Near miss w jet

[Diegohilario3]

melo o bumbum

[1123359]

Luckiest person ever

[coma13794]

If a low level MTR is hot and you're a civilian pilot transitioning the area, then fly above it. They're only good up to 1500' AGL if memory serves.

[Dakers11]

I swallowed my gum! Can anybody tell me what just happened?

[11past2]

"Oh my gosh! ... ... ... ... Ok, let's go home."

[olegunnarsolskjaer99]

that was fucking close

[mustanglead]

That could have been real messy.. I tell you what, if you think that was close pay real close attention to that thing at 36-37 seconds.

[jmillski1]

what did the pilot/navigator say?

[quinnjim]

There are a lot of "near miss" videos on youtube....but this is one of the few that really is a near miss. WOW!

[MegaBuckBuck1]

I too think it was a Baron. And I think I woulda crapped in my flight suit! That was CLOSE!

[torch39]

Was this in a MOA? R-2508 in Calif is saturated with incursions.

[tjodalv44]

I guess he didn't get a TCAS RA because he was in A/G master mode. I think it only works in NAV. But I'm assuming the jet had TCAS installed, which it might not have. I'm not sure if it came with the C upgrade or if it was separate.

[pullchocks72]

T-38 was on a VR MTR. These are depicted on all sectionals. Non participating aircraft are recommended to cross these at 90 degree angles to reduce time in the MTR. Exactly what this light Twin (looks like a Beech Baron) did. Whoever was flying the light twin, if they did proper flight planning, should have expected military aircraft from that direction at those altitudes. They can easily call the controlling agency prior to flying get info on MTR training that day. Transiting SUA is legal.

[sigmet25]

There was no time manuver out of the was, VFR was NOT being followed. They may have been in the pattern because it is showing a magnetic heading of 327 degrees and altitude looks like its 3500 feet. This would be a violation of direction of flight altitudes because pilot should be holding an even altitude plus 500 feet. The "tweet" is proceeding east bound and is at the correct altitude.

[MasonPilot06]

@sigmet25

Your an idiot. PLEASE people...stop talking unless you actually know what your talking about. First off "VFR was not being followed" makes no sense. What you're meaning to say is Cardinal Cruising altitudes are not being followed. But your wrong, You are not supposed to obey those unless you are above 3,000 ft. AGL. They are below that, they are at 1,500 MSL. So cardinal cruising altitudes are not "in effect". And I have no idea what you mean by "Tweet". There is no T-37 lol

[sigmet25]

@MasonPilot06 VFR was not being followed = visual flight rules was not being followed --- makes perfect sense, and was correct. This is a discussion on what occured in the vid, not an opportunityfor you to make up for all the times your daddy made you feel like a little girl.

[sigmet25]

@MasonPilot06---Im not sure why you find yourself to be the posting cop for this video but I thought you might like to know I had a formal change of opinion. If its "OK" with you Id like to post that I now think this is on a VR route due to the comment made by the pilot "opening up a flight plan", this would be done w/ FSS and it might not be a tweet, could be a light civilian with nonretractable gear.

[skipplet]

@sigmet25 The T-38 in the video is on a low level route indicated by Air to Ground master mode, 670 ft AGL, and his airspeed.

[contrail25]

@skipplet THIS. Glad someone else gets it. :)

[bradporky16]

do they have clean replacement underwear in those fancy pressure suits?

[bobbelsekwol]

i think i would of turned around and followed this jet and smacked him one. unless it was my fault ,then i would of bought him a drink and said sorry.

[skazhiprivet]

TCAS would have been good to have here.

[devinodonnell2]

hahah i remember this from the aircraft owner and pilot association "Know before ya go airspace" interactive course

[reeledit]

"let's go home"  ......... wise words... i would agree after a scare like that.

[ferrabras]

After the plane passed what's the point in changing direction.... :)

[mattman1515]

near miss means you hit him but nearly missed... that was a near hit :)

[artagus21]

Looks like one of the VR routes west of San Antonio, towards Uvalde.

Don't you hate it when another airplane 'decloaks' in front of you?

[tryithere]

C'mon that was at least 10 feet

[12jjdfn]

just to let everyone know, i was squaking, we were in a baron, and it was a low level military training route outside San Antonio... and trust me when i say we said "lets go home, also!!!"

[doolittleraid]

Glad you survived to write about it!

[jwboll]

@12jjdfn

that was you?

wow!

