Seems like a fake to me. Tazers leave the person on the ground, in pain, long after the juice is cut off. Unless he was wearing leather underwear, something's not right with that Tazer.
Seems like a fake to me. Tazers leave the person on the ground, in pain, long after the juice is cut off. Unless he was wearing leather underwear, something's not right with that Tazer.
Wonder how many in that crowd now know this guy is a fake. Probably not too many. Sad, when the Christian Church doens't hold our own accountable like we're supposed to. Not to mention Caner STILL won't admit it.
If you would watch the entire message, it would be crystal clear. But people don't like to put this demonstration into context before judging....much like Scripture.
Tazering does not harm you. It causes a brief amount of pain with rarely any side effects. Paul accepted that he would be caused pain and harm by his actions of spreading the gospel and welcomed it if it meant his message would be received.
why would you want to put yourself through any pain? tazing yourself does not spread the gospel in anyway. He did it to gain publicity, then i regret to inform you that people came to see him get tazed and not for the gospel
You clearly don't know the facts or basis of the message. It was not announced beforehand that this would happen. It was a surprise to those who came to service that evening. The tazing does not spread the gospel no, but it is a perfect illustration of the point of the message. Like I said, Paul knew his actions would bring lasting pain and harm. The primary and focus is the message, not the pain.
If you are delievering your message and it just so happens that you bump into trials and tribulations which could potentially harm you, that is okay. But deliberately standing up and asking to be tazed. Looks more like jackass or dirty sanchez to me. Now i know where they learn it from.
Actually, the Bible says to expect trials and tribulation in spreading the Bible's message. The tazing was an illustration to the message, not simply a jackass demonstration. Jesus didn't tell parables just to shoot the breeze.
if you read what i wrote you would see that it's okay if you encounter trials and tribulations when delievering your message. But getting tazed is not a trial or tribulation. It is simple dumbness. It just doesn't make sense to stand up and taze yourself in the name of Jesus. Its dumb. If this happened in a mosque you would probably say they are training for a holy war.
The short and simple is that its a sermon illustration. If you just don't like the illustration, that's one thing. Some probably didn't like Jesus' stories. But if you have too much hate or biasness against the man to understand that, there's nothing I can say to help you to.
getting tazed isn't preaching, again...its a means to and end. the point of getting tazed wasn't just to get tazed. how is it so hard to understand a simply sermon illustration? thick headed haters, the worst.
If you wante people to understand this in context...why not have the entire sermon or at least have an expanation of the sermon? Rather you have this taze? Its nonsense.
Unfortunately, you fail to understand the context making your comment quite ignorant. If you were in attendance that evening, the message he preached would be engraved forever.
i dnt care wat he said b4 or afta the self harming ritual. im talkin bout this actual tazing. jst cos he gave a good speech it doesnt mean u celebrate with the 'good old tazing'
@mokhan247. What is the harm? Is working out and running and sports etc etc not harming the body in order to make it stronger and more fit? Your points are aimed towards the ignorant and simple minded who might accept ur hatred of caner w/o honest examination
@dsmitty1st Egun Caner has lied constantly about his alleged muslim upbringing.....Gods word says .............All liars shall have their part in the lake of fire...Revelation 21:8
It's always Arminians who are involved in all kinds of church shenanigans. Everything from muscle men breaking ice in churches to Rick Warren's 60 day trial of Jesus; they have a low view of God.
yes. when you refuse to accept scripture as it is then you have to make appeal to other things as well because you lack the confidence of the power of God and scripture to convict and get the message through so that the work of saving and sanctifying can be done. yes, low view of God and the Bible. typical of those who obstinately refuse to worship the God of the bible and believe His doctrine as revealed in the Word. :)
of course it doesn't say to go play in traffic, but what im saying is that is it so "sinful" for him to do this. If you were there to hear the sermon and witness everything you might feel different.
Now granted i know that caner is a bit for the theatrical but how is that so "sinful"? I think people are making a bigger deal out of it than it really is. thats all im sayin.
