Halloween

[tuzlaruja]

Halloween is more Catholic than Pagan.

Although this video bears a grain of truth regarding the Celtic influence on this holiday, please read this more informative, well-constructed, clearly informative and a bit more accurate article by Father Augustine Thompson, O.P. called "Halloween: The Real Story!" at Crossroads Initiative.

This is also excellent apologetic material.

[Jacksonholenativ]

Leave it to the Catholic Church to twist the truth and lie about the Celts. Samhain (now Halloween) the day when the veil between this world & the spirit world was celebrated as the thinnest, was forceably changed by the Catholic Church throughout the middle ages and the day was replaced with All Hallows Eve which preceded All Saints Day, a holiday that the Catholics imposed on the Celtic people. The Catholic Church loves to play a negative light on something that they just could not control.

[nessunopassato]

@Jacksonholenativ relook at history, we didnt force anyone to doing anything. they converted, and in order to be Catholic, you must ACT Catholic, which includes giving up the rituals and believes that would otherwise go against God and make every effort useless. Blessed be Saint Patrick

[Jacksonholenativ]

That's such crap nessunopassato. The Catholic Church is guilty of immense sins during the Crusades and the Inquisition. Some Popes have been amazing and wonderful and others have been horrific bloody tyrants. The Catholic religion has a mix of both the beautiful and the ugly. It's authoritarian force was forced upon millions of people throughout Europe. Why do you think that people were burned at the stake? The Catholic Church was behind that.

[nessunopassato]

@Jacksonholenativ I would realy hope you explore history very carefully, as most murders, wars, etc. are started for the exact opposite reason stated. What I stated is True, not BS. as you could only be truly Catholic, if you live life following Jesus. that is the up most importance and has been our teaching since His Life! simply because someone claims they act in the name of the Lord, does not make it so.

[bdeaner]

When the early Christians set out to convert the Pagans, they discovered conversion was easier if they adopted Pagan customs and traditions. Easter, for example, is tied into the pagan holiday Ostara because it is celebrated on the first Sunday after the first full moon after the vernal or spring equinox. Most of its rituals -- bunnies, eggs, baskets, etc. -- have roots in the pagan holiday it replaced. It is dumb to criticize Halloween for the same reason it is stupid to criticize Easter.

[bdeaner]

Very Christian of you, to go around denigrating others because they have a different opinion of yours. Maybe you are pretty clueless when it comes to the facts of history, in the face of which any idiot would realize, ALL Christian holidays have pagan roots. Adopting the rituals of pagan holidays has been a tradition of the Church since the very beginning.

[havock89]

Thats not technically true. All christian festivals were chosen to be celebrated on days that were pagan festivals as part of the inculcation process of the culture (thankfully) but the source of christian festivals came from the church and its traditions and teachings. Mere calendar dates adopted were not important beyond the de-emphasizatio of paganism.

[baaasienkaaa]

are you CATHOLIC agency? or devil? focus on catholic holidays and Pope!

[havock89]

The catholic faith does not focus on holidays and the pope. They just are a part of our chuch institution and liturgy of God.

The catholic faith focus' on repentance, living lives of grace, deepening our faith and encountering Christ Jesus everyway we can, especially in the eucharist.

The pope is equal in dignity to me in the eyes of God. He is a servant of God, just as I am, albeit a far better servant than I am, but I continue to persevere for my Lord and God.

[Darkmatter28031]

haloween s a day to laugh at the devil :D

[havock89]

yeah thats one way to look at it :)

[Joemantler]

Its a secular celebration, not any holiday. Consider less than 100 years a winter meant a time of cold, starvation, isolation, disease and dark! Having some social celebration is natural to stave off the fear of these things. Like Scooby Doo, the 'lesson' of modern Halloween is that once the masks come off there really is nothing to be afraid of.

If you want a Catholic tie, have the Saints come in at midnight and chase the evil away.

[paxcoder]

Hey, but why would the bad saints chase all the fun (evil) away?

Do you see what I mean?

Halloween is heathen.

[bdeaner]

Neither is Christmas nor Easter. You want to get rid of those too? EVERY Christian holiday has pagan roots. Every single one. I challenge you to name a single one that isn't.

