And the point is? If you watch Mr Hogan avidly there is one certainty,,,,,, repetition. You can split hairs on this but he was machine repetitive. Hence his record. If he were alive and young today he'd kick their arses. Of that there is no doubt.
True--esp. if you make everybody play musclebacks or straight blades and play the same ball today, Hogan--especially the 41-year-old Hogan--is gonna kill 'em. Lots of people know how he disparaged putting in his last few years, but in fact--as Snead says, and Snead would know--he was one of the best putters in the world from 10 feet in when he was at his peak. That's the thing that separates Woods from the pack when he's winning.
...then on top of that, let the rough grow and make it mean something to hit a fairway, and we'll see how that "these guys are good" campaign goes. There'll be about 50 guys who can break par, and that'll be it. When the U.S. Open was played at Torrey, both Tiger and Rocco were barely over 50% on fairways hit--AT THE U.S. OPEN--and tied for first. Fifty years ago with the rough like it was, you hit 50%, you're gonna shoot 85, I don't care what your name is.
You can't say anything about Hogan, 1P, etc., without somebody getting bent out of shape, but the vagaries of lining up the camera aside, it's true that Hogan was sometimes on the shoulder plane, sometimes above, sometimes below. We're talking about slight variations, mostly related to length of swing. On the very short swings, he was slightly below; on his longest swings, he was slightly above, if (and this is critical) you go from the shoulder socket to the middle of the butt of the club.
@emncaity Shoulder-schmoulder. Notice that the shaft of Hogan's club is PERFECTLY on plane both halfway back AND halfway down. This is done largely by losing height a bit on both the back-and-downswings. Check the top of Hogans head; approx. -2" each way! Tigers' called out all the time for this, but the fact is, almost ALL the great players do this, as it partially counters the shafts 'climb-up' as it travels from it's address plane up to around shoulder-level during the backswing.
@telescope3 Hey , Tele. I'm a huge fan of Hogan and have Five Lessons sitting right beside me. Your comment confused me a little bit, you didn't mean that he uses the same plane up and down did you? Because Hogan himself specifically says that the down plane is far shallower due to the hips rotating.
You might want to choose clips that are all filmed from the same position. The second clip where you suggest that Hogan's left arm is below his shoulder plane is bogus because the camera is slightly higher in comparison to the other two clips.
KOC, you can draw better lines than that. And even if you did draw perfect lines, hard to see the shoulder plane relationship with the left shoulder as some swings are taken from the outside...parallax.
Seems to me that the second clip is simply not a full a swing so it appears under the plane from behind.
donmcd71 1 month ago
Hogan today would not had a swing coach,
Unlike Tiger and Phil. I mean Tiger is trying to change his swing again? Hogan only used one swing...HIS
lonestargun 8 months ago
Let's all focus on shoulder plane instead of how to hit with lag, because amateurs have obviously mastered that part.
bunkerputt 1 year ago 2
And the point is? If you watch Mr Hogan avidly there is one certainty,,,,,, repetition. You can split hairs on this but he was machine repetitive. Hence his record. If he were alive and young today he'd kick their arses. Of that there is no doubt.
Muddo14 1 year ago
@Muddo14
True--esp. if you make everybody play musclebacks or straight blades and play the same ball today, Hogan--especially the 41-year-old Hogan--is gonna kill 'em. Lots of people know how he disparaged putting in his last few years, but in fact--as Snead says, and Snead would know--he was one of the best putters in the world from 10 feet in when he was at his peak. That's the thing that separates Woods from the pack when he's winning.
emncaity 1 year ago
@Muddo14
...then on top of that, let the rough grow and make it mean something to hit a fairway, and we'll see how that "these guys are good" campaign goes. There'll be about 50 guys who can break par, and that'll be it. When the U.S. Open was played at Torrey, both Tiger and Rocco were barely over 50% on fairways hit--AT THE U.S. OPEN--and tied for first. Fifty years ago with the rough like it was, you hit 50%, you're gonna shoot 85, I don't care what your name is.
emncaity 1 year ago
all 3 of these films are shot at different positions thus giving the illusion that theres a difference.
philebbesen 1 year ago
You can't say anything about Hogan, 1P, etc., without somebody getting bent out of shape, but the vagaries of lining up the camera aside, it's true that Hogan was sometimes on the shoulder plane, sometimes above, sometimes below. We're talking about slight variations, mostly related to length of swing. On the very short swings, he was slightly below; on his longest swings, he was slightly above, if (and this is critical) you go from the shoulder socket to the middle of the butt of the club.
emncaity 1 year ago 2
@emncaity Best answer
elnocho3 1 year ago
@elnocho3
Why, thank yuhverramussh.
emncaity 1 year ago
@emncaity Shoulder-schmoulder. Notice that the shaft of Hogan's club is PERFECTLY on plane both halfway back AND halfway down. This is done largely by losing height a bit on both the back-and-downswings. Check the top of Hogans head; approx. -2" each way! Tigers' called out all the time for this, but the fact is, almost ALL the great players do this, as it partially counters the shafts 'climb-up' as it travels from it's address plane up to around shoulder-level during the backswing.
telescope3 1 year ago
@telescope3 Hey , Tele. I'm a huge fan of Hogan and have Five Lessons sitting right beside me. Your comment confused me a little bit, you didn't mean that he uses the same plane up and down did you? Because Hogan himself specifically says that the down plane is far shallower due to the hips rotating.
Adam54545454 1 month ago
You might want to choose clips that are all filmed from the same position. The second clip where you suggest that Hogan's left arm is below his shoulder plane is bogus because the camera is slightly higher in comparison to the other two clips.
ellomikael 1 year ago
The line should be drawn from his neck to the ball, the shoulder plane isn't the plane he referred to in his book.
zedomax 2 years ago
KOC, you can draw better lines than that. And even if you did draw perfect lines, hard to see the shoulder plane relationship with the left shoulder as some swings are taken from the outside...parallax.
tongzilla 3 years ago