That needs alot of power, heck even some of the larger servers that have only 8 scsi drives and 2 processors have 2 ~ 4 power supplies (Some over 700 watts). Depending on your sata drives there, 45 drives are going to need at least 700 watts on a good power supply that can handle that at a continuous load. Not sure how well Enermax PSU's hold up. But I always tell people to oversize on PSU's, oversizing really won't waste power, but it will save your ass in lifespan and during load conditions.
How about an update? I wouldnt mind hearing more about the construction of this system and your day-to-day experience with this pod. I am also wondering about the difficulties of changing failed drives in a non-bay case.
@1Administrater Close, but it didn't get that far. The PSU's are independent of each other. The system failed before the PSU tied to the MB was even turned on so POST was never run. But you are right about the over load on power. The secondary PSU blew a fuse.
@heartsblood had a feeling. i so wont to have a rig like that minus the wire nest cas i have a huge move and music library that already i have used up 4Tb of space all on 4 HD and i only have on HD drive slot :(
but i have a solushon to you problem try to run the HD is parolel to decrees resistant or try to finding a power supply with higher amperage to power that beset of HD and her is one additional tip don't tap in to each other power supply or else you wont dezaster aka the blue smoke
@1Administrater That server is a 135TB 4u. That's a bit much for a movie/mp3 collection. I highly recommend one of the Super Micro towers for a home server solution. If you need something in the 10-15TB range, maybe a horizontal loaded 2u. I have gone through several versions of that server now and I don't have any issues at all. Also I always run parallel circuits insofar as the backplanes allow.
@heartsblood cool but i manly need some thing along the lines of this tipe of case becas i need some thing to holed all my back ups of all my computers that have 2Tb HD in them along with my music and moveys not forgeting an over kill on redundant HD clones for critical legal documents that can not be lost. can you plees tell me whar i can get this case. cas i already have to meany external HD running in RAD5 and one good bump and all the HD are gowning to come crashing down.
@heartsblood They have 15 bay triple redundant 700watt power supply server chasis for less than 800. Ideal for home use. Pair it with a 3ware/LSI raid card an you have a very functional NAS or iscsi target.
@heartsblood ps fuses only pop if the amp usige is hier than what it can handal. i know a lot a bowt computers and electrical i have 2Y of computer repair classes along with 1Y of basic electrical engineering and Principal. so i can hopefully help. do the calculation for max amp used by the HD and search for power supply that can handal that lode... or have a delay in boot order for all the HD i think it is in the BIOS settings throw i am not to formiler in how to do a delay HD start up
@Truxiz Sure, but depending on your backplane you will have a bit of a bottleneck. I've built around 20 of these now for VM's and raw HD video storage. Whatever you do, DO NOT USE GREEN OR ECO drives. Those drives are intended for desktop stations and not SATA backplanes. They spin down occasionally which causes massive seek latency when doing stuff like DBs or VMs.
I heard some bios'ses can make a delayed spinup for each drive.. i believe mine can.. an intel P67.. could do away with a lot of the peak drive spinup.
Well this is for bootup procedure.. not sure if theres anything to be done about the spinup during use..
@TheJulepalme Just don't use "Green" or ECO drives and you should be fine. As far as spin up is concerned just make sure all drives spin up on the backplane you are powering before you turn the second power supply on. You can avoid this all together by using a single 12v massive rail PSU but that kinda defeats the purpose of CHEAP storage. units like that can go for $450-900. My PSU's only cost me $70.
@gepisar only on startup. Each pod draws about 4.5amps (110v) on startup and idles @ 2.0-2.5. I rarely see a single box above 4amps and that's under heavy load. In a home or small office you can easily run 3 pods per 20amp circuit. I have 240v 30amp circuits per rack in my data center so it's kinda moot there.
@WilliamTang search google for petabytes on a budget. Very easy to build if you know you're way around the inside of a computer case. Keep in mind the article is about a year old now. I'm building these 67TB only costs me about $6k now.
You'll have to do the math yourself, I don't remember the breakdown from Volts to amps to watts, etc.. On a 110v circuit i've seen them draw around 4amps from my cage PSU's On 240v circuits they barely break 2amps full load. Startup is a whole different story. Startup disk spin can blow a fuse if you're not careful.
Now if only the forced fsck with JFS on >10TB used on a fs could get fixed both the backblaze people *and* I would be happy now that I have 24TB used on my 36TB JFS file-system.