[havock89]

Penticost.

[bdeaner]

Pentecost is associated with the Celtic pagan holiday of Beltaine in May.

[havock89]

Damn, I never knew that!

But wait Beltaine was the May Day festival. Pentecost is celebrated 40 days after Easter, which is thrid week in April.

That does not add up, sorry.

Also just because something CAN be associated with something else, does not mean that it should be.

[bdeaner]

Beltaine is an anglicization of the Irish "Bealtaine" or the cottish "Bealtuinn." It translates literally as "lucky fire" -- the fire that was associated with the coming of the new season. Hm, the symbolism of fire...that sounds familiar.

[havock89]

What weak-minded nonesense. Symbolism has to be universal to the human condition or it would be Useless. Fire is one of the most used symbols, as is motherhood. Simply because symbolic association CAN be made does not mean and deeper connotation can be extrapollated.

"I believe you are a believer in Isis."

"Rubbish, why do you think that?"

"Do you have a picture of your mother holding you as a child?"

"Why yes, what does that matter?"

"Well it proves you are a follower of Isis"

"D'Oh!"

[bdeaner]

Ok, genius, what other Christian holiday in the Catholic Calendar has fire as a major symbol? None that I can think of other than Pentecost. And it 'just so happens' to correspond with the exact same season as Beltaine that uses the exact same symbol. Yes, a universal symbol, linked to a universal, seasonal celebration that has pagan roots. Not bashing Catholicism here, mind you--just pointing out that bashing Halloween for having pagan roots is stupid. Read Benedict's "Truth and Tolerance."

[havock89]

No you are not getting my point. You cant do anything which has any kind of symbolic reference without touching on something that has been used by someone else at some point. This is a function of human nature, not a function of paganism. You cant OWN an abstract representation of an idea.

I am not bashing halloween. All hallows'eve is very kewl in my book. I am just saying that to cite pagan festivals as the root for all christian holidays is not accurate. + a season covers 1/4 of the year!

[bdeaner]

We can quibble over whether Pentecost has pagan roots, but I don't see much point. There is not much in the way of cultural rituals outside of the Church that correspond to Pentecost -- nothing like a Christmas tree, or Easter basket, or carved pumpkin. The Church has always adopted the pagan rituals of the cultures where its missionaries were converting natives. As a result, Christian holidays (not just Halloween) retain aspects of the pagan rituals that were adopted. That's my point.

[havock89]

OK. Yes I can accept your point to a degree. But pagan rituals are not the source of christian ritual. Christianity is. Similarities exist for different reasons, but not becase they are necessarily connected. Thats my point.

God bless you.

[bdeaner]

Oh come on, lighten up. Every Christian holiday has pagan roots. Are you going to start bashing Christmas now? Seriously. Why don't you guys expend your energy on more important matters, like abortion and the health care crisis.

[wintersdemise]

Yea, I've heard different Priests and organizations voice not so harsh opinions on Halloween. I am an EDGE core team member at my local parish, and a priest was talking to the kids about halloween. He explained the origins but didn't outright discredit it. He just told them to not to toy with the occult and try dressing up like a saint instead of a devil or a witch. Kids need to have a good time but at the same time understand the Christian roots of Halloween.

[Perfectibilisti]

It is not a Christian holiday.

[jabberwocky1969]

As the video explains.

[havock89]

All Hallowed Eve. The eve of All saints day. Definately Christian.

[Perfectibilisti]

Yes, All Saints day is definitely Christian. Halloween, on the other hand, is not Christian. WATCH THE VIDEO.

[bdeaner]

Halloween is short for All Hallow's Eve, the night before what used to be called Hallowmas, which is just another name for All Saint's Day. Halloween is a Christian holiday, in the same sense that Christmas Eve is a holiday and involves certain rituals and celebrations. The video is stupid and demonstrates ignorance of the Halloween tradition in Irish Catholic tradition.

[nessunopassato]

@bdeaner the video is awesome and keeps to history. how could there be an ignorance in Irish Catholic tradition, if it is in fact develop within Irish history? that makes no sense...you an Irishman/woman? you a historian?

