@Bigmoonproductions it so makes me cry. I'm almost crying just listening to the music, because I can see it happening in my mind. The charge of the Irish Brigade is my favorite part of the entire movie.
But it is sad what these corporation and politician have done with the government of the people. Abraham Lincoln, Franklin Rooselvet and the Kennedys must be turnig over in their one´s grave, whatching horrified what this corrupt men have done.
@MrBarto23 All those men started it. Lincoln turned the United States in a Police State during the Civil War. FDR turned the Armed Forces over to corporations and ran the country as a Police State much like Lincoln. And JFK nearly started WW3 over Soviet Missiles in Cuba (even though USSR already possessed submarines capable of carrying nuclear weapons) for PR.
¿What abut the Black Men? that got the freedom because of the great sacrifices of the North Men. You talk abut freedom, but your notion of freedom is as pale as you. The South only fight for the privilege of the slavery, how was enjoy by even "fewer" people. But nevertheless, I thank you for the good music. I recomend you to see the movie Glory.
@MrBarto23 Slavery had a big part in it yes. It is the birthright of any human being to free him or herself from tyranny, slave or non. But it is not entirely why Southerners fought. Most Southern Whites were too poor to even own slaves. Many just seen it as "huge armies are coming from the North, we've got to defend our homeland." States rights truly was a large issue. Each state had it's own currency. Georgia came close to succeeding from the Confederacy over States Rights.
@JTCodel I know that they whanted there liberty ¿But liberty for what? ¿Liberty to oppress more the black man? Even in this day, they get upset when the people form the North, criticize them because of the way they treat the Black man, in the Souther States. Im sorry, but the south cant talk and demand freedom while the oppress the Black Man. Is thanks of beloging to United State, that they have change their policy of oppresing the Black. And the sad think is that whe had to force them.
@MrBarto23 Like in modern times? Man, that's just a stereotype. I'm a southerner, well Oklahoman so that's up for debate, but I have no problem with blacks at all. Got black friends, too.. blacks were important to the development of southern culture. Rosa Parks is one of my heroes for practicing peaceful civil disobedience. But, in modern times you have to admit the Federal governments over reached it's authority by far. I don't care where you're from. Gonna have to make two comments.
@MrBarto23 But besides that, all I was saying is they fought for more than Slavery. As I said the majority couldn't even afford them. States rights was one reason. When Lincoln was elected they felt that their vote didn't count and that was really the last straw. Pride had a lot to do with it. Military was tradition in the South at the time, even today. And, times were different. People were more loyal to their State than the Union. Racism existed in more places than just the south, too man.
@NevadaWrangler well I do feel bad for the yankee Irish, since they were forced to fight once they landed in Federal areas such as New York. And I am very proud of those brave Irish who fought for the South.
Alright guys I think we can all agree on that people are taught that the South is bad and the North is good but we all know it isn't that simple. The South did what to them needed to be done and I fully respect that.
@MrDixieLove Many fought for the Union as well. Matter of fact this scene in the movie is where the Confederate Irishmen had to kill their own countrymen fighting for the Union. Lets jsut say God Bless all Irish....... all Americans, who fought and died in this horrible war.
To all you southern boys that wish to secede from the union, go ahead. Nobody is going to stop you this time. Us yankees learned our lesson. We'd have universal healthcare and you'd still have your hookworms and outhouses.
@360Nomad I have not seen this movie. If you look up on a movie base data sometimes it will tell you all the songs. Can you watch this whole movie on youtube?
Oh and I tell you what, because you're obvious a rabid English hater with your pro IRA bollocks and "hun slapping" shit, which most confederate americans would find offensive as most american southerners are protestant not catholic, well look here my irish friend:
List_of_Irish_inventions_and_discoveries
List_of_English_inventions_and_discoveries
Copy and paste the two things above to google and then wiki them!
Show's how much the Irish have done compared to us Anglo-Saxon Englishmen!
@EnglishNationalist13 I really don`t know where you are pulling these crazed facts from, Thousands upon thousands of Irishmen fought for both Union and Confederacy. And they surely weren`t "Ulster Scots" at Fredericksburg the Irish brigade, mostly all first generation immigrants from Leinster and Munster suffered 40% mortality.
@EnglishNationalist13 Of the five Irish men who commanded the Irish Brigade, three were killed and the other two wounded. Colonel Richard Byrne was mortally wounded at Cold Harbor; Colonel Patrick Kelly was killed at Petersburg. Major General Thomas A. Smyth died at Farmville. and Brigadier Generals Robert Nugent and Thomas Meagher were both wounded.
