@OccamKant Yes i watched the whole thing. You are making the point that VenomfangX was exemplifying hypocritical Christian behavior because He made a video that comes across as being a prideful compilation used to glorify his name. You compare this to the fact the Christians are called by God to be Humble yet they are prideful (You use another Christians video to point this out). You became the Judge in this case by making a video that points all this type of Hypocritical behavior out. Right?
@Besio222 Yes, though of course by saying "you became the judge" I can see that you're trying to use a logical fallacy to attack my point.
I didn't "judge" - I just pointed out the hypocrisy of a Christian saying that you should be humble, and the #1 You Tube Christian being exactly the opposite.
We see the same pattern all over the place in Church - Ted Haggard, the Pope.
@OccamKant I encourage and challenge you to read the Bible yourself and pray to Jesus to see if He really exists. Don't compare yourself with people that call themselves Christians and try to convert you with bad evangelism, compare yourself with God's word and Pray to Him through Jesus Christ. If you want watch my video in response of your video, also the video I made entitle Christian Walk. God Bless you. Christians may be hypocrites, but God is not.
@Besio222 I have read the bible, and I'm more familiar with it than many of the Christians I've argued with (it's like they have 5 favorite passages and are completely oblivious to the rest of it).
God is CERTAINLY a hypocrite - at lest the God of the bible.
He lies, he murders, he commits adultery, he steals. He commits pretty much every sin - though I guess perhaps he doesn't take his own name in vain. That would be difficult to do.
@OccamKant The god you know is not the God I know from scripture. I really challenge you to pray to Jesus. I have been transformed by the spirit, you can too. Just try it
@Besio222 I have tried it. I used to be a believer, but not because I ever felt that there was someone there, just because I had a lot of believers around me, and I was brainwashed.
As time went on, I started to realize that there was no-one on the other end of my "prayer phone" and I just hung up and realized that it's all a myth.
so in other words, you just contradicted yourself. you said you USED to be a believer, (I'm assuming you meant that you were a Christian) but believing in Jesus doesn't mean you're a christian. Satin believes in Jesus. "Just because you had a lot of believers around you" That means you "believed in Jesus for the wrong intentions. the Bible say's that in order to BE a true christian you have to do 2 things, A)repent, aka turning your back from sin & B) Trust in Jesus. u did neither.
@eaglrombie13 I believed in a God, just not the Christian form. Even as a child, the idea of a loving god creating a place of eternal torture was ridiculous and I rejected it out of hand. But I still believed in some kind of god.
How could I believe in the bible, a book so full of lies, hate and superstition? Also as a child I could see this clearly. I only feel sad that so many of you willingly deceive yourselves.
I see. well Occam, lets go through this step by step. Would a JUST God, allow law breakers free? without consequence? If so, then God should allow Hitler into Heaven. and there would be no reason to be "good" or OBEY God, because we could do WHATEVER we want.. does that make sense? :] And look Occam, I know you can't tell because we're on the computer typing, but i ask you these things in a loving way, because I'm concerned for you. Where have you personally found the bible to lie?
@eaglrombie13 The bible lies all the time, and you know it, or you wouldn't be trying to make excuses for it all the time.
As for a just god - punishment is not ETERNAL. That is nothing more than sadistic torture. And anyway - according to YOUR creed, if a murdering rapist has a deathbed conversion, then he goes to heaven anyway, doesn't he? So where is the justice in that?
Sir, i will continue our conversation via comments, a simple 450 character slot does not suffice for what needs to be said in rebuttal :P Follow me there :) I'll add you as a friend! ^_^
@OccamKant haha, well that wouldn't be too bad, the only thing is that i don't have a working webcam :( and PLUS its something i already wrote, i suppose i could break it down to 3 different comments if you'd like? =]
@eaglrombie13 I read what you wrote, and you wrote FAR more than you needed to. You are repeating yourself. I've also already addressed everything you brought up in your letter. Rather than repeating myself, please watch the rest of my videos for my rebuttals to your points.
I love how the reward they offer for being humble is glory in heaven -- isn't an act of humility then just merely an attempt to gain deferred glory? Round and round we go.
You seem to forget that I have had a diologue with you about God. You don't like Him nor do you trust Him. In fact, your whole journey towards athiesm is because of your wrong conclution that God sends innocent people to hell. Why do athiests spend so much time trying to argue about the Word of God if they don't believe in Him at all?
My wrong analogy that God sends innocent people to hell? How is it wrong? If I don't accept jesus as my savior (from himself) (sounds like one of the Sopranos) then I'm going to hell, regardless how good I am in life, how many people I help.
God doesn't exist. I don't trust or distrust him. He's fictional. He is the same as Santa, Voldemort and Darth Vader.
Get that through your thick skull -- HE IS THE SAME AS VADER - NONEXISTANT.
I will certainly agree with VFX on one of his points however. Your anger and frustration are not really aimed at him but at God who in your heart you know exists.
Your analogy about parenthood only applies when one is the parent of a child. You are not VFX's parent and therefore have no right to chastise him. Besides I certainly wouldn't call your behavior towards him parentlike to any degree, rather I would call it hatred.
If someone acts in such a way to stir up anger, what do you expect?
VFX is an ignorant, arrogant liar, spreading his lies. How would you feel if someone went around brashly spreading lies about something you knew to be true. I'm not talking about the god fairy tale, I'm talking about actual science.
If you guys really hated science so much, you should abandon it and go become amish.
And anyway - I wasn't talking about being his parent. It could be any adult watching a child misbehave - a teacher, a babysitter, whatever.
If you were taking care of a child, and he was running around breaking things, yelling, and generally being a little shit, would you say "Cut him some slack" or would you try to make him behave, be civilized?
I personally do not agree with some things that VFX does. I think that he should allow comments from detractors. He should allow opposing views on his comments section. I read JF777's comments on his page and you have athiests who comment that they respect him for allowing them to respond to his videos. But it also seems that JF is alot older than VFX and is more mature. I chalk it up to age. You live and you learn. VFX will as well. Give him a break.
Absolutely not. If someone is being a dick, you tell them so, so they learn NOT to be a dick. If we let him get away with being a little asshole like he is, he will never learn humility, and he will just grow up to be a bigger asshole.
Do you train children in the right ways by letting them do the bad things they do, or do you try to correct their behaviour?
It's interesting that you mention parenthood in terms of behavior. One can easily make the same case with God. He has rules for living so that people can learn the right way to live and not go to their own destruction. But with God He also is the Soverign Lord who created all things and by right He can do what He wishes with His creation.
I have a two year old daughter in my kitchen with a bright shiny bottle of open drain cleaner, and a bottle of Coke.
I tell her that to drink from the Coke is okay, but she will die if she drinks from the drain cleaner. I then tie a bright balloon onto the drain cleaner and surround it with stuffed animals. Then I leave the room.
Later, after she has poisoned herself, instead of dialing 911, I place her in the oven at 400 degrees, for ETERNITY.
Sounds like a pretty accurate retelling of Eden to me.
