Bruce Lipton epigenetics part 1

[deadindisguise]

SKrY209.tk

CHECKIIIIT!!!

[XxCrusifyMexX]

Hello my name is scott and based in the theory that bruce h lipton has i have come up with a formula that i beleive can solve any disease I DO NOT wanna release information i have came across to the wrong person i need a docter to write back!

[ToYouWhoHaveEars1]

6:35 "There was life on this planet before there was DNA, so you can't say that that's the source of life." WOWWW!!! "In my training as an embryologist, and in my own research I had found that you could take a nucleus with all the genes, out of the cell and throw it away. And that the cell does not die. But the cell could live for two or more months with no genes in it...it still has its life...the genes are not controlling the life of the cell...the source of the control?...The skin.

[kukendal6]

How does this work for an infant or toddler getting cancer that ends up killing them when they are , as you have said, still just recording? Did they record thier parents telling them that they will get cancer and die? That is the part that I don;' understand about all of this. The children developing fatal illnesses after birth.

[gotSelena]

@kukendal6 maybe it's a very strong negative influence from a past life that has carried over perhaps..

[kukendal6]

How does this work for an infant or toddler getting cancer that ends up killing them when they are , as you have said, still just recording? Did they record thier parents telling them that they will get cancer and die? That is the part that I don;' understand about all of this. The children developing fatal illnesses after birth.

[iamdk007]

no one hear knows how money works. the goal of the world bankers(government)is power not money, money is only the ways and the means and by having a capitalist you make people fight and compete against each other rather the working together. you cannot tell a customer that the product next door is better you would not get business, so you see you cannot be ethical in a monetary system it does not work. watch zietgiest 2 addendum and the fall of the republic then end game all good documentaries

[arzoyan]

Capitalism the wage slavery of immense humanity in a politically corrupt,manipulated ,tyrannical,destructive MARKET SYSTEM OF ARTIFICIAL SCARCITY to perpetuate poverty and exploitation in the interest of the ruling capitalist class.This Market system of private gain and greed is the template for War,Enviormental destructions,animal cruelty and suffering, A social reality of alienation and dehumanisation, We need to share the Earth in harmony and cooperation for our common needs and well being

[Th3Wab3]

in this forum i think what we are missing is the understanding of the monetary system... im not one to generalize that capitalism is absolutely wrong because it has great characteristics and this is shred by all the other economic systems.. i do believe the inherent problem in all these systems is it's blood and foundation, debt based money.

[ananiasacts]

@Th3Wab3, Do you mean fractional reserve banking or the asset backing the reserve held by the central bank? If it is the latter, then can you explain why you feel a commodity, like gold, has a greater ability to retain value than the taxing authority of the federal government? It just doesn't make sense to me. It really is possible for gold to lose it's value--for example it can never be that much higher than the cost of mining it. And if the fed breaks, guns would skyrocket more than gold.

[Th3Wab3]

@ananiasacts fractional reserve... gold backed currency is just as arbitrary as anything else considering our modern technology

[ananiasacts]

@Th3Wab3, You didn't explain what you believe the problem is with FRB. I see nothing wrong with the strategy in principle. I'd love to know why you believe it is so tragically dysfunctional.

[arzoyan]

@ValoruUlimited Scientists are workers for CORPORATIONS or STATE working to come up with PROFITABLE products be it millitary / pharma / agro / energy or .the field of science is not some UNKNOWN that scientist try to understand for the betterment of our collective illumination and well being otherwise why patents or commercial rights or economic espionage. When we share the Earth for our common well being the process of science will be freed from shackles of minority interest.

[Th3Wab3]

@arzoyan it's is strange how people don't see how capitalism restricts natural selection and human advancement by restricting funds needed to pursue technologies that would benefit all...

[ananiasacts]

@Th3Wab3, It is not as strange as people who believe that they, or the public, or people we can elect, can do a better job of allocating capital that those folks with what it takes to have earned it in the first place--a demonstrated ability to deploy it in society enhancing ways. I think you are confusing different things with capitalism. I agree that our system makes it too easy for capitalists to exploit our government to transfer many of their real costs to the public. Different issue.

[Th3Wab3]

@ananiasacts i agree with you forst point but i don't understand where you make the distinction that my perspective of capitalism is flawed (please clarify).. in theory capitalism is great in theory socialism and communism is too (at least i think).

the problem is that i don't think any of those systems take into account human greed and the corruption that power has on individuals or parties. i don't agree with perpetuating a system that is flawed by it principal of generating capital....