@EnglishNationalist13 Not to mention it was General Robert E Lee who referred to the Irish brigade as " Never were men so brave" And no I am not a Catholic I don`t see how a debate about war brings up anyones releigion but it is a common trait of the English to persecute others for their personal beliefs. I recomend that no one pay head to the Englishnationalist. As he is peddling lies half truths and frankly crazy statistics that he cannot back up with facts
Also, why all this shit about the "irish brigade" in the confederate war. Most of the people who immigrated to and settled in Americas deep south were English, Scottish, Ulster-scots, Germans and French. Most of the irish settled in the north-east in new jersey, boston, new york etc...
There were easily more Englishmen fighting for the confederate army than irishmen. I'm not having a go but come on, the irish trying to big yourselves up again. What have you done for the world thats so great?
@jettrink60 Ok, many English people today have Germanic roots as our ancestors from 1000's of years ago were the saxons, angles, jutes etc, but there is still a large celtic presence in English blood today.
Admittedly our politically correct government are bending over backwards to muslim scumbags, but I am damn proud to be English, we controlled over half the whole world at one point, with the world's greatest ever empire, and all from one tiny Island. I'm damn proud. England till I die.
Oh and another thing americans, most of you southerners who have "scots-irish" ancestry, it means your ancestors were Ulster Scots from Northern Ireland, of a protestant background, not full blooded irish catholics. Most of the irish settled in the north anyway, it was Englishman, Scots and Ulstermen who settled in the deep south.
@EnglishNationalist13 So English Nationalist keep the two below posts in mind and learn some history and stop pulling bollocks statistics out of your arse I I
The United States was and is a tyranny, governed by a few politicians in D.C. with their own interests at heart and complete disregard for the will of the people or the states. The federal government did not form the states. We the people formed the federal government. Therefore, the states are sovereign and the union is a VOLUNTARY alliance that should be dissolved if that be the wish of the people. The Southern states got screwed and simply wished to free themselves of this oppresive tyranny
@ntheo93 I don't know that at the time they thought that way specifically. But I do know that the Civil War was NOT about slavery. You just have to read history to know that.
However, I still believe that South shouldn't have tried to secede from the union because I believe that we as a nation must stand together and try to resolve our problems. To me, the Civil War was a failure in diplomacy, but it seems we still haven't learned from it or the Revolutionary War.
@YoungTeufelhunden "You just have to read history" Actually young one, if you read the actual secessionist documents, you would see that slavery was the precise reason the South seceded. Don't trust the milquetoast history fed to you in school. Think for yourself
@sutterbean1 Cute, but I didn't learn that in school; I actually came to that conclusion on my own through my own research. What I mean when I say that the war was not about slavery, is that slavery was not the "precise" reason for their secession. The war was more about states' rights and their own legislation of slavery rather than slavery itself. I didn't, nor do I, mean to suggest that slavery was not an issue, I'm merely stating that slavery, like I said, was not the "precise" reason.
@sutterbean1: Now, I'm not going to argue against the fact that slavery was probably the most prominent or influential state right, but I still don't believe it was purely about slavery. I just have a differing opinion, maybe I'm wrong. If, or when, I am wrong, I gladly admit so. But yes, I do research anything I intend to argue for or against, and I do have my own thoughts and viewpoints, so I'd really appreciate it if you kept your "think for yourself," comments.....well......to yourself =p
@sutterbean1 northern propagandist is nbullshit sir is what your being fed. Younteufelhunden is right. they dont teach what hes saying in school by far they dont. I live in stlouis. the only "Union" city in this "southern" state and we are tuaght in school that slavery was the reason for the war and like he says above. slavery was not the "precise" reason for the war. the war was over states rights, the right to secede, the idea of a voluntary union, and the right to withold or abolish slavery..
@sutterbean1 ..as each state saw fit... if YOU read the constitution as written by the southern states (CSA) and the seccessionist documents you so prooudly present as your proof, i counter present the wording therein them. look at the wording and you'll see that they specifically dont state slavery, but rather the right to maintain slavery if the state so chooses. the civil war was not about lavery. it was about states rights and the north wanted to create a binding rather than voluntary union.
@ntheo93 Although I agree with most of what you said, there is one thing we need to stop doing. We need to stop referring to the federal government as the United States. WE are the United States of America, not the federal government. I will salute, pledge allegiance, and die for this country and her flag if necessary..... not for the government, but for us, these United States. With all due respect I give you my reply.