I mean seriously, if God didn't want us eating from the tree, why put it there? If he's omniscient, wouldn't he KNOW that we were going to eat from it? And then why pretend to be surprised? What happened to his omniscience? And pretending, that sounds like dishonesty to me.
yes but God didnt tempt us to do it satan did and God gives us freedom to do it so if you as the parent tells them whats right from wrong and watches them and someone comes in and decorates then she eats it you would give her a chance to apologise besides that like commiting suicide and is completely different then what you were trying to get at
...who was placed in the garden by god, for the express purpose of tempting Eve.
Then god punished the serpent for acting according to the way HE had made it and programmed it, and god punished man for falling for the temptation god had placed in the garden.
And all the while, god KNEW ahead of time that all this would happen, even before making man, the snake, or the garden.
So, god knowingly created a flawed being in order to punish it eternally.
"...yes but God didnt tempt us to do it satan did and god gives us freedom to do it..."
Tempting someone means to place an object of temptation in their path, as god did with the tree of knowledge.
God granting us the "freedom" to do it, is akin to parents standing in the room and allowing the child to drink Drano, "just to show her consequences to her actions"
The Serpent was PLACED in the garden by god. God allowed sin to enter the garden first (as the devil), then blamed it on man.
Let me ask you something OccamKant, were you a humble person at 22? Do you know that VFX has only been a christian for 2 years? Have you not read the book of 1 Corinthians where Paul rebukes the Corinthian believers for their pride? He calls them carnal. Apparently not. Also you are generalizing when you say that all christians are Hypocrites. But I guess you have to believe in something to be a hypocrite huh.
JF wasn't repeating VFX's name. I had him repeating the word "Humble", but Youtube butchered the audio so it's not very clear.
I was trying to point out, with some sarcastic humor, that what VFX is doing is the opposite of humble.
And I'm aware that I took JF's clip from a different video. That's irrelevant - he was talking about humility, and how important it was. I just used that to show how VFX has none.
Watch the rest of the video before judging him. There's also brief clips of a stupid emo kid and a long haired pissed off guy telling VFX that they hope he dies, gets cancer, dies a violent death, gets infected with AIDS, and/or call him a stupid piece of sh*t. The video is not "just" of people saying his name, although you'd like to lead yourself to believe that.
He posted the brief threatening videos on purpose to show everyone that he was not lying about the death threats. I guarantee you if there were as many people who posted videos towards an Atheist or a Muslim here on Youtube, that person would probably post a similar video of all the users chanting their name. Not like it's right, but less than 10% of the people shown on his VFX Forever video weren't even of people speaking positively of him. Now how does that prove he was being egotistical?
Whether that's true or not, CapnOAwesome has also posted hate videos towards VenomFangX, LifeofApollos, and Jezuzfreek777, whereas the ones mentioned have not done the same towards him.
There is NO WAY that CapnOAwesome has posted any videos threatening these guys. He will mock them mercilessly, but that would be "Scorn" videos, not "Hate" videos.
This might be my last comment to you: when did VFX every threaten anyone, did he say "agree with me or burn you worthless sinner" or "you're a moron so there's no hope for you?" Some of his methods might be unorthodox, but that doesn't mean he deserves to be treated like scum and filth because of it.
It looks like you're set in your ways and you apparently won't like him unless he changes to satisy "your standards." So this discussion apparently is through.
Great comeback. Because I don't want to argue anymore, I am running away? You sir are a prime example of why Christians don't take you seriously because you act foolish in assuming that they have to keep arguing with you until one side is convinced that the other is right. I guess there's no such thing as 'agreeing to disagree' anymore with you is there?
Actually, this argument is probably not even remotely fair and balanced because the majority of your viewers are probably those who side with you on your beliefs and opinions. I'm not running away, I am choosing not to cast my pearls before swine. In other words, I am willingly choosing not to continue this "debate" when you've already made it perfectly clear that even if I do address your points, you're going to find some way to refute them, even if your points don't make sense.
Frankly, that's a minute point. Honestly, I am almost sick to death of arguing back and forth with VFX haters who spend all their energy trying to convince people like me that he is a bigot, a liar, and a threat to the human race. It annoys the crap out of me, and people need to realize that they could do better things than waste their time attacking one individual on Youtube.
The video we're commenting on here was illustrating how VFX is NOT humble, which is apparently an important christian trait (JF gives 3 bible passages regarding it). He is in fact egotistical.
It's not a minute point, it's the ENTIRE point.
If you want to avoid addressing it, then you're just doing the typical dishonest christian thing and running away rather than admitting defeat.
Doesn't that seem rather one sided, to assume I am either running away or that I should admit defeat?Right, let's completely ignore the notion that maybe some Atheists aren't as intelligent as they claim to be if they're going to draw 2 conclusions that make only them look good in the end. I answered your question already by saying that VFX's methods may be unorthodox(meaning he's probably not as humble as he should be).If you could careless about who he is as a whole, why bother to discuss him?
Well, VFX made a video talking about himself. That is clearly egotistical. You're supposed to be humble, according to the bible. You're being dishonest if you say otherwise.
If he was a nice guy, who told the truth, and didn't misrepresent science (or reality in general), no-one would mock him, or try to show how hypocritical he is.
But he's a jerk. A really aggressive jerk. That draws people's ire.
Whether or not he truly is hypocritical, that's one Christian on Youtube. If his videos are so contradictory to your beliefs and opinions, maybe you should stop watching them because there is no reason why he should personally apologize to people just because they choose to get offended.
Dishonest Youtube Christians in general? Name five that are dishonest, and JezuzFreek777 and LifeofApollos don't count unless you have direct proof that they are, not just your own assumption.
I've pointed out that VFX is not humble but egotistical. Rather than saying "Yeah, you're right. He is" which is the truth, you're defending him, or trying to distract the conversation away.
So now the attention is being diverted towards me. Watch out, you don't want to "stroke my ego" if you focus all your points towards me since you think VFX's ego is being stroked by posting short clips of people talking about him. And yes, that last statement was out of sarcasm.
So I'm saying that you are being dishonest, at least in this discussion, in your reluctance to recognize VFX's hypocrisy. I never said you were egotistical.
You asked me for 5 dishonest christians. I don't actually keep notes, I just see what happens in debates like this, when the christian I'm talking to refuses to acknowledge when he's wrong.
Tell me this: If you wanting me to acknowledge I'm wrong because you believe beyond the shadow of a doubt you're right, or do you want me to say I'm wrong just so you can say to yourself "yes, I won the argument, the idiot didn't see it coming?"
I just want you to acknowledge the simple fact that making a video where at least the first 3 minutes of which is people saying your name is egotistical.
That's all.
I don't think you're an idiot. I just think you're biased.
Honestly, I think it was just a bit of sarcasm since so many people made videos about him and towards him. If he really wanted to be egotistical as you claimed, he could have just posted a 5 minute video of himself saying how awesome and amazing he is for his views and opinions that support Creationism. By the way, I am a Christian myself, so what makes you think I am going to side with the Atheists just because you feel I should? If that makes me biased, sorry, but I am not here to please you.
Mainly because as a Christian, I have yet to meet or see an Atheist who is able to "agree to disagree" on anything a Christian discusses with him. Secondly, I've never seen a video on here by an Atheist that hasn't attempted to call Christians idiots or other names and then act all immature and say that they're wrong no matter how many explainations they give for what they believe in. I don't feel like we've established any common ground on the matter being discussed.
