How did Christianity survive when the early church was persecuted? Seriously?! Why die for a lie?! Why write that it was a woman who first saw the risen Christ when women in that time and culture were reguarded as nothing? Why not just say it was a man who saw him...make it more convincing? Oh that's right because God exists! And your "new stuff"? Lies. Lies that I used to believe. I wasn't raised with old religious views but I found that Jesus worked out better for me. :)
@TheHydrogen4 Really?! The future of humanity?! Oh my word, how have we survived this long? How on earth did we survive 2000 yrs believing in Jesus Christ (who preached love and unity btw) and how did the Jews survive 4000 yrs before that believing those "old religious views"?! How did the Jewish faith survive at all when all logic tells us that when a people are spread out the way the Jews were that they assimilated into whichever culture they entered?
ummm idk if anyone else noticed...but that guy that sits there only tells kirk and ray to hurry up...not the other peopleee.......an by the way... god is real!!!! u want to ask how i know..well like kirk said he changed my heart....the reason y people dont know god is real is because they never really give him a chance! i love god and i am so thankful for what he has done for mee....
@shanming716 Because the future of humanity depends on it. Old religious views only shut the mind and don't let the new stuff to get in. Regardless if there is or if there isn't a God, old religious views have always been used as an excuse to go to war. Although technology has been use to take the advantage in the wars, it has never been the excuse to go to it. Is always political or religious. And I am aware of the oil war, but is a hidden political agenda justified with religion.
@ASexyChef Yes I went to kindergarten and learned all about dinosaurs and how they lived millions of years ago. I was indoctrinated with the "proof" of evolution through high school and believed it until a few years ago. Then I became a Christian. So to say that I am ignorant and uneducated on evolution, darwinism, or anything in general is in fact ignorant of you.
In this day and age, to disbelieve in Evolution, is the same as to think the world is flat today. Or that the earth is the center of the world, or that world is 6,000 years old. All these are so ignorant to think, science has nothing to do, with Religion, just because you small close-minded interpretation do not allow you to accept science, well thats the reason why christians used to think the world was flat, wake up and stop fighting facts, and stop being stupid.
@ASexyChef well your argument would have a great point with the exception of one thing. Darwin himself. as he was writing his theory of evolution was that if his theory wasn't proved in 100 years....then it should be left alone. i wanted to say debunked but i'm not sure if that's correct. thanks for checking out this post :)
Kent Hovind is a great debator for the side of creation! In all honesty, I love Kirk and Ray and respect what they do-they get people to think and face things like eternity-but seriously, my husband could have debated they're point way better than they did!
@shanming716 Kent Hovid is a ignoramus, he is in jail, and he is the worst debater I have ever seen. You do not have to be an atheist to believe in Evolution, but you do have to be ignorant to not. 500 years ago, the christian world denounce the theory that the earth goes around the sun. Today that is still a scientific theory, just like gravity is a theory, scientific theories are better than facts, they are supported by many facts.
except when it comes to outer space, it disproves so many theory laws, like planets, moons, stars rotating backwards, space itself destroys big bang theory
@ASexyChef That's ironic,you believe in evolution with absolutely NO evidence.Here's afun fact for you,the Moon is moving away from the Earth at a rate of 4cm per year,do you know where the moon would be 5 billion years ago?Colliding with Earth and disappearing in space ie.NO LIFE DEVELOPEMENT...No slime NO single cell NO anything!!!!!Wake up stop believing fairy tales.
@jimmmmybrady Scientific Theories are better than facts because many facts make up a theory, and there is not theory with more proof than Evolution, here is a fact for you, DNA has proved Evolution the books is closed.. Stop preaching the world is flat, just because your read the bible like a bronze aged idiot doesn't mean you have to give all the others who read it such a bad name. Seriously, you are the same as those 100 years after Galleo who still claimed it was flat..
@ASexyChef Ironicly,the Jews ALREADY knew the Earth wasn't flat BECAUSE the Bible says its a sphere.DNA does NOT prove evolution,it proves common ancestry,that's all.
@jimmmmybrady If the Jews already knew, than why was the church so against it being round and denied it until we sailed around it... Its great I guess the Jews knew something the catholic church clearly could not read, because there is not corner of the world than huh... Yes sorry DNA proved beyond a doubt evolution, its sad that you try to deny something because you will force educated people to reject the bible than, if you teach your kids evolution cant be, and they grasp it is...
@ASexyChef Only the ORIGINAL church was Jews.The Catholics perverted the message of God.For instance just about zero Christians know that in the Hebrew language the word ALAH means CURSE.So in ZECHARIAH 5 where it warns of an ALAH(curse)spreading over the land very few know that it was a warning about Mohammads cult,Islam.
If you watched all the episodes, when the guy from rational response comes up for the first time, he speaks about how creation was not intelligent because snakes evolved from having legs. How would they have even known that snakes had legs back when the bible was written? Gen 3:14 -God Cursed the serpent. So the guy from rational response proved a verse in the bible to be true. thanks dude
Kirk and Ray sure flee the debate question immediately, so far not an ounce of proof or science from them. Ray babbles and Kirk falls back on the old scare routines.
its interesting how they take this so called "proof" of god and somehow can twist that to mean the judeo christian god of abraham. that alone disproves their argument.
All atheists can do, all 10 of them left in the world because most everyone on earth believes in God, is hate God and call names in response to being told the message of the Gospel. It scares them to death they will have to answer to God for how they lived. And they should be scared.
@HermannTheGreat so... fear is a good reason to believe in something? Sounds like manipulation to me - and as an agnostic, the tactics used in evangelism make me more angry than do they scare me. I am not a liar because I have told a few lies... most people would agree that a liar is a person who habitually lies. I am not a thief because I stole nail polish as a little girl... I would have to be stealing habitually. No one would consider me a thief today just because of that one incident.
@HermannTheGreat The thought of yahweh being real scares me because what kind of monster makes eternal torture contingent on blind faith? Why make it a fucking guessing game? How bout give everyone the same message in their head all at once? But nope guess right and believe shit that makes no sense or burn forever. Its like russian roulette. What a horrible thing. It gives me great comfort theres no evidence more the monster in the sky and the logic, compassion and equality govern our lives
@HermannTheGreat Actually atheism is on the rise especially among young people. In the United States there is only about a 7% population of atheists but when you look at that in terms of population size that's more atheists than the most atheistic Scandinavian countries combined. Atheists are not scared of God because we do not believe in God. Similarly I'm sure that you are not afraid of Buddha or Shiva (though I'm sure you're afraid of their followers as some atheists are afraid of Christians.
@HermannTheGreat And I say "afraid" not because they have answers that we don't and are going to get into Heaven. We do not believe in God and we do not believe in Heaven. Similarly you do not believe in Valhalla nor Nirvana nor reincarnation. I say afraid because the Christian doctrine is based on hate and many Christians have done horrible things both in the past and present because of their faith. Like Communism and Nazism it's a bad idea when someone murders because of a book.
They should have mentioned the complexity of the cell. To think this happened by accident would require a lobotomy.Protein Synthesis ,Reproduction this is very fascinating stuff and we still have a lot to learn about it. To say these things just happened is not intelligent or tells me two things about the individual, number one they have a reason not to want to believe in a God 2. They are ignorant about the workings of biology and physics.
@knight996 Yeah, it didn't happen by accident. The laws of biochemistry are very convenient for the formation and emergence of complex organic macromolecules. The source of those laws is mysterious and seems pretty mystical. Maybe God made those laws, whatever that means. But the natural process itself seems to be able to produce life in theory, even if we haven't shown exactly how it happened today.
@knight996 Science does not believe that anything "just" happened. There is no evidence whatsoever that cells just materialized out of thin air as they are now and have existed like that for millions of years. Christians however believe that God said a sentence and that cells just materialized out of thin air and have existed like that for thousands of years. Cells evolved and there is physical evidence of this which is reproducible. You however have no evidence to your claim that God did it.
