Yes, the United States was founded by rich white men who didn't want to pay taxes -- and kept slaves.
Sadly, it seems much the same is true today.
So, "revolution" without a moral compass--
simply creates a new "abuser" from the previously abused. Like dysfunctional families, the abused learn what they live, and without change, continue to become those they condemn.
"White men" died to stop slavery too.You are aware that slavery as an institution began from before the pyramids in ancient Egypt, and forms of it still exist today? You are aware that the Africans themselves engaged in the slave trade, delivering them to ports for the American and European slavers? That the "noble" American Indians engaged in slavery? The "rich white" slave owners engaged in what was an ancient and common institution. You are being inflammatory.
Yes I realize my lead sentence can inflame. The point that 95% of Americans were too poor to have slaves, and it was only the rich 5% who did, painted us all with the slaver brush.
The main point I was making was the second part. Did you even read this far?
Is the "moral compass" the social safety net? The moral, kind system which condemns generation after generation of inner city children to crime and failure? While millions of illegal aliens who cant even speak English arrive with only the shirt on their back find jobs, live, move up the ladder and succeed? That "moral compass?
I am a conservative, a regular person of 58 yrs old, small business at home, who has studied economics, and finance informally, as a "hobby". since I observed silver coins disappearing from circulation in 1964. My older brother collected coins, gave me $10 day for me to go to the bank, get rolls of coins, and search them out for the "good ones, good dates". He would share the "good ones" with me. The phenomena of silver disappearing from circulation, lead me to monetary policy.
I took the "moniker" luvcheney, because Libs hate Cheney (a Great Man) and it automatically makes them hate me. My interest in monetary policy leads me to invest in "junior gold stocks" ( highly volatile, risky), and "GLD", "SLV". I dont usually invest out of my area of interest. I am long "GLD right now, (with a stop). I am in cash in my speculative Gold miner stock 401k. 2009 was a spectacularly great year! The President, has created gigantic opportunities to make money. Thank you Obama! Pinko
He needs to earn a living. Did you listen to Thom in the video "Thom is challenging Wayne Root....."
Around 5min20sec Thom says that as a small businessman he is able to "zero out" his taxes, and that Wayne can too. Wayne replies "and thats good isnt it?". Thom, "thats totally good". Thom rants against the rich, wants them to pay high taxes, while he is happy he doesnt. Bet Thom is pretty rich, eh??
Reaganomics means lower taxes, lower spending (except more on the military). Obamanomics means higher taxes, higher spending (except lower on the military). They are exactly the opposite.
In 1979 the Fed Fund rate was 11.2%, the Fed Fund rate was 20% in 1981. Reagan became president in Jan 2001. The present rate is less than 1/4 of 1 %, or .25%. I am sure you understand the effect of the business cycle on the deficit, and can appreciate the fact that if Bernanke raised the federal funds rate to 20%, the housing market, the economy in general would collapse. Paul Volker raised the Fed Fund rate to kill inflation. This had an adverse affect on the deficit.
This is spot on. Of course, everything he says here in nothing new to a thinking person. I can't wait for a day when people will rooting and voting against there own interests purely for idealism. As our middle class disappears due to an unfair tax system and corporation's always are first and are always right loving law making, it is funny to me that people believe that it is OK for someone that is filthy rich to pay next to nothing in taxes compared to the average American. Wake up. Please.
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If your tax return has a positive Adj Gross Income, and your income is at the median level, (half more, half less), half the country that earns less than you pays 4% of the Federal Income tax, the half earning more than you pays 96%. Taxing is progressive, Libs like that. Now corporate taxes are a different matter. Any cost of a corporation is paid by the customer of the corp. Libs like that too, but they are just taxing themselves. But, they are "thinking people".
Thom Hartmans Christmas message: CEO`s, Banksters, Wall Street, Insurance companies, Free Trade, all in bed with Congress, Thats why we are helpless, hopeless, and dependent, until we OVERTHROW the man!! External forces against us! CONSERVATIVE message? Take responsibility for yourself, improve your life by your own actions, success is your responsibility. Problems? Take the blame. Why even TRY if you believe THOM? Hope and change? Sure, wait for a politician to help you? Help yourself.
Obviously, these "awful" jobs you refer to were BETTER than what was available to these workers who were IMMIGRANTS TO the Mariana`s! Picking strawberries in California is not MY dream, but it is to the illegals who die in our deserts for the opportunity. AS the U.S. went from agriculture to manufacturing, the conditions were not so cushy as they are today. Your point? If they dont get union wages and all their 15 minute breaks, let them starve to death?
TAX the Rich! Rich guy puts his mistress in swanky NY apartment. Helps the housing market, pays property taxes, revenues and taxes to the utility companies, employment for the doorman (tips too!), plumbers, electricians, garbage men. Buys her a Mercedes, commission for the salesman, dealer employs mechanics, car washers, office staff, buys her jewelry, job for salesgirl, pays costs of jewelery bus, Clothes, shoes, Victorias secret, tips for single mother waitress, dishwasher, cook, taxes, etc.
Then Obama says, TAX THE RICH". He takes the money from that rich guy, so he can NOT afford that beautiful, cooperative creature, and then he spends it to "create jobs". 53% of our Govt educated population says, "Tax the rich, Obama will make jobs." They think that you can take a bucket of water from one side of the tub, and pour it in the other side, and it will fill up.
Hey, help me out here. I see sock puppet is someone pretending to be someone else? Who am I really then? Now, I never did anything to my channel, is that an issue? I went to yours, looks like a trip I had 40 years ago. Far out!! But, I got scared, thought i would get a flashback.....trails man..........
Happy to help- that's what liberals call compassion and conservatives call weak, or socialistic. But, never mistake kindness for weakness.
So you joined YT a few days ago, chose a name that implies you'd like to bed Cheney, all for the express purpose of finding liberals to bash and to spead your conservative wisdom? I can't explain your motivation, but it seems sketchy at best. 108 yrs old? Doubtful- so I have reason to be skeptical of you. Hope this was helpful.
Well, it is amusing to watch you all. I also "luv: Reagan, but I chose the moniker because it is the fastest way to irritate a lib. But, thanks for adding sock puppet to my vocabulary.
Sorry for the delayed response- had to run out to get an abortion, meet with my commie/fascist/socialist organizers, volunteer at the local shelter, and on the way home, I hugged a tree. Man, what a great country! And it will be so much better when all the baby- boomers like you, who have sucked this country dry with your greed and fear of true social progress, are cold and dead. Tick- tock, tick- tock, pal.
BTW- the Founding Fathers were progressives- history is on our side.
I dont really see a specific critique here. As for us old baby boomers, with the $100 trillion unfunded liability of Social Security, and our wonderful Medicare Health insurance program (socialist designed), you actually dont have a future. Too late for you ........Me? I thought Obama`s spending, coupled with the financial collapse, presented a grand opportunity to make a buck, so I moved my 401k`s into speculative gold stocks (see John Embry, Greg McCoach) and sold out this year`s gain of 85%
So WTF are you complaining about? I'm LMAO, dude. You made money off of the current administration's decisions, and still you ridicule? You make no sense.
Here's the specific critique layed out for you: This country will be much better off when all the baby- boomers are dead and gone. Since you tend to have a myopic view of life (I, I, Me, Me, Mine), please include yourself in that statement.
LMAO? At least I got another word in my vocabulary, I had to Google it .Still could use an interpreter. As for my ridiculing the administration, personally I would like to see a much smaller govt, and the Federal reserve abolished. But, I live in the real world, and need to prosper even if the socialists are in power. Forgive my arrogance, I just get off when I make a lot of $, like when I used to sell cars, and every dope I met left deep in debt, like the sound of a girl sighing in my ear.....
Spare me what gets your rocks off- and you accuse Thom of using vile terms like teabagging... sigh.
You like to add to your vocabulary? Good- here's a new one for you- social democracy. The cruel type of 'socialism' you speak of is dead- has been for decades. What has emerged since WWII has been social democracy- high taxes at the top, strong safety net at the bottom. Google this: Equality Trust UK. Download the PPT slides- the US is bottom of the heap with a cascade of social ills...
due to finacial inequality. 50 years of data compiled from around the world- their statistcal methodology has been peer reviewed- and the results are in. 'Richness' of a country doesn't matter- the gap between rich and poor does. I trust you learned how to read a graph while selling cars. Chirping about smaller gov't is a useless distraction- the disease is not gov't- it's extreme wealth and power creating the enormous canyon between rich and poor.
EU (27 nations) $15.25 Trillion GDP. US 14.26 Trillion GDP. EU population 499million, US pop 307million. So, the GREAT Europeans, produce 7% more than the US with 63% more people. But,
at least no effort is as profitable there as effort.
GDP is not profit, it correlates to productivity. It makes you "feel better" to try to reduce the wealth and productivity of the US, if you cam spread it around based on equality, rather than effort. To a Lib, good intentions are the end, not results.
Listen, it's been fun, but you and I are not communicating. All of your comments are about money, and if that's what makes you happy, fine. I personally think there's more to this life than being aquisitive. Enjoy your money, but remember- you'll leave this life like you began- naked and alone. See ya.
BTW- you probably made Thom some money with all your comments. Thanks.
Go to Thom Hartman`s You Tube video "Thom is challenging Wayne Root - Economics that libertarians & conservatives don`t understand". Start at 5min20 secs and listen to Thom explain that as a small businessman, he is able to zero out his taxes at the end of the year, his guest Wayne asks "that`s good isnt it:", and Thom answers "it`s totally good." Thom is a capitalist who doesnt like paying taxes, just like me. Thom and I have more in common than Thom and you do.
No doubt- Thom created seven companies and has written 19 books. I'm well aware of his contributions to capitalism- I have no problem with someone doing well. I do have a problem with predatory capitalism with no restrictions- and so does Thom. He's an advocate of social democracy- watch some more of his videos.
I don't agree with Thom on everything- but then, what 2 people do? I admire him for being a passionate, outspoken , intelligent progressive- this is where we meet.
There are 2 Thoms. 1st Thom a is rich capitalist, who says he can zero out his taxes as a businessman, and that is "totally good". 2nd Thom is a Lib who rants against the rich, the disparity between rich and poor, wants the rich to pay much higher taxes. Limbaugh`s actions are the same as Thom #1`s, but Rush`s words and actions are the same. I am totally fine with Thom #1, and actually, I am also fine with Thom #2, because it is just a load of bull to earn a living with. Or, he`s a hypocrite.
