funny. Sweden= One of the most atheistic countries. Sweden= ONe the the most similar to socialistic countries. Sweden= One of the happiest countries, with low crime rates, and low amount of poverty.
Atheist Experience banned comment: Faerie Tale and the Santa CLAUSE are heavy hitters to those who cannot stand on their toes under what they speak about. The Atheist Experience are very intelligent, but that is only hitting the mythical stories against biblical mythical stories. Erase religion, and go scientific, you actually find that creation is our foundation, starting 15 billion years ago, and no atheist can deny what has been delved with evidence years of observatory proof. There is God.
Sweden is perverted? The Netherlands had all that like a decade earlier + decriminalized soft-drug production, sale and use and fully legal prostitution.
Where's the "God hates the Dutch" sites? Oh, I found it already.
It's incredible that even without a state religion we are so secular.
I'm from Sweden and as far as I know I can come up with two corrections:
The preacher that held a anti-gay sermon was not just shunned, he was prosecuted for "hate-speech", I'm not sure if he got convicted. As for the beastiality law, before 1944 having gay-sex and having sex with animals was punished under the same law, instead of re-writing the law they removed it, the reason being that having sex with animals was still punishable under the laws that protected animals from cruelty.
I think what America REALLY needs, is HISTORY. In Europe, we've had maybe 3-4000 years of that (note: history starts with first writings, before that is pre-history), while the Americas maybe have up to 1000 years of history, which was mostly destroyed by European colonists, about 500 years ago. (most Mayan/Incan/...writings have been burned to ashes as being "unholy")
Not only does America have a mere 500 year history, it's also unchallenged. War against the weak is nothing but a massacre.
We have a state religion (in Finland) - and it sucks. Currently it's the only thing slowding down the process of allowing gay marriage. That's just one thing that annoys me about it.
@pienipaha : Well state religion seems to have worked in killing religion in Finland also. We still have tons of nutjobs but Finland is pretty darn secular and just keeps on getting better.
Muslim Immigrants are the rain on this parade, as they are everywhere on this planet. But we have Sweden as a quineapig, they took 10 times more muslims and are now struggling to fit them in somehow. And failing, so it seems. So we can look what they do wrong and try to learn.
I do agree that Finland is relatively secular in many aspects, but that might not have all to do with state religion as much as other cultural things. Can't really say for sure, haven't looked much into it. All though I still think state and church (or any religion) should be kept separate. Kinda like religious political parties, which I feel are unnecessary.
@pienipaha : You are absolutely right on that. Voicing any religion-based opinions should be automatical political suicide. Just mentioning "christian values" or something ridiculous like that should have people thrown out of debates, not to mention any government office.
@bary1234 Too bad I live in America, where 99% of people don't use their goddamn brains and plenty of laws are passed on the logic of "Well the Bible says so."
The fact that everyone in my country is intelligent enough to understand that our government and media is owned by big corporations, but are too ignorant to investigate the fact, makes my life that much more frustrating. I'm moving to Australia as soon as I get the chance
@sk8tafrnk : Damn, that sounds bad. But its getting better, old religious farts are dying out everywhere, and there are not enough new morons rising to replace them.
Children are the future, and only marginal groups are succesfully brainwashed to superstition today.
@bary1234 Thank fucking god. The numbers of religious people should exponentially change every 10 years. But our country is governed by the media. Even people who aren't religious can't apply that same objectiveness to music and tv to realize it's true.
It's the reason we live in the richest country but our damn government can't take care of it's own people health or poverty wise. Nobody here questions anything, but as long as alcohol's always available I think I can suffice lol
@bary1234 Sadly, only human development is at fault for this. If we just lived in the trees like hippies and lived within the Earth's means we'd be okay. Instead, we developed too fast and by the time we realized the Earth's limited resources, we had already nearly used them up.
Now nobody's going to want to step backwards in technology to think ahead, so our intelligence I believe will probably be, ironically, the end of us.
@sk8tafrnk : Actually, in developed countries birth rates are dropping. Only muslims breed like rabbits anymore. When ever a nation empowers women, birth rates start to decline fast. We just might start reversing this horrible overpopulation. Off course some murderous pandemic disease would help a lot, swine flu should have killed 6 billion humans.
@sk8tafrnk : That is true. Developing countries should get endless supply of free condoms and other contraseption, free sterilisation and free abortion to all. As should everybody else on this planet.
@bary1234 The most developed countries barely have kids at all. It's all the undeveloped countries that need help like this. Basically education makes all that kind of stuff just fall into place because people realize the impact they have on other people, themselves, and the Earth.
@sk8tafrnk : Actually I dont think most people stop having babies to stop overpopulation. They just want to have fun, travel, build careers and enjoy life without children cramping their style :)
@bary1234 Basically when people are educated the more thoroughly understand the responsibility, implications, and consequences of children. The don't have the Church telling them to not use birth control, and the realize the importance of actually taking birth control.
The truly realize how much a kid would cramp their style lol
I agree with Matt. Bestality is an issue because it lacks consent. If you could prove there was consent between two adults of any species, I would not object to the two coupling, provided it was safe.
no no prove air or i won,t believe,coin the athiest statement.who couldn,t breath 200yrs ago and has no love today because they can,t prove love.chose your image wisely or at least use your brain,if there was time bent you just wiped out 99.999% of your allotted time.ignorant people say ignorant things,use your brains people.Jesus is God in spirit,human on earth ,and transfigured,meaning both.if your gonna follow make sure you use your brain.
lets say we can,t prove God to you,so you choose not to believe.but on the same subject air wasn,t proven to resently,so lets say you could go back in time,you would flop like a fish on your theory. 00000.lmao,please use your brain before going into a box.
you have to remember the difference between not making a law to forbid something, and encouraging people to do the same thing.
Sweeden didn't legalice bestiality because they want, or even encourage people to have sex with animals, but because theres no reasonable reason to outlaw it.
