Advent Conspiracy '08: Sunset Presbyterian Church, Oregon

[StevoDesign]

SERIOUSLY

Why is there a debate here.

[inertialcapacity]

Dear church, I am john the baptist for the 2nd coming. You should have been expecting me if you knew your bibles and God's nature. The father has sent me. I do not lie. If you were expecting me you would love me and would eagerly listen to my words. My Space: highestprecision. The fact that you did not expect me shows you need help.

[666sexy1]

change your laws on being high on meth

[yarrw]

The new covenant or covenant of the Spirit is this:

Hebrews 8:8-12 / Jer 31:31-34 "....I will put my law within them.....and I will be their God....and they shall all know me...."

1Cor 15:45 The first son of God, Adam became a living soul. The last Adam(Jesus) became a lifegiving spirit.... the first man is of dust, the second is from heaven ... we are the image of the man of dust ... we shall become the image of the man of heaven.

[yarrw]

maybe the correct time for the birth of Jesus would be the Jewish day of atonement (reconciliation) which is round about September/October

[Irishdandy1]

@yarrw:

Yes, that may be the actual time for His birth, however at the time that people began to celebrate his birth, they did not know for sure, so they celebrated it in December as a representation of His birth.

[yarrw]

Wasn't it Roman Emperor Constantine who called the Jews 'odious people' and then deliberately chose pagan festivals instead of biblical ones.

[Irishdandy1]

Roman Emperor Constantine was not baptized Christian until his deathbed. Also Christianity isn't based upon people, people make mistakes, people are corrupt and won't always make the right choice, no Christianity is based upon God and His morals.

[yarrw]

In bible school I discovered that Christmas and Easter are both pagan holidays from Roman times. While helping out with bible translation I discovered that Heaven is pagan also. What about the "New Earth" of Rev 21 2Pet 3:13 Isaiah 66 etc.

[1022603]

my church made this video XD napervill alleluigha

[crashman1203]

I don't think you have to be religious to appreciate this. I don't believe in Jesus any more than I believe in Allah, Dionysus, Krishnah, Zeus, Ba'al or Mithra, but I think this is a great message--every year we drive ourselves deep(er) into debt to buy stuff we don't need. Christmas--religious or not--should be about family and friends, not gifts. 5/5...and very well produced.

[Irishdandy1]

to crashman1203:

i agree, this does send out a good message, however the only problem with what you are telling us is that Jesus happens to be a real person, who was actually born. Allah is the hindu version of god, krishnah, hindu god, etc, but Jesus was actually born in historical records, His birth marks the point in time where the year 0 began and the first century followed. believe in God or not, Jesus is real.

[yarrw]

There is no year 0 on the current solar calendar. The early Christian church didn't understand the concept.

[Irishdandy1]

@yarrw:

yes, there is a year 0, what do you think the year was after BC 1? its called BC because it stands for Before Christ. When it hit year 0, it was the birth of Christ.

[yarrw]

By our modern understanding of zero you would be correct but we are talking about the early Christian church and they weren't well educated so we need to subtract one from any calculation of the number of years to any date BC.

[Irishdandy1]

@ yarrw:

do you have ANY proof whatsoever that states that they were not well educated? What you are saying is hard to believe because there is nothing to back it up.

[yarrw]

Only the mistakes they made. They obviously chose Roman year 750 (a nice round number) as the birth date of Christ and then didn't have any concept zero so we have to subtract 1 when calculating dates BC.

[Irishdandy1]

Where did you get the 750 BC from? Of course people had a concept of zero, you can't do math without the number zero.

[yarrw]

Look at Roman numerals. Is there a zero? Christianity originates from the Roman empire. Our modern numbers are Arabic.

[Irishdandy1]

No, actually Christianity originates from Judaism, Judaism branched off and began to add things to their religion that were not true to God's morals, so the religion that stuck to the true path was renamed Catholicism, since Judaism decided to keep it's name. (judaism wasnt a roman religion, just some romans happened to be christian)

[yarrw]

That's not a recommendation since in we see in Romans 8:2 "The law of the Spirit of life(Christ Jesus) has set me free from the law of sin and death". What is religion (true or otherwise) if it isn't 'law of sin and death'?

John 6:63 "It is the Spirit that gives life. The flesh (religion) is useless" but

I Cor 3 tells us that religion does have a use as babysitter for the 'babes in Christ'

[Irishdandy1]

how can you just assume that religion is what they mean by flesh? it actually isnt what they mean. What they were saying was that were are here to serve God, we are here to prove to Him that we are worthy in our soul to be in heaven with Him. It is not our bodies, our material things that matter, it is our souls and relationship with Him. It is He that gives us life. The material things are useless.

[yarrw]

Since there is no more paradise(garden in Eden) we find that this world and the churches are the closest thing to the tree of good and evil (or knowledge of) because evil needs law to be controlled. That is what Governments and churches seem to do best. Make laws.

The bible teaches that people who have the Spirit do not break Gods laws and in theory should be free of sin. In reality there was only one who did that, Jesus.

[Irishdandy1]

also at your first quote, the 'law of sin and death' is lust, greed, material things, etc that are sinful and deadly to our souls. if we keep doing those sins, we will be eternally punished in hell. Christ Jesus set us free from these things, and everyone who will listen to Him and follow God's will will be free.

[yarrw]

The 'Law of sin and death' in the Jewish religion of st Paul is Gen 2:17. Christianity uses Paul's letter to the Romans 5:12 I think (original sin). This was the only law in the garden of Eden which told Adam a basic truth; If you sin you will die.

In the protestant churches this is also called the Adamic covenant.

[JakeBatchelor]

I am very proud of my church for this movie. Best movie I ever saw from any church I have ever heard of.

[guywithfuzzyface]

But isn't one of the reasons the unemployment is up is because we spent less for Christmas this year? Circuit City was counting on us to spend and now 30,000 people are out of work. But this does not make the video wrong. Just the world is messed up. And we Christians are not of the world.

[c12crush]

this is completeyl true. every christmas is exauhsting becuase of all the spending and shopping. it feels like christmas is now only about presents.

[soldiermom2001]

CHRISTmas is about the "gift" that God gave us - His son to save us from eternal damnation. Taking care of others is part of the teachings of Christianity - so helping people in need would be exactly what God would expect of us - so this message is right on.

[yarrw]

Matt 8:22 '..leave the dead to bury their dead ..'. That tells me we have a more serious problem than just sin and eternal damnation. As Jn 3:16 says '... live for ever.'. That tells me I can't agree with Christian doctrine because what is missing is LIFE or 'the spirit of life'. Now that's before we can even begin to discuss sin even though I come from a traditional Presbyterian family.

[flea650]

Unless I'm terribly mistaken, wasn't christmas not celebrated until the 4th century? And was it not meshed with pagan celebrations involving the winter solstice (that is where we get the term "yule")? I understand the point being made and agree with it to an extent; but from a historical perspective, isn't christmas just another celebratory holiday, not a charitable one?

[yarrw]

At bible school I learned that Christmas and Easter were originally pagan festivals. While talking to a bible translator at the same school I was told that heaven is probably a pagan concept as well because the bible mentions a new Earth and new heaven about 4 times.

[guzza72]

An amazing video that I will share with my friends.

[stspry]

this is very meaningful

[outdoorstudios]

That is DEEP

[lilb0mber]

more people should see this video

[lilb0mber]

amazing

[SkooledMedic]

WOW! Great Video, very thought provoking!

This is the type of stuff that we as the church need to be concerned about.