Well, which of my videos are calling christians names, or idiots? I don't think I've done that.
Other than pointing out in this video how VFX is egotistical. I called it "Christian Hypocrisy" because it *is* hypocritical, and I've seen self-aggrandizement from other christians as well.
Not sure really. Give me a few days to think about it because I want to be 100% certain I know what I am getting myself into. The only way I'm willing to debate is if it's done without slander and mockery, personal bias, and without hatred or bitterness, and there's an equal amount of support for both sides of the discussion.
Sure. I'll leave all mockery, hatred & bitterness at the door. All I ask is honesty, and the willingness for either side to admit they're wrong about something.
If one's unwilling to ever admit that they're wrong, they've closed themself off to any kind of new understanding.
I can't promise a lack of bias. That's pretty hard to guarantee, though of course I'll try.
"If one's unwilling to ever admit that they're wrong, they've closed themself off to any kind of new understanding." Doesn't that imply that someone should admit they are wrong even if they are strong enough in their beliefs to claim that they are not? Call it a hunch, but from what it sounds like, you're wanting the debate to go in such a way to where you end up being victorious, despite anything I might lay out that could possibly end up being the opposite.
Nope. I've been debated into changing my mind before, so I'm completely open to it being me that is wrong.
I've already admitted to being wrong, by admitting to losing my temper.
I'm not debating with christians because I want to "beat them". I care about getting to the Truth.
I've had terriffic debates, where it's like a great game of chess. I love those. I just don't like it when the opponent tosses the chessboard off the table rather than concede a point.
Well, not all debates are equal, some end in a job well done from both sides, while others end in one side or the other leaving their argument incomplete.
Well, I guess I'm of the opinion that for a given point, there can only be one truth, but many falsehoods.
If two people are discussing and cannot come to an honest agreement about something, there must be something else there that is not being discussed, but is preventing agreement.
It may be bias, it may be pride, or it may be something else entirely.
So I'm hoping that we can overcome that and come to agreements, regardless which side of the "fence" the agreement is on.
"If two people are discussing and cannot come to an honest agreement about something, there must be something else there that is not being discussed, but is preventing agreement." That is true, but the problem is what wasn't discussed that hasn't already been addressed.
So you want to have a calm and rational debate? Let's schedule it for 2-3 weeks from now and decide where and when to have it. We can each invite our Youtube friends to join in on the debate and be allowed at least one buffer to offer additional input if necessary. Sound like a plan?
Well, I don't have a video camera that I can use to upload videos here on Youtube, so a video-to-video debate might not work out well. Secondly, if we did the debate in a chat room, we could everyone except the ones debating and then allow others to give their input once the debate is over.
Like the idea that there may be only one way to heaven? That Jesus Christ may actually be the truth? I would like to think that according to your statement that there would only be one way to God and not many. If you are so concerned about the truth then why is it that you believe there is no God?
Because there is no evidence for god. None. And in fact, the more we do research, the more we understand the completely natural processes that brought everything about.
The bible *could not* be true. And the more we learn, the more false it's shown to be.
I will agree with you on that. However, only God can be the judge of another person's actions, it's not our duty to point out every single, tiny error that they make in life, regardless of whether or not we think they were in the wrong. If VFX felt like his ego was getting the best of him, he'll have to answer to God for it.
1 Cor 5:12-13 What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside? God will judge those outside. "Expel the wicked man from among you."
So you SHOULD judge VFX, because you two are inside the church. It's up to God to judge me though. :)
That means to judge righteously and coherently. If I make an assumption about someone and then I turn around and do what I accused them of, then I am wrongfully judging them. However, can we agree that whether or not I accept your statement that "VenomFangX was egotistical" that it was not about winning or losing an argument, just an acknowledgment of what the real conclusion was?
I guess... I think you're being too careful here though. I understand that you don't want to go around being harsh on people, but you should also recognize when their behaviour needs a tune up.
Oh believe me I do what I can. If you remember GlenReb, I personally cannot stand him because he exemplifies EVERYTHING a Christian should not be. I think he is just using the term "Christian" to give other Christians who are the opposite of him a bad name. I have called him out at least twice on his hypocrisy, but he has yet replied to me.
I'd also like to point out that you had no problem judging me, and pointing out that I reacted with anger. That was something I did in the heat of the moment.
VFX's video must have taken a very long time to string all that together. That's a cold, calculated work, meaning much more thought and intention behind it.
Are you judging atheists and christians by the same yardstick?
It's not like I've planted a trap or anything -- the whole POINT of my video is that VFX is being egotistical.
You should always be able to recognize when people are wrong, even people you respect. Christopher Hitchens, for example, is someone who I agree with *somewhat*, but not in everything. I'm actually quite against him in some things.
It's healthy to be skeptical, and keep a critical eye on things.
He's lying because he makes all these stupid claims about science, and when he's corrected, rather than changing his tune, he CONTINUES with the bullshit.
I'm offended at his lies, not his hypocrisy. I don't care if he's a bad christian. But I'd like to point out to others that he is, so maybe he won't be able to persuade them with his lies.
If I wanted to continue this discussion with you for hours on end, you would clearly see that you were far from winning this argument. How can you win an argument that hasn't convinced me personally that you were right and I was wrong?
Obviously I won't convince you if you refuse to examine facts.
How am I wrong in my assertion that VFX is an egotistical liar?
VFX has taken down most of his old videos, but if you watch Thunderf00t's videos (the Why Do People Laugh At Creationists series) you'll see lots of VFX clips, and see him called out for his lying.
This is why some Christians don't like debating Atheists, they keep coming up with new excuses to point out another Christian as a liar, hypocrite, or egotistical jerk. If you call a comedian a moron can't tell good jokes and he gets at least a crowd of 100 people to laugh, is he still a moron?
And I don't understand your point about the comedian. He could very well be a moron and get 100 people to laugh. The two aren't related. Now if you asked if he could solve quantum physics problems and still be a moron... that's a different story.
By the way, mockery and scorn, when done in an immature or aggressive fashion, can easily be construed as hatred, even if the thesaurus you looked it up in doesn't quote hatred as being a synonym of scorn.
Did people like Martin Luther King, Rosa Parks, Ronald Regan, and Billy Graham deserve to be mocked just because they stood strongly for what they believed in and didn't water down their statements and beliefs? You tell me.
You're going to call two of the most respected conservatives of the 20th Century a**holes, and then expect me to keep arguing back and forth with you? You have another thing coming if you honestly believe that.
"Hate" speech is typically considered to be threatening.
Is that so? If someone calls a gay person a "faggot" is that threatening? what about calling a black person the "n" word? Neither of these things imply threats. They are words of diresion, and contempt, but not necessarily threats.
You must have your "own" version of a thesaurus because when I looked it up, synonyms for scorn included: condemn, ridicule, reject, scoff, despise(a synonym for hate), jeer, ostracize. Sounds like it's as close to hate as you can get without directly calling it hate.
I don't know if you're aware of this, but there are lots of thesauruses out there, published by different companies, that contain different sets of words!