[Th3Wab3]

@Th3Wab3 my point on the monetary system and the current supporting "capitalist" system is that by it's nature it forces every person on earth to have to work to eat sleep or for shelter... food can't be acquired without funds to buy and in order to have property you need money.. it is a system that enslaves man as opposed to benefiting man... their is no even starting point.. and jobs that benefit man or the earth do not provide people with enough money to live.. harmful job do! continued

[Th3Wab3]

@Th3Wab3 their is something wrong when a golfer or race car driver can earn 100, 000,000 in a year while scientist have to take up undesirable positions corrupt companies in order to make ens meat or people have to join the military for a check.. the monetary system uses to put people in a form of wage slavery..

[ananiasacts]

@Th3Wab3, The best explanation I think comes from Henry George's book "Progress and Poverty." The reason our brand capitalism does't work is because i is deeply riddled with externalities that effectively transfer wealth from poor to rich by neglecting to incorporate a mechanism to redress the inadvertent impact that enjoying our wealth has on other people. It's a relatively easy problem to fix, but very few people seem to realize that it is a problem at all. We become ideologues too easily.

[Th3Wab3]

@ananiasacts I'm glad that you bring up the point of externalities i haven't read Henry Georges book but I've watched Wendel Fitzgerald's short summation of the books thesis and i agree with it. it is very similar to the Venus project in principle and i am strongly for declaring all of the earth resources and land as the common heritage...

[ananiasacts]

@Th3Wab3, The Venus Project makes no sense to me. I can't see anything "evil" about money for example. Wealth is a useful idea I see no reason to abandon. I think we need merely redress the inadvertent impact we have on each other and there is an easy and very precise way to accomplish that because CO2 production is an accurate proxy for it. We must be made to buy the right to produce more than an average amount of CO2 from those who must then have produced less,, in an open market, to fix that.

[Th3Wab3]

@ananiasacts the inherent problem with money is that it is borrowed into existence with interest so for example for every 100 110 (with interest) is owed. the 10 (interest) does not exist and never can be payed back. much like the manorial land owner who produces nothing while and reaping profit from others work... all money in existence must be repaid with interest. check out the vid Money as Debt watch?v=vVkFb26u9g8

[ananiasacts]

@Th3Wab3, I disagree. What about changes in productivity? The reason we want there to be a little bit of inflation is because of the asymmetry of the alternative: Deflation is a greater threat because it is so much harder to control. Inflation is easy to control (simply raise interest rates.) But once they get to zero, there's little that can stop deflation other than quantitative easing, which is a far harder to implement as fairly. Gold's value is a poor substitute for taxing authority.

[Th3Wab3]

@ananiasacts could you explain what you mean by changes in productivity? and my problem with inflation is each new generation finds it more difficult to procure the wealth needed to sustain themselves, making it more difficult for have-nots to compete with haves in the market. i have no illusions about gold nor do i promote it as a reserve substitute... i think it is better to allot the necessary resources without the use of the middleman...

[ananiasacts]

@Th3Wab3, The trouble with communism is that it cannot avoid creating a disincentive to productivity (since you'll get out only what you need regardless of what you put in.) By productivity I mean the average amount of wealth created by an hour's worth of work by the average worker. That has been rising as significant rates for a very long time. You ask are right to ask 'How can we have increasing poverty while productivity is increasing so much?' Henry explained why, as I tired to summarize.

[ananiasacts]

@Th3Wab3,the fix for all of these problems is really simple: measure global CO2 production and give each person "income" in the form of "rights to produce the average amount" of CO2 and a global exchange on which to trade those rights. In this way, poverty becomes impossible, there is no need for any entitlement programs, it becomes possible to tax black markets, enforce a human rights standard, and a long list of other benefits. Lack of that mechanism is what stops capitalism from working.

[Th3Wab3]

@ananiasacts i vaguely see where you are going. what constitutes work? considering that technological advances continue to displace workers and this contributes to a saturation of workers in the service sector. how are these people going to contribute to society? are people going to earn while educating themselves?. i just think that productivity continues to increase and our current model feeds finite resources into an infinite concept of growth... do you see an alternative

[ananiasacts]

@Th3Wab3, This is only indirectly related to the issue of wages & work, which is a different problem. This is merely about redressing the measurable (though not necessarily meaningful) impact we have on each other via our behavior. You immediately see the suggestion as an entitlement program, but it really is exactly the opposite of that: a prevention of a presently ongoing and longstanding entitlement program. Without redressing the taking, we can't create the environment that would fix wages.