@knight996 Time is a fluid construct of which something needs to perceive it for it to exist. Man's concept of time changes frequently and people are often unable to keep accurate track of time (in the clock sense) on their own. When faced with a fall, for instance, the brain will "slow down" time. When you are waiting for something time can also seem to slow even though it is not.
@knight996 Things like weeks and months are purely a human construct created to maintain order in an only semi-reliable natural time system such as the day and seasons.
You'll have to be more specific on what you mean by "space". Space as in the area an object takes in relation to its surroundings or space as in the cosmos?
Matter was created when photons, heated to very high temperatures created the basic elements. Everything on Earth and outside it is made of atoms which are made of smaller...
@knight996 things still. In a sense no one really exists as we see them but are the amalgamation of many parts. This can be seen in single celled organisms which are only made of a few parts and animals such as human beings who are made of almost too many parts to count.
Energy is created by many things so you'll have to be more specific. Are you talking energy like electricity or force or light?
@knight996 Energy such as radiation and lasers are created by photons, moving very quickly, which vibrate along a "straight" path from one source to another. When the vibrations are long you get warmer colors (in terms of visible light) and things like radio, microwaves and infrared. When the vibrations are smaller and are more between peaks you get things like x-rays, ultra violet light, and gamma radiation.
Please note that I am not a scientist and this is just my basic understanding of sciene
I love how an ostrich sticks it's head in the sand and things with it's own logic, "If I can't see them, they can't see me." makes sense to that bird. But we can still see it!
Y'know these particular athiest guys were not too bright. They decided to do this debate. Comfort doesn't deserve a refute to his argument. That validates him. His 'vision' doesn't rate a critique. It's like me challenging a cat to multiplication tables. It's a silly concept...why would I consider it even? Challenging a 2week old baby makes vastly more sense but still nutty. Challenging Ray is like challenging the cat. A pointless win. This is why Dawkins refuses. Ray is mental.
@jerykk1 They aren't doing it to try and convince Ray and Kirk to switch sides, they are doing it for the people in the audience who might be trying to make a decision or have not completely made their minds up. That's true for any debate not just a religious one.
Here At Now You See TV We do Christian Video Testimonies of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ and how people have come to find him as real in their life. If you could checkout our videos, leave us some feedback, and subscribe to our channel we would greatly appreciate it, or at least stop by and say hi. Also if you have a testimony of How the Lord has changed your life personally we would love to hear it.
It's so obnoxious when these apologists claim to be atheist in the past so they can look down their noses and say "Oh, I used to be like you, but then I opened my heart and blah blah..."
If they really used to be atheist then they would be able to reflect even basic atheistic arguments and rationality, but they cannot. Kirk is so full of shit and his "I used to be an atheist" spiel isn't winning brownie points with any thinking person.
@ChaseKittens Your really full of it, he used to be an atheist....so what? why are you responding to that comment. Responding to it is useless, just like trying to explain evolution, it never happend so why try to expalin it to people.
@ChaseKittens At least they aren't trying to be reformed witches anymore. That got old fast when they didn't know basic information or even correct pronunciation for holidays and deities. It's tricky now though because there isn't a dogma where they could screw up. Many Christians identify atheism with selfishness though (which is terribly ironic) so it's easy to know they're lying when they start their "on top of the world" speech.
@ChaseKittens It's a common tactic amongst them. You'll find evidence of this in people like Carol Kornacky (probably butchering her name) or in the documentary Hell House where the former claimed to be a witch and the latter claimed to have been in the "rave" scene. None of them exhibit even basic knowledge of the things they are condemning because, obviously, they never were part of it. When you confront them with that though they'll say there were on "another level" as if they're a secret.
There was once a thug that went out and wanted to sell drugs and he love to see people get hurt. But he heard a sermon from a precher and he got saved and now this thug dosnt want to hurt people he just wants to help and love people..because he feel's so diffrent and that there was something in him that just hated his old self..and he became so diffrent.
To antheist they say there is no god..if there was anatheist world it would be dull!!
@dannybammy If this person received counseling instead of what was most likely jailhouse preaching then they would have a sound mental state instead of repressed psychological problems and a new found appreciation for Jesus which, as Ray mentioned, absolves him of his crimes (this is why 99.8% of the American prison population is religious 80% of them being Christian).
I think that he finished the show because what Ray and Kirk was saying was speaking to his conscience and he did not want to hear anymore. Kirk had more time that Kirk, but that is okay, of course.
@lThellRockl The reason atheists are atheists is because you cannot prove God exists any more than we can. That's the point. You can say you "feel him in your heart" or whatever but that is not proof that's a feeling. I can get upset at my sister for taking the last soda but if I didn't see her do it there's no evidence she did. I'd have to rely on second hand information that could be old, biased, or a straight up fabrication. Such is the case of religion.
Seriously though. FIVE $*@king minutes of personal testimony is not a valid argument!! You going to tell us about the time you saw a ghost in the haunted mansion next?
Kirk: "I was a popular child actor and made lots of money and everyone loved me and I felt special."
Me: I was a MacGyver fan...
Kirk: "Then my show got cancelled and I didn't feel special anymore."
Me: So?
Kirk "So I was driving in my fancy car and realized that I could feel special again if I allowed myself the delusion that an all powerful God loved me and made me special."
so basically what kirk said here is that when he was an atheist he was a bad one at it, he didnt know shit ,he just did it because of what others told him and not because of his own knowledge and experience and research about the subject, in one video he says he didnt even read the bible when he was atheist, so no wonder he became a believer after reading it , and also what hes stating here is that th reason why you become a believer is bceause of fear of hell, pathetic
Cameron's Fail: Did not present any arguments for his premise. Appealed once again to emotions. This was more like a testimonial instead of a argument. Sets up a false dichotomy with his arguments.
All i see in this debate is 4 people who have no idea of what they are talking about. Just a continuation of a false dichotomy.
@MrBabs12345 Not to be the devil's advocate (poor choice of words I know) here but there are some really shitty science teachers such as the ones who are teaching religion in lieu of actual scientific thinking to make it seem like God is more valid than he is. Granted they are more preacher than teacher but the fact remains that, just like history and literature, there are some really shitty teachers out there who are not doing what their position requires of them.
Where are the wise? Where is the teacher of the law? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe.
@funndamentalist So you believe that the earth is six parts land and one part water? You believe that the sun is a disk and that the earth is flat and that unicorns exist? Those are all things that your God has said in the Bible so it must mean he knows better than humans right?
wow....kirk opens up with a logical fallacy first sentence.... Patronizing fallacy (I use to think like that, in an attempt to falsely imply superiority)...secondly kirk was what? 14 ? when he was atheist? Ya I'm sure he did some deep philisophical thinking then.
...and like any true psychopath or sociopath they don't see their OWN wrongdoing and illness and assume everyone else is as empty and dangerous as they are...since they needed this cockamamie nonsense they're SURE you must need it to.
Under christianity you can murder, molest kids and women, lie, steal and cheat but as long as you believe in the cartoon character known as "god" you'll be forgiven...so "god" is a ravenous attention whore and christians are just cowards.
It's a system for morally corrupt sociopaths because they simply are too disturbed to figure out SIMPLE right from wrong without a guide-book...It's PATHETIC!!!!!! christianity is PATHETIC!!
then the rapist asked again "What about the girl I raped?", GOD answered:" Don't worry about her, I used HER to test you, physically you failed, but because you believe in ME....you PASSED....you may go to heaven to join the Hitler..he is waiting for you..because when the last moment before he died, he accepted me and prayed to me...come on...you brother is waiting for you...just go and have fun with him in my KINGDOM...."
The moral of the GOD and the Bible--->FUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
We all need forgiveness. It's our human way. If you have never felt guilty, you're either doing something really right, or you just don't care about anyone but yourself. And, when I ask God for forgiveness, I'm not avoiding anything. I tell God, this is what I did, please forgive me. It's just like going to your parent, or friend and saying hey, I lied to you and I'm sorry. Will you please forgive me? If anything, it is more noble than not confessing and asking forgiveness.
But why do you have to pray or ask for forgiveness at all? Surely if God knows all etc.., then surely he knows whether you really are sorry before you've even opened your mouth. If God is as powerful as you say he is, then perhaps he grants forgiveness before you even know you've done something wrong.