@ntheo93 It means the history of this heroic struggle will be written by the enemy; that our youth will be trained by Northern schoolteachers; will learn from Northern school books their version of the war; will be impressed by the influences of history and education to regard our gallant dead as traitors, and our maimed veterans as fit objects for derision - Patrick Cleburne "Stonewall of the West"
@raiders1815 I respect your opinion, but the directors cut if far better. Though i loved this movie from the get go, the Directors cut made it worthy of a Gettysberg prequal, and it trley diserves to be on the list of Epics. The music was great, the acting was spot on, the screen play , though dull in a few parts, was realy good. The book was far different, but i saw this befor reading the book, and perhaps that is one reason why I love the movie so much.
So many good men (mainly whites) died in that war and for what? Just so that the northern industrialists and Republicans could control the southern economy and because a few southern rich people (some of which were black) would not give up their slaves. (which isn't what the war was about anyways). Damn shame. I solute my ancestors that were Irish and fought for the Confederacy. I will never forget that they stood for my freedom from the US before I even existed.
@Faxe90Swe Why dont you talk TO me instead of to someone else, when you say He is basically fine, I get pissed off because I dont like people talking about me when their not talking to me. And hell yes Im for propaganda, I'll support my country until the last man. God Bless The USA! As for true history, I know mine. I never said I buy everything willingly like those who may watch movies or read books, I just think movies give you a better visual.
Well I kind of give up a serious debate when the guy start acting like a fanatic bigot. I mean, what is the point discussing the historical value of film when you obviously don`t care in the first place - all you want is for America to look as good as possible. And I find that strange because America look good enough without fabrications, but you don´t think so, apparently.
@Faxe90Swe As for you I dont like you, I maybe able to reconcile with Darth but not you. And once again you dont talk to me directly, when the guy... That really pisses me off, and I dont quite get how I act like a fanatic bigot, its you who think people shouldnt be appreciative of past events while watching a simple film. And yes I want America to look good, were the greatest country in the world. I dont see anything wrong in being patriotic.
@RevBillyRayCollins I understand your point of view. I do not entirely agree with it but I understand it. I just wanted to clear uo what I had said and make sure that I didn't accidently offend you. Btw, if you, like me, are a fan of this film, you may be interested to know that the Extended Director's Cut is being released on May 24! (I'm trying to spread the word to as many fans as I can :P).
@DarthMercanto Yes I am a fan of Gods And Generals but what exactly is included in the extended directors cut? Sounds interesting, but are they adding any new scenes to the movie? Or just behind the scenes stuff?
@RevBillyRayCollins The Extended Director's Cut is the print of the film that the audience was meant to see. It is approximatley 1 hour longer then the original. It contains several camp scenes from both sides, a sub plot involving Abraham Lincoln, John Wilkes Booth, and Harrison from Gettysburg, and, perhaps best of all, the Battle of Antietam, which was cut from the original film. If your a fan of the film its a must have (the Director's Cut of Gettysburg is also being released).
@RevBillyRayCollins The Director's Cut of Gettysburg will include 17 minutes of footage previously seen only on the TNT broadcasts of the film and the Special Edition released in 1994 on VHS. It will also be the first time the film will be remastered and released on Blu-Ray.
@RevBillyRayCollins Oh I forgot to mention that if you want to see the scenes cut from Gettysburg they are available on this site. Just look up deleted Gettysburg scenes.
@RevBillyRayCollins My pleasure, friend. Would you mind spreading the word if you run into anyone else on YouTube? Some of us on the forums are hopping that if these editions sell well enough Turner may finally reconsider his decision regarding LFM.
@RevBillyRayCollins My pleasure, friend. Would you mind spreading the word if you run into anyone else on YouTube? Some of us on the forums are hopping that if these editions sell well enough Turner may finally reconsider his decision regarding LFM.
@RevBillyRayCollins I understand your point of view. I do not entirely agree with it but I understand it. I just wanted to clear up what I had said and make sure that I didn't accidently offend you. Btw, if you, like me, are a fan of this film, you may be interested to know that the Extended Director's Cut is being released on May 24! (I'm trying to spread the word to as many fans as I can :P).
I´ve only written about you behind your back once, as i recall, and you´ve already bashed me for it. Did I do it again? Personally I agree fully in that respect: it`s pretty annoying when people backtalk you. I can stretch to an apology on that one.
