Perhaps the most troubling thing to think about is that God wants to sort out who is truly loyal to him, and who is loyal for the sake of themselves. Then you wonder if God wants all to be saved, why even sort it out?
It is because of freewill and a God who wants genuine affection/loyalty, wishing (but not forcing) you all to be as such.
"have delighted in wickedness" that is a key factor... you delight in wickedness, and if God can expose that by hiding some truth... then so be it.
But truly seek and you will find, and if not... continue to do good for you are probably being tested. As soon as your parents/supervisors are out of the room, do you immediately start acting out of principal/law/order?
"For this reason God sends them a powerful delusion so that they will believe the lie" READ ON... "and so that all will be condemned who have not believed the truth but have delighted in wickedness."
Listen if you were my trusted bank employee, and I told you that there is no alarm in the storage (jewellery) room. You as a "WICKED" person (if you were evil at heart) seem innocent enough, but at the right moment you snap and break into the storage room, and get caught (jailed
@LampPlaceThing God strengthens people's resolve, so that the truth comes out! For example with Pharaoh in Egypt, God hardened the heart of pharaoh so that pharoah would not latter on in a distant future, go after the Israelites (God wanted to deal with pharaoh's heart exposure, sooner than latter).
@LampPlaceThing In my defence I am NOT reading off "answers" from the internet, I am simply giving you my OWN whole hearted knowledge on the subject (I was not programmed for these responses).
@malignantpoodle You are not punished for believing the lie but acting on it, without heart.
Anyways I see your point that indeed someone should not be guilty of being unknowingly deceived --- however things like drinking impaired is not a good excuse since they know what they are getting into... unless they didn't know then I believe our justice system would be understanding.
One should also remember that the "devil" has powers to deceive, and even common man. When is it ok to lie hmm
Right, so you are punished for acting on something that's a lie that God made you believe. Act/believing the difference is not the point; the point is that God made you believe falsely, and then punishes you for something he made you do.
It doesn't even compare to drinking. Before you drink you are aware of the caveats. Not the case with god making you believe a lie.
Right, so you are punished for acting on something that's a lie that God made you believe. Act/believing the difference is not the point; the point is that God made you believe falsely, and then punishes you for something he made you do.
It doesn't even compare to drinking. Before you drink you are aware of the caveats. Not the case with god making you believe a lie.
Right, so you are punished for acting on something that's a lie that God made you believe. Act/believing the difference is not the point; the point is that God made you believe falsely, and then punishes you for something he made you do.
It doesn't even compare to drinking. Before you drink you are aware of the caveats. Not the case with god making you believe a lie.
Right, so you are punished for acting on something that's a lie that God made you believe. Act/believing the difference is not the point; the point is that God made you believe falsely, and then punishes you for something he made you do.
It doesn't even compare to drinking. Before you drink you are aware of the caveats. Not the case with god making you believe a lie.
@malignantpoodle Here is a QUOTE from the internet I like (you might not) In man's creation, God endowed him with a free will, the power of choice. He will never force man to be convinced against his will. Therefore, God never gives perfect knowledge and He always leaves room for doubt.
@malignantpoodle Basically In some points in your journey if you do not simply trust God (sounds like a leap of faith), you will be faced with that choice of doing it your way
If there was no if ands or buts, about the nature of everything, would people ever attempt to do the wrong thing? If I knew everything my choices would be so narrow. I would think that I would do good, only for the sake of the future which I see as all too predictable (in a world with limitless answeres).
Trusting god that sends strong delusion? That doesn't make any sense at all. If you trust the god that makes you believe a lie, then you are punished.
@malignantpoodle "Trusting god that sends strong delusion? That doesn't make any sense at all. If you trust the god that makes you believe a lie, then you are punished."
"trust" doesn't always lead you to lies. My statements did not mean that there is no rational/reason and some evidence for God.
@malignantpoodle "With god making you believe a lie, where is the personal responsibility involved with that?"
I am not a Calvinist (predestination) so I don't have to worry about explaining puppet string pulling theory. With that introduction I would say God did not "make you" delusional without your choice in mind, but gave you what you ask for "strong delusion" given when you aren't with God (not trusting) and rather believe God is not necessary.
@LampPlaceThing But you could say in response to my comment "But I would never ask for Strong delusion" then again, I would have to go back to the comment where I quoted that God gave room for doubt so that you are not convinced beyond what you truly rather it be.
“I am against religion because it teaches us to be satisfied with not understanding the world.” Richard Dawkins
If you refuse the truth, the only thing left is a lie
I hope you realize in your example that you are punished for believing god, and rewarded for not. And if you don't believe god, then his act of sending a strong delusion means that he failed at something, and is not perfect.
@malignantpoodle Quote: "I hope you realize in your example that you are punished for believing god, and rewarded for not." I don't quite see it as a punishment.
Quote: "And if you don't believe god, then his act of sending a strong delusion means that he failed at something."
Yes God "failed" to convince you that his ways with a bit of faith is better... However I would not go to say that that is evidence of God being "not perfect." God's will is not done "on earth as it is in heaven."
@malignantpoodle In the end of this conversation comes down to "YOU WIN" you are right in your mind (God shouldn't do things this way), and I am wrong, and so be it.
I am sure this conversation certainly did not make you feel like you would want to believe there is a God, but keep in mind I am not the best source of info
don't worry, I was a Christian for 20 years. Even the "best" sources of info (I guess you would define best as, "respected") don't provide a much better argument. It all comes down to faith and the willingness to believe despite the flaws. I'm not a person that can do that.
Right, so you are punished for acting on something that's a lie that God made you believe. Act/believing the difference is not the point; the point is that God made you believe falsely, and then punishes you for something he made you do.
It doesn't even compare to drinking. Before you drink you are aware of the caveats. Not the case with god making you believe a lie.
@malignantpoodle Oh I found out I was right that the sons were dead.
Here is a basic quote pasted form a web site: ”to keep my name in remembrance.”, which is a conditional statement. The passage does not say that “Absalom had no son” END QUOTE.
We know that Tamar was Absalom's daughter and there is no mention of the sons names (i think).... I would presume it didn't comes to mind much since they died.
A response to time frame 5:40 John 14: 8-9 Philip said, "Lord, show us the Father and that will be enough for us." Jesus answered: "Don't you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, 'Show us the Father'?
Using that fact, apply it to genesis, and in fact it doesn't have to be Jesus, it is God's presence manifesting in some kind of form... through an angel in a burning bush, Moses could have seen God
"God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent"
Doesn't the word "should" mean must for the better? would it not be changing the bible to interpret it as "that he might, perhaps repent"
God is not bound to such a need of repentence... he might if he changes his mind )but not because of a sin of his own doing). Numbers 23:19 "hath he said, and shall he not do it? "or hath he spoken, and shall he not make it good?"
Interesting, because some of the Christians you spoke with were unable to answer every question popping into your mind, you turned away from the Bible. Yet not only is the Big Bang / Spontaneous Generation / Evolution crowd unable to answer every question, they have regularly been caught lying., And even when telling the truth, they reside in violation of the science the claim to love, such as:
To learn the real truth go to 4shared.com and search for the word Jmmanuel and look there for a file with 9,873 KB | 2009-12-08 | File name: The-Real-New-Testament-The-Talmud-of-Jmmanuel-Person-Known-Nowadays-as-Jesus-Forgery-in-Christianity.pdf
I've noticed all the videos on youtube that debate the issue of biblical contraditions...its' only the non believers that allow their videos to be rated and comments allowed to stimulate debate...christians like to disable to comment and rating system..very curious.
Christians are overly concerned with ratings. They love to comment/vote on other channels, but won't allow it on their own. Also, the notion of vote botting (using a hack or other method to give oneself multiple votes on a video) I've only seen used by Christians; nobody else. I had many of my videos go from almost 100% liked to half and half over night.
In today's world we have now three generations of misled young atheist followers, indoctrinated by the liberal atheist liars that run ABC, NBC, NPR and CBS. They are the majority here at youtube and a growing presence around the globe. If creationist posters have shut off comments (and you offered no evidence to verify they do in any greater numbers), perhaps it is due to the lack of reasonable discourse that follows mentioning the Biblical God.
No, because allowing comments would mean allowing ppl to freely discuss and expose the notorious and shameless lying, quote-mining and pissing into the fountain of knowledge of creationists which is the only way those bible clowns can make an "argument" in the first place. XD
Atheists always say the easiest way to make someone an atheist is to have them read the Bible. Yet, atheists have a shit-fit when we try to hand them out.
Hmm. I personally don't know of any that raise issue with handing out bibles. It's when ignorant little shits start pushing the filth contained in the bible onto public policy that I draw the line.
No, I wouldn't be ok with that. As I stated, with regard to public policy is where I have a problem. Using schools for any religion's proliferation falls under that.
@malignantpoodle Why? What could better separate Church and State than eliminate it all together? If everyone becomes an atheist, doesn't that make the separation even greater?