Selling a car, making a lot of money, doesnt cause orgasms The "urban dictionary" says 2) "to enjoy tremendously". You took it sexually. As for Thom, doyou maintaine that instead of "tea partier", he says "tea-bagger" without the sexual context? About the website: its not surprising that in a more market oriented society, with less taxes, that people who make bad decisions have bad outcomes. You prefer that good or bad decisions lead to the same outcome.
Oil is half of Venezuela`s economy, oil production is down 25% since 1999, when Chavez became President. Mexico also owns the oil industry. There is a political struggle there because of declining oil production. Mexico also "helps people, not billionaires". Mexico has spent oil profits on the "people". Capital for exploration is needed from US corps to raise production, share in Mexican profits. Mexican Libs dont like that, so the industries ability to help the poor will decline. Kill the goose
Oil was $10 barrel when Chavez became president. Hugo had it easy, oil is their economy, and the oil price exploded. It`s production peaked at 4 million barrels a day, presently is 2.6million. Reserves are 171 bill barrels, 2nd on earth. In 1998, there were 109 oil rigs drilling. (trying to get oil to sell), by 2002 there were 35. It is always possible to sell oil by lowering the price slightly. If a fool spends all the profits, there is NOT capital to get the oil out. Same for Mexico.
@nowellian Glad to hear that. I also voted for Nader, in 04 and 08 both. At least we tried to steer the country back on track. Probably will vote only for Independents this year in the primaries. We need to clean house of the two-party dictatorship, which is just making things worse every year.
IN 1920, Fed taxes were 3% of GDP, 3 years ago 18%, now 26% ( the crisis). Govt has been growing for 90 years. Ronnie, Bush did NOT roll back govt, they may have slowed it`s growth relative to what a Dem would have done. 90 years of growth of govt leaves you wanting continued growth of govt.
Lets tax the corporations more, sue them more, regulate more costs on them, have the unions strike for higher wages, and then we can all complain when they move to China, India, Brazil, Singapore. While we wait in the unemployment line. We dont need those stinking capitalists!
Revenue act of 1964 lowered corp taxes from 52% to 48%. You are mistaken.The rate is currently 35%, the 2nd highest of 30 OECD countries. At the same time US corp`s are taxed at a higher %, revenue generated is a lower % of GDP. Our country taxes at Fed and State level. Our corps taxes are past the point revenues are maximized. You do want maximum revenue, dont you?? Raise rates from here, revenues decline. Cut them to rates of OECD, revenues increase. And, corps can always go overseas.
My model? I said that if govt raises costs for corporations, that will encourage them to move overseas. You say, nationalize the industries. How about the UK, nations of Eastern Europe, Soviet Union for a start. Do you want to replay a failure that took 50-100 years to play out? Nationalizing an industry will not relieve it from financial realities. If it is not productive, it dies. Innovation, expansion requires capital. Where has that worked??
He hit on all the points. We've been destroyed by Reaganomics and Bushonomics, and Obamanomics is turning out to be too wimpy to meet the challenge. We need Krugmanomics or Bonneromics!
Yea Thom, tell `em! You have no hope! Everyone is out to screw you! Have another reefer, turn on The Colbert Report, and fall asleep. You will have many of your troubles solved that way!
@TheKuffarKid huh? Are you on drugs or just counting on no one noticing that you are trying to slip in more disinfo there luvcheney? Hoover? Mister tax cuts? Go fuck yourself. Hoover was a republocrap in the finest tradition of the species you twat. But, from a sock puppeteer like you, what else should one expect?
Hoover and FDR did completely different things. Hoover was a republican, and FDR a Democrat. FDR policies delivered us out from the Republican caused great depression and Hoover policies made it worse. Most of what FDR did worked very well until the republicans overturned them and lead us to the brink of another republican caused great depression.
Thanks to republican policies that overturned glass-steagal wall street's greed screwed us and we bailed them out
The Federal Reserve was created in 1913. The economy was always cyclical before the Fed, but it tried to eliminates business cycles, to avoid recessions. It would stimulate the economy through monetary policy, prolonging the boom. Remember the "Roaring 20`s"? The boom went too long, the fall was hard. They call it the Great Depression because its size was GREAT. The Stock market crashed in 1929, the Depression ended in 1946. FDR`s policies took 17 years. Good luck until 2026!
You are just flat wrong. Hoover increased Gov. spending by near 50% spending money on aloth of public works projects the most famous of which is Hoover Dam started in 1930. He also signed the Smoot-Hawley tarriff act, he also raised taxes on the 'rich' etc. Rexford B. Tugwell was an adviser to FDR in his 1st term and later said this; "We didn't admit it at the time, but practically the whole New Deal was extrapolated from the programs that Hoover started." YOU ARE JUST FLAT WRONG!!
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Bring back our jobs!. Raise taxes, more unions, higher wages, more regulations, carbon taxes, spend, tax, regulate, spend, tax, regulate!!! That ought to encourage them to come back!. Dont those awful, psychopathic businessmen know they should come back here to such a welcome? I`m just a little guy, got my IRA`s, 401k, and I send my retirement money OUT of the U.S., into small gold mining co`s. I`m out now, up 85% this year. A couple of clicks and WOOOSH...capital out of the U.S..
The "free market" is a naturally occurring phenomena when free people enter into voluntary transactions between each other. Reagan didnt invent it, it has always existed. At times, Govts attempt to override it. See "Edict on Prices", price controls in Roman times, 3rd century ad, . Emperor Diocletian. Or, you can check on Nixon`s Wage and Price controls, if you want. Or, Reagan abolished controls on oil industry 2nd day in office, price fell all the way to $10 eventually.
Free market is when no rules exists, and people cannot be trusted to not to abuse the system. Government is made up of citizens, and corporations are also run by citizens, how can one be trusted while another not?
The govt is irrelevant to a free transaction between between individuals, or between individuals and corporations. Because the free market, the pricing system, is a balance between the 2 sides of a trade. If the price is too high, consumers move to another supplier, or a substitute. This system works, the average corp profit is 5%. United Health (ins co), largest in the U.S., is 3.7% profit. $500 policy, $18.50 profit. WalMart, less than 4%. Average supermarket chain, 3%. Exxon-Mobil now, 5%.
government is relevant. if you want sustainable growth. current system does not work for long term, current system cares only about short term gains and does not care about the good of the nation overall. fool.
I am a fan of monetary policy, like some are of football. The financial collapse and election of Obama was an opportunity. I read interviews with John Embry, who in late 2008, named a flock of small cap (junior miners) gold stocks. I subscribe to The Mining Speculator, by Greg McCoach. I moved assets from my 401K that has been in "GLD" into about 15 small gold stocks. I got nervous about 2 weeks ago, went into cash from the gold stocks, I am up 85% in 2009. How about you?
Sure you did. Thats why you are in such a happy mood. You bought in at the exact perfect moment, but you dont believe in the market? By the way, mining stocks behave in a leveraged way, so if copper went up 100% (it did), mining stocks go up more. The 3 largest market cap copper mining shares all went up over 100%, and smaller cap stocks can go even higher. If what you say is true, you would be well over 100%. Sorry, I would bet 25% of my 401k you are not telling the truth.
If it were true, it`s normal to share insight, related facts. If not to shore up your claim, out of a common interest with a fellow speculator. I shared with you 2 market experts, reason to enter the market, market sector of interest, a publication, stock symbol, The fact I sold my position recently, where a 10% decline in gold already occurred, implying a bigger decline in my gold stocks. If I timed the market perfectly, my gains would be way over 85%. You however, claim to be perfect. NOT!
Thom will not EVER discuss the percent of profit of anything, the truth does not lend itself to his opinions. Its easier to say "they make billions". "Evil Banksters", "Gangsters in suits".
Thanks, Thom- only you can put so much reason into such a tiny nutshell...
I was going to feature the part of 'A Christmas Carol' with Allister Sim throwing his quill over his shoulder as he says, "I don't deserve to be so happy!", on my channel for the day, but this one is closer to my heart.
Gods, can we become any more screwed? I say, we need Thom to be far more visible, his words spread across the landscape and made part of the political fabric of the land. He has the perspective that is true, the heart that does care and the honesty to speak truth to power.
Those that have never suffered can never know what pain is and the CEO class is 90% composed of who have no empathy, the other 10% are merely sociopaths.
@Plutonwolf Thom is so invisible because people who believe this sort of thing are mostly busy listening to music, watching football, getting high, waiting in line down at the welfare office, bumming quarters, watching basketball,standing with cardboard signs on freeway exits, watching Californication on HBO etc. He has 81 other people like you listening to him on the radio. Guys like us watch Bloomberg, Fox Business, Rush Limbaugh.He makes us laugh, and we can click our 401K`s after the news
@kuffarkid aka luvcheney. First off, grow a set and stop with the sock puppeting. Second, blow it out your ass you arrogant piece of overfed shit. There is nothing wrong with investing, but the tax curve has become inverted and investors receive far better treatment, tax wise, than wage earners/productive human beings.
As to the other nonsense you spouted, yeah, stick to Rush, you are his target audience. BTW, thanks to ass lords like you, we are in this financial mess. Great job.
Pluto, tax system IS inverted. The top half pays 96% of the income tax. Capital gains, well, If I go work, pay taxes, save my money and my investment goes up, why should it get taxed again? Most folks dont save anything, they borrow and spend as much as they can, on cars, homes, spinning wheels, floppy pants,, weed, kids with no Daddies, on welfare. etc. Your "productive" people to dumb to get a home they could afford crashed the economy. So, if I save, I get punished? I paid cash for my home.
@luvcheney1 wealth concentration is inverted. the top 1% of people in the US control 80% of the wealth so it only makes sense that they pay more in taxes. But, if the tax rate was higher on profits, what would they do with their profits? They would do what they USED to do. They would reinvest them in the company instead of bleeding it dry. Instead, they take the profits, spend profligately and off shore the monies to avoid taxes all sanctioned by Reagan era policies.
Pluto, if half the people pay virtually No taxes, that is a growing set of people rewarding themselves for low productivity. Reward the non=productive, penalize the productive. This will give a bad result. If the company is very profitable, profits will be reinvested. If not, help them be more profitable or, of course they will leave. Raising taxes on business is not an incentive to stay. Top 1% pay 40%. Top 25% pays 87%. You are aware that total dollars paid increased when tax rates lowered?
@luvcheney1 aka kuffarkid, obsess much? Rewarding themselves for low productivity you say? Like driving otherwise prosperous companies into the ground by over burdening them with debt and huge, inflated top step salaries? Yeah, real productive there sparky.
As to that bull shit about total taxes paid increasing when the rate lowered, there were hidden costs that totally negated the gains. But you and yours care shit for subtle, you seem to only understand and hear sound bites.