And if u ask a everyday sweed, i think he would say bestiality is grosse, just like everybody else. :)
on bestiality; they seem to have done the sensible thing, made their law clearer, where there's harm (imo in 80% of bestiality cases) the trial goes ahead, but where they can find no harm caused, they don't impose their beliefs.
so in effect they don't kill animals for some moral judgment on whats right (like most other country's do), they protect people and animals from harm and suffering.. seems sensible, and a better way to write laws using logic and reason instead of emotion and hysteria.
Y'know what. I know it's kind of this unwritten rule that us irreligious people have to support freedom of religion. But me... I say screw that.
I think having state atheism the same way say... Norway has a state church. (So not Soviet style, but Norway style.) would be a good thing for the planet.
Religion causes way more damage then it's worth. And the only thing people get out of it is presumed authority to be asshats and oppressors. Which I'd happily take away.
@pienipaha Not that I'm pro-beastiality or anything, but, seriously, do you think you can rape a horse? I think you'd have to at least use some kinda date-rape drug or something if the horse was unwilling. :p
Animals, by their nature, tend to be quite obvious in indicating what they want or don't want.
As a side note, there was that gay guy that got killed in Washington by a horse, I leave the details to your imagination. =8O
I really don't give a damn if someone tries to rape a horse. In either case, it's more likely they get killed.
Also, I know a few cases where someone has been killed after trying to engage in anal penetratuion with a horse. Non of these were gay though. As for trying to shove one's own organ in a horse... they kick. It hurst.
I'm more concerned about "raping" smaller animals than horses.
And no, I can not rape a horse because first of all I'm not an idiot
ps. take note my first message was a joke (though it is true you can't really ask a non-human animals' consent. Though some, mostly male, animals can attempt to mate with a human xD )
I think you are gving too much thought to technique. ;p Even humans use about 80% 'body language' for communication and often human on human mating rituals have little or no spoken words, and if you start whipping out a written consent form for sex just so you know if they -really- want sex(Kobe needed one, lol), I think that would definitely cut into your sex life. I only wanted to point out that the consent arguement is flawed. How do animals ask each other for consent?
Mating rituals. For some animals rape is technically impossible (tail block). Sexual selection is interesting.. for so many animals either the male or female has to get the companions "consent" by somehow winning them over and beating the competition.
For animals there is a way to say no, but it's a different matter if the other one listens :(
Other animals can't say "no" but they have their own way to communicate.
Where did you get the written consent from ? Funny lol.
Well, I don't think tail block works that effectively. Really many 'mating rituals', involve the male eliminating the competition, and then running the female down until she is too tired to run anymore and she just gives up and submits. Humans, ironically, aren't much different. Rape, in common human sense, is typically defined by a human's ability to detain another human against their will. Almost no other animal can do that. So female animals can run away, that is usually the main defens.
There is much more to mating rituals than "running the female down" (though there are species that use this.. technique.) And females can do more than just run off.
Anyway all that crap is besides the point. I get what you're saying though.
But why would body language be unacceptable o.O
It's very important for communication after all :)
(I am wondering why people think that it's not, as you seem to understand it's importance.)
Yes, I did -greatly- oversimplify and generalize the 'rituals', but I like to get to the basics. ;)
Ya, I think body language should be considered, just look at the horse whisperer to see the power of that.
Males are often hardwired for sex, but sometimes they aren't wired correctly as to what they are supposed to have sex with. =8O Dogs are a good example, a male dog will jump on almost anything.
It's true rape may have played an important part in our evolution. Unattractive males who could rape well would pass on their genes. Eventually we developed the brain power to regard females as fellow autonomous humans, the empathy to want to avoid their suffering, and the society to punish wrongdoing, and now rape is an evolutionary impediment. Those who rape are likely to be killed or imprisoned and will not pass on their genes. Any pregnancies that result are likely aborted. Rape is obsolete.
Lol, apparently you don't read the claims that a large amount of "rapes" are never reported. And many times women cannot even ID the right guy, there are plenty of documented cases of wrongfull imprisonment. The primary reason a man isn't going to rape women is that there is no challenge to it, you're taking the easy way out. Any man with pride is gonna talk a girls pants off, beat them at their own game, so to speak.
The written just came from the next step of provable acceptance. People are saying, by default, that body language is unacceptable, even tho humans use only body language in many cases. They are moving the 'burden of proof' up to the verbal, so I figure take it to the next step, written. For the step above that, we can use a notary public. Of course, all this is me being facetious, but I figure it helps make the point. ;)
I repeat, I didnt compare the beastiality and gay marriage in the way you discribed (look at your original comment).. I said that I support both in the same way which is completely diffrent because I believe in freedom for people.
So dont twist my arguements please..
You then end it all off with a big arguement from emotion at best.. otherwise just your bald assertion.
You need an actually well constructed valid arguement to make zoophilia illegal.
I don't need any other argument then that its is unethical. And yes, that argument derives from an emotional standpoint. But you also argument from an emotional standpoint..."At best" So what is your point?
And I didn't twist anything, I merely conceive what you say as it is.
Would you accept that I would want murder to be legal just because I believe in freedom for people. Would you accept that as a valid argument??
I don't think so. And if you don't than you're nothing but a hypocrite.
Your arguements just get worse and worse.. its really sad.
Prove its unethical?
If the animal and human wants it, who are you to say its wrong and shouldnt be done, the burden is on you to restrict what people want to do in the privacy in their own homes when they dont harm anyone or anything.
Are you SERIOUSLY comparing murder with sex? Argueably consented sex if animal behavior is really studied instead of labelled tabu and unconsentable.
First of all you claim that the animal wants it which you can not prove.. my dog probably wants to eat only candy instead of real food...but I don't fucking let him do i because its bad for him..
And yes, you've just proved that your a hypocrite!
I think its unethical because I believe that it is.
Here is a perfect example why you're wrong.. the dog mounts its master, are you telling me that the dog in that moment doesnt want to but does it anyway... beeeccaaaause?
Your analogy is flawed though because sex is good for the health, most pets die as virgins you know.
You end it off with claiming I have to prove why your personal opinion isnt universal..
You can answear that yourself by watching Atheist Experience lol..