Oh, and how can you preach forgiveness, when right since the it's beginning, christianity has been vengeful, its also full of inconsistencies, paradox and hypocrisies.
Christianity is the ONLY religion that offers FORGIVENESS! Why would anyone not want that? I have done research on the fastest growing religion of Islam. There is NOT one single other religion that can GUARANTEE where you go. The Bible is the only book that gives us that! And Christianity is the ONLY religion that offers forgiveness.
a guy raped a girl one day, he felt guilty ,he went to the GOD to ask for forgiveness, he deserved,
then he raped again..he went again, he was forgiven again repeatedly....until he asked the GOD why every time I came with guilty, and I left with forgiveness..GOD said:Bible tell you that, as long as you believe in ME....you are saved (No need to do any good deeds,first YOU HAVE TO BELIEVE IN ME..then when you die you will go to heaven."
Harry Potter is documented? Come on dude, in a fictional book. Sarcasm is annoying. Since you know so much about what the world accepts as history, I wanted to know what and who defines whether or not something is historically accurate?
you just said that he was documented. Poorly or not, he was documented so that argument is over. What kills me is the world accepts the Bible as a historical document. You want to know where Jesus is documented? Open the Bible. While you're there read it with an open mind and you might just surprise yourself.
I believe Kirk Cameron was seriously looking for the truth, but his search for truth was limited by very narrow paramaters from the beginning. The christianity that he believes to be absolute truth just happened to fit into those limited paramaters so he jumped into that and now his paramaters are closed off to any other possibilities. People don't only "see what they want to see" but they see what they've been conditioned to see and what they believe. "Seek and ye shall find".
Jesus that may or may not have existed? Jesus has already been proven by SCIENCE to be a historical figure and that comes from records from many scientific sources and history books. Jesus existed like Gandhi existed, there is no question of that.
Really? What SCIENTIFIC process proves that? You christians love to run your mouths, but you get exposed when your feet is put to the fire and are asked to provide PROOF!
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Insecure!!!???, are you serious?, no! thik about all the wonders of he human body. it can heal itelf, it can regulate its own temperature, we grow a different kind of hair on our eyebrows than do on our arm, we grow a second set of teeth for when we leave baby hood two child hood, the human eye can identify over 3.000.000(three million!) different shades of every colour and can change size to let more light in or out and we can see inthe dark!!!!. yeah like that would just go to waste. whatever
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I mean come on!, what factors?!, the fact that spirituality exists!, its our way of communicating with the "other side"!, if deathy was "it!" there would be no reason for it that is how your know that can't be "it!".
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really with the right camera and equipment you can see the particles tht are the "soul", and the soul is just another way of sayin spirit or ghost and it looks like the shape of that person only transperent and their very quick, theres a film called "white noise" where guys go into old buildings with audio equipment and record "ghost conversations". very interesting. take a look.
And the answer to Pascal's Wager is so simple. Basically, which is more intrinsically moral? Someone who lived a "moral" life because they feared divine retribution and wanted eternal reward, or someone who lived a life of charity, kindness and good deeds because it was the right thing to do, and not because they had any expectation of some sort of omnipotent cosmic arbiter. The answer seems very obvious to me.
Seriously, is this their idea of a "scientific debate"? I mean, come on, they're deluded fairytale-loving nimrods, but at least they should realize that stupid personal anecdote does not equal "science". Can you imagine if the same standard applied to actual science? "Sir, how do you know that this nuclear generator will work?" "Well, I pulled over to the side of the road and prayed on my way to work, and god spoke to me and told me it would.".
owning ones self is only a projection from the perspective of the beholder. Religious jargon will not impress someone, if they do not subscribe to the religion. Atheists have no answers at all, though they pretend to. many sheeple out there...are you just another sheeple laughing at another sheeple?
You're telling me that the free will I perceive that I have is projected upon me by some enormous, invisible "beholder"? There is no evidence for that claim. Science offers real answers to how we got here, and how the world around us works.
Science has given us everything you god gave us nothing, only a false sence of security. Just go live under a rock "istheretruth" because you don't diserve the luxury of science.
what? are you responding to something that I said, or are you projecting some idea onto me....that you have instead drawn from your own stereotypes? Can you please explain just what the fuck you are talking about?
This debate, both sides included, consists of the most superficial arguments. Keep in mind that neither argument can be fully proven; most scientists will tell you that the further they discover, the weirder and more complex it gets. This debate is ancient, and if you really want to look into it read into it: feurbach, democritus, plato. etc. This program just draws on their arguments, but with less clarity.
I'll tell you what, for as much BS as they're spewing, they're much better speakers than the RR team. Invest in some presence RR team, it'll make you connect better with the people who wouldn't otherwise agree. That being said; I heard just about zero evidence for the existance of God. All he said was a personal experience -- no evidence. And then he invokes Pascals Wager yet again! It's blatant fear mongering, believe In Him Or He'll send you To hell. All the important words are capitalized.
Kirk Cameron's speech sounds so fucking rehearsed, it's unbelievable. He must give the exact same speech at every public appearance, because this sounds more like a god damned testimonial rather than an explanation of god's existence. Why did I expect more from these people?
believing in science does not require faith, believing in god does. Clearly you did not ever think the way they think. Not to mention, believe in god because of the fear of the possibility of god NOT existing, is shallow and meaningless. Just as being good for the sole purpose of going to heaven is shallow and meaningless. He essentially argues NOTHING in this entire segment.
So, Kirk, if I start worrying about and obsessing over the fact that I will die.... then I will conclude that there is a god? Sounds like, if I delude myself into thinking that there might be an after life when I start thinking about death, I will become so fearful and obsessed with death that I will accept the Western religion- Christianity because it is the most accessible religion in the United States. That is using your emotions versus your noodle.
The Atheist duo isn't that good at debating and still they kick the shit out of these guys. But i'd really like to see Dawkins or Hitchens debate these half-wits. It would be a complete massacre.
If you seek him you will find him? That's not proof of anything and it doesn't mean anything. Plus you forget about the many other religions that say you find god through different means. You simply have a christian bias.
He comes to decieve many and he doesnt mind disguising himself as thor,venus,zeus or marshans, or any other false god for that matter just as long as he can keep you from finding the true God of the bible he'l do whatever it takes.
2 corinthians 11v14 says this.
And no wonder for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light.
Let me get this straight. All gods are satan except for the trinity? HAH! The dumb deluded religions of the world. The bible is correct and every other religion is wrong. I see now. I am enlightened. Thank you ogiaag5m, you are the smartest and least deluded bigot I've met today. (:
How do you know god isn't actually the one decieving you through the bible, and satan is worthy of yor praise? Oh wait, you don't; because of the lack of evidence necessary for faith, it is completely arbitrary, and any dispute between two faith based sides is basically a dick measuring contest.
People all over the world and throughout history have had identical experiences with thier gods, nothing makes yours special. In ancient Athens, people "experienced" Zeus, in Rome, Apollo, in Arabia, Allah, in India, Vishnu, in Denmark, Thor; why do you think your special. Even I have had similar experiences with nature and my own thought, but I don't abandon rational thinking for a delusion.
How do you know what you are saying is true? Do you know anything about the about what you wrote or are you parroting Dawkins? Based upon your other comment you seem to believe what is true in your experience is true of everyone elses,Is that what you believe?
You say I have not and yet you don't know me... I must ask again, How do you know what you are saying is true about me? What evidence do you find the most convincing in your world view?
"I know who my mother is for example and no one could pose as her cos i know her so well."
Listen, I'm sorry but that's just not true. With training someone could theoretcally pose as her. At some point we may even have robots that can do the same thing through programming. You are imagining things where there are none, and you fail to recognize the fallability of your mind and senses.
Lucifer didnt masquerade as anything, he started out as an angel, get your own mythology right....
Oh, and how do you know your god isnt actually Satan in disguise? What better way to hide in plain sight than pretend to be a god, deman worship, conduct holy wars, etc...explains a lot...only the gnostics knew that, but then, "god" had all them killed, didnt he?