Everything has to do with theology. One's theology dictates how they preach. Caner is clearly from the "do anything to keep them entertained" category given this and other 'sermons' he's given. One would expect the president of a seminary to understand the life and death nature of the truth of God so as to not turn it into a game.
I understand your point, however, your conclusion does not even remotely apply to Ergun Caner. Tell me, how much do you know about the man? Have you spoken with him? Have you heard his account of how he came to follow Christ out of a Muslim worldview? I can assure you that Ergun Caner is vividly aware of how essential the Gospel is.
I'm not sure about your conclusion. The idea that simply because an extreme illustration was used within a sermon, he has somehow turned the message into a game. Is it illustration itself that makes the message a game? I suppose this means that any and all illustration is off limits? Or is it just you who gets to decide what illustrations are appropriate? I suppose Paul was wrong for his commitment to be all things to all people so that he might win some to Christ?
If you follow Jesus, then you are my brother in Christ. And for that, I love you like a brother. But the thing is that you and Caner are on the same side. There is not enough time to be taking shots at our own. We need to stand together. Because like you said, the message is too important.
You didn't hear the sermon or how this "stunt" is related to it. If you have some kind of Biblical backing for denouncing its use, please share. Or if you have a more detailed response as to how it is sad sermon material please also share. Should be interesting since you have not heard the sermon, however. Go hate somewhere else.
Caner's "sermons" are well known. I see no Biblical support, whatsoever, for this kind of entertainment. Perhaps you'd rather be entertained than here the Gospel? In today's climate of Joel Osteens and the like, Caner would consider the seriousness of Christ crucified as something not to turn into a side show.
Let's not forget that Jesus Himself did some pretty outrageous things so that we might hear Him and know He was from God. Remember? Multiplying food, healing the sick, raising the dead? And boy, those Pharisees were incensed that He would dare make such a side show of their religion. God is nothing if not extreme.
I sincerely hope you will remit your assertion that the miracles of Jesus should even be remotely considered to be at the same level as Ergun Caner volunteering to be tasered in front of a live audience of "peers".
No, my intention was to demonstrate how God uses that which we may find to be "freakish." Don't rule things out just because you are uncomfortable with them. I don't think Caner performs miracles.
Honestly, the problem I have with your criticism is that I wonder how much you actually know about him, because (the whole tazing incident aside, because I know it bothers you) he is serious about the gospel.
I mean, come on, he chose Christ out of a Muslim upbringing. I'm sure he lost more in his following Jesus than you and I combined. So if you can for a moment put this video out of your head, maybe you could see that he is our brother in Christ, and that he has counted the cost and followed anyway. Can't you at least give him that?
"I'm sure he lost more in his following Jesus than you and I combined."
I'm not so sure about that.
I must admit that I'm somewhat biased because I've kept up with all his banter and rhetoric over the years between him Ascol and James White. I saw a lot of what he "truly gave up" which wasn't much of his pride and ego if it's true that what comes out of a man's mouth is what is in his heart as our Lord said.
I'm saying that I know I didn't lose family when I submitted to the leadership of Jesus. And I don't know you, but I'm guessing that you didn't either. I admit that I could be wrong in this regard, but chances are that as American's who haven't left Islam, we probably haven't suffered for the Lord the way many of our brothers and sisters have.
I will give you that Caner is not perfect. That's why I follow Jesus and not man. He'd probably even admit to you that his ego may be a stumbling block to him at times. I'd just have to ask, do you NEVER speak that which would be offensive to a holy God? I'm sure I can say with confidence that we all have.
As for the Ascol/White/Caner x 2 contention....quite frankly, I am wearied by it. Because (let's just bottom-line things) even if one side could blow the other side out of the water in debate, 1) what does this do for the cause of Christ to an onlooking world, and 2) what would actually change in the evangelistic responsibility of either party, and 3) if we can't love each other as brethren, shouldn't we just pack it up and announce "game over?"