And in mine, despise wasn't listed as a synonym of scorn.
And you're splitting hairs to a stupid degree. Scorn, derision, mockery. To make fun of. To laugh at.
I still stand by my point that "hate speech" is that which is considered threatening, and certainly CA hasn't done that.
Just look at the name of his video! VFX Forever! That's about as egotistical as you can get.
The guy is a fucking twat, who self promotes and praises himself with his works. He's a smug, arrogant, ignorant prick who plays drama queen games for subscribers.
He claimed he was leaving youtube forever. That was such bullshit. He is a fucking liar.
With statements like the ones you just made: "he is a f**king liar," "he's a smug, arrogant, ignorant prick who plays drama queen games for subscribers," and "the guy is a f**king twat," it's no wonder he blocks and censors comments from people like you. Where in the U.S. Constitution does it state that he has to put up with that kind of mockery and slander if he feels it doesn't lead the discussion into anything intelligent? When he receives such hatred, why should he tolerate it at all?
So your best defense is to immaturely call him names in your bitterness and anger, what makes you think you're any better than him when you act that way?
The real "cowards" are the ones who are afraid to approach VFX in a civilized and non hateful manner because they are too lazy to make a comment without vulgarity or some useless insult.
You CAN'T approach him, in any way. He blocks anyone who disagrees.
I shouldn't have to suck his dick just to comment on his channel. All he accepts are ass kissers. Look at his videos. NOT ONE SINGLE ONE that disagrees with him, even politely.
VenomFangX is a bitch although we all knew that I think people should just stop caring altogether about him, stop paying him any attention, eventually he'll find out how insignificant he is and he'll cease to exist.
Christian Hypocrisy?....Check out my video on the subject
Besio222 1 year ago
@Besio222 Did you actually WATCH my video? Do you understand the points I was making?
OccamKant 1 year ago
@OccamKant Yes i watched the whole thing. You are making the point that VenomfangX was exemplifying hypocritical Christian behavior because He made a video that comes across as being a prideful compilation used to glorify his name. You compare this to the fact the Christians are called by God to be Humble yet they are prideful (You use another Christians video to point this out). You became the Judge in this case by making a video that points all this type of Hypocritical behavior out. Right?
Besio222 1 year ago
@Besio222 Yes, though of course by saying "you became the judge" I can see that you're trying to use a logical fallacy to attack my point.
I didn't "judge" - I just pointed out the hypocrisy of a Christian saying that you should be humble, and the #1 You Tube Christian being exactly the opposite.
We see the same pattern all over the place in Church - Ted Haggard, the Pope.
Religion leads to hypocrisy obviously.
OccamKant 1 year ago
Comment removed
Besio222 1 year ago
@OccamKant I encourage and challenge you to read the Bible yourself and pray to Jesus to see if He really exists. Don't compare yourself with people that call themselves Christians and try to convert you with bad evangelism, compare yourself with God's word and Pray to Him through Jesus Christ. If you want watch my video in response of your video, also the video I made entitle Christian Walk. God Bless you. Christians may be hypocrites, but God is not.
Besio222 1 year ago
@Besio222 I have read the bible, and I'm more familiar with it than many of the Christians I've argued with (it's like they have 5 favorite passages and are completely oblivious to the rest of it).
God is CERTAINLY a hypocrite - at lest the God of the bible.
He lies, he murders, he commits adultery, he steals. He commits pretty much every sin - though I guess perhaps he doesn't take his own name in vain. That would be difficult to do.
OccamKant 1 year ago
@OccamKant The god you know is not the God I know from scripture. I really challenge you to pray to Jesus. I have been transformed by the spirit, you can too. Just try it
Besio222 1 year ago
@Besio222 I have tried it. I used to be a believer, but not because I ever felt that there was someone there, just because I had a lot of believers around me, and I was brainwashed.
As time went on, I started to realize that there was no-one on the other end of my "prayer phone" and I just hung up and realized that it's all a myth.
OccamKant 1 year ago
@OccamKant
so in other words, you just contradicted yourself. you said you USED to be a believer, (I'm assuming you meant that you were a Christian) but believing in Jesus doesn't mean you're a christian. Satin believes in Jesus. "Just because you had a lot of believers around you" That means you "believed in Jesus for the wrong intentions. the Bible say's that in order to BE a true christian you have to do 2 things, A)repent, aka turning your back from sin & B) Trust in Jesus. u did neither.
eaglrombie13 1 year ago
@eaglrombie13 I believed in a God, just not the Christian form. Even as a child, the idea of a loving god creating a place of eternal torture was ridiculous and I rejected it out of hand. But I still believed in some kind of god.
How could I believe in the bible, a book so full of lies, hate and superstition? Also as a child I could see this clearly. I only feel sad that so many of you willingly deceive yourselves.
OccamKant 1 year ago
@OccamKant
I see. well Occam, lets go through this step by step. Would a JUST God, allow law breakers free? without consequence? If so, then God should allow Hitler into Heaven. and there would be no reason to be "good" or OBEY God, because we could do WHATEVER we want.. does that make sense? :] And look Occam, I know you can't tell because we're on the computer typing, but i ask you these things in a loving way, because I'm concerned for you. Where have you personally found the bible to lie?
eaglrombie13 1 year ago
@eaglrombie13 The bible lies all the time, and you know it, or you wouldn't be trying to make excuses for it all the time.
As for a just god - punishment is not ETERNAL. That is nothing more than sadistic torture. And anyway - according to YOUR creed, if a murdering rapist has a deathbed conversion, then he goes to heaven anyway, doesn't he? So where is the justice in that?
OccamKant 1 year ago
@OccamKant
Sir, i will continue our conversation via comments, a simple 450 character slot does not suffice for what needs to be said in rebuttal :P Follow me there :) I'll add you as a friend! ^_^
eaglrombie13 1 year ago
@eaglrombie13 If you would like to rebut me, and have a lot to say, the best thing would be to make a video.
OccamKant 1 year ago
@OccamKant haha, well that wouldn't be too bad, the only thing is that i don't have a working webcam :( and PLUS its something i already wrote, i suppose i could break it down to 3 different comments if you'd like? =]
eaglrombie13 1 year ago
@eaglrombie13 I read what you wrote, and you wrote FAR more than you needed to. You are repeating yourself. I've also already addressed everything you brought up in your letter. Rather than repeating myself, please watch the rest of my videos for my rebuttals to your points.
OccamKant 1 year ago
Fuck all these religions. They're all bullshit.
bnbalenda 2 years ago
i love this vid, venomfangx is an idiot!!!
underclassdamnriot 3 years ago 2
Solid gold editing my friend -- lol!
I love how the reward they offer for being humble is glory in heaven -- isn't an act of humility then just merely an attempt to gain deferred glory? Round and round we go.
Cainer666 3 years ago
Well, hypocrisy is certainly not a new concept to the run of the mill christian. ;)
OccamKant 3 years ago
You seem to forget that I have had a diologue with you about God. You don't like Him nor do you trust Him. In fact, your whole journey towards athiesm is because of your wrong conclution that God sends innocent people to hell. Why do athiests spend so much time trying to argue about the Word of God if they don't believe in Him at all?
