The REAL history of JRPGs / console rpgs / light rpg Part 2

[davidzxx]

back in the day, I didn't call my games JRPGS or anything like that, I just called them based on the system I was using, not where they came from.

[TheRpgFanatic]

@davidzxx That's what many people did. I'm trying to promote new labels that define RPGs by their different styles of combat and narrative models. When my new website launches the game database will use these labels to categorize the games.

[drinkbudyXD]

@putinblood it has nothing to do with console or pc,the reason asian rpg's specifically japanese ones are for consoles is those pple actually work a lot,they dont have a lot of time and most of their games are not intended for people that should have a job and when they are.. their made for hand held consoles,so you got something to do while on the subway or stuff like that

[9snaker]

Ha when I'm finished with my game you'll be screwed! ^^

Cause you need gathering power-ups to be able level up yourself (like every 5th level you need an extra orb or something). Also it'll be Action based like Zelda, Secret of Mana etc. but it'll have items like in Zelda. :D

[Omn1c1d3]

I'm not sure Japanese is a race...



[Rasuke11]

I just furthered my education on RPGs right here.

[TKnightcrawler]

Okay okay okay, I want you to listen to this.

You said that "console-style RPGs" and "PC-style RPGs" can be released on either console OR PC, and they get their names from the fact that, during their origins, that's where the games primarily originated. Uh... isn't that EXACTLY the same reasoning as calling it a JRPG or WRPG?

[redneckpride4ever]

I suppose I should be a whine ass when people say Irish are drunks. Fuck that foolishness. Fried chicken has African cooking techniques, but I suppose that's racist too since we have the chicken/African stereotype. Fuck off you schmuck. And remember- if you call a pc style rpg a western or American rpg, you're racist garbage.

[redneckpride4ever]

Racist? Oh Jesus, calling console style Japanese as slang when said style was created in Japan. I suppose calling crepes French is racist too. You make a brilliant video but submerge yourself with utterly foolish comments. More whiny idiocy from political correct folks, aka those who invent crap to shine about and invent causes to pass time.

[TheRpgFanatic]

@putinblood Doesn't matter if it's a "slang term". The point is IT'S RACIST. The term was invented by Western game reviewers who HATE certain games like the Final Fantasy series. The term does not describe game mechanics, only superficial things like art style.

[Stektanudlar]

Who decides what is a genre, I wonder.

[Goldendriger]

Yeah, calling Console RPGS- JRPGS, isnt that like calling Boarderlands a "Comic shooter" or a "Cartoon FPS"?

[Firebomber7]

You've got good points.  Your facts are dead on.

But, you really come off as a dick in your videos.

[xxcrysad3000xx]

I can't remember the first time I saw the label 'jrpg' in print, but i do remember it striking me as contradictory and a tad pejorative. now it seems to have been accepted into the gaming language, which is a shame for the reasons you've so thoroughly outlined.

[malwambi]

So fantastically informative!  Thanks for all your research and your great videos.

[iArkanoid]

I logged in for this this already shows that your video has great information not that im special in some kind of way or something.

I am focussed on the creation of games and am trying to make a RPG I really respect your ludological view of the game it is trully fascination to hear you make these things so clear in no time this video really deserves more than 1435 hits. It really has correct content and you backup your arguments like somekind of backupper sorry for the lame joke

[Cobac]

nice explanation . Why do we flame each other about genres and useless thigns and DONT just play and have fun with the games ?

[Blasingame0]

Great video, as an avid RPG player I thoroughly enjoyed it. I remember the first time I read JRPG used on GameFaqs forums. Until then I had mainly used the term RPG, as they are all classified as RPGs. I never thought of it as a racist overstatement to use JRPG. From watching this video I feel enlightened and use revert back to using RPG instead of JRPG to classify those games. Question, can I still classify SRPGs under RPGs?

[Blasingame0]

Great video, as an avid RPG player I thoroughly enjoyed it. I remember the first time I read JRPG used on GameFaqs forums. Until then I had mainly used the term RPG, as they are all classified as RPGs. I never thought of it as a racist overstatement to use JRPG. From watching this video I feel enlightened and use revert back to using RPG instead of JRPG to classify those games. Question, can I still classify SRPGs under RPGs?

[jfreedan]

@Blasingame0 Yes, strategy rpgs are still computer rpgs.