I am all for discussing theology because I believe it is important, but what's the point if all it breeds is resentment among the body, and sneers from skeptics? At some point we have to be able to admit that since God's thoughts are so much higher than ours, maybe just maybe, the answer to the whole Calivnistic vs. Arminian issue is actually some blending of the two, or something completely different. I'm sure that neither side has it totally right.
Because when God actually shared some of his thoughts, (ie the Bible) he didn't expect for us to say about those, "I am all for discussing theology because I believe it is important, BUT..." "I'm not all for discussing theology" is basically what you could have said without all the other jargon after your proverbial "BUT". It's the classic bait and switch. It doesn't work here.
Okay, well, you can suppose that you know my every thought and intention. You can even put words into my mouth and assume that I have purposed to deceive you. But the only way that your approach to the scriptures makes sense is if you can honestly say that you have a firm grasp on EVERY biblical concept in the book. So, tell me, would you explain to me the in's and out's of the Trinity?
I believe it was Paul in I Cor. 13 who summarily said that even if I am the uber-Christan and can do it all, "BUT" I don't have love, then it's worthless. Should we toss out everything after Paul's "but?" There are conjunctions all over the Word of God...for a reason.
I am convinced that the remedy for theological arrogance is to remember our own debt to a holy God, and remember that it has been forgiven. At some point in all the debating, each of us must remember our own sinfulness and maintain a heart of gratitude. That's when brotherly love can play out. Otherwise, it's just noise.
You misunderstand me. I was not saying that the understanding/studying/clarifying of doctrine is arrogance. I was saying that the attitudes and rhetoric (on both sides) of the recent Calvinism/Arminian debate could very well have been received by the rest of the world to be arrogant and quarrelsome.
I think that you would be surprised to find that you and I probably agree on more than we disagree on. I have agreed with you that doctrine is important. But for some reason (which I have yet to be able to decipher), I have yet to hear you acknowledge that, scripturally, love is the partner that CANNOT be separated from doctrinal soundness.
Doctrinally speaking, God is love, truth, and justice all rolled into one. Take away any of those attributes, and He is not the God of the Bible. Can we at least agree on this?
Aren't people supposed to know we are Christians by the love we have for each other? Pretty sure they'll never know it by our stances on Calvinism vs. Arminianism. I am certain that it is ultimately His kindness that leads us to repentance. And we can do no less for others.
Since when did Ergun Caner have gray hairs in his beard?
wooowmeato 5 months ago
Taze this fat ass LIAR! I have never seen a bigger SHIT talker then caner in my life.
hudfadz 5 months ago
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Seems like a fake to me. Tazers leave the person on the ground, in pain, long after the juice is cut off. Unless he was wearing leather underwear, something's not right with that Tazer.
mksclr 9 months ago
Seems like a fake to me. Tazers leave the person on the ground, in pain, long after the juice is cut off. Unless he was wearing leather underwear, something's not right with that Tazer.
mksclr 9 months ago
and this guy is suposed to be an ex-MAZLIM...my ass...
khalilrabee 1 year ago
DON'T TAZE HIM BRO
lonewolf0017 1 year ago
Wonder how many in that crowd now know this guy is a fake. Probably not too many. Sad, when the Christian Church doens't hold our own accountable like we're supposed to. Not to mention Caner STILL won't admit it.
voted4bush 1 year ago
lolzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Exposingantiahmadiya 1 year ago
Comment removed
Rachella38 1 year ago
@Rachella38
hahahahahaha
ALLaHUakER 10 months ago
could be his preparation into the world wrestling federation once liberty ditch this liar.
kelubi99 1 year ago
that is NOT Ergun Caner.
puzzydee 1 year ago
@puzzydee are you retarded? One, I was there when he did this. Two, its obviously him...
dsmitty1st 1 year ago
@dsmitty1st oh, sorry bro, my mistake. Thanks for calling me a retard though...very encouraging.
puzzydee 1 year ago
haha he is fake ex-muslim
ThePathanO 1 year ago
@ThePathanO incorrect.