Pluto, If a company "drives itself into the ground" as you say, we have a mechanism for that called "bankruptcy". Seems like GOVT is not aware of that. The Federal Reserve had an easy money, low interest rate, inflating money supply, credit expanding bubble that was reflected in the housing bubble. It had to burst eventually, and all those mortgages lost value, and collapsed the banking system. Blame the FED. Houses, credit for mortgages can NOT rise all over so far without the credit to fuel it
@luvcheney1 aka kuffarkid. If Thom has 81 viewers and you consider that bad, how do you feel about Faux Business having to pay people to watch it? I mean DAMN! Can that channel be more awful if it tried? When I want updates on the market, I do not need to see old retreads from CNBC. Bloomberg is where you should stay, great channel.
Beck was from CNN. He made $23 million last year, $2 million of it from Fox. Well, if they pay people to watch Fox, please let me know, they owe me a lot of money. Pluto, my point is that most liberals (not all) really dont spend much time on it. Otherwise Hartman would compete with Rush. Beck was nothing at CNN, now gets 5million viewers a day.
@luvcheney1 They do owe you a lot of money, brain cells are irreplaceable. And why drag Beckerhead into this? Is he on Fox Business now? Gods I hope not, the man is a buffoon who can't even spell, much less do a EBITDA, his head would most likely implode if he even tried.
Beck is on Fox News, not Fox Business. Fox news Prime time is almost triple MSNBC, almost double CNN. Obviously, conservatives do NOT out number the pinkos, its just a much larger percent of us WATCH news. #1 talk radio is Rush, #2 is Hannity. We listen to politics when we drive, you guys roll the windows down and bother everyone with your obnoxious RAP music. I`m gonna get some giant speakers to put in the bed of my pickup, and force you to listen to Rush when you gas up, I`ll have my Model 19.
@luvcheney1 Numbers explained by your groups singularity mind set. you all travel in hordes. You all need to get on message so that your minority status can be mollified by you all acting and screaming in concert thus generating the appearance of greater numbers.
So, why don't you go drag a gay person behind your truck, lynch a black family, dump some toxins illegally or just go into an airport bathroom and do some toe tapping? I too have some cliches to use bitch.
Pluto, You are so touching. The % of families actually headed by fathers has dramatically fallen since "War on Poverty". The Welfare State has created now generations of families whose life is dependent of the State. Funny how African-American leaders do all they can to cultivate, grow the numbers of dependent people, on their knees, begging. I prefer to see folks get off their knees, but you can beat them down as a liberal. Because "you care", results dont matter, your "intentions" do.
You guys complain about taking responsibility but when evangelical conservatives have the highest divorce rate it's because the nanny state is forcing them to do it so that the conservatives will be dependent upon the state apparently all the while moaning about how the reason we're losing our moral values is because of policies that help conservative women get out of situations of being trapped in an abusive relationship being beaten by their drunken right wing red neck husbands.. Right?
in the USA there are about 305,000,000 people. Limbaugh claims 20 million listeners, estimates are between 8 to 20 million listeners a week. Even if it were 40 million a week, divide 40 million by 7 and you get less than 6 million a day. That means almost 2% of the country listens to Rush who by all accounts is the most listened to talking head on radio. Since modern ignorant conservatives make up about 10% of the USA I would think Rush's numbers would be much higher.
lisa, unfortunately, some conservatives happen to work, remember, the top half pays 96% of the Fed income tax. Do you mind if we go pay for your liberal ideas? You would think the inner city liberal dependent hordes would listen to some socialist rant somewhere. Rush doesnt work 7 days a week, its 5, and he does take a lot of days off.
I'd like to see Thom critique the movie Food Inc. the illegal immigrants are taking over our food industry jobs. the employers like Perdue advertises in Mexico. gov't is subsidizing the corporate farmers, keeping the family farmers under their thumbs. subsidies were only given to family farmers until Nixon's agricultural secretary, Earl Butz. HAPPY HOLIDAYS THOM.
Thank you, Thom, for mentioning student loan burdons. I began paying mine off when I was 21. I am 44 now and not much closer to being out from under. They have ways of keeping you under their thumb to be bought and sold on the bond market when your life is taking its harshest turns. This is hardly what I had in mind when I got my degrees. Saddest part: I have actually been "successful," but in a job market so unstable I have no consistancy. Merry Xmas, Thom.
Bingo, Pluton! That is EXACTLY where the jobs in my field have gone. We shall see how long that lasts, though. For a while they went to Japan, then Korea, then the Philippines, now India. Soon another slave labor colony will undercut them all. If the government wants to pave the way for corporations to take advantage of cheap labor to the exclusion of tending its own tax base, there may soon be no government left to pull us back from the brink as we fall into destitution and ignorance.
Perhaps we should bomb those awful 3rd world countries daring to produce and support their families!! Obviously, their lives, their children need to stay in the mud, because we deserve the 4 bedroom home, the Tahoe, 200 channels. My heart goes out to the American forced to rent, but the poor baby with the bloated belly, and the flies all over his face, well, he can sleep in the mud. Yea! Protectionism!
@luvcheney1 wtf? We only have 2 choices, to enslave them or bomb them? Is that where your world view ends? Wow. Borders have a purpose. They are like the cell membrane which allows a certain amount of things in or out to promote the health of the cell. Those poor nations need to keep the free trade wolves out and develop their own organic economies.
Yes, lets all build walls around our countries, keeping our stuff in, and their stuff out. As well as the capital too. Then, we could be just like Feudal times in Europe! Miss the Dark Ages?
@luvcheney1 again, all you see are extremes. If we want to import something that can't be made in this country, for example like specific wines or cheeses from France or something (many 1000s of other examples to be had), then fine, let's import those items and enjoy a healthy trade policy with our trade partners. But if something can be made in this country, we shouldn't give the jobs to another country so the companies can sell the goods back to us at the same price while making bigger profit.
The last time a television was made in the US was 1972. A 25" color tv then cost an average worker 73 or so hours of labor to buy it. Today an average worker can buy a 32" color/remote/av inputs/ stereo etc for about 25 hours of labor. You prefer the former?
@luvcheney1 we used to fund a large part of our Federal budget (even 100% if you go back far enough) with import tariffs. Those tariffs made sure that our working class and middle class citizens could pursue "Life, Liberty," and "Happiness" by making a living wage. Instead, today we have terrible wages while we save a few bucks on junk from China sold at Walmarts and the like. I'd rather pay a few more dollars on USA-made goods while my paycheck goes up by 30%-50%. Now that's smart.
Import tariffs were the main source of revenue in those days because it was the only way to collect revenue. Frontier country, how can they enforce, and collect an income/other taxes in that environment?? It was possible though, to observe ships at harbors. Tthey made those taxes because they were much easier to collect. It WOULD be smart, except it is not true.
@luvcheney1 If a country's major industries lose to foreign competition, the loss of jobs & tax revenue can severely impair parts of that country's economy and increase poverty. If a nation's standard of living or industrial regulations are too great, it's impossible for domestic industries to survive unprotected trade with inferior nations without compromising them; this compromise consists of a global race to the bottom. Protective tariffs have historically been used as a measure against this.
Obama just proposed tariffs on Chinese tires. Then the Chinese Govt said the US was subsidizing the production of cars (bailouts) and illegally "dumping" them in China. They also mentioned chicken parts!! Funny? So, we can send the chicken growers and the auto workers who will lose jobs over to the tire factory to work in those NEW jobs pissy will create. Obama and pissy are on the same page alright.
@luvcheney1 "The Smoot-Hawley tariff legislation was signed into law on June 17, 1930, well into the Great Depression. In the following 2 years, international trade dropped from 6% of GNP to roughly 2% of GNP (between 1930 and 1932), but most of that was the result of the depression going worldwide, not Smoot-Hawley.
Living in the woods, farming, making shoes, ranching, making candles, clothes etc. is romantic. But, when cities formed, railroads came, the increased SPECIALIZATION by everyone focusing on a individual trade, raised the standards of living for all. Some still live outside, and farmed and ranched, but traded. Free trade allows a greater degree of specialization among nations.
@luvcheney1 The main result of Smoot-Hawley was that American businesses now had strong financial incentives to do business with other American companies, rather than bring in products made with cheaper foreign labor: Americans started trading with other Americans. Smoot-Hawley didn't cause the Great Depression. It may have had a slight short-term negative effect on the economy ("1.4% at most" according to many historians), but its long-term effect was to bring American jobs back to America.
pissy, go to wiki, read "Great Depression in the United States". They, and many others disagree with your position. You also can surely google up about Obama`s tire tariffs with China, and their threat to retaliate with our auto and "chicken parts" exports. Surely, you see our partners will retaliate? They certainly did after Smoot-Hartley too. I would support a policy that worked. Making new jobs in tires, losing jobs in the auto and "chicken parts" parts does nothing but screw things up.
In 1850, 60% of our population worked in agriculture.(so 40% could do OTHER things). Today its 2% (so 98% does other things).That other 98% raise our living standards. When we import items that are cheaper, we can employ that worker in another capacity WE are more efficient at. , AND still have the imported item! We get both! If we block the item and do it our self, our worker does the less efficient job, and we are deprived of the ability to employ him in the more efficient job.We get one. 1<2
@luvcheney1 and we need to keep them from bringing their cheap shit made with slave labor back into this country so maybe we Americans can have the job of making the stuff with pride like we used to and get better paychecks than our service economy jobs currently provide.
I try to buy American...but sadly, 99% of the time, there just is no choice. The stores are stocked full of China product. Little to no choice. It's really depressing.
I never asked for your commentary on my life in the first place. I have no idea what makes you think that displaced Americans have all those luxuries or that they don't care about other nationalities. Fine - you go over there and save them all since you have all the answers, you swaggering, self-important loudmouth. Give them one of your pep talks about how it is all their fault. They will thank you for it.
Illegals by the 10`s of millions without an education like you, who cant speak English like you, whose only possessions are the clothes on their back, die in the desert for a chance to work here. They find work, live here, pay smugglers to bring relatives, and progress. Their children grow up, are police officers, firefighters, teachers, and fight and die in our Army. I have a sad story too, and I have no education, but I dont see myself as a victim. I refuse to participate in the recession.
Watch Dave Ramsey on Fox Business, he can show you how to get out of debt. I have no college education, raised/raising 5 kids, I`m near 60, have NEVER had an auto loan, NEVER run credit card debt, paid off a home on a 15yr mortgage about 18yrs ago, so when I moved, I wrote a check for my home. My DADDY told me when I want to buy a car, or whatever, I can do so if I actually have the money. Either your Daddy forgot to tell you that, or you didnt listen.
