If I'm not mistaken, the footage at the start of the guy on the balcony was shot from the infamous 101 Cromwell Road. If you look on Google maps streetview & stand outside the Holiday Inn, looking slightly to the left, the road layout seems to match.. obviously alot of the cityscape has changed since 1967, new buildings erected, old victorian ones demolished etc.. but the restaurant on the corner is still there, 2 branches of the railway meet up here & go under the A4/ Crmwell rd..Great vid BTW!
You could say his story is sad but Syd found another mountain to climb.The mind is so little understood. Would we have done it better,differently or worse than Syd....who knows.Drugs are really no good either.....unless medical.Give him some credit for being so clever once and surviving so long in a changing world.
If this was about Syd's first trip on acid and it was documented by the band, I find that disturbing. It's like we're seeing where it all started to go wrong for Syd.
@maximusrex1979 i dont know, i think he would have been fucked up eventually even if he didnt do all the acid that he did. that was probably one of the most amazin days he ever had
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Sad Syd Sad Syd Sad Syd Syd Sad Syd Sad Sadsyd Sydsad... Hmmmmm! No nononononononnoo definately not him no!!! Really? Yes.. Definately not him no no no!
Well, i wonder! Is it? Could be! No no definately could not be but maybe it is him!!! SYD???? Is that you??? No? Oh ok! Nope! Definately not him.
The debate below is all very interesting, but not one of you experts has pointed out that the bare-chested dude on the balcony at the beginning of this video is not even Syd Barrett. It's actually one of his flatmates from the time.
its not him on the balcony. It is a friend who was also on acid. the footage is from syds first experience with acid. It was documented by the band and friends of the band. That's why the footage is shot like it is.
The debate above made for some fascinating reading, I think. It is entirely appropriate to discuss Syd here, after all, this is a freaking youtube video, not Syd's gravestone.
I have to side mostly with Lymbo here, as I've never fully understood the Syd fascination. Especially because his popularity is mostly due to the popularity of the Floyd, like how I came to know of him by getting into the Floyd, then hearing "hey did you hear this crazy-awesome guy was their original guitarist?"
Well, this debate carries on over my pages. Personally, I don't give a shit about the rest of the Floyd's work & many of my favorite bands are unheard of 60s acts, like The Monks. A lot of his popularity has to do with how big Pink Floyd got, true, but I imagine if they hadn't he would still be remembered. His influence has been too large, and he was too popular in his day. The Velvets are remembered, & they never even cracked the Billboard top 100 in the 60s.
If you wait a few days they go in right order, there's some sort of messed up lag with youtube comments, I don't know why; it fucked with me for awhile too until i figured out too. Of course, by the time it corrects itself, everyone has posted in the wrong place trying to figure what was going on, so they are still a little messy. Anyway, thank you.
FEELINGVERYPINK: No apologises are necessary, and they might just attract more arguments from less enlightened souls. Life is more beautiful when you avoid the detractors, as i'm sure you already know.
I would also like to say that the majority of the information regarding Syd Barrett's mental condition comes from members of PF--architect school dropouts, not mental health clinicians. Yes, I know thay knew Syd Barrett and I didn't, but I do work in healthcare
Also, it's quite judgmental and quite possibly irresponsible to say if Syd were alive, he wouldn't be a source of information regarding events of his own life. As it's been stated before, no one with the exception of his family knows to what extent he did or did not recover from his breakdown.
He agreed to theraphy in a psychiatric institution,but in his case the pshychiatric medication was considered not reccomendable. However he was diagnosed schizophrenia and bi-polar shyndrome,besides masive brain cell destruction.Of course one can recover from such thing,but you dont recover the dead cells man,you cant recover the memory of that past life. He became a different normal person,Mr. Roger Barrett:painter and gardener,coin collector;but the old Syd never came back from that acid trip.
Really, where did you acquire such information? That contradicts every reliable source I've ever heard, and so what if he did have bipolar disorder and/or schizophrenia, that doesn't mean shit, plenty of people have these problems, myself included, it doesn't mean you're a different person. People that have these problems often develop them in their late teens to early twenties, so if he had it, it was probably coming anyway, acid or not.
It comes from an interview to his sister and it is refered also in Wikipedia. Now Schizophrenia and bipolar disorder is not a common, everyday mental condition as you put it: its considered high risk. Of course its origin was not the acid, but it is well known that LSD abuse does accelerate the damage of that condition and besides the purely psycological damage, LSD creates massive brain cell destruction. This last thing is what really ruined his memory and performing skills.
No, his sister said the opposite, that he had no illnesses, and the references on wikipedia are just theories. Second, you obviously don't know much about these conditions, I'm not about to explain the range of their effects, nor do I feel like defending my knowledge on bipolar disorder when I live with it every fucking day.
The long term effects of LSD use are questionable, the only truly "damaging" one being very rare, HPPD, which he certainly would have been prescribed something for.
Well there is no data of he being treated with any kind of psychiatric medication. His family seemed to be in denial and they certainly neglected Syd in the early days of his rehabilitation process, as they failed to provide him with the treatment he really needed. "Oh no, my boy is alright there is nothing wrong with him". OH and about the medical condition, it is schizophrenia condition that i mean accelelarates with LSD abuse.
So why do you act like it's fact when you have no evidence? Seems isn't a license to assume. How do you know the relationship he had with his family? What makes you so sure his brain was damaged, or he had severe mental problems, if any, or that he didn't recover if he did? What so wrong with putting your past behind you, or retiring to your garden listening to Jazz records? There's no real evidence for anything after his breakdown other than some depression and slight reclusiveness.
OH of course there is nothing wrong with Syd's retirement, i think he did the world a favor. I never said he didnt recovered, in fact he did have a pretty normal life after he finally rehabilitated. All i have said is doccumented in testimonies of lots of people. The only people that seemed blind to Syds condition was his own family.
No, that is what you said. You said or implied he was retarded, infantile, lost all memory and was incapable of playing, when there is strong evidence on the contrary, nevermind all sorts of inaccuracies and rude assumptions to his past, character, & mental state, and whenever I confront you, you dodge the question.
I don't have nearly enough room to explain the complexities of human character, where those quotes came from, or feel like it doing it.
Nobody can deny his lyrics were infantile: just listen to Bike.People seem to agree, even when they actually like that.Retarded i didnt mean in the clinical sense,but i have taken it back a thousand times,i agree that was rude. Now people who overdoze with LSD do lose the memory of his past life,thats why Syd couldnt recognize his own bandmates and friends as many have testified, or remember his own songs onstage.That also explains the dramatic change of his character.
Syd was incapable of playing live in 1968,everyone who ever worked onstage with him during that period and his subsequent solo career pointed out that fact. If you know so much about him, can you tell how many live shows did Syd Barret in his 7 years of solo career?
At least 9 shows, with the latest being in 1973, including jazz, blues, Floyd and solo material. It wasn't his career, but he played just fine. You want dates, anecdotes, bootlegs? Also, there are numerous accounts of him running into old friends and recognizing them just fine. Guess that fucks up your whole Syd lost all his memory cause one day in 1967 he didn't recognize Gilmour while he was probably tripping face on acid.
Oh, and there's a difference between childlike and childish, dipshit.
Mobile - I like everything you say. One thing tho' - I don't think there was a 1973 concert, unless you can tell me otherwise. From recollection there was Stars in 1972, then nothing, except for the abortive 1974 sessions. I ask because I've always wondered what Syd was doing in 1973. Living in the Park Lane Hilton? The three pairs of trousers story? "Far further than you could possibly imagine"? I guess these anecdotes date from around that time. But no concert, so far as I know.
