@gunsandbullhorns I don't mean to sound rude, but did you not watch the rest of the video? Texas and other such southern states would fuck themselves over.
Just because the system isn't perfect (and it sure as hell isn't) and just because it needs an overhaul doesn't mean that the answer is to scrap the system.
I asked what progress we've made that we would be throwing away if we scrapped the system. Preventing Texas from teaching something silly is not "progress". That's merely a lack of regress.
I'd prefer that Texas be miseducated in their own special way than have all 50 states be uniformly miseducated. I argue in favour of diversity. It works well for the market, and it works well for evolution. I say it works the same way for education. That's my argument for scrapping the system.
About teaching creationism as a science: sure, it's a horrible thought, but a lot of high school seniors would love it - an AP Creationism exam would surely be easy to pass with a bunch of "God did it". Unfortunately, not many colleges would give them any course credit.
@gremlinn7 Well an AP Creationism would have to go through Collegeboard =) Somehow I don't think a private corporation would go for it haha Then again, Collegeboard is stupid so you never know...
You dislike the educational system, but want to defend to institution which has a significant hand in shaping current education? It is partly a catering to the peitist christians, but in a real way local assholes are in a better position to evaluate the needs of schools and the effectiveness of spending measures.
Regardless the current education system is rotten at the core, and is designed to destroy the minds of children, by the admission of the founders of the system.
@WorBlux Just because the system isn't the greatest at the moment doesn't mean that the answer is to scrap it. My previous video is a rant about how it needs to be fixed.
Sure more money to the local boards may help with budgets, but that's just something that needs to be fixed then - again we don't need to scrap the DOE as the answer.
Not merely isn't the greatest. The origin of the current free and compulsory schooling is with manipulative, controlling, and domineering intentions of influential industrialists and socialists. And the function which they envisioned for these schools continue today.
The potential redemption of the proposal is not so much in the money as in the control. It is more likely to respond to the concerns of the parents in a productive way. And it is a problem of standardization.
... As parents are really in the best position to determine if their child is being well educated.
The solution to many of the ills is to open education to the market. so that needs of students and parents are met by entrepreneurial creativity and innovation rather than arbitrary bureaucratic decisions. One method would be provide tax credit on private tuition. Another would be to abolish pubic school, and provide vouchers to families who currently qualify for the SCHIP programs.
But this would be a little to radical even for a radical assholes such as Schiff, so he is catering to distrust of the federal system, and frustration with the educational system. He is after all out for votes rather that providing the best solutions at the expense of such votes.
@WorBlux I like the idea for tax credits on private school, but regardless they're still wildly expensive. Most that I know of in my area wouldn't have the resources to expand if more students begin to use their services. It'd be a very slow process unfortunately, and not one that is really viable in this economy given that endowment has decreased.
Would public schools still exist in this open market? I don't really know much about this idea though I have heard of it.
"As parents are really in the best position to determine if their child is being well educated."
I'm not so sure about that. There are certainly many parents who wouldn't care very much, not all parents are loving and considerate. And others might be bible thumpers who want to "protect" their children from science and critical thinking.
@WorBlux I've never been to public school so you'll have to explain. Give me the name of who started this or something of that nature and I can start looking stuff up on Wiki and I can get back to you.
The cost for three siblings and myself to attend a private catholic school was about $3,500 per year. The costs of private schools are often half that of public schools, and a good endowment can cut the cost to parents by another half. There were also several scholarships available. And the credit method would be long term to that the current economy is not a strong hindrance
One way is the money follows the student, making all schools publicly funded, but managed privately within a public standard.
Some other proposals are to offer vouchers only when the public school falls below a particular performance benchmark.
As for a source, the essay mentioned previously is a good into. A fully researched case is available as ""The underground history of American education" by the same author.
A voucher is a piece of paper saying, the State of X will pay Y dollars to whichever educational system can show that student Z is enrolled in their school.