You're apply to me, some perspective that someone else has. I never said that reading the bible is the best way to become an atheist. People who want to believe will decide to regardless of what rubbish is in the bible. I'm also not evangelical. I'm not trying to spread atheism. I think people should be free to have whatever religion they like. Stay out of public policy, and public policy should stay out of your business as well.
@HonestMan395 I wish I had heard that quote from Azimov. Reading the Bible is what made me an Atheist. I found so many inconsistencies, scientific impossibilities and outright contradictions, I could not take it seriously. When I asked clergy about it, I was given a lenghty list of reasons why what I read is not what it really said, and always ended with "You have to have faith and believe in your heart".
@TheThunderduck It never ceases to amaze me how the only way christians can explain their bible is by indulging in huge flights of imaginative interpretation, for what is supposed to be the infallible word of an onmicient god.
My brother-in-Law was a C of E vicar. He lost his faith when he was in the seminary. They actually taught him things about the bible. Facts that they've know about for hundreds of years and it's not what they tell the punters.
A bible expert I'm not, yet I do remember Jesus sent his apostles out twice. The first time he told them to bring nothing the second time he said they should bring things, such as a food pouch.
THE BIBLE HAS SURVIVED OVER 3,000 YEARS OF ATTEMPTS TO DESTROY IT, DISCREDIT IT AND BELITTLE IT. YET IT SURVIVES WHILE CIVILIZATIONS AND MAN HIMSELF - COMES AND GOES ... LIKE A BREATH OF WIND.
Isaiah 40:6-8 "All men are like grass, and all their glory is like the the flowers of the field. The grass withereth , the flower fadeth; but the word of our God shall stand forever."
The bible has been around for 3000 years? Interesting.
So the longer the following, the more credible the belief? I guess Zoroastrianism must be true! Or Taoism! Because they're much older than Christianity and have not been destroyed! How about Judaism? They've survived thousands of years of persecution including the holocaust.
@malignantpoodle But anethemasserenades put her argument in all-caps. You can't argue with that. She must be right, or her computer would never have let her use all caps. lol Caps.
@malignantpoodle: Not to mention that the first records of established Judaism are from 600 BC and the actual bible was written a couple of hundred years "after Christ" and then edited and added to for some 1000 years. ^_^
And ppl also eat at McDonalds all around the world. That does not make this trash healthy.
@anathemasserenades The Bible isn't 3000 years old so and Hinduism is about 6000 years old, maybe even a little older. So you've shown you don't know any thing about religion but also appealed to authority, which means you aren't very bright or don't know how to form an argument. The Bible discredits itself, don't believe me, read the last chapter of each Gospel. All four can't be right.
You're wrong about Absalom. Sure they said he had children but in the period of time from when the children where born till the time when he said he had no children alot of things could have happened. They were not mentioned because didn't think it was important to put in the bible. maybe his children were killed we don't know but certainly at the end of days will all mysteries be answered I mean if you are a Christian as you say you are then surely you must know this
"I mean if you are a Christian as you say you are"
I did not say I was a Christian. I used to be a Christian. If you want to cite to take extra-biblical information (and in this case, there is no source, only assumption) then where do you draw the line? I can take all kinds of things that aren't in the bible and make wild statements myself. If it said something like, "no longer had a son" that'd be different.
The Old testament was created by oppressed Israelites who feared everything that bad happen or good happen was because of God. It is human nature to seek help in time of need. The disbelief or lack of by some people is caused by the promises of faith not being made. People tend to ask for so much in prayer and cannot be answered. God is not a Genie or something that u use to clear problems. God is the spirit within everyone of us throughout years and generations good vs. evil and doubts of men.
I'm not a Creationist but I do believe in God. But my translation of the Bible is different from most Christians. The bible was inspired by God translated by many different minds. The true meaning is discovered by each individual spiritually, The world was created over billions of years by the will of God but not with his hands. The big bang was a reaction caused when the spiritual being of God interacted with the physical universe of nothingness. The design is like a pyramid design. (continued)
@VokalSanity (Continuation) Like everything else expanding and continuously evolving God's will is ever continuing and expanding truth that is being carried out. The expansion of the universe, the evolution of man and the passing of information on human DNA is a living example of God's existence. The coded content in each everything living or nonliving contains the Trademark of God. The human spirit that enables free thinking, faith and belief was the gift given to us and is a mystery still..
In my humble opinion it sounds like the simple problem is simply assumming that if a word is used it means the exact same thing in both sentences. If you read the new testament...Jesus says not to judge ....then in other booksk Paul says we are to judge righteoussly . And even though someone reading those things out of context say its a contradiction, they actually mean different things. The Word is the same, yet its meaning is different in different situations.
This doesn't explain or rectify most contradictions. How does your explanation have any relevance to Jesus telling his people to go barefoot and then later telling them to wear sandals? How does this explain Samuel's firstborn being Joel and then later Vashni?
Let me guess, you didn't even watch the video and just assumed that entire contradictions presented here hinged on the meaning or context of one word.
@malignantpoodle can you give me the scripture on those two? I'm going to read them , then ask the Holy Spirit to give me some wisdom on it. Thanks ;)
It's in the video. If you're going to come here and comment on and criticize the video without even watching it, this shows obviously that y our mind is made up and your position decided before doing any evaluation.
Good thing our courts don't work that way. Render the guilty verdict, then look for the evidence.
@malignantpoodle Oh, I'm sorry, the reason I didn't finish watching the video is cause I watched some of the scriptures you were using and already saw how they made sense without contradicting each other. I'll finish watching it. Look, I'm not looking to fight...or argue...I seriously am going to look into this, cause before I had an encounter with Jesus, I doubted too...for 8 years. I'll watch and look into it and get back with you. Peace , Love, and Truth xoxoxo
You saw how they didn't make sense but couldn't explain it. I see.
You doubted too? Oh really. Well, I wore bible blinders for 20 years myself. Wasted half my life with the garbage. I don't think your comparison is appropriate.
@TheImmortalTree by the way, my short little video on my site is only the tip of the iceberg. I've healed one girls back and one mans arm and there are more healings to come. These are miracles and I have lots more testimonies. The thing is, it takes a humble mind. God resists the proud and reveals his wisdom to the humble. Your heart is hardened right now. I'd like to apologize to you for all the people that blew you off when you were geniunely inquiring. This would be easier on the phone
Funny thing about you "healers"; never see you at any children's hospital healing terminal cancer ridden babies. Never see you healing amputees (funny how God never wants to heal an amputee, but heals all other kinds of vague things).
Additional anecdotal stories aren't any more convincing, nor do they lend any more credit to your original anecdotal stories.
That's not what it says. It tells them what to take with them on their journey. It says nothing about what to go out and acquire beyond one's own possessions. That's YOUR creation.
@malignantpoodle "take a staff" in Mark, and then in Luke it says "neither staves" different words, one in singular, one in plural. That is noteworthy. Also, this scripture keeps popping into my mind for you. John 7:17"If any man do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself" It is very possible to read the bible without gaining wisdom or power from it. It takes the Holy Spirit indwelling you - the very Spirit of God. Did you ever ask for him?
That's "noteworthy" but the contradictions aren't? lol ok... One being plural and one singular doesn't matter; in one instance he tells them to take NOTHING. In another, he tells them what to take. Sorry, but the "one is plural one isn't" is not noteworthy and does nothing to explain the contradiction.
Gee, 20 years of being a Christian and I never asked for him! You must have so much discernment... Not really.
A copy or portion of nearly every Old Testament book was found in Qumran. There were extra-biblical and apocryphal books found as well, but again, 40% of the scrolls were copies of the Hebrew Old Testament.
The Dead Sea Scrolls can also give us confidence in the reliability of the Old Testament manuscripts since there were minimal differences between the manuscripts that had previously been discovered and those that were found in Qumran.
Again, factually incorrect. No Joshua, Judges, Ruth, Kings I and II, Chronicles I and II, Ezra, Nehemiah, Job, Ecclesiastes, Lamentations, and many others. Those which are referenced do not contain original text but merely reference to the books or their descriptions.
The bible is NOT in fact intact since the Dead Sea Scrolls. The differences are enormous.
The Dead Sea Scrolls simply verify that the Bible has been transmitted correctly over the last 2000 years. The Dead Sea Scrolls were written between 300BC and 67AD, approximately.
The NLT has good footnotes and is easy to read. Educated theologians understand the nuisances, hyperbole and metaphor of the original languages. The numbers could be copy errors or simply hyperbole. Again no change to the core story. A yearning for God should not be disregarded due to the number of Solomon's horses.
"Educated theologians understand the nuisances, hyperbole and metaphor of the original languages. "
Wrong. Even educated theologians do not agree and debate on many major points. Christians from the recently reborn up to the highest levels of education in the religion do not agree amongst themselves. There is no solidarity and very little commonality between theologians.
1. Bible is the word of God 2. One God triune in nature 3.Jesus is God 4. Christ died for our sins 5. Christ rose again 6. Believers recieve eternal life.