Many people all over the world proffess to be Christians but i can assure you they are NOT.
Jesus said many shall even say to him on that day Didnt we do this and that but he shall say to them depart from me i never KNEW YOU.
Once you have been born again and filled with the spirit of God you can never deny that fact so i would have to lovingly but truthfully submit to you that you were never a TRUE christian in the first place you just thought you were.
What buisness is it of mine to judge those outside the church?Are you not to judge those inside the church.
God will judge those outside.
If you read on Jesus said you will know a tree by its fruit.
The bible must be read in context with the indwelling of Gods spirit in you to understand it.
Christians are in many different denominations but we primaraly follow Jesus though not all do cos there is a difference between christianity and religion.
you still have blatently disregarded jesus's commandments. ergo- you don't follow jesus (or more accurately the character of jesus as written in the bible myth).
i don't need to know what the bible says to spot someone who is judging another. it's a plus that i do know and understand the bible and judging is one of the greatest offenses one can perform.
of course, the delusion that you think you have some special understanding of the man made bible blinds you to your arrogance and conceit.
Yes there is something else you can't even understand context or literature. Your probably right about the sermon.He probably don't expect to change a fool from his folly but to call Gods elect to repentance. Great audience to do so. But if your are intelligent enough to understand you should listen to some presuppositional apologetics. The problem debating MOST atheist is they are too ignorant or dishonest to understand the argument.
How did Christianity survive when the early church was persecuted? Seriously?! Why die for a lie?! Why write that it was a woman who first saw the risen Christ when women in that time and culture were reguarded as nothing? Why not just say it was a man who saw him...make it more convincing? Oh that's right because God exists! And your "new stuff"? Lies. Lies that I used to believe. I wasn't raised with old religious views but I found that Jesus worked out better for me. :)
shanming716 3 months ago
@TheHydrogen4 Really?! The future of humanity?! Oh my word, how have we survived this long? How on earth did we survive 2000 yrs believing in Jesus Christ (who preached love and unity btw) and how did the Jews survive 4000 yrs before that believing those "old religious views"?! How did the Jewish faith survive at all when all logic tells us that when a people are spread out the way the Jews were that they assimilated into whichever culture they entered?
shanming716 3 months ago
ummm idk if anyone else noticed...but that guy that sits there only tells kirk and ray to hurry up...not the other peopleee.......an by the way... god is real!!!! u want to ask how i know..well like kirk said he changed my heart....the reason y people dont know god is real is because they never really give him a chance! i love god and i am so thankful for what he has done for mee....
catzNpools 3 months ago
I think it's so funny. People put so much time and energy into proving that God does not exist. If there truly is no God why bother?!
shanming716 4 months ago
@shanming716 Because the future of humanity depends on it. Old religious views only shut the mind and don't let the new stuff to get in. Regardless if there is or if there isn't a God, old religious views have always been used as an excuse to go to war. Although technology has been use to take the advantage in the wars, it has never been the excuse to go to it. Is always political or religious. And I am aware of the oil war, but is a hidden political agenda justified with religion.
TheHydrogen4 3 months ago
@ASexyChef Yes I went to kindergarten and learned all about dinosaurs and how they lived millions of years ago. I was indoctrinated with the "proof" of evolution through high school and believed it until a few years ago. Then I became a Christian. So to say that I am ignorant and uneducated on evolution, darwinism, or anything in general is in fact ignorant of you.
shanming716 4 months ago
In this day and age, to disbelieve in Evolution, is the same as to think the world is flat today. Or that the earth is the center of the world, or that world is 6,000 years old. All these are so ignorant to think, science has nothing to do, with Religion, just because you small close-minded interpretation do not allow you to accept science, well thats the reason why christians used to think the world was flat, wake up and stop fighting facts, and stop being stupid.
ASexyChef 4 months ago
@ASexyChef well your argument would have a great point with the exception of one thing. Darwin himself. as he was writing his theory of evolution was that if his theory wasn't proved in 100 years....then it should be left alone. i wanted to say debunked but i'm not sure if that's correct. thanks for checking out this post :)
ubc20 4 months ago
GO KIRK!
studiousangel 4 months ago
Kent Hovind is a great debator for the side of creation! In all honesty, I love Kirk and Ray and respect what they do-they get people to think and face things like eternity-but seriously, my husband could have debated they're point way better than they did!
shanming716 6 months ago 2
@shanming716 Kent Hovid is a ignoramus, he is in jail, and he is the worst debater I have ever seen. You do not have to be an atheist to believe in Evolution, but you do have to be ignorant to not. 500 years ago, the christian world denounce the theory that the earth goes around the sun. Today that is still a scientific theory, just like gravity is a theory, scientific theories are better than facts, they are supported by many facts.
ASexyChef 4 months ago
@ASexyChef
except when it comes to outer space, it disproves so many theory laws, like planets, moons, stars rotating backwards, space itself destroys big bang theory
marioakayoyo 3 months ago
@ASexyChef That's ironic,you believe in evolution with absolutely NO evidence.Here's afun fact for you,the Moon is moving away from the Earth at a rate of 4cm per year,do you know where the moon would be 5 billion years ago?Colliding with Earth and disappearing in space ie.NO LIFE DEVELOPEMENT...No slime NO single cell NO anything!!!!!Wake up stop believing fairy tales.
jimmmmybrady 2 months ago
@jimmmmybrady Scientific Theories are better than facts because many facts make up a theory, and there is not theory with more proof than Evolution, here is a fact for you, DNA has proved Evolution the books is closed.. Stop preaching the world is flat, just because your read the bible like a bronze aged idiot doesn't mean you have to give all the others who read it such a bad name. Seriously, you are the same as those 100 years after Galleo who still claimed it was flat..
ASexyChef 1 month ago
@ASexyChef Ironicly,the Jews ALREADY knew the Earth wasn't flat BECAUSE the Bible says its a sphere.DNA does NOT prove evolution,it proves common ancestry,that's all.
jimmmmybrady 1 month ago
@jimmmmybrady If the Jews already knew, than why was the church so against it being round and denied it until we sailed around it... Its great I guess the Jews knew something the catholic church clearly could not read, because there is not corner of the world than huh... Yes sorry DNA proved beyond a doubt evolution, its sad that you try to deny something because you will force educated people to reject the bible than, if you teach your kids evolution cant be, and they grasp it is...
ASexyChef 1 month ago
@ASexyChef Only the ORIGINAL church was Jews.The Catholics perverted the message of God.For instance just about zero Christians know that in the Hebrew language the word ALAH means CURSE.So in ZECHARIAH 5 where it warns of an ALAH(curse)spreading over the land very few know that it was a warning about Mohammads cult,Islam.
jimmmmybrady 1 month ago
If you watched all the episodes, when the guy from rational response comes up for the first time, he speaks about how creation was not intelligent because snakes evolved from having legs. How would they have even known that snakes had legs back when the bible was written? Gen 3:14 -God Cursed the serpent. So the guy from rational response proved a verse in the bible to be true. thanks dude
Galden172007 7 months ago
Kirk and Ray sure flee the debate question immediately, so far not an ounce of proof or science from them. Ray babbles and Kirk falls back on the old scare routines.
milesalpha1 7 months ago
its interesting how they take this so called "proof" of god and somehow can twist that to mean the judeo christian god of abraham. that alone disproves their argument.
autopsy87 8 months ago
Man how I wish Carl Sagan was around to debate these chumps. Or at least Hitchens
zzyzx0788 8 months ago
This part = "Hi! I'm Kirk Cameron! Welcome to the debate!"
jankendorf 9 months ago
Did that guy mistake a debate into preaching? If anything, he bolstered the opposition's claims.
Scobragon 10 months ago
Did that guy just turn a perfectly good debate into preaching about how people are going to hell?
Scobragon 10 months ago
All atheists can do, all 10 of them left in the world because most everyone on earth believes in God, is hate God and call names in response to being told the message of the Gospel. It scares them to death they will have to answer to God for how they lived. And they should be scared.