Furthermore, I call you a bigot because you quite plainly embrace, even promote, untruthful propaganda.
@Faxe90Swe The only thing Im going to say is about remembering the dead, personally I never understood why people want to see the dead at their burial place, whenever my wife goes to lay wreaths at the graves during Christmas I never go with her, I cant say why because I dont know why but I dont like it. I remember the dead through my thoughts and a good song, something I can help flow my thoughts with, as for military a good way is to go to a battlefield and honor them there. To See where and
It was a high-budget movie if compared to Gettysburg, but if compared to other, more generally celebrated movies, as Gladiator, which had a budget of 105, 000,000 $, Gods and Generals, with 56,000,000 $, is a low-budget movie.
Anyway, I just wanted to correct Darth: the Directors Cut of G&G is almost two and a half hours longer than the theatrical, nearly six hours in total.
@Faxe90Swe Thats still preety expensive, considering all the time that went into making G&G and Gettysburg, I consider them to be great films. Now Gladiator is a whole different story... Personally I like Ben Hur better, which if you think about it, and you rearrange some of the plot line, there basically the same story.
I too consider Gettysburg and G&G great films, if I take them for what they is - entertainment.
About Ben Hur and Gladiator, I think The Fall of the Roman Empire, with Christopher Plummer as Commodus, is more reminiscent of Gladiator than Ben Hur. Again, all these movies are great entertainment, but devoid of accuracy. Commodus, for example, did not get killed in the arena, he was strangled in his sleep.
@Faxe90Swe I've never seen The Fall of the Roman Empire so I wouldn't know. And yes they are devoid of accuracy but I at least enjoy Ben Hur, because Charlton Heston is the greatest actor of all time. And no my last post wasnt meant for you but if you know the answer then feel free to tell me.
@Faxe90Swe Although the working print that has been screened in the past was 5 1/2 to 6 hours, the Extended release will onl be 1 hour longer with a total running time of 280 minutes instead of 220. No one is really sure why this is. It may be because some of the shots were incomplete or redundant. It could also be that Warner Brothers made a mistake in their announcement but as it stands the official annoucnement and all other press releases state the film at 280 minutes, not the rumourd 323.
@Faxe90Swe No problem. Apparently its all there. The Antietam battle is supposedly a bit shorter then Manassas Junction. However the footage is supposed to be incredible.
I learned awile ago that one of my great grandmothers, however far back, on my fathers side lived in Fredericksburg at the time of the war, her house was not far from the stone wall, I visited Fredericksburg National Battlefield Park over the summer and went to where the wall stood, it was very emotional to see where the battle actually took place, the CSA probably had one of their greatest victories there, Im proud to be a southernor!
@boerenyoghurt, Being both an Irish-American and a southerner i would say that both sides of north and south of Irishmen deserves respect and gratitude due to their bravery and loyalty to their cause not because of which side they happend to be on because both only wanted freedom and a new start in America.
@1798Greenflag1916 Ah piss off you bloody irishman. I don't understand why you Americans with Irish ancestry are so keen to celebrate your supposed "irishness" despite the fact you may be about 12.5% irish and 25% English. Like Obama going to Ireland and having a Guinness, making a public show of his irishness when he's 3% irish and about 20% English. What have you irish ever fucking done eh? The English made the USA what it is today, most of the founding fathers were English. Read your history.
@EnglishNationalist13 Where the hell are you pulling those statistics out of ?. What have we Irish ever done ?. Built the American nation on the back of our sweat blood and tears as well as inventing some of the most important inventions that are key to the survivial of humanity every single day, from the foundation of the principle of chemistry and anti biotics to the syringe, something every world navy prides themselves on is too an Irish invention that being the submarine.
@EnglishNationalist13 Not to mention you seem to forget that while the English were running around naked playing in the mud beating each other shitless with sticks and stones and the egyptians hadn`t even envisioned the great Pyramids and occupied themselves building sand castles . The Irish were a highly organized race making the greats monuments the world had ever seen and would see for centuries to come . I suppose your English school never thought you about Newgrange Knowth or Dowth
@1798Greenflag1916 Yeah ok. Look I have nothing against the irish, I don't hate irish people or the Catholicism. It just annoys me how the irish seem to take great pride in claiming things which they're not responsible for as their own. Ok a few hundred years ago us English may have oppressed your people, i'm sorry, but I had no say in that. Africa is a mess without our colonial rule and we built India, the USA and other countries...we controlled more than half the world from one tiny island....