@malignantpoodle I am of course speaking about Christian Thologians and Apologists. Obviously an athiest would not agree. To my knowledge Catholics and most mainstream protestants are Trinitarians. Of course Unitarians are around but not near as prevalent. Calvin, Luther, Wesley all agreed on common beliefs. Today Willliam Lane Craig, Paul Copan, Hugh Ross, Norman Giesler, J.P. Moreland, Greg Koukl share these beliefs. Uneducated? I am not the one who said that Mark6 was in the Dead Sea Scrolls.
Right, even Christian theologians of the same denominations disagree on many major points. Heck even the biblical authors disagree on major issues such as Jesus' lineage as there are three conflicted accounts naming different people.
And yes, Mark 6:52-53 is the only part of the bible intact from the Dead Sea Scrolls. Your argument that the bible stays intact going back to the scrolls is factually incorrect as only a couple of verses are there.
@malignantpoodle It has been argued that (7Q5) is a New Testament text from the Mark 6:52–53. In recent years this controversial assertion has been taken up again. Opponents consider that the fragment is tiny and requires so much reconstruction (the one complete word in Greek is "και" = "and"). It most likely came from a text other than Mark. Look up Dead Sea Scrolls on Wikipedia and you will see all of the total and partial writings that match the Old Testament. Including Ruth, etc....
Oh I see, you JUST NOW started reading about the Dead Sea Scrolls and are telling me that instead of the bible remaining intact going back tot he scrolls, that now there are huge chunks missing?
Seems you haven't put much thought or research into your argument.
These are the same old arguments from the past. You are truly a literal fundamentalist. You need to read the works of real theologians to understand the actual "truth" of the Bible. People were inspired to write the words of the Bible by God. Few theologians actually believe in a "Dictation theory of Inspiration", so these irrelevent errors do not change the meaning conveyed. The Bible is true in what it "teaches" and it is literally unaltered since the "Dead Sea Scrolls".
@malignantpoodle The Dead Sea Scrolls verify that the Bible has been transmitted correctly over the last 2000 years. The Dead Sea Scrolls were written between 300BC and 67AD. The NLT has good footnotes and is easy to read. Educated theologians understand the nuisances, hyperbole and metaphor of the original languages. The numbers could be copy errors or simply hyperbole. No change to the core story. God should not be disregarded due to the # of Solomon's horses.
"The Dead Sea Scrolls verify that the Bible has been transmitted correctly over the last 2000 years."
Factually incorrect. 60% of the scrolls mention nothing biblical in nature, and there is only one passage from Mark 6 which is in the bible that stays intact from the Dead Sea Scrolls. The rest do not represent the modern bible except for mention of some of the same people, but the contradictions, errors, and inconsistencies abound, without mentioning omissions.
I love it. If the Bible is right, then I feel that the Apocrypha books, Gospel of Thomas, Q, Enoch, should be right too and be included in the bible. Yet man removed those books.
Actually, I have to question the Numbers 3:19. I've checked Numbers 3:1 through 3:25, and I can't find the passage you mentioned. Found the other one though.
In my KJV bible, Numbers 3:19 says "And the sons of Kohath by their families; Amram, and Izehar, Hebron, and Uzziel."
There are different Christain denominations. There are Catholics, Lutherists, Jehovah's Witnesses, Anglicans, Quakers, etc. and each one interprets god differently. Therefore god is subjective. If something is subjective it is not accepted as fact. If something is subjective it is not objective; if something is not objective then it is not real. Therefore God is not real.
@LonesomePaleRider I doubt anything I could say would be accepted by you as proof, but perhaps the complexity of the world would indicate an intelligent design or God. Are you familiar with flagellar motors?
I'm not speaking for onesomePaleRider but... The existence, nature and mind of whichever god is clearly a matter of subjective opinion... surely that's the point; people explaining how everyone else has the wrong idea of god.
@malignantpoodle What is your opinion of Carlton Pearson and his Gospel of Inclusion? He says Christ died to save everyone, and they are saved whether they know it or not. He has definitely upset some fundie's apple-carts. Pearson is now a 'new-thought' preacher. My question is: If he is right, do we even need to know about Christianity?
Well, I don't know where he's getting his information. The bible is very clear about non-believers or people of other religions. It's the whole, "us" vs. "them" mentality. If it's one thing the bible is consistent about, it's that people who aren't Christians are lost.
But Pearson just underscores the point that people will spin any kind of story they like out of the bible to substantiate what they want believe. This is one of the reasons why Christians themselves cannot agree.
None taken, because you obviously don't know what you're talking about. I was a true believer for 20 solid years. Brought people to the Lord that are still with him today. Pastors, brothers in Christ, the people I brought to God, I guess I just had them all duped.
Saying that I was never a Christian reveals an obvious lack of discernment on your part. I have a video about discernment being hit and miss. Your remarks here underscore that.
My favorite one is where God commanded blood sacrifices in Exodus, and then in Jeremiah asked who commanded them to offer such sacrifices. WTF? See, there were horns on the AL-tars, and the promised land was Caanan. Well, convienient because Caana worshipped a bull god with horns named AL. I believe there is ONE God, but I don't think we can find Him from the bible.
In both verses given (correcting for Exodus 3:19 actually being Exodus 23:19), not only the English, but also the original Hebrew word is the same, according to Strong: good old H5162, nacham.
Even if christianity is right, there are over 33000 branches of christianity. There are also 150 religins wrld-wide. This limits your chances of being right to 0.6%. Assuming the branches of christianity doesn't count.
In addition to your comment, as you pointed out, there are so many religions and branches of religions, it is clear everyone is still going around saying "Know the Lord" (at least, their version of who that god is). This in itself disproves Christianity, as they claim that Jesus was the fulfillment of Jeremiah 31:31-34 (the new covenant). Yet verse 34 of that prophecy specifically states that no longer will anyone go around saying "know the LORD", for everyone will know Him. =o
Agreed, the prophecy in Jeremiah 31:31-34 does indeed mean that under the new covenant, the laws listed in the Torah will still be adhered to strictly, including animal sacrifices, but instead, it will be different by the laws being written on their hearts. It does not mean the laws will cease, in part, or in whole. This is obviously something most Christians miss, even when Jesus himself said in Matthew 5:18-19 that every single bit of the Law was to be kept and re-taught.=)
Your videos are just self-pleasing to yourself and lots of gullable people. Why can't you make a serious video with serious disputes instead of showing one side how about you give us 2 examples of a good christian explanation and your explanation. Instead you just say anyone who explain it to be true their explanation sucks and yours is right?
firstborn does not mean first created, the greek word is Prototokos it means firstborn Protoktioti means firstcreated. Firstborn means sovereign over something not "first" created...
He did because this is the word he used? Who told you that firstborn means first born? firstborn is one word first born is 2 words. What don't you understand?
Have you ever once in your life sat down and actually tried to understand what the bible is actually reading? Firstborn mean's soverign. Just replace everytime they use firstborn with soverign. It's quite obvious firstborn does not mean first created lol... If you would simply look at the greek text or well you know everytime it has been used in the english translations. Search Greek Interlinear Bible on google... I know you won't and do not care your agenda holds you against the truth.
If you are not aware it is not exactly a perfected or exact science translating something 2000 years ago. But even though this fact be true the King James Version still is the closest translation.
If you look at the greek manuscripts you know those silly copies of the bible from 1000AD remember they were found to be nearly identical to the dead sea scrolls which date to latest 100AD... the word is protoki it means sovereign in a rough english translation.
If you are going to choose to not believe what the bible actually says there is plenty of make believe contradictions you can make up, Colossians 1:18 says Jesus is the first born from the dead... yet he is not the first born from the dead, remember Jesus ressurected. Sorry I meant to say Prototokos, Protoki is used wherever they literally mean first created
Kings 17:8-22 Elija is the first documented "first born" of the dead in the bible. The reason he is not the Prototokos is because Jesus ressurected himself from the dead he is over the control of death. Psalm 89:27 David calls his eighth son his firstborn but it does not mean it's his first son we can see the context CLEARLY means a rough equivelant to sovereign or pre-eminence. Which is what it means. Search Greek Interllinear bible you would really like that.
I've seen Greek Interlinear, the Blue Bible, all of that stuff.
You hide in the translation argument without speaking the languages. You weren't brought to Christianity by the Greek, you were brought it by the English versions.
You have made up your mind to believe what you want, and are now trying to go back and find the evidence to support the decision you've already made.
That is a very interesting inference you have made. However I believe you are doing what you claim I am doing. I go back to the original greek to try to find contradictions I go through the english versions to try to find contradictions not to support my claim but to see if their truely is any valid arguments against it. And people like you who just makes jokes out of obvious non-contradictions really strengthens my views that their truely is no contradictions at least as long as your literate.
"And people like you who just makes jokes out of obvious non-contradictions really strengthens my views that their truely is no contradictions at least as long as your literate."
