"If I find the truth, I take it—bitter or not." That's reminiscent of a quote from Thomas Henry Huxley: "Sit down before fact as a little child, be prepared to give up every preconceived notion, follow humbly wherever and to whatever abysses nature leads, or you shall learn nothing."
Science and religion are incompatible for deeper reasons than timelines. Science shows that the very concept of consciousness is something that only applies to biological organisms. There can't be a supernatural being with a mind because there can't be a mind without a brain. You can't separate [thoughts & feelings] from [living creatures]. Living creature define thoughts and feelings. God can only be a construct of the imagination.
I found some Christians, who I thought were dunces, have acquired a strong spiritual knowledge and understanding of God through spiritual experience (possible in any religion). Knowledge and spirituality seem to appear as opposites because knowledge lessens one ability to rely on faith (vs self), and one can depend on spiritual experience to the extent that they do illogical things that not even the Bible would agree to.
So when it comes to the portions of the Bible consisting of miraculous things, or parts not making sense due to culture, time gaps, the change in translations, context, and pure age! A person who can't believe in something until every detail made sense, would struggle with this. Yet a person who can base everything on faith, that would be easy because they know what God is capable of. But they may lack knowledge and struggle with understanding even the simple concepts
Well the guy was right about the religious debate being bad for your studies, I'm ment to be revising for the 4 exams I have this week but would rather watch this
The part where the professor is trying to warn you away from all this reminded me of the scenes from that Dewey Cox movie where he keeps walking in on the guy doing drugs and the guy keeps saying 'Get out of here Dewey, you don't want none of this!'
I follow a very similar path on my way to atheism. Although, I met no one on the same intellectual level as me who was an atheist and helped exposed the various fallacies of the church. I'm similar in that as I studied God more, it led me closer to atheism. The further I investigated, the more illogical religion seemed. Yet it wasn't until the vary end did I stop believing. I wonder how many atheist became that way through slow and deliberate thought.
2:25 "If I find the truth, I take it, bitter or not."
This is the difference between rationality and fundamentalism. I doubt either of us would be Atheists today if we only believed what stroked our own egos.
Then you will be handed over to be persecuted and put to death, and you will be hated by all nations because of me. At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people (Mat. 24:9-11).
PRAISE BE TO GOD THE GREAT PROPHECY OF APOSTACY IS HERE THIS MEANS THE HOUR IS NEAR
God bless you Chris and other "former" Christians, as you are doing this documentary, i hope you realize that this world is not about what you do, or how you live. Life is useless if only for entertainment like you propose. We have no purpose in this world and you might as well think that there is no God. But you are not being rational. Look outside. Could a jug of milk in any way do that? Science screams God's name. Stop blinding yourself and thinking that blind means you can see everything.
"This worlds is not about what you do, or how you live"
That is one of the most false statements I have heard, your actions make up everything, and this can be easily demonstrated by anyone anywhere. We have demonstrated through science that everything is atomically connected, and that negative, and positive make up the balance of the entire universe. He is not proposing life is for entertainment, its about creation, beauty, learning, loving.
Tower of babel is impossible... maybe i'm confused on this. As last I checked, under current science, even today, we aren't sure what the pyramids are for, nor how they were built. There are areas of this work with 200 ton bricks, with holes drilled in stone, far beyond anything we can do today. So does that mean that the pyramids must not exist as it is impossible for us to build them today? Had they been destroyed, would he claim they never existed as well?
@RejechtedGaming Except that like in the pyramids, they are dated to have taken only 20 years. So unless you only lived for 5 years at a time, the pyramids were built in only one generation.
@unassumption they emailed each other, he may just decided not to give any information, and he did not say culture>physhics he said that a physician speaking about a cultural phenomenon was as out of place as say a cook speaking about a geology.
don't slap people you are better than that Salvor Hardin said it "ignorance is the last resource of the ignorant."
@unassumption Oh, is that what he said? And, is that how he said it? We must have been listening to different presentations, for if we were, WERE did you find what you to believe are points?
I think one of the reasons the professor's statements were so effective on Chris was that he showed Christianity the same respect that Chris is showing it now in these videos. Proof that you don't have to be condescending to make your point. Take note, atheists.
@NuttyMongrel Perhaps, but most Christians aren't like Chris. I don't think Atheists have problems debating / arguing with people as rational as he, it's much easier to be civil. Note how the original review the professor wrote sounded a bit more scathing, but once sent an email by Chris he (probably) changed his tone.
@CarthageDude13 Yes, in implying that he would probably become an atheist if he found the truth, it puts that huge curiosity there, then in saying "dont look for the truth cuz u might not handle it well" it creates a stronger urge to witness such powerful information.
@yiuvince - Agreed. Very good step through and appeals those who want to or have done analysis on the subject. I similarly went through this type of conversion - although in my case it took years.
This is so honest and powerful that I am weeping as I type. I came here on Douglas Adams' birthday to feel a certain kinship with my fellow non-believers. I am getting far more than I bargained for.
The foundation that allowed you to become an atheist seem to be your strong and genuine belief in god. This allowed you to dig deeper and deeper without having the fear of being wrong. You were confident that nomatter how much you researched, your understanding of god would only become stronger. You were not afraid.
Does this mean that the average not-that-serious christian is less likely to convert than one dedicating their life to it? Would be interesting to know.
The fact that the unbelieving professor seemed to "outclass" the seeker in no way refuted Schroeder. The appeal to the moral authority of thinking people who relegated Christianity to myth did not refute Schroeder's mathematical propositions, and it affords no predicate whatsoever to the relegation of Christian people to the status of deluded automatons, mental children, or inferior intellectual honesty. Nothing you say in this section refutes or even addresses, Schroeder.
I like this video series for it's sincerity and what I suspect is it's impact, but I find your views of other atheists difficult at times. I completed much of the journey you describe by the age of 7 and recognized that I didn't believe in a god, whilst attending Christian faith schools. I have been where you are now for more than 30 years whilst still following philosophy, science, history etc. I no less grasp the mind of a Christian but am still exasperated by them. Why is this bad?
Yup...other Christians are usually a good way to gauge the belief system. Ever notice how many are bigoted or homophobic? I remember when i was new in church in the early 90s, invited over to a youth event. I mentioned I voted for Clinton, and people were like "how could you vote for him? He's trying to legalize gays in the military!"
Then look at their history- no group fought harder AGAINST interracial marriage. All for their invisible silent magical Jesus.
The tower of Babel?? Really? Friend, you should take a BASIC hermeneutics class on Old Testament theology. The tower of Babel is OBVIOUSLY allegory and has been labeled as such going all the way back. Go and read the writings of famous Rabbis from the middle ages like Mamionides or Nahmanides. I thought I was going to see some groundbreaking arguments on this video and instead all I see is amateurish drivel from somebody who hasn't the slightest clue on proper biblical interpretation. FAIL.
"Friend, you should take a BASIC hermeneutics class on Old Testament theology. The tower of Babel is OBVIOUSLY allegory and has been labeled as such going all the way back"
I've seen this new Christian trick- it's "allegory" now. We were taught for centuries this book was "the absolute word of God" and it was all true. NOTHING in the passage indicates "allegory" & it's just you making an excuse.
@hipstermi You to should also take a basic hermeneutics class since you make the same mistake as the person who made the video. It is both the word of God and allegory. The two are not mutually exclusive. Allegory is meant to teach great truths. Go and read the writings of Saint Augustine from the fourth century where he makes perfectly CLEAR that stories like Johna and the tower of Babel are OBVIOUSLY allegory. (continued)
"You to should also take a basic hermeneutics class since you make the same mistake as the person who made the video"
You keep acting like an "expert" and oh so educated...but you really use this as a way to not answer questions including common sense. No, flying, changing water to wine, and sea partings are no possible...and if they were I'd love to see any Christian do it.
"Go and read the writings of Saint Augustine from the fourth century"
You need to stop talking down like you "teaching" me anything. I am familiar with his works.
Second, there are plenty of other 4th century christians who did not say "allegory".
You sinned with a false accusation (actualy LIED) that I knew nothing of Catholic or Orthodox. When I was in the Orthodox church, "allegory" was not taught...the Bible was "the word of god" and all the magical stories were TRUE.
@hipstermi I am acting like an expert because I am. First, I am an Orthodox Christian. Second, I have my M.Div from Holy Cross in Boston. Third, I am in my last year of my Ph.D in Orthodox Theology at the University of Geneva in Switzerland. So, if you would like to discuss or debate me on the Cannons, Councils or Church fathers and their instruction on proper biblical interpretation I will be happy to. Also, I didnt lie when I said you know nothing about Orthodoxy. Its obvious you dont.
@hipstermi Check your mail. Btw, i refuse to believe you were ever an orthodox christian. You know almost nothing about orthodoxy. If a Biologist said that the theory of evolution means babies come from storks would you believe he was a biologist?? probably not. Just like you claiming to be an orthodox christian and not knowing the first thing about Orthodoxy leads me to believe that you were never an orthodox Christian. Maybe you were born into the faith but that does not make you one.
" refuse to believe you were ever an orthodox christian. You know almost nothing about orthodoxy"
YOur Christian lying again about me. That's a "sin" so repent to magical Jesus. You can't even live your own belief.
You being led by bishops who are old men who choose to be >snicker< CELIBATE is laughable and pathetic. Funny how that requirement is not Biblical. Paul makes one "sort of" reference and you guys want to make men live like freaks.
@hipstermi You are not capable of thoughtful debate. I have already proved that you know nothing about orthodoxy even though you claim to have "studied". You asking me for proof for a localized event that happened 2,000 years ago. There are plenty of extra biblical sources that mention Christ like the Talmud, Josephus, Pliny the younger, lucian of samosata etc. You are nothing but a belligerent troll who doesn't know shit from shinola about Christianity, the bible or orthodox doctrine.