@EnglishNationalist13 This is about something that happened a hundred and fifty years ago. I've not seen this movie . But I do know the Irish Brigade was canon fodder at Frederickburg. as most soldiers are. Look at Robert E. Lee's hell bent decision that he was right and ordered Pickett's Charge! War is a nasty pitiful thing that is controlled my big fat men usually a thousand miles away acting like children. What the English get out of Gallipoli that wasn't a smart move
God bless you Irishmen!!! If i ever fight a battle I wouldn't do it unless I had an Irishman by my side and by the way you fellows make the best damn beer in the whole fucked up world. God love yah!!!
This song is very moving and melancholy. I've watched the scene from Gods and Generals in which this score is played, and it has made me cry on several occasions.
@fishsama999 I know! I had Irish in my family 7 generations ago, and even though it's been that long, that scene hit me hard. That Irish blood is where I get my unusual hair color, and fair skin. Many on my Mom's of the family is very light skinned. Unusual for Hispanics. Also unusual for me to have natural auburn highlights and strawberry blond facial hair and stand at 6'3" where other than two male cousins on my mom's side are under 5'9". They both stand over 6'5". One is 6'9"! 0_o
@fishsama999 Holy crap! I got a strange feeling in the pit of my stomach when I found it. Oddly proud as well. I had family on both my mom and dad's side who fought in that war. My Mom told me a long time ago that a member of the family fought in it. I never would have connected the two though. They had always been spoken about separately. The fact there was Irish in the family was pretty much mentioned in passing. Never did they say they was Irish family in the Mexican Army. Thank you so much!
@GeneralKenobiSIYE Sorry. I meant third generation American. lol Still love what the country's /meant/ to stand for, despite the current situation and divisions.
Or they have an eye for detecting superficial hero-worship, and realize that their forebears deserved better than become the object for entertainment to be enjoyed by bloodthirsty audiences who don`t actually care about what they did or why they did it, they just want a good war movie with lots of death and human tragedy so that they can then go to youtube and testify to how their emotions were so touched and how they respect the deeds of these men and get a thumbs up...
@Faxe90Swe Maybe they actually are touched by this film and this peice of history. Had they of not seen this movie many people may have not known what these soldiers went through, it gives them a good visual. Now I had family fight in this war, so I do care. Its people like you who have no respect for remembering their ancestors.
Me too, I had an ancestor fight in this war. And i remember him by finding out where he fought, his service-record, and if possible his reasons for fighting. And about respect, I think we have two totally different definitions of it.
"This piece of history"... well, here we got a very common problem: that people think movies are a source of learning, a way of masseducation for those too lazy or indifferent to read a book.
@Faxe90Swe I still dont see whats wrong with movies, they give people better visuals of what happened. Although books are great they usually give a biased view of what happened. Documentaries are very educational and easier to follow than books since they usually cut out all the personal opinion crap.
@RevBillyRayCollins And movies aren`t biased!!? Watch The Patriot, then read a book on the subject, even a biased book, and you`ll see how truthful that movie was. Documentaries ususally give ONE perspective for simplicity and viewer convenience, while a book, any book, will at least list the different theories and opinions on the matter. "The story of the US" or what´s its name is perfect example of crap documentaries.
@Faxe90Swe Not necessarily true, most books are usually written by one person and they tend to not bother writing about someones elses opinion, the book The South Was Right is a prime example, a good book yes but only one opinion, where as the documentary Gettysburg The Battle gave both perspectives of the battle not just one side. Movies are made to entertain and inform people about subjects, gods and generals and gettysburg arent biased films because they give both views. The only books I know
What is both perspectives of a battle worth? At best the honor of individuals, like commanders. Your comparison is not fair. The book you mention deals with the very loaded subject of who was right politically and ideologically, the documentary is about a three-day battle with a purely military perspective. Find a better example. Military and political history are not compareable.
Of course history books display personal opinion, but a very qualified opinion, opinions formulated by men who may have devoted their whole lives to the study of the subject. Can you say that about the author of the novel and the director of this movie? And I think you might have read the wrong books, given your stance. If you exclude obviously biased works (sometimes revealed by the very title, "The South Was Right", for example) I think you would have another opinion.