LifeLibertyLove - the Bible is riddled with Giants, Unicorns and Hell-Fire. That is ok, on its own, but couple this with hoards of idiots that believe in it and act on it,then... it has retarded society and inflicted more harm than good. (If you believe that the words of the Bible are divine (if divine: why all the interpretation?????), explain the diverse interpretation (FACT!!!)- that has/ and still leads to intolerance, bloodshed and stupidity).
So you believe Dinosaurs are real? And you believe there is millions of species of animals that once existed and have gone extinct and somehow there is intermediate species that go from a mouse to a dinosaur to a bird to a human yet these creatures seem ridiculous to have once existed?
Belief in dinosaurs is a result of looking where the empirical, objective evidence points. FAITH is exactly that; belief without evidence. You cannot compare biblical passages with empirical scientific evidence. It's like comparing Mike Tyson to Tinkerbell.
Lifelibertylove: Did Humans live at the same time as Dinosaurs?
BTW - "when was the last war over the bible" its not the bible (or other religious text) it is what it stands for - that being a so called "truth". If 2 "truths" are diametrically opposed- this often leads to conflict. In history MOST wars have had religion entwined. Atheist political dogma (in the case of Stalin) copied the structure of religious dogma!
people are the problem ...the Jacobins in france killed in the name or atheism ... it's note able to point out that Jesus said love your enemies ... I think Martain Luther Kings Vietnam speach is a very important one in todays political climate
Noticed how he said that mouse turns into dinosaur and birds into humans? Thats false and If that really did happen in evolution then it would prove evolution wrong.
How would you like it if we put the same false argument to you guys? Example..
You really think there is an deep voiced old man in the sky? How did this man in the sky fly in the sky? Yet this man in the sky seems ridiculous.
How about understanding the other side first? Otherwise you seem so arrogant.
When was the last war over the bible. How many years ago was this war. Please state the casualties. How many wars have we had that were purely for materialistic gain. Yes certain people have trouble reading the bible and misinterpreting it. But a majority of things are agreed upon. The bible clearly says love of money and wordly materials is bad this is not a question amongst any christians who believe the bible.
If you pay attention to the rhetoric of some of the more wingnut generals we have, then both Iraq and Afghanistan are part of a "biblical mandate" to scourge Islam from the region.
And I'm sure one of the main reasons we're still there in Iraq (even after Saddam is gone) is for a misplaced "missionary" purposes.
The contradictions I point out are very obvious and some of them mathematical. You cannot summarily address the issue of contradictions by citing a translation issue. There are profound errors and inconsistencies in the entire work which stands in the Greek, Hebrew, and English.
Where? Every so called mathamatical error you claim to have found is not an error at all. GIve me one specific example and I will easily show you why it's not. You are not even reading the thing you don't care what it says you just want to find things that look like contradictions and throw them all in one video all at once.
If I choose to believe not what the bible says? You means, if I choose not to think like you do.
This is the same dogmatic line that Christians use against each other. That the person that thinks otherwise is "not a real Christian" or "doesn't understand the bible". Right.
Good video.
themakerofmine 1 month ago
Perhaps the most troubling thing to think about is that God wants to sort out who is truly loyal to him, and who is loyal for the sake of themselves. Then you wonder if God wants all to be saved, why even sort it out?
It is because of freewill and a God who wants genuine affection/loyalty, wishing (but not forcing) you all to be as such.
LampPlaceThing 1 month ago
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LampPlaceThing 1 month ago
test
malignantpoodle 1 month ago
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malignantpoodle 1 month ago
I have to actually go to work... enough of this.
LampPlaceThing 1 month ago
"have delighted in wickedness" that is a key factor... you delight in wickedness, and if God can expose that by hiding some truth... then so be it.
But truly seek and you will find, and if not... continue to do good for you are probably being tested. As soon as your parents/supervisors are out of the room, do you immediately start acting out of principal/law/order?
LampPlaceThing 1 month ago
A response to 6:43
"For this reason God sends them a powerful delusion so that they will believe the lie" READ ON... "and so that all will be condemned who have not believed the truth but have delighted in wickedness."
Listen if you were my trusted bank employee, and I told you that there is no alarm in the storage (jewellery) room. You as a "WICKED" person (if you were evil at heart) seem innocent enough, but at the right moment you snap and break into the storage room, and get caught (jailed
LampPlaceThing 1 month ago
@LampPlaceThing God strengthens people's resolve, so that the truth comes out! For example with Pharaoh in Egypt, God hardened the heart of pharaoh so that pharoah would not latter on in a distant future, go after the Israelites (God wanted to deal with pharaoh's heart exposure, sooner than latter).
LampPlaceThing 1 month ago
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@LampPlaceThing In my defence I am NOT reading off "answers" from the internet, I am simply giving you my OWN whole hearted knowledge on the subject (I was not programmed for these responses).
LampPlaceThing 1 month ago
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LampPlaceThing 1 month ago
@LampPlaceThing
Reading on just makes things worse. You see, you are punished for believing the lie that god made you believe :)
malignantpoodle 1 month ago
@malignantpoodle You are not punished for believing the lie but acting on it, without heart.
Anyways I see your point that indeed someone should not be guilty of being unknowingly deceived --- however things like drinking impaired is not a good excuse since they know what they are getting into... unless they didn't know then I believe our justice system would be understanding.
One should also remember that the "devil" has powers to deceive, and even common man. When is it ok to lie hmm
LampPlaceThing 1 month ago
@LampPlaceThing
Right, so you are punished for acting on something that's a lie that God made you believe. Act/believing the difference is not the point; the point is that God made you believe falsely, and then punishes you for something he made you do.
It doesn't even compare to drinking. Before you drink you are aware of the caveats. Not the case with god making you believe a lie.
malignantpoodle 1 month ago
@LampPlaceThing
Right, so you are punished for acting on something that's a lie that God made you believe. Act/believing the difference is not the point; the point is that God made you believe falsely, and then punishes you for something he made you do.
It doesn't even compare to drinking. Before you drink you are aware of the caveats. Not the case with god making you believe a lie.
malignantpoodle 1 month ago
@LampPlaceThing
test
malignantpoodle 1 month ago
@LampPlaceThing
@LampPlaceThing
Right, so you are punished for acting on something that's a lie that God made you believe. Act/believing the difference is not the point; the point is that God made you believe falsely, and then punishes you for something he made you do.
It doesn't even compare to drinking. Before you drink you are aware of the caveats. Not the case with god making you believe a lie.
malignantpoodle 1 month ago
@LampPlaceThing
Right, so you are punished for acting on something that's a lie that God made you believe. Act/believing the difference is not the point; the point is that God made you believe falsely, and then punishes you for something he made you do.
It doesn't even compare to drinking. Before you drink you are aware of the caveats. Not the case with god making you believe a lie.
malignantpoodle 1 month ago
@LampPlaceThing
You know the caveats of drinking when you start. The responsibility lies when one decides to drink.
With god making you believe a lie, where is the personal responsibility involved with that?
malignantpoodle 1 month ago
@malignantpoodle Here is a QUOTE from the internet I like (you might not) In man's creation, God endowed him with a free will, the power of choice. He will never force man to be convinced against his will. Therefore, God never gives perfect knowledge and He always leaves room for doubt.
LampPlaceThing 1 month ago
@malignantpoodle Basically In some points in your journey if you do not simply trust God (sounds like a leap of faith), you will be faced with that choice of doing it your way
If there was no if ands or buts, about the nature of everything, would people ever attempt to do the wrong thing? If I knew everything my choices would be so narrow. I would think that I would do good, only for the sake of the future which I see as all too predictable (in a world with limitless answeres).
LampPlaceThing 1 month ago
@LampPlaceThing
Trusting god that sends strong delusion? That doesn't make any sense at all. If you trust the god that makes you believe a lie, then you are punished.
malignantpoodle 1 month ago
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@malignantpoodle "Trusting god that sends strong delusion? That doesn't make any sense at all. If you trust the god that makes you believe a lie, then you are punished."
"trust" doesn't always lead you to lies. My statements did not mean that there is no rational/reason and some evidence for God.
LampPlaceThing 1 month ago
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@malignantpoodle "With god making you believe a lie, where is the personal responsibility involved with that?"
I am not a Calvinist (predestination) so I don't have to worry about explaining puppet string pulling theory. With that introduction I would say God did not "make you" delusional without your choice in mind, but gave you what you ask for "strong delusion" given when you aren't with God (not trusting) and rather believe God is not necessary.
LampPlaceThing 1 month ago
@LampPlaceThing But you could say in response to my comment "But I would never ask for Strong delusion" then again, I would have to go back to the comment where I quoted that God gave room for doubt so that you are not convinced beyond what you truly rather it be.
“I am against religion because it teaches us to be satisfied with not understanding the world.” Richard Dawkins
If you refuse the truth, the only thing left is a lie
LampPlaceThing 1 month ago
@LampPlaceThing
I hope you realize in your example that you are punished for believing god, and rewarded for not. And if you don't believe god, then his act of sending a strong delusion means that he failed at something, and is not perfect.
malignantpoodle 1 month ago
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@malignantpoodle Quote: "I hope you realize in your example that you are punished for believing god, and rewarded for not." I don't quite see it as a punishment.