It's mostly forgotten, but he totally did play live at least once after Stars. I'm Mr. Syd Barrett Expert myself, and I just learned about that one yesterday when determining the exact amount of concerts Syd played for Dumbass, whose convinced Syd became comatose or something. He played in a couple pick-up bands throughout the early 70s, mostly old friends trying to get him out of the house.
Once again, there's a funny story about it, but I can't find the link. I'll mail it to you later.
Mobile - I'm fascinated. Yes, send me all the info and links you can. I'm most intrigued by the post-71 and pre-Cambridge return period: Hilton, Cloisters, etc. What was he doing all that time? (Watching TV, yes, but days are 24 hours long, and this went on for 8 or 9 years.) I think you can send me a message via youtube, can't you? If not, I'll tell you my e-mail address.
Doin' Mandies and feeling existential, from what I gather. It's pretty grim, a difficult period to flesh out really, and it's all filled with hearsay, legend, drugs and armchair psychologists. They were already writing their own story for him by the late 60s, he was the "crazy guy", and he very much knew it. He chilled with friends a bit though, yeah.
Me, I imagine him being kinda' like Jack Nicholson in As Good As It Gets, jaded, complicated, and a bit nutty. I'll hit you with those links.
Thanks for the links. You should have got my reply, which at first appeared not to go through. Yep, I think your version is pretty believable alright. (Jack Nicholson in As Good As It Gets - sure.) Certainly dovetails neatly with the Jenny Fabian tale you sent me.
9 shows that is very, very little for the years of his solo career. Thats says a lot about the deterioration of his performing skills. Ask the musicians that participated in "Stars", his last project: they would tell you about how disastrous his performance was.
"Twink: Yeah well some of the gigs were great, some of them were really good but the Corn Exchange gigs were awful... and we did a few in the Dandelion Coffee Bar, I think we did two there & they were also good."
The final performance was disastrous for several reasons besides Syd just not being together that day, but regardless, he could play live. This whole forgot how to play thing is bull, dude had a bad day and said "fuck it".
"Syd was really hung up about it; so the band folded. He came 'round to my house and said he didn't want to play anymore. He didn't explain; he just left. I was really amazed working with him, at his actual ability as a guitar player."
Oh, and once again, playing live wasn't his career. The reason his solo albums happened was because his friends told him he should record again, and the reason he played in Stars was because Twink told him he should. He'd show up to the occasional jam, but mostly he just wanted to be left alone. You make it sound like he just dieing to get famous again.
Again, Lymbo: you have a very linear way of thinking. Whoever said that this was a "career" for Barrett? I can't speak for Mobile, but my point is simply that Barrett was, during his brief window of musical creativity (in effect 66-70), a wonderful artist, one of the best. Perhaps he could have been more; but there is no point in saying "what if". What we have is wonderful. If you disagree, that's okay. I just don't see why you feel such a need to slug with Syd fans it out on these pages.
I mean, of course, "slug it out with Syd fans". Your excuse about "research" is specious. And who the *hell* cares what "King Crimson are up to these days"? For goodness' sake. You're an anachronism, terribly defensive of your little corner because, deep down, you have picked up that the more erudite and literary types seem to prefer Syd - but with your linear mind you can't see why. Try the London Review of Books article by Jeremy Harding: google "afternoonishness Syd" and you'll find it.
Just for fun, I googled "Gordian Knot". Now, I'm far from rating artists on their popularity or commercial clout (else I'd prefer Waters to Barrett) - but here we were talking of the relative influence of prog and punk on the industry today. If this is the best you can do for prog, then... you've disproved your own case. Gordian Knot hasn't even got a WIKI ENTRY. Ha! What with GK and the bunch of 60 year olds comprising King Crimson, I think it's clear that prog is alive and well! Not.
Nope, it wasn't a career, occasional impromptu jam aside, every time he played and recorded after January 1968 was at the invitation/strong persuasion of friends and business men. Recording Madcap, Barrett and the '74 sessions weren't his ideas and Stars was Twink's idea to get Syd to play again. Syd was spending most of his time alone, painting, even then.
Gilmour's comments on working with Syd are Gilmour trying to sound like a martyr. He is quoted as saying he closed the sessions to "protect Syd's reputation" (so the public will remember talented, charismatic Syd) and then goes on record saying what a nightmare it was. That's nice.
Well it wasnt politically correct, but it was likely to be true. I'd like to see you working in charge of a recording session with a menthally illed person.
Well, since Syd isn;t here to rell his side of it, who knows what's true? A member of Soft Machine who backed Syd and Gilmour in the studio during Madcap sessions said Syd was pleasant and very easy to work with, with the exception of not giving the other musicians too much direction.
Well Syd himself wouldnt be a very reliable source, his memmory of everything was always blurry back then. And of course opinions differs due to many factors as reputation, pollitical impression care, public image, etc. But Barrett's condition is a doccumented historical fact, and doccumented doesnt mean rumours or opinion; means medical diagnosis and legal implications.
What medical diagnosis are you referring to? According to his sister, Syd was never diagnosed with or pharmacologically treated for any specific mental illness, and I'm sure you can't refute that, since, as you say, medical records are sealed and confidential (at least here in the US, and I am assuming in Britain as well)
Of course he was treated and diagnosed. Medical records are confidential, not sealed. That means their owner or manager can use them with discretion. And of course they were used, to probe Barretts condition to EMI records, otherwise he wouldnt be entitled to the pension he obtained from them. His sister and aunt are not stupid at all (they took care of him until his death), and they knew that they could deny to the public the real condition of Barrett and no one could probe them wrong.
Do you have any experience with psychiatric patients? if you do you surely know that people with the kind of brain damage Barrett had loose memory partially or fully. There are testimonies of people around him that corroborate that fact, as well as photos and footage of him being synthomatic. I believe he did recover sanity and judgement as i readed recent interviews with him, where he is articulated and speaks normally, but by no chances he could have recovered memory.
Only a psychiatriac rotation when training to be an RN. So, as you claim to be a writer and in the music industry, I think it's fair to say I have more experience with psychiatric patients than you do. I haven't heard of any recent interviews with Syd, so I'm not sure what you are referring to. And do you mean "symptomatic" when you say "synthomatic"? Footage I've seen of Syd he's either normal in some or under the influence in others, but none I've seen automatically point to mental illness.
If you want to see Syd Barrett acting retard check the American Bandstand tv performance, see also the VH1 "Rock Legends" documentary on Pink Floyd. About the interviews, well i meant relatively recent, not this years of course.
if anyone is passing by, just take a look at the grammar in this post. This man is writing a book and better hope to god he gets the best editing staff alive
I've come across a number of your other posts where you say you are doing research to determine Syd's influence on PF. Based on others' responses to you, it seems to me your research points to the fact that most people who know PF's history feel that without Syd Barrett, the world probably would never have heard of Pink Floyd. Based on that alone, don't you think the man deserves respect?
This part of my research is not to determine Syd's influence on Floyd, but in the public in general. Determine Syd's influence in Floyd trough the public opinion would be unaccurate and therefore, methodologically wrong. And yes i do think the man deserves respect for what he was, not for what people think he was.
Admittedly, Syd had a breakdown, but I really believe that he gave many clues prior to this that he was not going to stay in the music business for long--considered himself more of an artist than a musician. He chose to turn his back on a soul-sucking, money hungry industry that turned his talent and musical artistry into a common street whore. IMO, it was a matter of artistic self-preservation.
Surely his opinion on media and music industry was advanced, he had a very accurate judgement according to the interviews i have read. That doesnt makes his art any better whatsoever. And well if he would have wanted to retire he would have simply done it, but he didnt, he was basically thrown off the business. Even Dark Globe's lyrics (from one of his solo albums) plead for tolerance and comprehension of his condition ("Wouldn't you miss me at all?").