First of all, YOU'RE the one telling ME that I have to prove why my personal opinion is universal. Which I btw never claimed. You cant do something and then say I'm wrong for doing the same.. Again, you're a fucking hypocrite. You keep arguing like a 6 year old.. So tell me now why you think it's ethical.
And if you care that much about virgin animals than why not let them fuck other animals of the same species instead of humans?? Do you have any idea how pathetic your arguments are?
You really are full of yourself aren't you. Why am I not impressive? Do I have a need to be impressive? No I don't. Especially not in your eyes. Do you really think I give a shit about what you think I am or not? Get over yourself..
I never said that the dog didn't want it. I said "my dog probably wants to eat only candy instead of real food...but I don't fucking let him do I because its bad for him"
Bestiality doesn't necessarily harm an animal. But if people are so worried about the sexual treatment of cows, then why not go vegan? Slaughter is far worse than having an orgasm. At least go organic!
Why bestiality was legalized the same time as gay marriage was legalized was because both gay sexuality and bestially was but in the same "paragraph" when the law forbid it. So when they made that paragraph legal again, bestiality automatically became legal. But I think They have fixed that mistake now lol.
/ Proud Swed =)
(God can hate us as much as he like! HAHA)
To the caller. Really nice hear a swed call in to these guys. So cudos for that mate.
Beastiality is still fully legal here, both in pornography or active engagement in it..
However many asshats try to sue people for animal abuse when they find out about someone.. which is absurd in some cases if you've seen the size of an erect horse penis.
Oh so you support bestiality because you believe in freedom of mankind?? I asked you why you support it and that is the only answer you gave. What about animal rights?
If you support bestiality for the same reason you support gay marriage I hope you realize that you've just compared gay people with people who wants to have sex with animals....way to go...
And zoophilia is only about sex and sexual fantasies.
Ok you made another series of falsehoods yet again, I wonder why you bother.. lets dissect it.
Yes I believe in freedom of mankind to do as they wish with animals given that neither are harmed.
So that covers animal rights aswell yet again, most animals wants to bone their masters actually (this is tabu and not highlighted when argued).
I didnt compare the beastiality and gay marriage in the way you discribed.. I said that I support both in the same way because I believe in freedom for ppl
the reason more dominant species kill and eat other animals is for survival. humans having sex with an animals is just for pleasure. but then again, if animals had the choice to be raped for the pleasure of humans or killed and eaten i think they would opt not to be slaughtered to death. but if we're using the premise that animals have the minds to make such decisions maybe they would actually enjoy having sex with humans. very perplexing.
Yeah if you can be homo, why can´t you be animalomo... LoL. not far from there to be honest! Homos say they love eachother i bet some pet owners will say the same :S...................
There's a bit of difference between two sentient, cognizant consenting adults of the same species and raping animals. Your assertion that they aren't far from each other illustrates that you can't even get the lines between species straight and have no understanding on what consent and cognizance means when it comes to sexual partners. Your argument falls insanely short and I can't believe it took 17 hours for someone to point out how stupid you are.
You have enlighten me! I now know animals act less animal compared to humans ! And well i do know the lines between species. Evolution act like it don´t. :). And like it seem you missed the main point in my comment. I bet homos love eachother, i also bet pet owners and the pets love eachother!
Was there any English in that? And no, I didn't say anything about animals acting animal compared to human, I said domesticated pets lack cognizance. I didn't "miss" anything in your post, you can't tell the difference between sexual attraction and platonic attraction, even if its sarcasm you sound like an idiot.
How can i be angry? If someone choose to be gay why should i be angry its their life, if they wanna choose a path like that go ahead but you better realise what you do before you do it.
Although I agree it's not a choice, I can name a lot of reasons being gay is bad for someone; they are discriminated, they are excluded from marriage, they can't have children etc.
@LanteanKnight Your reasons are cultural problems and that is the whole point, we are trying to change that culture, and yes, gay people can and do reproduce all the time, Teddy Haggard has like 6 children.
I wonder if Europe's lack of real strong Christianity makes it easier for Muslims to subvert it. Even though I am a non-believer,. as a practical matter I'm rather more fearful of radical islam than the pale christianity outside the U.S. I don't think we will have the same problem here with Muslim separatists because we are better at assimilating (they would say subverting) the youth.
I'd have to agree with you that radical Islam at the moment is a greater threat than the "pale Christianity" as you put it. I don't think this is an issue of assimilation so much as there is a massive competition in Europe among the countries threatened by Islam for banking rights to their oil money. Indeed socially, Islam is far from a threat, its politically where there is a real threat because politicians are trying to convince Muslim oil money to bank through their economies.
Yes. Islam, for this reason, finds it easier to bully the people into bending backwards for them. If you haven't seen Pat Condell's videos on Islam, YOU MUST SEE IT. He's a VERY intelligent Atheist who lives in the UK, and he talked about Islam A LOT! Just search for Pat Condell on youtube and find his home page.
Yes, Pat Condell's videos are fantastic. His message isn't that Islam is bullying their way in by force, they are extorting political systems of countries who are economically dependent on banking (like Britain, the Netherlands, etc) using their money to buy legislation favorable only to their minority groups, and many of his videos are in response to legislation passed in these countries that make any secularist's stomach turn.
Since we're on this subject, another thing to check out is the way Islam has an greater implied population by having a lot more children in Europe than the average non Islamic family. So if every Islamic family has more than 6 kids, then in the future Islam is predicted to be the major religion, and in a democracy, they will have a greater voice, which will actually take away more rights from the non-Islamics.
That is a scary thought, then again in a 1st world country education is mandatory and as the patricianatheist likes to say, reason is the enemy of religion. The employers will be properly educated and if the Muslim majority only has a sub-basic religious education it will only be a matter of time before social Darwinism kicks in. Maybe I'm being optimistic though.
Even if first generation immigrants have 6 kids, those kids do not have the same birthrate. When third generation rolls around, there is no difference any more between "original" and immigrant populations birthrate.
Not every family does, but what if the majority do? I agree with what you said about the future generations. I was raised by Hindu parents and I live in a Hindu and Muslim area of NY (I'm an Atheist). My sister is dating a guy who was raised by Muslim parents, but he's more of an Agnostic, and disagrees with Islam. The point is, if he feels this way, hopefully children raised in our societies would feel this way too, and won't conform to the ideas of their parents. There's always hope.