BudManInChrist 3 years ago
My wrong analogy that God sends innocent people to hell? How is it wrong? If I don't accept jesus as my savior (from himself) (sounds like one of the Sopranos) then I'm going to hell, regardless how good I am in life, how many people I help.
God doesn't exist. I don't trust or distrust him. He's fictional. He is the same as Santa, Voldemort and Darth Vader.
Get that through your thick skull -- HE IS THE SAME AS VADER - NONEXISTANT.
OccamKant 3 years ago
I will certainly agree with VFX on one of his points however. Your anger and frustration are not really aimed at him but at God who in your heart you know exists.
BudManInChrist 3 years ago
No. My anger is directed at ignorant, arrogant, obstinant CHRISTIANS.
I've said it a thousand times (well, maybe 10 times) that fictional characters like Darth Vader, Voldemort, Sauron & God don't make me angry.
OccamKant 3 years ago
Tell me - are YOU angry at Vishnu, the hindu god? Are YOU angry at Allah? Are YOU angry at Zeus? Ra? Ba'al? Mithras? Horus?
No? Don't believe in them, so they don't affect you? Guess what. I don't believe in YOUR god, just like you don't believe in these ones.
OccamKant 3 years ago
Your analogy about parenthood only applies when one is the parent of a child. You are not VFX's parent and therefore have no right to chastise him. Besides I certainly wouldn't call your behavior towards him parentlike to any degree, rather I would call it hatred.
BudManInChrist 3 years ago
If someone acts in such a way to stir up anger, what do you expect?
VFX is an ignorant, arrogant liar, spreading his lies. How would you feel if someone went around brashly spreading lies about something you knew to be true. I'm not talking about the god fairy tale, I'm talking about actual science.
If you guys really hated science so much, you should abandon it and go become amish.
Otherwise, grow up.
OccamKant 3 years ago
And anyway - I wasn't talking about being his parent. It could be any adult watching a child misbehave - a teacher, a babysitter, whatever.
If you were taking care of a child, and he was running around breaking things, yelling, and generally being a little shit, would you say "Cut him some slack" or would you try to make him behave, be civilized?
OccamKant 3 years ago
I personally do not agree with some things that VFX does. I think that he should allow comments from detractors. He should allow opposing views on his comments section. I read JF777's comments on his page and you have athiests who comment that they respect him for allowing them to respond to his videos. But it also seems that JF is alot older than VFX and is more mature. I chalk it up to age. You live and you learn. VFX will as well. Give him a break.
BudManInChrist 3 years ago
"Give him a break."
Absolutely not. If someone is being a dick, you tell them so, so they learn NOT to be a dick. If we let him get away with being a little asshole like he is, he will never learn humility, and he will just grow up to be a bigger asshole.
Do you train children in the right ways by letting them do the bad things they do, or do you try to correct their behaviour?
OccamKant 3 years ago
It's interesting that you mention parenthood in terms of behavior. One can easily make the same case with God. He has rules for living so that people can learn the right way to live and not go to their own destruction. But with God He also is the Soverign Lord who created all things and by right He can do what He wishes with His creation.
BudManInChrist 3 years ago
I have a great god parenting analogy.
I have a two year old daughter in my kitchen with a bright shiny bottle of open drain cleaner, and a bottle of Coke.
I tell her that to drink from the Coke is okay, but she will die if she drinks from the drain cleaner. I then tie a bright balloon onto the drain cleaner and surround it with stuffed animals. Then I leave the room.
Later, after she has poisoned herself, instead of dialing 911, I place her in the oven at 400 degrees, for ETERNITY.
smaugfrost 3 years ago
Sounds like a pretty accurate retelling of Eden to me.
I mean seriously, if God didn't want us eating from the tree, why put it there? If he's omniscient, wouldn't he KNOW that we were going to eat from it? And then why pretend to be surprised? What happened to his omniscience? And pretending, that sounds like dishonesty to me.
This god guy is pretty messed up.
OccamKant 3 years ago
yes but God didnt tempt us to do it satan did and God gives us freedom to do it so if you as the parent tells them whats right from wrong and watches them and someone comes in and decorates then she eats it you would give her a chance to apologise besides that like commiting suicide and is completely different then what you were trying to get at
that70sshowaddict 2 years ago
It wasn't satan, it was a serpent, and it wasn't a lie, he told the truth.
The rest of your message is a little incomprehensible.
OccamKant 2 years ago
your right im sorry he twisted the truth to make it sound good thats is why we say he is the king of deceit
that70sshowaddict 2 years ago
"he is the king of deceit"
...who was placed in the garden by god, for the express purpose of tempting Eve.
Then god punished the serpent for acting according to the way HE had made it and programmed it, and god punished man for falling for the temptation god had placed in the garden.
And all the while, god KNEW ahead of time that all this would happen, even before making man, the snake, or the garden.
So, god knowingly created a flawed being in order to punish it eternally.
smaugfrost 2 years ago
"...yes but God didnt tempt us to do it satan did and god gives us freedom to do it..."
Tempting someone means to place an object of temptation in their path, as god did with the tree of knowledge.
God granting us the "freedom" to do it, is akin to parents standing in the room and allowing the child to drink Drano, "just to show her consequences to her actions"
The Serpent was PLACED in the garden by god. God allowed sin to enter the garden first (as the devil), then blamed it on man.
smaugfrost 2 years ago
Let me ask you something OccamKant, were you a humble person at 22? Do you know that VFX has only been a christian for 2 years? Have you not read the book of 1 Corinthians where Paul rebukes the Corinthian believers for their pride? He calls them carnal. Apparently not. Also you are generalizing when you say that all christians are Hypocrites. But I guess you have to believe in something to be a hypocrite huh.
BudManInChrist 3 years ago
I'm not humble, no. But I don't pretend to be, and I don't pretend to be a part of a religion which demands humility and grovelling.
OccamKant 3 years ago
Also, no - you don't have to believe in anything to be a hypocrite. You just have to not practice what you preach.
OccamKant 3 years ago
And the clip you showed of JF777 repeating VFX's name wasn't even from the same video, it was off "reason for Atheism."
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
JF wasn't repeating VFX's name. I had him repeating the word "Humble", but Youtube butchered the audio so it's not very clear.
I was trying to point out, with some sarcastic humor, that what VFX is doing is the opposite of humble.
And I'm aware that I took JF's clip from a different video. That's irrelevant - he was talking about humility, and how important it was. I just used that to show how VFX has none.
OccamKant 3 years ago
Watch the rest of the video before judging him. There's also brief clips of a stupid emo kid and a long haired pissed off guy telling VFX that they hope he dies, gets cancer, dies a violent death, gets infected with AIDS, and/or call him a stupid piece of sh*t. The video is not "just" of people saying his name, although you'd like to lead yourself to believe that.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
Well, I watched 3 minutes of self aggrandizement. Why should I watch more in the hopes that he actually does something worth watching?
And posting videos of people talking about him, regardless of good or bad, is still being egotistical and the opposite of humble.