dsmitty1st 1 year ago
he shoulda been tazed on his bald head or ass.tht wud be super funny xD
devilsown18 1 year ago
"Let all things be done decently and in order." 1 Corinthians 14:40.
jtw2e 2 years ago
@jtw2e it was quite orderly. And what was co nsidered decent when Paul wrote that? And how does that relate to our culture today?
dsmitty1st 1 year ago
nothing like a good ole tazing to make the point. yes I mean it sarcastically
strech7951 2 years ago
If you would watch the entire message, it would be crystal clear. But people don't like to put this demonstration into context before judging....much like Scripture.
dsmitty1st 2 years ago
Yeah.
Even Christian hates him (Calvinist to be specific).
BTW did you got that last message that I sent you about Ergun Caner E-mail debate with a Muslim?
Make sure you use in Part 5
Peace
Kite208 2 years ago
self harm is not allowed in christianity
mokhan247 2 years ago
Tazering does not harm you. It causes a brief amount of pain with rarely any side effects. Paul accepted that he would be caused pain and harm by his actions of spreading the gospel and welcomed it if it meant his message would be received.
dsmitty1st 2 years ago
why would you want to put yourself through any pain? tazing yourself does not spread the gospel in anyway. He did it to gain publicity, then i regret to inform you that people came to see him get tazed and not for the gospel
mokhan247 2 years ago
You clearly don't know the facts or basis of the message. It was not announced beforehand that this would happen. It was a surprise to those who came to service that evening. The tazing does not spread the gospel no, but it is a perfect illustration of the point of the message. Like I said, Paul knew his actions would bring lasting pain and harm. The primary and focus is the message, not the pain.
dsmitty1st 2 years ago
If you are delievering your message and it just so happens that you bump into trials and tribulations which could potentially harm you, that is okay. But deliberately standing up and asking to be tazed. Looks more like jackass or dirty sanchez to me. Now i know where they learn it from.
mokhan247 2 years ago 2
Actually, the Bible says to expect trials and tribulation in spreading the Bible's message. The tazing was an illustration to the message, not simply a jackass demonstration. Jesus didn't tell parables just to shoot the breeze.
dsmitty1st 2 years ago
if you read what i wrote you would see that it's okay if you encounter trials and tribulations when delievering your message. But getting tazed is not a trial or tribulation. It is simple dumbness. It just doesn't make sense to stand up and taze yourself in the name of Jesus. Its dumb. If this happened in a mosque you would probably say they are training for a holy war.
mokhan247 2 years ago 3
The short and simple is that its a sermon illustration. If you just don't like the illustration, that's one thing. Some probably didn't like Jesus' stories. But if you have too much hate or biasness against the man to understand that, there's nothing I can say to help you to.
dsmitty1st 2 years ago
right okay. that makes perfect sense. lets all go get tazed and say we are preaching. its okay though. because paul said we could.
mokhan247 2 years ago 4
getting tazed isn't preaching, again...its a means to and end. the point of getting tazed wasn't just to get tazed. how is it so hard to understand a simply sermon illustration? thick headed haters, the worst.
dsmitty1st 2 years ago
so what did you learn from seeing ergun getting tazed?
mokhan247 2 years ago 13
haha. After all these posts from haters, someone finally asks about the context. Love it.
dsmitty1st 2 years ago
great context!
mokhan247 2 years ago
OK I am not a hater
But can you tell me what did you learn from that guy getting tazed?
Kite208 2 years ago 11
@mokhan247 I learned nothing but as I said before, his tongue should be tazed for being a damn boldface liar!
trinidadparaminman 7 months ago
If you wante people to understand this in context...why not have the entire sermon or at least have an expanation of the sermon? Rather you have this taze? Its nonsense.