@houkouonchi I scrapped JFS completely from my build. it's an obsolete FS which isn't getting any further support. Depending on your comfort level I would recommend either XFS for novice/intermediate experience and BTRFS for regular/pro users. Stay away from EXT4, it's not ready for prime time yet when dealing with mounts 14.9TB+. The latest builds of Debian support BTRFS out of the box with little configuration.
@heartsblood They actually did fix the logredo error with > TB file-system though =P. I have had horrible problems with XFS in the past and BTRFS is still a bit too beta for me. Its funny you said stay away from EXT4 but I remember reading recently backblaze switched over to ext4 =P
@peacockealot Yea it was a PITA figuring out back blaze's design. It's almost impossible to build these cases without a custom PSU cabling job. I've got a full data center running several of these guys now. Super micro 1u's run the VM heads, and the back blaze pods manage the VM images/back ups. It's hard to express in words how cheap/efficient this setup is.
My company is about to invest in this doe to the "Cloud" BS. We figure why pay someone else. Make them pay us. So are you saying the parts list required on Blazes site isn't right? We really are going to build a couple of these things so it would be nice to know.. Thanks!
@AKAThunderhead Yes an no. Those modular power supplies are very finicky. The reason it died on me at startup was because the modu 82+ power supplies couldn't handle the amp draw from that many hard drives without balancing the load across all of the module ports on the PSU itself. In my original design I ran 10 drives per port on the PSU, the Modu 82+ couldn't handle that. Now I found a way around this by alternating the high and low amp draw on the module ports.
@heartsblood I should also point out that one thing BackBlaze doesn't mention is that when they build these in bulk they get custom wiring jobs from the PSU manufactures - something they don't tell you until you start calling the PSU manufactures yourself asking for it. Also the PSU companies won't do a custom wiring job unless you plan on buy a lot, as in 100+ a month. Our first 2 pods were a nightmare to deal with.
@heartsblood Unless you want to build a lot of molex cables by hand (trust me you don't) I highly recommend buying as 1200w PSU with a massive single 12v rail. A single 12v rail is very important because when the system starts up all 45 hard drives are going to be pulling 12-15amps on startup through the 12v rail. if you have any other questions you can reach me at michaele at fuscollc.com
Yea it wasn't very fun but I figured it out. The problem is the Power supplies they spec for original design couldn't handle the full load of the Hard disks on startup without being balanced. What I mean by that is, if you have an uneven amp draw say, 2 back planes on 1 of the module ports, and say 3 fans and a 1 backplane on the second module port, then the internal fuse goes off and the whole system shuts down. It took me awhile to learn all of the intricacies of this design.
As you can see I've made several changes to the original design, the most obvious was the dual nic's for 802.3ad. I've also added fiber channel cards for real time HD video rendering. For just under $20k (for the 2 pods in the movie) we were able to do what apple was going to do for ~$80k. It's hard to argue with that kind of cost savings.
Are the harddrive's staggered to prevent gyroing?
BobDoleNSatanRmyniGz 2 months ago
That needs alot of power, heck even some of the larger servers that have only 8 scsi drives and 2 processors have 2 ~ 4 power supplies (Some over 700 watts). Depending on your sata drives there, 45 drives are going to need at least 700 watts on a good power supply that can handle that at a continuous load. Not sure how well Enermax PSU's hold up. But I always tell people to oversize on PSU's, oversizing really won't waste power, but it will save your ass in lifespan and during load conditions.
NightWolfx03 3 months ago
How about an update? I wouldnt mind hearing more about the construction of this system and your day-to-day experience with this pod. I am also wondering about the difficulties of changing failed drives in a non-bay case.
KlagesNewMedia 3 months ago
i want to see a builde video
dbmaster46446 3 months ago
I LVOE IT
BUT WOHOOOOOOO I GOT 64TB HDDS BUT PAY 10 $ AN HOUR TO RUN IT
UnkownName321123 4 months ago
I think it failed at POST over lode on power.