Quote: "And if you don't believe god, then his act of sending a strong delusion means that he failed at something."
Yes God "failed" to convince you that his ways with a bit of faith is better... However I would not go to say that that is evidence of God being "not perfect." God's will is not done "on earth as it is in heaven."
LampPlaceThing 1 month ago
@malignantpoodle In the end of this conversation comes down to "YOU WIN" you are right in your mind (God shouldn't do things this way), and I am wrong, and so be it.
I am sure this conversation certainly did not make you feel like you would want to believe there is a God, but keep in mind I am not the best source of info
LampPlaceThing 1 month ago
@LampPlaceThing
don't worry, I was a Christian for 20 years. Even the "best" sources of info (I guess you would define best as, "respected") don't provide a much better argument. It all comes down to faith and the willingness to believe despite the flaws. I'm not a person that can do that.
malignantpoodle 1 month ago
@malignantpoodle I can't write away your point, as it is filled with question. I need to think about this some more.
LampPlaceThing 1 month ago
@LampPlaceThing
@LampPlaceThing
Right, so you are punished for acting on something that's a lie that God made you believe. Act/believing the difference is not the point; the point is that God made you believe falsely, and then punishes you for something he made you do.
It doesn't even compare to drinking. Before you drink you are aware of the caveats. Not the case with god making you believe a lie.
malignantpoodle 1 month ago
A reply to timeline 6:10
Ezra 2: 11 623, AND Nehemiah 7: 16 628.... could that just be a recount after the crazy man had more children (quote some time had passed).
LampPlaceThing 1 month ago
@LampPlaceThing
Coulda shoulda woulda. Quote the rebuttal rather than speculating one.
malignantpoodle 1 month ago
A reply to timeline 6:05
2 Samuel 18:18 for he thought, "I have no son to carry on the memory of my name."
Weren't his sons killed?
LampPlaceThing 1 month ago
@LampPlaceThing
You tell us.
malignantpoodle 1 month ago
@malignantpoodle Oh I found out I was right that the sons were dead.
Here is a basic quote pasted form a web site: ”to keep my name in remembrance.”, which is a conditional statement. The passage does not say that “Absalom had no son” END QUOTE.
We know that Tamar was Absalom's daughter and there is no mention of the sons names (i think).... I would presume it didn't comes to mind much since they died.
LampPlaceThing 1 month ago
@LampPlaceThing
Where does it say his sons were dead? He could say the exact same thing without ever having had a son born.
malignantpoodle 1 month ago
A response to time frame 5:40 John 14: 8-9 Philip said, "Lord, show us the Father and that will be enough for us." Jesus answered: "Don't you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, 'Show us the Father'?
Using that fact, apply it to genesis, and in fact it doesn't have to be Jesus, it is God's presence manifesting in some kind of form... through an angel in a burning bush, Moses could have seen God
LampPlaceThing 1 month ago
@LampPlaceThing reference of burning bush and moses is Acts 7: 30-Acts 7: 35
LampPlaceThing 1 month ago
"God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent"
Doesn't the word "should" mean must for the better? would it not be changing the bible to interpret it as "that he might, perhaps repent"
God is not bound to such a need of repentence... he might if he changes his mind )but not because of a sin of his own doing). Numbers 23:19 "hath he said, and shall he not do it? "or hath he spoken, and shall he not make it good?"
LampPlaceThing 1 month ago
Awesome way to end the video, nothing beats the FF victory fanfare
SacredSoul1990 1 month ago
Interesting, because some of the Christians you spoke with were unable to answer every question popping into your mind, you turned away from the Bible. Yet not only is the Big Bang / Spontaneous Generation / Evolution crowd unable to answer every question, they have regularly been caught lying., And even when telling the truth, they reside in violation of the science the claim to love, such as:
1. The Law of Biogenesis.
2. The First Law of Thermodynamics.
3. The Law of Information.
randalusa 2 months ago
To learn the real truth go to 4shared.com and search for the word Jmmanuel and look there for a file with 9,873 KB | 2009-12-08 | File name: The-Real-New-Testament-The-Talmud-of-Jmmanuel-Person-Known-Nowadays-as-Jesus-Forgery-in-Christianity.pdf
Barreto7x7x7 7 months ago
I've noticed all the videos on youtube that debate the issue of biblical contraditions...its' only the non believers that allow their videos to be rated and comments allowed to stimulate debate...christians like to disable to comment and rating system..very curious.
SkinnyWmn69 7 months ago
@SkinnyWmn69
Christians are overly concerned with ratings. They love to comment/vote on other channels, but won't allow it on their own. Also, the notion of vote botting (using a hack or other method to give oneself multiple votes on a video) I've only seen used by Christians; nobody else. I had many of my videos go from almost 100% liked to half and half over night.
malignantpoodle 7 months ago
@SkinnyWmn69
In today's world we have now three generations of misled young atheist followers, indoctrinated by the liberal atheist liars that run ABC, NBC, NPR and CBS. They are the majority here at youtube and a growing presence around the globe. If creationist posters have shut off comments (and you offered no evidence to verify they do in any greater numbers), perhaps it is due to the lack of reasonable discourse that follows mentioning the Biblical God.
randalusa 2 months ago
@randalusa:
No, because allowing comments would mean allowing ppl to freely discuss and expose the notorious and shameless lying, quote-mining and pissing into the fountain of knowledge of creationists which is the only way those bible clowns can make an "argument" in the first place. XD
MsHyde1 1 month ago
i know this video is old, but i just had to nitpick and point out that at 5:31, you have the answers for the bcv references backwards
num 3.19 is no, god does not repent
and ex 32.14 is yes, god does repent
:-p
GodsArePeopleToo 8 months ago
Atheists always say the easiest way to make someone an atheist is to have them read the Bible. Yet, atheists have a shit-fit when we try to hand them out.
YesYou123333 11 months ago
@YesYou123333
Hmm. I personally don't know of any that raise issue with handing out bibles. It's when ignorant little shits start pushing the filth contained in the bible onto public policy that I draw the line.
malignantpoodle 11 months ago
@malignantpoodle How about handing them out at school? Would you support that?
YesYou123333 11 months ago
@YesYou123333
No, I wouldn't be ok with that. As I stated, with regard to public policy is where I have a problem. Using schools for any religion's proliferation falls under that.
malignantpoodle 11 months ago
@malignantpoodle Why? What could better separate Church and State than eliminate it all together? If everyone becomes an atheist, doesn't that make the separation even greater?
YesYou123333 11 months ago
@YesYou123333
You're apply to me, some perspective that someone else has. I never said that reading the bible is the best way to become an atheist. People who want to believe will decide to regardless of what rubbish is in the bible. I'm also not evangelical. I'm not trying to spread atheism. I think people should be free to have whatever religion they like. Stay out of public policy, and public policy should stay out of your business as well.
malignantpoodle 11 months ago
I remember as a child, being told that the bible was the best selling book in the world. I was impressed.
unfortunately, I now believe that, irrespective of it's sales figures, it is also the least read.
I advise christians that I meet to read their bibles from cover to cover, over and over again.
Most christians only read favourite passages or ones selected by their ministers.
Isaac Asimov said.
"Properly read, the Bible is the most potent force for atheism ever conceived."
I believe him
HonestMan395 1 year ago 7
@HonestMan395
Great comment and thanks!
Oh yeah, the #2 selling book of all time? "Quotations from Chairman Mao Tse Tung"
:)
malignantpoodle 1 year ago
@HonestMan395 I wish I had heard that quote from Azimov. Reading the Bible is what made me an Atheist. I found so many inconsistencies, scientific impossibilities and outright contradictions, I could not take it seriously. When I asked clergy about it, I was given a lenghty list of reasons why what I read is not what it really said, and always ended with "You have to have faith and believe in your heart".
TheThunderduck 6 months ago
@TheThunderduck It never ceases to amaze me how the only way christians can explain their bible is by indulging in huge flights of imaginative interpretation, for what is supposed to be the infallible word of an onmicient god.
My brother-in-Law was a C of E vicar. He lost his faith when he was in the seminary. They actually taught him things about the bible. Facts that they've know about for hundreds of years and it's not what they tell the punters.
HonestMan395 6 months ago
A bible expert I'm not, yet I do remember Jesus sent his apostles out twice. The first time he told them to bring nothing the second time he said they should bring things, such as a food pouch.
WrightvsWrong 1 year ago
love the D20 shirt, mate!
jymbo1969 1 year ago
THE BIBLE HAS SURVIVED OVER 3,000 YEARS OF ATTEMPTS TO DESTROY IT, DISCREDIT IT AND BELITTLE IT. YET IT SURVIVES WHILE CIVILIZATIONS AND MAN HIMSELF - COMES AND GOES ... LIKE A BREATH OF WIND.
anathemasserenades 1 year ago
Isaiah 40:6-8 "All men are like grass, and all their glory is like the the flowers of the field. The grass withereth , the flower fadeth; but the word of our God shall stand forever."
anathemasserenades 1 year ago
@anathemasserenades too bad it won't, eh? There is no god; it doesn't have a "word."
jymbo1969 1 year ago
@anathemasserenades
The bible has been around for 3000 years? Interesting.