OccamKant 3 years ago
He posted the brief threatening videos on purpose to show everyone that he was not lying about the death threats. I guarantee you if there were as many people who posted videos towards an Atheist or a Muslim here on Youtube, that person would probably post a similar video of all the users chanting their name. Not like it's right, but less than 10% of the people shown on his VFX Forever video weren't even of people speaking positively of him. Now how does that prove he was being egotistical?
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
I'm sure that CapnoAwesome gets far more death threats for the stuff he does against islam than VFX gets.
OccamKant 3 years ago
Whether that's true or not, CapnOAwesome has also posted hate videos towards VenomFangX, LifeofApollos, and Jezuzfreek777, whereas the ones mentioned have not done the same towards him.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
Define "Hate" videos.
There is NO WAY that CapnOAwesome has posted any videos threatening these guys. He will mock them mercilessly, but that would be "Scorn" videos, not "Hate" videos.
OccamKant 3 years ago
Scornful is a synonym for hateful, look it up in the thesaurus if you disagree.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
"Hate" speech is typically considered to be threatening.
I repeat: I've never seen CapnOAwesome leave a video threatening anyone. He mocks them, scorns them, but never threatens them.
OccamKant 3 years ago
This might be my last comment to you: when did VFX every threaten anyone, did he say "agree with me or burn you worthless sinner" or "you're a moron so there's no hope for you?" Some of his methods might be unorthodox, but that doesn't mean he deserves to be treated like scum and filth because of it.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
Actually, he DOES say that the people who don't agree with him are going to burn. Have you not watched any of his videos?
And when I say he lies, I'm talking about how he talks about evolution. He knows nothing of evolution, yet talks as though he's an expert.
He talks about cosmology without understanding anything about it.
He talks about geology without understanding anything about it.
And when Thunderf00t calls him out, he runs away crying like a baby.
OccamKant 3 years ago
It looks like you're set in your ways and you apparently won't like him unless he changes to satisy "your standards." So this discussion apparently is through.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
Excellent! Rather than addressing my points, attack me ad-hominem then run away.
Bye!
OccamKant 3 years ago
Great comeback. Because I don't want to argue anymore, I am running away? You sir are a prime example of why Christians don't take you seriously because you act foolish in assuming that they have to keep arguing with you until one side is convinced that the other is right. I guess there's no such thing as 'agreeing to disagree' anymore with you is there?
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
You're running away because you refuse to address my points.
You continue to sidetrack, and when I point this out (aggressively, as is my wont) you say you're going to leave.
Address my points and we can get back to a calm, levelheaded discussion.
OccamKant 3 years ago
Actually, this argument is probably not even remotely fair and balanced because the majority of your viewers are probably those who side with you on your beliefs and opinions. I'm not running away, I am choosing not to cast my pearls before swine. In other words, I am willingly choosing not to continue this "debate" when you've already made it perfectly clear that even if I do address your points, you're going to find some way to refute them, even if your points don't make sense.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
Go back to your original comment on this video then.
I was pointing out that VFX is the opposite of humble.
After the dust settles, are you going to agree or disagree that he's egotistical?
OccamKant 3 years ago
Frankly, that's a minute point. Honestly, I am almost sick to death of arguing back and forth with VFX haters who spend all their energy trying to convince people like me that he is a bigot, a liar, and a threat to the human race. It annoys the crap out of me, and people need to realize that they could do better things than waste their time attacking one individual on Youtube.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
Again - you completely avoid my points.
The video we're commenting on here was illustrating how VFX is NOT humble, which is apparently an important christian trait (JF gives 3 bible passages regarding it). He is in fact egotistical.
It's not a minute point, it's the ENTIRE point.
If you want to avoid addressing it, then you're just doing the typical dishonest christian thing and running away rather than admitting defeat.
OccamKant 3 years ago
Doesn't that seem rather one sided, to assume I am either running away or that I should admit defeat?Right, let's completely ignore the notion that maybe some Atheists aren't as intelligent as they claim to be if they're going to draw 2 conclusions that make only them look good in the end. I answered your question already by saying that VFX's methods may be unorthodox(meaning he's probably not as humble as he should be).If you could careless about who he is as a whole, why bother to discuss him?
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
Well, VFX made a video talking about himself. That is clearly egotistical. You're supposed to be humble, according to the bible. You're being dishonest if you say otherwise.
If he was a nice guy, who told the truth, and didn't misrepresent science (or reality in general), no-one would mock him, or try to show how hypocritical he is.
But he's a jerk. A really aggressive jerk. That draws people's ire.
OccamKant 3 years ago
Whether or not he truly is hypocritical, that's one Christian on Youtube. If his videos are so contradictory to your beliefs and opinions, maybe you should stop watching them because there is no reason why he should personally apologize to people just because they choose to get offended.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
If you see someone spreading lies, do you just let them go on doing it, or do you try to do something about it?
OccamKant 3 years ago
Well, Bill Clinton got away with it for eight years, why was he never kicked out of the Oval Office?
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
? We're not talking about bill clinton. Or Georgie (who's lied far more than clinton).
We're talking about VFX, and dishonest YouTube christians in general.
OccamKant 3 years ago
Dishonest Youtube Christians in general? Name five that are dishonest, and JezuzFreek777 and LifeofApollos don't count unless you have direct proof that they are, not just your own assumption.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
Well, YOU are being dishonest right now actually.
I've pointed out that VFX is not humble but egotistical. Rather than saying "Yeah, you're right. He is" which is the truth, you're defending him, or trying to distract the conversation away.
That's dishonest.
OccamKant 3 years ago
So now the attention is being diverted towards me. Watch out, you don't want to "stroke my ego" if you focus all your points towards me since you think VFX's ego is being stroked by posting short clips of people talking about him. And yes, that last statement was out of sarcasm.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
You're not stroking your own ego. VFX is.
So I'm saying that you are being dishonest, at least in this discussion, in your reluctance to recognize VFX's hypocrisy. I never said you were egotistical.
You asked me for 5 dishonest christians. I don't actually keep notes, I just see what happens in debates like this, when the christian I'm talking to refuses to acknowledge when he's wrong.
OccamKant 3 years ago
Tell me this: If you wanting me to acknowledge I'm wrong because you believe beyond the shadow of a doubt you're right, or do you want me to say I'm wrong just so you can say to yourself "yes, I won the argument, the idiot didn't see it coming?"
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
Neither.
I just want you to acknowledge the simple fact that making a video where at least the first 3 minutes of which is people saying your name is egotistical.
That's all.
I don't think you're an idiot. I just think you're biased.
OccamKant 3 years ago
Honestly, I think it was just a bit of sarcasm since so many people made videos about him and towards him. If he really wanted to be egotistical as you claimed, he could have just posted a 5 minute video of himself saying how awesome and amazing he is for his views and opinions that support Creationism. By the way, I am a Christian myself, so what makes you think I am going to side with the Atheists just because you feel I should? If that makes me biased, sorry, but I am not here to please you.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
I would hope that you wouldn't think of it as an "Atheist vs Christian" thing.
VFX is being egotistical. Regardless of whether or not an atheist points this out, you should be able to recognize the fact.
If your priest pointed this out, you'd agree with him in a second.
The fact that I, as an atheist, point this out makes you want to disagree, on principle.
Why can't we discuss matters as two humans, rather than as an atheist and a christian?