If he was thrown out of the business why has the man been appraoched throughout the years to return to the studio? I believe the book Crazy Diamond said a record company appraoched him not too many years ago to record whatever he wanted to and offered a vast amt of money in return. It's unclear if he was "thrown out" of PF, but it was definitely his decision to leave the music industry altogther. Hell, if people like Michael Jackson aren't "thrown out", why would Syd Barrett be?
Well yes, a few years ago. However his solo work was not very sucessfull commercially and well after Gilmour helped him producing his two releases, he became very busy with The Floyd and no one had enough patience to take his place. According to Gilmour, it was hell working with him.
Commercial success is, by no means, the best, or even a good way, in my opinion, to critique a piece of art or music. His solo work lacks the intricate studio techniques that Floyd albums have (hell, Madcap is basically Syd on acoustic guitar).
PS-Thanks for respectful tone--it's nice to know there are still people out there that can have a good-natured debate w/o all the name calling and other assorted BS.
Syd's writing was more imaginative--Waters severely lacked imagination IMO. Just because Waters wrote about politics/current events does not necessarily equate to intelligence. Billy Joel did this in "We Didn't Start the Fire"--another song that makes me want to lose my lunch. Does that automatically make him more intelligent/better songwriter than anyone else out there?
Far beyond the contents of waters lyrical work, his literary technique is quite more impressive. It is truly poetic in most cases. Its not only about what he says but how he says it. Check Wish you were here or Shine On you Crazy Diamond, they're greatly metaphoric and use true literary resources and retorical figures. Non of that can be found in Barrett.
I'm sorry, I disagree--their styles may be different, but Barrett has a unique, fantastic way of expressing himself--perhaps not your taste, but that doesn't mean it doesn't speak to vast number of people.
So James Joyce isn't a true literary source? Is that what I'm hearing? I mean, never mind the fact Roger Waters writes like an angry 16 year-old who just read Orwell for the first time and Syd actually had some poetic skill, you're saying that either a) Syd didn't show an influence of true literature, or b) James Joyce and Lewis Carrol don't count as true literature.
Lyrical Poetry is defined as the art of writing poetry specially for musical purposes, and it is far much more than just refering the work of other litterates. However, Barretts "lyrics" have no sense of poetic technique. Not because it rhymes and talks about the I-Ching or The willow in the winds, it is a good poem. Poetry is basically about rhetoric figures, although it considers metrics and rythm. Barretts lyrics contain almost no sense of rhetorics at all, except for "Dark Globe" perhaps.
I'm not talking about his references, even though there are very many and it certainly shows how well read he was for his age, it's his prose. Much of his solo works flow and style was inspired by James Joyce. If you've ever read, or even just flipped through Ulysses or Finnegan's Wake, this would be very obvious. In the context of real poetry, he's not that special, but in pop, and against Roger Waters trite, he's genius. Your notions of poetry are very dated, "A poem should not mean, but be."
I admitt Barrett had moments of lyrical glow in his solo work,with some songs like Dark Globe.I do not see anything relevant as a matter of content or technical delivery in the lyrics he did for Pink Floyd,they are about frivolous, childish and superficial themes and the delivery is technically poor.Roger Waters was much more accomplished as a lyricist his themes are much deeper and are full of interesting rhetorics as his sense of irony,wordplay,metaphor,paradox,etc.
Strange.. when did some bloke get the idea that he could make 'rules' for poetry? I'm sure they are great for impressing other high-brow poets, but the ARTIST is the one who does whatever the hell he wants and if it touches just one, its internal rules are good enough. Heck, if free-form gibberish was enjoyed by enough people some hack would come behind and make up rules for it. Barrett didn't need no rules - that's why we are talking about his work 40 years later. RIP Syd.
It is not like there are specific rules about poetry, Gandalf, but as a literature bachelor i can tell you there are guidelines to know what is a true poem and what is just a medioquer rock lyric.
Lymbo, A 'true' poem or rock lyric is the one that finds its mark. Some poetry gives great insight into the unspoken horrors of the mind and heart - thank you Roger Waters. On the other hand, after a long day's work, I like to open a cold can of 'Syd' and roam with the Gnomes and sail with Sam. Both fill a different NEED and are 'true' poetry in their own application. No need to employ arbitrary 'guidelines' or compare, just enjoy! Or don't - I respect a man's TASTE, not his literary resume..
Rose: "Roger was unique; they didn't have the vocabulary to describe him and so they pigeonholed him. If only they had seen him with children. His nieces and nephews, the kids in the road — he would have them in stitches. He could talk at length and he played with words in a way that children instinctively appreciated, even if it sometimes threw adults."
Seems to me that Syd continued to practice his gift after PF. Those kids didn't give a hoot about his credentials. Nor should we.
Well I'm glad someone brought the snooty rules of the english language to YouTube, now I can sleep at night. I knew Waters was just writing mediocre rock lyrics but now I have a trustworthy source I can site for my school book report, damn 3rd grade intellectualism is fun!
So you're agreeing with me than, right? His influences were all the literary greats. Syd was a very well-read, intelligent man. I read that at one of their early shows, there were so few people in the audience (can you imagine) so Syd recited Hamlet's soliloquy (To be or not to be...). He was an amazing artist, too. Not too many people have as many gifts as Syd did. The world is blessed that he shared them, if even for a short while.
Sorry if you were disturbed by the back and forth. What I thought would be a quick reply set this guy off. When people spew unsubstantiated information on the internet, I, for one, think it's important to point out to others that may read it that these are opinions, not facts. My personal opinion is that Syd had many gifts and the world is blessed that he chose to share those gifts, even if for a short while.
Yeah, people listen to Rats or Opel, and write him off as just some acid freak, but he was actually just emulating modernist literature. I don't think he was neccessarily a genius, but I do think he was a fascinating, honest, inventive, bright kid who had a lot of unfortunate shit happen to him I can relate to, who overcame a lot of personal grief to become a well adjusted eccentric with integrity, which I respect. He's also a key figure in modern rock, which I think is often overlooked.
Fellingverypink. Thanks again, although just to clarify, I try not to think at all, just to enjoy. Perferring to react to circumstances rather than to waste time thinking.
You write him off for not following traditional concepts of poetry; structure and moral purpose, these concepts were considered irrelevant over seventy-five years ago.
Syd's merger of Finnegan's Wake inspired poetry and pop was interesting, colorful, innovative and effective. He could also be silly, there's nothing wrong with that, and he was good at it. Meanwhile, Roger Waters tries to be deep and profound, and he falls on his face. He isn't either, and his delivery is stiff and forced.
Literary criticisim has diminished the relevance of moral purpose in literature, true, but not of rhetorics. It is to date a foundation of the art itself, and Syd didnt have a bit of it. He had literary culture i admitt, but not talent, at least with the Floyd, but i admitt he did some good lyrics, truly poetic like Waters, in his solo career. With Pink Floyd, his "silly" side is prominent. Im not saying its wrong to be silly, but i am not impressed by it.
1) It's not the basis of art, literature or music, it's the basis of philosophy 2) If it was, Waters rhetoric is amateur, and as a poet his metaphors are weak & his delivery is stale. He's not Aristotle, or Shakespeare, or fucking Yeats - he's a fucking joke. He's camp, a working class bloke who deluded himself into thinking he's an intellectual & you know what, I don't give a fuck, but you have to go every Syd Barrett video and act like such an asshole and I'm sick of it. So please, just stop.
I am very sorry to dissapoint you man, but this is an open forum, not a popularity contest and you do not get to say who speaks here and who doesnt. Intolerance and ignorance , my friend, are close relatives. With all respects, you certainly wont make me degrade to that level of conversation.