1,5000 feet altitude?

missed by about 40 feet?

give your wife and kids the map to the buried treasure next time you fly around there!

[jwalsh8]

did anyone else see the near birdstrike at 0:37 ... go to 0:35 and watch

[Tovkal]

Let's go home!. 0:42

[killingamps]

Looks to me like the crossing traffic was a low wing, fixed gear....Saratoga, or Commanche? Either way, that was pretty durned close!

[denelson83]

Uh, no TCAS?

[rpazda]

Actually this particular jet was on a military training route and at fault in this near miss is the Cessna pilot because according to FAA recommendation marked military training routes should be crossed at as close to a 90 degree angle as possible so as to lessen the possibility of collision. This pilots angle of attack was much to wide and he should have been more alert. As said below it is very difficult if not impossible for a fighter pilot to see a small oncoming plane.

[fholbert]

Both pilots shared in the blame. 50/50!

[JPH1786]

All of you people who are saying shit like "the military should look out for civillian planes", well the military shouldn't have to. That's why they have MOAs, to have some kind of protected airspace to train in without having to watch out for people buzzing around in a 152.

[rrpilot]

MOA's are CIVILIAN airspace! They aren't military exclusive airspace were never meant to be. To quote from FAR part 1: "A MOA is airspace established outside of Class A airspace to separate or segregate certain NON-HAZARDOUS military activities from IFR traffic and to identify for VFR traffic where these activities are conducted." Military traffic gets no special treatment and flys by by the same rules as my Cessna, if they wanna dogfight they need to fly in Restricted or Prohibited airspace.

[holmesjeh]

yes MOA's are CIVILIAN airspace... although you'd be a complete asshole to fly in them because as a military pilot I can tell you we can't see your piece of shit Cessna when we are flying around at 500 kts... so if you want to die just fly on in, we'll be fine though because we have ejection seats:)

[rrpilot]

Glancing at a sectional will show that many MOA's are too large to be circumnavigated by the average 150kt light plane, I can think of a few airports that lie inside MOA's...how should a civilian plane get there?, You can be as arrogant as you like, the regulations are very clear, military traffic is not relieved of VFR see and avoid inside an MOA, so after you join the Martin Baker fan club you can defend your loss of a multimillion dollar plane and reckless flying at court martial, good luck.

[holmesjeh]

You need to watch that video again, I don't see any reckless flying in it. When you are flying at 350 kcas your ground speed can be upwards of 420. It has nothing to do with military pilots being reckless, its simply that the Cessna 172 is small and slow, no bigger than a bug until its too late. As far as you flying through MOA's, here's an idea... fly under them! Oh and if I joined the MB fan club, I'd still be alive and you'd be a cloud of red vapor.

[rrpilot]

I always make sure to be in radio contact with the controlling agency. What I object to is the attitude that I've seen from some military that 'we don't need to worry about VFR because were military', thats just not true. VFR is the same rules for all of us, if you cant remain VFR that phase should be conducted in a restricted area, you don't wanna hit me and I don't wanna hit you either...BTW what service do you fly for?

[charlieechovictor]

on't forget you started on these shitty cessna's... they brought you to were you are

[2003UNC]

HE WAS NOT IN A MOA! It was a military training route, outside of San Antonio.

[reichec]

Looked like a 421

[vrettos88]

fuk me thats crazy shit

[fiskalito]

Man, lets go home...

[tendonplucker]

that was actually a double near miss... check the bird at 0:37

[Heyheyheyhobo]

wanting new friends

this video was good m5

[thebloody1]

I work at Vance AFB. We protect the MOAs from IFR traffic, via altitude seperation by having the civilian traffic at a specific alt. or by caping the pilot in the MOA at a certain alt. VFR traffic we could care less about we have alot else going on, we advise you that your entering a MOA and give you the working Alt's if you want to go in it your choice. Were not going to provide any seperation or even try.

[joyfuldoc]

Most NMACs in MOAs are the fault of the civilian pilot, but sometimes it's the military flight that is at fault.

Example: If you're going to make an unrestricted climb at 20,000 FPM under a busy arrival corridor, squawk ON for a while so my flight attendants aren't injured during the RA and evasive maneuver! Same goes for practice intercepts- there are times when you shouldn't be on my TCAS....