HermannTheGreat 1 year ago
@HermannTheGreat so... fear is a good reason to believe in something? Sounds like manipulation to me - and as an agnostic, the tactics used in evangelism make me more angry than do they scare me. I am not a liar because I have told a few lies... most people would agree that a liar is a person who habitually lies. I am not a thief because I stole nail polish as a little girl... I would have to be stealing habitually. No one would consider me a thief today just because of that one incident.
winterbird85 11 months ago
@HermannTheGreat The thought of yahweh being real scares me because what kind of monster makes eternal torture contingent on blind faith? Why make it a fucking guessing game? How bout give everyone the same message in their head all at once? But nope guess right and believe shit that makes no sense or burn forever. Its like russian roulette. What a horrible thing. It gives me great comfort theres no evidence more the monster in the sky and the logic, compassion and equality govern our lives
zzyzx0788 8 months ago
@HermannTheGreat Actually atheism is on the rise especially among young people. In the United States there is only about a 7% population of atheists but when you look at that in terms of population size that's more atheists than the most atheistic Scandinavian countries combined. Atheists are not scared of God because we do not believe in God. Similarly I'm sure that you are not afraid of Buddha or Shiva (though I'm sure you're afraid of their followers as some atheists are afraid of Christians.
weholdparties 8 months ago
@HermannTheGreat And I say "afraid" not because they have answers that we don't and are going to get into Heaven. We do not believe in God and we do not believe in Heaven. Similarly you do not believe in Valhalla nor Nirvana nor reincarnation. I say afraid because the Christian doctrine is based on hate and many Christians have done horrible things both in the past and present because of their faith. Like Communism and Nazism it's a bad idea when someone murders because of a book.
weholdparties 8 months ago
They should have mentioned the complexity of the cell. To think this happened by accident would require a lobotomy.Protein Synthesis ,Reproduction this is very fascinating stuff and we still have a lot to learn about it. To say these things just happened is not intelligent or tells me two things about the individual, number one they have a reason not to want to believe in a God 2. They are ignorant about the workings of biology and physics.
knight996 1 year ago
@knight996 Yeah, it didn't happen by accident. The laws of biochemistry are very convenient for the formation and emergence of complex organic macromolecules. The source of those laws is mysterious and seems pretty mystical. Maybe God made those laws, whatever that means. But the natural process itself seems to be able to produce life in theory, even if we haven't shown exactly how it happened today.
Ledwix 1 year ago
@knight996 Science does not believe that anything "just" happened. There is no evidence whatsoever that cells just materialized out of thin air as they are now and have existed like that for millions of years. Christians however believe that God said a sentence and that cells just materialized out of thin air and have existed like that for thousands of years. Cells evolved and there is physical evidence of this which is reproducible. You however have no evidence to your claim that God did it.
weholdparties 8 months ago
@weholdparties What is time, space, matter, energy? Where did they come from? Please respond with an intelligent answer.
knight996 8 months ago
@knight996 Time is a fluid construct of which something needs to perceive it for it to exist. Man's concept of time changes frequently and people are often unable to keep accurate track of time (in the clock sense) on their own. When faced with a fall, for instance, the brain will "slow down" time. When you are waiting for something time can also seem to slow even though it is not.
weholdparties 8 months ago
@knight996 Things like weeks and months are purely a human construct created to maintain order in an only semi-reliable natural time system such as the day and seasons.
You'll have to be more specific on what you mean by "space". Space as in the area an object takes in relation to its surroundings or space as in the cosmos?
Matter was created when photons, heated to very high temperatures created the basic elements. Everything on Earth and outside it is made of atoms which are made of smaller...
weholdparties 8 months ago
@knight996 things still. In a sense no one really exists as we see them but are the amalgamation of many parts. This can be seen in single celled organisms which are only made of a few parts and animals such as human beings who are made of almost too many parts to count.
Energy is created by many things so you'll have to be more specific. Are you talking energy like electricity or force or light?
weholdparties 8 months ago
@knight996 Energy such as radiation and lasers are created by photons, moving very quickly, which vibrate along a "straight" path from one source to another. When the vibrations are long you get warmer colors (in terms of visible light) and things like radio, microwaves and infrared. When the vibrations are smaller and are more between peaks you get things like x-rays, ultra violet light, and gamma radiation.
Please note that I am not a scientist and this is just my basic understanding of sciene
weholdparties 8 months ago
@weholdparties
You win. :)
WaltonSauce 8 months ago
Kirk Cameron: Once i stopped getting money out the ass, I turned to god for help
quote55 1 year ago
Scrare people with hell, nice that'll proof god is real
jaca1 1 year ago
I love how an ostrich sticks it's head in the sand and things with it's own logic, "If I can't see them, they can't see me." makes sense to that bird. But we can still see it!
Same goes for people in life.
bluesith 1 year ago
Kirk Cameron was a stupid atheist. He makes an even more stupid christian.
RaustBD 1 year ago
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There is by no doubt ,a God all you have to do is look around you.
Reneec1964 1 year ago
Y'know these particular athiest guys were not too bright. They decided to do this debate. Comfort doesn't deserve a refute to his argument. That validates him. His 'vision' doesn't rate a critique. It's like me challenging a cat to multiplication tables. It's a silly concept...why would I consider it even? Challenging a 2week old baby makes vastly more sense but still nutty. Challenging Ray is like challenging the cat. A pointless win. This is why Dawkins refuses. Ray is mental.
jerykk1 1 year ago
@jerykk1 They aren't doing it to try and convince Ray and Kirk to switch sides, they are doing it for the people in the audience who might be trying to make a decision or have not completely made their minds up. That's true for any debate not just a religious one.
weholdparties 8 months ago
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Here At Now You See TV We do Christian Video Testimonies of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ and how people have come to find him as real in their life. If you could checkout our videos, leave us some feedback, and subscribe to our channel we would greatly appreciate it, or at least stop by and say hi. Also if you have a testimony of How the Lord has changed your life personally we would love to hear it.
Thanks and God Bless
NowYouSeeTV 1 year ago
"I don't want to commit intellectual suicide", well kirk, you did when you decided to believe in a fairy tale =)
mit871chell 1 year ago
2:30 How do i humble myself before a possibility of a perhaps?
omnissient 1 year ago
nice story kirk but where is your point
henshinman 1 year ago
Kurt - Testimony isn't evidence. The perfect example of faith.
psycotria 1 year ago
@psycotria
Oops! Kirk, not Kurt.
psycotria 1 year ago
It's so obnoxious when these apologists claim to be atheist in the past so they can look down their noses and say "Oh, I used to be like you, but then I opened my heart and blah blah..."
If they really used to be atheist then they would be able to reflect even basic atheistic arguments and rationality, but they cannot. Kirk is so full of shit and his "I used to be an atheist" spiel isn't winning brownie points with any thinking person.
ChaseKittens 1 year ago
@ChaseKittens Your really full of it, he used to be an atheist....so what? why are you responding to that comment. Responding to it is useless, just like trying to explain evolution, it never happend so why try to expalin it to people.
dude33ism 1 year ago
@dude33ism "evolution, it never happend so why try to expalin it to people."
lolololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololololo science.
ChaseKittens 1 year ago
@ChaseKittens "t's so obnoxious when these apologists claim to be atheist in the past ..."
That's right!
'I wuz a evilushunnis too'. lol!
Kirk wasn't an atheist, he was a self-centered, stuck-up idiot that only thought of himself, if he ever thought at all.
psycotria 1 year ago 2
@ChaseKittens At least they aren't trying to be reformed witches anymore. That got old fast when they didn't know basic information or even correct pronunciation for holidays and deities. It's tricky now though because there isn't a dogma where they could screw up. Many Christians identify atheism with selfishness though (which is terribly ironic) so it's easy to know they're lying when they start their "on top of the world" speech.
weholdparties 8 months ago
@ChaseKittens It's a common tactic amongst them. You'll find evidence of this in people like Carol Kornacky (probably butchering her name) or in the documentary Hell House where the former claimed to be a witch and the latter claimed to have been in the "rave" scene. None of them exhibit even basic knowledge of the things they are condemning because, obviously, they never were part of it. When you confront them with that though they'll say there were on "another level" as if they're a secret.
weholdparties 7 months ago
There was once a thug that went out and wanted to sell drugs and he love to see people get hurt. But he heard a sermon from a precher and he got saved and now this thug dosnt want to hurt people he just wants to help and love people..because he feel's so diffrent and that there was something in him that just hated his old self..and he became so diffrent.