Regarding you being a college graduate and not having you loans paid off at 44 years old, and you are successful too, that seems to reflect on you. Dave Ramsey will teach you what your Daddy should have. As a successful, college graduate, money management should have been taught by SOMEONE. Start! You really shouldnt pay your loans with your Social Security check. I am an uneducated dupe, but I am debt-free, and not paying student loans at 44!!
@luvcheney1 exactly, I agree. Specific circumstances or tuition bill amounts should not factor in to a discussion about how affordable education is or isn't. Victims should be blamed wherever they exist so we can protect monopolies wherever they exist. That's the only righteous path for our nation's future. Long live greedy right wing liars on the radio and TV, along with their hate-filled listener pawns, such as yourself.
Yea, having to pay back a loan is evil. Guess those greedy banks should just pass it out. All you "victims" who thought you`d make a killing in real estate and couldnt pay back anything, well, of course, you had nothing to do with bank`s assets going to zero. I do think the greedy banks let us all down, they should have told all you greedy deadbeats trying to
get rich quick to keep on renting, sleeping in your cars, or under the bridge instead of loaning you the money to buy a home.
@luvcheney1 dumbass, can you read? paying back loans is the idea. The point is that education is not affordable, and it needs to be, for everyone. Stop and think before responding instead of being emotional in your responses.
Steve, i use a large dose of sarcasm, and exaggerate my positions. I am a conservative, and I know that Thom Hartman`s fans are a bunch of liberals, who feel good about themselves by being victims. I come here to light a firecracker, and watch you all jump. I work (just barely) out of my home, and I do actually learn things by looking up and studying about some dumb statement one of you will make. Your such statements just leave me overwhelmed.
@luvcheney1 you're only overwhelmed because you've been gobbling up illogic from conservative bullshit artists which you thought was the way the world should be. Then when you ponder the possibility (for all of 1.5 seconds) that you've been wrong in your thinking all of this time and have been being lied to all along, you get flustered and display a knee-JERK reaction of trashing liberals and calling us whiners just because we think things should not be this way.
Well, I AM glad I am not smart enough to hate our system, to hate both parties and dream of some nonexistent party saving me. Thinking Wall Street is after me, greedy bankers, ins co`s, my doctor, the bank that helped me get my 1st home, Big Pharma that makes my drugs.. Me? I saw the financial disaster, and Obama`s election as an OPPORTUNITY, screaming FEAR! I Read John Embry, Greg McCoach, and bought small cap gold mine stocks in Jan `09. Sold with 85% gains. I bet against the MESSIAH!
Yeah, it is all the borrowers' fault that loans are sold on the bond market, terms changed, sneaky penalties added, and resold as high-risk debt to foreigners. They don't want us to pay them off because that shuts the casino down. One day you will not have purchasing power and will become a commodity for sale to the highest bidder. Then you can scream from the private contractor's care facility about what a responsible citizen you are. You are not immune to Wall Street games.
Yeah, well that can change any time when you have an emergency, which is how most people get into debt in the first place. You base your entire attack on others on ONE difference between you and them. Why attack? What do you get out of it? Finally getting to repackage your laziness and lack of talent as a virtue? But if this is the limit of your political activism, have at it. Burn yourself out here. It doesn't sound like any activism that takes you away from your armchair interests you
Well, I used to work hard, now I`m taking it easy. So what? I sacrificed to pay off a home, To buy cars for cash, sacrificed to save for a rainy day. I`ve had plenty of emergencies too. Murphy is coming to knock on our doors. Thats a fact. Get ready BEFORE he comes, if he has been there already, sorry. He is coming back!
So sacrificing! Now your reward is getting to watch bad propoganda on a low-brow network and look for strangers to attack anonymously. Glad you earned your American Dream. It must be wonderful to be so wise that nothing can touch you, to be ready for all unforeseen changes in the world. Most of us would have wanted world travel after all that sacrifice, but if all you wanted was to imagine yourself superior to people smarter than you, guess you achieved it. Congrats.
Thanks. My message is simple, stay out of debt. Dont assume a victim mentality.Look out for yourself. Because, Obama sure as hell wont. Obama will spend us to destruction, look for hard assets, gold stocks, warrants. I got scared 2 weeks ago, am out of the gold stocks now. Made 85% since Jan 2009, thanks for scaring everybody, OBAMA!
I qualified for college. Did you, as an 18 year old really make a responsible money choice (like all 18 year olds do) to avoid higher education? Was it a choice? It must have sucked to be one of those kids in the "dummy group." Must have felt good to have a president who raised ignorance to a virtue. This country needs more than bubbas with their names on pickup trucks building mini-malls. BTW, my "daddy" is dying right now, so thanks for pointing out twice what a schmuck he was.
Sorry for your Dad, at least you still have a Daddy, mine has been dead for 37 years. From your own words, you are a successful college graduate, who at 44 has not yet paid for your education, but you are complaining about the institution who got you the money to get that education. I`m debt free. You are still paying off college, and call me the Bubba! I qualified for college, but I had better things to do at the time. Fun. At 59 I wish I had done things different but you dont hear me whining
No, you are busy accusing. You must have a very satisfying life if you are so merry around holiday time that you randomly pick fights with strangers. Tell ya what - when my "daddy" kicks off, I will let you know where we bury him so you can dance on his grave. Show him some Compassionate Conservatism. You really think I believe that someone at 18 qualified for college, chose fun over education, and is actually a responsible citizen based on that choice? College teaches reason; you have none
Hope you cooled off some. If I made you angry, I am Sorry. But, Thom, Obama, and nobody on this thread will help you. If you blame "the system" for your troubles, that discourages the only person who CAN help you. YOU.
Yes, the United States was founded by rich white men who didn't want to pay taxes -- and kept slaves.
Sadly, it seems much the same is true today.
So, "revolution" without a moral compass--
simply creates a new "abuser" from the previously abused. Like dysfunctional families, the abused learn what they live, and without change, continue to become those they condemn.
greatbroad 2 years ago 3
"White men" died to stop slavery too.You are aware that slavery as an institution began from before the pyramids in ancient Egypt, and forms of it still exist today? You are aware that the Africans themselves engaged in the slave trade, delivering them to ports for the American and European slavers? That the "noble" American Indians engaged in slavery? The "rich white" slave owners engaged in what was an ancient and common institution. You are being inflammatory.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
@ luvcheney1
Yes I realize my lead sentence can inflame. The point that 95% of Americans were too poor to have slaves, and it was only the rich 5% who did, painted us all with the slaver brush.
The main point I was making was the second part. Did you even read this far?
greatbroad 2 years ago
Is the "moral compass" the social safety net? The moral, kind system which condemns generation after generation of inner city children to crime and failure? While millions of illegal aliens who cant even speak English arrive with only the shirt on their back find jobs, live, move up the ladder and succeed? That "moral compass?
luvcheney1 2 years ago
No, it is not the social safety net you speak of.
greatbroad 2 years ago
Thanks to all the Libs who vote negativley to my comments! It isnt often you here from a conservative.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
luvcheney1, i think you have more posts on here than everyone else combined.
Are you just a rich person speaking out for his own interest?
Are you being paid by some rich people to spread propaganda to help their interests?
Or are you just a middle class or working class person who is advocating against your own interests.
I bet you are being paid.
nowellian 2 years ago
I am a conservative, a regular person of 58 yrs old, small business at home, who has studied economics, and finance informally, as a "hobby". since I observed silver coins disappearing from circulation in 1964. My older brother collected coins, gave me $10 day for me to go to the bank, get rolls of coins, and search them out for the "good ones, good dates". He would share the "good ones" with me. The phenomena of silver disappearing from circulation, lead me to monetary policy.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
I took the "moniker" luvcheney, because Libs hate Cheney (a Great Man) and it automatically makes them hate me. My interest in monetary policy leads me to invest in "junior gold stocks" ( highly volatile, risky), and "GLD", "SLV". I dont usually invest out of my area of interest. I am long "GLD right now, (with a stop). I am in cash in my speculative Gold miner stock 401k. 2009 was a spectacularly great year! The President, has created gigantic opportunities to make money. Thank you Obama! Pinko
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Thank you Thom...
I don't know how you do this everyday.
Happy Holiday & a more Progressive New Year.
madilyneh 2 years ago
He needs to earn a living. Did you listen to Thom in the video "Thom is challenging Wayne Root....."
Around 5min20sec Thom says that as a small businessman he is able to "zero out" his taxes, and that Wayne can too. Wayne replies "and thats good isnt it?". Thom, "thats totally good". Thom rants against the rich, wants them to pay high taxes, while he is happy he doesnt. Bet Thom is pretty rich, eh??
luvcheney1 2 years ago
What do you mean rwcbanzai?
Obama is just re inflating the same old balloon economy - Reaganomics continues!
nowellian 2 years ago
Reaganomics means lower taxes, lower spending (except more on the military). Obamanomics means higher taxes, higher spending (except lower on the military). They are exactly the opposite.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
@luvcheney1 Lower spending? Reagan more than tripled the national debt in his 8 yr. presidency and had the largest deficit since WW2.
arcturus33333 2 years ago
In 1979 the Fed Fund rate was 11.2%, the Fed Fund rate was 20% in 1981. Reagan became president in Jan 2001. The present rate is less than 1/4 of 1 %, or .25%. I am sure you understand the effect of the business cycle on the deficit, and can appreciate the fact that if Bernanke raised the federal funds rate to 20%, the housing market, the economy in general would collapse. Paul Volker raised the Fed Fund rate to kill inflation. This had an adverse affect on the deficit.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Thom Hartman is right on!
nowellian 2 years ago 2
rwcbanzai,
I wish reagonomics is dead on arrival in 2010, but Obama is keeping it alive.
nowellian 2 years ago
5 stars. We need more true patriots like Thom.
arcturus33333 2 years ago 6
Like a hole in the head.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Obama is doing just fine in destroying the economy, he doesnt need Thom`s help.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
This is spot on. Of course, everything he says here in nothing new to a thinking person. I can't wait for a day when people will rooting and voting against there own interests purely for idealism. As our middle class disappears due to an unfair tax system and corporation's always are first and are always right loving law making, it is funny to me that people believe that it is OK for someone that is filthy rich to pay next to nothing in taxes compared to the average American. Wake up. Please.
quack10 2 years ago 5
This comment has received too many negative votes show
If your tax return has a positive Adj Gross Income, and your income is at the median level, (half more, half less), half the country that earns less than you pays 4% of the Federal Income tax, the half earning more than you pays 96%. Taxing is progressive, Libs like that. Now corporate taxes are a different matter. Any cost of a corporation is paid by the customer of the corp. Libs like that too, but they are just taxing themselves. But, they are "thinking people".
