Game Geeks #61 Dungeons & Dragons 4th Edition Previews

[sonoNEKO]

D&D was never really Tolkien-based, as a big Tolkien fan, I really had a hard time getting into D&D because I hated how elves were, I hated gnomes, good dragons were weird, the gods were weird, and so on. I had to really step away from Tolkien fantasy and really get into the D&D stuff before the Greyhawk setting stuck to me. Gygax has also stated in an article in the Dragon that he wasn't even a fan of Lord of the Rings and didn't take much inspiration from it.

[capndax]

Thank you D&D !!

D&D inspired us to make movies in the fantasy world and rules and characters.

Monsters and various races are used.

Our movies are all put on You Tube

Movies by: Shadowyn Films

movies like: Soul Searching

If you like D&D you will like these movies a well.

Ideas are welcome!

[ZachariasClub]

@capndax ... and then 4th edition came out.

[pspboy7]

Elves, Dwarves, Humans, Halflings, dragons, wraiths... that is as far as D&D is compared to Tolkien's world, after that the similarities end. D&D is very magic heavy, Tolkien's world is not... But yes, it is obvious that D&D was heavily influenced but Tolkien, albeit indirectly.

[MhicWombat]

I started with OD&D ... pre-"1st ed"; I dropped out with AD&D, I got brought back with 3e, never fully converted to 3.5, and have subsequently moved away from D&D again. I am glad there are so many other game systems out there -- D&D does not satisfy my needs in the slightest.

[quequien2002]

Loooooooool soooo Wrong first impresion check ep 92 and see how he hates it xD

[ADnDsDM]

@quequien2002

Yep. Talks so much BS about it here then trashes it later. Would have been better to have kept him mouth shut till he actually played the game to begin with. He educates viewers my aunt Fanny.

[tetsubo57]

When I found out that they were charging for the preview books, I knew doom was on the march.

4E isn't D&D to me. It's a tactical miniatures game with a fantasy expansion tacked onto it.

The last version of D&D is 3.5.

[Zombiewulf]

"The last version of D&D is 3.5. " - tetsubo57

Pathfinder Beta is the new D

[tetsubo57]

Well, we are all entitled to our opinions.

And I've preordered Pathfinder.

The best version of 3.5 I have yet seen is Everstone. I even did a video on it on my channel.

[Beelzebubbles]

"...folks,, I think is going to be another version of Dungeons and Dragons..."

I hoped you would be right about this one,,, but this ain't DnD anymore for me...

Keep up the good work... :)

[Orklord90]

I had actully never played DnD or any RPG more then Computer rpgs! but i think i should get the Startet set for DnD 4th and i'm doining a homebrew campagin setting called: Lords of Alristaar!

[ZachariasClub]

@Orklord90 4th is ok for starting... but you should try earlier editions. once you've played a little, you might want try 1st edition. ask be questions!

[mynamesaretakenwtf]

Since 4E has come out now, what's your take on it, Kurt? I've tried it with an open mind, my results were so-so. Not bad, but not great either. I'm about to try Pathfinder, and get a first hand look at how that works compared to 3e, cause after 4e, it does kind of make me have to take a step back and really think about how the game is going to work now.

[ZachariasClub]

makes 4th ed pretty good. a nice change to other reviews.

[Wook13]

THeres a 4th ED?????

[spuddmc34]

yup, where have you been?

[jonstewartfanboy]

It's all about money, and adds nothing to the overall rpg experience. A GM creates the world and player experience, not the rules. All RPG's are the same, what changes is the setting, if changing old monsters requires you to throw away your old stuff, it's just arbitrary and silly. Changing how magic works or healing etc is insane, the world has long been established, up is not down and /paying/ to change the basics is even sillier. If old DND wasn't fun, the new DND will not be either.

[Jakegothicsnake]

they hsould shift a little but towards Lewis (Lewis as in C.S. Lewis)

[aramisrameriz]

man i hope my friends deside that we should play dungeons and dragons

[araciel82]

Dragon alignment (and monster alignment for that matter) has always been a source of frustration... Honestly, I've always played that if you belong to a sentient race, you won't be strictly one alignment... No iteration of the game tells me to be stupid and gets away with it, I do stupid just fine by myself.