MariposahNYC 2 years ago
@MariposahNYC. I didn't say I posted this to prove his sermon point or even say what it was. Ur post is a strawman and quite nonsensical
dsmitty1st 1 year ago
stop tryna justify stupidity using the bible man
davidwea 2 years ago
Yea, y try to use the Bible to justify someone preaching the Bible. Craziness.
dsmitty1st 2 years ago
getin tazed is not preachin u dummy, gettin tazed is stupidity.
davidwea 2 years ago 4
Unfortunately, you fail to understand the context making your comment quite ignorant. If you were in attendance that evening, the message he preached would be engraved forever.
dsmitty1st 2 years ago
i dnt care wat he said b4 or afta the self harming ritual. im talkin bout this actual tazing. jst cos he gave a good speech it doesnt mean u celebrate with the 'good old tazing'
davidwea 2 years ago 5
so you choose to be ignorant of the context of the tazing. Think I'll stop entertaining your ignorance.
dsmitty1st 2 years ago
@mokhan247. What is the harm? Is working out and running and sports etc etc not harming the body in order to make it stronger and more fit? Your points are aimed towards the ignorant and simple minded who might accept ur hatred of caner w/o honest examination
dsmitty1st 1 year ago
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@dsmitty1st Egun Caner has lied constantly about his alleged muslim upbringing.....Gods word says .............All liars shall have their part in the lake of fire...Revelation 21:8
Trust Jesus Christ ...Not Ergun Caner (The liar)
daleyboy77 7 months ago
bottom line is, hes an amazing speaker and likes to use interesting illustrations to get his point across and make an impact while doing so.
ollipeepz 2 years ago
I am sorry but can you tell me what is the point of getting Tazed?
Kite208 2 years ago 2
It's always Arminians who are involved in all kinds of church shenanigans. Everything from muscle men breaking ice in churches to Rick Warren's 60 day trial of Jesus; they have a low view of God.
clofto4087 3 years ago
haha. "low view of GOd" Must say that's what I always hear in response as well, and I'm not Arminian.
dsmitty1st 3 years ago
yes. when you refuse to accept scripture as it is then you have to make appeal to other things as well because you lack the confidence of the power of God and scripture to convict and get the message through so that the work of saving and sanctifying can be done. yes, low view of God and the Bible. typical of those who obstinately refuse to worship the God of the bible and believe His doctrine as revealed in the Word. :)
parakeethands 2 years ago
are you guys happy with what he did? he reminds me of JACKASS, I was waiting for Wee man to run and hump him lol stupid
bomchikawawaoooo 3 years ago
Why is it so stupid?! Can Christians not use crazy or fun illustrations? what is it harming? Does it say to not taze yourself in the Bible?
ktloveland 3 years ago
does it not say to go play in traffic in the bible,yet you wouldnt expect him to do that,right.
lilmindfreak1619 3 years ago
of course it doesn't say to go play in traffic, but what im saying is that is it so "sinful" for him to do this. If you were there to hear the sermon and witness everything you might feel different.
Now granted i know that caner is a bit for the theatrical but how is that so "sinful"? I think people are making a bigger deal out of it than it really is. thats all im sayin.
ktloveland 3 years ago
Arminian "evangelism" at its finest.
LaneCh 4 years ago
Uuuuuuh.......am I the only one who thinks that this tiny clip has NOTHING to do with Arminian theology?
sarahjoy1235 4 years ago
Everything has to do with theology. One's theology dictates how they preach. Caner is clearly from the "do anything to keep them entertained" category given this and other 'sermons' he's given. One would expect the president of a seminary to understand the life and death nature of the truth of God so as to not turn it into a game.
klockheed 4 years ago
I understand your point, however, your conclusion does not even remotely apply to Ergun Caner. Tell me, how much do you know about the man? Have you spoken with him? Have you heard his account of how he came to follow Christ out of a Muslim worldview? I can assure you that Ergun Caner is vividly aware of how essential the Gospel is.
sarahjoy1235 4 years ago
I'm not sure about your conclusion. The idea that simply because an extreme illustration was used within a sermon, he has somehow turned the message into a game. Is it illustration itself that makes the message a game? I suppose this means that any and all illustration is off limits? Or is it just you who gets to decide what illustrations are appropriate? I suppose Paul was wrong for his commitment to be all things to all people so that he might win some to Christ?
sarahjoy1235 4 years ago
If you follow Jesus, then you are my brother in Christ. And for that, I love you like a brother. But the thing is that you and Caner are on the same side. There is not enough time to be taking shots at our own. We need to stand together. Because like you said, the message is too important.
sarahjoy1235 4 years ago
...It's amazing what you find when you type "police tazer university student" in the searchbox. Priceless!!
