Joe Higgins 21/02/2009

[naoisesmashpumpkin]

And by the sound of the rest of what you're saying, you're all for Ireland's economic success before its social development. We aren't a money machine. We're a country.

[naoisesmashpumpkin]

"Have you forgotten that FF made us one of the wealthiest nations in the world?" -- MADE. For glorious, all-too-fleeting bubbles that each proceeded to burst, and only really affected those on the top of the heap. "They were far-left until Lemass" -- What pre- and post-Lemass FF policies even passed for Left Wing? I'm assuming you're referring to the fact that they advocated change in each election. You need to specify and implement said change to be remotely liberal.

[naoisesmashpumpkin]

Christ, where to start. "We have seen them in practice moron" -- wow, Joe's a time-traveller who avers to that particular brand of Marxism? I admire the guy, but I didn't realise he had that much power! "Ireland is Capitalist and has the best labour flexibility in Europe" -- I thought we were 'Socialist'? Wowza, such is our labour flexibility that we change with a snap of the fingers! "If you don't like it you can get out" -- speaks for itself about your remarkable open-mindedness and tolerance.

[Invirtuo]

If people are mad at FF for the economic mess then vote FG, not Socialist thugs like this guy

[Invirtuo]

Ye people need to stop this class-warfare "get the rich" adoloescent nonsense. There are crooks running wild in governmental departments and ye are worried about the only people who have ever improved the lives of the ordinary man

[naoisesmashpumpkin]

Alright, let's assume that there's no validity in Joe's theories. We still haven't seen them in practice. What we have seen is a 70-year Fianna Fáil regime. They've had ample chance to prove themselves, and they've failed. We've had an economic calamity every 20 years or so. FF ideology has, at best, improved things on a short-term basis, and even that is extremely doubtful.

[Invirtuo]

We have seen them in practice moron. In the Soviet Union, in the DPRK, and in Cuba..all power-houses of economic might...cough. Ireland is Capitalist and has the best labour flexibility in Europe. If you don't like it you can get out. Have you forgotten that FF made us one of the wealthiest nations in the world? Are peoples' memories about 5 minutes long?

[Invirtuo]

Btw FF don't have an ideology. They were far-left until Lemass, when they moved to centre-left and have been centrist since. I don't think that qualifies as an "ideology". Look at the things which are creating gaping deficits...fucking social welfare, massive government bureaucracy, state healthcare, free fees etc All these are part of this tyrannical Socialist dogma that Labour pressures the government implementing

[Invirtuo]

What an unintelligent pseudo-intellectual. The actual implementation of his policies would be catastrophic. Electing him as an mep though would be good if he stopped Lisbon

[naoisesmashpumpkin]

Well, what would you propose? Taxing ordinary people to the point that their spending power is completely decimated? We Fianna Fáil'd our way into this mess. What makes you think we can Fianna Fáil our way out of it?

[Invirtuo]

The richest 5% pay 70% of all income tax. The bottom fifty per cent are net recipients. We are a Socialist country as it is, more Socialism will ruin us. The best solution would be no income tax imo

Why do I support FF over the rest?Because I believe a disaster is better than a catastrophe

[Invirtuo]

I suggest you check out the Laffer Curve to understand why marginal rate tax cuts for the rich tend to drive economic growth. In some cases cutting the top rate can have a revenue-positive effect.

[naoisesmashpumpkin]

It's common sense that 100% tax rates won't result in no revenue, and 0% won't produce revenue, so the key to the Laffer Curve is finding somewhere in between. Under a certain point, tax cuts for the rich won't drive economic growth. We have to experiment and find that point (if we're following Keynes, who, in the end, did need a WAR to fix things.) Socialism would argue that we've been ridiculously light on the rich for decades, and if it was going to work, it would have done by now.

[dmcc20012]

The only 2 T.Ds that I ever any faith in Joe Higgins and Tony Gregory

[brennan1979]

Good man Donal!

[cpenter]

Thanks for posting this!