In Germany a lot of church costs are carried by the state with regular tax money. The churches get church tax that is collected by the state from members of the religions and handed over, but the state is additionally obligated to pay salaries, maintenance, renovations, training, construction and gets no taxes because of the exemptions. All in all billions per year.
Bestiality is legal in Denmark as well.. .xD
M3t4lManiac 6 months ago
funny. Sweden= One of the most atheistic countries. Sweden= ONe the the most similar to socialistic countries. Sweden= One of the happiest countries, with low crime rates, and low amount of poverty.
The US HAS ALLOT TO LEARN.
gulbirk 9 months ago 12
@gulbirk
Too bad the back wash AKA Southerners aint gots no smarts on logic as us Northerners call ot!
Dracoflamz 7 months ago
@Dracoflamz haha. Well south state people tend to be more religios and right winged, thats for sure.
gulbirk 7 months ago
In England it's quite similar concerning the Anglican church, though not as far "forward".
NormanAngle 11 months ago
oh shit, i forgot, you can fuck pigs here in sweden
horbergaren 1 year ago
@horbergaren You can fuck animals yes.
However I suspect the percent of people that DO this is not impressive.
Imhornydadcomeinside 11 months ago
Atheist Experience banned comment: Faerie Tale and the Santa CLAUSE are heavy hitters to those who cannot stand on their toes under what they speak about. The Atheist Experience are very intelligent, but that is only hitting the mythical stories against biblical mythical stories. Erase religion, and go scientific, you actually find that creation is our foundation, starting 15 billion years ago, and no atheist can deny what has been delved with evidence years of observatory proof. There is God.
massiahmassiah7 1 year ago
@massiahmassiah7 If, as you say, all atheists believe that there is a god, then how are there atheists?
easytoremember0 1 year ago
@massiahmassiah7 Denied, instead of saying "I don't know' you're saying "god did it'.
alienlifeform11 1 year ago
Sweden is perverted? The Netherlands had all that like a decade earlier + decriminalized soft-drug production, sale and use and fully legal prostitution.
Where's the "God hates the Dutch" sites? Oh, I found it already.
It's incredible that even without a state religion we are so secular.
Quintinohthree 1 year ago
Damn you swedes! not only do you have some of the hottest women but you guys just so happen to be least religious in the world!! aghhh
mmmodafoca 1 year ago
The audio in this one is awsome. I would love to know how they got it so well. I would guess it was that he had an awsome mic, but just a guess.
Jesses001 1 year ago
I'm from Sweden and as far as I know I can come up with two corrections:
The preacher that held a anti-gay sermon was not just shunned, he was prosecuted for "hate-speech", I'm not sure if he got convicted. As for the beastiality law, before 1944 having gay-sex and having sex with animals was punished under the same law, instead of re-writing the law they removed it, the reason being that having sex with animals was still punishable under the laws that protected animals from cruelty.
Bjottis 1 year ago
I think what America REALLY needs, is HISTORY. In Europe, we've had maybe 3-4000 years of that (note: history starts with first writings, before that is pre-history), while the Americas maybe have up to 1000 years of history, which was mostly destroyed by European colonists, about 500 years ago. (most Mayan/Incan/...writings have been burned to ashes as being "unholy")
Not only does America have a mere 500 year history, it's also unchallenged. War against the weak is nothing but a massacre.
PJDesseyn 1 year ago
state religion is a WONDERFUL idea. The taliban in the middle east have state religion and look how wonderful that place is!
Zurround100 1 year ago
Wait, wait, wait; how do you not legalize GAY marriage, but legalize BESTIALITY? How the fuck does that work?!
I'm LOLing as I type this...
UnderlordZ 1 year ago
Boo, hisssss: Matt eats animals because they are tasty.
AtheisticHappiness 1 year ago
legalized beastiality...Godless for a reason
h2omanz 1 year ago
We have a state religion (in Finland) - and it sucks. Currently it's the only thing slowding down the process of allowing gay marriage. That's just one thing that annoys me about it.
pienipaha 1 year ago
@pienipaha : Well state religion seems to have worked in killing religion in Finland also. We still have tons of nutjobs but Finland is pretty darn secular and just keeps on getting better.
Muslim Immigrants are the rain on this parade, as they are everywhere on this planet. But we have Sweden as a quineapig, they took 10 times more muslims and are now struggling to fit them in somehow. And failing, so it seems. So we can look what they do wrong and try to learn.
bary1234 1 year ago
@bary1234
I do agree that Finland is relatively secular in many aspects, but that might not have all to do with state religion as much as other cultural things. Can't really say for sure, haven't looked much into it. All though I still think state and church (or any religion) should be kept separate. Kinda like religious political parties, which I feel are unnecessary.
pienipaha 1 year ago
@pienipaha : You are absolutely right on that. Voicing any religion-based opinions should be automatical political suicide. Just mentioning "christian values" or something ridiculous like that should have people thrown out of debates, not to mention any government office.
bary1234 1 year ago
@bary1234 Too bad I live in America, where 99% of people don't use their goddamn brains and plenty of laws are passed on the logic of "Well the Bible says so."
The fact that everyone in my country is intelligent enough to understand that our government and media is owned by big corporations, but are too ignorant to investigate the fact, makes my life that much more frustrating. I'm moving to Australia as soon as I get the chance
sk8tafrnk 1 year ago
@sk8tafrnk : Damn, that sounds bad. But its getting better, old religious farts are dying out everywhere, and there are not enough new morons rising to replace them.
Children are the future, and only marginal groups are succesfully brainwashed to superstition today.
bary1234 1 year ago
@bary1234 Thank fucking god. The numbers of religious people should exponentially change every 10 years. But our country is governed by the media. Even people who aren't religious can't apply that same objectiveness to music and tv to realize it's true.