1Administrater 4 months ago
@1Administrater Close, but it didn't get that far. The PSU's are independent of each other. The system failed before the PSU tied to the MB was even turned on so POST was never run. But you are right about the over load on power. The secondary PSU blew a fuse.
heartsblood 4 months ago
@heartsblood had a feeling. i so wont to have a rig like that minus the wire nest cas i have a huge move and music library that already i have used up 4Tb of space all on 4 HD and i only have on HD drive slot :(
but i have a solushon to you problem try to run the HD is parolel to decrees resistant or try to finding a power supply with higher amperage to power that beset of HD and her is one additional tip don't tap in to each other power supply or else you wont dezaster aka the blue smoke
1Administrater 4 months ago
@1Administrater That server is a 135TB 4u. That's a bit much for a movie/mp3 collection. I highly recommend one of the Super Micro towers for a home server solution. If you need something in the 10-15TB range, maybe a horizontal loaded 2u. I have gone through several versions of that server now and I don't have any issues at all. Also I always run parallel circuits insofar as the backplanes allow.
heartsblood 4 months ago
@heartsblood cool but i manly need some thing along the lines of this tipe of case becas i need some thing to holed all my back ups of all my computers that have 2Tb HD in them along with my music and moveys not forgeting an over kill on redundant HD clones for critical legal documents that can not be lost. can you plees tell me whar i can get this case. cas i already have to meany external HD running in RAD5 and one good bump and all the HD are gowning to come crashing down.
1Administrater 4 months ago
@heartsblood They have 15 bay triple redundant 700watt power supply server chasis for less than 800. Ideal for home use. Pair it with a 3ware/LSI raid card an you have a very functional NAS or iscsi target.
BobDoleNSatanRmyniGz 2 months ago
@heartsblood ps fuses only pop if the amp usige is hier than what it can handal. i know a lot a bowt computers and electrical i have 2Y of computer repair classes along with 1Y of basic electrical engineering and Principal. so i can hopefully help. do the calculation for max amp used by the HD and search for power supply that can handal that lode... or have a delay in boot order for all the HD i think it is in the BIOS settings throw i am not to formiler in how to do a delay HD start up
1Administrater 4 months ago
@1Administrater lode ... lol
produKtNZ 2 months ago
There is staggered spin up, that might be useful.
Datzfunk 4 months ago
The end is the best part!
Datzfunk 4 months ago
the end is fail
undergroundradio11 4 months ago
awesome *-*
caioalegato 4 months ago
@alienhddna Petabyte 10^5
heartsblood 4 months ago
what comes after the tb any ways
alienhddna 5 months ago
not enough power?
TomTeneg 5 months ago
@TomTeneg Kind of. The PSU's had enough power but it was distributed unevenly causing the 12v rails to pop their auto amp fuse.
heartsblood 5 months ago
'For those of you who don't know what this is....SHOULD GTFO!'
EyesOnMeStudios 6 months ago
Why don't you guys utilize ZFS?
bradbeckett 6 months ago
not good --- LMFAO
exploblob 6 months ago
Hello.
Can i use 2-3 TB disk for this pod/storage-server?
Truxiz 7 months ago
@Truxiz Sure, but depending on your backplane you will have a bit of a bottleneck. I've built around 20 of these now for VM's and raw HD video storage. Whatever you do, DO NOT USE GREEN OR ECO drives. Those drives are intended for desktop stations and not SATA backplanes. They spin down occasionally which causes massive seek latency when doing stuff like DBs or VMs.
heartsblood 7 months ago
@heartsblood OK, thanks for reply'ing.
Truxiz 7 months ago
I heard some bios'ses can make a delayed spinup for each drive.. i believe mine can.. an intel P67.. could do away with a lot of the peak drive spinup.
Well this is for bootup procedure.. not sure if theres anything to be done about the spinup during use..
TheJulepalme 7 months ago
@TheJulepalme Just don't use "Green" or ECO drives and you should be fine. As far as spin up is concerned just make sure all drives spin up on the backplane you are powering before you turn the second power supply on. You can avoid this all together by using a single 12v massive rail PSU but that kinda defeats the purpose of CHEAP storage. units like that can go for $450-900. My PSU's only cost me $70.
heartsblood 7 months ago
the power draw on start up must be WAY high!
gepisar 7 months ago
@gepisar only on startup. Each pod draws about 4.5amps (110v) on startup and idles @ 2.0-2.5. I rarely see a single box above 4amps and that's under heavy load. In a home or small office you can easily run 3 pods per 20amp circuit. I have 240v 30amp circuits per rack in my data center so it's kinda moot there.
heartsblood 7 months ago
how to build that blackplane !!!