So the longer the following, the more credible the belief? I guess Zoroastrianism must be true! Or Taoism! Because they're much older than Christianity and have not been destroyed! How about Judaism? They've survived thousands of years of persecution including the holocaust.
Your logic isn't logic at all... it's fails.
malignantpoodle 1 year ago 4
@malignantpoodle But anethemasserenades put her argument in all-caps. You can't argue with that. She must be right, or her computer would never have let her use all caps. lol Caps.
jymbo1969 1 year ago
@malignantpoodle re anathemasserenades "THE BIBLE HAS SURVIVED OVER 3,000 YEARS OF [snip]"
I often wonder if posting in ALL CAPITALS is simply the electronic version of writing in crayon .... ?
mandolinic 1 year ago
@malignantpoodle: Not to mention that the first records of established Judaism are from 600 BC and the actual bible was written a couple of hundred years "after Christ" and then edited and added to for some 1000 years. ^_^
And ppl also eat at McDonalds all around the world. That does not make this trash healthy.
MsHyde1 1 month ago
@anathemasserenades The Bible isn't 3000 years old so and Hinduism is about 6000 years old, maybe even a little older. So you've shown you don't know any thing about religion but also appealed to authority, which means you aren't very bright or don't know how to form an argument. The Bible discredits itself, don't believe me, read the last chapter of each Gospel. All four can't be right.
SQuiRR3LM0nk3y 1 year ago
You're wrong about Absalom. Sure they said he had children but in the period of time from when the children where born till the time when he said he had no children alot of things could have happened. They were not mentioned because didn't think it was important to put in the bible. maybe his children were killed we don't know but certainly at the end of days will all mysteries be answered I mean if you are a Christian as you say you are then surely you must know this
jconnor117 1 year ago
@jconnor117
"I mean if you are a Christian as you say you are"
I did not say I was a Christian. I used to be a Christian. If you want to cite to take extra-biblical information (and in this case, there is no source, only assumption) then where do you draw the line? I can take all kinds of things that aren't in the bible and make wild statements myself. If it said something like, "no longer had a son" that'd be different.
malignantpoodle 1 year ago
The Old testament was created by oppressed Israelites who feared everything that bad happen or good happen was because of God. It is human nature to seek help in time of need. The disbelief or lack of by some people is caused by the promises of faith not being made. People tend to ask for so much in prayer and cannot be answered. God is not a Genie or something that u use to clear problems. God is the spirit within everyone of us throughout years and generations good vs. evil and doubts of men.
VokalSanity 1 year ago
I'm not a Creationist but I do believe in God. But my translation of the Bible is different from most Christians. The bible was inspired by God translated by many different minds. The true meaning is discovered by each individual spiritually, The world was created over billions of years by the will of God but not with his hands. The big bang was a reaction caused when the spiritual being of God interacted with the physical universe of nothingness. The design is like a pyramid design. (continued)
VokalSanity 1 year ago
@VokalSanity (Continuation) Like everything else expanding and continuously evolving God's will is ever continuing and expanding truth that is being carried out. The expansion of the universe, the evolution of man and the passing of information on human DNA is a living example of God's existence. The coded content in each everything living or nonliving contains the Trademark of God. The human spirit that enables free thinking, faith and belief was the gift given to us and is a mystery still..
VokalSanity 1 year ago
@VokalSanity Then what is your criterion for truth? How do you know which verse are bullshit, and which are true, when they look and sound alike?
jymbo1969 1 year ago
In my humble opinion it sounds like the simple problem is simply assumming that if a word is used it means the exact same thing in both sentences. If you read the new testament...Jesus says not to judge ....then in other booksk Paul says we are to judge righteoussly . And even though someone reading those things out of context say its a contradiction, they actually mean different things. The Word is the same, yet its meaning is different in different situations.
TheImmortalTree 1 year ago
@TheImmortalTree
This doesn't explain or rectify most contradictions. How does your explanation have any relevance to Jesus telling his people to go barefoot and then later telling them to wear sandals? How does this explain Samuel's firstborn being Joel and then later Vashni?
Let me guess, you didn't even watch the video and just assumed that entire contradictions presented here hinged on the meaning or context of one word.
malignantpoodle 1 year ago
@malignantpoodle can you give me the scripture on those two? I'm going to read them , then ask the Holy Spirit to give me some wisdom on it. Thanks ;)
TheImmortalTree 1 year ago
@TheImmortalTree
It's in the video. If you're going to come here and comment on and criticize the video without even watching it, this shows obviously that y our mind is made up and your position decided before doing any evaluation.
Good thing our courts don't work that way. Render the guilty verdict, then look for the evidence.
malignantpoodle 1 year ago
@malignantpoodle Oh, I'm sorry, the reason I didn't finish watching the video is cause I watched some of the scriptures you were using and already saw how they made sense without contradicting each other. I'll finish watching it. Look, I'm not looking to fight...or argue...I seriously am going to look into this, cause before I had an encounter with Jesus, I doubted too...for 8 years. I'll watch and look into it and get back with you. Peace , Love, and Truth xoxoxo
TheImmortalTree 1 year ago
@TheImmortalTree
You saw how they didn't make sense but couldn't explain it. I see.
You doubted too? Oh really. Well, I wore bible blinders for 20 years myself. Wasted half my life with the garbage. I don't think your comparison is appropriate.
malignantpoodle 1 year ago
@malignantpoodle the disciples were not to acquire additional staffs or sandals – but to use the ones they already had
TheImmortalTree 1 year ago
@TheImmortalTree by the way, my short little video on my site is only the tip of the iceberg. I've healed one girls back and one mans arm and there are more healings to come. These are miracles and I have lots more testimonies. The thing is, it takes a humble mind. God resists the proud and reveals his wisdom to the humble. Your heart is hardened right now. I'd like to apologize to you for all the people that blew you off when you were geniunely inquiring. This would be easier on the phone
TheImmortalTree 1 year ago
@TheImmortalTree
Funny thing about you "healers"; never see you at any children's hospital healing terminal cancer ridden babies. Never see you healing amputees (funny how God never wants to heal an amputee, but heals all other kinds of vague things).
Additional anecdotal stories aren't any more convincing, nor do they lend any more credit to your original anecdotal stories.
malignantpoodle 1 year ago
@TheImmortalTree
That's not what it says. It tells them what to take with them on their journey. It says nothing about what to go out and acquire beyond one's own possessions. That's YOUR creation.
malignantpoodle 1 year ago
@malignantpoodle "take a staff" in Mark, and then in Luke it says "neither staves" different words, one in singular, one in plural. That is noteworthy. Also, this scripture keeps popping into my mind for you. John 7:17"If any man do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself" It is very possible to read the bible without gaining wisdom or power from it. It takes the Holy Spirit indwelling you - the very Spirit of God. Did you ever ask for him?
TheImmortalTree 1 year ago
@TheImmortalTree
That's "noteworthy" but the contradictions aren't? lol ok... One being plural and one singular doesn't matter; in one instance he tells them to take NOTHING. In another, he tells them what to take. Sorry, but the "one is plural one isn't" is not noteworthy and does nothing to explain the contradiction.
Gee, 20 years of being a Christian and I never asked for him! You must have so much discernment... Not really.
malignantpoodle 1 year ago
FF3 MUSIC SWEEEEEEEEEET
equallyeasilyfuqyou 1 year ago
A copy or portion of nearly every Old Testament book was found in Qumran. There were extra-biblical and apocryphal books found as well, but again, 40% of the scrolls were copies of the Hebrew Old Testament.
The Dead Sea Scrolls can also give us confidence in the reliability of the Old Testament manuscripts since there were minimal differences between the manuscripts that had previously been discovered and those that were found in Qumran.
whiskeymeow 1 year ago
@whiskeymeow
Again, factually incorrect. No Joshua, Judges, Ruth, Kings I and II, Chronicles I and II, Ezra, Nehemiah, Job, Ecclesiastes, Lamentations, and many others. Those which are referenced do not contain original text but merely reference to the books or their descriptions.
The bible is NOT in fact intact since the Dead Sea Scrolls. The differences are enormous.
malignantpoodle 1 year ago
The Dead Sea Scrolls simply verify that the Bible has been transmitted correctly over the last 2000 years. The Dead Sea Scrolls were written between 300BC and 67AD, approximately.