LOL! Jews disagree with you on that one! Not everyone accepts Herford's take.
Plus...you are telling me this older book tells of a messiah...you think your later book "proves" he's the Messiah because...the later book says so.
So if I write a book with a character and I write it to coincide with say Navajo prophesy... according to your circular logic that makes it "true" because my book says so?
PLINY THE YOUNGER- He wrote about ChristIANS not encountering Christ. That doesn't prove "Christ". You or I can meet or even write about Voodoo worshipers, and that doesn't "prove" Bondyè or any Loa.
there are non Koran writings of Mohamed. That doesn't "prove" Islam true to me (or you).
"lucian of samosata"
A guy who lived 100 years or so AFTER THE FACT & wrote about Jesus "proves" what?
@hipstermi my point to you was that its impossible to prove that these people existed beyond a shadow of a doubt. simply because they lived so long ago. instead of engaging in meaningful discourse you insist on throwing around terms like "magical Jesus". This is obviously the consequences of a piss poor education system in America. You Americans are fat, lazy, obnoxious and completely incapable of having a rationale discussion on the ORIGINAL topic which was biblical hermeneutics.
"my point to you was that its impossible to prove that these people existed beyond a shadow of a doubt"
Not really. The Shakespear notations I gave are conclusive. AND if you disproved Shakespear existed, I would stil ask you to prove Jesus and his magical feats happened. Cause come on- levitation over water is just not possible. Then again...Peter did it so why can't YOU?
""magical Jesus". This is obviously the consequences of a piss poor education system in America. You Americans are fat, lazy, obnoxious and completely incapable of having a rationale discussion on the ORIGINAL topic which was biblical hermeneutics. "
NAME CALLING is not very "Christ like"
Greece has it's fair share of fat asses to.
C. In 05, I was disgusted how your young men were drunk and at date rape capacity to American women.
@hipstermi judging from your page its obvious that you are a troll who likes to provoke people on different videos. You are truly pathetic. Its also obvious from your page that you are a sodomite and therefore it is no wonder that you have a problem with Christianity. Having to face the truth makes you feel like a pervert and so you dismiss it. You are truly pathetic....please dont go around claiming to be Greek. You give real Greeks a bad name.
@hipstermi You dont even speak Greek and you know nothing about Greece. I am sure like other so-called Greek americans all you know about is ancient Greece. You say I bear false witness but thats what you say. i say that you are a sodomite.
"You dont even speak Greek and you know nothing about Greece. I am sure like other so-called Greek americans all you know about is ancient Greece"
This is typical of Christians- unable to prove supernatural beliefs, they have to resort to childish insults. Nothing you said addressed anything in this video or my questions on proof to your magical stories. No rational answers or ability on your part to reason.
On top of that... all your angry insults have NOTHING to do with the topic- no proof to your beliefs or your stories with supernatural powers. No historical evidence- EVERY person you cited wrote decades or centuries after Jesus.
Your reply to that is "you're not Greek enough" & "you're gay"
Especially the last part, that's something a teenager would say.
AND it didn't address the point- you have provided NO proof or even a rational argument.
"Just like you claiming to be an orthodox christian and not knowing the first thing about Orthodoxy leads me to believe that you were never an orthodox Christian"
This is the typical Christian trick- lie.
When someone disagrees, you guys ALWAYS say "you don't know..." I KNOW your teachings. I don't agree with them. Many Christians know evolution and don't agree with that.
It is possible for 2 guys to go to the same church & get the same lessons/brainwashing & believe different.
So instead of your Christian anger, insults and cussing and lies about me...
why didnt you present ANY historic proof of Jesus? or proof to supernatural feats? You gave names of guys who wrote after the fact...one who didnt write about Christ but of Christians.
Fact is...you didnt really address one question posed to you.
@hipstermi Prove Genghis Khan or Alexander the great existed. Prove that Shakespeare or Plato or Aristotle existed. Prove that when you read "the republic" by Plato that you are actually reading his works and not the works of a later scribe centuries later. Prove that the crusades happened or that Christopher Columbus existed and came to America.
"Prove Genghis Khan or Alexander the great existed"
Instead of directly answering questions, your whole strategy seems to be about "you prove something different". Why is it you try the turn around answers and not directly answering about magical Jesus?
"Prove Genghis Khan or Alexander the great existed. Prove that Shakespeare or Plato or Aristotle existed"
you are acting childisn and just repeating the same questions I posed to you about proving Jesus. Not only that, but we don't have SUPERNATURAL accounts of the men you listed.
Records in their life time, not "after the fact" like your bible.
Shakespear- birth, baptism, marriage & death record.
Now back to the original point- what have you got on Jesus &magical powers?
"Also, I didnt lie when I said you know nothing about Orthodoxy. Its obvious you dont"
yes you are christian lying. I told you my background and my personal studies. You don't know anything about me, so you make up stuff.
I get why you are so defensive. You've devoted much time and study to this magical belief system of yours. You seems to have a tough time admitting you are wrong.
It is interesting...you do seem to point to Orthodox dogma more than the actual Bible.
If you want to pretend the magical feats of the OT are "allegory" that's fine. Many rational people also have issues with the sick laws in the OT.
Killing gays? Disobedient children? Even the excuse "taht was Old Testament" doesnt cover the fact you guys seem to get off on such a being that would kill people for any reason.
Oh yeah...there's no historical proof of magical Jesus. Of all we know of Roman and Hebew law there's no proof a criminal like Barabus would be VOTED free.
@hipstermi I can name literally DOZENS of famous Christian theologians from the first couple centuries of Christianity that AFFIRMED the allegorical nature of many of these stories. A Christian who takes these stories as literal is also in need of a BASIC class in hermeneutics. In fact, if you go all the back to the Babylonian Talmud which predates Jesus, you will see that the book of genesis is described in the original hebrew as a great poem. Anyway, you should educate yourself.
I'm educated just fine, and probably a lot more than you are.
On top of that...you still didn't answer my question. Jesus' magical powers- were they "allegory" as well? Raising dead, mater transutation, levitation and flying, coming back from the dead, casting out >snicker< DEMONS. You know...the bullshit impossible feats Christians say Jesus did?
The fact Christians believe in devils and demons is rather childish.
You also avoided a key point- you can say "allegory" but the majority of Christians don't feel that way nor teach that.
On top of that...if you want to toss out the magical talking snake as "allegory" ... what else? Moses's magical sea parting? Moses existing? Jesus' magical powers? Jesus existing? Paul's stories? Kind David's tales?
Unless by allegory you mean made up symbolic fictional stories...then we agree.
@hipstermi First, yes, the powers and feats of Christ were real. Secondly, you are presumably American and therefore have a limited view of the Christian world. Evangelicals are in fact the MINORITY in the Christian worlds next to Catholics and Eastern Orthodox. So no, you accusation that the majority of Christians feel that way is false. You say that these feats were impossible why? how can you possibly know that?
"You say that these feats were impossible why? how can you possibly know that?"
Common sense. For one none of the Christians can duplicate them. And don't give me the "medical" miracles like your headache or a guy told you cancer was cured. No documentation of you guys curing the blind. Or hey...what about levitation? Jesus and Peter both levitated on water.
So why do you think they ARE real outside being told what to think...and how can you possibly know those accounts are real?
@hipstermi Do you have any idea how many modern day medical miracles happen that science can not even hope to explain? Lastly, you are obviously not educated on Christian theology because you keep making one fallacious argument after another. its actually quite pathetic....
Oh and Aegean? Yes I am Greek, was Orthodox and have been to Greece and other parts of Europe multiple times.
You should also realize...even with your "allegory" of the Bible, there is no commands in the Bible for the Greek Orthodox Mary worship or praying to Saints. If YOU read history you would know how Christianity abosorbed Pagan practices... and now you have your seconday and demi gods again.
@hipstermi There is nothing magical about icons. This is exactly what I am talking about. It is embarrassing how little you know about Orthodoxy. We should have our discussion in Greek since you claim to be one. But, as with other so called "Greeks" in America you probably dont even speak Greek. You are so ignorant and uneducated that you cannot grasp the spiritual depth of orthodoxy which is why it seems like magic to you. People hate what they dont understand.
"There is nothing magical about icons. This is exactly what I am talking about. It is embarrassing how little you know about Orthodoxy"
You're doing it again- you lying (sin). I was in the Orthodox church for 20 years. I was an alter boy. When I considered leaving I spent a considerable amount of times reading in the library early church history.
Let's not debate icons- PROVE YOUR BIBLE.
Prove the events/ people happened. prove Jesus' magical powers
@hipstermi I am not lying . you are very ignorant. You obviously did not read early church history because if you did you would not say something as stupid as "the trinity was invented at Nicaea". That is a complete amateur mistake. There is nothing magical about icons. Go and pick up an Orthodox catechism. Icons are there to convey theological messages and truths. They are also there to give us a visual reference since sight is important to how we feel.
@hipstermi Lets talk about Saint John of Damascus, the most important Orthodox theologian, and his instruction on biblical interpretation and lets dissect his liturgy so I can educate you on the simple fact that Orthodoxy more than any other version of Christianity puts the most emphasis on allegory.
"Lets talk about Saint John of Damascus, the most important Orthodox theologian,"
Again- you're not "teaching" me anything.