@Faxe90Swe of that try to tell both sides are usually text books, so I really hope your not reading books like those considering most of the material in there is biased anyway. Now the Patriot was meant to tell the story of The Swamp Fox and thats what it did, it wasnt meant to be the most accurate portrayl of The American Revolutionary War. It just focused on his little part. Books should be fair to both sides if they are to give an accurate description, but most arent because it involves
@RevBillyRayCollins " it wasnt meant to be the most accurate portrayl of The American Revolutionary War. It just focused on his little part." His little part didn`t involve winning the battle of Guilford Courthouse, the end battle of the movie, since the Americans actually lost that battle. The Swamp Fox was a man named Marion, not Martin. As I recall it, he wasn`t even present at the battle of Guilford Courthouse.
@Faxe90Swe someone looking back on the subject and giving their opinion as to what happened. Onw good book that didnt do that was Brutal Journey about and expedition gone wrong. The author however wrote the book as a story with characters and they didnt say well what they meant by this was or any of that crap, sort of like the novel The Killer Angels, they had a plot. But most other books that try to teach us something are pure opinion.
And damn right it wasn`t accurate - it was downright distortive. Tavington, presumably based on real-life legion commander Banastre Tarleton, never burned a church full of civilians. He did possibly order the killing of war prisoners, POSSIBLY, but even then it is a hell of a difference from killing civilians. The British are demonized beyond justifiable reason. Cornwallis is depicted as a rear-stationed old general, when he in fact was in his thirties and was at the
Posted wrong, but I´m sure you`ll read that post as well and understand it was intended for you. Anyway, I recommend James McPherson`s book "Battle Cry of Freedom" for an outstanding work that takes all possible angles of the conflict into account.
@RevBillyRayCollins heat of the battle, driving his men forward, being physically dragged from the frontline by his ADC:s. Any man with the least knowledge of the American Revolutionary War (and I´m Swedish!!!) will know to completely disregard The Patriot as instructive of history, unless he himself is a fanatic bent on glorifying American history. American history doesn`t require glorification, it is well enough glorious and honorable as it is.
@Faxe90Swe I'm not entirely sure what your debating, but I whole-heartedly agree that "The Patriot" is astounding jingonistic travesty! I also agree that all historical works are somewhat biased. I very much enjoyed this film and I am eagerly awaiting the Director's Cut this May, but it is still biased. I think its best to take multiple perspectives, sift through them, and come to your own conclusion. How is McPherson btw? I'm planning on tackling Battle Cry after I finish with Shelby Foote.
Agreed on the multiple perspectives. The debate is about me not thinking this movie, or any movie or novel, is to be considered historically instructive, and above all not to be considered as "honoring" the men who fought and died.
McPherson is very objective, and very exhaustive, describing every aspect of the conflict in detail. It is THE standard one-volume work on the Civil War, in my opinion. And it has a very good bibliography for further reading.
@Faxe90Swe I think historical novels and films can be instructive, they just shouldn't be taken for Gospel. Gods and Generals gave me a better understanding of battles like Chancellorsville and Fredricksburg, however I certainly wouldn't rely upon them as my only source of information on those engagements. As for the political opinions, I think it is instructive in so far as it demonstrates the Southern Perspective. I think that perspective is wrong but it is a great way to understand it.
It scratches the surface, but is in no way sufficient for anyone to base an opinion on, like you basically said. But people do tend to view movies as an easy access to knowledge.
@Faxe90Swe Personally I dont think it matters if they demonized Cornwalis, Im an American and he waged war against us, so I already dont care for him. And as I said the book The South Was Right was very good but clearly biased, you wrote a lot and Im not responding to it all so I'll end with movies give people a visual, they can here and see depictions of what happened. Im not going to keep this up other than saying if you hate movies for this aspect so much then dont bother watching them.
@RevBillyRayCollins I don't think that makes it fair to demonize him. General Lee technically bore arms against the United States, and I think it would be unfair to demonize him. The film not only fails to give the British time to explain their point of view, not only is it one sided, but it also completely invents fictional events. For example Tavington burning down a church filled with civilians. That never happened. I believe America had the right to secede, but there's no need to demonize.
@DarthMercanto Oh I see, all the assholes are against me now just because something is out of my control, I dont make these movies but since I watch them I guess that makes me less of a person. I feel real appreciated. Dont get me wrong I love Lee and the South and I strongly support seccesion but if someone wants to 'hate' on him, then do so, its their opinion. I have mine and all I was saying is that movies give you a better visual.
