This would be good for forging wootz, where it is very hard, but can break from the shock of the hammers. A slow but strong press would make the job quicker and reduce the risk of cracking.
What would be the minimum tonnage rating for a good press. Would one 3 or 4 inch cylider be enough pressure to be effective? Did you have any binding problems using the 2 cylinder setup?
@nlightened2 A lot of the bladesmiths use a 24 ton with good success. It all depends on what you're making. For how wide some of my projects are I find times when I wish it was a little bit bigger. Get Batson's book to see what you need. I have no problems with binding as the pressure equalizes.
@TheGreatFishFillet Yes, I do sell them. I have also created a line of bronze belt buckles and I am designing more of them. Soon I'll sell them on line. You can email me through my website for more info.
This is a sweet press, and in my opinion just the right speed to have good control, love your 2 way foot peddle valve. I think press's are far more versatile than air hammers. I love that impression die.
I made myself a rust y style hammer, all the materials were free however, but now I want one of these lol.
I've noticed that a lot of presses have a moving bottom die. Other than reducing the overall height of the press, what other advantages do you have over a press with a moving top die?
Reducing the overall height means that you use less material to build the press, you don't need as high of a ceiling and the unit isn't top heavy. Being shorter also makes it more easily portable if need be. Also this unit just sits on the floor and can be moved anywhere. The units with the cylinder overhead require some kind of mounting system to the floor or a beam. I also feel it is a stronger construction.
nice press , do you have a relief valve ? do you need one ? and i was also wondering how you reverse your flow to get your press up then down that fast ? how do you do it without a solenoid valve ?
The valve mounted on the side of the press, attacheded to the foot pedals is a "4 way hydraulic control valve with pressure relief". That's what controls the flow and gives you the control in operation. No solenoid. There is an excellent book available, usually through bladesmith websites, for designing and building presses. It's "Build Your Own Hydraulic Forging Press" by James L. Batson.
Wow Randy, I read your blacksmithing primer a few years ago and learned a lot from it. I never did figure out what this meant....
TOTI
EMUL
ESTO
but the rest of the book was very clear. Heh Heh. Any way, that press is magnificent, I wonder about how much it cost to make. Did you buy all of the steel and components new or did you scavenge a bit?
The "puzzle" is on page 56 and the answer is on page 120 above the "twisting" section. Don't want to spill the beans ;-)
I bought the I-beam framework all welded up and with most of the workings. I had to get all the face plates and make the cart. Then I had to put it all together and get the plumbing done. I have about $1,700 into it. You could do it cheaper IF you are a good welder and torch man. Very reasonable compared to what power hammers go for today.
As long as they are both the same size cylinders it's no problem at all. No special fittings or anything. The cylinders will just equalize the pressure between them and they work together on the up and down strokes.
that is so awsome. if I don't have a power hammer or a press which would you sugguest I get first? is there anything you couldn't do with that that you can do with the power hammer?
Good question. They both have their merits and negatives. Negatives with the press is that it can push the scale back into the metal so just be aware of that and keep your metal clean. In smaller work the dies pull the heat right out of the metal at first, until they heat up, so may take more heats to do a job. On larger material, like on the piece I pushed the scroll into, there is plenty of time and heat to do more than one operation which i could never do on a power hammer. Continued...
The metal actually gets hotter due to the energy pushed into it. The press is definitely the more dangerous of the 2 machines. Hoses need to be protected and covered with Kevlar sleeves. Fluid leaking from a pin hole comes out at such force that can hurt you. Plus if that stream catches on fire it's like a flame thrower. The power hammer does a good job forging, but in imprinting designs into the metal the tool or metal bounces and you end up with double impressions. The mechanical -continued..
power hammers have springs in the front that can break and fly off at you, so they need guards installed. Air hammers are safer and give you much more control. I think the amount of different jobs that the press can do gives it an advantage over the hammer. Which ever you get you need to be educated as to safety, of the proper way to use and maintain them. Hope this helps.
This would be good for forging wootz, where it is very hard, but can break from the shock of the hammers. A slow but strong press would make the job quicker and reduce the risk of cracking.
truggeri 4 months ago
good work
MegaHari1989 8 months ago
Wow....simply wow. Now THAT sounds like something that would help me out with my latest project
AnthoFlex 1 year ago
WELL DONE!!!
dennyk1024 1 year ago
What would be the minimum tonnage rating for a good press. Would one 3 or 4 inch cylider be enough pressure to be effective? Did you have any binding problems using the 2 cylinder setup?
nlightened2 1 year ago
@nlightened2 A lot of the bladesmiths use a 24 ton with good success. It all depends on what you're making. For how wide some of my projects are I find times when I wish it was a little bit bigger. Get Batson's book to see what you need. I have no problems with binding as the pressure equalizes.
drgnfly4g 1 year ago
Please tell me you sell those cats! Thats very cool!!!!!!!