To antheist they say there is no god..if there was anatheist world it would be dull!!
dannybammy 1 year ago
@dannybammy If this person received counseling instead of what was most likely jailhouse preaching then they would have a sound mental state instead of repressed psychological problems and a new found appreciation for Jesus which, as Ray mentioned, absolves him of his crimes (this is why 99.8% of the American prison population is religious 80% of them being Christian).
weholdparties 8 months ago
I think that he finished the show because what Ray and Kirk was saying was speaking to his conscience and he did not want to hear anymore. Kirk had more time that Kirk, but that is okay, of course.
Isolation00 1 year ago
I mean Ray had more time than Kirk. c:
Isolation00 1 year ago
There was hardly even an argument on the opposite side, the redhead was going off on a rant about absolutely nothing.
gt5323b 1 year ago
@gt5323b That is the problem this isnt a debate - this is just a chance for Kirk to evanglise. he even openly admited that
badpanda84 1 year ago
facepalm.jpg multiplied by a million
no im not trying to be funny, my face and nose hurts
stfu and sit down kirk, also, way to ignore the opposite arguement and go on a rant about NOTHING
Dopesmoker213 2 years ago
......He himself, was once famous....Then y would he even bothered doing this crap that ppl like "Atheists" laugh at on a stupid show?
Bcuz Jesus changed him, and He changed me too......
Trust me All Atheists out there.....Do not Rebuke what u can not prove......or it will b too late.....
lThellRockl 2 years ago
@lThellRockl The reason atheists are atheists is because you cannot prove God exists any more than we can. That's the point. You can say you "feel him in your heart" or whatever but that is not proof that's a feeling. I can get upset at my sister for taking the last soda but if I didn't see her do it there's no evidence she did. I'd have to rely on second hand information that could be old, biased, or a straight up fabrication. Such is the case of religion.
weholdparties 8 months ago
@lThellRockl And Kirk is still famous. He and Ray still make lots of money from their ministry.
weholdparties 8 months ago
@weholdparties
Thats a blessing from the Lord. But all those mean nothing when we die, pass away and go to heaven.
lThellRockl 8 months ago
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@lThellRockl
Can you prove it?
WaltonSauce 8 months ago
Seriously though. FIVE $*@king minutes of personal testimony is not a valid argument!! You going to tell us about the time you saw a ghost in the haunted mansion next?
*sigh
TheProphetless 2 years ago
Kirk: "I was a popular child actor and made lots of money and everyone loved me and I felt special."
Me: I was a MacGyver fan...
Kirk: "Then my show got cancelled and I didn't feel special anymore."
Me: So?
Kirk "So I was driving in my fancy car and realized that I could feel special again if I allowed myself the delusion that an all powerful God loved me and made me special."
Me: "AAAAND?"
Kirk: "You should believe in God too now."
Me: "No. You should go back to school."
TheProphetless 2 years ago 4
@TheProphetless
LOL.
iQualify 1 year ago
so basically what kirk said here is that when he was an atheist he was a bad one at it, he didnt know shit ,he just did it because of what others told him and not because of his own knowledge and experience and research about the subject, in one video he says he didnt even read the bible when he was atheist, so no wonder he became a believer after reading it , and also what hes stating here is that th reason why you become a believer is bceause of fear of hell, pathetic
hovsec 2 years ago
mmmm kirk claims he had the "world at the tail"?
the devil has a tail, hasn't he?
thedayitriedtodie 2 years ago
Cameron's Fail: Did not present any arguments for his premise. Appealed once again to emotions. This was more like a testimonial instead of a argument. Sets up a false dichotomy with his arguments.
All i see in this debate is 4 people who have no idea of what they are talking about. Just a continuation of a false dichotomy.
Stitchman3875 2 years ago 2
Kirk starts with an actual fact,,,, yes kirk your science teachers are intellectually superior,, and not just in what they know but how they think.
MrBabs12345 2 years ago
@MrBabs12345 Not to be the devil's advocate (poor choice of words I know) here but there are some really shitty science teachers such as the ones who are teaching religion in lieu of actual scientific thinking to make it seem like God is more valid than he is. Granted they are more preacher than teacher but the fact remains that, just like history and literature, there are some really shitty teachers out there who are not doing what their position requires of them.
weholdparties 8 months ago
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there is no ONE scientific proof that we evolved, evolution is a theory, remember that next time.
funndamentalist 2 years ago
you need to learn what a theory is in scientific terms moron.
go to notjustatheory(dotcom)
fredmelmackian 2 years ago 8
Where are the wise? Where is the teacher of the law? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe.
1 Corinthian 1:20-21
funndamentalist 2 years ago
@funndamentalist So you believe that the earth is six parts land and one part water? You believe that the sun is a disk and that the earth is flat and that unicorns exist? Those are all things that your God has said in the Bible so it must mean he knows better than humans right?
weholdparties 8 months ago
wow....kirk opens up with a logical fallacy first sentence.... Patronizing fallacy (I use to think like that, in an attempt to falsely imply superiority)...secondly kirk was what? 14 ? when he was atheist? Ya I'm sure he did some deep philisophical thinking then.
boorens18 2 years ago 3
@boorens18 He said 17 years old, for the record. Just entering the philosophical stage of life.
Gethsemaneful 2 years ago
...and like any true psychopath or sociopath they don't see their OWN wrongdoing and illness and assume everyone else is as empty and dangerous as they are...since they needed this cockamamie nonsense they're SURE you must need it to.
farawayreach 2 years ago
Under christianity you can murder, molest kids and women, lie, steal and cheat but as long as you believe in the cartoon character known as "god" you'll be forgiven...so "god" is a ravenous attention whore and christians are just cowards.
It's a system for morally corrupt sociopaths because they simply are too disturbed to figure out SIMPLE right from wrong without a guide-book...It's PATHETIC!!!!!! christianity is PATHETIC!!
farawayreach 2 years ago
then the rapist asked again "What about the girl I raped?", GOD answered:" Don't worry about her, I used HER to test you, physically you failed, but because you believe in ME....you PASSED....you may go to heaven to join the Hitler..he is waiting for you..because when the last moment before he died, he accepted me and prayed to me...come on...you brother is waiting for you...just go and have fun with him in my KINGDOM...."
The moral of the GOD and the Bible--->FUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
weleio 2 years ago
you have the worst perception of what salvation out of anyone that i have ever talked to.
tkoch25 2 years ago
to all arguers: the only sure barrier to truth is to assume that we already have it.
danielalien 2 years ago 3
We all need forgiveness. It's our human way. If you have never felt guilty, you're either doing something really right, or you just don't care about anyone but yourself. And, when I ask God for forgiveness, I'm not avoiding anything. I tell God, this is what I did, please forgive me. It's just like going to your parent, or friend and saying hey, I lied to you and I'm sorry. Will you please forgive me? If anything, it is more noble than not confessing and asking forgiveness.
tkoch25 2 years ago
But why do you have to pray or ask for forgiveness at all? Surely if God knows all etc.., then surely he knows whether you really are sorry before you've even opened your mouth. If God is as powerful as you say he is, then perhaps he grants forgiveness before you even know you've done something wrong.
Oh, and how can you preach forgiveness, when right since the it's beginning, christianity has been vengeful, its also full of inconsistencies, paradox and hypocrisies.