WilliamTang 8 months ago
@WilliamTang search google for petabytes on a budget. Very easy to build if you know you're way around the inside of a computer case. Keep in mind the article is about a year old now. I'm building these 67TB only costs me about $6k now.
heartsblood 7 months ago
@heartsblood 6k? wow , have you consider to buy a new one ?
WilliamTang 7 months ago
@WilliamTang what do you mean? I build a new one every couple of months to keep up with my storage needs (mostly uncompressed HD video).
heartsblood 7 months ago
how much energy (Watts) does it consume at full load?
red0point 1 year ago
You'll have to do the math yourself, I don't remember the breakdown from Volts to amps to watts, etc.. On a 110v circuit i've seen them draw around 4amps from my cage PSU's On 240v circuits they barely break 2amps full load. Startup is a whole different story. Startup disk spin can blow a fuse if you're not careful.
heartsblood 7 months ago
Now if only the forced fsck with JFS on >10TB used on a fs could get fixed both the backblaze people *and* I would be happy now that I have 24TB used on my 36TB JFS file-system.
houkouonchi 1 year ago
@houkouonchi I scrapped JFS completely from my build. it's an obsolete FS which isn't getting any further support. Depending on your comfort level I would recommend either XFS for novice/intermediate experience and BTRFS for regular/pro users. Stay away from EXT4, it's not ready for prime time yet when dealing with mounts 14.9TB+. The latest builds of Debian support BTRFS out of the box with little configuration.
heartsblood 7 months ago
@heartsblood They actually did fix the logredo error with > TB file-system though =P. I have had horrible problems with XFS in the past and BTRFS is still a bit too beta for me. Its funny you said stay away from EXT4 but I remember reading recently backblaze switched over to ext4 =P
houkouonchi 4 months ago
EPIC fail lol
peacockealot 1 year ago 2
@peacockealot Yea it was a PITA figuring out back blaze's design. It's almost impossible to build these cases without a custom PSU cabling job. I've got a full data center running several of these guys now. Super micro 1u's run the VM heads, and the back blaze pods manage the VM images/back ups. It's hard to express in words how cheap/efficient this setup is.
heartsblood 7 months ago
fail
lenoat702 1 year ago
My company is about to invest in this doe to the "Cloud" BS. We figure why pay someone else. Make them pay us. So are you saying the parts list required on Blazes site isn't right? We really are going to build a couple of these things so it would be nice to know.. Thanks!
AKAThunderhead 1 year ago
@AKAThunderhead Yes an no. Those modular power supplies are very finicky. The reason it died on me at startup was because the modu 82+ power supplies couldn't handle the amp draw from that many hard drives without balancing the load across all of the module ports on the PSU itself. In my original design I ran 10 drives per port on the PSU, the Modu 82+ couldn't handle that. Now I found a way around this by alternating the high and low amp draw on the module ports.
heartsblood 1 year ago
@heartsblood I should also point out that one thing BackBlaze doesn't mention is that when they build these in bulk they get custom wiring jobs from the PSU manufactures - something they don't tell you until you start calling the PSU manufactures yourself asking for it. Also the PSU companies won't do a custom wiring job unless you plan on buy a lot, as in 100+ a month. Our first 2 pods were a nightmare to deal with.
heartsblood 1 year ago
@heartsblood Unless you want to build a lot of molex cables by hand (trust me you don't) I highly recommend buying as 1200w PSU with a massive single 12v rail. A single 12v rail is very important because when the system starts up all 45 hard drives are going to be pulling 12-15amps on startup through the 12v rail. if you have any other questions you can reach me at michaele at fuscollc.com
heartsblood 1 year ago
Yea it wasn't very fun but I figured it out. The problem is the Power supplies they spec for original design couldn't handle the full load of the Hard disks on startup without being balanced. What I mean by that is, if you have an uneven amp draw say, 2 back planes on 1 of the module ports, and say 3 fans and a 1 backplane on the second module port, then the internal fuse goes off and the whole system shuts down. It took me awhile to learn all of the intricacies of this design.
heartsblood 1 year ago
As you can see I've made several changes to the original design, the most obvious was the dual nic's for 802.3ad. I've also added fiber channel cards for real time HD video rendering. For just under $20k (for the 2 pods in the movie) we were able to do what apple was going to do for ~$80k. It's hard to argue with that kind of cost savings.
heartsblood 1 year ago
I almost cried.
HunterGregorySr 1 year ago