@WorBlux I'm going to look into the voucher thing more before I get back to you. I can see both it's good and bad points at the moment, but I don't want to jump the gun and give my opinion straight off the bat like this.
I'll probably PM you by Friday afternoon (no more internship after thursday =( )
the cost today at the school is 2600 one child, 3700 two children, 4400 for three or four for parish members, 50% more for those not members of the associated parish. One in six families receive financial aide.
Actual cost per child is 3800. Average cost of public school in the state is 9600 per child. ACT scores were above the state average.
@WorBlux ... When did you go to school??? My Catholic school cost about $28,000 in 9th grade (but I was on aid). The school I just graduated from cost about the same (still on aid) and the endowment is $60,000,000 according to Wiki. So...
I've never heard of scholarship on the high school level but there is financial aid.
Yeah but without a department of education bluestate schools would do much better also and in general people will go to the best of schools with vouchers.
It might be a rare instance where privatization works for the arts, sciences and vocational needs
@funsizedchoco sure, school privatization and the DOE gone or at least little more than a charter agency for poor and middle class families.
The trade off would be this you would lose about 10 to 15 % of the total national school kids to fundieland christ schools but that number would soon become saturated.
While on the other hand you would have more specialized schools for the working poor or vocational , the artistic fame type kids and the scholar science types.
@Curas1 I don't like getting rid oft he DOE. The issue with that is that textbook suppliers tailor the material for Texas because it's the largest buyer of books. So we'd all get stuck with the BS books TX gets.
I am definitely for more charter schools as an option!
Privatization isn't all it's cracked up to be. There's no regulations for costs and eventually (ie. now) it's a bit out of control. At least where I am. (keep in mind, I went to private school)
@funsizedchoco I see your point but to be honest this system of campus style schools with constantly expiring textbooks leaves me a little taken back.
We can design cheap laptops for third world children and we cant have a return to the old single classroom school but this time a overhead hd projector and a wifi connected set of those green laptops ?
I just hate how modern schools are more like detention centers than places of knowledge and beauty ...
@Curas1 Well constantly expiring textbooks are more useful in some subjects than others - particularly science. Although if TX takes over the system you probably wouldn't have to worry about that haha
I'm a bit confused by your second point... particularly the part about the single classroom.
I would blame overcrowding and poor architecture for that. And it's definitely true of many schools.
@funsizedchoco Public education seems more like socialized daycare than true learning and considering crime and liability it's even more repressive
There is a large park by my house and down the street is a jr high a high school and a few elementary schools with a old but nice community collage across the street
But I wonder what it would be like if that park (it's large) with nothing but solar powered roofed bungalows (ac/heat/pr) or amphitheaters to lecture with wifi projectors n Ipads?
@Curas1 My guess is the cost of the WiFi , the green laptops and the digital laptops for a educational website and even the Internet as a teaching tool would much less expensive than the classroom buildings maintenance and utilities and this textbook debacle.
Forgive me for playing devil's advocate here...but it's such a fun game, after all :o)
One of the big things that Republicans talk about when it comes to the Department of Education (and many other departments) is that it's unconstitutional, ergo by the law of the land, the DOE is an illegal entity.
@funsizedchoco Well, if you're a strict constitutionalist, than the federal government can only do things directly permitted by the constitution. The constitution makes no provision for a Department of Education (which would make sense, because schools were much different animals back then), and the way in which the original Department of Health, Education, and Welfare was created is all a bit on the iffy side.
@CobraJones My response: 1776 was a very different time. The education was still by European standards so it didn't need regulation. Things have changed and the nation has grown. If they really have an issue with all this, then make an Amendment to include to make them "happy". haha
@funsizedchoco I'd actually be pretty much in the "for" column for making an amendment setting up the Department of Education. I mean...that's one of the main reasons they put in the whole amending process, but amendments only ever work if we actually make them.