Yeah...I remember that. The Greek church does places these "theologians" equal if not more important than the Bible. And you bring up one of the chief pro ICON guys?
also- a guy born 600 some years after the fact of Christ? Not exactly the most convincing argument your magical religion is true
@hipstermi We can talk about Saint John Chrysostom, another major orthodox theologian, and his instruction on proper biblical interpreation. Lets dissect Orthodox hymnology so we can examine the allegorical nature of the major biblical stories. Are you up for it? somehow I doubt it. Let me give you some advice. Do not discuss these issues with me because you are not prepared or educated on the topic and I will run circles around you. I take great pleasure in humiliating know-it-all atheists.
You have not offered anything of substance. You keep saying "we can discuss____" who were all fallible MEN.
On top of that- you have offered no logical explanation for your magical stories or Christ's super powers.
You keep self bragging on "educated" but all I see is a superstitious greek who never got over the pagan inspired church of his. Quiz- find me "holy trinity" in the Bible. You can't- that's an invention of the Council of Nicea.
3. ordering rape victims to marry the rapist after he pays off the dad
4. and since we are talking belief...I must ask were/are you a virgin until you got married? If not...why shoudl I believe any Christian thing you say?
This video is very well done even though I disagree with it completely on grounds of proper hermeneutics. In any case, I will pray that you one day find your faith again. God bless you.
Your mind is not the only one that that thought crossed. Though I don't think we're in a good position to actually conclude anything about the professor's motives one way or the other.
I took about a year to lose my faith on or around the age of eight but then I lived a lifetime of guilt maybe I should have deconstructed my faith over many years then the blow may have been softer on my vulnerable but acutely logical baby mind. It is a shame that stuff like this was not available when I was growing up - I just had to choose to be logical and damned or deluded and saved. I made the difficult choice.
I feel awkward crying while hearing the "old man's" speech (er, typed speech xD). I liked how he presented to you that you can still have your religious life if you wished for it. As a Christian teen (almost out of high school Senior x_x;) this is really inspirational. I'm still questioning my faith though... JUST A FEW MORE VIDS TO GO!
@lormendi Why did you blocked me? What have I done?? Tell me!! Why? Hahaha. Anyway, I visited your channel, for the first time ever to repay the tens of visit from you, my channel views increased significantly from yesterday you see, thanks to you. And I am really sorry that your filthy posts are erased which I know will make your miserable life even more frustrating. Anytime you need somebody to release your anger to, please turn to me, I will always be there for you. Stay strong!
To say that you had a "weak faith" is preposterous. Some people just fail to see how open minded you are, willing to accept alternate points of view if true. If you had a "weak faith", you would have been an atheist by now in the series. Yet you kept looking for the truth without dismissing any possibility, even the possibility of God. Truly admirable.
@Garu279 Amen Garu! I am a christian, but am thoroughly enjoying this series and the open minded views of this man. I have had these very same conflicts myself and more and more am leading to his very same conclusion. I don't think I could ever give up on a belief in a higher being, our LORD GOD, but it is to what extent we allow ignorance over the truth to guide our lives. There is nothing wrong in believing just don't allow truth to be buried. of course Truth is truth
These videos are beautiful. I feel like I'm seeing how my own conversion happened. I was a Catholic once when at 22 years of age I took a course in Philosophy of Science and started questioning religion and started my own quest for truth, ultimately becoming an atheist.
Ah, the eternal search for knowledge. Isnt this the choice that got us here in the first place? well, that is if you believe in the Bible. whether you believe it or not i can assure you this...Knowledge is infinite and you will die ignorant. No matter how much knowledge you gain, it is nothing compared to the knowledge yet to be known. To think your smarter or on another level than those of faith is like comparing 1 grain of sand to 2. We all die ignorant. Few die with hope
@Evid3nc3 ''I am curious. Does that professor you communicated with via Amazon.com know how much of an impact he has had on you?'' -paultoronto42
Yeah. And is he still in contact with you? attending school in madrid 1960's means he was likely both 1940's latest, probably mid 1930's. Any chance you still communicate? He sounds like an incredibly intelligent and interesting man.
You are lucky to have found him; the universe is weird in that way.
I' m a little disappointing. I thought the argument Gerald Schroeder made was reasonable argument (if the science *actually* is accurate) and I was waiting to hear a reasonable rebuttal from the professor .. but instead the guy was just like I'm a baddass and you ... your just a kid and Schroeder can suck it... boom
I know the argument is to a certain extent a slight of hand argument but .. I think it seemed reasonable enough that it should be rebutted
This felt like a discussion between Morpheus and Neo. I really am enjoying these videos. Although I am not on a level equal with your intellect, I feel I came to much of the same conclusions you did.
As smart as this professor guy is, I found that last statement of his condescending. I consider myself agnostic on the existence of God, but I don't think his statement of "Those Christians are so much more stupid than people like you and me Chris. We are intellectually supeior". (Yes, I know those weren't his exact words but that's how I interpreted them). I know atheists TEND to be smarter, but that doesn't mean ALL of them are. My parents are Christian, but I consider them to be smart.
I have to agree with the Professor about differing levels of intellect. It’s not so much a measure of raw mental ability as it is the way a person uses their mind. You’re average person uses their minds to solve puzzles and accomplish practical goals. On another level a person is driven to gather truth with a capital “T”. One of the common elements in all the deconversion stories I’ve listened to is this desire to know what the truth is regardless of the consequences.
@ryanmshepard92- Yes, I know those weren't his exact words but that's how I interpreted them.
I think you have misinterpreted them, then. He was talking about themselves in relation to Chris' congregation, not "all theists/atheists". Chris described them as close-minded and generally uninterested in truth, science, and knowledge in general; whereas he and the professor are. Even so, the professor said “most of your church associates”. In which case, I think his assessment is fairly accurate.
Your correspondence sounded like a scene from the Matrix. "This is your last chance. After this, there is no turning back. You take the blue pill - the story ends, you wake up in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe. You take the red pill - you stay in Wonderland and I show you how deep the rabbit-hole goes."
Fascinating how much the internet has been an avenue in the search for your truth. Even being able to find books to order to read appears thanks to the internet. Makes sense that you are using this medium to reach out to others. I am old enough that I had no such avenue and was very isolated.
Enjoying your series. Hopefully others seeing your journey won't feel so alone in theirs.
I like how your process is all about reasoning and spirituality, not only condescending comments on science and/or degrading other people belief. I think that deconversion is really personal, just as yours, and the way you are exposing it is inspiring for those who already are on that road and might feel awkward by other YT!atheist's agressive approach . My own deconversion went fast from age 12 to 15 and without real questionning but I realize that I followed the same steps... Good work, man
I had the pleasure of meeting Dr. Schroeder in Israel in 2008 and saw him give a talk explaining his theory. It was intriguing, the math held up, and it definitely made me think. However, I'm still an atheist.
I am incredibly envious of the relationship you had with this professor. My own transition from a heavily faith centered family to an intellectually centered atheism was far less... facilitated, and paved with nihilism and apathy until my early college years.
You went through roughly the same thing as I did, only that it was my uncle which asked the question which made me do more research on Christianity and other religions for as well old mythologies such as Northern/Greek/Egyptian to name a few.
His question was simple: "How can you be so sure of what you are saying is right?"
This question confused me, as how could it not be true? Wasn't God a reality?
I liked how you use the background music on your videos! the music is beautiful and relaxing! may i know how to get a hold of the songs? at least give me the name of the album or tracks??
Wow. Thus far this series is probably the most honest and comprehensive look into the mentality of a very intelligent person who happened to had been of Christian faith. I commend you for putting this information out there for the world.
Christianity is good. I know in my heart the Christianity had good intentions. I just can't force myself to believe in something that I know is wrong, I want to believe, I want to believe that it is Truth, but truth is just what someones idea of truth is. Christians believe that God is truth, that is their truth. I won't believe in something I cant understand or ever hope to understand. I hope that all of us can learn the one truth that really matters.
fuck i almost cried. i got that old feeling back when i was 14 or so praying in the local mosque, back when i used to believe. the sort of feeling you got when you felt like god talked to you and understood you. it felt as though i have been revealed important truths about the universe. but mehh it's probably just the bg music and your NLP therapist voice. but man i think you are going to deconvert a hell lot of people. good luck and "god" bless.
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
more professors and other books... and the "I don't want you to be brought down" comment by the professor.. I said that to my fiance'(now wife) about 3 years ago too, when I was an atheist and consistently pursuing "truth."
I'm just going to skip to it, since you like logic/science/mathematics/truth... questions will suffice.
1) How do you learn about the world around you and come to know truth?
2) Do you employ circular reasoning in this also?
You haven't said anything with substance here. Your modus operandi seems to be making condescending remarks about how "weak my faith was" and how much I "depended on professors and books". Yet, you give no objective measure by which we can judge how strong a person's faith is and no convincing justification for why reading books is bad. You are full of hot air and full of yourself. Present some substantive, topical counter-arguments or go condescend to someone else.
You wish to have proper responses--and I give them to you, according to the Bible. Not according to myself.
I am, answer the questions and you will see the point I'm making with this. As I said in the other video, evidence is not what matters--because "A" is backed up by "B" and "C", "C" by "D,""F,""G<"---you get the point. You end up trusting so many back-sources by faith that you have no idea if the original information has been skewed in the evidence you're seeing now.
@droptozro You seem to be directly implying that there is circular reasoning present in this video. As I understand it, circular reasoning is when the conclusion of an argument is included in one or more of the premises that are used to argue for the same conclusion. Could you please point out to me the argument here which is circular, specifically: the conclusion of the argument and the circular premise that is used to support it?
It's not in the video, I'm just not seeing grounds for his legitimacy because his faith was so quickly hacked away by a lack of knowledge in the Scriptures it seems--so I began asking questions to get to the heart of his beliefs, the presuppositions that every person holds within a worldview.
