchoMarxist22]

@thestreetsempty

None at all! It's the natural 'dumb hair' look with all organic ingredients! :D

[Nepjoe]

The holocaust is nothing compared to what homo sapiens do to other animals. Humans deserve to dieeee!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[skegpit]

@Nepjoe Obvious troll sucks dick.

[GrouchoMarxist22]

@Nepjoe

Troll harder.

[FablesJonny]

BOLLOCKS!

[yooanoozarrmay]

good vid BTW I've calmed down now. 

[GrouchoMarxist22]

@yooanoozarrmay

Thanks very much.

[yooanoozarrmay]

Morrissey: Killing a stag is like killing a child

Guess who isn't a parent? and never will be. THANK GOD

[yooanoozarrmay]

This is one of the saddest things that has ever happened in Europe, and this lilly-livered, carrot sucking excuse for a human being feels the need to start comparing it with a bunch of chickens and cows. I feel sorry for him in a way.

[christyfanderson]

I don't think he's militant. I think he's speaking what he feels. Anything against the mainstream is considered radical. His remarks were insensitive and ill timed which is the only problem I have with it. I do believe animal life is just as precious as human life (of course humans are animals).

[yooanoozarrmay]

But what point is there in peace and compassion if you don't have it for your fellow human beings? More than 80 innocent kids died out there last week. I think his comments were a disgrace. I bet when he made his money he couldn't give a shit who was buying his records. Meat is murder my fucking ass.

[GrouchoMarxist22]

@yooanoozarrmay

Exactly.

[GoodCopBadCop91]

Really don't understand the heavy criticism of Morrissey over these comments. He speaks the truth and he is doing his bit to prevent the suffering of millions of animals everyday. Respect to Morrissey for siding for peace and compassion and firmly against cruelty and brutality.

[GrouchoMarxist22]

@GoodCopBadCop91

People have been eating animals since the dawn of time.. and I agree that animals should be kept in good conditions and at least to have a quality of life. If humans were eating an endangered species then I could understand the urgent need for vegetarianism.. and I still support those that do live that lifestyle. But I cannot respect someone that claims the tragic murder of so many young lives is comparable to even controlled killing of animals for food.

[AurelioErik]

If he really believes what he believes then that is what he says.. Just like he anti-abortionists really believe abortion is actually murder, then it makes sense for them to bomb abortion clinics. Just like it would make sense for someone to bomb a house that day in and day out killed school age children.. So it must be stopped. In the case of Morrissey, he thinks animals lives are the same as humans. And so McDonalds is like a concentration camp to him, and he just said what he thinks.

[GrouchoMarxist22]

@AurelioErik

Abortion is not murder.. only fundamentalist religious zealots believe that this is the case. I believe in pro-choice.

[TheKawadaKick]

who. cares?

[LuciferWitch666]

That is,very sad,he would say,something like that!

You would think,he would know better!I guess he was dropped on his head,what happened in Norway is very sad!

[GrouchoMarxist22]

@LuciferWitch666

It was very sad and you're right, he should know better.

[LuciferWitch666]

@GrouchoMarxist22 Yes he should!

[GrouchoMarxist22]

@LuciferWitch666

It must be the lack of iron in his bloodstream from not eating red meat that's affecting his oxygen flow!

[LuciferWitch666]

@GrouchoMarxist22 Lmao i agree with,what you said!Lol i guess if, he got hurt, i should tell him,Subway is much wrost than you lol!

[raybanfandom]

However, as true as the words Morrissey said, they should not be uttered. If you believe it, you should not say it because people will not think about the truth of your words and will just focus on the massacre, what is recent and what happened to humans. There are massacres of indigenous peoples by corporations in remote parts of the world, almost monthly, yet the Norway massacre makes the news. I believe humans should have equal rights, regardless of race. Animals have rights too... oh well.

[raybanfandom]

The Norway massacre was horrible in so many ways, yet it could of not of been prevented. One man, in Norway, decided to kill em all. He planned it out well and even got a cop uniform. What McDonald's and KFC do on a daily basis was and continues to be horrible in many ways, even more because it can be prevented. It takes millions of people worldwide to operate that killing machine, the sellers, middlemen, and the buyers. Millions of humans die a year because of their love for profit and murder.

[GrouchoMarxist22]

@raybanfandom

This might actually be the most sensible comment on this page... thanks for your contribution.

[dirkbogarde44]

His comment may have a validity of sense but his timing is atrocious. This time he really should have kept his mouth shut.

[GrouchoMarxist22]

@dirkbogarde44

This is Morrissey... I'm beginning to think that he goes out of his way to court controversy and thinks "to hell with the consequences."

[Sarrac90]

What he stands for is out of my way - but what he said is terrible.

[GrouchoMarxist22]

@Sarrac90

Indeed.  And so soon after this tragedy too.

[calypsotwenty]

Morrisey just believes that animals have the same rights as humans. He's wrong, but that's what he believes. There's no hatred in that

[ThePariahLivesOn]

I don't think people get more Right wing as they get older, I think every generation gets abit more left wing than the last one because the immigrants that their parents had a problem with are just a fact of life to them

[GrouchoMarxist22]

@ThePariahLivesOn

You'd think that would be the case.. but what about their parents? Parents have such a strong influence in their children.. and if they are weak-willed then they would allow themselves to follow what their parents teach them. You only need to look at those people that are being forced to believe certain things rather than being encouraged to find out information/opinions of their own accord!

[abbynormal0ne]

I cannot believe he actually said that at all. How sad.

[GrouchoMarxist22]

@abbynormal0ne

Let's face it, his name even rhymes with 'controversy'.

[abbynormal0ne]

@GrouchoMarxist22 Do you think it's just his way of trying to stay relevant and newsworthy?

[GrouchoMarxist22]

@abbynormal0ne

Considering that he's already called the Chinese a "sub-species" and banned a music festival in Belgium from selling meat while he was playing within the last twelve months... he's going the wrong way about trying to stay in the news.

[abbynormal0ne]

@GrouchoMarxist22 I guess he could be part of the ridiculous mantra, "Bad press is still good press."