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Thom Hartmans Christmas message: CEO`s, Banksters, Wall Street, Insurance companies, Free Trade, all in bed with Congress, Thats why we are helpless, hopeless, and dependent, until we OVERTHROW the man!! External forces against us! CONSERVATIVE message? Take responsibility for yourself, improve your life by your own actions, success is your responsibility. Problems? Take the blame. Why even TRY if you believe THOM? Hope and change? Sure, wait for a politician to help you? Help yourself.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Tom Delay locks away slaves in overseas, unsafe, grimy factories?
Google "tom delay mariana islands" and you'll see just what the fuck Hartmann is talking about.
bamboozlewatch 2 years ago 6
Obviously, these "awful" jobs you refer to were BETTER than what was available to these workers who were IMMIGRANTS TO the Mariana`s! Picking strawberries in California is not MY dream, but it is to the illegals who die in our deserts for the opportunity. AS the U.S. went from agriculture to manufacturing, the conditions were not so cushy as they are today. Your point? If they dont get union wages and all their 15 minute breaks, let them starve to death?
luvcheney1 2 years ago
TAX the Rich! Rich guy puts his mistress in swanky NY apartment. Helps the housing market, pays property taxes, revenues and taxes to the utility companies, employment for the doorman (tips too!), plumbers, electricians, garbage men. Buys her a Mercedes, commission for the salesman, dealer employs mechanics, car washers, office staff, buys her jewelry, job for salesgirl, pays costs of jewelery bus, Clothes, shoes, Victorias secret, tips for single mother waitress, dishwasher, cook, taxes, etc.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Then Obama says, TAX THE RICH". He takes the money from that rich guy, so he can NOT afford that beautiful, cooperative creature, and then he spends it to "create jobs". 53% of our Govt educated population says, "Tax the rich, Obama will make jobs." They think that you can take a bucket of water from one side of the tub, and pour it in the other side, and it will fill up.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
You must be talking about your republican representatives... after all, their scadals DID involve GIRLS this year! You must be proud.
(Nobody likes a trolling sockpuppet... you should maybe spruce up your channel, BTW. Dead giveaway.)
julsHz 2 years ago 3
Whats a scadal? Do you mean republicans like girls? I thought we were more inclusive than that.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Hey, help me out here. I see sock puppet is someone pretending to be someone else? Who am I really then? Now, I never did anything to my channel, is that an issue? I went to yours, looks like a trip I had 40 years ago. Far out!! But, I got scared, thought i would get a flashback.....trails man..........
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Happy to help- that's what liberals call compassion and conservatives call weak, or socialistic. But, never mistake kindness for weakness.
So you joined YT a few days ago, chose a name that implies you'd like to bed Cheney, all for the express purpose of finding liberals to bash and to spead your conservative wisdom? I can't explain your motivation, but it seems sketchy at best. 108 yrs old? Doubtful- so I have reason to be skeptical of you. Hope this was helpful.
julsHz 2 years ago 2
Well, it is amusing to watch you all. I also "luv: Reagan, but I chose the moniker because it is the fastest way to irritate a lib. But, thanks for adding sock puppet to my vocabulary.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Sorry for the delayed response- had to run out to get an abortion, meet with my commie/fascist/socialist organizers, volunteer at the local shelter, and on the way home, I hugged a tree. Man, what a great country! And it will be so much better when all the baby- boomers like you, who have sucked this country dry with your greed and fear of true social progress, are cold and dead. Tick- tock, tick- tock, pal.
BTW- the Founding Fathers were progressives- history is on our side.
julsHz 2 years ago
You are right about one thing... this is amusing.
julsHz 2 years ago
I dont really see a specific critique here. As for us old baby boomers, with the $100 trillion unfunded liability of Social Security, and our wonderful Medicare Health insurance program (socialist designed), you actually dont have a future. Too late for you ........Me? I thought Obama`s spending, coupled with the financial collapse, presented a grand opportunity to make a buck, so I moved my 401k`s into speculative gold stocks (see John Embry, Greg McCoach) and sold out this year`s gain of 85%
luvcheney1 2 years ago
So WTF are you complaining about? I'm LMAO, dude. You made money off of the current administration's decisions, and still you ridicule? You make no sense.
Here's the specific critique layed out for you: This country will be much better off when all the baby- boomers are dead and gone. Since you tend to have a myopic view of life (I, I, Me, Me, Mine), please include yourself in that statement.
Clear gramps?
julsHz 2 years ago
LMAO? At least I got another word in my vocabulary, I had to Google it .Still could use an interpreter. As for my ridiculing the administration, personally I would like to see a much smaller govt, and the Federal reserve abolished. But, I live in the real world, and need to prosper even if the socialists are in power. Forgive my arrogance, I just get off when I make a lot of $, like when I used to sell cars, and every dope I met left deep in debt, like the sound of a girl sighing in my ear.....
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Spare me what gets your rocks off- and you accuse Thom of using vile terms like teabagging... sigh.
You like to add to your vocabulary? Good- here's a new one for you- social democracy. The cruel type of 'socialism' you speak of is dead- has been for decades. What has emerged since WWII has been social democracy- high taxes at the top, strong safety net at the bottom. Google this: Equality Trust UK. Download the PPT slides- the US is bottom of the heap with a cascade of social ills...
julsHz 2 years ago
due to finacial inequality. 50 years of data compiled from around the world- their statistcal methodology has been peer reviewed- and the results are in. 'Richness' of a country doesn't matter- the gap between rich and poor does. I trust you learned how to read a graph while selling cars. Chirping about smaller gov't is a useless distraction- the disease is not gov't- it's extreme wealth and power creating the enormous canyon between rich and poor.
julsHz 2 years ago
EU (27 nations) $15.25 Trillion GDP. US 14.26 Trillion GDP. EU population 499million, US pop 307million. So, the GREAT Europeans, produce 7% more than the US with 63% more people. But,
at least no effort is as profitable there as effort.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
My god, man. You keep talking about profit when I'm talking about people. YOU CANNOT EVALUATE A HUMAN LIFE LIKE A BOTTOM LINE.
You are a shallow man.
julsHz 2 years ago
GDP is not profit, it correlates to productivity. It makes you "feel better" to try to reduce the wealth and productivity of the US, if you cam spread it around based on equality, rather than effort. To a Lib, good intentions are the end, not results.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Listen, it's been fun, but you and I are not communicating. All of your comments are about money, and if that's what makes you happy, fine. I personally think there's more to this life than being aquisitive. Enjoy your money, but remember- you'll leave this life like you began- naked and alone. See ya.
BTW- you probably made Thom some money with all your comments. Thanks.
Figure it out.
julsHz 2 years ago
Go to Thom Hartman`s You Tube video "Thom is challenging Wayne Root - Economics that libertarians & conservatives don`t understand". Start at 5min20 secs and listen to Thom explain that as a small businessman, he is able to zero out his taxes at the end of the year, his guest Wayne asks "that`s good isnt it:", and Thom answers "it`s totally good." Thom is a capitalist who doesnt like paying taxes, just like me. Thom and I have more in common than Thom and you do.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
No doubt- Thom created seven companies and has written 19 books. I'm well aware of his contributions to capitalism- I have no problem with someone doing well. I do have a problem with predatory capitalism with no restrictions- and so does Thom. He's an advocate of social democracy- watch some more of his videos.
I don't agree with Thom on everything- but then, what 2 people do? I admire him for being a passionate, outspoken , intelligent progressive- this is where we meet.
julsHz 2 years ago
There are 2 Thoms. 1st Thom a is rich capitalist, who says he can zero out his taxes as a businessman, and that is "totally good". 2nd Thom is a Lib who rants against the rich, the disparity between rich and poor, wants the rich to pay much higher taxes. Limbaugh`s actions are the same as Thom #1`s, but Rush`s words and actions are the same. I am totally fine with Thom #1, and actually, I am also fine with Thom #2, because it is just a load of bull to earn a living with. Or, he`s a hypocrite.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Selling a car, making a lot of money, doesnt cause orgasms The "urban dictionary" says 2) "to enjoy tremendously". You took it sexually. As for Thom, doyou maintaine that instead of "tea partier", he says "tea-bagger" without the sexual context? About the website: its not surprising that in a more market oriented society, with less taxes, that people who make bad decisions have bad outcomes. You prefer that good or bad decisions lead to the same outcome.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Yea, get it out, its stinking up the place.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Thank you for standing up for clarity and truth in these Orwellian times Thom.
But, I'm still not sure about the Employees Free Choice Act. Secret ballots are a necessity for the democratic process to not be corrupted.
Solidarity!
nowellian 2 years ago
Not a TRUE believer? Corrupting the process IS the intent! "The end justifies the means".
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Thirty years of Reaganomics have taught us that government is the only solution to the problems we created by treating government as the problem.
This is known to everyone in the world except the Obama Administration.
PerryLogan 2 years ago 3
Jeez, the the socialists think Obama is a conservative!
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Yea, and what is wrong with that?
nowellian 2 years ago
Just funny, thats all.Guess that "hope and Change" is not working out for you, is it?
luvcheney1 2 years ago
I knew Obama was a corporate Manchurian Candidate. I voted for Nader!
nowellian 2 years ago
We right wing radicals thought he was just another dopey left wing puke, but turns out he`s Hugo Chavez.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
luvcheney,
He is more like Ronald Reagan than Chavez.
Chavez is a real socialist, Obama is a real capitalist. You are a real ditto head!
nowellian 2 years ago
Chavez has run his oil industry into the ground, Obama is racing him to the bottom. Yes, I am a ditto head.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Chavez has used his oil industry to help the people of Venezuela not oil billionaires.
nowellian 2 years ago
Oil is half of Venezuela`s economy, oil production is down 25% since 1999, when Chavez became President. Mexico also owns the oil industry. There is a political struggle there because of declining oil production. Mexico also "helps people, not billionaires". Mexico has spent oil profits on the "people". Capital for exploration is needed from US corps to raise production, share in Mexican profits. Mexican Libs dont like that, so the industries ability to help the poor will decline. Kill the goose
luvcheney1 2 years ago
luvcheney,
Oil production is down because of the economy. Even so, the money is going to the Venezuelan people now not to US oil companies.
Every community now has a doctor and every Venezuelan has free health care now that Chavez made a deal with Cuba to swap doctors for oil.
The political struggle in Venezuela is between the Venezuelan people and the former elite ruling 'oil' class.
The people are winning with the help of Hugo Chavez!