It's the reason we live in the richest country but our damn government can't take care of it's own people health or poverty wise. Nobody here questions anything, but as long as alcohol's always available I think I can suffice lol
sk8tafrnk 1 year ago
@sk8tafrnk . Human overpopulation is making a mess of everything. There are too damn many of us on this planet. And superstition is not helping.
bary1234 1 year ago
@bary1234 Sadly, only human development is at fault for this. If we just lived in the trees like hippies and lived within the Earth's means we'd be okay. Instead, we developed too fast and by the time we realized the Earth's limited resources, we had already nearly used them up.
Now nobody's going to want to step backwards in technology to think ahead, so our intelligence I believe will probably be, ironically, the end of us.
sk8tafrnk 1 year ago
@sk8tafrnk : Actually, in developed countries birth rates are dropping. Only muslims breed like rabbits anymore. When ever a nation empowers women, birth rates start to decline fast. We just might start reversing this horrible overpopulation. Off course some murderous pandemic disease would help a lot, swine flu should have killed 6 billion humans.
bary1234 1 year ago
@bary1234 Haha. Pretty said to think that way. Depressing that if we developed all the undeveloped countries we'll probably die from overpopulation.
sk8tafrnk 1 year ago
@sk8tafrnk : That is true. Developing countries should get endless supply of free condoms and other contraseption, free sterilisation and free abortion to all. As should everybody else on this planet.
bary1234 1 year ago
@bary1234 The most developed countries barely have kids at all. It's all the undeveloped countries that need help like this. Basically education makes all that kind of stuff just fall into place because people realize the impact they have on other people, themselves, and the Earth.
sk8tafrnk 1 year ago
@sk8tafrnk : Actually I dont think most people stop having babies to stop overpopulation. They just want to have fun, travel, build careers and enjoy life without children cramping their style :)
bary1234 1 year ago
@bary1234 Basically when people are educated the more thoroughly understand the responsibility, implications, and consequences of children. The don't have the Church telling them to not use birth control, and the realize the importance of actually taking birth control.
The truly realize how much a kid would cramp their style lol
sk8tafrnk 1 year ago
"ignorestics" ...hilarious.
Korkzor 1 year ago
Does anyone know what is the song at the start of the video?
AlausBaronas 1 year ago
Well, the farmers of Sweden did not approve of bestiality being legalized, I can assure you of that!
LordEsel88 1 year ago
I agree with Matt. Bestality is an issue because it lacks consent. If you could prove there was consent between two adults of any species, I would not object to the two coupling, provided it was safe.
1RadicalOne 1 year ago
no no prove air or i won,t believe,coin the athiest statement.who couldn,t breath 200yrs ago and has no love today because they can,t prove love.chose your image wisely or at least use your brain,if there was time bent you just wiped out 99.999% of your allotted time.ignorant people say ignorant things,use your brains people.Jesus is God in spirit,human on earth ,and transfigured,meaning both.if your gonna follow make sure you use your brain.
mickwillie1 1 year ago
lets say we can,t prove God to you,so you choose not to believe.but on the same subject air wasn,t proven to resently,so lets say you could go back in time,you would flop like a fish on your theory. 00000.lmao,please use your brain before going into a box.
mickwillie1 1 year ago
@mickwillie1 I am not sure what you mean, air can be felt. If I went back in time that would not change.
JUANMO94 1 year ago
@mickwillie1 : Thats exacly the type of logic that would lead to religion. Embarrassing, stupid and childish.
bary1234 1 year ago
you have to remember the difference between not making a law to forbid something, and encouraging people to do the same thing.
Sweeden didn't legalice bestiality because they want, or even encourage people to have sex with animals, but because theres no reasonable reason to outlaw it.
And if u ask a everyday sweed, i think he would say bestiality is grosse, just like everybody else. :)
anonymepelle 1 year ago 4
Did PETA move their headquarters to Sweeden then??? lol
Nate2203 2 years ago
on bestiality; they seem to have done the sensible thing, made their law clearer, where there's harm (imo in 80% of bestiality cases) the trial goes ahead, but where they can find no harm caused, they don't impose their beliefs.
so in effect they don't kill animals for some moral judgment on whats right (like most other country's do), they protect people and animals from harm and suffering.. seems sensible, and a better way to write laws using logic and reason instead of emotion and hysteria.
doles909 2 years ago
Aaah state religions.
Y'know what. I know it's kind of this unwritten rule that us irreligious people have to support freedom of religion. But me... I say screw that.
I think having state atheism the same way say... Norway has a state church. (So not Soviet style, but Norway style.) would be a good thing for the planet.
Religion causes way more damage then it's worth. And the only thing people get out of it is presumed authority to be asshats and oppressors. Which I'd happily take away.
Shavarnarak 2 years ago
Bestiality is legal there... I had no idea. Is he kidding !?
As far as it doesn't hurt them... well, I still don't think it's ok. How do you ask a horse if s/he's ok with it or not ?
Maybe if the animal hops on you *lOl*
pienipaha 2 years ago
@pienipaha Not that I'm pro-beastiality or anything, but, seriously, do you think you can rape a horse? I think you'd have to at least use some kinda date-rape drug or something if the horse was unwilling. :p
Animals, by their nature, tend to be quite obvious in indicating what they want or don't want.
As a side note, there was that gay guy that got killed in Washington by a horse, I leave the details to your imagination. =8O
l337pwnage 2 years ago
I really don't give a damn if someone tries to rape a horse. In either case, it's more likely they get killed.
Also, I know a few cases where someone has been killed after trying to engage in anal penetratuion with a horse. Non of these were gay though. As for trying to shove one's own organ in a horse... they kick. It hurst.
I'm more concerned about "raping" smaller animals than horses.
And no, I can not rape a horse because first of all I'm not an idiot
pienipaha 2 years ago
ps. take note my first message was a joke (though it is true you can't really ask a non-human animals' consent. Though some, mostly male, animals can attempt to mate with a human xD )
pienipaha 2 years ago
Also, the people can can tie the horse up with ie. veterinary equipment. Though I don't understand why anyone would bother :p
As for raping a horse..
I am not very keen on the thought of getting my internals ripped. If one can't realise that risk... they apparantely never seen a horse dong.