@RevBillyRayCollins I didn't mean to be offensive and I don't think anything I said justifies that kind of language. To be honest I was hoping to have a civil discussion like the one you had with mark (:P). If you read my comments to Faxe you'll find that I actually argue for historical validity in film and historical fiction, I merely argue that it should be taken with a grain of salt. Also when did I say liking this film made you less of a person? Personally I love this film.
@DarthMercanto I dont think you were being offensive its just me venting out anger, and if you go way back on me and marks conversations on multiple videos there was 'foul' language exchanged, from me anyway I usually only use it when Im frustrated, but eventually we achieved each others respect. I'll admit back then I didnt like the guy but now I would say we are somewhat friends. Personally I dont give a damned, Im frustrated, about inaccuracy in films because film is an art, the directors
Now, I can only refer to my original post to you for an explanation of my hesitation towards movies as "honoring" of past events and men. In my book the Washington Monument and others such as it, Military graveyards and scholarly works are the best ways of remembering. Such things triggers my emotions, not low-budget films - it frustrated me that you ascribed, or at least implied, such value to simple movies.
@DarthMercanto vision, if they dont want the true story to be only whats in the film then they have the right to change it, no one is requiring the story to be told on screen and to be absolutely true, the directors in charge. And making me less of a person is also a common phrase I use when someone is dead set against me, just mindless words that really have no menaing to me.
And propaganda is not patriotism, and in the American case completely unnecessary to begin with. And I think directors have a responsibility to be truthful in their films, for the same reasons I don`t approve of photographers (also an artist) manipulating pictures and then publish them. I´m all for obscure perspectives, angling and bias, that´s natural in all human affairs, but pure fabrications are a crime to the memory of past men.
@Faxe90Swe To bad there isnt a whole lot that is glorious and honorable about American history. America has proved to be as imperialistic and genocidal as Europe even worse because at least Europe has learned from those mistakes over the years while America continues to make those same blunder.
Im not arguing that American has'nt done glorious or honorable things but we've got a hell of a lot of blood on our hands.
Yes, you do, every people and every nation do. But America is no where near to have the same "guilt" as Europe. No European country can indict America of something that that country hasn`t made itself guilty of sometime in its history. And America continues to make these blunders because America is still young. America have a somewhat casual attitude to war, as opposed to Europe, because they haven`t had a war fought on home terf for 150 years.
The American nation still have a lot of lessons to learn, but I have no doubt they will learn them and consolidate that knowledge in the most appropriate way. Worth mention also: Americas dubious role as world police was forced upon them by the power vacuum in Europe after ww2, a vacuum filled by the Soviet Union. America paid a heavy price besides actual casualties in ww2 - that of becoming militarized and un-American.
I went to Fredericksburg this summer and laid my hand on the piece of the original wall and I just collapsed crying thinking of all blood shed to try and take and keep that wall, it just hit home. It didn’t take much to see the Irish Bridge huddling against the low dip the wall, as Cobb’s Confederate Irishmen littered their own countrymen with volley after volley. Ná déan dearmad orth!
I went to Fredericksburg this summer and laid my hand on the piece of the original wall and I just collapsed crying thinking of all blood shed to try and take and keep that wall, it just hit home. It didn’t take much to see the Irish Bridge huddling against the low dip the wall, as Cobb’s Confederate Irishmen littered their own countrymen with volley after volley. Ná déan dearmad orth!
My great grandpa thomas loughlin was with the 158th new york regiment in the civil war he was an irish imergrant like the res who fought im proud of my heritiage
To me this is by far the most haunting piece of the Gods and Generals soundtrack, especially in conjunction with the image of the men of the Irish brigade getting cut to pieces in that murderous frontal assault.
"I must side either with or against my section or country. I cannot raise my hand against my birthplace, my home, my children. I should like, above all things, that our difficulties might be peaceably arranged.... Whatever may be the result of the contest, I foresee that the country will have to pass through a terrible ordeal, a necessary expiation perhaps for our national sins" - Robert E. Lee
@RevBillyRayCollins Good vs. Evil? Bro that's just dumb. Come on man these aren't nazis we're talking about, this is the United States Federal government. And whether you would like to admit it or not both the States and the Feds have the best interest of America at heart, they just have different views and methods of achieving said goals.
Generally both sides in this war we're overly hasty and stubborn, this war could've been avoided but neither side was willing to compromise.