Venezuela need no help from murdering US corps.
nowellian 2 years ago
Oil was $10 barrel when Chavez became president. Hugo had it easy, oil is their economy, and the oil price exploded. It`s production peaked at 4 million barrels a day, presently is 2.6million. Reserves are 171 bill barrels, 2nd on earth. In 1998, there were 109 oil rigs drilling. (trying to get oil to sell), by 2002 there were 35. It is always possible to sell oil by lowering the price slightly. If a fool spends all the profits, there is NOT capital to get the oil out. Same for Mexico.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
@nowellian Glad to hear that. I also voted for Nader, in 04 and 08 both. At least we tried to steer the country back on track. Probably will vote only for Independents this year in the primaries. We need to clean house of the two-party dictatorship, which is just making things worse every year.
arcturus33333 2 years ago
Thom says the govt is in bed with the Banksters, and Corporate interests. So, you like the Govt?
luvcheney1 2 years ago
IN 1920, Fed taxes were 3% of GDP, 3 years ago 18%, now 26% ( the crisis). Govt has been growing for 90 years. Ronnie, Bush did NOT roll back govt, they may have slowed it`s growth relative to what a Dem would have done. 90 years of growth of govt leaves you wanting continued growth of govt.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Joe Lieberman is a cunt
Blanch Lincoln is a cunt
Mary Landrieu is a cunt
Ben Nelson is the MOTHER OF ALL CUNTS!
Ed76638 2 years ago
Another Gentleman for socialism!
luvcheney1 2 years ago
This guy is brilliant. Read his book, Screwed, and it has zero to few flaws.
The one thing that really kills his message is the fact the dim witted right wing uncle ronnies out there just can't grasp what he is saying.
They will NEVER give up that "trickle down economics", nor the idea that tax breaks are the answer to all problems.
Simple minded buffoons just will never understand anything but their own smelly bull shit.
HulksHeroes 2 years ago 6
Brilliant technical analysis.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Lets tax the corporations more, sue them more, regulate more costs on them, have the unions strike for higher wages, and then we can all complain when they move to China, India, Brazil, Singapore. While we wait in the unemployment line. We dont need those stinking capitalists!
luvcheney1 2 years ago
luvcheney,
Corporations were taxed at a rate of over 90% in the '70's. They were better regulated and unionized then as well.
Now that tax rates have been cut to the 20-30% rate, less regulation, and broken unions corporations have moved most production overseas!
If we would just nationalize these industries they would not be able to fire workers and move over seas.
Your model is the old model that has failed us and left us in depression again.
It's time for something new!
nowellian 2 years ago
Revenue act of 1964 lowered corp taxes from 52% to 48%. You are mistaken.The rate is currently 35%, the 2nd highest of 30 OECD countries. At the same time US corp`s are taxed at a higher %, revenue generated is a lower % of GDP. Our country taxes at Fed and State level. Our corps taxes are past the point revenues are maximized. You do want maximum revenue, dont you?? Raise rates from here, revenues decline. Cut them to rates of OECD, revenues increase. And, corps can always go overseas.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
My model? I said that if govt raises costs for corporations, that will encourage them to move overseas. You say, nationalize the industries. How about the UK, nations of Eastern Europe, Soviet Union for a start. Do you want to replay a failure that took 50-100 years to play out? Nationalizing an industry will not relieve it from financial realities. If it is not productive, it dies. Innovation, expansion requires capital. Where has that worked??
luvcheney1 2 years ago
He hit on all the points. We've been destroyed by Reaganomics and Bushonomics, and Obamanomics is turning out to be too wimpy to meet the challenge. We need Krugmanomics or Bonneromics!
ComradeSephiroth 2 years ago
Yes, that pesky Obama is quite the conservative, isnt he?
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Power to the people, right on.
jimlaregina 2 years ago 3
MAO says, "Political power flows from the barrel of a gun" Sorry to mention it, we got most the guns. God bless Dick Cheney!
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Yes, the United States has most of the guns and look how great we're doing!
jimlaregina 2 years ago 2
Thats true, but I sense sarcasm.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Yea, burn baby, burn. Start in your neighborhood please.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
You tell them Thom!
Hallstyle 2 years ago
Yea Thom, tell `em! You have no hope! Everyone is out to screw you! Have another reefer, turn on The Colbert Report, and fall asleep. You will have many of your troubles solved that way!
luvcheney1 2 years ago
? Sorry I don't understand gibberish!
Hallstyle 2 years ago
Hey yeah Thom wants to do all the things that Hoover and FDR did. That worked out real well for them didn't it?
TheKuffarKid 2 years ago
@TheKuffarKid huh? Are you on drugs or just counting on no one noticing that you are trying to slip in more disinfo there luvcheney? Hoover? Mister tax cuts? Go fuck yourself. Hoover was a republocrap in the finest tradition of the species you twat. But, from a sock puppeteer like you, what else should one expect?
Plutonwolf 2 years ago 6
Pluto, I have the feeling that you disagree. Am I interpreting correctly your sentiments?
luvcheney1 2 years ago
In responding to lisabob I noticed this post. I am not luvcheney sorry try again.
TheKuffarKid 2 years ago
Hoover and FDR did completely different things. Hoover was a republican, and FDR a Democrat. FDR policies delivered us out from the Republican caused great depression and Hoover policies made it worse. Most of what FDR did worked very well until the republicans overturned them and lead us to the brink of another republican caused great depression.
Thanks to republican policies that overturned glass-steagal wall street's greed screwed us and we bailed them out
lisabob22 2 years ago
The Federal Reserve was created in 1913. The economy was always cyclical before the Fed, but it tried to eliminates business cycles, to avoid recessions. It would stimulate the economy through monetary policy, prolonging the boom. Remember the "Roaring 20`s"? The boom went too long, the fall was hard. They call it the Great Depression because its size was GREAT. The Stock market crashed in 1929, the Depression ended in 1946. FDR`s policies took 17 years. Good luck until 2026!
luvcheney1 2 years ago
You are just flat wrong. Hoover increased Gov. spending by near 50% spending money on aloth of public works projects the most famous of which is Hoover Dam started in 1930. He also signed the Smoot-Hawley tarriff act, he also raised taxes on the 'rich' etc. Rexford B. Tugwell was an adviser to FDR in his 1st term and later said this; "We didn't admit it at the time, but practically the whole New Deal was extrapolated from the programs that Hoover started." YOU ARE JUST FLAT WRONG!!
TheKuffarKid 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Bring back our jobs!. Raise taxes, more unions, higher wages, more regulations, carbon taxes, spend, tax, regulate, spend, tax, regulate!!! That ought to encourage them to come back!. Dont those awful, psychopathic businessmen know they should come back here to such a welcome? I`m just a little guy, got my IRA`s, 401k, and I send my retirement money OUT of the U.S., into small gold mining co`s. I`m out now, up 85% this year. A couple of clicks and WOOOSH...capital out of the U.S..
luvcheney1 2 years ago
such clear thinking, and great communication
Justin9Noble 2 years ago
Clear communication and facts must be censored in our "democracy."
johnlouisville 2 years ago
Fuck Reagan's free market.
mrzack888 2 years ago 7
The "free market" is a naturally occurring phenomena when free people enter into voluntary transactions between each other. Reagan didnt invent it, it has always existed. At times, Govts attempt to override it. See "Edict on Prices", price controls in Roman times, 3rd century ad, . Emperor Diocletian. Or, you can check on Nixon`s Wage and Price controls, if you want. Or, Reagan abolished controls on oil industry 2nd day in office, price fell all the way to $10 eventually.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Free market is when no rules exists, and people cannot be trusted to not to abuse the system. Government is made up of citizens, and corporations are also run by citizens, how can one be trusted while another not?
mrzack888 2 years ago
The govt is irrelevant to a free transaction between between individuals, or between individuals and corporations. Because the free market, the pricing system, is a balance between the 2 sides of a trade. If the price is too high, consumers move to another supplier, or a substitute. This system works, the average corp profit is 5%. United Health (ins co), largest in the U.S., is 3.7% profit. $500 policy, $18.50 profit. WalMart, less than 4%. Average supermarket chain, 3%. Exxon-Mobil now, 5%.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
government is relevant. if you want sustainable growth. current system does not work for long term, current system cares only about short term gains and does not care about the good of the nation overall. fool.
mrzack888 2 years ago
Challenge a Libs beliefs with a financial statement, receive a reply of "feelings and emotions", and an insult for good measure.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Challenge a repuke tard about the reality of what has transpired, and receive a reply of delusion. how do u like your 401(k) now bitch??
mrzack888 2 years ago
I am a fan of monetary policy, like some are of football. The financial collapse and election of Obama was an opportunity. I read interviews with John Embry, who in late 2008, named a flock of small cap (junior miners) gold stocks. I subscribe to The Mining Speculator, by Greg McCoach. I moved assets from my 401K that has been in "GLD" into about 15 small gold stocks. I got nervous about 2 weeks ago, went into cash from the gold stocks, I am up 85% in 2009. How about you?
luvcheney1 2 years ago
i'm up 100% bitch, cuz i bought copper stocks spring of 2009. i wouldn't have asked if i had lost money fool.
mrzack888 2 years ago
Sure you did. Thats why you are in such a happy mood. You bought in at the exact perfect moment, but you dont believe in the market? By the way, mining stocks behave in a leveraged way, so if copper went up 100% (it did), mining stocks go up more. The 3 largest market cap copper mining shares all went up over 100%, and smaller cap stocks can go even higher. If what you say is true, you would be well over 100%. Sorry, I would bet 25% of my 401k you are not telling the truth.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
If it were true, it`s normal to share insight, related facts. If not to shore up your claim, out of a common interest with a fellow speculator. I shared with you 2 market experts, reason to enter the market, market sector of interest, a publication, stock symbol, The fact I sold my position recently, where a 10% decline in gold already occurred, implying a bigger decline in my gold stocks. If I timed the market perfectly, my gains would be way over 85%. You however, claim to be perfect. NOT!
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Thom will not EVER discuss the percent of profit of anything, the truth does not lend itself to his opinions. Its easier to say "they make billions". "Evil Banksters", "Gangsters in suits".
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Thanks, Thom- only you can put so much reason into such a tiny nutshell...
I was going to feature the part of 'A Christmas Carol' with Allister Sim throwing his quill over his shoulder as he says, "I don't deserve to be so happy!", on my channel for the day, but this one is closer to my heart.
Cheers!
Julia
julsHz 2 years ago 5
Gods, can we become any more screwed? I say, we need Thom to be far more visible, his words spread across the landscape and made part of the political fabric of the land. He has the perspective that is true, the heart that does care and the honesty to speak truth to power.