@CobraJones Yeah that'd be a good idea. I didn't realize it was such a huge source of contention with some people cause it's never brought up by politicians in my state. Make the system go to work for once! haha
No I love your rants, even though both of us arent single minded on this issue. I'll let it be: most points of contention have already been brought up by other commenters.
Well Ive been much more persuaded last couple years , by points like yours that at a time when we have school curricula being attacked by creationism and replacing historical figures like Jefferson with religious ones: we need some authoritative body in control.
But I am unconvinced they are doing there job, plus they might just be a money pit wrapping bureaucratic red tape around the schools problems.
I can see the benefits of putting the states in charge of their own educational systems. There would be less standardized testing and less done in an effort to simply get more funding. Any way it has to be done, the emphasis needs to be on making kids smarter. Religion is definitely a hurdle, and that might be where the federal government being in charge is a good idea.
@PluralOfEverything I don't have an issue with standardized testing - it just needs to be fixed and test in a different way. There's testing even in private schools where the gov't isn't involved so I'm not sure giving $ to the state board of edu would change anything. The DOE is necessary for more than just religion. A lot of schools are failing children early on w/reading and math - they need to step up the game across the board.
But after viewing the website, did you read what it says girly...??? He doesn't just want to kill the education system - he wants to take the federal government out of the loop so it allows more of the funds to actually go towards education instead of the pockets of the bureaucrats clogging up the system. In the end, it should make our education system better funded (and theoretically more effective).
I do agree that we need a national standard otherwise fucked off states like TX will continue to produce retards. Knowing the federal governement though, I'd have to assume the national board of education does a lot more than just set education standards. I don't know for sure though.
@funsizedchoco i don't think standards is a reason to keep something either
you can have standards for anything including propaganda
about the only good thing that comes from wide spread standards is unification and sometimes i wounder if that is even good
at this point the amount of garbage and lies career politicians asking for more power are spreading is what opened me up to listening to the finer details of what anarchist and libertarians have to say
-- rather have no standard than a standardized theocratic police state where everybody in the nation or world even is taught that Thomas Jefferson was an evil man
i say let Texas fuck up it's education system and let the north east fix theirs
Texas is one of the richest states full of assholes why not let them prove how shitty heir ideas really are with some generational competition in the education system that fucks up their economy to the point that they start looking to better systems.
@eonomen 1) The entire country needs to fix the education system, not just the NE
2) Do you seriously think that our national government is going to go all TX one day and impose religious education or something like that? Really? Besides in the end it's up to the teachers when they teach the material.
3) When their economy fucks up the indoctrinated ppl will probably resist change bc, well, they've been indoctrinated.
@funsizedchoco "Besides in the end it's up to the teachers when they teach the material."
"When their economy fucks up the indoctrinated ppl will probably resist change bc, well, they've been indoctrinated."
those totally contradict each other
ever hear the phrase "don't put all your eggs in one basket"?
he entire country needs to fix the education system, not just the NE blanket statement why do you think everybody is the same? that is completely false
is fucking up the way we view our selves and the way the world views us
every state is equivalent to it's own country in terms of educational and economic ability
Texas = Canada in terms of wealth
the only reason we have a nation of many states is to protect our basic human rights/freedoms
as it keeps collecting more and more power it has proven to twist what is really going on more and more aka national polling systems used to blanket the whole united states as ignorant backwoods fucks
-because some country the size of florida gets an A+ on its report card the entire united states of florida sized countries gets an C and labled stupid
that is complete bullshit
the only reason we are falling behind in education compared to the world is because the world is catching up to us
give the European union time to stabilize its self and you'll find we are really quite the same
@eonomen No the reason we are falling behind in education is because we are under the impression that from an early age we need to build self-esteem and the "it's OK if you get a C" attitude. Some kids can't even read by the time they get to 1st grade.
Size of a country doesn't matter at all - I never said anything to that effect.
@funsizedchoco "The entire country needs to fix the education system, not just the NE"
what I'm saying is that the united states is not a country it is a federation/alliance of many smaller countries called states, who all have varying degrees of education,
because some propaganda tells you that the USA has poor education you think that every state has a poor education system?
what works in one country doesn't work in all countries
@eonomen So states are wealthy. They aren't autonomous.