TheGreatFishFillet 1 year ago
@TheGreatFishFillet Yes, I do sell them. I have also created a line of bronze belt buckles and I am designing more of them. Soon I'll sell them on line. You can email me through my website for more info.
drgnfly4g 1 year ago
this was so cool! wow, i don't even know what to say except thanks for a great video on a very interesting and well documented subject!
fuyukodochi 1 year ago
What is the high and low GPM of your pump? Is it a 2 stage one?
senftpotatochips 2 years ago
It's a 16 GPM, 2 stage pump. 2,500 psi/ max 3,000 psi.
drgnfly4g 2 years ago
This is a sweet press, and in my opinion just the right speed to have good control, love your 2 way foot peddle valve. I think press's are far more versatile than air hammers. I love that impression die.
I made myself a rust y style hammer, all the materials were free however, but now I want one of these lol.
john0270 2 years ago
Nice underdrive press
n1a2t3h4a5l6i7e8 2 years ago
I like your press, very nice! can you give information on your cylinders and where you bought them?
lik2waterski 2 years ago
They're what's known as 6" cylinders. The cylinders were bought at a salvage yard and then cut to size and refurbished.
drgnfly4g 2 years ago
Interesting, mine closes 8" in about 2 seconds with a single ram. Would increasing the pump capacity improve the speed?
windfireforge 2 years ago
I've noticed that a lot of presses have a moving bottom die. Other than reducing the overall height of the press, what other advantages do you have over a press with a moving top die?
Good videos btw.
bwhip 2 years ago
Reducing the overall height means that you use less material to build the press, you don't need as high of a ceiling and the unit isn't top heavy. Being shorter also makes it more easily portable if need be. Also this unit just sits on the floor and can be moved anywhere. The units with the cylinder overhead require some kind of mounting system to the floor or a beam. I also feel it is a stronger construction.
drgnfly4g 2 years ago
nice press , do you have a relief valve ? do you need one ? and i was also wondering how you reverse your flow to get your press up then down that fast ? how do you do it without a solenoid valve ?
SAMgirouard 2 years ago
The valve mounted on the side of the press, attacheded to the foot pedals is a "4 way hydraulic control valve with pressure relief". That's what controls the flow and gives you the control in operation. No solenoid. There is an excellent book available, usually through bladesmith websites, for designing and building presses. It's "Build Your Own Hydraulic Forging Press" by James L. Batson.
drgnfly4g 2 years ago
Wow Randy, I read your blacksmithing primer a few years ago and learned a lot from it. I never did figure out what this meant....
TOTI
EMUL
ESTO
but the rest of the book was very clear. Heh Heh. Any way, that press is magnificent, I wonder about how much it cost to make. Did you buy all of the steel and components new or did you scavenge a bit?
vorpalknives 2 years ago
The "puzzle" is on page 56 and the answer is on page 120 above the "twisting" section. Don't want to spill the beans ;-)
I bought the I-beam framework all welded up and with most of the workings. I had to get all the face plates and make the cart. Then I had to put it all together and get the plumbing done. I have about $1,700 into it. You could do it cheaper IF you are a good welder and torch man. Very reasonable compared to what power hammers go for today.
drgnfly4g 2 years ago
Nice Press. I'm building a similar one but was told it is difficult to sync two cylinders. Do you use any special fittings, or is in not a problem?
TomCkey1 2 years ago
As long as they are both the same size cylinders it's no problem at all. No special fittings or anything. The cylinders will just equalize the pressure between them and they work together on the up and down strokes.
drgnfly4g 2 years ago
that is so awsome. if I don't have a power hammer or a press which would you sugguest I get first? is there anything you couldn't do with that that you can do with the power hammer?
freddytk421 3 years ago
Good question. They both have their merits and negatives. Negatives with the press is that it can push the scale back into the metal so just be aware of that and keep your metal clean. In smaller work the dies pull the heat right out of the metal at first, until they heat up, so may take more heats to do a job. On larger material, like on the piece I pushed the scroll into, there is plenty of time and heat to do more than one operation which i could never do on a power hammer. Continued...
drgnfly4g 3 years ago
The metal actually gets hotter due to the energy pushed into it. The press is definitely the more dangerous of the 2 machines. Hoses need to be protected and covered with Kevlar sleeves. Fluid leaking from a pin hole comes out at such force that can hurt you. Plus if that stream catches on fire it's like a flame thrower. The power hammer does a good job forging, but in imprinting designs into the metal the tool or metal bounces and you end up with double impressions. The mechanical -continued..
drgnfly4g 3 years ago
power hammers have springs in the front that can break and fly off at you, so they need guards installed. Air hammers are safer and give you much more control. I think the amount of different jobs that the press can do gives it an advantage over the hammer. Which ever you get you need to be educated as to safety, of the proper way to use and maintain them. Hope this helps.
Randy
drgnfly4g 3 years ago