The NLT has good footnotes and is easy to read. Educated theologians understand the nuisances, hyperbole and metaphor of the original languages. The numbers could be copy errors or simply hyperbole. Again no change to the core story. A yearning for God should not be disregarded due to the number of Solomon's horses.
whiskeymeow 1 year ago
@whiskeymeow
"Educated theologians understand the nuisances, hyperbole and metaphor of the original languages. "
Wrong. Even educated theologians do not agree and debate on many major points. Christians from the recently reborn up to the highest levels of education in the religion do not agree amongst themselves. There is no solidarity and very little commonality between theologians.
malignantpoodle 1 year ago
@malignantpoodle Common beliefs include
1. Bible is the word of God 2. One God triune in nature 3.Jesus is God 4. Christ died for our sins 5. Christ rose again 6. Believers recieve eternal life.
whiskeymeow 1 year ago
@whiskeymeow
Not all theologians believe the bible is the word of God. MANY believe otherwise. There are MAJOR rifts with regard to the trinity.
It's amazing how uneducated you are about your own religion.
malignantpoodle 1 year ago
@malignantpoodle I am of course speaking about Christian Thologians and Apologists. Obviously an athiest would not agree. To my knowledge Catholics and most mainstream protestants are Trinitarians. Of course Unitarians are around but not near as prevalent. Calvin, Luther, Wesley all agreed on common beliefs. Today Willliam Lane Craig, Paul Copan, Hugh Ross, Norman Giesler, J.P. Moreland, Greg Koukl share these beliefs. Uneducated? I am not the one who said that Mark6 was in the Dead Sea Scrolls.
whiskeymeow 1 year ago
@whiskeymeow
Right, even Christian theologians of the same denominations disagree on many major points. Heck even the biblical authors disagree on major issues such as Jesus' lineage as there are three conflicted accounts naming different people.
And yes, Mark 6:52-53 is the only part of the bible intact from the Dead Sea Scrolls. Your argument that the bible stays intact going back to the scrolls is factually incorrect as only a couple of verses are there.
malignantpoodle 1 year ago
@malignantpoodle It has been argued that (7Q5) is a New Testament text from the Mark 6:52–53. In recent years this controversial assertion has been taken up again. Opponents consider that the fragment is tiny and requires so much reconstruction (the one complete word in Greek is "και" = "and"). It most likely came from a text other than Mark. Look up Dead Sea Scrolls on Wikipedia and you will see all of the total and partial writings that match the Old Testament. Including Ruth, etc....
whiskeymeow 1 year ago
@whiskeymeow
Oh I see, you JUST NOW started reading about the Dead Sea Scrolls and are telling me that instead of the bible remaining intact going back tot he scrolls, that now there are huge chunks missing?
Seems you haven't put much thought or research into your argument.
malignantpoodle 1 year ago
Profound?
These are the same old arguments from the past. You are truly a literal fundamentalist. You need to read the works of real theologians to understand the actual "truth" of the Bible. People were inspired to write the words of the Bible by God. Few theologians actually believe in a "Dictation theory of Inspiration", so these irrelevent errors do not change the meaning conveyed. The Bible is true in what it "teaches" and it is literally unaltered since the "Dead Sea Scrolls".
whiskeymeow 1 year ago
@whiskeymeow
So I need to read the work of real theologians, even though the bible is true and unchanged?
BTW, the bible did not come from the Dead Sea Scrolls which were discovered in the 1940s. So, try again.
malignantpoodle 1 year ago
@malignantpoodle The Dead Sea Scrolls verify that the Bible has been transmitted correctly over the last 2000 years. The Dead Sea Scrolls were written between 300BC and 67AD. The NLT has good footnotes and is easy to read. Educated theologians understand the nuisances, hyperbole and metaphor of the original languages. The numbers could be copy errors or simply hyperbole. No change to the core story. God should not be disregarded due to the # of Solomon's horses.
whiskeymeow 1 second ago
whiskeymeow 1 year ago
@whiskeymeow
"The Dead Sea Scrolls verify that the Bible has been transmitted correctly over the last 2000 years."
Factually incorrect. 60% of the scrolls mention nothing biblical in nature, and there is only one passage from Mark 6 which is in the bible that stays intact from the Dead Sea Scrolls. The rest do not represent the modern bible except for mention of some of the same people, but the contradictions, errors, and inconsistencies abound, without mentioning omissions.
malignantpoodle 1 year ago
I love it. If the Bible is right, then I feel that the Apocrypha books, Gospel of Thomas, Q, Enoch, should be right too and be included in the bible. Yet man removed those books.
Topazman12 1 year ago
i don't get how u won with like a couple 9s
RAPSUCKSSSSS 1 year ago
Actually, I have to question the Numbers 3:19. I've checked Numbers 3:1 through 3:25, and I can't find the passage you mentioned. Found the other one though.
In my KJV bible, Numbers 3:19 says "And the sons of Kohath by their families; Amram, and Izehar, Hebron, and Uzziel."
Is this another typo?
...Ah, I found it. It's Numbers 23:19, not 3:19.
GoblinKnightLeo 1 year ago
Wheee!! Christians are boring!! :D
sumtin1617 1 year ago
There are different Christain denominations. There are Catholics, Lutherists, Jehovah's Witnesses, Anglicans, Quakers, etc. and each one interprets god differently. Therefore god is subjective. If something is subjective it is not accepted as fact. If something is subjective it is not objective; if something is not objective then it is not real. Therefore God is not real.
LonesomePaleRider 1 year ago
@LonesomePaleRider A small fallacy in your argument : God is not subjective, it is those who interpret Him differently that are subjective.
k0smon 1 year ago
@k0smon You say people are the subjective ones. Prove it. Show me your Mathematical Logic.
LonesomePaleRider 1 year ago
@LonesomePaleRider I doubt anything I could say would be accepted by you as proof, but perhaps the complexity of the world would indicate an intelligent design or God. Are you familiar with flagellar motors?
k0smon 1 year ago
@k0smon That's cause I'm a Mathematician. Are you fimiliar with Chaos Theory; The Theory of Everything?
LonesomePaleRider 1 year ago
@k0smon re God is not subjective.
I'm not speaking for onesomePaleRider but... The existence, nature and mind of whichever god is clearly a matter of subjective opinion... surely that's the point; people explaining how everyone else has the wrong idea of god.
queenastilon 1 year ago
Liked it a lot. Keep it up.
DeaconVerter 1 year ago
Thanks for the support!
malignantpoodle 1 year ago
@malignantpoodle What is your opinion of Carlton Pearson and his Gospel of Inclusion? He says Christ died to save everyone, and they are saved whether they know it or not. He has definitely upset some fundie's apple-carts. Pearson is now a 'new-thought' preacher. My question is: If he is right, do we even need to know about Christianity?
k0smon 1 year ago
@k0smon
Well, I don't know where he's getting his information. The bible is very clear about non-believers or people of other religions. It's the whole, "us" vs. "them" mentality. If it's one thing the bible is consistent about, it's that people who aren't Christians are lost.
But Pearson just underscores the point that people will spin any kind of story they like out of the bible to substantiate what they want believe. This is one of the reasons why Christians themselves cannot agree.
malignantpoodle 1 year ago
@k0smon You are saved if you accept Jesus as savior that is what the Bible says.
Now malignant I am also working on answering your "contradictions"
Jnest55 1 year ago
Go Poodle!
DeaconVerter 1 year ago
I liked your pyramid scheme videos. This one... not so much. But great effort nonetheless.
PandawdyBob 1 year ago
Yeah well I have a pretty diversified channel. I definitely won't please all of the people all of the time :)
malignantpoodle 1 year ago
this will be fun. I will answer all your questions in the bible and you have never been a christian, no offence.
jasonwkeller76 2 years ago
None taken, because you obviously don't know what you're talking about. I was a true believer for 20 solid years. Brought people to the Lord that are still with him today. Pastors, brothers in Christ, the people I brought to God, I guess I just had them all duped.
Saying that I was never a Christian reveals an obvious lack of discernment on your part. I have a video about discernment being hit and miss. Your remarks here underscore that.
malignantpoodle 2 years ago
Hahahahaha... I love the end!
adamredwine 2 years ago
My favorite one is where God commanded blood sacrifices in Exodus, and then in Jeremiah asked who commanded them to offer such sacrifices. WTF? See, there were horns on the AL-tars, and the promised land was Caanan. Well, convienient because Caana worshipped a bull god with horns named AL. I believe there is ONE God, but I don't think we can find Him from the bible.
TrinaTown213 2 years ago
In both verses given (correcting for Exodus 3:19 actually being Exodus 23:19), not only the English, but also the original Hebrew word is the same, according to Strong: good old H5162, nacham.
Thesterness 2 years ago
To clarify, that was @ higgolini's comment about different words being used in different translations.