[n118nw]

As a pilot, MOA's don't worry me; the military should be looking out for the civilian's that enter that airspace.. but the civilian aircraft does not need to be under ATC control. For IFR traffic, ATC directs most civilian traffic around the MOA, but VFR traffic is free to go right through... so again, VFR traffic is not obligated to be under ATC control (unless in Class B, C, or D airspace (and certain parts of other airspaces as well)

[Kentuckyhorse1]

not true

[distantsky8]

It's said this is an Air Force TRNG Video. In any regards, the other possibility is that the MIL Jet purposely Intercepted the Plane as a Target of Interest and Intercepted it with the "obvious" minimum spacing shown. I used to be intercepted all the time while learning to fly when I was at ERAU by F-18's and F-15's near Barstow, it was a great sight, I must admit never this close but with a 100-200 foot Vertical separation. They always pegged the Interception so I know it was done intentionally

[joyfuldoc]

The other aircraft is obviously not military. It's a single-engine civil aircraft- possibly a Commander. The angle of convergence appears to be just over 90 degrees too- not anything close to what you would see in an intentional intercept.

[redshirt012]

that looks scary!

[pOsTaLxL]

aahh...To Civilian Pilots: STAY OUT OF FUCKING ACTIVE MOA'S!

[starlinestudios]

true..but military. Please stop actiavting so many MOAs

[pOsTaLxL]

Fuck your Couch....

[data130111]

How did they not possibly see that or why were they not at least given a traffic conflict call from ATC?

[Pimpmastahanhduece]

"you guys are reckless 'jawsnap'"-ice

[xlqex]

I think aviation comes out on top of motoring if you look at accidents per user.

Maybe flying is safer because there's a lot of space, and so there's plenty of room for error.

[xlqex]

Flying is safer than driving. However that doesn't mean that it's completely safe, and it doesn't mean that there aren't silly people.

[tomchambo]

fuckin retard he hd the righter way.

[b1cc2]

who's the "fuckin retard" here? What the Fuck is a "righter way"?! OMG you're dumb!! Thanks for making my day, douchebag.

[kratos32godofwar]

fucking hell!!!!

[xxtalitha]

is this real??

[donlightbody]

hey Tap02, you're a retard! and even if they did, I guess it wouldn't matter since it wasn't an airliner. go climb back in your mom, your not done yet. lol

[RamboVital]

You know when you almost lost it when you can see the numbers on the tail of the aircraft that just missed you. Man.. that was to close.... I would say the same dam thing. Man, their hearts have to be going a million miles a second.

[Tap02]

it's this guy's fault airliners have the right of way always

[franktbird]

nice comment idiot.

sounds like you know what your talking about.

lol

[majhankee]

Thumbs up for you!

[majhankee]

Learn what you're talking about first. Ever heard of ATC, Restricted Airspace, and so on and so forth?

[duckfool]

Are you kidding me?

[rhroberts1]

yeah he was confused!? not the moron civilian flying in a MOA. but, thanks for you smart falcon 5.0 lingo.

[nicklking]

damn! looked like a cherokee! To think of the combined speed...and then miss an aircraft by that much is freaking insane!!! I wonder who took responsibilty?

[mithat87]

According to international air law, aircraft must give way to other aircraft on their right. (unless the a/c on the right is a glider/ a/c engaged in towing operations or banners etc).. therefore it was the white jets fault. (But the jet we were looking at must also take evasive action ofcourse)... both at fault i believe, but white jet is more at fault.

[stardust79mars]

very scary indeed

[SenorSpode]

So, did they bust the bastard?

[trechan]

seems like CCIP was started and ready for bombing

[swishfunny]

its funny how "near hit" and "near miss" are interchangable and miss and hit have opposite meanings.

[CLK15]

I wouldn't have wanted to be the guy who had to clean the poo out of the Talon's cockpit....scary

[SPQRTempus]

So what was the aircraft that went past? Some people think its a Cherokee but to my eyes it looks more like a Rockwell Commander. I've had a close call at a much lower closure rate and believe me its pretty scary. Certainly nothing to laugh about.

[C0mdot]

wowzers

[nach657]

very close!!! did he say san angelo tx. man i used to fly around there. those damn air force pilots. watch out for b-1's too

[obezana]

close

[mitchbarker]

man that was close ay!

[mrblack61]

"hey lets go home!" ROF! =)

[ttdantt10384]

Goodness Gracious me, did you bloody see dat Sanjay...

[MistaEks]

All that technology... and it cant tell you theres plane nearby... jeesus!