Yeah, I know. Like all the mean spirited things you say about Syd Barrett, or the assumptions you make when you obviously don't know anything about him.
No I won't "degrade" you to my level. You will remain in your ivory tower of ignorance, and continue to politely be a douche bag to everyone. Being polite doesn't mean you aren't rude. I don't front like that, I make it very clear how I feel, I think you're a childish, pompous, pretentious ass whose worn out his welcome.
Okay (for one, you're right, I misunderstood rhetoric - it's still not Waters strong suit).
Rude: "offensive in manner or action... lacking refinement or delicacy... may suggest intentional discourtesy"
Yup, add a healthy dose of pomp, and that's you. Believe it or not, being rude isn't just about please and thank you, it can also concern character, content, and attitude. Going out of your way to pompously insult someones character, blindly, just to upset others, is quite rude, and childish.
Yeah, I know. Like all the mean spirited things you say about Syd Barrett, or the assumptions you make when you obviously don't know anything about him.
No I won't "degrade" you to my level. You will remain in your ivory tower of ignorance, and continue to politely be a douche bag to everyone. Being polite doesn't mean you aren't rude. I don't front like that, I make it very clear how I feel, I think you're a childish, pompous, pretentious ass whose worn out his welcome.
He he he he, well Scott you certainly displayed the true nature of your own self with that kind of statements. I refuse to be judgemental to anyone in this or any forum: its completely pointless. The debate is about music and history, not you or me. Maybe you ran out of intelligent arguments, and perhaps thats why you being harsh to me. I coulnt care less of course. In fact i kinda like to be hated by some. Comments like this make my day everyday. So thanks Scott!
No, I'm just being direct and honest, that's exactly what I think about you. I could break down what you say here all day, far beyond what I have, but I hardly have the room, time, or desire, b/c you're just not worth it. Other than poetic syntax, you obviously don't know much about anything, art, life, popular music, people, psychology, or least of all Syd, and you're not very interested in learning, you just like feeling superior, and I'm sick of talking to you; you're very repulsive Tony.
As i already said, i refuse to be judgemental about you or anyone on this forum. What you think about me personally is non of anyones concern really, as what i think about you. In my experience as a writer, i have never heard of such a thing as "poetic syntax". Syntax is just a part of Grammar.
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The Man and the Journey is the name of a unreleased conceptual music piece by Pink Floyd - We have our The (Vegetable) Man & The Journey
Airwaves lost in the labyrinth? Another vegetable. If you have a listen; Hope you like it
AirwavesOfficial 3 months ago
If I'm not mistaken, the footage at the start of the guy on the balcony was shot from the infamous 101 Cromwell Road. If you look on Google maps streetview & stand outside the Holiday Inn, looking slightly to the left, the road layout seems to match.. obviously alot of the cityscape has changed since 1967, new buildings erected, old victorian ones demolished etc.. but the restaurant on the corner is still there, 2 branches of the railway meet up here & go under the A4/ Crmwell rd..Great vid BTW!
griff4560 5 months ago
does anybody know the title of this Song, or the Artist ?? it's amazing :)
mkowalson 6 months ago
You could say his story is sad but Syd found another mountain to climb.The mind is so little understood. Would we have done it better,differently or worse than Syd....who knows.Drugs are really no good either.....unless medical.Give him some credit for being so clever once and surviving so long in a changing world.
ROCKYBLUEDOGS 8 months ago
A black kid in England! Roger, get it on film!
ternak001 9 months ago
I'm pretty sure this isn't Syd's first trip. I heard he did it way before
musicdork4ever 9 months ago
Beautiful, beautiful Syd.
wouldntyoulike2know 1 year ago 3
113 people who'd have loved to be around in the sixties
7 people who think the world is better today
alanmk5 1 year ago 3
@alanmk5
lol count me in I love the 60s ^_^
I love this video isn't Ricky so cute and hot <3 he always was all his life
ThePinkFloydPortal 1 year ago
@ThePinkFloydPortal he definitely is... rick was the cutest one to me :D
DefenderOfTheFaith84 10 months ago
Can anyone spot the 14 Hour Technicolor Dream poster on the back of that van?
butterybiscuits67 1 year ago
I like the song that you used for this. I just lovee Richard he is so cute xoxoxo
ChryslerLaser1986 1 year ago
Syd started something that would become the greatest sound ,,welcome to the show SYD ..........
deansusky 1 year ago
If this was about Syd's first trip on acid and it was documented by the band, I find that disturbing. It's like we're seeing where it all started to go wrong for Syd.
maximusrex1979 1 year ago
@maximusrex1979 i dont know, i think he would have been fucked up eventually even if he didnt do all the acid that he did. that was probably one of the most amazin days he ever had
sellout87 1 year ago
who is that girl with them?
friskas3 1 year ago
@friskas3 I have no idea, but I would LOVE to have been in her shoes....sitting inches away from ♥Syd♥ :)
SydzDarling4Eternity 11 months ago
Oh how I wish I could have been there with them, looks like a glorious time
craverdude 1 year ago
Have you got it yet ??????
20x20Ghost 1 year ago
como se llama el tema (song) ?
gavaqueivan 2 years ago
The music is scary.....I reallyyyyy much big like Syd...but what about the music.....shouldnt be there something like See Emily play?
Dareformoreful 2 years ago 3
@Dareformoreful This music is great its The Floyd Sound Dark and mysterious
nfc127 1 year ago
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by this time syd was fat and had shaved all his hair off
pasteypete2 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Sad Syd Sad Syd Sad Syd Syd Sad Syd Sad Sadsyd Sydsad... Hmmmmm! No nononononononnoo definately not him no!!! Really? Yes.. Definately not him no no no!
Well, i wonder! Is it? Could be! No no definately could not be but maybe it is him!!! SYD???? Is that you??? No? Oh ok! Nope! Definately not him.
liamardo007 2 years ago
Really? Was that even necessary?
ThePerchance 2 years ago
Yes!
liamardo007 2 years ago
A+ filming job.
Hogweed11 2 years ago
actually, i think that one guy is richard.One part it was syd, though. They both look very alike.
blood666fall 2 years ago
sad
retrocareermelted 2 years ago
It seems like all the video footage of syd Barrett that exists, whoever is filming can never focus on anything for more than 3 seconds.
floydazoid 2 years ago 5
I'm not 100% sure it's Syd walking around on the balcony without a shirt. It's definitely him later in the video though.
Equinas 2 years ago
I don't think it is him on the balcony.
lewars1912 2 years ago
I don't either.
GharedGhared 2 years ago
That's definitely not Syd on the balcony.
floydfn 2 years ago 18
The dumb FUCK that was filming this did a pretty shitty job of holding the camera steady. I WANT TO SEE SYD!
shivaboyd 2 years ago 2
Yes, I feel thee EXACT same way....morons anyway lol.
66MadcapLaughs 2 years ago
awesome!what is the track playing on the video?
Ulmo1111 2 years ago
i worked with them in 1970
fujivoo 2 years ago
did you now? you are a lucky bastard! wish i could of been around in the 6o's 7o's & 80's. any intresting stories while you were working with them?
imbob1234566 2 years ago
did you meet them? I envy you.
sethmanjette12 2 years ago
omg rick and syd are so exciting! so sexy
orzabal1983islove 2 years ago 3
Who ever filmed this, didn't show enough of Syd!!!!
66MadcapLaughs 2 years ago 4
in the rough.
chasecartr 2 years ago
wow, very beautiful... a true gem
REALITYinPIXELS 3 years ago
Syd Barrett looks like a childish prince.