@droptozro Give God a chance to speak to you, and really reveal Himself to you, and answer your questions about Him, life's true purpose, why sufferings, ...does He have Laws? Has He spoken to humanity? Throguh who (the Messiah?) Have we transgressed His Laws bringing curses and sufferings upon us, and upon God's Creation? Cry out to the God who created you (and all things), let Him be your teacher,..then come judgement day, you can say to Him, I asked You to show me the true way in your defence
@droptozro God does NOT reveal Himself to (nor answer their questions) to those who don't "choose" to really seriously want to know Him... its a "free-will choice" we ALL have to make... do I want to know the God who created me, or not ?...what if He has Laws I've transgressed? He only asks us to CHOOSE to really want to know Him, and let Him convict, teach, and change us as He shepherds and leads us through life,... all christians can do is tell you what God revealed to them when they ASKED
@droptozro Give God a chance to speak to you, and really reveal Himself to you, and answer your questions about Him, life's true purpose, why sufferings, ..does He have Laws? Has He spoken to humanity? Through who (the Messiah?) Have we transgressed His Laws bringing curses and sufferings upon us, and upon God's Creation? Cry out to the God who created you (and all things), let Him be your teacher,..then come judgement day, you can say to Him, I asked You to show me the true way in your defence
@droptozro God does NOT reveal Himself to (nor answer their questions) to those who don't "choose" to really seriously want to know Him... its a "free-will choice" we ALL have to make... do I want to know the God who created me, or not ?...what if He has Laws I've transgressed? He only asks us to CHOOSE to really want to know Him, and let Him convict, teach, and change us as He shepherds and leads us through life,... all christians can do is tell you what God revealed to them when they ASKED
@SpoiledDeryn The fallen angels and satan are extremely kind at first when trying to deceive us into rejecting the True version of God (Jesus) for the false versions of God, and right-relationship with Him, ...a Holy God who loves humanity, hates the lies and sin that sickens, and destroys humanity and all His creations He loves so deeply...who just wants humans to choose to want to know Him, and to let Him change their hearts daily to prepare them for life in His Holy Eternal Kingdom forever
"If I find the truth, I take it—bitter or not." That's reminiscent of a quote from Thomas Henry Huxley: "Sit down before fact as a little child, be prepared to give up every preconceived notion, follow humbly wherever and to whatever abysses nature leads, or you shall learn nothing."
KaineSpawnX 5 days ago
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to put my impression of this video eloquently: HOLY SHIT. I love your vid, and what you discuss in it.
daosmoke 6 days ago in playlist Why I am no longer a Christian
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daosmoke 6 days ago in playlist Why I am no longer a Christian
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Science and religion are incompatible for deeper reasons than timelines. Science shows that the very concept of consciousness is something that only applies to biological organisms. There can't be a supernatural being with a mind because there can't be a mind without a brain. You can't separate [thoughts & feelings] from [living creatures]. Living creature define thoughts and feelings. God can only be a construct of the imagination.
TheWhiteStripes3 1 week ago
Lols it's funny how only smart people snap out of that religion bullshit xD.
MordieSG 1 week ago in playlist More videos from Evid3nc3 2
halaious
onotix 1 week ago in playlist Why I am no longer a Christian
I found some Christians, who I thought were dunces, have acquired a strong spiritual knowledge and understanding of God through spiritual experience (possible in any religion). Knowledge and spirituality seem to appear as opposites because knowledge lessens one ability to rely on faith (vs self), and one can depend on spiritual experience to the extent that they do illogical things that not even the Bible would agree to.
Hibitrit 2 weeks ago in playlist Why I am no longer a Christian
So when it comes to the portions of the Bible consisting of miraculous things, or parts not making sense due to culture, time gaps, the change in translations, context, and pure age! A person who can't believe in something until every detail made sense, would struggle with this. Yet a person who can base everything on faith, that would be easy because they know what God is capable of. But they may lack knowledge and struggle with understanding even the simple concepts
Hibitrit 2 weeks ago in playlist Why I am no longer a Christian
Well the guy was right about the religious debate being bad for your studies, I'm ment to be revising for the 4 exams I have this week but would rather watch this
mancno1 2 weeks ago
i always forget that the tower of babel is a just so story about why people in other parts of the world speak different languages.
like the stories of how the leopard got his spots, or how the elephant got his trunk,
kelbykross1 3 weeks ago
These videos are an epic poem and I'm enjoying them.
MrJivePirate 3 weeks ago
if you use that libera song in the next video I wont be able to listen. its driving me nuts!
newgeorge 3 weeks ago in playlist More videos from Evid3nc3
7.09 or thereabouts . . . .deluded automatons? thats letting the cat out of the bag!
newgeorge 3 weeks ago in playlist More videos from Evid3nc3
Only 48 dislikes? I guess all those religious fanatics do not have much computers.
upisoft2 1 month ago
The part where the professor is trying to warn you away from all this reminded me of the scenes from that Dewey Cox movie where he keeps walking in on the guy doing drugs and the guy keeps saying 'Get out of here Dewey, you don't want none of this!'
IMelkor42 1 month ago
I follow a very similar path on my way to atheism. Although, I met no one on the same intellectual level as me who was an atheist and helped exposed the various fallacies of the church. I'm similar in that as I studied God more, it led me closer to atheism. The further I investigated, the more illogical religion seemed. Yet it wasn't until the vary end did I stop believing. I wonder how many atheist became that way through slow and deliberate thought.
onslaught147 1 month ago
2:25 "If I find the truth, I take it, bitter or not."
This is the difference between rationality and fundamentalism. I doubt either of us would be Atheists today if we only believed what stroked our own egos.
TheBiAtheist 2 months ago in playlist Why I am no longer a Christian 24
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Then you will be handed over to be persecuted and put to death, and you will be hated by all nations because of me. At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people (Mat. 24:9-11).
PRAISE BE TO GOD THE GREAT PROPHECY OF APOSTACY IS HERE THIS MEANS THE HOUR IS NEAR
jesusyarrup 3 months ago
God bless you Chris and other "former" Christians, as you are doing this documentary, i hope you realize that this world is not about what you do, or how you live. Life is useless if only for entertainment like you propose. We have no purpose in this world and you might as well think that there is no God. But you are not being rational. Look outside. Could a jug of milk in any way do that? Science screams God's name. Stop blinding yourself and thinking that blind means you can see everything.
13identity 3 months ago in playlist Why I am no longer a Christian
@13identity
"This worlds is not about what you do, or how you live"
That is one of the most false statements I have heard, your actions make up everything, and this can be easily demonstrated by anyone anywhere. We have demonstrated through science that everything is atomically connected, and that negative, and positive make up the balance of the entire universe. He is not proposing life is for entertainment, its about creation, beauty, learning, loving.
NeutralExistence 1 month ago
... follow the path of those who leave?
faro0485 4 months ago
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... propping up the ego I see... /watch?v=luDOXkynZz8
faro0485 4 months ago
Are we the same person? O.o
I love the series so far. It's like watching a documentary of what went on in my head.
StevenCasteel 5 months ago in playlist Why I am no longer a Christian
@StevenCasteel Tsk tsk tsk... /watch?v=DDyDtYy2I0M
faro0485 4 months ago
Tower of babel is impossible... maybe i'm confused on this. As last I checked, under current science, even today, we aren't sure what the pyramids are for, nor how they were built. There are areas of this work with 200 ton bricks, with holes drilled in stone, far beyond anything we can do today. So does that mean that the pyramids must not exist as it is impossible for us to build them today? Had they been destroyed, would he claim they never existed as well?
bluefootedpig 5 months ago
@bluefootedpig You'd be surprised what generations of countless slaves can accomplish.
RejechtedGaming 5 months ago
@RejechtedGaming Except that like in the pyramids, they are dated to have taken only 20 years. So unless you only lived for 5 years at a time, the pyramids were built in only one generation.
bluefootedpig 5 months ago
I forgot just how much of a douchebag this professor sounds
introducing himself with his qualifications on an anonymous website?
saying he's on a higher intellectual plane than most people?
not caring about the truth, and thinking culture > physics?
I wanna slap that guy so hard ._.
unassumption 5 months ago
@unassumption they emailed each other, he may just decided not to give any information, and he did not say culture>physhics he said that a physician speaking about a cultural phenomenon was as out of place as say a cook speaking about a geology.
don't slap people you are better than that Salvor Hardin said it "ignorance is the last resource of the ignorant."
:)
cichriz 4 months ago in playlist Why I am no longer a Christian
@unassumption Oh, is that what he said? And, is that how he said it? We must have been listening to different presentations, for if we were, WERE did you find what you to believe are points?
Milpower 2 months ago in playlist More videos from Evid3nc3
I think one of the reasons the professor's statements were so effective on Chris was that he showed Christianity the same respect that Chris is showing it now in these videos. Proof that you don't have to be condescending to make your point. Take note, atheists.
NuttyMongrel 5 months ago
@NuttyMongrel Perhaps, but most Christians aren't like Chris. I don't think Atheists have problems debating / arguing with people as rational as he, it's much easier to be civil. Note how the original review the professor wrote sounded a bit more scathing, but once sent an email by Chris he (probably) changed his tone.
cordlc 3 months ago
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TheBiAtheist 6 months ago in playlist Why I am no longer a Christian 35
That guy had some INSANE reverse phycology!!! "if you keep looking, you'll find atheism, so dont look for the truth" ^^
Yahweigh 6 months ago
@Yahweigh Really? Reverse Psychology?
CarthageDude13 6 months ago
@CarthageDude13 Yes, in implying that he would probably become an atheist if he found the truth, it puts that huge curiosity there, then in saying "dont look for the truth cuz u might not handle it well" it creates a stronger urge to witness such powerful information.