[RonCrafton1989]

Hey bud I've been telling people to watch your videos on GameFaqs my sccont name is Ron1989

[hrodwulf]

Very interesting, if a bit obnoxious. But as a nice challenge that would serve as education, I'd like it if you TheRpgFanatic would provide some examples of contemporary RPGs and how you'd define them, say Demon's Souls as someone said, the SaGa series, Mass Effect & Fallout, etc.

[TheRpgFanatic]

@hrodwulf Well, as I said toward the end, the old-school genre lines are starting to blur because game designers are coming up with unique mechanics for the games in effort to keep computer rpgs "fresh". Some do tend to lean toward certain directions though, and in general, American rpgs lean toward PC-style and Japanese lean toward console-style. I'll try to make a video about this topic one day.

[yaoilovertash]

Thank you for this video. Is there any way you can go in the history of voice-acting in rpg games? I'm so tired of people complaining about english dubbing in games and how the english dubbing in games somehow determines the quality of the game. I honestly liked the games where there were no voice-acting because you could imagine what the character sounded like and their own personality and story can unravel in the game but people think I'm crazy because of my opinion.

[TheRpgFanatic]

@yaoilovertash I'll add "video review of computer rpg voice acting" to my To-Do list. But I'll need to acquire several games and systems I don't have, mostly Working Designs titles.

[yaoilovertash]

@TheRpgFanatic

Which ones do you need? I have the lunar collection and the arc the lad collection.

[Char7es96]

@yaoilovertash I agree unless the voice acting is absolutly fantastic id rather read the conversation

[RonCrafton1989]

So this is why we have Demons Souls

[barbe00brune]

EXELLENT, ive been wating so long for someone to clear that up! I totally agree.

[vivalastupidity]

Very opinionated review! That's a good thing. I especially liked all the DQ1 remixes throughout. Great stuff man. Your Unlimited SaGa review is hilarious too, though I still have yet to try the game.

[aNiL8r]

Very informative, very well made, and very well spoken. I am genuinely impressed.

[Silvererazor]

Almost everybody knows what a JRPG ist, even though the term is not accurate. we know, that a potato is. If in 100 Years 100% of earth population call a potato a tomato, so the word "tomato" will be a correct description for a potato, because everybody will know that this is. Sry for the bad example and 2 parts.

[TheRpgFanatic]

@Silvererazor You've missed the entire point of these videos. It is because people DON'T know what actually defines these games that the label JRPG is meaningless. The same goes for anime; it's not a genre, it's just an industry. Your argument is basically that it's okay for people to be ignorant, when it's actually not.

[Silvererazor]

@TheRpgFanatic

I get the point of the videos and i agree with them. I just had to point out, that it's just how all of the languages work. For example american-english contains a lot of words, whose meaning is different from their oiginal meaning, but it desen't mean, that these words are wrong. And even if the terms anime and jrpg are not correct, they are established all over the world and everybody knows what an anime is.

[Silvererazor]

Even if its born from ignorance jrpg is a substitute for console-style/light RPGs. Well and i think its ok, as long as this term is used only for light rpgs. And i think "anime" is better, than "cartoons with a style which originate in japan".

I know, what u intedned to say with your videos (history of rpg-games and difference between light-rpgs and pcrpgs and the incorrect usage of jrpg).

P.S. I like your videos keep the good work up. Hmm can you make a review of the first 4 BoF?

[TheRpgFanatic]

@Silvererazor The term isn't used only for light-rpgs. JRPG is used in an inconsistent manner and often by those that focus on completely irrelevant things (ex. "anime" artwork, random battles, having generic fantasy cliches in the story, etc) that actually appear in multiple games regardless of genre or country of origin. I think it's better if people abandon the term JRPG and go back to calling the genre console-style like we have for two decades. JRPG has only existed for a couple years.

[TheRpgFanatic]

I don't currently own all the BoF games right now (I did and have beaten them all) but when I re-obtain them I'll do a marathon review on them.

[Silvererazor]

@TheRpgFanatic

In this point i agree with you.

[Shintai123]

@Silvererazor By your logic, if the majority believed 2+2=5 then it's True. No, it's not and thinking that is moronic. The majority doesn't change what the truth is regardless of how much they really want to.

[Silvererazor]

@Shintai123

You don't get the point. 2+2=4 is a basic mathematical fact. But if for example in 200 years the word four is replaced by the word uqri(just an example) and if everybody knows that uqri=4 (one, two, three, uqri, five, six, seven), so it is ok to use the word uqri and not the word four (as long as it doesn't change the meaning of 4).