Eccentrricity 3 years ago
hey that girl is not lindsay?
castreed 3 years ago
awesome video, great footage, great music
sawsosis 3 years ago
Kind of reminds me of A Clockwork Orange.
jettimothy 3 years ago 3
Simply seperated from nature in downtown London, the poor bloke.
murmurfunk 3 years ago
Simply seperated from nature in downtown London, the poor bloke.
murmurfunk 3 years ago
april 1967
Redkite82 3 years ago
I worked with them in 1970.
ankhaton 3 years ago
I worked with them in 1970.
ankhaton 3 years ago
I worked with them in 1970.
ankhaton 3 years ago
youtube comments...
rjmyy 3 years ago
personally im 150% obsessed with syd by himself. he is amazing.
Jukeboxheroswsprod 3 years ago 2
2:48 to 2:54 or so is the best
parkt6792 3 years ago 2
What song is this in the background?
PeaceFrog9 3 years ago
wondering too... i know it from somewhere. but its not on a pink floyd album that i have and i`ve got 17 so...
bavarianbass 3 years ago
yeah i didn't think it was pink floyd. but i love the way it sounds but can't get a name to search!
PeaceFrog9 3 years ago
The debate below is all very interesting, but not one of you experts has pointed out that the bare-chested dude on the balcony at the beginning of this video is not even Syd Barrett. It's actually one of his flatmates from the time.
gr7ty888 3 years ago 2
No, but that's because I'm pretty damn sure he's the dude in the ascot.
mobile513 3 years ago
its not him on the balcony. It is a friend who was also on acid. the footage is from syds first experience with acid. It was documented by the band and friends of the band. That's why the footage is shot like it is.
kolubukola 2 years ago 15
@kolubukola it was his first experience on shrooms not acid
sublimepuravidamae 10 months ago
@kolubukola -- Dude, it's just Super 8 footage. There is no 'why it was shot the way it was' or anything to do with acid.
dcpride76 6 months ago
syd barrett is the man
compxbox 3 years ago
The debate above made for some fascinating reading, I think. It is entirely appropriate to discuss Syd here, after all, this is a freaking youtube video, not Syd's gravestone.
I have to side mostly with Lymbo here, as I've never fully understood the Syd fascination. Especially because his popularity is mostly due to the popularity of the Floyd, like how I came to know of him by getting into the Floyd, then hearing "hey did you hear this crazy-awesome guy was their original guitarist?"
BEERBONG2DEATH 3 years ago
Well, this debate carries on over my pages. Personally, I don't give a shit about the rest of the Floyd's work & many of my favorite bands are unheard of 60s acts, like The Monks. A lot of his popularity has to do with how big Pink Floyd got, true, but I imagine if they hadn't he would still be remembered. His influence has been too large, and he was too popular in his day. The Velvets are remembered, & they never even cracked the Billboard top 100 in the 60s.
He also wrote the songs and sang.
mobile513 3 years ago 2
This is not Syd Barrett- I think the guy who is in this video would rather have his name on it
icemilk14 3 years ago
RIP SYD... you deserved so much more.....
NirvanaRider186 3 years ago
Man, my replies are being posted all over the place. The one to Hondaboy is in the right spot. The one below is for mobile513 a while back.
feelingverypink 3 years ago
If you wait a few days they go in right order, there's some sort of messed up lag with youtube comments, I don't know why; it fucked with me for awhile too until i figured out too. Of course, by the time it corrects itself, everyone has posted in the wrong place trying to figure what was going on, so they are still a little messy. Anyway, thank you.
mobile513 3 years ago
Man, my replies are being posted all over the place. The one to Hondaboy is in the right spot. The one below is for mobile513 a while back.
feelingverypink 3 years ago
Fantastic film. Thanks for posting it here.
To everyone else, this isn't the place to argue the man's mental state of mind.
Hondaboy27160478 4 years ago
The above comment starting with "sorry" was meant for you.
feelingverypink 4 years ago
The above comment starting with "sorry" was meant for you.
feelingverypink 4 years ago
FEELINGVERYPINK: No apologises are necessary, and they might just attract more arguments from less enlightened souls. Life is more beautiful when you avoid the detractors, as i'm sure you already know.
Hondaboy27160478 3 years ago
Amen to you. Cheers!
feelingverypink 3 years ago
I would also like to say that the majority of the information regarding Syd Barrett's mental condition comes from members of PF--architect school dropouts, not mental health clinicians. Yes, I know thay knew Syd Barrett and I didn't, but I do work in healthcare
feelingverypink 4 years ago
Also, it's quite judgmental and quite possibly irresponsible to say if Syd were alive, he wouldn't be a source of information regarding events of his own life. As it's been stated before, no one with the exception of his family knows to what extent he did or did not recover from his breakdown.
feelingverypink 4 years ago
He agreed to theraphy in a psychiatric institution,but in his case the pshychiatric medication was considered not reccomendable. However he was diagnosed schizophrenia and bi-polar shyndrome,besides masive brain cell destruction.Of course one can recover from such thing,but you dont recover the dead cells man,you cant recover the memory of that past life. He became a different normal person,Mr. Roger Barrett:painter and gardener,coin collector;but the old Syd never came back from that acid trip.
LYMBO2006 4 years ago
Really, where did you acquire such information? That contradicts every reliable source I've ever heard, and so what if he did have bipolar disorder and/or schizophrenia, that doesn't mean shit, plenty of people have these problems, myself included, it doesn't mean you're a different person. People that have these problems often develop them in their late teens to early twenties, so if he had it, it was probably coming anyway, acid or not.
mobile513 3 years ago
It comes from an interview to his sister and it is refered also in Wikipedia. Now Schizophrenia and bipolar disorder is not a common, everyday mental condition as you put it: its considered high risk. Of course its origin was not the acid, but it is well known that LSD abuse does accelerate the damage of that condition and besides the purely psycological damage, LSD creates massive brain cell destruction. This last thing is what really ruined his memory and performing skills.
LYMBO2006 3 years ago
No, his sister said the opposite, that he had no illnesses, and the references on wikipedia are just theories. Second, you obviously don't know much about these conditions, I'm not about to explain the range of their effects, nor do I feel like defending my knowledge on bipolar disorder when I live with it every fucking day.
The long term effects of LSD use are questionable, the only truly "damaging" one being very rare, HPPD, which he certainly would have been prescribed something for.
mobile513 3 years ago
Well there is no data of he being treated with any kind of psychiatric medication. His family seemed to be in denial and they certainly neglected Syd in the early days of his rehabilitation process, as they failed to provide him with the treatment he really needed. "Oh no, my boy is alright there is nothing wrong with him". OH and about the medical condition, it is schizophrenia condition that i mean accelelarates with LSD abuse.
LYMBO2006 3 years ago
So why do you act like it's fact when you have no evidence? Seems isn't a license to assume. How do you know the relationship he had with his family? What makes you so sure his brain was damaged, or he had severe mental problems, if any, or that he didn't recover if he did? What so wrong with putting your past behind you, or retiring to your garden listening to Jazz records? There's no real evidence for anything after his breakdown other than some depression and slight reclusiveness.
mobile513 3 years ago
OH of course there is nothing wrong with Syd's retirement, i think he did the world a favor. I never said he didnt recovered, in fact he did have a pretty normal life after he finally rehabilitated. All i have said is doccumented in testimonies of lots of people. The only people that seemed blind to Syds condition was his own family.
LYMBO2006 3 years ago
No, that is what you said. You said or implied he was retarded, infantile, lost all memory and was incapable of playing, when there is strong evidence on the contrary, nevermind all sorts of inaccuracies and rude assumptions to his past, character, & mental state, and whenever I confront you, you dodge the question.
I don't have nearly enough room to explain the complexities of human character, where those quotes came from, or feel like it doing it.