Thesterness 2 years ago
Even if christianity is right, there are over 33000 branches of christianity. There are also 150 religins wrld-wide. This limits your chances of being right to 0.6%. Assuming the branches of christianity doesn't count.
metalsaw666 2 years ago 6
@metalsaw666 thats why you don't follow a branch...you follow Jesus
TheImmortalTree 1 year ago
@TheImmortalTree That was no arguement at all. You just ignored my comment.
metalsaw666 1 year ago
@metalsaw666
In addition to your comment, as you pointed out, there are so many religions and branches of religions, it is clear everyone is still going around saying "Know the Lord" (at least, their version of who that god is). This in itself disproves Christianity, as they claim that Jesus was the fulfillment of Jeremiah 31:31-34 (the new covenant). Yet verse 34 of that prophecy specifically states that no longer will anyone go around saying "know the LORD", for everyone will know Him. =o
JewishResearchGuy 1 year ago
@JewishResearchGuy That also means they MUST follow the OT laws as stated in Jeremiah 31:31-33 if they want to claim the title as the new covenant.
SQuiRR3LM0nk3y 1 year ago
@SQuiRR3LM0nk3y
Agreed, the prophecy in Jeremiah 31:31-34 does indeed mean that under the new covenant, the laws listed in the Torah will still be adhered to strictly, including animal sacrifices, but instead, it will be different by the laws being written on their hearts. It does not mean the laws will cease, in part, or in whole. This is obviously something most Christians miss, even when Jesus himself said in Matthew 5:18-19 that every single bit of the Law was to be kept and re-taught.=)
JewishResearchGuy 1 year ago
Your videos are just self-pleasing to yourself and lots of gullable people. Why can't you make a serious video with serious disputes instead of showing one side how about you give us 2 examples of a good christian explanation and your explanation. Instead you just say anyone who explain it to be true their explanation sucks and yours is right?
LifeLibertyLove 2 years ago
A serious dispute?
The fact that you've posted to me some 30 times in the last 48 hours means that something I brought to the table bothers you deeply.
But hey, here's a serious dispute for you; CHRISTIANS THEMSELVES CANNOT AGREE UPON WHAT THE BIBLE SAYS.
malignantpoodle 2 years ago
firstborn does not mean first created, the greek word is Prototokos it means firstborn Protoktioti means firstcreated. Firstborn means sovereign over something not "first" created...
LifeLibertyLove 2 years ago
Interesting that your infallible, all knowing god couldn't understand this.
malignantpoodle 2 years ago
He did because this is the word he used? Who told you that firstborn means first born? firstborn is one word first born is 2 words. What don't you understand?
LifeLibertyLove 2 years ago
Same thing except for how it's written. What's the difference between a firstborn son and a first born son?
You're really grabbing at straws now.
malignantpoodle 2 years ago
Have you ever once in your life sat down and actually tried to understand what the bible is actually reading? Firstborn mean's soverign. Just replace everytime they use firstborn with soverign. It's quite obvious firstborn does not mean first created lol... If you would simply look at the greek text or well you know everytime it has been used in the english translations. Search Greek Interlinear Bible on google... I know you won't and do not care your agenda holds you against the truth.
LifeLibertyLove 2 years ago
You said firstborn and first born are not the same thing. Explain.
malignantpoodle 2 years ago
If you are not aware it is not exactly a perfected or exact science translating something 2000 years ago. But even though this fact be true the King James Version still is the closest translation.
Colossians 1:15
Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
Colossians 1:18
And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
Look at Colossians 1:18 if you look at
LifeLibertyLove 2 years ago
If you look at the greek manuscripts you know those silly copies of the bible from 1000AD remember they were found to be nearly identical to the dead sea scrolls which date to latest 100AD... the word is protoki it means sovereign in a rough english translation.
LifeLibertyLove 2 years ago
If you are going to choose to not believe what the bible actually says there is plenty of make believe contradictions you can make up, Colossians 1:18 says Jesus is the first born from the dead... yet he is not the first born from the dead, remember Jesus ressurected. Sorry I meant to say Prototokos, Protoki is used wherever they literally mean first created
LifeLibertyLove 2 years ago
Kings 17:8-22 Elija is the first documented "first born" of the dead in the bible. The reason he is not the Prototokos is because Jesus ressurected himself from the dead he is over the control of death. Psalm 89:27 David calls his eighth son his firstborn but it does not mean it's his first son we can see the context CLEARLY means a rough equivelant to sovereign or pre-eminence. Which is what it means. Search Greek Interllinear bible you would really like that.
LifeLibertyLove 2 years ago
I've seen Greek Interlinear, the Blue Bible, all of that stuff.
You hide in the translation argument without speaking the languages. You weren't brought to Christianity by the Greek, you were brought it by the English versions.
You have made up your mind to believe what you want, and are now trying to go back and find the evidence to support the decision you've already made.
malignantpoodle 2 years ago
That is a very interesting inference you have made. However I believe you are doing what you claim I am doing. I go back to the original greek to try to find contradictions I go through the english versions to try to find contradictions not to support my claim but to see if their truely is any valid arguments against it. And people like you who just makes jokes out of obvious non-contradictions really strengthens my views that their truely is no contradictions at least as long as your literate.
LifeLibertyLove 2 years ago
Literate? ROFL look at yourself;
"And people like you who just makes jokes out of obvious non-contradictions really strengthens my views that their truely is no contradictions at least as long as your literate."
their instead of there, your instead of you're.
YOU buddy, are illiterate.
malignantpoodle 2 years ago
LifeLibertyLove - the Bible is riddled with Giants, Unicorns and Hell-Fire. That is ok, on its own, but couple this with hoards of idiots that believe in it and act on it,then... it has retarded society and inflicted more harm than good. (If you believe that the words of the Bible are divine (if divine: why all the interpretation?????), explain the diverse interpretation (FACT!!!)- that has/ and still leads to intolerance, bloodshed and stupidity).
alieales 2 years ago
So you believe Dinosaurs are real? And you believe there is millions of species of animals that once existed and have gone extinct and somehow there is intermediate species that go from a mouse to a dinosaur to a bird to a human yet these creatures seem ridiculous to have once existed?
LifeLibertyLove 2 years ago
Belief in dinosaurs is a result of looking where the empirical, objective evidence points. FAITH is exactly that; belief without evidence. You cannot compare biblical passages with empirical scientific evidence. It's like comparing Mike Tyson to Tinkerbell.
malignantpoodle 2 years ago
Many people believed in dinosaur like creatures before the word dinosaur was discovered or any fossils so all of these people are fools?
LifeLibertyLove 2 years ago
Dinosaur like? There are myths of creatures of all sorts in many different legends and religions.
malignantpoodle 2 years ago
Lifelibertylove: Did Humans live at the same time as Dinosaurs?
BTW - "when was the last war over the bible" its not the bible (or other religious text) it is what it stands for - that being a so called "truth". If 2 "truths" are diametrically opposed- this often leads to conflict. In history MOST wars have had religion entwined. Atheist political dogma (in the case of Stalin) copied the structure of religious dogma!
alieales 2 years ago
people are the problem ...the Jacobins in france killed in the name or atheism ... it's note able to point out that Jesus said love your enemies ... I think Martain Luther Kings Vietnam speach is a very important one in todays political climate
sl0j0 2 years ago
2nd Foundational Falsehood of Creationism by AronRa on youtube might intrest you LifeLibertyLove?
alieales 2 years ago
@LifeLibertyLove
Noticed how he said that mouse turns into dinosaur and birds into humans? Thats false and If that really did happen in evolution then it would prove evolution wrong.
How would you like it if we put the same false argument to you guys? Example..
You really think there is an deep voiced old man in the sky? How did this man in the sky fly in the sky? Yet this man in the sky seems ridiculous.
How about understanding the other side first? Otherwise you seem so arrogant.
truckcompany 2 years ago
When was the last war over the bible. How many years ago was this war. Please state the casualties. How many wars have we had that were purely for materialistic gain. Yes certain people have trouble reading the bible and misinterpreting it. But a majority of things are agreed upon. The bible clearly says love of money and wordly materials is bad this is not a question amongst any christians who believe the bible.
LifeLibertyLove 2 years ago
"when was the last war over the bible"
If you pay attention to the rhetoric of some of the more wingnut generals we have, then both Iraq and Afghanistan are part of a "biblical mandate" to scourge Islam from the region.
And I'm sure one of the main reasons we're still there in Iraq (even after Saddam is gone) is for a misplaced "missionary" purposes.
LordCustos3 2 years ago
no no no that was only a pretext to get the republicans on board
sl0j0 2 years ago
The contradictions I point out are very obvious and some of them mathematical. You cannot summarily address the issue of contradictions by citing a translation issue. There are profound errors and inconsistencies in the entire work which stands in the Greek, Hebrew, and English.
malignantpoodle 2 years ago
Where? Every so called mathamatical error you claim to have found is not an error at all. GIve me one specific example and I will easily show you why it's not. You are not even reading the thing you don't care what it says you just want to find things that look like contradictions and throw them all in one video all at once.
LifeLibertyLove 2 years ago
Um, so you haven't even watched the video and you're debating with me about contents?
Here's a mathematical error at 6:27
malignantpoodle 2 years ago
If I choose to believe not what the bible says? You means, if I choose not to think like you do.
This is the same dogmatic line that Christians use against each other. That the person that thinks otherwise is "not a real Christian" or "doesn't understand the bible". Right.
malignantpoodle 2 years ago