Yahweigh 6 months ago 2
I am a medical doctor and a former christian. Your videos were so brilliantly done with very clear step wise structure and very logical.
Your experience really reminded me of my past struggles.
yiuvince 8 months ago 46
@yiuvince - Agreed. Very good step through and appeals those who want to or have done analysis on the subject. I similarly went through this type of conversion - although in my case it took years.
CaptainGreen2008 2 months ago
An incredible story. Thank you.
TylerOmega 8 months ago in playlist Why I am no longer a Christian 2
This is so honest and powerful that I am weeping as I type. I came here on Douglas Adams' birthday to feel a certain kinship with my fellow non-believers. I am getting far more than I bargained for.
Thank you so very much.
nsofast 8 months ago 2
The foundation that allowed you to become an atheist seem to be your strong and genuine belief in god. This allowed you to dig deeper and deeper without having the fear of being wrong. You were confident that nomatter how much you researched, your understanding of god would only become stronger. You were not afraid.
Does this mean that the average not-that-serious christian is less likely to convert than one dedicating their life to it? Would be interesting to know.
TheLivirus 8 months ago
@TheLivirus Correction:
Not "convert"... what's the word I'm looking for? Devert? Deconvert? Revert?
English is not my native language.
TheLivirus 8 months ago
The fact that the unbelieving professor seemed to "outclass" the seeker in no way refuted Schroeder. The appeal to the moral authority of thinking people who relegated Christianity to myth did not refute Schroeder's mathematical propositions, and it affords no predicate whatsoever to the relegation of Christian people to the status of deluded automatons, mental children, or inferior intellectual honesty. Nothing you say in this section refutes or even addresses, Schroeder.
jsgehrke 8 months ago
This was beautiful.
miketwo345 8 months ago
This is amazing.... everything mentioned so far seems so right. i like the responses of the professor.
Dlxxx159 8 months ago
I somehow knew you were a Kansan. Not sure how, maybe it was how you speak.
Do you still live in Kansas? I must tell you, it's very nice to know I'm not the only Atheist here...
apopheniacMCMLXXXIX 8 months ago
@Evid3nc3
I like this video series for it's sincerity and what I suspect is it's impact, but I find your views of other atheists difficult at times. I completed much of the journey you describe by the age of 7 and recognized that I didn't believe in a god, whilst attending Christian faith schools. I have been where you are now for more than 30 years whilst still following philosophy, science, history etc. I no less grasp the mind of a Christian but am still exasperated by them. Why is this bad?
TheGodlessGuitarist 8 months ago
Dr. Schroeder is not an apologist. He is a world class physicist.
AegeanKing 8 months ago
Yup...other Christians are usually a good way to gauge the belief system. Ever notice how many are bigoted or homophobic? I remember when i was new in church in the early 90s, invited over to a youth event. I mentioned I voted for Clinton, and people were like "how could you vote for him? He's trying to legalize gays in the military!"
Then look at their history- no group fought harder AGAINST interracial marriage. All for their invisible silent magical Jesus.
hipstermi 9 months ago
hi quality video, much appreciated!
theclewis 9 months ago
The tower of Babel?? Really? Friend, you should take a BASIC hermeneutics class on Old Testament theology. The tower of Babel is OBVIOUSLY allegory and has been labeled as such going all the way back. Go and read the writings of famous Rabbis from the middle ages like Mamionides or Nahmanides. I thought I was going to see some groundbreaking arguments on this video and instead all I see is amateurish drivel from somebody who hasn't the slightest clue on proper biblical interpretation. FAIL.
AegeanKing 9 months ago
@AegeanKing
"Friend, you should take a BASIC hermeneutics class on Old Testament theology. The tower of Babel is OBVIOUSLY allegory and has been labeled as such going all the way back"
I've seen this new Christian trick- it's "allegory" now. We were taught for centuries this book was "the absolute word of God" and it was all true. NOTHING in the passage indicates "allegory" & it's just you making an excuse.
How's about Jesus' magical powers like levitation & matter transmutation? allegory?
hipstermi 9 months ago
@hipstermi You to should also take a basic hermeneutics class since you make the same mistake as the person who made the video. It is both the word of God and allegory. The two are not mutually exclusive. Allegory is meant to teach great truths. Go and read the writings of Saint Augustine from the fourth century where he makes perfectly CLEAR that stories like Johna and the tower of Babel are OBVIOUSLY allegory. (continued)
AegeanKing 9 months ago
@AegeanKing
"You to should also take a basic hermeneutics class since you make the same mistake as the person who made the video"
You keep acting like an "expert" and oh so educated...but you really use this as a way to not answer questions including common sense. No, flying, changing water to wine, and sea partings are no possible...and if they were I'd love to see any Christian do it.
hipstermi 8 months ago
@AegeanKing
"Go and read the writings of Saint Augustine from the fourth century"
You need to stop talking down like you "teaching" me anything. I am familiar with his works.
Second, there are plenty of other 4th century christians who did not say "allegory".
You sinned with a false accusation (actualy LIED) that I knew nothing of Catholic or Orthodox. When I was in the Orthodox church, "allegory" was not taught...the Bible was "the word of god" and all the magical stories were TRUE.
hipstermi 8 months ago
@hipstermi I am acting like an expert because I am. First, I am an Orthodox Christian. Second, I have my M.Div from Holy Cross in Boston. Third, I am in my last year of my Ph.D in Orthodox Theology at the University of Geneva in Switzerland. So, if you would like to discuss or debate me on the Cannons, Councils or Church fathers and their instruction on proper biblical interpretation I will be happy to. Also, I didnt lie when I said you know nothing about Orthodoxy. Its obvious you dont.
AegeanKing 8 months ago
@AegeanKing
"First, I am an Orthodox Christian"
unimpressive. So was I for 20 years.
"M.Div from Holy Cross in Boston"
Wow...the study of magic. Again unimpressive.
"like to discuss or debate me on the Cannons, Councils or Church "
Again- prove any validity or history to the bible. or magical powers.
Given your studies you must be able to point to a Hebrew or Roman law proving the "vote Barabus free" story?
hipstermi 8 months ago
@hipstermi Check your mail. Btw, i refuse to believe you were ever an orthodox christian. You know almost nothing about orthodoxy. If a Biologist said that the theory of evolution means babies come from storks would you believe he was a biologist?? probably not. Just like you claiming to be an orthodox christian and not knowing the first thing about Orthodoxy leads me to believe that you were never an orthodox Christian. Maybe you were born into the faith but that does not make you one.
AegeanKing 8 months ago
@AegeanKing
" refuse to believe you were ever an orthodox christian. You know almost nothing about orthodoxy"
YOur Christian lying again about me. That's a "sin" so repent to magical Jesus. You can't even live your own belief.
You being led by bishops who are old men who choose to be >snicker< CELIBATE is laughable and pathetic. Funny how that requirement is not Biblical. Paul makes one "sort of" reference and you guys want to make men live like freaks.
hipstermi 8 months ago
@hipstermi You are not capable of thoughtful debate. I have already proved that you know nothing about orthodoxy even though you claim to have "studied". You asking me for proof for a localized event that happened 2,000 years ago. There are plenty of extra biblical sources that mention Christ like the Talmud, Josephus, Pliny the younger, lucian of samosata etc. You are nothing but a belligerent troll who doesn't know shit from shinola about Christianity, the bible or orthodox doctrine.
AegeanKing 8 months ago
@AegeanKing
"Talmud"
LOL! Jews disagree with you on that one! Not everyone accepts Herford's take.
Plus...you are telling me this older book tells of a messiah...you think your later book "proves" he's the Messiah because...the later book says so.
So if I write a book with a character and I write it to coincide with say Navajo prophesy... according to your circular logic that makes it "true" because my book says so?
"Josephus, Pliny the younger"
Not alive during Jesus time.
(cont)
hipstermi 8 months ago
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@AegeanKing
PLINY THE YOUNGER- He wrote about ChristIANS not encountering Christ. That doesn't prove "Christ". You or I can meet or even write about Voodoo worshipers, and that doesn't "prove" Bondyè or any Loa.
there are non Koran writings of Mohamed. That doesn't "prove" Islam true to me (or you).
"lucian of samosata"
A guy who lived 100 years or so AFTER THE FACT & wrote about Jesus "proves" what?
hipstermi 8 months ago
@hipstermi my point to you was that its impossible to prove that these people existed beyond a shadow of a doubt. simply because they lived so long ago. instead of engaging in meaningful discourse you insist on throwing around terms like "magical Jesus". This is obviously the consequences of a piss poor education system in America. You Americans are fat, lazy, obnoxious and completely incapable of having a rationale discussion on the ORIGINAL topic which was biblical hermeneutics.
AegeanKing 8 months ago
@AegeanKing
"my point to you was that its impossible to prove that these people existed beyond a shadow of a doubt"
Not really. The Shakespear notations I gave are conclusive. AND if you disproved Shakespear existed, I would stil ask you to prove Jesus and his magical feats happened. Cause come on- levitation over water is just not possible. Then again...Peter did it so why can't YOU?
hipstermi 8 months ago
@AegeanKing
""magical Jesus". This is obviously the consequences of a piss poor education system in America. You Americans are fat, lazy, obnoxious and completely incapable of having a rationale discussion on the ORIGINAL topic which was biblical hermeneutics. "
NAME CALLING is not very "Christ like"
Greece has it's fair share of fat asses to.
C. In 05, I was disgusted how your young men were drunk and at date rape capacity to American women.
hipstermi 8 months ago
@AegeanKing
If you want want to knock American education, you should look at your lottery style college admittance that DON'T educate your own country.
and yes i think our k-12 education needs improvement.