[spuddmc34]

thats why some of us are shutting up about 4th edition and playing 3.5 edition

[Darkwintre]

Yes I liked Worlds and monsters more than Races and classes too

[MuslimViking]

...

Not sure how I feel about no Gnomes...to me they always kind of seemed like a cross-breed between Dwarves and Halflings, but nonetheless, they have been a part of DnD for some time...what's more, many established worlds have already have Gnomes...It makes me wonder how they'll deal with that, as they can't just have every Gnome Character Disappear. Hopefully, they'll make a sourcebook for Gnomes and the like, as I'm pretty sure that there is still a large amount of people who like Gnomes..

[babydollgoddess]

I called 4E (and then some) when Hasbro bought out wotC. RIP, D&D. *sniff sniff*

[acm4bass]

Ok. I played DnD back in second edition and toyed with 3.5 enough to understand what it was. Ive seen some youtube demo for the computer stuff which is better than lead figures, but in never used those anyway. Im very concerned with this reviews 1-10 dungeoncrawling comment becasue thats not DnD.I wanna have my own world, mythos etc. This is the first I'm hearing of this and I will be very attentive to furthur news. True, Im getting old but I have aspirations of playing DnD with my kid someday.

[arrugao]

Has "Unhallowed Metropolis" been reviewed? It is a sweet delicious gem out there... me thinks anyway...

[aikighost]

"Unhallowed Metropolis" is a great game, I'd also like to see A/State reviewed another awesome dark setting.

[arrugao]

2nd edition for ever!

[ZachariasClub]

@arrugao 1st edition forever!!!!!!!!

[ADnDsDM]

@ZachariasClub

DAMN RIGHT! OD&D started it all and 1st edition enhanced the rules further. After that the game becomes a competition between what was popular at the time. 2nd edition was created to get into the Magic the Gathering Market, (Wizard & Cleric Spell Card Boxes as well as The Trading Card sets. 3rd was an attempt (poor as it was) to bring the old system back, 3.5 was done to make money, pure and simple, while 4th edition was made to tap into the World of Warcraft Market.

[psiseferepies]

guys has anybody heard of any major changes of the game mechanics

[Crimyote]

Psiseferepies:

A change I've read about is that a wizard isn't limited to casting spells only a certain amount of of times a day. Each class has 3 types of abilities; At will, encounter and daily. So some can be cast whenever they want.

I've read that death is being handled differently as well.

[Kergillian]

Well, the timing of this review is a little off.

Keep on the Shadowfell is out, and the 4E quickstart rules are out.

4E isn't DnD as you know it, this is DnD evolved. In many ways, this is more like DnD of old, but the mechanics are new and (IMHO) improved. Like every version of DnD to date, this isn't for everyone. It isn't as versatile as 3.0/3.5 but it's a lot easier to run. Gaming has evolved a lot in the last 30 years, I for one am happy to see DnD keeping up.

[korrozive]

As for the game, I couldn't care less, some will love it, some will hate it, and that's really the way it should be. But what I'm curious about is what it's gonna do to the market in general... might be good, might be bad, I'm just curious...

[finniksa]

I have two gnomes and a leprechaun (using a grig template with some gnome blending)... I dunno. I've been in more games with gnomes than half-orcs.

[zulgyan]

I don't agree D&D to be too Tolkien. I quiet think it's very different. I don't play 3E. Anyway, discussion if D&D is too Tolkien would be impossible to do in youtube.

Kurt, I like your reviews!! Even thought I don't always agree! Cheers, and keep it up.

[WatcherThePunk]

Apparantly, my comment got lost, so I'll have to ask again:

What are /stIrb/ and /dran/? (That /a/ should be the other /a/, but I only have 1 font here.)

[ViperHeartJack]

*Wide-Eyed Wonder* ... it's like... you saw my comment and decided it was a good idea.

*Small, child-like voice* I love you...

[jidar]

I'm glad you did this, I wouldn't normally read something like this myself but I picked up the first one and was pleasantly surprised at how good of a read it was. I've recommended both books to my friends.