[Silvererazor]

Even though "JRPG" isn't an accurate description or name for console-style RPGs, its stil valid. Why? Well it has became the norm, thats how language works. Its the same with anime. Like it was said in part 1, in japan anime is just another word for cartoons and it doesn't matter, if the origin is in japan, france or us. But to the western audiences an anime is a japanese-style cartoon and everybody knows what to expect, if they hear the word "anime".

[TheRpgFanatic]

@InvisibleTrainwreck Roleplaying in tabletop rpgs means to assume the role of a character in a fictional world and collaboratively create the narrative with other players / GM.

In computer RPGs you cannot roleplay because the narrative (if any) is on a rail decided by the game designer. The player has a finite number of choices they can make limited by the designer, whereas in RPG games the limit is determined by your own imagination.

[Rich9837]

0:23- What game is that? Looks fun.

[TheRpgFanatic]

@Rich9837 Radia Senki for the Famicom.

[PoisonSawada]

Good video but you overlooked Falcom`s orginal Dragon Slayer, seen by many Japanese gamers as the first Japanese action RPG. Released back in 1984, from what I`ve read work on it started before the some what similar Tower of Druaga.

[TheRpgFanatic]

@PoisonSawada Dragon Slayer wasn't a console-style rpg. Tower of Druaga isn't a computer rpg.

[TheRpgFanatic]

@TheRpgFanatic I'll talk about action rpgs eventually.

[velocityeleven]

I would like to add the the "defining an RPG" thing... I would say that its not necessarily to do this hower the power-ups/level-ups are obtained, but how possible it is to repeatidly get them

for example, I would say that leveling up in an average RPG is done by killing enemies, killing enemies is a constant repeatable task. The heart containers in zelda is not a repeatable task, but a series of individual ones.

[TheRpgFanatic]

@velocityeleven By computer rpg elements, I'm really talking about the game mechanics of D&D, especially AD&D. Turn-based combat, dungeon crawling, and character growth based on repetitive actions (ex. exp points for killing enemies or the systems used in FF2 / SaGa games). There is also character customization, even if it is something seemingly simple as equipping different armor and weapons.

[TheRpgFanatic]

@TheRpgFanatic Today some of these elements have drifted into other genres (customizing a character with different combination of items / powerups) but the computer rpg genre was defined in the 80's when these games first came out.

As for Zelda, I'm pretty sure it descends from arcade "item grab" games, most notably Tower of Druaga. The major difference with Zelda is you have freedom to explore the dungeons as you wish and you can buy power ups with earned points (rupees).

[velocityeleven]

do you understand what I'm trying to say though?

[darkkodiak001]

Wow, very informative. This put the nail in the coffin for me to stop using JRPG all-together even for country of origin.

[TwilightsView]

I really like that you made these videos. My friend always rips the piss outta me for playing these games mainly because he is a fan of that guy on the escapist who steriotypes any RPG from Japan and hasnt a clue how wonderful alot of them can be.

Can i ask your favourite RPGs?

Mine are Suikoden 2, BOF 3, Star Ocean 2 and FF9.

[TheRpgFanatic]

@TwilightsView I like so many, it feels a little unfair to narrow down a small list. But some of my favorites are FF6, FF7, Xenogears, SaGa Frontier 2, Romancing SaGa: MS, Earthbound, Azure Dreams and Lufia 2. I also like some pc-style, such as Arcanum: Of Steamworks and Magick Obscura. I play MMORPGs as well (Atlantica Online, WoW, etc)

[v1zdr1x]

@TheRpgFanatic Wow I haven't met anyone else besides me who has actually played Azure Dreams much less liked it. You sir have +10 cool points from me =P

Also great video.

[TheRpgFanatic]

@v1zdr1x I'll be reviewing Azure Dreams eventually. I'm planning something special for it, too.

[velocityeleven]

Azure Dreams is my favourite game of all time (the PS1 version anyway) it is really well done... also I agree with pretty much everything you say, and a lot. Especially about Zelda not being an RPG

[akimotonaoki]

Excellent its about time someone did this! Do you have a favourite RPG out of curiousity?

[TheRpgFanatic]

@akimotonaoki I like many, it's hard to pick just one.

[TheRpgFanatic]

By the way, if you guys really like this then be sure to show it to others, especially those who don't get it. I put these videos together to educate people on what the history is and what console-style rpgs actually are.

[BurntHighMe]

That was very enjoyable and educational. Very nicely done good sir.

[TheRpgFanatic]

@BurntHighMe Thank you.