Also, sorry about the typos on the previous post. Typing in a hurry.
pienipaha 2 years ago
I think you are gving too much thought to technique. ;p Even humans use about 80% 'body language' for communication and often human on human mating rituals have little or no spoken words, and if you start whipping out a written consent form for sex just so you know if they -really- want sex(Kobe needed one, lol), I think that would definitely cut into your sex life. I only wanted to point out that the consent arguement is flawed. How do animals ask each other for consent?
l337pwnage 2 years ago
Mating rituals. For some animals rape is technically impossible (tail block). Sexual selection is interesting.. for so many animals either the male or female has to get the companions "consent" by somehow winning them over and beating the competition.
For animals there is a way to say no, but it's a different matter if the other one listens :(
Other animals can't say "no" but they have their own way to communicate.
Where did you get the written consent from ? Funny lol.
pienipaha 2 years ago
Well, I don't think tail block works that effectively. Really many 'mating rituals', involve the male eliminating the competition, and then running the female down until she is too tired to run anymore and she just gives up and submits. Humans, ironically, aren't much different. Rape, in common human sense, is typically defined by a human's ability to detain another human against their will. Almost no other animal can do that. So female animals can run away, that is usually the main defens.
l337pwnage 2 years ago
There is much more to mating rituals than "running the female down" (though there are species that use this.. technique.) And females can do more than just run off.
Anyway all that crap is besides the point. I get what you're saying though.
But why would body language be unacceptable o.O
It's very important for communication after all :)
(I am wondering why people think that it's not, as you seem to understand it's importance.)
pienipaha 2 years ago
Nice conversation we got out of one comment that was mostly a joke x)
I suppose beastiality is not discussed enough since it's such a strong taboo in most cultures :P
It's not like it would necessarily be morally wrong if no harm is done to the "victim".
Then again I don't really see the point to boning other species in the first place lol. (Guess it's a fetish sorta thing :P )
pienipaha 2 years ago
Yes, I did -greatly- oversimplify and generalize the 'rituals', but I like to get to the basics. ;)
Ya, I think body language should be considered, just look at the horse whisperer to see the power of that.
Males are often hardwired for sex, but sometimes they aren't wired correctly as to what they are supposed to have sex with. =8O Dogs are a good example, a male dog will jump on almost anything.
youtube search bunny cat hump for fun. :)
People make too big a deal about sex sometimes.
l337pwnage 2 years ago
It's true rape may have played an important part in our evolution. Unattractive males who could rape well would pass on their genes. Eventually we developed the brain power to regard females as fellow autonomous humans, the empathy to want to avoid their suffering, and the society to punish wrongdoing, and now rape is an evolutionary impediment. Those who rape are likely to be killed or imprisoned and will not pass on their genes. Any pregnancies that result are likely aborted. Rape is obsolete.
bcgonynor 2 years ago
Lol, apparently you don't read the claims that a large amount of "rapes" are never reported. And many times women cannot even ID the right guy, there are plenty of documented cases of wrongfull imprisonment. The primary reason a man isn't going to rape women is that there is no challenge to it, you're taking the easy way out. Any man with pride is gonna talk a girls pants off, beat them at their own game, so to speak.
l337pwnage 2 years ago
The written just came from the next step of provable acceptance. People are saying, by default, that body language is unacceptable, even tho humans use only body language in many cases. They are moving the 'burden of proof' up to the verbal, so I figure take it to the next step, written. For the step above that, we can use a notary public. Of course, all this is me being facetious, but I figure it helps make the point. ;)
l337pwnage 2 years ago
Furthermore (ran out of character count).
Beastiality is the fetish, zoophilia isnt as it doesnt even involve sex many times.
You are mislabeling the terms and argue like a creationist.. Give me some real solid arguements please.
KarinMikazuki 2 years ago
""Im in it for the same reason that I would support gay marriage""
You're putting them both in the same category and that is comparing them as equal. You can't say one thing and ignore that a few minutes later.
Having sex with animals is wrong, unethical and sick..that's it! No more argument.
lordabomity 2 years ago
I repeat, I didnt compare the beastiality and gay marriage in the way you discribed (look at your original comment).. I said that I support both in the same way which is completely diffrent because I believe in freedom for people.
So dont twist my arguements please..
You then end it all off with a big arguement from emotion at best.. otherwise just your bald assertion.
You need an actually well constructed valid arguement to make zoophilia illegal.
KarinMikazuki 2 years ago
I don't need any other argument then that its is unethical. And yes, that argument derives from an emotional standpoint. But you also argument from an emotional standpoint..."At best" So what is your point?
And I didn't twist anything, I merely conceive what you say as it is.
Would you accept that I would want murder to be legal just because I believe in freedom for people. Would you accept that as a valid argument??
I don't think so. And if you don't than you're nothing but a hypocrite.
lordabomity 2 years ago
Your arguements just get worse and worse.. its really sad.
Prove its unethical?
If the animal and human wants it, who are you to say its wrong and shouldnt be done, the burden is on you to restrict what people want to do in the privacy in their own homes when they dont harm anyone or anything.
Are you SERIOUSLY comparing murder with sex? Argueably consented sex if animal behavior is really studied instead of labelled tabu and unconsentable.
and now I am a hypocrite for no reason.. lol
KarinMikazuki 2 years ago
First of all you claim that the animal wants it which you can not prove.. my dog probably wants to eat only candy instead of real food...but I don't fucking let him do i because its bad for him..
And yes, you've just proved that your a hypocrite!
I think its unethical because I believe that it is.
Why don't YOU prove that is IS ethical with
lordabomity 2 years ago
To your first really bad arguement..
Here is a perfect example why you're wrong.. the dog mounts its master, are you telling me that the dog in that moment doesnt want to but does it anyway... beeeccaaaause?
Your analogy is flawed though because sex is good for the health, most pets die as virgins you know.
You end it off with claiming I have to prove why your personal opinion isnt universal..
You can answear that yourself by watching Atheist Experience lol..
You arent very impressive.