[SmoothCriminalAaron]

Why do they Call it a Neat miss If they Don't Hit??? They Nearly Missed??? It should be called a near hit. If they Crashed but Almost Got away then They Should call it a near miss.

[Dejablue630]

Lmao, you're right!

[Ultranothing]

Jerry Seinfeld, everyone :)

[marneydog]

That was not a near miss it was a near HIT.

[landroversrs1]

Looked like a Beechcraft Barron light twice, they dont come much closer than that!

[Dingydong83]

Plus, everyone here that is actually a pilot knows that if you are on a collision course with another aircraft, they are stationary on your canopy, making them EXTREMEMLY difficult to see since the human eye usually picks up relative motion to spot things. This is just a case of the "Big Sky Theory" coming dangerously close to being proven wrong.

[Dingydong83]

If the GA aircraft was squawking, the T-38 would likely have picked him up on his TCAS and climbed to avoid conflict. However, those of you falting the traffic scan of either pilot have probably never had a such a close call. At the closure rates experienced between these two pilots it's likely they had less than 5 seconds to react if the spotted them right away.

[Dingydong83]

To clarify for the people who haven't seen this in a safety briefing or pilot meeting, this was a T-38C on a low-level route. There was no violation of airspace on either aircraft's part since most low-level routes are not protected airspace.

[delta472]

hey whats a 'rival message'?

[Derkaderk13]

Yeah what was that at 37 seconds it was under the jet I cant tell what it is

[atenco01]

Bird, looks like...2 near misses within 43 seconds, flying is Dangerous down there in Texas, boys....

[BB10Pilot]

Lol "OMG" "I have the aircraft!" "YOU HAVE THE AIRCRAFT!" Glad to see the instructor take informative action just a split second after. I love the Pilot/Co-pilot lingo in flight training it's so great. Glad to see they are OK...Folks, make sure to scan the horizon especially in a MOA..Dang!

[bringyourownbombs78]

there was something goin very fast at 37sec

[Chronologger]

ROFLMAO "OH MY GOD!" ROFL

[HSJJSJJS]

yes akrain i saw sumfin doing +++mach in front of them at 36

[arkain21]

Did anyone else notice another object fly in front of them at 36-37 seconds ? It looks like a large bird of some sort.

[RobertGary1]

Whether they were in a MOA, an IR route or even IFR the military pilot is *STILL* required to see-and-avoid other aircraft. In class E ATC only guarantees separation between IFR and IFR aircraft, not IFR and VFR.

-Robert, CFII

[aviator8a8]

The 38 did have the right of way but both pilots should have maintained a better VFR scan. If the military wanted an area to be restricted than they could make it restricted. MOAs and training routes are not restricted (or prohibited) and therefore open to all aviators, so get off your high horse.

[BlackHawk322]

that small plane looks like a beachcraft baron 58. and holy crap that was close

[mikeportnoy84]

Paused at 21 secs. and it looks like a small Beechcraft to me.Still very lucky though.

[homer090]

IMO thats not a jet its too small, if you look just under the nose it look like what could be a nose wheel, i may be mistaken it may be an engine, but i think its too small to be a jet

[malicula]

Jay, you ROCK!

[ricardo2004]

Thats what you get when you run a red light!

[aviatortrevor]

It may have been a military IR VR route. niether one was IFR or participating in ATC services, and because of the low altitude, they may not have been within radar coverage anyway. Nobody broke any rules, and it's no-one's fault. they just need to exercise more frequent traffic scanning, and it's easy for me to dish out the judgement, but getting distracted happens to all of us.

[Staubb00]

damn, pucker factor of 10.  stay out of the MOA when it's hot dammit

[fiveninerzero]

Staying out of a MOA or a low level military training route really means nothing to the VFR private pilot!

[scottsside]

this has got to be pretty old.. the runway at Goodfellow AFB (San Angelo) has been closed for at least 12 years.

[scottsside]

ahh nevermind date is at start.. maybe from san angelo's civil airport.

[Sleepy198181]

First of all, this is a T-38C, not an F-5. C-models do have CCIP pippers.

For the incident in UPT/IFF you fly low level routes on designated routes, 500' AGL. However these routes are VFR, and everybody has the same right to be there.

[geoffinak]

B 2s can go down to 50 feet in time of war. From 20,000 to 100 feet in 2 minutes flying mach .95

[Jamesnutt1988]

uh huh, you call this low level? he's at almost 1,600ft!!! ok the radar alt is 700, but still, the RAF fly at 250ft routinely and then they go low level which take em down to 100ft....