And what polls am I quoting? I don't even pay attention to those things. The only one I see is the occasional approval rating poll. Which I ignore anyway because those things always go down.
@eonomen No they aren't. It's true that some teachers will teach the material correctly (ie. not the retarded Creationist/conservative way), but others will follow the curriculum. Therefore there will be indoctrinated ppl.
I have heard of that. We also shouldn't scrap something just because it's not working at 100%.
Why do I think everyone's the same? I don't. The NE has the best education system in the nation - if we need change then so does everyone.
@funsizedchoco ahh I kind of follow him a bit, he basically is a stock broker who started his own firm and predicted the housing collapse, this is how most of his fame came about, as far as i know this is the first time he has tried for political office
@funsizedchoco Peter Schiff is someone you should honestly learn about choco. Yes, he's a politician but he isn't a career-politician. He recently became a politician after being urged to by many people who follow his market forecasts. He was shouting from the roofs about the housing crashes and the other systemic failures in our monetary system much sooner than it actually happened. People made fun of him before the housing crash, then he turned into an economic-superstar.
I was about to favorite this video based on the first 40sec, but I can't favorite it now, because of how profoundly we disagree.
First question: I'm curious what "progress" we've made, that we would be throwing away if we decentralized education?
gunsandbullhorns 1 year ago
@gunsandbullhorns I don't mean to sound rude, but did you not watch the rest of the video? Texas and other such southern states would fuck themselves over.
Just because the system isn't perfect (and it sure as hell isn't) and just because it needs an overhaul doesn't mean that the answer is to scrap the system.
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
@funsizedchoco
I asked what progress we've made that we would be throwing away if we scrapped the system. Preventing Texas from teaching something silly is not "progress". That's merely a lack of regress.
I'd prefer that Texas be miseducated in their own special way than have all 50 states be uniformly miseducated. I argue in favour of diversity. It works well for the market, and it works well for evolution. I say it works the same way for education. That's my argument for scrapping the system.
gunsandbullhorns 1 year ago
About teaching creationism as a science: sure, it's a horrible thought, but a lot of high school seniors would love it - an AP Creationism exam would surely be easy to pass with a bunch of "God did it". Unfortunately, not many colleges would give them any course credit.
gremlinn7 1 year ago
@gremlinn7 Well an AP Creationism would have to go through Collegeboard =) Somehow I don't think a private corporation would go for it haha Then again, Collegeboard is stupid so you never know...
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
You dislike the educational system, but want to defend to institution which has a significant hand in shaping current education? It is partly a catering to the peitist christians, but in a real way local assholes are in a better position to evaluate the needs of schools and the effectiveness of spending measures.
Regardless the current education system is rotten at the core, and is designed to destroy the minds of children, by the admission of the founders of the system.
WorBlux 1 year ago
One example is the look-say method, which is training in illiteracy.
If anybody isn't familiar with such research "AGAINST SCHOOL" by John Taylor Gatto serves well as a short introduction.
WorBlux 1 year ago
@WorBlux Just because the system isn't the greatest at the moment doesn't mean that the answer is to scrap it. My previous video is a rant about how it needs to be fixed.
Sure more money to the local boards may help with budgets, but that's just something that needs to be fixed then - again we don't need to scrap the DOE as the answer.
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
@funsizedchoco
Not merely isn't the greatest. The origin of the current free and compulsory schooling is with manipulative, controlling, and domineering intentions of influential industrialists and socialists. And the function which they envisioned for these schools continue today.
The potential redemption of the proposal is not so much in the money as in the control. It is more likely to respond to the concerns of the parents in a productive way. And it is a problem of standardization.
WorBlux 1 year ago
... As parents are really in the best position to determine if their child is being well educated.