You guys seem to trail us.
the OECD ranked the US as "average" (to which I cringe) and Greece? well...Greece is BELOW us.
Making Greece BELOW AVERAGE.
Google "OECD Education Rankings – 2010 Chart A1.2 Population that has achieved at least upper secondary education(2008)"
hipstermi 8 months ago
@hipstermi judging from your page its obvious that you are a troll who likes to provoke people on different videos. You are truly pathetic. Its also obvious from your page that you are a sodomite and therefore it is no wonder that you have a problem with Christianity. Having to face the truth makes you feel like a pervert and so you dismiss it. You are truly pathetic....please dont go around claiming to be Greek. You give real Greeks a bad name.
AegeanKing 8 months ago
@AegeanKing
"judging from your page its obvious that you are a troll"
Not very "Christ like" to JUDGE people and call names. You are a hypocrite to your beliefs.
"You are truly pathetic"
your Christian anger is unChristlike
"also obvious from your page that you are a sodomite and"
BEARING FALSE WITNESS! I'm a stright male married to a woman. You LIED again.
"Having to face the truth makes you feel like a pervert"
LIE again
hipstermi 8 months ago
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@AegeanKing
"You are truly pathetic...."
You call yourself a "king"...so your ego knows no bounds.
"please dont go around claiming to be Greek. You give real Greeks a bad name. "
Your Bible talks about not being judgmental. how are we going to take you seriously as a Christian when you can't follow your own rules?
It's also sad you think I have to agree with your silly religion to be a "true Greek".
That's more weak willed conformity on your part.
hipstermi 8 months ago
@AegeanKing
"please dont go around claiming to be Greek. You give real Greeks a bad name. "
Orthodox does not equal "real Greek" and there are plenty of Greeks who believe the same as I do.
You bore false witness when you said I was a "sodomite". I'm married to a woman, how about you?
Gay rights is an issue I support. it's discussed a lot now here. If YOU spoke on behalf of black people, it doesn't make you black.
I have corrected your beating of false witness. don't lie anymore.
hipstermi 8 months ago
@hipstermi You dont even speak Greek and you know nothing about Greece. I am sure like other so-called Greek americans all you know about is ancient Greece. You say I bear false witness but thats what you say. i say that you are a sodomite.
AegeanKing 8 months ago
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@AegeanKing
"I am sure like other so-called Greek americans all you know about is ancient Greece."
Last time I was there was '05. Have been to America? Or any non Euro country?
"You say I bear false witness but thats what you say. i say that you are a sodomite."
Me- man married to a woman.
You- don't know me. You bore false witness. I corrected you. You repeated claim. You knowingly LIED.
That's a "sin" to Christians.
hipstermi 8 months ago
@AegeanKing
"You dont even speak Greek and you know nothing about Greece"
We are not "speaking" dumbass...this is writing. On an American's video ... spoken in ... get this...English!
I also speak some Spanish...I wouldn't post in English on a video posted by a guy in Mexico with Mexican replys.
hipstermi 8 months ago
@AegeanKing
"You say I bear false witness but thats what you say. i say that you are a sodomite."
If I was gay, I would say so...since rational people know it's no big deal.
Like your religion, you have no proof to your accusations. You know nothing about me, or even my name.
Ergo- you lied!
Making up things means it's true? So if I wrote you ass rape little boys and girls...that makes it true?
hipstermi 8 months ago
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@AegeanKing
"You dont even speak Greek and you know nothing about Greece. I am sure like other so-called Greek americans all you know about is ancient Greece"
This is typical of Christians- unable to prove supernatural beliefs, they have to resort to childish insults. Nothing you said addressed anything in this video or my questions on proof to your magical stories. No rational answers or ability on your part to reason.
hipstermi 8 months ago
@AegeanKing
On top of that... all your angry insults have NOTHING to do with the topic- no proof to your beliefs or your stories with supernatural powers. No historical evidence- EVERY person you cited wrote decades or centuries after Jesus.
Your reply to that is "you're not Greek enough" & "you're gay"
Especially the last part, that's something a teenager would say.
AND it didn't address the point- you have provided NO proof or even a rational argument.
What a weak "Christ"ian you are.
hipstermi 8 months ago
@AegeanKing
"Just like you claiming to be an orthodox christian and not knowing the first thing about Orthodoxy leads me to believe that you were never an orthodox Christian"
This is the typical Christian trick- lie.
When someone disagrees, you guys ALWAYS say "you don't know..." I KNOW your teachings. I don't agree with them. Many Christians know evolution and don't agree with that.
It is possible for 2 guys to go to the same church & get the same lessons/brainwashing & believe different.
hipstermi 8 months ago
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@AegeanKing
So instead of your Christian anger, insults and cussing and lies about me...
why didnt you present ANY historic proof of Jesus? or proof to supernatural feats? You gave names of guys who wrote after the fact...one who didnt write about Christ but of Christians.
Fact is...you didnt really address one question posed to you.
That's some weak faith you have there.
hipstermi 8 months ago
@hipstermi Prove Genghis Khan or Alexander the great existed. Prove that Shakespeare or Plato or Aristotle existed. Prove that when you read "the republic" by Plato that you are actually reading his works and not the works of a later scribe centuries later. Prove that the crusades happened or that Christopher Columbus existed and came to America.
AegeanKing 8 months ago
@AegeanKing
"Prove Genghis Khan or Alexander the great existed"
Instead of directly answering questions, your whole strategy seems to be about "you prove something different". Why is it you try the turn around answers and not directly answering about magical Jesus?
hipstermi 8 months ago
@AegeanKing
"Prove Genghis Khan or Alexander the great existed. Prove that Shakespeare or Plato or Aristotle existed"
you are acting childisn and just repeating the same questions I posed to you about proving Jesus. Not only that, but we don't have SUPERNATURAL accounts of the men you listed.
Records in their life time, not "after the fact" like your bible.
Shakespear- birth, baptism, marriage & death record.
Now back to the original point- what have you got on Jesus &magical powers?
hipstermi 8 months ago
@AegeanKing
"Also, I didnt lie when I said you know nothing about Orthodoxy. Its obvious you dont"
yes you are christian lying. I told you my background and my personal studies. You don't know anything about me, so you make up stuff.
I get why you are so defensive. You've devoted much time and study to this magical belief system of yours. You seems to have a tough time admitting you are wrong.
It is interesting...you do seem to point to Orthodox dogma more than the actual Bible.
hipstermi 8 months ago
@AegeanKing
If you want to pretend the magical feats of the OT are "allegory" that's fine. Many rational people also have issues with the sick laws in the OT.
Killing gays? Disobedient children? Even the excuse "taht was Old Testament" doesnt cover the fact you guys seem to get off on such a being that would kill people for any reason.
Oh yeah...there's no historical proof of magical Jesus. Of all we know of Roman and Hebew law there's no proof a criminal like Barabus would be VOTED free.
hipstermi 8 months ago
@hipstermi I can name literally DOZENS of famous Christian theologians from the first couple centuries of Christianity that AFFIRMED the allegorical nature of many of these stories. A Christian who takes these stories as literal is also in need of a BASIC class in hermeneutics. In fact, if you go all the back to the Babylonian Talmud which predates Jesus, you will see that the book of genesis is described in the original hebrew as a great poem. Anyway, you should educate yourself.
AegeanKing 9 months ago
@AegeanKing
@AegeanKing
I'm educated just fine, and probably a lot more than you are.
On top of that...you still didn't answer my question. Jesus' magical powers- were they "allegory" as well? Raising dead, mater transutation, levitation and flying, coming back from the dead, casting out >snicker< DEMONS. You know...the bullshit impossible feats Christians say Jesus did?
The fact Christians believe in devils and demons is rather childish.
hipstermi 8 months ago
@AegeanKing
You also avoided a key point- you can say "allegory" but the majority of Christians don't feel that way nor teach that.
On top of that...if you want to toss out the magical talking snake as "allegory" ... what else? Moses's magical sea parting? Moses existing? Jesus' magical powers? Jesus existing? Paul's stories? Kind David's tales?
Unless by allegory you mean made up symbolic fictional stories...then we agree.
hipstermi 8 months ago
@hipstermi First, yes, the powers and feats of Christ were real. Secondly, you are presumably American and therefore have a limited view of the Christian world. Evangelicals are in fact the MINORITY in the Christian worlds next to Catholics and Eastern Orthodox. So no, you accusation that the majority of Christians feel that way is false. You say that these feats were impossible why? how can you possibly know that?
AegeanKing 8 months ago
@AegeanKing
"the powers and feats of Christ were real"
so you believe in...magic. With no proof whatsoever.
"presumably American and therefore have a limited view of the Christian world"
Making outrageous accusations don't make them true.
"Evangelicals are in fact the MINORITY in the Christian worlds next to Catholics and Eastern Orthodox"
I was raised Greek Orthodox as well in a Catholic town and attended more charasmatic churches later in life. Orthodox is just as silly/ magical
hipstermi 8 months ago
@AegeanKing
"You say that these feats were impossible why? how can you possibly know that?"
Common sense. For one none of the Christians can duplicate them. And don't give me the "medical" miracles like your headache or a guy told you cancer was cured. No documentation of you guys curing the blind. Or hey...what about levitation? Jesus and Peter both levitated on water.
So why do you think they ARE real outside being told what to think...and how can you possibly know those accounts are real?
hipstermi 8 months ago
@hipstermi Do you have any idea how many modern day medical miracles happen that science can not even hope to explain? Lastly, you are obviously not educated on Christian theology because you keep making one fallacious argument after another. its actually quite pathetic....