[bdeaner]

The video is clueless about history. Sorry. Go read about how Irish Catholicism was built upon the culture and rituals of Celtic pagan systems of belief. It has been a huge influence on holiday practices within the contemporary Church.

[nessunopassato]

@bdeaner well first off, theres no such thing as Irish Catholicism. that would declare a difference between the rituals/teachings of the Church established within Ireland and that established by the Vatican=established by Jesus/Apostles. There is not such a difference. Since there is not a present difference nor was there in the past. than there are no pegan roots/rituals/etc. having any of the such would be contrary to our beliefs.

[bdeaner]

Halloween comes from "All Hallow's Eve," the day before All Saint's Day ("Hallowmas"). Come on, people. Its Christian! ALL major Christian holidays have pagan roots. That doesn't mean they are not Christian.

[Perfectibilisti]

That is a total lie. I don't care what you call it, All Hallow's Eve, Hallowmas, Halloween; it's pagan. All Saint's Day is Christian.

[bdeaner]

It is a sin to accuse someone unjustly of a lie. I am telling you the truth, look it up for yourself. All Saint's Day was created for the very purpose of replacing Samhain, the Irish Celt holiday. They are the same celebrations, same rituals, etc., just like Christmas and Easter contain pagan rituals that were overlaid with Christian themes. Many of the rituals of Halloween -- i.e. carving pumpkins -- were created by Christians as part of the celebrations of All Hallow's Eve.

[nessunopassato]

@bdeaner huh, there are nothing alike. All Saints Day is celebrated by going to Mass. samhain, and every possible religious activity involved is the complete opposite. Christmas and Easter are the same. Nothing dealt with is similar.

[Perfectibilisti]

Okay. I like you for some reason. I don't have time for this anyway. I hope you get it all sorted out. I'm going to sleep.

[nessunopassato]

@bdeaner NO CHRISTIAN HOLIDAY HAS PEGAN ROOTS. to say the such means it started with pegan beliefs and developed from it. however NONE of our rituals/holidays allow anything pegan involved as to do so is contrary to our beliefs and would be against GOD as most pegan rituals/events are similar to that of satanism.

[raymoohackuray]

You don't even know how to spell 'Pagan' correctly. Have you not bothered to even do some basic research on something like say, Christmas?

[nessunopassato]

@raymoohackuray and where am I going to research smart guy? some book or website writen by some random nobody, whose sole purpose is to corrupt the idea of what I see as peace and holy? WRONG. If I am to research anything than I am to look towards the people who infact started that holiday, event, cultural significance(exp:If I am to study roman empire, than I research papers during that time,from those involved.NOT someone with a chip over their shoulder

[raymoohackuray]

Wikipedia's articles have citations, evidence does not go away by simply ignoring it.

[nessunopassato]

@raymoohackuray what are you talking about? you never once told me to visit wiki anything. furthermore again I say it again. I will not take information from just anyone. wiki pages are influence be random anybodies that may not even have the right information. a problem that has cursed wikipedia since it's start. furthermore many of their citations goes to the wrong source. Im not interested in more websites or any book by some guy who doesn't even know.thats why teachers ban wiki for papers

[raymoohackuray]

There's this thing called Google, maybe you should learn to use it. I think religious people are allergic to research and citations though.

[nessunopassato]

@raymoohackuray I only reasearch and cite relative books, magazines, and many more ALLOWED works for citation. otherwise it is a waste of effort, pointless journey, and a bad grade.

[CathPresbyter]

Halloween/All Hallowed Eve is Christian, the pagan holiday Samhein is pagan. Christians put on costumes of dark things mocking them, because we know Christ won the victory just like Paul who mocks death in 1 Cor 15. Can this group please FIRE THE PROTESTANT FUNDIE WHO MADE THIS VIDEO. I hate cross polination of Protestantism into Catholicism. Typical either or protestant thinking, a genetic falacy.

[bdeaner]

You nailed it, CathPresbyter. This video is WAY TOO Protestant for my taste. It has Puritan, anti-Catholic sentiments that I reject on deeply Catholic grounds. Bah!

[jabberwocky1969]

False.

[bdeaner]

Wrong.