[iamdk007]

@ananiasacts interest rate is the problem. the money system in America is based on debt from the very minute the central bank gets in to action(federal reserve). income tax(40%) in America goes directly to the interest that has built up for the country. interest is for nothing but profit for a hand full of people. that bank will eventually own the world. and inflation would not be necessary at all if they didnt have to pay back money with money that doesnt exist until they inflate the money.

[ananiasacts]

@iamdk007, The Kahn academy has a great series of lectures on money if you wish to understand why the interest rate is not any sort of problem. Nor is basing our currency on our government's ability to tax us. You are wrong that the tax rate is 40% (higher for some, lower for others), that all of the government revenue goes to service the debt (I'm guessing less than 1/4 of it.), and that banks will eventually own the world. We want a small inflation rate for good reasons, as Kahn explains.

[iamdk007]

@ananiasacts federal reserve has engineered all the drops and rises in the market. its a show to keep you occupied. they are a private corporation and they are taking more of your rights everyday. not directly. they throw america in to wars all the time. including world war 1 2 and Vietnam. simply because when a war happens that country has to borrow money from the central bank on interest. i dont know how you find interest is not a problem because its the foundation of the central bank scam.

[arzoyan]

@Drastam I agree with you, obviously the rulers SHALL NOT relinquish their hold on our lives, Its up to us to organise democratically and create the consciousnees that CAPITALISM is a mechanism of minority exploitation of immense humanity in a politically manipulated market mechanism where the wage slavery of us empowers and enriches the ruling class. Once we become many there shall momentous movement of historic change from planet of slavery to a world of harmony and cooperation.

[arzoyan]

The future community of humanity will not be harking about equality , justice or fairness as the causes of ineqaulity , the horrors of worship of power/ private property shall be abolished and a community of harmony conscious of its abillities and resources will provide for our common needs and emotional well being, The banners of the french revolution of 1789 was EGALITE,LIBERTE AND JUSTICE to abolish the feudal,aristocratic hold on society and paving the way for the CAPITALISM.

[ananiasacts]

@arzoyan, there is a good discussion of these issues here: watch?v=rdiHWBVwuOM

[Th3Wab3]

@arzoyan strange how you can't see how "first world" country corporations hold "third world" country peoples in feudal slavery and economic marginalization... you have to look at the bigger picture what circumstances have allowed america to profit and the peoples of the third world to be forced from their lands into horrific factories...

[maitrimorningstar]

You'll find the need for crime, theft, drugs, etc, will decrease. The very reason there is crime, theft, etc, things that ruin a society, are direct result of inequality. It's a no brainer and so obvious I am a bit baffled why other people don't speak of it. It's something we strive for in families, in schools, in work places; the condition of treating people equally. It only makes sense to do it socially/globally. We can do this and we must. Cooperation works better than competition.

[hughtub]

@maitrimorningstar Egalitarianism is a religion that denies the lessons of Darwinian evolution. It is as wacky as creationism. There is no equality anywhere in nature. Violent crime stems from a preference for short term over long term gain, which is merely low IQ. Cooperation is only good among similar creatures. Different creatures always compete, and there is no instance in nature of multiple sub-species sharing the same habitat. One is either displaced or goes extinct.

[maitrimorningstar]

I think you missed the point about Darwinian evolution.  Crime has nothing to do with low I.Q. You can be brilliant and commit crimes or be brilliant and not be able to look past your own egotistical nature. It's pointless to debate with someone like you. You are convinced you are right. I don't think you have much room for anything other than your perspective.

[hughtub]

@maitrimorningstar You're projecting yourself. Crime does correlate with low IQ. It's a fact. There are exceptions, but the correlation is a fact. They commit crimes because it's easier to do that than provide value, since their lower IQ doesn't provide them many chances to add value to other people's lives for which they'd be compensated.

[maitrimorningstar]

We don't do that. Capitalism, as it is now, only thrives because of cheap labor....that is what built it. Someone is always repressed. It creates problems. To think beyond what we currently have to what makes sense for the world population is something that needs to happen and I think will. It becomes the only sensible solution after a point. And there are ways to do that. If everyone eats, is clothed, is educated, has a decent roof over their heads and is treated with respect...

[hughtub]

@maitrimorningstar You don't know what capitalism is. It's a system where you get what you pay for and don't have to pay for what you don't CONSENT to. Cheap labor only exists for jobs that have been made obsolete due to technological gains. Robots can do most things faster than humans. Blame govt public schools for costing us $10k/year for each kid, but giving them no greater skills than the cheap laborer in another country.

[maitrimorningstar]

You are so wrong about capitalism. Do some more reading. Your perspective is just to narrow to debate with. Sorry. You would just frustrate the heck out of me.  Not worth it.