[LanguTV]

I had hope for 4th edition already, anyone who plays or has played second, third, 3.5 knows that after you go through enough campaigns and have your players chew the fat on all the soft books, you want something different, Eberon touched on the different we loved that. but 4th has given us a reason to sit idle and not try to run any games that would in fact cause us to again, get bored. Thanx for the review.

[SuperCatMan]

Thanks for the review, you've given me some hope for 4th edition. But I was wondering if you could give us another World of Darkness review. I was particularly hoping that you would review Armories and Asylum. Thanks in advance.

[Jeffrywith1e]

those two books you showed at the beginning were pretty much useless, weren't they. I'm looking forward to the changes in the system. Sounds like improvements to me. I do not like the direction the art has taken, it looks more demonic and anime than ever before. I favor the old Tolkien feel of the AD&D art a whole lot more. This Eberron-ish art is not to my liking.

[ciangarotti]

Totally agree, this is d&d for otakus.

Please, bring back from the past some gladiators of Athas to crush these cartoonish characters.

[walt776]

My advice? Skip 4e. There are other roleplaying systems out there that work just as well and won't force you to buy 20 supplements. D&D lost my interest years ago, although I admit I quite liked it when it was still run by TSR. They were far more creative in those days, putting out a variety of different campaigns (My favorite being Hollow World for the original D&D). If you want to play D&D, get some of the old TSR books, convert the stats to your favorite system, and go at it.

[kaosdevice]

You ought to check out Paizo's Pathfinder RPG.

[knwiegel]

I've just discovered it (Hi, I'm Kurt and I'm late tp the party) I like what I see quite a bit.

[kaosdevice]

They are doing some neat clean up sorts of things with 3.5. What I'm not digging about 4E is that they seem to be MMORPG-izing D&D. Plus I agree on the online component, that is where they are migrating Dragon and Dungeon (and thus ended their paper version agreement with Paizo.) I'm not inherently aganst that, I've been a Pyramid subscriber for years, it is just a somewhat and yet another cheesy stratgem to get online subscriptions.

[Jeffrywith1e]

I played a gnome once. A bard who wore a blue coat and had a red pointed hat. Profession - gardening. He was very fun.

[walt776]

:) I think WOTC's issue with gnomes is they never perfected "lawn ornament" as a feat.

[Plissken07]

You're late Kurt. You gotta review Keep on the Shadowfell.

[EliteOM3G4]

I play gnomes, my first character was a gnome.

[knwiegel]

Cool. You're the first person I ever met. They've always seemed the back-seat demihuman to me.

[MoltenPlastic]

Here we go with the old "They're a business" tagline: "therefore they are authorised to publish overpriced preview pamphlets".

Well guess what? They're a business and I'm a client: "clients are authorised to not buy what they see as pathetic and useless"

And you're a critic, Mr Wiegel: "critics are obliged to CRITICISE from time to time"

[mysterycycle]

So my solution would be not to buy them. Why is this a problem? If WotC makes money on these, are you being hurt?

Kurt's already established that he doesn't like to give negative reviews (GG#48). Game Geeks isn't that sort of show; personally, I appreciate that. Kurt explains what the game is about and gives his impressions on it. It's more like a sneak peek than anything else.

If you want a more meticulous in-depth analysis - or a vitriolic rant - I'd recommend going to RPGnet.

[walt776]

While I've been known to do the WOTC rant sometimes, you know what? I think they've been a boon to the industry in some ways. Their lack of creativity has allowed a lot of smaller publishers to come in and fill the void. And thanks to PDFs, a lot of people can publish these days.

[swinebread]

no 4th Edition for me

[DoktorZinieztro]

While good and a wee-bit apologetic, the review is useful, Kurt... still, it does sounds like 4e is going to be yet another field day for powergamers.

Finally, yes, Wizards-Hasbro are just about business, but making money on "teasers" wel..

It's a cheap shot.

Why, with all the urge to get epopel to susbcribe to the digital trend they are implementing, you'd think they'd made those available there and for a reduced price.

Anyway, another nice review.

Cheers.