KarinMikazuki 2 years ago
First of all, YOU'RE the one telling ME that I have to prove why my personal opinion is universal. Which I btw never claimed. You cant do something and then say I'm wrong for doing the same.. Again, you're a fucking hypocrite. You keep arguing like a 6 year old.. So tell me now why you think it's ethical.
And if you care that much about virgin animals than why not let them fuck other animals of the same species instead of humans?? Do you have any idea how pathetic your arguments are?
lordabomity 2 years ago
You really are full of yourself aren't you. Why am I not impressive? Do I have a need to be impressive? No I don't. Especially not in your eyes. Do you really think I give a shit about what you think I am or not? Get over yourself..
I never said that the dog didn't want it. I said "my dog probably wants to eat only candy instead of real food...but I don't fucking let him do I because its bad for him"
Who's twisting things now?
lordabomity 2 years ago
ab hom, lovely, im done with you
KarinMikazuki 2 years ago
Peace
lordabomity 2 years ago
what if its consensual. lol! just kidding.
Yesitis808 2 years ago
.. xD
lordabomity 2 years ago
I seldom feel proud over my country but after watching this video I was, at least in that respect
LaoDecmius 2 years ago 2
Bestiality doesn't necessarily harm an animal. But if people are so worried about the sexual treatment of cows, then why not go vegan? Slaughter is far worse than having an orgasm. At least go organic!
SpazzzDog 2 years ago
Why bestiality was legalized the same time as gay marriage was legalized was because both gay sexuality and bestially was but in the same "paragraph" when the law forbid it. So when they made that paragraph legal again, bestiality automatically became legal. But I think They have fixed that mistake now lol.
/ Proud Swed =)
(God can hate us as much as he like! HAHA)
To the caller. Really nice hear a swed call in to these guys. So cudos for that mate.
To bad mass-immigration is killing us =/
lordabomity 2 years ago 2
What do you mean that we fixed that mistake?
Beastiality is still fully legal here, both in pornography or active engagement in it..
However many asshats try to sue people for animal abuse when they find out about someone.. which is absurd in some cases if you've seen the size of an erect horse penis.
(Mr Hands)
just saying.
KarinMikazuki 2 years ago
I wrote that I "think" we've fixed it. But thanks for making us look good......
lordabomity 2 years ago
well dra åt helvetet for being so closed minded..
Zoophilia should be legal
KarinMikazuki 2 years ago
Haha. bra swengeska där du lol.. Och nej zoopjilia är sjukt. But if you want to be fucked by animal cocks, that's your choice.
lordabomity 2 years ago
You got poor insults, no im not personally interested in zoophilia.. Besides I even got a boyfriend anyway.
So other than your personal opinion that zoophilia is "sick" which is used against gay marriage by the christian fundies too..
You dont really have a leg to stand on.
Freedom FTW
KarinMikazuki 2 years ago
If you're not in to it then why do you support it? Gay marriage should be legel, sex with animals should not.
So you think it's ok for someone to fuck a cat in the ass, which most likely will kill the cat btw.
That's like saying its ok to have sex with infants.
lordabomity 2 years ago
Ok you made 2 absurd claims
1. Im in it for the same reason that I would support gay marriage, I am not gay but I support freedom of mankind
2. Of course that wouldnt be okay and you know it, that would be considered animal abuse to the highest degree.
Sex with infants isnt alright either for obvious reasons.
Btw, zoophilia isnt just about sex either
KarinMikazuki 2 years ago
Oh so you support bestiality because you believe in freedom of mankind?? I asked you why you support it and that is the only answer you gave. What about animal rights?
If you support bestiality for the same reason you support gay marriage I hope you realize that you've just compared gay people with people who wants to have sex with animals....way to go...
And zoophilia is only about sex and sexual fantasies.
lordabomity 2 years ago
Ok you made another series of falsehoods yet again, I wonder why you bother.. lets dissect it.
Yes I believe in freedom of mankind to do as they wish with animals given that neither are harmed.
So that covers animal rights aswell yet again, most animals wants to bone their masters actually (this is tabu and not highlighted when argued).
I didnt compare the beastiality and gay marriage in the way you discribed.. I said that I support both in the same way because I believe in freedom for ppl
KarinMikazuki 2 years ago
why do there calls sound so good like there really there
thesparitan 2 years ago
NIce song!
Domzdream 2 years ago
Oh god please don't mention the British royal familily... It's so embarrasing that we still have one... :(
RodHullIOnceWasHim 2 years ago 3
After this caller, there was a mass emigration of rural Welshmen to Sweden.
PPartisan 2 years ago 2
I want to call you a stuck up Southern twat, but unfortunately that joke is very funny. (Also works with Aberdeenshire.)
PurushaDesa 2 years ago
the reason more dominant species kill and eat other animals is for survival. humans having sex with an animals is just for pleasure. but then again, if animals had the choice to be raped for the pleasure of humans or killed and eaten i think they would opt not to be slaughtered to death. but if we're using the premise that animals have the minds to make such decisions maybe they would actually enjoy having sex with humans. very perplexing.
Freakshow572 2 years ago 2
Yeah if you can be homo, why can´t you be animalomo... LoL. not far from there to be honest! Homos say they love eachother i bet some pet owners will say the same :S...................
Inmatinus 2 years ago
There's a bit of difference between two sentient, cognizant consenting adults of the same species and raping animals. Your assertion that they aren't far from each other illustrates that you can't even get the lines between species straight and have no understanding on what consent and cognizance means when it comes to sexual partners. Your argument falls insanely short and I can't believe it took 17 hours for someone to point out how stupid you are.
Russlem 2 years ago 3
You have enlighten me! I now know animals act less animal compared to humans ! And well i do know the lines between species. Evolution act like it don´t. :). And like it seem you missed the main point in my comment. I bet homos love eachother, i also bet pet owners and the pets love eachother!
Love have no bounderies! *sarcasm*
Inmatinus 2 years ago
Was there any English in that? And no, I didn't say anything about animals acting animal compared to human, I said domesticated pets lack cognizance. I didn't "miss" anything in your post, you can't tell the difference between sexual attraction and platonic attraction, even if its sarcasm you sound like an idiot.