OccamKant 3 years ago
Mainly because as a Christian, I have yet to meet or see an Atheist who is able to "agree to disagree" on anything a Christian discusses with him. Secondly, I've never seen a video on here by an Atheist that hasn't attempted to call Christians idiots or other names and then act all immature and say that they're wrong no matter how many explainations they give for what they believe in. I don't feel like we've established any common ground on the matter being discussed.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
Well, which of my videos are calling christians names, or idiots? I don't think I've done that.
Other than pointing out in this video how VFX is egotistical. I called it "Christian Hypocrisy" because it *is* hypocritical, and I've seen self-aggrandizement from other christians as well.
OccamKant 3 years ago
I'd be more than happy to have a calm, rational discussion with you. All I ask is that you be honest. That's it.
It should be easy to keep personal attacks out of it, as long as we're being honest with each other and with ourselves.
And I'm perfectly happy to try to establish common ground. Where would you suggest we start?
OccamKant 3 years ago
Not sure really. Give me a few days to think about it because I want to be 100% certain I know what I am getting myself into. The only way I'm willing to debate is if it's done without slander and mockery, personal bias, and without hatred or bitterness, and there's an equal amount of support for both sides of the discussion.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
Sure. I'll leave all mockery, hatred & bitterness at the door. All I ask is honesty, and the willingness for either side to admit they're wrong about something.
If one's unwilling to ever admit that they're wrong, they've closed themself off to any kind of new understanding.
I can't promise a lack of bias. That's pretty hard to guarantee, though of course I'll try.
OccamKant 3 years ago
"If one's unwilling to ever admit that they're wrong, they've closed themself off to any kind of new understanding." Doesn't that imply that someone should admit they are wrong even if they are strong enough in their beliefs to claim that they are not? Call it a hunch, but from what it sounds like, you're wanting the debate to go in such a way to where you end up being victorious, despite anything I might lay out that could possibly end up being the opposite.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
Nope. I've been debated into changing my mind before, so I'm completely open to it being me that is wrong.
I've already admitted to being wrong, by admitting to losing my temper.
I'm not debating with christians because I want to "beat them". I care about getting to the Truth.
I've had terriffic debates, where it's like a great game of chess. I love those. I just don't like it when the opponent tosses the chessboard off the table rather than concede a point.
OccamKant 3 years ago
Well, not all debates are equal, some end in a job well done from both sides, while others end in one side or the other leaving their argument incomplete.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
Yes, that's very true.
OccamKant 3 years ago
Plus, if your statement is true, and neither side admits to being wrong, then how would either side know which opinions and beliefs made more sense?
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
Well, I guess I'm of the opinion that for a given point, there can only be one truth, but many falsehoods.
If two people are discussing and cannot come to an honest agreement about something, there must be something else there that is not being discussed, but is preventing agreement.
It may be bias, it may be pride, or it may be something else entirely.
So I'm hoping that we can overcome that and come to agreements, regardless which side of the "fence" the agreement is on.
OccamKant 3 years ago
"If two people are discussing and cannot come to an honest agreement about something, there must be something else there that is not being discussed, but is preventing agreement." That is true, but the problem is what wasn't discussed that hasn't already been addressed.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
It can be tricky to find out what the thorn in the side of the debate is. It's not always found.
OccamKant 3 years ago
So you want to have a calm and rational debate? Let's schedule it for 2-3 weeks from now and decide where and when to have it. We can each invite our Youtube friends to join in on the debate and be allowed at least one buffer to offer additional input if necessary. Sound like a plan?
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
You want to make this a big, formal debate? Do you mean in the comment section, or as videos, or what?
OccamKant 3 years ago
Like in a chat room or something similar.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
I would be happier with one-on-one, public or private (doesn't matter) than group-on-group.
I think it'd be easier to keep tempers under control if there are less people involved.
OccamKant 3 years ago
Well, I don't have a video camera that I can use to upload videos here on Youtube, so a video-to-video debate might not work out well. Secondly, if we did the debate in a chat room, we could everyone except the ones debating and then allow others to give their input once the debate is over.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
Ok, sure. Let's arrange something.
Anyway, I'm sleepy now and off to bed. Gnight.
OccamKant 3 years ago
I meant we could "mute" all the observers and listeners throughout the duration of the debate.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
Like the idea that there may be only one way to heaven? That Jesus Christ may actually be the truth? I would like to think that according to your statement that there would only be one way to God and not many. If you are so concerned about the truth then why is it that you believe there is no God?
BudManInChrist 3 years ago
Because there is no evidence for god. None. And in fact, the more we do research, the more we understand the completely natural processes that brought everything about.
The bible *could not* be true. And the more we learn, the more false it's shown to be.
OccamKant 3 years ago
Do you accept evolution, or are you a creationist?
OccamKant 3 years ago
Even Jesus gave the hypocritical pharisees the smack down.
OccamKant 3 years ago
I will agree with you on that. However, only God can be the judge of another person's actions, it's not our duty to point out every single, tiny error that they make in life, regardless of whether or not we think they were in the wrong. If VFX felt like his ego was getting the best of him, he'll have to answer to God for it.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
Actually, you ARE supposed to judge VFX:
1 Cor 5:12-13 What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside? God will judge those outside. "Expel the wicked man from among you."
So you SHOULD judge VFX, because you two are inside the church. It's up to God to judge me though. :)
OccamKant 3 years ago
That means to judge righteously and coherently. If I make an assumption about someone and then I turn around and do what I accused them of, then I am wrongfully judging them. However, can we agree that whether or not I accept your statement that "VenomFangX was egotistical" that it was not about winning or losing an argument, just an acknowledgment of what the real conclusion was?
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
I guess... I think you're being too careful here though. I understand that you don't want to go around being harsh on people, but you should also recognize when their behaviour needs a tune up.
OccamKant 3 years ago
Oh believe me I do what I can. If you remember GlenReb, I personally cannot stand him because he exemplifies EVERYTHING a Christian should not be. I think he is just using the term "Christian" to give other Christians who are the opposite of him a bad name. I have called him out at least twice on his hypocrisy, but he has yet replied to me.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
I'd also like to point out that you had no problem judging me, and pointing out that I reacted with anger. That was something I did in the heat of the moment.
VFX's video must have taken a very long time to string all that together. That's a cold, calculated work, meaning much more thought and intention behind it.
Are you judging atheists and christians by the same yardstick?
OccamKant 3 years ago
It's not like I've planted a trap or anything -- the whole POINT of my video is that VFX is being egotistical.
You should always be able to recognize when people are wrong, even people you respect. Christopher Hitchens, for example, is someone who I agree with *somewhat*, but not in everything. I'm actually quite against him in some things.
It's healthy to be skeptical, and keep a critical eye on things.
OccamKant 3 years ago
Who says that he is lying?
BudManInChrist 3 years ago
Venomfangx I mean.
BudManInChrist 3 years ago
He's lying because he makes all these stupid claims about science, and when he's corrected, rather than changing his tune, he CONTINUES with the bullshit.
That's what infuriates us.