The solution to many of the ills is to open education to the market. so that needs of students and parents are met by entrepreneurial creativity and innovation rather than arbitrary bureaucratic decisions. One method would be provide tax credit on private tuition. Another would be to abolish pubic school, and provide vouchers to families who currently qualify for the SCHIP programs.
WorBlux 1 year ago
But this would be a little to radical even for a radical assholes such as Schiff, so he is catering to distrust of the federal system, and frustration with the educational system. He is after all out for votes rather that providing the best solutions at the expense of such votes.
WorBlux 1 year ago
@WorBlux I like the idea for tax credits on private school, but regardless they're still wildly expensive. Most that I know of in my area wouldn't have the resources to expand if more students begin to use their services. It'd be a very slow process unfortunately, and not one that is really viable in this economy given that endowment has decreased.
Would public schools still exist in this open market? I don't really know much about this idea though I have heard of it.
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
@WorBlux
"As parents are really in the best position to determine if their child is being well educated."
I'm not so sure about that. There are certainly many parents who wouldn't care very much, not all parents are loving and considerate. And others might be bible thumpers who want to "protect" their children from science and critical thinking.
Great discussion BTW.
NoNiceNameFound 1 year ago
@WorBlux I've never been to public school so you'll have to explain. Give me the name of who started this or something of that nature and I can start looking stuff up on Wiki and I can get back to you.
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
@funsizedchoco
The cost for three siblings and myself to attend a private catholic school was about $3,500 per year. The costs of private schools are often half that of public schools, and a good endowment can cut the cost to parents by another half. There were also several scholarships available. And the credit method would be long term to that the current economy is not a strong hindrance
WorBlux 1 year ago
@WorBlux
Voucher type systems can be with public school.
One way is the money follows the student, making all schools publicly funded, but managed privately within a public standard.
Some other proposals are to offer vouchers only when the public school falls below a particular performance benchmark.
As for a source, the essay mentioned previously is a good into. A fully researched case is available as ""The underground history of American education" by the same author.
WorBlux 1 year ago
@WorBlux
On wikipedia the topic branch "Critical_pedagogy" is a good place to start, as well as the entry on John Taylor Gatto.
WorBlux 1 year ago
@WorBlux What exactly is a voucher system?
I'll take a look at the articles and get back to you - probably by PM if it's anything huge lol thanks!
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
@funsizedchoco
A voucher is a piece of paper saying, the State of X will pay Y dollars to whichever educational system can show that student Z is enrolled in their school.
WorBlux 1 year ago
@WorBlux I'm going to look into the voucher thing more before I get back to you. I can see both it's good and bad points at the moment, but I don't want to jump the gun and give my opinion straight off the bat like this.
I'll probably PM you by Friday afternoon (no more internship after thursday =( )
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
the cost today at the school is 2600 one child, 3700 two children, 4400 for three or four for parish members, 50% more for those not members of the associated parish. One in six families receive financial aide.
Actual cost per child is 3800. Average cost of public school in the state is 9600 per child. ACT scores were above the state average.
WorBlux 1 year ago
@WorBlux ... When did you go to school??? My Catholic school cost about $28,000 in 9th grade (but I was on aid). The school I just graduated from cost about the same (still on aid) and the endowment is $60,000,000 according to Wiki. So...
I've never heard of scholarship on the high school level but there is financial aid.
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
@funsizedchoco I graduated 2005.
WorBlux 1 year ago
@WorBlux ... Which area of the country do you live in then?
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
@funsizedchoco
Western Midwest / central great plains
WorBlux 1 year ago
Yeah but without a department of education bluestate schools would do much better also and in general people will go to the best of schools with vouchers.
It might be a rare instance where privatization works for the arts, sciences and vocational needs
Curas1 1 year ago
@Curas1 Indeed we would do much better w/out the DOE - that's why I want to keep it =)
Privatization of what? All schools? (sorry just woke up haha)
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
@funsizedchoco sure, school privatization and the DOE gone or at least little more than a charter agency for poor and middle class families.