"Did the world favor", once again, rudeness.
mobile513 3 years ago
Nobody can deny his lyrics were infantile: just listen to Bike.People seem to agree, even when they actually like that.Retarded i didnt mean in the clinical sense,but i have taken it back a thousand times,i agree that was rude. Now people who overdoze with LSD do lose the memory of his past life,thats why Syd couldnt recognize his own bandmates and friends as many have testified, or remember his own songs onstage.That also explains the dramatic change of his character.
LYMBO2006 3 years ago
Syd was incapable of playing live in 1968,everyone who ever worked onstage with him during that period and his subsequent solo career pointed out that fact. If you know so much about him, can you tell how many live shows did Syd Barret in his 7 years of solo career?
LYMBO2006 3 years ago
At least 9 shows, with the latest being in 1973, including jazz, blues, Floyd and solo material. It wasn't his career, but he played just fine. You want dates, anecdotes, bootlegs? Also, there are numerous accounts of him running into old friends and recognizing them just fine. Guess that fucks up your whole Syd lost all his memory cause one day in 1967 he didn't recognize Gilmour while he was probably tripping face on acid.
Oh, and there's a difference between childlike and childish, dipshit.
mobile513 3 years ago
Mobile - I like everything you say. One thing tho' - I don't think there was a 1973 concert, unless you can tell me otherwise. From recollection there was Stars in 1972, then nothing, except for the abortive 1974 sessions. I ask because I've always wondered what Syd was doing in 1973. Living in the Park Lane Hilton? The three pairs of trousers story? "Far further than you could possibly imagine"? I guess these anecdotes date from around that time. But no concert, so far as I know.
timkinson 3 years ago
It's mostly forgotten, but he totally did play live at least once after Stars. I'm Mr. Syd Barrett Expert myself, and I just learned about that one yesterday when determining the exact amount of concerts Syd played for Dumbass, whose convinced Syd became comatose or something. He played in a couple pick-up bands throughout the early 70s, mostly old friends trying to get him out of the house.
Once again, there's a funny story about it, but I can't find the link. I'll mail it to you later.
mobile513 3 years ago
Mobile - I'm fascinated. Yes, send me all the info and links you can. I'm most intrigued by the post-71 and pre-Cambridge return period: Hilton, Cloisters, etc. What was he doing all that time? (Watching TV, yes, but days are 24 hours long, and this went on for 8 or 9 years.) I think you can send me a message via youtube, can't you? If not, I'll tell you my e-mail address.
timkinson 3 years ago
Doin' Mandies and feeling existential, from what I gather. It's pretty grim, a difficult period to flesh out really, and it's all filled with hearsay, legend, drugs and armchair psychologists. They were already writing their own story for him by the late 60s, he was the "crazy guy", and he very much knew it. He chilled with friends a bit though, yeah.
Me, I imagine him being kinda' like Jack Nicholson in As Good As It Gets, jaded, complicated, and a bit nutty. I'll hit you with those links.
mobile513 3 years ago
Thanks for the links. You should have got my reply, which at first appeared not to go through. Yep, I think your version is pretty believable alright. (Jack Nicholson in As Good As It Gets - sure.) Certainly dovetails neatly with the Jenny Fabian tale you sent me.
timkinson 3 years ago
9 shows that is very, very little for the years of his solo career. Thats says a lot about the deterioration of his performing skills. Ask the musicians that participated in "Stars", his last project: they would tell you about how disastrous his performance was.
LYMBO2006 3 years ago
You mean this musician...
"Twink: Yeah well some of the gigs were great, some of them were really good but the Corn Exchange gigs were awful... and we did a few in the Dandelion Coffee Bar, I think we did two there & they were also good."
The final performance was disastrous for several reasons besides Syd just not being together that day, but regardless, he could play live. This whole forgot how to play thing is bull, dude had a bad day and said "fuck it".
mobile513 3 years ago
To continue what Twink said...
"Syd was really hung up about it; so the band folded. He came 'round to my house and said he didn't want to play anymore. He didn't explain; he just left. I was really amazed working with him, at his actual ability as a guitar player."
mobile513 3 years ago
Oh, and once again, playing live wasn't his career. The reason his solo albums happened was because his friends told him he should record again, and the reason he played in Stars was because Twink told him he should. He'd show up to the occasional jam, but mostly he just wanted to be left alone. You make it sound like he just dieing to get famous again.
mobile513 3 years ago
Again, Lymbo: you have a very linear way of thinking. Whoever said that this was a "career" for Barrett? I can't speak for Mobile, but my point is simply that Barrett was, during his brief window of musical creativity (in effect 66-70), a wonderful artist, one of the best. Perhaps he could have been more; but there is no point in saying "what if". What we have is wonderful. If you disagree, that's okay. I just don't see why you feel such a need to slug with Syd fans it out on these pages.
timkinson 3 years ago
I mean, of course, "slug it out with Syd fans". Your excuse about "research" is specious. And who the *hell* cares what "King Crimson are up to these days"? For goodness' sake. You're an anachronism, terribly defensive of your little corner because, deep down, you have picked up that the more erudite and literary types seem to prefer Syd - but with your linear mind you can't see why. Try the London Review of Books article by Jeremy Harding: google "afternoonishness Syd" and you'll find it.
timkinson 3 years ago
Just for fun, I googled "Gordian Knot". Now, I'm far from rating artists on their popularity or commercial clout (else I'd prefer Waters to Barrett) - but here we were talking of the relative influence of prog and punk on the industry today. If this is the best you can do for prog, then... you've disproved your own case. Gordian Knot hasn't even got a WIKI ENTRY. Ha! What with GK and the bunch of 60 year olds comprising King Crimson, I think it's clear that prog is alive and well! Not.
timkinson 3 years ago
I always care what King Crimson is up to, they are one of the best bands to grace the planet.
jreichwein 3 years ago
Nope, it wasn't a career, occasional impromptu jam aside, every time he played and recorded after January 1968 was at the invitation/strong persuasion of friends and business men. Recording Madcap, Barrett and the '74 sessions weren't his ideas and Stars was Twink's idea to get Syd to play again. Syd was spending most of his time alone, painting, even then.
mobile513 3 years ago
Gilmour's comments on working with Syd are Gilmour trying to sound like a martyr. He is quoted as saying he closed the sessions to "protect Syd's reputation" (so the public will remember talented, charismatic Syd) and then goes on record saying what a nightmare it was. That's nice.
feelingverypink 4 years ago
Well it wasnt politically correct, but it was likely to be true. I'd like to see you working in charge of a recording session with a menthally illed person.
LYMBO2006 4 years ago
Well, since Syd isn;t here to rell his side of it, who knows what's true? A member of Soft Machine who backed Syd and Gilmour in the studio during Madcap sessions said Syd was pleasant and very easy to work with, with the exception of not giving the other musicians too much direction.
feelingverypink 4 years ago
Well Syd himself wouldnt be a very reliable source, his memmory of everything was always blurry back then. And of course opinions differs due to many factors as reputation, pollitical impression care, public image, etc. But Barrett's condition is a doccumented historical fact, and doccumented doesnt mean rumours or opinion; means medical diagnosis and legal implications.
LYMBO2006 4 years ago
What medical diagnosis are you referring to? According to his sister, Syd was never diagnosed with or pharmacologically treated for any specific mental illness, and I'm sure you can't refute that, since, as you say, medical records are sealed and confidential (at least here in the US, and I am assuming in Britain as well)
feelingverypink 4 years ago
Of course he was treated and diagnosed. Medical records are confidential, not sealed. That means their owner or manager can use them with discretion. And of course they were used, to probe Barretts condition to EMI records, otherwise he wouldnt be entitled to the pension he obtained from them. His sister and aunt are not stupid at all (they took care of him until his death), and they knew that they could deny to the public the real condition of Barrett and no one could probe them wrong.