FryFubar 2 years ago
Christianity is the ONLY religion that offers FORGIVENESS! Why would anyone not want that? I have done research on the fastest growing religion of Islam. There is NOT one single other religion that can GUARANTEE where you go. The Bible is the only book that gives us that! And Christianity is the ONLY religion that offers forgiveness.
tkoch25 2 years ago
Hey, dude, tell you a story...
a guy raped a girl one day, he felt guilty ,he went to the GOD to ask for forgiveness, he deserved,
then he raped again..he went again, he was forgiven again repeatedly....until he asked the GOD why every time I came with guilty, and I left with forgiveness..GOD said:Bible tell you that, as long as you believe in ME....you are saved (No need to do any good deeds,first YOU HAVE TO BELIEVE IN ME..then when you die you will go to heaven."
weleio 2 years ago
Harry Potter is documented? Come on dude, in a fictional book. Sarcasm is annoying. Since you know so much about what the world accepts as history, I wanted to know what and who defines whether or not something is historically accurate?
dandelionsenior09 2 years ago
you just said that he was documented. Poorly or not, he was documented so that argument is over. What kills me is the world accepts the Bible as a historical document. You want to know where Jesus is documented? Open the Bible. While you're there read it with an open mind and you might just surprise yourself.
dandelionsenior09 2 years ago
nice that they don't touch upon the other religions.
zgbrotherhood 2 years ago
I believe Kirk Cameron was seriously looking for the truth, but his search for truth was limited by very narrow paramaters from the beginning. The christianity that he believes to be absolute truth just happened to fit into those limited paramaters so he jumped into that and now his paramaters are closed off to any other possibilities. People don't only "see what they want to see" but they see what they've been conditioned to see and what they believe. "Seek and ye shall find".
scruethedemiurge 2 years ago
Great job. You are correct that the bible is myth and the jesus (who may or may not existed) of the bible is a fabrication.
greatgrandpasfolly 2 years ago
Jesus that may or may not have existed? Jesus has already been proven by SCIENCE to be a historical figure and that comes from records from many scientific sources and history books. Jesus existed like Gandhi existed, there is no question of that.
dandelionsenior09 2 years ago
Really? What SCIENTIFIC process proves that? You christians love to run your mouths, but you get exposed when your feet is put to the fire and are asked to provide PROOF!
billsbunions 2 years ago
he sees god because he wants to see god. that is the only reason to beleive in god. and it is valid.
drez13 2 years ago
Check out how many times Kirk says "I" or "me" or "my."
PosterNutbag27 2 years ago 2
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PosterNutbag27 2 years ago
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need to see Lee Strobel for a debate
UcommonAdmiration 2 years ago
I'm glad this aheadstix character is on the theists side. He does more for the cause of rational thinking than any amount debate can ever do.
davefromomaha 2 years ago 9
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Insecure!!!???, are you serious?, no! thik about all the wonders of he human body. it can heal itelf, it can regulate its own temperature, we grow a different kind of hair on our eyebrows than do on our arm, we grow a second set of teeth for when we leave baby hood two child hood, the human eye can identify over 3.000.000(three million!) different shades of every colour and can change size to let more light in or out and we can see inthe dark!!!!. yeah like that would just go to waste. whatever
Aheadstix85 2 years ago
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I mean come on!, what factors?!, the fact that spirituality exists!, its our way of communicating with the "other side"!, if deathy was "it!" there would be no reason for it that is how your know that can't be "it!".
Aheadstix85 2 years ago
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really with the right camera and equipment you can see the particles tht are the "soul", and the soul is just another way of sayin spirit or ghost and it looks like the shape of that person only transperent and their very quick, theres a film called "white noise" where guys go into old buildings with audio equipment and record "ghost conversations". very interesting. take a look.
Aheadstix85 2 years ago
do spiders soul's go to heaven when you squash one?
canuckman87 2 years ago
Die and cease to exist!!!???, that cant be it , there are just to many factors against that. The soul hoes to heaven the body dies though
Metallicman1985 2 years ago
the soul goes to "heaven"? how do you know? who came back from "heaven" and personally told you to your face that souls go to "heaven"?
fredmelmackian 2 years ago
What does the soul look like?
SSJ3Ulcer 2 years ago
what kind of factors? your fear? regret? guilt? you are just insecure in your own mind.
tsrox20 2 years ago
smelly kelly, selling her love these days I hear....what a know nothing, loud mouth..maybe that gig will suit her better!!!
istheretruth 2 years ago
Epic Religious Fail
MetalEagle95 2 years ago
WHAT IF you are wrong....
gooberaza86 2 years ago
then he'll die and cease existence, no?
istheretruth 2 years ago
And the answer to Pascal's Wager is so simple. Basically, which is more intrinsically moral? Someone who lived a "moral" life because they feared divine retribution and wanted eternal reward, or someone who lived a life of charity, kindness and good deeds because it was the right thing to do, and not because they had any expectation of some sort of omnipotent cosmic arbiter. The answer seems very obvious to me.
bekele2617 2 years ago 2
Seriously, is this their idea of a "scientific debate"? I mean, come on, they're deluded fairytale-loving nimrods, but at least they should realize that stupid personal anecdote does not equal "science". Can you imagine if the same standard applied to actual science? "Sir, how do you know that this nuclear generator will work?" "Well, I pulled over to the side of the road and prayed on my way to work, and god spoke to me and told me it would.".
bekele2617 2 years ago
Wow, Way of the Master just owned themselves HARD.
okblog 2 years ago
owning ones self is only a projection from the perspective of the beholder. Religious jargon will not impress someone, if they do not subscribe to the religion. Atheists have no answers at all, though they pretend to. many sheeple out there...are you just another sheeple laughing at another sheeple?
istheretruth 2 years ago
You're telling me that the free will I perceive that I have is projected upon me by some enormous, invisible "beholder"? There is no evidence for that claim. Science offers real answers to how we got here, and how the world around us works.
okblog 2 years ago
lmao
what the hell are you talking about?
I didn't say anything in the neighborhood of that.
Do you have reading comprehension problems?
read it again...very slowly this time.....and then respond again. I'm pulling for you ;- )
istheretruth 2 years ago
Science has given us everything you god gave us nothing, only a false sence of security. Just go live under a rock "istheretruth" because you don't diserve the luxury of science.
helldogas2 2 years ago
what? are you responding to something that I said, or are you projecting some idea onto me....that you have instead drawn from your own stereotypes? Can you please explain just what the fuck you are talking about?
istheretruth 2 years ago
This debate, both sides included, consists of the most superficial arguments. Keep in mind that neither argument can be fully proven; most scientists will tell you that the further they discover, the weirder and more complex it gets. This debate is ancient, and if you really want to look into it read into it: feurbach, democritus, plato. etc. This program just draws on their arguments, but with less clarity.
lukemcq 2 years ago
All Kirk is proving is that a he's a gullible idiot with no education or curiosity.
ImmenseRaven 2 years ago
I'll tell you what, for as much BS as they're spewing, they're much better speakers than the RR team. Invest in some presence RR team, it'll make you connect better with the people who wouldn't otherwise agree. That being said; I heard just about zero evidence for the existance of God. All he said was a personal experience -- no evidence. And then he invokes Pascals Wager yet again! It's blatant fear mongering, believe In Him Or He'll send you To hell. All the important words are capitalized.
tarminlessrer 2 years ago
Kirk Cameron's speech sounds so fucking rehearsed, it's unbelievable. He must give the exact same speech at every public appearance, because this sounds more like a god damned testimonial rather than an explanation of god's existence. Why did I expect more from these people?
mikedubya 2 years ago
believing in science does not require faith, believing in god does. Clearly you did not ever think the way they think. Not to mention, believe in god because of the fear of the possibility of god NOT existing, is shallow and meaningless. Just as being good for the sole purpose of going to heaven is shallow and meaningless. He essentially argues NOTHING in this entire segment.
gooberaza86 2 years ago
worst "debate" ever :/
sprflyenya 2 years ago
'I believe in god because I fear hell, but I love god'
YoeriYoeri 2 years ago
So, Kirk, if I start worrying about and obsessing over the fact that I will die.... then I will conclude that there is a god? Sounds like, if I delude myself into thinking that there might be an after life when I start thinking about death, I will become so fearful and obsessed with death that I will accept the Western religion- Christianity because it is the most accessible religion in the United States. That is using your emotions versus your noodle.