AegeanKing 8 months ago
@AegeanKing
Oh and Aegean? Yes I am Greek, was Orthodox and have been to Greece and other parts of Europe multiple times.
You should also realize...even with your "allegory" of the Bible, there is no commands in the Bible for the Greek Orthodox Mary worship or praying to Saints. If YOU read history you would know how Christianity abosorbed Pagan practices... and now you have your seconday and demi gods again.
Have fun kissing magical icons i guess.
hipstermi 8 months ago
@hipstermi There is nothing magical about icons. This is exactly what I am talking about. It is embarrassing how little you know about Orthodoxy. We should have our discussion in Greek since you claim to be one. But, as with other so called "Greeks" in America you probably dont even speak Greek. You are so ignorant and uneducated that you cannot grasp the spiritual depth of orthodoxy which is why it seems like magic to you. People hate what they dont understand.
AegeanKing 8 months ago
@AegeanKing
"There is nothing magical about icons. This is exactly what I am talking about. It is embarrassing how little you know about Orthodoxy"
You're doing it again- you lying (sin). I was in the Orthodox church for 20 years. I was an alter boy. When I considered leaving I spent a considerable amount of times reading in the library early church history.
Let's not debate icons- PROVE YOUR BIBLE.
Prove the events/ people happened. prove Jesus' magical powers
hipstermi 8 months ago
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@hipstermi I am not lying . you are very ignorant. You obviously did not read early church history because if you did you would not say something as stupid as "the trinity was invented at Nicaea". That is a complete amateur mistake. There is nothing magical about icons. Go and pick up an Orthodox catechism. Icons are there to convey theological messages and truths. They are also there to give us a visual reference since sight is important to how we feel.
AegeanKing 8 months ago
@hipstermi Lets talk about Saint John of Damascus, the most important Orthodox theologian, and his instruction on biblical interpretation and lets dissect his liturgy so I can educate you on the simple fact that Orthodoxy more than any other version of Christianity puts the most emphasis on allegory.
AegeanKing 8 months ago
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@AegeanKing
"Lets talk about Saint John of Damascus, the most important Orthodox theologian,"
Again- you're not "teaching" me anything.
Yeah...I remember that. The Greek church does places these "theologians" equal if not more important than the Bible. And you bring up one of the chief pro ICON guys?
also- a guy born 600 some years after the fact of Christ? Not exactly the most convincing argument your magical religion is true
hipstermi 8 months ago
@hipstermi We can talk about Saint John Chrysostom, another major orthodox theologian, and his instruction on proper biblical interpreation. Lets dissect Orthodox hymnology so we can examine the allegorical nature of the major biblical stories. Are you up for it? somehow I doubt it. Let me give you some advice. Do not discuss these issues with me because you are not prepared or educated on the topic and I will run circles around you. I take great pleasure in humiliating know-it-all atheists.
AegeanKing 8 months ago
@AegeanKing
You have not offered anything of substance. You keep saying "we can discuss____" who were all fallible MEN.
On top of that- you have offered no logical explanation for your magical stories or Christ's super powers.
You keep self bragging on "educated" but all I see is a superstitious greek who never got over the pagan inspired church of his. Quiz- find me "holy trinity" in the Bible. You can't- that's an invention of the Council of Nicea.
hows about your pagan Mary worship?
hipstermi 8 months ago
@AegeanKing
Oh...and just for fun...
give me a rational explanation for:
1. Orthodox anti gay policy
2. killing gays in the old testament
3. ordering rape victims to marry the rapist after he pays off the dad
4. and since we are talking belief...I must ask were/are you a virgin until you got married? If not...why shoudl I believe any Christian thing you say?
hipstermi 8 months ago
This video is very well done even though I disagree with it completely on grounds of proper hermeneutics. In any case, I will pray that you one day find your faith again. God bless you.
AegeanKing 9 months ago
Am I the only one that thinks the professor was using reverse psychology?
Roenazarrek 9 months ago
@Roenazarrek
Your mind is not the only one that that thought crossed. Though I don't think we're in a good position to actually conclude anything about the professor's motives one way or the other.
IamBHM 9 months ago
Schroeder book is crappy.
alive4ever1 9 months ago
Thanks, now i know where Quagmire comes from...a distorted "piece" of mind...gigiri gigiri!!
xniquilador 9 months ago
I took about a year to lose my faith on or around the age of eight but then I lived a lifetime of guilt maybe I should have deconstructed my faith over many years then the blow may have been softer on my vulnerable but acutely logical baby mind. It is a shame that stuff like this was not available when I was growing up - I just had to choose to be logical and damned or deluded and saved. I made the difficult choice.
vohshkab 9 months ago
What does reverse terminology mean?
KenM66 10 months ago
Wow, what you said about "Feeling like you're in a different rational 'room' than everyone else in your church" is exactly how I felt.
Wrathmont313 10 months ago 3
Holy shit man you went to KU?? no way
pythor2 10 months ago
I feel awkward crying while hearing the "old man's" speech (er, typed speech xD). I liked how he presented to you that you can still have your religious life if you wished for it. As a Christian teen (almost out of high school Senior x_x;) this is really inspirational. I'm still questioning my faith though... JUST A FEW MORE VIDS TO GO!
kmelfina 10 months ago 2
The older guy he was talking to is a Jedi master......brilliant.
lormendi 10 months ago 2
@lormendi Why did you blocked me? What have I done?? Tell me!! Why? Hahaha. Anyway, I visited your channel, for the first time ever to repay the tens of visit from you, my channel views increased significantly from yesterday you see, thanks to you. And I am really sorry that your filthy posts are erased which I know will make your miserable life even more frustrating. Anytime you need somebody to release your anger to, please turn to me, I will always be there for you. Stay strong!
walkingphilosopher 10 months ago
Church associates as deluded. Perfectly on the money. All religious people are morons and deluded for sure :)
srikargottipati 10 months ago
To say that you had a "weak faith" is preposterous. Some people just fail to see how open minded you are, willing to accept alternate points of view if true. If you had a "weak faith", you would have been an atheist by now in the series. Yet you kept looking for the truth without dismissing any possibility, even the possibility of God. Truly admirable.
Garu279 10 months ago 39
@Garu279 Amen Garu! I am a christian, but am thoroughly enjoying this series and the open minded views of this man. I have had these very same conflicts myself and more and more am leading to his very same conclusion. I don't think I could ever give up on a belief in a higher being, our LORD GOD, but it is to what extent we allow ignorance over the truth to guide our lives. There is nothing wrong in believing just don't allow truth to be buried. of course Truth is truth
HardcoreEnigma 7 months ago 2
@Garu279 Christians commenting on this video think that this guy wasn't a true christian, only "weak faith"?
These people are extremely desperate to win in that case.
AtheismIsCorrect 3 months ago
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@AtheismIsCorrect i am a christian and i believe he was a true christian.
the bible says (yes i know u dont believe in it) that many will rebell and reject christianity this is what is happening .
2 Thessalonians 2:3 Don’t let anyone deceive you in any way. That day won’t come unless the rebellion (apostacy) comes first .......
jesusyarrup 3 months ago
These videos are beautiful. I feel like I'm seeing how my own conversion happened. I was a Catholic once when at 22 years of age I took a course in Philosophy of Science and started questioning religion and started my own quest for truth, ultimately becoming an atheist.
Garu279 10 months ago 5
Ah, the eternal search for knowledge. Isnt this the choice that got us here in the first place? well, that is if you believe in the Bible. whether you believe it or not i can assure you this...Knowledge is infinite and you will die ignorant. No matter how much knowledge you gain, it is nothing compared to the knowledge yet to be known. To think your smarter or on another level than those of faith is like comparing 1 grain of sand to 2. We all die ignorant. Few die with hope
TheHumanbeingHuman 10 months ago
I am curious. Does that professor you communicated with via Amazon.com know how much of an impact he has had on you?
paultoronto42 10 months ago
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@Evid3nc3 ''I am curious. Does that professor you communicated with via Amazon.com know how much of an impact he has had on you?'' -paultoronto42
Yeah. And is he still in contact with you? attending school in madrid 1960's means he was likely both 1940's latest, probably mid 1930's. Any chance you still communicate? He sounds like an incredibly intelligent and interesting man.
You are lucky to have found him; the universe is weird in that way.
pyro666926 10 months ago
I' m a little disappointing. I thought the argument Gerald Schroeder made was reasonable argument (if the science *actually* is accurate) and I was waiting to hear a reasonable rebuttal from the professor .. but instead the guy was just like I'm a baddass and you ... your just a kid and Schroeder can suck it... boom
I know the argument is to a certain extent a slight of hand argument but .. I think it seemed reasonable enough that it should be rebutted
but what ev good vid thanks 4 upload
midgety1 11 months ago
@midgety1 Later on in the series, he addresses some of the issues with Schroeder's book. Keep watching! :)
whatthellman 11 months ago
Well Done,, Bravo!
rclark23 11 months ago
@rclark23 Yeah bravo! ^^
SamuelFriberg 9 months ago
This felt like a discussion between Morpheus and Neo. I really am enjoying these videos. Although I am not on a level equal with your intellect, I feel I came to much of the same conclusions you did.
Kalashnikov5741 1 year ago
As smart as this professor guy is, I found that last statement of his condescending. I consider myself agnostic on the existence of God, but I don't think his statement of "Those Christians are so much more stupid than people like you and me Chris. We are intellectually supeior". (Yes, I know those weren't his exact words but that's how I interpreted them). I know atheists TEND to be smarter, but that doesn't mean ALL of them are. My parents are Christian, but I consider them to be smart.
ryanmshepard92 1 year ago
@ryanmshepard92
I have to agree with the Professor about differing levels of intellect. It’s not so much a measure of raw mental ability as it is the way a person uses their mind. You’re average person uses their minds to solve puzzles and accomplish practical goals. On another level a person is driven to gather truth with a capital “T”. One of the common elements in all the deconversion stories I’ve listened to is this desire to know what the truth is regardless of the consequences.