OccamKant 3 years ago
I'm offended at his lies, not his hypocrisy. I don't care if he's a bad christian. But I'd like to point out to others that he is, so maybe he won't be able to persuade them with his lies.
OccamKant 3 years ago
You'll disagree with this, but what many of you Atheists call lies, us Christians call "truth that Atheists don't want to hear."
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
There is no such thing as a "truth we don't want to hear".
We want evidence. Testable evidence. We want to understand the world around us, so we take it apart, create laws & theories to describe it.
What "truths" do we not want to hear, but are actual truths?
OccamKant 3 years ago
"...if they're going to draw 2 conclusions that make only them look good in the end."
I'm proposing this conclusion because I've won the argument, obviously.
When you have checkmate in chess, you call out checkmate. You don't dilly dally.
OccamKant 3 years ago
If I wanted to continue this discussion with you for hours on end, you would clearly see that you were far from winning this argument. How can you win an argument that hasn't convinced me personally that you were right and I was wrong?
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
Obviously I won't convince you if you refuse to examine facts.
How am I wrong in my assertion that VFX is an egotistical liar?
VFX has taken down most of his old videos, but if you watch Thunderf00t's videos (the Why Do People Laugh At Creationists series) you'll see lots of VFX clips, and see him called out for his lying.
OccamKant 3 years ago
This is why some Christians don't like debating Atheists, they keep coming up with new excuses to point out another Christian as a liar, hypocrite, or egotistical jerk. If you call a comedian a moron can't tell good jokes and he gets at least a crowd of 100 people to laugh, is he still a moron?
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
I'm afraid I don't understand your point here.
What new excuse am I bringing up?
And I don't understand your point about the comedian. He could very well be a moron and get 100 people to laugh. The two aren't related. Now if you asked if he could solve quantum physics problems and still be a moron... that's a different story.
OccamKant 3 years ago
And what points have I made that dont' make any sense?
OccamKant 3 years ago
By the way, mockery and scorn, when done in an immature or aggressive fashion, can easily be construed as hatred, even if the thesaurus you looked it up in doesn't quote hatred as being a synonym of scorn.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
Obviously mockery, scorn & ridicule are going to have unpleasant emotion attached to them.
But I hope you agree that it's much better to mock someone than to threaten them.
Go back over all my videos, all my comments. I have never once threatened anyone, or wished pain on them.
You guys are always laughing with glee at the thought of us atheists crisping up forever.
Who's got more ill will, eh?
OccamKant 3 years ago
Also - I never said he deserved to be threatened. I don't think anyone deserves to be threatened. I just don't believe he was.
He certainly deserves to be mocked. If he's going to be so inflammitory, he has to expect some pushback.
OccamKant 3 years ago
Did people like Martin Luther King, Rosa Parks, Ronald Regan, and Billy Graham deserve to be mocked just because they stood strongly for what they believed in and didn't water down their statements and beliefs? You tell me.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
MLK & Rosa Parks, as far as I know, weren't liars.
Billy Graham is an asshole, and so was Regan, so yeah, they totally deserve to be mocked.
And I'm trash talking VFX because he is a LIAR, not because he's standing for his beliefs.
I don't respect liars. You shouldn't either.
OccamKant 3 years ago
You're going to call two of the most respected conservatives of the 20th Century a**holes, and then expect me to keep arguing back and forth with you? You have another thing coming if you honestly believe that.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
I'm not really interested in discussing Regan or Graham, so let's just drop them.
OccamKant 3 years ago
"Hate" speech is typically considered to be threatening.
Is that so? If someone calls a gay person a "faggot" is that threatening? what about calling a black person the "n" word? Neither of these things imply threats. They are words of diresion, and contempt, but not necessarily threats.
BudManInChrist 3 years ago
Actually, I just did. Hate is NOT a synonym for scorn in my thesaurus.
OccamKant 3 years ago
You must have your "own" version of a thesaurus because when I looked it up, synonyms for scorn included: condemn, ridicule, reject, scoff, despise(a synonym for hate), jeer, ostracize. Sounds like it's as close to hate as you can get without directly calling it hate.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
I don't know if you're aware of this, but there are lots of thesauruses out there, published by different companies, that contain different sets of words!
And in mine, despise wasn't listed as a synonym of scorn.
And you're splitting hairs to a stupid degree. Scorn, derision, mockery. To make fun of. To laugh at.
I still stand by my point that "hate speech" is that which is considered threatening, and certainly CA hasn't done that.
OccamKant 3 years ago
Just look at the name of his video! VFX Forever! That's about as egotistical as you can get.
The guy is a fucking twat, who self promotes and praises himself with his works. He's a smug, arrogant, ignorant prick who plays drama queen games for subscribers.
He claimed he was leaving youtube forever. That was such bullshit. He is a fucking liar.
OccamKant 3 years ago
I think you need to watch the video again. I don't recall him saying literally "I am leaving Youtube permanently 'or' forever."
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
He did. But he's taken the video down, so we can't watch it.
OccamKant 3 years ago
With statements like the ones you just made: "he is a f**king liar," "he's a smug, arrogant, ignorant prick who plays drama queen games for subscribers," and "the guy is a f**king twat," it's no wonder he blocks and censors comments from people like you. Where in the U.S. Constitution does it state that he has to put up with that kind of mockery and slander if he feels it doesn't lead the discussion into anything intelligent? When he receives such hatred, why should he tolerate it at all?
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
He IS all those things. If you watch his videos, I've never seen such as smug, arrogant & ignorant asshole.
What do YOU call someone who's being an asshole? Seriously dude.
And don't get distracted by the words I choose to vent my frustration. The guy is dishonest and egotistical. You can't get around that.
And the fact that he is the OPPOSITE of humility shows he's not much of a christian. He's just a hypocrite.
OccamKant 3 years ago
So your best defense is to immaturely call him names in your bitterness and anger, what makes you think you're any better than him when you act that way?
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
No, that's not my best defense. That's me giving into my anger, which I will agree is something I should work on.
OccamKant 3 years ago
Do you know WHY he receives such hatred? Because he treats the truth like shit. He lies. People get pissed off at liars.
I don't care if he blocks me, or others, who are trying to leave comments. It just goes to show what a coward he is.
OccamKant 3 years ago
The real "cowards" are the ones who are afraid to approach VFX in a civilized and non hateful manner because they are too lazy to make a comment without vulgarity or some useless insult.
Rawk4Life 3 years ago
You CAN'T approach him, in any way. He blocks anyone who disagrees.
I shouldn't have to suck his dick just to comment on his channel. All he accepts are ass kissers. Look at his videos. NOT ONE SINGLE ONE that disagrees with him, even politely.
OccamKant 3 years ago
people telling other people what to do and believe is completely un-humble.
windham666 3 years ago
I hate bible quoting, they may as well preach Harry Potter at me or any other work of fiction.
KerryPanda 3 years ago 2
Hypochristianity in action.
Pronghorn22 3 years ago
VenomFangX is a bitch although we all knew that I think people should just stop caring altogether about him, stop paying him any attention, eventually he'll find out how insignificant he is and he'll cease to exist.
Shalek 3 years ago 2
I love your videos, I also invite you to take a look at mine, you may find them interesting, thanks.
mortemdei 3 years ago