Those that have never suffered can never know what pain is and the CEO class is 90% composed of who have no empathy, the other 10% are merely sociopaths.
Bless you Thom, you are a treasure.
Plutonwolf 2 years ago 4
@Plutonwolf Thom is so invisible because people who believe this sort of thing are mostly busy listening to music, watching football, getting high, waiting in line down at the welfare office, bumming quarters, watching basketball,standing with cardboard signs on freeway exits, watching Californication on HBO etc. He has 81 other people like you listening to him on the radio. Guys like us watch Bloomberg, Fox Business, Rush Limbaugh.He makes us laugh, and we can click our 401K`s after the news
luvcheney1 2 years ago
@kuffarkid aka luvcheney. First off, grow a set and stop with the sock puppeting. Second, blow it out your ass you arrogant piece of overfed shit. There is nothing wrong with investing, but the tax curve has become inverted and investors receive far better treatment, tax wise, than wage earners/productive human beings.
As to the other nonsense you spouted, yeah, stick to Rush, you are his target audience. BTW, thanks to ass lords like you, we are in this financial mess. Great job.
Plutonwolf 2 years ago
Pluto, tax system IS inverted. The top half pays 96% of the income tax. Capital gains, well, If I go work, pay taxes, save my money and my investment goes up, why should it get taxed again? Most folks dont save anything, they borrow and spend as much as they can, on cars, homes, spinning wheels, floppy pants,, weed, kids with no Daddies, on welfare. etc. Your "productive" people to dumb to get a home they could afford crashed the economy. So, if I save, I get punished? I paid cash for my home.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
@luvcheney1 wealth concentration is inverted. the top 1% of people in the US control 80% of the wealth so it only makes sense that they pay more in taxes. But, if the tax rate was higher on profits, what would they do with their profits? They would do what they USED to do. They would reinvest them in the company instead of bleeding it dry. Instead, they take the profits, spend profligately and off shore the monies to avoid taxes all sanctioned by Reagan era policies.
Plutonwolf 2 years ago 3
Pluto, if half the people pay virtually No taxes, that is a growing set of people rewarding themselves for low productivity. Reward the non=productive, penalize the productive. This will give a bad result. If the company is very profitable, profits will be reinvested. If not, help them be more profitable or, of course they will leave. Raising taxes on business is not an incentive to stay. Top 1% pay 40%. Top 25% pays 87%. You are aware that total dollars paid increased when tax rates lowered?
luvcheney1 2 years ago
@luvcheney1 aka kuffarkid, obsess much? Rewarding themselves for low productivity you say? Like driving otherwise prosperous companies into the ground by over burdening them with debt and huge, inflated top step salaries? Yeah, real productive there sparky.
As to that bull shit about total taxes paid increasing when the rate lowered, there were hidden costs that totally negated the gains. But you and yours care shit for subtle, you seem to only understand and hear sound bites.
Plutonwolf 2 years ago 3
Pluto, If a company "drives itself into the ground" as you say, we have a mechanism for that called "bankruptcy". Seems like GOVT is not aware of that. The Federal Reserve had an easy money, low interest rate, inflating money supply, credit expanding bubble that was reflected in the housing bubble. It had to burst eventually, and all those mortgages lost value, and collapsed the banking system. Blame the FED. Houses, credit for mortgages can NOT rise all over so far without the credit to fuel it
luvcheney1 2 years ago
@luvcheney1 aka kuffarkid. If Thom has 81 viewers and you consider that bad, how do you feel about Faux Business having to pay people to watch it? I mean DAMN! Can that channel be more awful if it tried? When I want updates on the market, I do not need to see old retreads from CNBC. Bloomberg is where you should stay, great channel.
Plutonwolf 2 years ago 4
Beck was from CNN. He made $23 million last year, $2 million of it from Fox. Well, if they pay people to watch Fox, please let me know, they owe me a lot of money. Pluto, my point is that most liberals (not all) really dont spend much time on it. Otherwise Hartman would compete with Rush. Beck was nothing at CNN, now gets 5million viewers a day.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
@luvcheney1 They do owe you a lot of money, brain cells are irreplaceable. And why drag Beckerhead into this? Is he on Fox Business now? Gods I hope not, the man is a buffoon who can't even spell, much less do a EBITDA, his head would most likely implode if he even tried.
Plutonwolf 2 years ago 4
Beck is on Fox News, not Fox Business. Fox news Prime time is almost triple MSNBC, almost double CNN. Obviously, conservatives do NOT out number the pinkos, its just a much larger percent of us WATCH news. #1 talk radio is Rush, #2 is Hannity. We listen to politics when we drive, you guys roll the windows down and bother everyone with your obnoxious RAP music. I`m gonna get some giant speakers to put in the bed of my pickup, and force you to listen to Rush when you gas up, I`ll have my Model 19.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
@luvcheney1 Numbers explained by your groups singularity mind set. you all travel in hordes. You all need to get on message so that your minority status can be mollified by you all acting and screaming in concert thus generating the appearance of greater numbers.
So, why don't you go drag a gay person behind your truck, lynch a black family, dump some toxins illegally or just go into an airport bathroom and do some toe tapping? I too have some cliches to use bitch.
Plutonwolf 2 years ago 3
Pluto, You are so touching. The % of families actually headed by fathers has dramatically fallen since "War on Poverty". The Welfare State has created now generations of families whose life is dependent of the State. Funny how African-American leaders do all they can to cultivate, grow the numbers of dependent people, on their knees, begging. I prefer to see folks get off their knees, but you can beat them down as a liberal. Because "you care", results dont matter, your "intentions" do.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
You guys complain about taking responsibility but when evangelical conservatives have the highest divorce rate it's because the nanny state is forcing them to do it so that the conservatives will be dependent upon the state apparently all the while moaning about how the reason we're losing our moral values is because of policies that help conservative women get out of situations of being trapped in an abusive relationship being beaten by their drunken right wing red neck husbands.. Right?
d3p3ch3mod3 2 years ago 2
d3p, sorry, what the heck are you rambling about? Please, sober up and give me an insult I can understand. Thanks................
luvcheney1 2 years ago
in the USA there are about 305,000,000 people. Limbaugh claims 20 million listeners, estimates are between 8 to 20 million listeners a week. Even if it were 40 million a week, divide 40 million by 7 and you get less than 6 million a day. That means almost 2% of the country listens to Rush who by all accounts is the most listened to talking head on radio. Since modern ignorant conservatives make up about 10% of the USA I would think Rush's numbers would be much higher.
lisabob22 2 years ago 2
lisa, unfortunately, some conservatives happen to work, remember, the top half pays 96% of the Fed income tax. Do you mind if we go pay for your liberal ideas? You would think the inner city liberal dependent hordes would listen to some socialist rant somewhere. Rush doesnt work 7 days a week, its 5, and he does take a lot of days off.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Merry Christmas to YOU..
And lets h o p e 2010 will
suprice us all ...
in a posivtive way
GlobVetus 2 years ago 2
AMEN!
NewChicago 2 years ago
I'd like to see Thom critique the movie Food Inc. the illegal immigrants are taking over our food industry jobs. the employers like Perdue advertises in Mexico. gov't is subsidizing the corporate farmers, keeping the family farmers under their thumbs. subsidies were only given to family farmers until Nixon's agricultural secretary, Earl Butz. HAPPY HOLIDAYS THOM.
LouieArrighi 2 years ago 2
Thank you, Thom, for mentioning student loan burdons. I began paying mine off when I was 21. I am 44 now and not much closer to being out from under. They have ways of keeping you under their thumb to be bought and sold on the bond market when your life is taking its harshest turns. This is hardly what I had in mind when I got my degrees. Saddest part: I have actually been "successful," but in a job market so unstable I have no consistancy. Merry Xmas, Thom.
hollywoodartchick 2 years ago 3
Move to India, that seems to be where the jobs are soon to be all located.
Plutonwolf 2 years ago 2
Bingo, Pluton! That is EXACTLY where the jobs in my field have gone. We shall see how long that lasts, though. For a while they went to Japan, then Korea, then the Philippines, now India. Soon another slave labor colony will undercut them all. If the government wants to pave the way for corporations to take advantage of cheap labor to the exclusion of tending its own tax base, there may soon be no government left to pull us back from the brink as we fall into destitution and ignorance.
hollywoodartchick 2 years ago 2
Perhaps we should bomb those awful 3rd world countries daring to produce and support their families!! Obviously, their lives, their children need to stay in the mud, because we deserve the 4 bedroom home, the Tahoe, 200 channels. My heart goes out to the American forced to rent, but the poor baby with the bloated belly, and the flies all over his face, well, he can sleep in the mud. Yea! Protectionism!
luvcheney1 2 years ago
@luvcheney1 wtf? We only have 2 choices, to enslave them or bomb them? Is that where your world view ends? Wow. Borders have a purpose. They are like the cell membrane which allows a certain amount of things in or out to promote the health of the cell. Those poor nations need to keep the free trade wolves out and develop their own organic economies.
pissysteve 2 years ago 4
Yes, lets all build walls around our countries, keeping our stuff in, and their stuff out. As well as the capital too. Then, we could be just like Feudal times in Europe! Miss the Dark Ages?
luvcheney1 2 years ago
@luvcheney1 again, all you see are extremes. If we want to import something that can't be made in this country, for example like specific wines or cheeses from France or something (many 1000s of other examples to be had), then fine, let's import those items and enjoy a healthy trade policy with our trade partners. But if something can be made in this country, we shouldn't give the jobs to another country so the companies can sell the goods back to us at the same price while making bigger profit.
pissysteve 2 years ago 2
The last time a television was made in the US was 1972. A 25" color tv then cost an average worker 73 or so hours of labor to buy it. Today an average worker can buy a 32" color/remote/av inputs/ stereo etc for about 25 hours of labor. You prefer the former?