[maitrimorningstar]

I think to find another system that works instead of Capitalism does not make one a communist. The argument that there is nothing better is silly as if to say stick with what you got because it's the best. I don't think it's difficult to figure out something better. I also think it's time WE the people figured out the something better. Our political leaders are too far removed from us and us them. The first place to start might be to look at what works best for EVERYONE.

[hughtub]

@maitrimorningstar Absolutely right about the gap b/w politicians and the people. Centralization/big govt/socialism is all the same thing. States/local govt can see what they need more than leaders thousands of miles away. Do you know that you support capitalism but just don't realize its manifestations? Local, small businesses doing services for one another is pure 100% capitalism.

[arzoyan]

@sn3192 would you tell me China the most profitable political economy in the world for the last two decades is a communist system? or Ex Soviet regime a state capitalist political dictatorship had anything to do with the principles of WORLD COMMUNITY OF HUMANITY SHARING THE EARTH IN COOPERATION FOR OUR COLLECTIVE NEEDS AND WELL BEING. We are living in the historical period of IDEOLOGICAL manipulation and distortation of the real interests of world working class .

[arzoyan]

We need to organise democratically with no leader and follower principle for a world of cooperation for our collective needs and well being. A community of humanity abolishing the class system where a few have dominated the immense humanity through the wage slavery in a politically manipulated market mechanism. Production for profit has enslaved,distorted and devalued humanity. Capitalism is an artificial brake to further progress and realisation of our true human cooperative qualities.

[arzoyan]

We are programed to believe that capitalism is the only way that humanity can provide for its material and spiritual needs. It is the acceptance and internalisation of false and dangerous beliefs that is destroying ourselves and our natural enviornment. Capitalism is a parasitic system destroying our world.

[sn3192]

@arzoyan then what do u suggest instead of capitalism?

i agree capitalism has its flaws. but they haven't come up with anything better up to date

i mean communism was a nice idea. but it just didn't work: sovjet union, DDR(east germany) total failures!

so again, what do you suggest?

[Drastam]

Correct.

It is a psychopathic system designed by and for psychopaths (non-empathics). They comprise a small % of our species, but they dominate us completely. They are more able in the Darwinian sense than empathic humans; they can act without the impediments of empathy or conscience. But their capitalist system is now a mortal threat to our survival as a species. So we are in dangerous times.

They will not relinquish their kingdom willingly; and they are capable of doing whatever it takes.

[arzoyan]

the only central dogma is the production for profit and that is taking the humanity to the brink of extinction, capitalism is the enemy of humanity , only by sharing the world for our common well being can there be any meaningfull step towards healing ourselves and OUR WORLD,OUR WORLD

[hughtub]

@arzoyan Capitalism is strangers stranded on an island providing services for each other to increase their individual survival. The parasites can't survive and die out. Socialism is the same strangers on the island, but the production of the workers is distributed equally, so instead of the most productive getting more food to increase in numbers, the parasites do. Socialism opposes the natural order.

[ananiasacts]

@arzoyan, I disagree. I see nothing wrong with capitalism itself. The problem is that we don't redress externalities in our economy that force us to inadvertently steal from each other surreptitiously. But it has nothing to do with capitalism.

The bottom line is that a process very close to brute capitalism is what made us and the entire web of life we're a part of. So it can't be all bad.

[Th3Wab3]

@ananiasacts this comment about capitalism is like saying slavery isn't all bad because it produces economic results.. well capitalism is wage slavery.. and capitalism had nothing to do with making us if anything all it did was "legally" or snakishly' take property from a large group and give it to a small group and it continues to do so.. it is much like a new religious system where priests r replaced with large capital holders.. free market capitalism would have been nice but it never existed

[Th3Wab3]

@ananiasacts capitalism has effectively and continues to effectively wipe out any remaining egalitarian groups and replace them with wealth based stratification... capitalisms infinite growth doctrine in a finite world may have worked early on but in the days of peak oil and dwindling resources it is a dated and failed system...

[ananiasacts]

@Th3Wab3, Your entire rant is meaningless. Substitute the term "natural selection" for "capitalism" and it reads exactly the same. The irony here is that I agree completely that our implementation of it has serious problems that I feel there are elegant and genuine solutions to. I've been trying to explain them for quite some time but keep finding people so jaded, intolerant, and close-minded it doesn't end up being a discussion, merely an opportunity for folks like you to vent rage. A waste.

[Th3Wab3]

@arzoyan simply, well put

[mejt1958]

@arzoyan So true my brother!!!!!!!!!!!