[RobertGary1]

I'm not sure how people are able to "suppose" he's in a MOA or restricted area or anything. He could be anywhere. Sucks that the TCAS didn't alarm though. We share a lot of airspace below 18,000 feet.

[jwebley]

sorry for the repost

[jwebley]

whoa, chill out. This is a Low level training mission. One of the few times that Military aircraft wont operate on an Instrument clearrance. This is one of those gray areas that somtimes happen and both pilots have just as much right to be in that place. The low level routes arent "owned" by anyone they are considered MOAs. The 38 technically has the right of way because they are on the right, but both pilots have the responsibilty to "see and avoid" other aircraft.

[jwebley]

whoa, chill out. This is a Low level training mission. One of the few times that Military aircraft wont operate on an Instrument clearance. This is one of those gray areas that somtimes happen and both pilots have just as much right to be in that place. The low level routes arent "owned" by anyone they are considered MOAs. Its on both aircraft to see and avoid under these conditions. Technically the 38 has the right of way because they are on the right.

[brendankevinsmith]

I would love to get my hands on the original, non-compressed digital video file. It looks like a great archival piece. If it is an original piece of footage, then the contributor will be willing to disclose the source of this footage.

[videohuggy]

Not fake: this gets showed to military pilots during safety briefings.

[topmarks]

obviously fake

[Staubb00]

wo! and that is why you stay out of the MOA when it's hot

[bogart345]

well at least he had the decency to not have potty mouth.

[TonyWilliams123]

Below 3000 feet, a VFR aircraft can be at any altitude they want. It's in the regs. Also, the general aviation plane was not a Piper Cherokee, but most likely a Piper Twin Commanche.

[faabound]

Or I don't know maybe a T-37 trainer with what looks like "RA" on the tail for Randolph Air Force base Texas. Further backed up bu the fact that the Randolph AV Flight made the film.

[hornetball]

Half of you sound like 50 hour private pilots. Shut up and keep your salty commentary to yourself. ~Hornet Guy

[faabound]

Agreed! Particularly the "wrong hemispheric altitude for flight criers". Since that only applies above 3000 agl!

[TonyWilliams123]

The video starts out by identifying the T38C.You ask in the singular, "was the pilot busted?" Which pilot? The military T38C trainee pilot (and instructor in the back seat) or the general aviation pilot? With good visibilty, both airplanes straight and level. It's quite likely that neither aircraft were IFR (instrument flight rules) at 1500 feet. We can surmise from the voice that the T38C was on an VR route, picking out landmarks, like that hill they mention.

[gtrslinger]

seriously,no one gives a shit lol

[gtrslinger]

hah stupid asssholes

[TonyWilliams123]

Below 3000 feet above ground level, the pilot or a VFR aircraft can be at any altitude they want, which exceptions for populated areas, obstructions, etc. No, it most likely was a Piper twin Commanche. It has two wing mounted engines.

[askdslhsda]

since when does a T-38 have a CCIP pipper? And yes, that plane was most lilely a Piper Cherokee.

[aflack]

Actually thats an Air Force F-5 which is capable of Air to Ground Bombing. Strictly Used as a trainer! Good Eyes However on calling the Piper! I concur with your judgement there!

[mechan9]

H O L Y SHIT that was a close one. Was it a small GA aircraft? Was the pilot ever busted for it?

[aflack]

Looks to me that the F-5 Pilot was not flying VFR Altitudes! Course 325 he should of been flying at even thousands +500 "2500, 4500, etc etc" but he is flying at 1500 ft! Unless he was in a designated Military Operations Area or Bomb Range! Looks to me that He was the one out of line for two reasons, 1 not flying VFR courses and Altitudes, 2 not maintaining Situational Awareness!

[BE36pilot]

Probably not since he didn't do anything wrong except fly through a Military Operating Area. I would not fly through a MOA when it was hot unless I was in radar contact with the controlling facility, but it is legal.

[TonyWilliams123]

He could be in a charted Restricted Area, on a VR route, in an MOA, or just motoring along in Class E or G airspace. We don't know.

[BE36pilot]

Tony,

True he could be in one of Alert Area's, A-640 probably outside of Hondo. There are a lot of MOA's around Randolph and Laughin for training. And you can bet when I was in that area a couple of years ago I was talking to Houston Center and stayed out of both Alert and MOA's.

[dougapepper]

way too close...