RPR1983 1 year ago
@ryanmshepard92- Yes, I know those weren't his exact words but that's how I interpreted them.
I think you have misinterpreted them, then. He was talking about themselves in relation to Chris' congregation, not "all theists/atheists". Chris described them as close-minded and generally uninterested in truth, science, and knowledge in general; whereas he and the professor are. Even so, the professor said “most of your church associates”. In which case, I think his assessment is fairly accurate.
deviroth 1 year ago
Watching this is so intense.
cheeseit126 1 year ago 45
@cheeseit126 I feel you, man. I had to rewatch it just to fully comprehend his explanations.
zaSpeaker 1 year ago
Your correspondence sounded like a scene from the Matrix. "This is your last chance. After this, there is no turning back. You take the blue pill - the story ends, you wake up in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe. You take the red pill - you stay in Wonderland and I show you how deep the rabbit-hole goes."
TrulyEvilBob 1 year ago 3
Fascinating how much the internet has been an avenue in the search for your truth. Even being able to find books to order to read appears thanks to the internet. Makes sense that you are using this medium to reach out to others. I am old enough that I had no such avenue and was very isolated.
Enjoying your series. Hopefully others seeing your journey won't feel so alone in theirs.
MegF142857 1 year ago
I like how your process is all about reasoning and spirituality, not only condescending comments on science and/or degrading other people belief. I think that deconversion is really personal, just as yours, and the way you are exposing it is inspiring for those who already are on that road and might feel awkward by other YT!atheist's agressive approach . My own deconversion went fast from age 12 to 15 and without real questionning but I realize that I followed the same steps... Good work, man
Pollypo66 1 year ago
I had the pleasure of meeting Dr. Schroeder in Israel in 2008 and saw him give a talk explaining his theory. It was intriguing, the math held up, and it definitely made me think. However, I'm still an atheist.
BalanceTheories 1 year ago
I am incredibly envious of the relationship you had with this professor. My own transition from a heavily faith centered family to an intellectually centered atheism was far less... facilitated, and paved with nihilism and apathy until my early college years.
inademv 1 year ago
You have my respect.
You went through roughly the same thing as I did, only that it was my uncle which asked the question which made me do more research on Christianity and other religions for as well old mythologies such as Northern/Greek/Egyptian to name a few.
His question was simple: "How can you be so sure of what you are saying is right?"
This question confused me, as how could it not be true? Wasn't God a reality?
Wasn't it logical that God created us?
Five years later, here I am.
BenitoraSan 1 year ago
I liked how you use the background music on your videos! the music is beautiful and relaxing! may i know how to get a hold of the songs? at least give me the name of the album or tracks??
fatalkeyv 1 year ago
Beautiful video
JDSproducitons 1 year ago
Wow. Thus far this series is probably the most honest and comprehensive look into the mentality of a very intelligent person who happened to had been of Christian faith. I commend you for putting this information out there for the world.
TrueMusou 1 year ago
I am not afraid of the fire. Become what you fear is the best course or at least face it and acknowledge it.
doublewhat 1 year ago
History is not a quagmire to me, it is an adventure.
doublewhat 1 year ago
Christianity is good. I know in my heart the Christianity had good intentions. I just can't force myself to believe in something that I know is wrong, I want to believe, I want to believe that it is Truth, but truth is just what someones idea of truth is. Christians believe that God is truth, that is their truth. I won't believe in something I cant understand or ever hope to understand. I hope that all of us can learn the one truth that really matters.
Lordwakka 1 year ago
fuck i almost cried. i got that old feeling back when i was 14 or so praying in the local mosque, back when i used to believe. the sort of feeling you got when you felt like god talked to you and understood you. it felt as though i have been revealed important truths about the universe. but mehh it's probably just the bg music and your NLP therapist voice. but man i think you are going to deconvert a hell lot of people. good luck and "god" bless.
tetleydidley 1 year ago 21
What do de lette E and P on the lower corners mean?
rclawitw 1 year ago
@rclawitw i think it meant to show who's talking. E for the creator of this vid and P for the prof.
tetleydidley 1 year ago
I want to know the truth, no matter how bad or good it is. ----> Eventual Atheism
CptMcClain 1 year ago 2
@AllTheMusicYouNeed - He's quoting what the professor said in their conversation.
Klokhand 1 year ago
May i ask why you say Chris 19 seconds into the video?
AllTheMusicYouNeed 1 year ago
wooooow. Your story is almost like mine, except that im 17
noesupert 1 year ago
I really like the comment about how religions 'best serve those you are describing'. Slight paradigmshift for me.
pyogenic 1 year ago
This series is awesome, I wish my deconversion was this powerful and systematic haha.
ArmandoXIII 1 year ago
you should not keep unemployed people awake all night
wardogPC 1 year ago
Where can I get that historical linguistics chart you've got in this video?
dissonantsonorant 1 year ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
more professors and other books... and the "I don't want you to be brought down" comment by the professor.. I said that to my fiance'(now wife) about 3 years ago too, when I was an atheist and consistently pursuing "truth."
I'm just going to skip to it, since you like logic/science/mathematics/truth... questions will suffice.
1) How do you learn about the world around you and come to know truth?
2) Do you employ circular reasoning in this also?
3) How did you come to finally reject the Bible?
droptozro 1 year ago
@droptozro
You haven't said anything with substance here. Your modus operandi seems to be making condescending remarks about how "weak my faith was" and how much I "depended on professors and books". Yet, you give no objective measure by which we can judge how strong a person's faith is and no convincing justification for why reading books is bad. You are full of hot air and full of yourself. Present some substantive, topical counter-arguments or go condescend to someone else.
Evid3nc3 1 year ago 57
@Evid3nc3
You wish to have proper responses--and I give them to you, according to the Bible. Not according to myself.
I am, answer the questions and you will see the point I'm making with this. As I said in the other video, evidence is not what matters--because "A" is backed up by "B" and "C", "C" by "D,""F,""G<"---you get the point. You end up trusting so many back-sources by faith that you have no idea if the original information has been skewed in the evidence you're seeing now.
droptozro 1 year ago
@Evid3nc3 I think droptozro says a person with a strong faith is her: /watch?v=q3mDLsyn6ns
ChaoticBlack1 10 months ago
@droptozro You seem to be directly implying that there is circular reasoning present in this video. As I understand it, circular reasoning is when the conclusion of an argument is included in one or more of the premises that are used to argue for the same conclusion. Could you please point out to me the argument here which is circular, specifically: the conclusion of the argument and the circular premise that is used to support it?
.
If I have misunderstood, please correct me.
robertbently 1 year ago
@robertbently
It's not in the video, I'm just not seeing grounds for his legitimacy because his faith was so quickly hacked away by a lack of knowledge in the Scriptures it seems--so I began asking questions to get to the heart of his beliefs, the presuppositions that every person holds within a worldview.
droptozro 1 year ago
@droptozro Give God a chance to speak to you, and really reveal Himself to you, and answer your questions about Him, life's true purpose, why sufferings, ...does He have Laws? Has He spoken to humanity? Throguh who (the Messiah?) Have we transgressed His Laws bringing curses and sufferings upon us, and upon God's Creation? Cry out to the God who created you (and all things), let Him be your teacher,..then come judgement day, you can say to Him, I asked You to show me the true way in your defence
successissure 1 year ago
@droptozro God does NOT reveal Himself to (nor answer their questions) to those who don't "choose" to really seriously want to know Him... its a "free-will choice" we ALL have to make... do I want to know the God who created me, or not ?...what if He has Laws I've transgressed? He only asks us to CHOOSE to really want to know Him, and let Him convict, teach, and change us as He shepherds and leads us through life,... all christians can do is tell you what God revealed to them when they ASKED
successissure 1 year ago
@droptozro Give God a chance to speak to you, and really reveal Himself to you, and answer your questions about Him, life's true purpose, why sufferings, ..does He have Laws? Has He spoken to humanity? Through who (the Messiah?) Have we transgressed His Laws bringing curses and sufferings upon us, and upon God's Creation? Cry out to the God who created you (and all things), let Him be your teacher,..then come judgement day, you can say to Him, I asked You to show me the true way in your defence
propheticman 1 year ago
@droptozro God does NOT reveal Himself to (nor answer their questions) to those who don't "choose" to really seriously want to know Him... its a "free-will choice" we ALL have to make... do I want to know the God who created me, or not ?...what if He has Laws I've transgressed? He only asks us to CHOOSE to really want to know Him, and let Him convict, teach, and change us as He shepherds and leads us through life,... all christians can do is tell you what God revealed to them when they ASKED
propheticman 1 year ago
Each time I watch the videos, I learn something new. (And I am an atheist).
pannysat 1 year ago
That's amazing that you thought your professor, a natural man outclassed you, a spiritual man in understanding the things of God.
preachinshawn 1 year ago
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@SpoiledDeryn The fallen angels and satan are extremely kind at first when trying to deceive us into rejecting the True version of God (Jesus) for the false versions of God, and right-relationship with Him, ...a Holy God who loves humanity, hates the lies and sin that sickens, and destroys humanity and all His creations He loves so deeply...who just wants humans to choose to want to know Him, and to let Him change their hearts daily to prepare them for life in His Holy Eternal Kingdom forever
propheticman 1 year ago