[CosmicRevolutionKS]

@arzoyan Our social, political, and economic systems are products of our minds: what we value, our interpretations of reality and how the world works, the place we believe we have in the universe. Saying "Capitalism is the enemy of humanity" makes it seem like, a) we didn't create it, and b) that if we only abolish it everything will be fine. If we change our internal consciousness (the way we view reality), the external landscape will change accordingly. The crisis is internal, not external.

[madmax200769]

The gene "model" is not just deterministic it is a simplistic/linear deterministic one

Often compared to a computer program the more accurate analogy of the central dogma would be that the DNA unfolds and runs like a computer program but with no inputs & only outputs

Real world programs, as with the genome interact with inputs to change the range of output probabilities. The real world is not simplistic, linear and deterministic. It is chaotic

c.f. emergentc complexity+abstraction+taxonom­ies

[Bluesage2009]

It is highly intelligent "chaos" . Chaos a human expression of our limited range of conceptual thought.

[gunman806]

DNA does appear to be fundamental. It is, after all, DNA which encodes the ligands and receptors that allows for intercellular communication to occur. Lipton almost seems to be suggesting that biological systems are controlled exclusively from the top down, when it appears as if control is bidirectional. That is, the parts are not autonomous, but neither is the whole.

[MsGrammarnazi]

I am hot for college instructors.

:)

[gunman806]

I wonder, was Lipton ever an honest scientist or has he always been a dogmatic ideologue?

[mermadeinheaven]

I dunno, but you sound kind've dogmatic yourself. lol

[gunman806]

The behaviour and morphology of cells is indeed influenced by environmental factors, however Mr. Lipton is exaggerating the degree of flexibility associated with these elements. Conflating the well-founded belief that organisms are chemical systems with the idea that human behaviour and morphology are both determined absolutely by genes is silly and dishonest.

[mermadeinheaven]

Environmental influences do factor into human behavior but their influence is secondary to inherent DNA algorithms. For instance, if ur genes configure ur brain to process information more creatively than logically, u will process reality more from the right-brain, which will affect ur behavior more than say being raised in an academic oriented family environment with copious amounts of stimulus to encourage academic thinking.

[gunman806]

I think we're in agreement. The basic macro-architecture of the central nervous system is determined by one's genome, however built into this wonderful system is the capacity for a high degree of flexibility.

[mermadeinheaven]

Yes, and so what I'm interested in is the question - Does this high degree of flexibility extend to encompass placebo type phenomenon, where a suggestion accepted at the subconscious (subjective) level of a person overrides the genetic or biological processes which would normally take precedence over all other influences?

[gunman806]

Thought seems to be the product of a biological process itself. What processes are you speaking of specifically? Research in the field of psychoneuroimmunology has made it clear that thoughts and attitudes affect other systems in the body and vice versa, however the degree of influence is limited.

[mermadeinheaven]

Yes, it would appear that thought is a product of biological processes, but recently there have been a number of studies demonstrating that by deliberately changing your emotional/mental (subjective) states, you can induce changes in biochemical production, which cascade down into measurable effects in behavior, performance, decision making and outcomes.

Basically, changes in subjectivity have been observed to cause changes at the objective level. And this correlates with the placebo affect.

[mermadeinheaven]

Now, if deliberate changes at the subjective level (changes in thought and emotion of the individual) can influences biochemical production which can have a major influence in the outcomes of that individuals life, then it suggests an extremely high degree of flexibility. Because usually these kinds of processes function without any application of conscious intent. If they can be influenced by conscious intent, then I find that very fascinating.

[gunman806]

I'm still grappling with the question of freedom to will, or veto. Let's not venture there just yet.

[mermadeinheaven]

If we can choose an emotion to focus on, and if by that focusing we can change our biochemical production, and if by changing our biochemical production we can improve our performance at certain tasks, then i'd say that constitutes proof of the existence of freewill. Because usually we would not have that choice. i.e., to change hardwired biological processes.

[gunman806]

Ah, but where does cause begin and effect end?

[mermadeinheaven]

The cause begins in the now and ends in the now. For instance, if you decide to change your biochemical production, that decision itself has a measurable causal efficacy. And although we cant say that it is the single cause of the whole of existence, we can say that it is proof of a greater degree of free-will (as it pertains to our physiology) than was previously believed possible.

[gunman806]

This is tricky. How does one know that a decision which appears to have been caused by will was not simply the result of a previous brain state of which one may or may not have been conscious of? It could very well be another addition on the causal chain.