Russlem 2 years ago 9
This comment has received too many negative votes show
You seem angry. Is your dad Gay?
Cuythulu 2 years ago
First question: No. 2th: No.
How can i be angry? If someone choose to be gay why should i be angry its their life, if they wanna choose a path like that go ahead but you better realise what you do before you do it.
Inmatinus 2 years ago
Being gay is not a choice, and animals are not citizens far as I know. And I bet you can´t name one reason being gay is bad for anyone.
Cuythulu 2 years ago 32
For a person who embrace evolution: nothing wrong or bad but from a naturistic perspective, silly.
For a christian: Life or death etc.
Inmatinus 2 years ago
What? So you can´t quote any good reason being gay efects you in a negative way.
Cuythulu 2 years ago 2
I just did.
Inmatinus 2 years ago
@Cuythulu Well I've heard a few but it's all just a bunch of horse shit based on religious bias.
MovieFinatic456 1 year ago
@Cuythulu If animals are not citizens then we aren't citizens either.
jshjamaarify 1 year ago
@Cuythulu
Breeding/Family problems.
NormanAngle 11 months ago
@Cuythulu male rape?
centretotheleft 9 months ago
@Cuythulu
Although I agree it's not a choice, I can name a lot of reasons being gay is bad for someone; they are discriminated, they are excluded from marriage, they can't have children etc.
LanteanKnight 9 months ago
@LanteanKnight Your reasons are cultural problems and that is the whole point, we are trying to change that culture, and yes, gay people can and do reproduce all the time, Teddy Haggard has like 6 children.
Cuythulu 9 months ago 2
My bigotry alert just went off big time.
Nix ~ doesn't understand how any one could make that comparison with the proverbial straight face.
nixonfanatic 2 years ago
I wonder if Europe's lack of real strong Christianity makes it easier for Muslims to subvert it. Even though I am a non-believer,. as a practical matter I'm rather more fearful of radical islam than the pale christianity outside the U.S. I don't think we will have the same problem here with Muslim separatists because we are better at assimilating (they would say subverting) the youth.
JonKevinCherry 2 years ago 2
I'd have to agree with you that radical Islam at the moment is a greater threat than the "pale Christianity" as you put it. I don't think this is an issue of assimilation so much as there is a massive competition in Europe among the countries threatened by Islam for banking rights to their oil money. Indeed socially, Islam is far from a threat, its politically where there is a real threat because politicians are trying to convince Muslim oil money to bank through their economies.
Russlem 2 years ago
Yes. Islam, for this reason, finds it easier to bully the people into bending backwards for them. If you haven't seen Pat Condell's videos on Islam, YOU MUST SEE IT. He's a VERY intelligent Atheist who lives in the UK, and he talked about Islam A LOT! Just search for Pat Condell on youtube and find his home page.
raby760 2 years ago 3
Yes, Pat Condell's videos are fantastic. His message isn't that Islam is bullying their way in by force, they are extorting political systems of countries who are economically dependent on banking (like Britain, the Netherlands, etc) using their money to buy legislation favorable only to their minority groups, and many of his videos are in response to legislation passed in these countries that make any secularist's stomach turn.
Russlem 2 years ago 2
I was being metaphoric, but that was what I was trying to say. I bully people in poker but it's not with force.
raby760 2 years ago
To clarify I wasn't disagreeing with you, just expanding on the content of Pat's videos to support my previous post.
Russlem 2 years ago
Since we're on this subject, another thing to check out is the way Islam has an greater implied population by having a lot more children in Europe than the average non Islamic family. So if every Islamic family has more than 6 kids, then in the future Islam is predicted to be the major religion, and in a democracy, they will have a greater voice, which will actually take away more rights from the non-Islamics.
raby760 2 years ago
That is a scary thought, then again in a 1st world country education is mandatory and as the patricianatheist likes to say, reason is the enemy of religion. The employers will be properly educated and if the Muslim majority only has a sub-basic religious education it will only be a matter of time before social Darwinism kicks in. Maybe I'm being optimistic though.
Russlem 2 years ago
But not every islamic family has 6 kids.
Even if first generation immigrants have 6 kids, those kids do not have the same birthrate. When third generation rolls around, there is no difference any more between "original" and immigrant populations birthrate.
LeafHuntress 2 years ago
Not every family does, but what if the majority do? I agree with what you said about the future generations. I was raised by Hindu parents and I live in a Hindu and Muslim area of NY (I'm an Atheist). My sister is dating a guy who was raised by Muslim parents, but he's more of an Agnostic, and disagrees with Islam. The point is, if he feels this way, hopefully children raised in our societies would feel this way too, and won't conform to the ideas of their parents. There's always hope.
raby760 2 years ago 3
In Germany a lot of church costs are carried by the state with regular tax money. The churches get church tax that is collected by the state from members of the religions and handed over, but the state is additionally obligated to pay salaries, maintenance, renovations, training, construction and gets no taxes because of the exemptions. All in all billions per year.
blackwolf1272 2 years ago
what is the name of the song at the beginning?
12outland12 2 years ago
In Finland you can leave the state church, but if you own a business, you are still forced to pay tax to the church. It's absurd.
ObakeOnna 2 years ago
Paying taxes for maintaining any churches is only voluntary in Europe (at least for the countries I know).
JennyFarlopez 2 years ago
I can fuck pigs? I didnt know :D sweden ftw. lol just kiddin.
Cellsplitter 2 years ago
It is hypocritical. You can kill animals, but sex is off-limits.
TheDemonataLeader 2 years ago 3
Thats quite an interesting thought :D
therock27374 2 years ago
sorry, wanted to thumb up but i misclicked and thumbed down... :-(
LeafHuntress 2 years ago
We have a "state religion", all I can say NO THANKS!
Unfortunately all citizens of Croatia are FORCED to pay taxes to RCC (RomanCatholicChurch)
even though there are different religions and Atheists.
We even "sold our soul" :) to the devil with crazy contract that state is OBLIGATED to pay ALL church expenses.
We are poor country and crisis is killing us but RCC demands around 50 million euro per year to cover "expenses" and they pay NO TAXES!
sahardoom 2 years ago 3