LYMBO2006 4 years ago
Do you have any experience with psychiatric patients? if you do you surely know that people with the kind of brain damage Barrett had loose memory partially or fully. There are testimonies of people around him that corroborate that fact, as well as photos and footage of him being synthomatic. I believe he did recover sanity and judgement as i readed recent interviews with him, where he is articulated and speaks normally, but by no chances he could have recovered memory.
LYMBO2006 4 years ago
Only a psychiatriac rotation when training to be an RN. So, as you claim to be a writer and in the music industry, I think it's fair to say I have more experience with psychiatric patients than you do. I haven't heard of any recent interviews with Syd, so I'm not sure what you are referring to. And do you mean "symptomatic" when you say "synthomatic"? Footage I've seen of Syd he's either normal in some or under the influence in others, but none I've seen automatically point to mental illness.
feelingverypink 4 years ago
If you want to see Syd Barrett acting retard check the American Bandstand tv performance, see also the VH1 "Rock Legends" documentary on Pink Floyd. About the interviews, well i meant relatively recent, not this years of course.
LYMBO2006 4 years ago
if anyone is passing by, just take a look at the grammar in this post. This man is writing a book and better hope to god he gets the best editing staff alive
jjlolicus 3 years ago
I've come across a number of your other posts where you say you are doing research to determine Syd's influence on PF. Based on others' responses to you, it seems to me your research points to the fact that most people who know PF's history feel that without Syd Barrett, the world probably would never have heard of Pink Floyd. Based on that alone, don't you think the man deserves respect?
feelingverypink 4 years ago
This part of my research is not to determine Syd's influence on Floyd, but in the public in general. Determine Syd's influence in Floyd trough the public opinion would be unaccurate and therefore, methodologically wrong. And yes i do think the man deserves respect for what he was, not for what people think he was.
LYMBO2006 4 years ago
Well, in your opinion, what was he, and what do people think he was?
feelingverypink 4 years ago
Admittedly, Syd had a breakdown, but I really believe that he gave many clues prior to this that he was not going to stay in the music business for long--considered himself more of an artist than a musician. He chose to turn his back on a soul-sucking, money hungry industry that turned his talent and musical artistry into a common street whore. IMO, it was a matter of artistic self-preservation.
feelingverypink 4 years ago
Surely his opinion on media and music industry was advanced, he had a very accurate judgement according to the interviews i have read. That doesnt makes his art any better whatsoever. And well if he would have wanted to retire he would have simply done it, but he didnt, he was basically thrown off the business. Even Dark Globe's lyrics (from one of his solo albums) plead for tolerance and comprehension of his condition ("Wouldn't you miss me at all?").
LYMBO2006 4 years ago
If he was thrown out of the business why has the man been appraoched throughout the years to return to the studio? I believe the book Crazy Diamond said a record company appraoched him not too many years ago to record whatever he wanted to and offered a vast amt of money in return. It's unclear if he was "thrown out" of PF, but it was definitely his decision to leave the music industry altogther. Hell, if people like Michael Jackson aren't "thrown out", why would Syd Barrett be?
feelingverypink 4 years ago
Well yes, a few years ago. However his solo work was not very sucessfull commercially and well after Gilmour helped him producing his two releases, he became very busy with The Floyd and no one had enough patience to take his place. According to Gilmour, it was hell working with him.
LYMBO2006 4 years ago
Commercial success is, by no means, the best, or even a good way, in my opinion, to critique a piece of art or music. His solo work lacks the intricate studio techniques that Floyd albums have (hell, Madcap is basically Syd on acoustic guitar).
feelingverypink 4 years ago
The comment on commercial success wasnt a critic to his artistic work, it was about him being kicked out of the music business.
LYMBO2006 4 years ago
People don't get kicked out of the music business. If people chose not to buy their music, that doesn't mean you're kicked out.
feelingverypink 4 years ago
Dude, i am in the music business and i can tell you this: people get kicked out every day, by companies, mangers, bandmates, even by the audience.
LYMBO2006 4 years ago
One of Dark Globe's lyrics is "I'm only a person"-- a fact it would behoove Roger Waters to remember as well. None of them are gods.
feelingverypink 4 years ago
It also says "I've tattooed my brain all the way"
LYMBO2006 4 years ago
You "tattoo your brain" when you get drunk, smoke pot, whatever. Big deal.
feelingverypink 4 years ago
Yeah but the difference is that he did it "all the way" in his own words.
LYMBO2006 4 years ago
PS-Thanks for respectful tone--it's nice to know there are still people out there that can have a good-natured debate w/o all the name calling and other assorted BS.
feelingverypink 4 years ago
Syd's writing was more imaginative--Waters severely lacked imagination IMO. Just because Waters wrote about politics/current events does not necessarily equate to intelligence. Billy Joel did this in "We Didn't Start the Fire"--another song that makes me want to lose my lunch. Does that automatically make him more intelligent/better songwriter than anyone else out there?
feelingverypink 4 years ago
Far beyond the contents of waters lyrical work, his literary technique is quite more impressive. It is truly poetic in most cases. Its not only about what he says but how he says it. Check Wish you were here or Shine On you Crazy Diamond, they're greatly metaphoric and use true literary resources and retorical figures. Non of that can be found in Barrett.
LYMBO2006 4 years ago
I'm sorry, I disagree--their styles may be different, but Barrett has a unique, fantastic way of expressing himself--perhaps not your taste, but that doesn't mean it doesn't speak to vast number of people.
feelingverypink 4 years ago
Never said it didn't, in fact my resolution so far is that he is over-rated.
LYMBO2006 4 years ago
I'm getting confused, what is this post referring to?
feelingverypink 4 years ago
So James Joyce isn't a true literary source? Is that what I'm hearing? I mean, never mind the fact Roger Waters writes like an angry 16 year-old who just read Orwell for the first time and Syd actually had some poetic skill, you're saying that either a) Syd didn't show an influence of true literature, or b) James Joyce and Lewis Carrol don't count as true literature.
mobile513 4 years ago
Lyrical Poetry is defined as the art of writing poetry specially for musical purposes, and it is far much more than just refering the work of other litterates. However, Barretts "lyrics" have no sense of poetic technique. Not because it rhymes and talks about the I-Ching or The willow in the winds, it is a good poem. Poetry is basically about rhetoric figures, although it considers metrics and rythm. Barretts lyrics contain almost no sense of rhetorics at all, except for "Dark Globe" perhaps.
LYMBO2006 4 years ago
I'm not talking about his references, even though there are very many and it certainly shows how well read he was for his age, it's his prose. Much of his solo works flow and style was inspired by James Joyce. If you've ever read, or even just flipped through Ulysses or Finnegan's Wake, this would be very obvious. In the context of real poetry, he's not that special, but in pop, and against Roger Waters trite, he's genius. Your notions of poetry are very dated, "A poem should not mean, but be."
mobile513 3 years ago
I admitt Barrett had moments of lyrical glow in his solo work,with some songs like Dark Globe.I do not see anything relevant as a matter of content or technical delivery in the lyrics he did for Pink Floyd,they are about frivolous, childish and superficial themes and the delivery is technically poor.Roger Waters was much more accomplished as a lyricist his themes are much deeper and are full of interesting rhetorics as his sense of irony,wordplay,metaphor,paradox,etc.
LYMBO2006 3 years ago
Ok, now Syd sucks and Roger Rules. wow this is so interesting!
jreichwein 3 years ago
Strange.. when did some bloke get the idea that he could make 'rules' for poetry? I'm sure they are great for impressing other high-brow poets, but the ARTIST is the one who does whatever the hell he wants and if it touches just one, its internal rules are good enough. Heck, if free-form gibberish was enjoyed by enough people some hack would come behind and make up rules for it. Barrett didn't need no rules - that's why we are talking about his work 40 years later. RIP Syd.
gandalfnwhite 3 years ago 2
Actually, the high brow poets dismissed most of those rules 75 years ago, poets who were his influences.
mobile513 3 years ago
It is not like there are specific rules about poetry, Gandalf, but as a literature bachelor i can tell you there are guidelines to know what is a true poem and what is just a medioquer rock lyric.