TheKuffarKid 2 years ago
@luvcheney1 we used to fund a large part of our Federal budget (even 100% if you go back far enough) with import tariffs. Those tariffs made sure that our working class and middle class citizens could pursue "Life, Liberty," and "Happiness" by making a living wage. Instead, today we have terrible wages while we save a few bucks on junk from China sold at Walmarts and the like. I'd rather pay a few more dollars on USA-made goods while my paycheck goes up by 30%-50%. Now that's smart.
pissysteve 2 years ago 2
Import tariffs were the main source of revenue in those days because it was the only way to collect revenue. Frontier country, how can they enforce, and collect an income/other taxes in that environment?? It was possible though, to observe ships at harbors. Tthey made those taxes because they were much easier to collect. It WOULD be smart, except it is not true.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
@luvcheney1 If a country's major industries lose to foreign competition, the loss of jobs & tax revenue can severely impair parts of that country's economy and increase poverty. If a nation's standard of living or industrial regulations are too great, it's impossible for domestic industries to survive unprotected trade with inferior nations without compromising them; this compromise consists of a global race to the bottom. Protective tariffs have historically been used as a measure against this.
pissysteve 2 years ago 2
Obama just proposed tariffs on Chinese tires. Then the Chinese Govt said the US was subsidizing the production of cars (bailouts) and illegally "dumping" them in China. They also mentioned chicken parts!! Funny? So, we can send the chicken growers and the auto workers who will lose jobs over to the tire factory to work in those NEW jobs pissy will create. Obama and pissy are on the same page alright.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
See "Smoot-Hawley Tariff Act", passed June 17 1930. The Great Depression ended 16 years after we started you exact proposal.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
@luvcheney1 "The Smoot-Hawley tariff legislation was signed into law on June 17, 1930, well into the Great Depression. In the following 2 years, international trade dropped from 6% of GNP to roughly 2% of GNP (between 1930 and 1932), but most of that was the result of the depression going worldwide, not Smoot-Hawley.
pissysteve 2 years ago
Living in the woods, farming, making shoes, ranching, making candles, clothes etc. is romantic. But, when cities formed, railroads came, the increased SPECIALIZATION by everyone focusing on a individual trade, raised the standards of living for all. Some still live outside, and farmed and ranched, but traded. Free trade allows a greater degree of specialization among nations.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
@luvcheney1 The main result of Smoot-Hawley was that American businesses now had strong financial incentives to do business with other American companies, rather than bring in products made with cheaper foreign labor: Americans started trading with other Americans. Smoot-Hawley didn't cause the Great Depression. It may have had a slight short-term negative effect on the economy ("1.4% at most" according to many historians), but its long-term effect was to bring American jobs back to America.
pissysteve 2 years ago
pissy, go to wiki, read "Great Depression in the United States". They, and many others disagree with your position. You also can surely google up about Obama`s tire tariffs with China, and their threat to retaliate with our auto and "chicken parts" exports. Surely, you see our partners will retaliate? They certainly did after Smoot-Hartley too. I would support a policy that worked. Making new jobs in tires, losing jobs in the auto and "chicken parts" parts does nothing but screw things up.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
In 1850, 60% of our population worked in agriculture.(so 40% could do OTHER things). Today its 2% (so 98% does other things).That other 98% raise our living standards. When we import items that are cheaper, we can employ that worker in another capacity WE are more efficient at. , AND still have the imported item! We get both! If we block the item and do it our self, our worker does the less efficient job, and we are deprived of the ability to employ him in the more efficient job.We get one. 1<2
luvcheney1 2 years ago
@luvcheney1 and we need to keep them from bringing their cheap shit made with slave labor back into this country so maybe we Americans can have the job of making the stuff with pride like we used to and get better paychecks than our service economy jobs currently provide.
pissysteve 2 years ago 4
I try to buy American...but sadly, 99% of the time, there just is no choice. The stores are stocked full of China product. Little to no choice. It's really depressing.
HulksHeroes 2 years ago 3
I never asked for your commentary on my life in the first place. I have no idea what makes you think that displaced Americans have all those luxuries or that they don't care about other nationalities. Fine - you go over there and save them all since you have all the answers, you swaggering, self-important loudmouth. Give them one of your pep talks about how it is all their fault. They will thank you for it.
hollywoodartchick 2 years ago
Illegals by the 10`s of millions without an education like you, who cant speak English like you, whose only possessions are the clothes on their back, die in the desert for a chance to work here. They find work, live here, pay smugglers to bring relatives, and progress. Their children grow up, are police officers, firefighters, teachers, and fight and die in our Army. I have a sad story too, and I have no education, but I dont see myself as a victim. I refuse to participate in the recession.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Watch Dave Ramsey on Fox Business, he can show you how to get out of debt. I have no college education, raised/raising 5 kids, I`m near 60, have NEVER had an auto loan, NEVER run credit card debt, paid off a home on a 15yr mortgage about 18yrs ago, so when I moved, I wrote a check for my home. My DADDY told me when I want to buy a car, or whatever, I can do so if I actually have the money. Either your Daddy forgot to tell you that, or you didnt listen.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
I worked for that network and can tell you honestly that they knowingly lie thru their teeth. Congrats on being an uneducated dupe.
hollywoodartchick 2 years ago 3
Regarding you being a college graduate and not having you loans paid off at 44 years old, and you are successful too, that seems to reflect on you. Dave Ramsey will teach you what your Daddy should have. As a successful, college graduate, money management should have been taught by SOMEONE. Start! You really shouldnt pay your loans with your Social Security check. I am an uneducated dupe, but I am debt-free, and not paying student loans at 44!!
luvcheney1 2 years ago
@luvcheney1 exactly, I agree. Specific circumstances or tuition bill amounts should not factor in to a discussion about how affordable education is or isn't. Victims should be blamed wherever they exist so we can protect monopolies wherever they exist. That's the only righteous path for our nation's future. Long live greedy right wing liars on the radio and TV, along with their hate-filled listener pawns, such as yourself.
pissysteve 2 years ago 3
Yea, having to pay back a loan is evil. Guess those greedy banks should just pass it out. All you "victims" who thought you`d make a killing in real estate and couldnt pay back anything, well, of course, you had nothing to do with bank`s assets going to zero. I do think the greedy banks let us all down, they should have told all you greedy deadbeats trying to
get rich quick to keep on renting, sleeping in your cars, or under the bridge instead of loaning you the money to buy a home.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
@luvcheney1 dumbass, can you read? paying back loans is the idea. The point is that education is not affordable, and it needs to be, for everyone. Stop and think before responding instead of being emotional in your responses.
pissysteve 2 years ago 2
Steve, i use a large dose of sarcasm, and exaggerate my positions. I am a conservative, and I know that Thom Hartman`s fans are a bunch of liberals, who feel good about themselves by being victims. I come here to light a firecracker, and watch you all jump. I work (just barely) out of my home, and I do actually learn things by looking up and studying about some dumb statement one of you will make. Your such statements just leave me overwhelmed.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
@luvcheney1 you're only overwhelmed because you've been gobbling up illogic from conservative bullshit artists which you thought was the way the world should be. Then when you ponder the possibility (for all of 1.5 seconds) that you've been wrong in your thinking all of this time and have been being lied to all along, you get flustered and display a knee-JERK reaction of trashing liberals and calling us whiners just because we think things should not be this way.
pissysteve 2 years ago 2
Well, I AM glad I am not smart enough to hate our system, to hate both parties and dream of some nonexistent party saving me. Thinking Wall Street is after me, greedy bankers, ins co`s, my doctor, the bank that helped me get my 1st home, Big Pharma that makes my drugs.. Me? I saw the financial disaster, and Obama`s election as an OPPORTUNITY, screaming FEAR! I Read John Embry, Greg McCoach, and bought small cap gold mine stocks in Jan `09. Sold with 85% gains. I bet against the MESSIAH!
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Yeah, it is all the borrowers' fault that loans are sold on the bond market, terms changed, sneaky penalties added, and resold as high-risk debt to foreigners. They don't want us to pay them off because that shuts the casino down. One day you will not have purchasing power and will become a commodity for sale to the highest bidder. Then you can scream from the private contractor's care facility about what a responsible citizen you are. You are not immune to Wall Street games.
hollywoodartchick 2 years ago
Actually, I am immune. I dont owe any bank a penny.
luvcheney1 2 years ago
Yeah, well that can change any time when you have an emergency, which is how most people get into debt in the first place. You base your entire attack on others on ONE difference between you and them. Why attack? What do you get out of it? Finally getting to repackage your laziness and lack of talent as a virtue? But if this is the limit of your political activism, have at it. Burn yourself out here. It doesn't sound like any activism that takes you away from your armchair interests you
hollywoodartchick 2 years ago 2
Well, I used to work hard, now I`m taking it easy. So what? I sacrificed to pay off a home, To buy cars for cash, sacrificed to save for a rainy day. I`ve had plenty of emergencies too. Murphy is coming to knock on our doors. Thats a fact. Get ready BEFORE he comes, if he has been there already, sorry. He is coming back!
luvcheney1 2 years ago
So sacrificing! Now your reward is getting to watch bad propoganda on a low-brow network and look for strangers to attack anonymously. Glad you earned your American Dream. It must be wonderful to be so wise that nothing can touch you, to be ready for all unforeseen changes in the world. Most of us would have wanted world travel after all that sacrifice, but if all you wanted was to imagine yourself superior to people smarter than you, guess you achieved it. Congrats.
hollywoodartchick 2 years ago 2
Thanks. My message is simple, stay out of debt. Dont assume a victim mentality.Look out for yourself. Because, Obama sure as hell wont. Obama will spend us to destruction, look for hard assets, gold stocks, warrants. I got scared 2 weeks ago, am out of the gold stocks now. Made 85% since Jan 2009, thanks for scaring everybody, OBAMA!
luvcheney1 2 years ago
I qualified for college. Did you, as an 18 year old really make a responsible money choice (like all 18 year olds do) to avoid higher education? Was it a choice? It must have sucked to be one of those kids in the "dummy group." Must have felt good to have a president who raised ignorance to a virtue. This country needs more than bubbas with their names on pickup trucks building mini-malls. BTW, my "daddy" is dying right now, so thanks for pointing out twice what a schmuck he was.
hollywoodartchick 2 years ago
Sorry for your Dad, at least you still have a Daddy, mine has been dead for 37 years. From your own words, you are a successful college graduate, who at 44 has not yet paid for your education, but you are complaining about the institution who got you the money to get that education. I`m debt free. You are still paying off college, and call me the Bubba! I qualified for college, but I had better things to do at the time. Fun. At 59 I wish I had done things different but you dont hear me whining
luvcheney1 2 years ago
No, you are busy accusing. You must have a very satisfying life if you are so merry around holiday time that you randomly pick fights with strangers. Tell ya what - when my "daddy" kicks off, I will let you know where we bury him so you can dance on his grave. Show him some Compassionate Conservatism. You really think I believe that someone at 18 qualified for college, chose fun over education, and is actually a responsible citizen based on that choice? College teaches reason; you have none
hollywoodartchick 2 years ago 2
Hope you cooled off some. If I made you angry, I am Sorry. But, Thom, Obama, and nobody on this thread will help you. If you blame "the system" for your troubles, that discourages the only person who CAN help you. YOU.
luvcheney1 2 years ago