New Book From Craig Groeschel: Christian Athiest

[lucasboden]

Maybe if you actually talk about Jesus, his teachings, and his character, and his relationship with others, then more people will freely choose to follow him. Christians do not want to preach Jesus because that would mean they would have to love their enemies and give their riches to the poor.

[Pernic10us]

This sounds like a very complex and convoluted angle on Pascal's wager.

This is assuming that everyone already believes, and is afraid of hell. I wonder if he addresses the fact that hell is extremely unlikely to exist in the first place.

Motivational speaking, and confident charisma do not give any of his ideas any weight. I am sure however, that those already in church will think so.

[thewisenashvillestar]

I think you both should read the book I don't have enough faith to be an athiest!

[Pernic10us]

@thewisenashvillestar

I have read it. I was not impressed. It was full of logical fallacies, and emotional presumptions. Very few solid facts were presented, and most of the rebuttals to atheistic stand-points are weak, at best.

The main premise of the book is based on an argument of incredulity: 'I don't know how it could happen so (X) did it!'

It will only reinforce the faith of believers, and hammer down reasonable doubts they may have. It isn't going to convert any rational skeptics.

[pokeround]

While struggling to characterise my own religious feelings for my Facebook profile, I coined the term 'Christian Atheist'. By this I intended to convey that I don't believe in God but try to live as though He does exist. Then I clicked on it and found myself led to your profile. It looks like some confusions lie ahead for me....

[patrickledford420]

@pokeround why would you try to live as if that god existed? why not try to live as if allah, zues or thor is real? if it is the "if im right then i will go to heaven" excuse, then allah might be real and send you to hell. it is really unreasonable to act as if god is real yet not actually beleive that one is.

[pokeround]

@patrickledford420 Tx, Patrick. Well, because my idea of God encapsulates the values that I believe in, Zeus and Thor don't. Allah might workl if he were the more compassionate Allah of the Sufi's, perhaps. I think heaven is something we have to strive to make here on earth, not an afterlife club that I will get into as a reward for having the 'right' beliefs. I think God is as real as we make Him by our faith and our living. I think faith is, ultimately, 'un-reasonable'.

Best Wishes.

[patrickledford420]

@pokeround that is just wishful thinking and honestly, it annoys me that someone such as yourself knows that this god is not real yet you pretend that he is, this is one problem that makes it difficult for religion to end. no, god is not as real as you make him with your faith, god is as real either way, please, stop deluding yourself

[pokeround]

@patrickledford420 'God' probably isn't real ahead of time, in the same way that 'justice' and 'human rights' aren't. These are social and psychological constructs and the fact that they do not exist a priori does not render them valueless in my view. I do not see in what way I am 'deluded' in any of this.

Thanks.

[patrickledford420]

@pokeround because "justice" and "human rights" are concepts, not beings. the concept of justice is just as real as the concept of god, but god will never actually be real from people thinking it is.

[pokeround]

@patrickledford420 Tx. Glad we cleared up the misunderstanding. I meant God as a concept that is actualized by people adopting it. It doesn't exist 'out there' so to speak.

Regards.