The trade off would be this you would lose about 10 to 15 % of the total national school kids to fundieland christ schools but that number would soon become saturated.
While on the other hand you would have more specialized schools for the working poor or vocational , the artistic fame type kids and the scholar science types.
Might be worth it
Curas1 1 year ago
@Curas1 I don't like getting rid oft he DOE. The issue with that is that textbook suppliers tailor the material for Texas because it's the largest buyer of books. So we'd all get stuck with the BS books TX gets.
I am definitely for more charter schools as an option!
Privatization isn't all it's cracked up to be. There's no regulations for costs and eventually (ie. now) it's a bit out of control. At least where I am. (keep in mind, I went to private school)
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
@funsizedchoco I see your point but to be honest this system of campus style schools with constantly expiring textbooks leaves me a little taken back.
We can design cheap laptops for third world children and we cant have a return to the old single classroom school but this time a overhead hd projector and a wifi connected set of those green laptops ?
I just hate how modern schools are more like detention centers than places of knowledge and beauty ...
Curas1 1 year ago
@Curas1 Well constantly expiring textbooks are more useful in some subjects than others - particularly science. Although if TX takes over the system you probably wouldn't have to worry about that haha
I'm a bit confused by your second point... particularly the part about the single classroom.
I would blame overcrowding and poor architecture for that. And it's definitely true of many schools.
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
@funsizedchoco Public education seems more like socialized daycare than true learning and considering crime and liability it's even more repressive
There is a large park by my house and down the street is a jr high a high school and a few elementary schools with a old but nice community collage across the street
But I wonder what it would be like if that park (it's large) with nothing but solar powered roofed bungalows (ac/heat/pr) or amphitheaters to lecture with wifi projectors n Ipads?
Curas1 1 year ago
@Curas1 My guess is the cost of the WiFi , the green laptops and the digital laptops for a educational website and even the Internet as a teaching tool would much less expensive than the classroom buildings maintenance and utilities and this textbook debacle.
Curas1 1 year ago
@Curas1 I don't doubt that from what I've heard lol
It is fun when teachers take classes outside! We had a large campus so we did it sometimes in the spring. But again, no public school here.
The damn parents would have a fit though if they thought their kids were being taught by some crazy liberals outside! haha
And what about in cities where space is more limited (ie. NYC)? Science labs would have to be enclosed too =/
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
@funsizedchoco Yes I'm thinking central California not Tuson, Seattle, Iowa or NYC LOL!
What I was thinking was low cost single room classrooms that could be swapped out and easily cooled and heated without the costs of a large building.
Making teaching mobile by electronic means would be so much better.
Hey btw you aren't from Iowa are you ? My ex had a daughter named Chelsea, you don't have a mom named Pam or a sister named Gabi do you ?
Curas1 1 year ago
Remember, the government is evil unless it's arresting minorities, killing A'rabs, or stomping teh gays from forcing us straight people to gay marry.
MinervaInTheBrain 1 year ago
@MinervaInTheBrain Geez how could I forget that?! Silly, silly me
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
@MinervaInTheBrain Exactly, lol!
I think that's what cons n libs both gotta learn is that there can be times when less government is as good as big government.
civil liberties, international relations, progressive tolerance - Ba useless!
Curas1 1 year ago
Forgive me for playing devil's advocate here...but it's such a fun game, after all :o)
One of the big things that Republicans talk about when it comes to the Department of Education (and many other departments) is that it's unconstitutional, ergo by the law of the land, the DOE is an illegal entity.
CobraJones 1 year ago
@CobraJones Since I'm really lazy, I'm going to have to ask how it's unconstitutional.
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
@funsizedchoco Well, if you're a strict constitutionalist, than the federal government can only do things directly permitted by the constitution. The constitution makes no provision for a Department of Education (which would make sense, because schools were much different animals back then), and the way in which the original Department of Health, Education, and Welfare was created is all a bit on the iffy side.