AutumnTheCuzzy 4 years ago
This man is the president of a seminary? Sad.
klockheed 4 years ago
I don't see how that is sad...entertaining? yes...
manofYAHWEH 4 years ago
No... sad that this passes for sermon material.
klockheed 4 years ago
Okay, so THIS was not the sermon. This was an object lesson. Listen to the WHOLE sermon before you get all worked up. You can find it on iTunes.
sarahjoy1235 4 years ago
Yep, read "Pulpit Crimes" by James White.
parakeethands 2 years ago
What, like YOU'D have the balls to do something like this? LOLs...
AutumnTheCuzzy 4 years ago
You didn't hear the sermon or how this "stunt" is related to it. If you have some kind of Biblical backing for denouncing its use, please share. Or if you have a more detailed response as to how it is sad sermon material please also share. Should be interesting since you have not heard the sermon, however. Go hate somewhere else.
dsmitty1st 4 years ago
Caner's "sermons" are well known. I see no Biblical support, whatsoever, for this kind of entertainment. Perhaps you'd rather be entertained than here the Gospel? In today's climate of Joel Osteens and the like, Caner would consider the seriousness of Christ crucified as something not to turn into a side show.
klockheed 4 years ago
Let's not forget that Jesus Himself did some pretty outrageous things so that we might hear Him and know He was from God. Remember? Multiplying food, healing the sick, raising the dead? And boy, those Pharisees were incensed that He would dare make such a side show of their religion. God is nothing if not extreme.
sarahjoy1235 4 years ago
I sincerely hope you will remit your assertion that the miracles of Jesus should even be remotely considered to be at the same level as Ergun Caner volunteering to be tasered in front of a live audience of "peers".
LaneCh 4 years ago
No, my intention was to demonstrate how God uses that which we may find to be "freakish." Don't rule things out just because you are uncomfortable with them. I don't think Caner performs miracles.
sarahjoy1235 4 years ago
Honestly, the problem I have with your criticism is that I wonder how much you actually know about him, because (the whole tazing incident aside, because I know it bothers you) he is serious about the gospel.
sarahjoy1235 4 years ago
I mean, come on, he chose Christ out of a Muslim upbringing. I'm sure he lost more in his following Jesus than you and I combined. So if you can for a moment put this video out of your head, maybe you could see that he is our brother in Christ, and that he has counted the cost and followed anyway. Can't you at least give him that?
sarahjoy1235 4 years ago
"I'm sure he lost more in his following Jesus than you and I combined."
I'm not so sure about that.
I must admit that I'm somewhat biased because I've kept up with all his banter and rhetoric over the years between him Ascol and James White. I saw a lot of what he "truly gave up" which wasn't much of his pride and ego if it's true that what comes out of a man's mouth is what is in his heart as our Lord said.
LaneCh 4 years ago
I'm saying that I know I didn't lose family when I submitted to the leadership of Jesus. And I don't know you, but I'm guessing that you didn't either. I admit that I could be wrong in this regard, but chances are that as American's who haven't left Islam, we probably haven't suffered for the Lord the way many of our brothers and sisters have.
sarahjoy1235 4 years ago
I will give you that Caner is not perfect. That's why I follow Jesus and not man. He'd probably even admit to you that his ego may be a stumbling block to him at times. I'd just have to ask, do you NEVER speak that which would be offensive to a holy God? I'm sure I can say with confidence that we all have.