LYMBO2006 3 years ago
Lymbo, A 'true' poem or rock lyric is the one that finds its mark. Some poetry gives great insight into the unspoken horrors of the mind and heart - thank you Roger Waters. On the other hand, after a long day's work, I like to open a cold can of 'Syd' and roam with the Gnomes and sail with Sam. Both fill a different NEED and are 'true' poetry in their own application. No need to employ arbitrary 'guidelines' or compare, just enjoy! Or don't - I respect a man's TASTE, not his literary resume..
gandalfnwhite 3 years ago 2
Rose: "Roger was unique; they didn't have the vocabulary to describe him and so they pigeonholed him. If only they had seen him with children. His nieces and nephews, the kids in the road — he would have them in stitches. He could talk at length and he played with words in a way that children instinctively appreciated, even if it sometimes threw adults."
Seems to me that Syd continued to practice his gift after PF. Those kids didn't give a hoot about his credentials. Nor should we.
gandalfnwhite 3 years ago
The world will never truly apprecaite people like Syd.... thats pretty sad... an mad artist is still an artist.... RIP Syd...
NirvanaRider186 3 years ago
Where did you read this Gandalf? I haven't read this interview yet.
mobile513 3 years ago
Wait, I found it, and already read it. Guess I forgot that part.
mobile513 3 years ago
Well I'm glad someone brought the snooty rules of the english language to YouTube, now I can sleep at night. I knew Waters was just writing mediocre rock lyrics but now I have a trustworthy source I can site for my school book report, damn 3rd grade intellectualism is fun!
jreichwein 3 years ago
So you're agreeing with me than, right? His influences were all the literary greats. Syd was a very well-read, intelligent man. I read that at one of their early shows, there were so few people in the audience (can you imagine) so Syd recited Hamlet's soliloquy (To be or not to be...). He was an amazing artist, too. Not too many people have as many gifts as Syd did. The world is blessed that he shared them, if even for a short while.
feelingverypink 4 years ago
Sorry if you were disturbed by the back and forth. What I thought would be a quick reply set this guy off. When people spew unsubstantiated information on the internet, I, for one, think it's important to point out to others that may read it that these are opinions, not facts. My personal opinion is that Syd had many gifts and the world is blessed that he chose to share those gifts, even if for a short while.
feelingverypink 4 years ago
Yeah, people listen to Rats or Opel, and write him off as just some acid freak, but he was actually just emulating modernist literature. I don't think he was neccessarily a genius, but I do think he was a fascinating, honest, inventive, bright kid who had a lot of unfortunate shit happen to him I can relate to, who overcame a lot of personal grief to become a well adjusted eccentric with integrity, which I respect. He's also a key figure in modern rock, which I think is often overlooked.
mobile513 3 years ago
Damn straight! I like how you think.
feelingverypink 3 years ago
Fellingverypink. Thanks again, although just to clarify, I try not to think at all, just to enjoy. Perferring to react to circumstances rather than to waste time thinking.
Hondaboy27160478 3 years ago
Agree Syd was a very cultivated person, with literary taste, but that doesnt make him a good poet or lyricist.
LYMBO2006 3 years ago
You write him off for not following traditional concepts of poetry; structure and moral purpose, these concepts were considered irrelevant over seventy-five years ago.
Syd's merger of Finnegan's Wake inspired poetry and pop was interesting, colorful, innovative and effective. He could also be silly, there's nothing wrong with that, and he was good at it. Meanwhile, Roger Waters tries to be deep and profound, and he falls on his face. He isn't either, and his delivery is stiff and forced.
mobile513 3 years ago
Literary criticisim has diminished the relevance of moral purpose in literature, true, but not of rhetorics. It is to date a foundation of the art itself, and Syd didnt have a bit of it. He had literary culture i admitt, but not talent, at least with the Floyd, but i admitt he did some good lyrics, truly poetic like Waters, in his solo career. With Pink Floyd, his "silly" side is prominent. Im not saying its wrong to be silly, but i am not impressed by it.
LYMBO2006 3 years ago
1) It's not the basis of art, literature or music, it's the basis of philosophy 2) If it was, Waters rhetoric is amateur, and as a poet his metaphors are weak & his delivery is stale. He's not Aristotle, or Shakespeare, or fucking Yeats - he's a fucking joke. He's camp, a working class bloke who deluded himself into thinking he's an intellectual & you know what, I don't give a fuck, but you have to go every Syd Barrett video and act like such an asshole and I'm sick of it. So please, just stop.
mobile513 3 years ago
I am very sorry to dissapoint you man, but this is an open forum, not a popularity contest and you do not get to say who speaks here and who doesnt. Intolerance and ignorance , my friend, are close relatives. With all respects, you certainly wont make me degrade to that level of conversation.
LYMBO2006 3 years ago
Yeah, I know. Like all the mean spirited things you say about Syd Barrett, or the assumptions you make when you obviously don't know anything about him.
No I won't "degrade" you to my level. You will remain in your ivory tower of ignorance, and continue to politely be a douche bag to everyone. Being polite doesn't mean you aren't rude. I don't front like that, I make it very clear how I feel, I think you're a childish, pompous, pretentious ass whose worn out his welcome.
mobile513 3 years ago
By the way politeness and rudeness are actually antonyms. If you dont know what that is you can google or simply check on your nearest dictionary.
LYMBO2006 3 years ago
Okay (for one, you're right, I misunderstood rhetoric - it's still not Waters strong suit).
Rude: "offensive in manner or action... lacking refinement or delicacy... may suggest intentional discourtesy"
Yup, add a healthy dose of pomp, and that's you. Believe it or not, being rude isn't just about please and thank you, it can also concern character, content, and attitude. Going out of your way to pompously insult someones character, blindly, just to upset others, is quite rude, and childish.
mobile513 3 years ago
Yeah, I know. Like all the mean spirited things you say about Syd Barrett, or the assumptions you make when you obviously don't know anything about him.
No I won't "degrade" you to my level. You will remain in your ivory tower of ignorance, and continue to politely be a douche bag to everyone. Being polite doesn't mean you aren't rude. I don't front like that, I make it very clear how I feel, I think you're a childish, pompous, pretentious ass whose worn out his welcome.
mobile513 3 years ago
He he he he, well Scott you certainly displayed the true nature of your own self with that kind of statements. I refuse to be judgemental to anyone in this or any forum: its completely pointless. The debate is about music and history, not you or me. Maybe you ran out of intelligent arguments, and perhaps thats why you being harsh to me. I coulnt care less of course. In fact i kinda like to be hated by some. Comments like this make my day everyday. So thanks Scott!
LYMBO2006 3 years ago
No, I'm just being direct and honest, that's exactly what I think about you. I could break down what you say here all day, far beyond what I have, but I hardly have the room, time, or desire, b/c you're just not worth it. Other than poetic syntax, you obviously don't know much about anything, art, life, popular music, people, psychology, or least of all Syd, and you're not very interested in learning, you just like feeling superior, and I'm sick of talking to you; you're very repulsive Tony.
mobile513 3 years ago
As i already said, i refuse to be judgemental about you or anyone on this forum. What you think about me personally is non of anyones concern really, as what i think about you. In my experience as a writer, i have never heard of such a thing as "poetic syntax". Syntax is just a part of Grammar.
LYMBO2006 3 years ago