CobraJones 1 year ago
@CobraJones My response: 1776 was a very different time. The education was still by European standards so it didn't need regulation. Things have changed and the nation has grown. If they really have an issue with all this, then make an Amendment to include to make them "happy". haha
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
@funsizedchoco I'd actually be pretty much in the "for" column for making an amendment setting up the Department of Education. I mean...that's one of the main reasons they put in the whole amending process, but amendments only ever work if we actually make them.
CobraJones 1 year ago
@CobraJones Yeah that'd be a good idea. I didn't realize it was such a huge source of contention with some people cause it's never brought up by politicians in my state. Make the system go to work for once! haha
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
Still no HD.
Promises, Promises :(
gusb232 1 year ago
@gusb232 *gives cookies* sowwies... i was ranty...
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
@funsizedchoco 'sowwies... i? was ranty... '
No I love your rants, even though both of us arent single minded on this issue. I'll let it be: most points of contention have already been brought up by other commenters.
gusb232 1 year ago
@gusb232 You don't want the DOE?
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
@funsizedchoco 'You don't want the? DOE?'
Well Ive been much more persuaded last couple years , by points like yours that at a time when we have school curricula being attacked by creationism and replacing historical figures like Jefferson with religious ones: we need some authoritative body in control.
But I am unconvinced they are doing there job, plus they might just be a money pit wrapping bureaucratic red tape around the schools problems.
It might be better to start with a clean slate.
gusb232 1 year ago
good video!!
the intelligent design movement would love to get rid of the dept of educatiion
TheUnmaskedMagician 1 year ago
@TheUnmaskedMagician Indeed - not sure how heavily this guy falls into that movement, but he'd certainly have a shitload of supporters in the south!
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
i like your rants.
gothatfunk 1 year ago
@gothatfunk =) haha thanks
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
I can see the benefits of putting the states in charge of their own educational systems. There would be less standardized testing and less done in an effort to simply get more funding. Any way it has to be done, the emphasis needs to be on making kids smarter. Religion is definitely a hurdle, and that might be where the federal government being in charge is a good idea.
PluralOfEverything 1 year ago
@PluralOfEverything I don't have an issue with standardized testing - it just needs to be fixed and test in a different way. There's testing even in private schools where the gov't isn't involved so I'm not sure giving $ to the state board of edu would change anything. The DOE is necessary for more than just religion. A lot of schools are failing children early on w/reading and math - they need to step up the game across the board.
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
But after viewing the website, did you read what it says girly...??? He doesn't just want to kill the education system - he wants to take the federal government out of the loop so it allows more of the funds to actually go towards education instead of the pockets of the bureaucrats clogging up the system. In the end, it should make our education system better funded (and theoretically more effective).
YourBrainOnReligion 1 year ago
@YourBrainOnReligion Ah I commented too quickly..
I do agree that we need a national standard otherwise fucked off states like TX will continue to produce retards. Knowing the federal governement though, I'd have to assume the national board of education does a lot more than just set education standards. I don't know for sure though.
YourBrainOnReligion 1 year ago
@YourBrainOnReligion Hey no worries I do that all the time =)
Yes technically more money on the local level in theory could make programs better funded, but at the same time this is gov't we're talking about haha
TX makes me cry inside...
It does do more I would assume, but for me the reason not to get rid of it is because of the standards.
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
@funsizedchoco i don't think standards is a reason to keep something either
you can have standards for anything including propaganda
about the only good thing that comes from wide spread standards is unification and sometimes i wounder if that is even good
at this point the amount of garbage and lies career politicians asking for more power are spreading is what opened me up to listening to the finer details of what anarchist and libertarians have to say
theocracy can be a standard I'd -----
eonomen 1 year ago
-- rather have no standard than a standardized theocratic police state where everybody in the nation or world even is taught that Thomas Jefferson was an evil man
i say let Texas fuck up it's education system and let the north east fix theirs
Texas is one of the richest states full of assholes why not let them prove how shitty heir ideas really are with some generational competition in the education system that fucks up their economy to the point that they start looking to better systems.
eonomen 1 year ago
@eonomen 1) The entire country needs to fix the education system, not just the NE
2) Do you seriously think that our national government is going to go all TX one day and impose religious education or something like that? Really? Besides in the end it's up to the teachers when they teach the material.