[mermadeinheaven]

Regardless of whether a decision made in the present is the result of a previous brain state or not, it would not overshadow the fact that we have greater freewill to change our physiological than previously thought. This is far more significant than determining the original cause that lead to the decision (i.e., whether the cause was matter or consciousness), because understanding the original cause is not required in order to procure significant measurable results in the immediate future.

[gunman806]

Agreed, it's a useful tool which warrants further investigation. Debating determinism versus free will is akin to arguing as to whether or not a God exists.

[gunman806]

Aye, the distinction between mind and brain is one of convenience. Now if only I could derive results from suggesting to myself to up-regulate cannabinoid production.

[mermadeinheaven]

But you'd have to agree that there is the obvious distinction between a biochemical process (as observed) in the brain and the subjective experience of that process. Like, it's one thing to look at the THC and another thing to experience it hehe. That's the distinction between objective processes and subjective experience, or brain and mind. Mind seems to be the subtle or the two.

[gunman806]

Yes, it's difficult to conceive of the two as being one, but then again, our brains are constantly establishing arbitrary divisions. Explaining consciousness in reductionist terms is challenging, and I think reveals its limitations.

[mermadeinheaven]

Following through on that, if we change the subtle aspect of the brain (what we can refer to as 'mind') by application of cognitive processes (attention, imagination, memory), then of course we will observe corresponding changes in the brain. But then the question that comes to mind is, Would these changes still happen if we did not experience changes at the subjective level? Like, if i didn't feel like i was going to be cured, would the placebo tablet still work? The evidence seems to say "No".

[gunman806]

This is when language starts becoming problematic I think, I'll do my best regardless. Is the subjective expectation of being cured a thing unto itself, or is it a description or representation of an underlying brain state? It's possible to resolve a state of depression using a placebo, as one forms positive expectations and experiences a shift in attitude towards the better. I would think that genuine commitment is necessary for such a thing to work as you suggested.

[mermadeinheaven]

"...or is it a description or representation of an underlying brain state?"

I would say that the subjective experience is qualitatively different than say an image of a brain state, bc it's possible to look at fMRI brain scans and still not know what the person whose brain has been scanned is experiencing. Youre only going to be able to extrapolate information about their subjective experience via the brain scan, but you will still be missing the subjective piece ... It's a big piece!

[gunman806]

Oh certainly, using brain scans to infer subjective states is useful only to a degree. Unless we somehow succeed in merging two brains together, we're trapped in individual subjective realms. My subjective state is "pinned" to my brain, as is the case with every other person I assume.

[mermadeinheaven]

"Is the subjective expectation of being cured a thing unto itself, or is it a description or representation of an underlying brain state?"

It's a thing unto itself, otherwise subjective experience would not reveal anything that its representation could not. Like comparing the description given by someone playing a video game VS playing the game yourself. The subjective experience you undergo while being there and playing it is vastly more revealing than any description can ever be.

[mermadeinheaven]

That's why we often say.. "Have you experienced it? if you haven't then you don't know what you're missing". Because while a person may have read a description of the experience (a representation of it), if they have not had a direct (subjective) experience, then they're still essentially a "virgin" of that experience.

[ValorUnlimited]

The answer I would say, is probably yes, although one of the MAJOR factors of epigenetics which Liption chooses to omit are multigenerational epigenetic factors. Whereas stimuli which your parents and grandparents were exposed to can negate and even reverse environmental stimuli that you are exposed to on a generational level. There's a Nova special on this called "Ghost in your Genes". Very compelling stuff. Stuff that gets conveniently overlooked in his work.

[mermadeinheaven]

"which Liption chooses to omit .."

But why? If sensory stimuli, beliefs, mental habits, and emotional states etc that we get exposed to and/or harbor (over time) can affect the way our genes behave, then the same applied to our ancestors, which would mean that what we think of as ourselves (our current personal behaviors, thoughts, beliefs, emotions, and preferences etc) is actually more a collage of past factors combined with present factors.

[mermadeinheaven]

The question for me is: Can those inherited factors be changed? And if so, to what degree, and how?

[ValorUnlimited]

It is a collage, but the factors that affected your parents and grandparents are more weighted than your own, since the means of your development occurred before you had sensory input from your environment.

[mermadeinheaven]

"but the factors that affected? your parents and grandparents are more weighted than your own,"

There is much evidence to the contrary. For example, there is nothing in Matthieu Ricard's genetic lineage to suggest a propensity for euphoria, but that didn't stop him from altering his psychophysiology (using Tibetan Buddhist meditation techniques) and generating euphoria independent of sensory stimuli (which got him labeled by neuroscientists as "the happiest man in the world".)

[mermadeinheaven]

"Whereas stimuli which your parents.."