sarahjoy1235 4 years ago
As for the Ascol/White/Caner x 2 contention....quite frankly, I am wearied by it. Because (let's just bottom-line things) even if one side could blow the other side out of the water in debate, 1) what does this do for the cause of Christ to an onlooking world, and 2) what would actually change in the evangelistic responsibility of either party, and 3) if we can't love each other as brethren, shouldn't we just pack it up and announce "game over?"
sarahjoy1235 4 years ago
I am all for discussing theology because I believe it is important, but what's the point if all it breeds is resentment among the body, and sneers from skeptics? At some point we have to be able to admit that since God's thoughts are so much higher than ours, maybe just maybe, the answer to the whole Calivnistic vs. Arminian issue is actually some blending of the two, or something completely different. I'm sure that neither side has it totally right.
sarahjoy1235 4 years ago
Because when God actually shared some of his thoughts, (ie the Bible) he didn't expect for us to say about those, "I am all for discussing theology because I believe it is important, BUT..." "I'm not all for discussing theology" is basically what you could have said without all the other jargon after your proverbial "BUT". It's the classic bait and switch. It doesn't work here.
LaneCh 4 years ago
Okay, well, you can suppose that you know my every thought and intention. You can even put words into my mouth and assume that I have purposed to deceive you. But the only way that your approach to the scriptures makes sense is if you can honestly say that you have a firm grasp on EVERY biblical concept in the book. So, tell me, would you explain to me the in's and out's of the Trinity?
sarahjoy1235 4 years ago
I believe it was Paul in I Cor. 13 who summarily said that even if I am the uber-Christan and can do it all, "BUT" I don't have love, then it's worthless. Should we toss out everything after Paul's "but?" There are conjunctions all over the Word of God...for a reason.
sarahjoy1235 4 years ago
I am convinced that the remedy for theological arrogance is to remember our own debt to a holy God, and remember that it has been forgiven. At some point in all the debating, each of us must remember our own sinfulness and maintain a heart of gratitude. That's when brotherly love can play out. Otherwise, it's just noise.
sarahjoy1235 4 years ago
You call it arrogance...
Holding fast the faithful word as he has been taught, that he may be able by sound doctrine both to exhort and to refute the opposition.
(Tit 1:9)
...
LaneCh 4 years ago
Take heed unto yourself, and unto the doctrine; continue in them: for in doing this you shall both save yourself, and them that hear you.
(1Ti 4:16)
Paul calls it holding to sound doctrine. Again, I'll stick with an Apostle of God instead of your pejorative opinion.
LaneCh 4 years ago
You misunderstand me. I was not saying that the understanding/studying/clarifying of doctrine is arrogance. I was saying that the attitudes and rhetoric (on both sides) of the recent Calvinism/Arminian debate could very well have been received by the rest of the world to be arrogant and quarrelsome.
sarahjoy1235 4 years ago
When we approach these issues, they MUST be couched in love, not a desire to win the argument.
And FYI, I stick with the same apostles you do. I'm not sure why you seem intent on driving a wedge between us. I wish you no malice.
sarahjoy1235 4 years ago
I think that you would be surprised to find that you and I probably agree on more than we disagree on. I have agreed with you that doctrine is important. But for some reason (which I have yet to be able to decipher), I have yet to hear you acknowledge that, scripturally, love is the partner that CANNOT be separated from doctrinal soundness.
sarahjoy1235 4 years ago
Doctrinally speaking, God is love, truth, and justice all rolled into one. Take away any of those attributes, and He is not the God of the Bible. Can we at least agree on this?
sarahjoy1235 4 years ago
Aren't people supposed to know we are Christians by the love we have for each other? Pretty sure they'll never know it by our stances on Calvinism vs. Arminianism. I am certain that it is ultimately His kindness that leads us to repentance. And we can do no less for others.
sarahjoy1235 4 years ago
Yes, an arminian seminary. That is what is really sad.....arminianism.
parakeethands 2 years ago