3) When their economy fucks up the indoctrinated ppl will probably resist change bc, well, they've been indoctrinated.
4) It's not just TX that would fail.
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
@funsizedchoco "Besides in the end it's up to the teachers when they teach the material."
"When their economy fucks up the indoctrinated ppl will probably resist change bc, well, they've been indoctrinated."
those totally contradict each other
ever hear the phrase "don't put all your eggs in one basket"?
he entire country needs to fix the education system, not just the NE blanket statement why do you think everybody is the same? that is completely false
this whole national poll bullshit---
eonomen 1 year ago
is fucking up the way we view our selves and the way the world views us
every state is equivalent to it's own country in terms of educational and economic ability
Texas = Canada in terms of wealth
the only reason we have a nation of many states is to protect our basic human rights/freedoms
as it keeps collecting more and more power it has proven to twist what is really going on more and more aka national polling systems used to blanket the whole united states as ignorant backwoods fucks
eonomen 1 year ago
-because some country the size of florida gets an A+ on its report card the entire united states of florida sized countries gets an C and labled stupid
that is complete bullshit
the only reason we are falling behind in education compared to the world is because the world is catching up to us
give the European union time to stabilize its self and you'll find we are really quite the same
eonomen 1 year ago
@eonomen No the reason we are falling behind in education is because we are under the impression that from an early age we need to build self-esteem and the "it's OK if you get a C" attitude. Some kids can't even read by the time they get to 1st grade.
Size of a country doesn't matter at all - I never said anything to that effect.
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
@funsizedchoco "The entire country needs to fix the education system, not just the NE"
what I'm saying is that the united states is not a country it is a federation/alliance of many smaller countries called states, who all have varying degrees of education,
because some propaganda tells you that the USA has poor education you think that every state has a poor education system?
what works in one country doesn't work in all countries
things aren't so simple as one size fits all
eonomen 1 year ago
@eonomen So states are wealthy. They aren't autonomous.
And what polls am I quoting? I don't even pay attention to those things. The only one I see is the occasional approval rating poll. Which I ignore anyway because those things always go down.
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
@eonomen No they aren't. It's true that some teachers will teach the material correctly (ie. not the retarded Creationist/conservative way), but others will follow the curriculum. Therefore there will be indoctrinated ppl.
I have heard of that. We also shouldn't scrap something just because it's not working at 100%.
Why do I think everyone's the same? I don't. The NE has the best education system in the nation - if we need change then so does everyone.
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
how much do you know about him? sounds like you just heard about him
eonomen 1 year ago
@eonomen Just heard of him - I'm not really keeping up on this political race I must admit.
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
@funsizedchoco ahh I kind of follow him a bit, he basically is a stock broker who started his own firm and predicted the housing collapse, this is how most of his fame came about, as far as i know this is the first time he has tried for political office
eonomen 1 year ago
@eonomen I mean that's cool and all, but I still don't agree with him haha
Even if he only recently made the transition from human to asshole he is now an asshole IMO lol
funsizedchoco 1 year ago
@funsizedchoco Peter Schiff is someone you should honestly learn about choco. Yes, he's a politician but he isn't a career-politician. He recently became a politician after being urged to by many people who follow his market forecasts. He was shouting from the roofs about the housing crashes and the other systemic failures in our monetary system much sooner than it actually happened. People made fun of him before the housing crash, then he turned into an economic-superstar.
YourBrainOnReligion 1 year ago
@YourBrainOnReligion Career-politician or not, I don't agree with him. That's all that matters for the election at any rate. *shrug*
funsizedchoco 1 year ago