Yes, but while current/recent generational influences might appear weaker in influence (biologically) than more distant/ingrained generational influences, what's more significant to me is the question of how specifically engineered processes or technologies (such as NLP, rTMS, Heartmath techniques, relaxation response, etc, as distinctive from generational influences) can alter the behavior and expression of genes by changing their state of activity.

[mermadeinheaven]

Because if it's possible to override deeply (genetically) ingrained behavioral/neurological/physio­logical patterns by application of engineered processes or technologies, then it's of relatively little concern to me whether recent generational influences have more or less impact on current genetic expression than distant generational influences.

[ValorUnlimited]

It depends on the disorder, if it is genetic or epigenetic, and if it's genetic, how your ancestors dealt with it. If it's intergenerational epigenetic it matters very little. if it's generational epigenetic then it matters only to the degree if your recent ancestors did not encounter it.

Hope that helps.

Dr. Lipton doesn't address this because he only focuses on generational factors.

[ValorUnlimited]

Any response from those kinds of procedures would be a result of activity from glandular responses caused by signals from the brain. I don't have to tell you how little we know about how that works.

[mermadeinheaven]

"Any response from those kinds of procedures would be a result of activity from glandular responses caused by signals from the brain."

Yes brain signals do play a role, but since they can be modified by subjectivity (e.g., deliberately recalling/sustaining a positive emotion, believing something to be real, imagination) to catalyze a significantly different physiological, cognitive, and emotional systems response (e.g. placebo effect, spontaneous remission,), then that changes the equation.

[mermadeinheaven]

Current evidence suggests that the results obtained by use of subjective processes (whether derived from brain signals or not) warrants further investigation in its application as a major health intervention, which is why I'm more interested examining the science behind how subjective interventions can be used to cause changes in physiological processes and DNA behavior, rather than focusing too much on the old paradigm that mutli-generation factors carry more weight than current interventions.

[mermadeinheaven]

Also, control over gene activation & the ability to alter physiological processes is a significant advantage when viewed from an evolutionary perspective (whether or not the changes observed are caused by brain signals). For instance, we know for a fact that being in highly tense & emotionally imbalanced states (..anxiety, fear, worry, doubt, etc) is not conducive to survival and/or success. This should be obvious.

[mermadeinheaven]

Therefore, the potential for having a level of control over our emotions/physiology/genes is, I think, something that definitely warrants further investigation. After all, if we develop the capacity to control our genes and emotional states, we could probably eliminate half of our collective problems. One reason why is because we would be less subject to genetically ingrained compulsions that are non-conducive to success and survival as a species etc.

[KirkLichtenberg]

I meant "A" STRANGER. Also read Samuel Clemens short novella "A Yankee in King Arthur's Court." Just in short of mind for suggestion precisionly.

[KirkLichtenberg]

Even though community response may be questioned, I think this man is uniquely intriguing. May I suggest, even though I am strongly against drugs, study James P. Carse's book: Infinite & Finite Games with nonphilosophical insights to logic. I support Bruce Lipton without 'quatrain-cancering" his strong ideals and think Bruce is on the track to great determinancy egalitarianly apisitima. Althought I am stranger, I respect your opinions as well as His without argumentation. GratitiaHamen.

[mrniggerbaiter]

This Stanford affiliate is a fresh breath of relief from Crick and his DNA religion, Seeing most of these scientists heavily revised over the years,you find there is no unified field theory,and Crickett is just as pedagogic,homosexual and antichristian as possible.

[ValorUnlimited]

I'm new to the world of genetics, but I've already uncovered major loopholes in Lipton's theories. They omit factors which completely negate his arguments, and underscore trivialities in a way that's designed to purposely mislead from what epigenetics truly is.

[mrniggerbaiter]

Thank you for an educated response. Entertained by genetics,we curiousity seekers need Led Zeppelins for clear light.

[streamofwellbeing]

Once upon a time they said that the world was flat and you would fall of the edge.

And anybody who thought otherwise was nuts.

When you have a closed and ridgid belief system then it is difficult to let in new possibilities and if you are absolute in "what I have been taught is the only way" - then in your ridgid disbelief you dont have the neuronet structures within the brain to let in these theories as possibilities.

This is the new frontier in medicine. Time to wake up.

[mos619]

One more reason why cannabis should be, not only legalized, but mandatory.

[ValorUnlimited]

Uh. No it's not. It's stilted garbage. I'm a 2nd year bio major and I know more about living systems than this guy does...apparently.