TheHarbinger09 2 years ago
Do the way of the masters people realize that this is a debate?
One guy gives a sunday morning sermon, and kirk cameron comes on giving his personal testimony like some sort of Bible Club meeting.
okamichamploo 3 years ago 2
Kirk, you were an athiest? Really? Didnt you convert when you were 17? Switch teams in your 30;s or 40's and i will grant you that one, but 17?!?
Hahahahahaha
BobChaos23 3 years ago
The Atheist duo isn't that good at debating and still they kick the shit out of these guys. But i'd really like to see Dawkins or Hitchens debate these half-wits. It would be a complete massacre.
pavlopwnsyourface 3 years ago
I second that. I even searched for "Hitchens vs. WOTM" and unfortunately could find nothing.
Hitchens would crush WOTM unmercifully, unapologetically and unrepentantly. It would be something that I would even pay money to see on pay-per-view.
DarkOnyx 3 years ago
If you seek him you will find him? That's not proof of anything and it doesn't mean anything. Plus you forget about the many other religions that say you find god through different means. You simply have a christian bias.
HenningII 3 years ago
you all cant handle the truth....keep putting negative on me and Praise GOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
given2u 3 years ago
I have noticed that too Kirk.
People claim there is no God without even looking into it properly.
Jesus said if you seek him you will find him.
Seems to me that people just do not want to know the truth because they may just be wrong.
ogiaag5m 3 years ago
I seeked Thor and I found him. That is indisputable proof that Thor is real.
limwl1990 3 years ago 2
I can well believe that.
But In the bible he is called satan.
He comes to decieve many and he doesnt mind disguising himself as thor,venus,zeus or marshans, or any other false god for that matter just as long as he can keep you from finding the true God of the bible he'l do whatever it takes.
2 corinthians 11v14 says this.
And no wonder for Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light.
ogiaag5m 3 years ago
Let me get this straight. All gods are satan except for the trinity? HAH! The dumb deluded religions of the world. The bible is correct and every other religion is wrong. I see now. I am enlightened. Thank you ogiaag5m, you are the smartest and least deluded bigot I've met today. (:
limwl1990 3 years ago 2
limwl1990
im glad youve seen the light.
It didnt take much looking into to see that did it ? ( :-)
Please feel free to come again if you need any more enlightenment. lol
Or better still read the bible for yourself and try asking God if he really is real.
You might get a shock.
ogiaag5m 3 years ago
What if god shows up and tells me he is fake? What do I do then....?
BobChaos23 3 years ago
How do you know god isn't actually the one decieving you through the bible, and satan is worthy of yor praise? Oh wait, you don't; because of the lack of evidence necessary for faith, it is completely arbitrary, and any dispute between two faith based sides is basically a dick measuring contest.
PhiloCentinel 3 years ago
The reason i know is cos i have experienced both the demonic and Jesus who is truth.
The devil has no love in him and he's here to destroy human life take the D away from his name and you are left with evil thats what he is.
Once you are born again of Gods spirit you experience a love and a peace that surpasses knowledge.
Its like anything in life once you have the real deal you see through the false.
I know who my mother is for example and no one could pose as her cos i know her so well.
ogiaag5m 3 years ago
People all over the world and throughout history have had identical experiences with thier gods, nothing makes yours special. In ancient Athens, people "experienced" Zeus, in Rome, Apollo, in Arabia, Allah, in India, Vishnu, in Denmark, Thor; why do you think your special. Even I have had similar experiences with nature and my own thought, but I don't abandon rational thinking for a delusion.
PhiloCentinel 3 years ago
How do you know what you are saying is true? Do you know anything about the about what you wrote or are you parroting Dawkins? Based upon your other comment you seem to believe what is true in your experience is true of everyone elses,Is that what you believe?
cryptoenigmatist 3 years ago
this could be the most incoherant post ever.
callmeblackjesus 3 years ago
"How do you know what you are saying is true?"
Because I've looked at the evidence on an honest attempt to find the truth; you have not.
PhiloCentinel 2 years ago
You say I have not and yet you don't know me... I must ask again, How do you know what you are saying is true about me? What evidence do you find the most convincing in your world view?
cryptoenigmatist 2 years ago
"How do you know what you are saying is true about me?"
Well from what I've gathered, you deny evolution, noone who was educated and honest on the subject would.
"What evidence do you find the most convincing in your world view?"
If by "world view" you mean "theory of evolution", I suppose the observation of evolution of organisms recently, such as the development of nylonase.
PhiloCentinel 2 years ago
"I know who my mother is for example and no one could pose as her cos i know her so well."
Listen, I'm sorry but that's just not true. With training someone could theoretcally pose as her. At some point we may even have robots that can do the same thing through programming. You are imagining things where there are none, and you fail to recognize the fallability of your mind and senses.
PhiloCentinel 3 years ago
Lucifer didnt masquerade as anything, he started out as an angel, get your own mythology right....
Oh, and how do you know your god isnt actually Satan in disguise? What better way to hide in plain sight than pretend to be a god, deman worship, conduct holy wars, etc...explains a lot...only the gnostics knew that, but then, "god" had all them killed, didnt he?
BobChaos23 3 years ago
BobChaos23
I am only quoting what the bible says.
You are right Lucifer was an angel but is now a fallen angel.
His greatest tactic is to decieve man kind just like he did in the garden of Eden.
I know my heavenly father so well and i know who my enemy satan is too.
You have a wrong concept of God
Why are you so bitter and angrey towards God?
If only you knew how much he loves you and longs to have a relationship with you.
Please dont leave it until your death to find the truth.
ogiaag5m 3 years ago
have you seen lucifer or jesus with your own eyes? you you heard their voices with your ears?
otherwise- this "experience" you speak of is highly subjective and highly debatable.
i used to be a christian. i used to think i had experiences. i know better now.
fredmelmackian 3 years ago
redmelmackian
Many people all over the world proffess to be Christians but i can assure you they are NOT.
Jesus said many shall even say to him on that day Didnt we do this and that but he shall say to them depart from me i never KNEW YOU.
Once you have been born again and filled with the spirit of God you can never deny that fact so i would have to lovingly but truthfully submit to you that you were never a TRUE christian in the first place you just thought you were.
ogiaag5m 3 years ago
jesus also said judge not, lest ye be judged!!!
since you have such a blatent disregard for jesus's commandments- i hope you bring the marshmellows!!
omahavinnie2 3 years ago
omahavinnie2
1Corinthians 5v12 also says
What buisness is it of mine to judge those outside the church?Are you not to judge those inside the church.
God will judge those outside.
If you read on Jesus said you will know a tree by its fruit.
The bible must be read in context with the indwelling of Gods spirit in you to understand it.
Christians are in many different denominations but we primaraly follow Jesus though not all do cos there is a difference between christianity and religion.
ogiaag5m 3 years ago
you still have blatently disregarded jesus's commandments. ergo- you don't follow jesus (or more accurately the character of jesus as written in the bible myth).
i don't need to know what the bible says to spot someone who is judging another. it's a plus that i do know and understand the bible and judging is one of the greatest offenses one can perform.
of course, the delusion that you think you have some special understanding of the man made bible blinds you to your arrogance and conceit.
omahavinnie2 3 years ago
omahavinnie2
How can anyone who clearly expresses that the bible is a book of myths on one hand then try to interpret the wording of the book itself.
Is this a contradiction or what ?
coolfunkDJ 3 years ago
i'm showing the person the contradictory nature of his bible myth book and that the person doesn't even follow his own rules.
anything else?
didn't think so!
omahavinnie2 3 years ago
Yes there is something else you can't even understand context or literature. Your probably right about the sermon.He probably don't expect to change a fool from his folly but to call Gods elect to repentance. Great audience to do so. But if your are intelligent enough to understand you should listen to some presuppositional apologetics. The problem debating MOST atheist is they are too ignorant or dishonest to understand the argument.
cryptoenigmatist 3 years ago
Go read the entire segment where he said that stupid!! He said more!!! He said but when you judge......learn to read.
cryptoenigmatist 3 years ago