[ebdario]

wow!!! you're a 2nd year bio major and you think you're better than a microbiologist!!! he is a scientist and one of the first who did research on stem cells way back in 1965.

just a reminder - "A little learning is a dangerous thing". If you want to be smart, know more before you insult people's knowledge you know little about.

[ValorUnlimited]

Quite simply, I do.

I've spent less time, but either his knowledge is antiquated, or he's INTENTIONALLY misleading in his arguments. I've watched every one of his videos and they carry the same theme to them, assembled from incomplete data. If you want to discuss this in-depth, I'll do so without the character count cap.

[mermadeinheaven]

Merely stating that you know more than Lipton is not convincing. You need to provide real facts before anyone will take you seriously.

[ValorUnlimited]

Which I can do. I just prefer not to attempt to with the character cap. If you'd like to know about the many loopholes which I've found in "Dr." Lipton's "research" please send me a message.

[mermadeinheaven]

Yes, I would like to examine the loop holes that you found. Explain them to me as concisely as possible so that I can verify them for myself.

[ValorUnlimited]

Sent. Check your inbox.

[mermadeinheaven]

Thanks :)

[BlacklitFloater]

this reminds me of that love or hate wavelength thing.

[ValorUnlimited]

What?

[TiaSaysSo]

How did this guy get a PhD?How?How?How?

[ValorUnlimited]

I have no idea. I'm just a 2nd year bio major and I think I know more about biochemistry than him.

This guy's work, if people are uninformed enough to listen to him, could do serious damage...

[TiaSaysSo]

From 3:40 onwards,his explanation for his "experiment" is astoundingly stupid.All his explanations for how the cell reacts to the environment are misconstrued.He is another new age quack like Deepak Chopra.

[ValorUnlimited]

Get the word out. Speak in facts and speak clearly.

Dr. Mercola is someone else I would strongly question. He gives a lot of lofty advice that's supported by extremely stilted supporting data. Also most of these "epigenetics bandwagoneers" seem to delete comments that are negative, and keep only the positive comments, and then close comment posting altogether. It's sad.

I sent Mercola a private message but there was no response. I didn't berate him either. I'm beginning to suspect...

[ValorUnlimited]

...that he can't be bothered confronting any issues with his advice.

[quidproquo2004]

What exactly is damaging about what Dr. Lipton says? Is it not true that our bodies are open systems with a constant interchange of information between the body and the environment?  Don't worry, I'm an open-minded scientist truly interested in your rebuttal of his work.

[ValorUnlimited]

I don't think it's entirely accurate to think of the body as an open or closed system. It's not as simple as a distillation or a calorimetry exercise... What's -most- dangerous about his presentation of epigenetics is what he chooses to leave out, which is inclusive of things like antagonistic pleiotropy, and intergenerational epigenetic factors. If you'd like a more detailed explanation of these terms contact me directly and I'll respond on why these issues make him sound uninformed.

[ValorUnlimited]

The cell's membranes are not limited to the outer wall of the cell, every organelle's structure is made up of a phospholipid bilayer.

Truly, epigenetics deals with RNA structures that are vastly more numerous than protein structures. Those segments can be transcribed into dozens of different proteins. So essentially you need less to do more.

What's sad is many doctors are already jumping on this bandwagon and claiming that you need only 6 hours of yoga a day to cure cancer.

[maitrimorningstar]

6 hours of yoga a day to cure cancer? That is a ridiculous statement. Science does indeed have it's own problems. I've had cancer 3 times and if I told you how it was healed and the reason for me getting it you would not believe me. You are too hired wired for science. Bruce is closer to the truth than you might think.

[ValorUnlimited]

Explain to me how science has its own problems? Just because a scientist produces a bad analogy in an experiment does not mean science has problems. Just because a scientist produces good data that people don't want to hear doesn't mean science has problems. Science is a technique that's been around longer than religion or any other man-made indoctrination of 'higher thought' or 'epigenetic control'. And it's so non-problematic it's responsible for every major breakthrough of the last millennium

[ValorUnlimited]

Why does this sound more like a sermon than an informed lecture?

[regfmcd]

Bruce is just wonderful and I am always astounded that not more people know about him and his wonderful work which can change ones life.

[dougeroonie]

This info should be the RAGE right now. A real shame it's not. Science has it's own problems like religion and they are more similar than you would know. Thank you Bruce for rising above all that B.S. Thank you! Great book by the way. It's a challenge being Columbus ready to sail the oceans, isn't it???? lol I wish you the best, thanks.

[rnstuffy]

You are so right. It should be the rage right now. People like us, who know have the responsibility to pass this information along.

[coreydmt]

this means are mind is going to change on the out look of this empire!