@JB1528 I guess your right there isnt good vs evil in a war between brothers but what the C.S.A. was fighting for was a lot better cause than the union, this country was founded on individual states coming together to create a country, with this the govt back then created a few national laws and allowed the states to do the rest, since thats how it has always been, but in the mid 1800s the natl govt wanted to have more authority than the states and the southern states said no since the national
Makes me proud to be an Irish American
89jersy 1 week ago
This scene made me cry, anybody else?
Bigmoonproductions 1 month ago 2
@Bigmoonproductions Me too! Whenever I hear this, I get a longing for the Emerald Isle!!! Nice to know that it's not just me goes like this :)
FairytaleIsland 1 month ago
@Bigmoonproductions it so makes me cry. I'm almost crying just listening to the music, because I can see it happening in my mind. The charge of the Irish Brigade is my favorite part of the entire movie.
kansasviolinist 1 week ago
But it is sad what these corporation and politician have done with the government of the people. Abraham Lincoln, Franklin Rooselvet and the Kennedys must be turnig over in their one´s grave, whatching horrified what this corrupt men have done.
MrBarto23 1 month ago in playlist Favorite videos
@MrBarto23 All those men started it. Lincoln turned the United States in a Police State during the Civil War. FDR turned the Armed Forces over to corporations and ran the country as a Police State much like Lincoln. And JFK nearly started WW3 over Soviet Missiles in Cuba (even though USSR already possessed submarines capable of carrying nuclear weapons) for PR.
catsareweapons 1 week ago
¿What abut the Black Men? that got the freedom because of the great sacrifices of the North Men. You talk abut freedom, but your notion of freedom is as pale as you. The South only fight for the privilege of the slavery, how was enjoy by even "fewer" people. But nevertheless, I thank you for the good music. I recomend you to see the movie Glory.
MrBarto23 1 month ago in playlist Favorite videos
@MrBarto23 Slavery had a big part in it yes. It is the birthright of any human being to free him or herself from tyranny, slave or non. But it is not entirely why Southerners fought. Most Southern Whites were too poor to even own slaves. Many just seen it as "huge armies are coming from the North, we've got to defend our homeland." States rights truly was a large issue. Each state had it's own currency. Georgia came close to succeeding from the Confederacy over States Rights.
JTCodel 1 month ago
@JTCodel I know that they whanted there liberty ¿But liberty for what? ¿Liberty to oppress more the black man? Even in this day, they get upset when the people form the North, criticize them because of the way they treat the Black man, in the Souther States. Im sorry, but the south cant talk and demand freedom while the oppress the Black Man. Is thanks of beloging to United State, that they have change their policy of oppresing the Black. And the sad think is that whe had to force them.
MrBarto23 1 month ago in playlist Favorite videos
@MrBarto23 Like in modern times? Man, that's just a stereotype. I'm a southerner, well Oklahoman so that's up for debate, but I have no problem with blacks at all. Got black friends, too.. blacks were important to the development of southern culture. Rosa Parks is one of my heroes for practicing peaceful civil disobedience. But, in modern times you have to admit the Federal governments over reached it's authority by far. I don't care where you're from. Gonna have to make two comments.
JTCodel 1 month ago
@MrBarto23 But besides that, all I was saying is they fought for more than Slavery. As I said the majority couldn't even afford them. States rights was one reason. When Lincoln was elected they felt that their vote didn't count and that was really the last straw. Pride had a lot to do with it. Military was tradition in the South at the time, even today. And, times were different. People were more loyal to their State than the Union. Racism existed in more places than just the south, too man.
JTCodel 1 month ago
@NevadaWrangler well I do feel bad for the yankee Irish, since they were forced to fight once they landed in Federal areas such as New York. And I am very proud of those brave Irish who fought for the South.
MrDixieLove 2 months ago
WOUHOUHOU WOUHOUHOU !!!!
BaronRougeCF 2 months ago
Alright guys I think we can all agree on that people are taught that the South is bad and the North is good but we all know it isn't that simple. The South did what to them needed to be done and I fully respect that.
cody92697 2 months ago
God bless those brave Irish heroes who fought for the southern nation :)
MrDixieLove 2 months ago 2
@MrDixieLove Many fought for the Union as well. Matter of fact this scene in the movie is where the Confederate Irishmen had to kill their own countrymen fighting for the Union. Lets jsut say God Bless all Irish....... all Americans, who fought and died in this horrible war.
NevadaWrangler 2 months ago
I LOVE THIS MOVIE ; AND GETTYSBURG TOO
;D
GeneralGeorgeHaZard 2 months ago
@GeneralGeorgeHaZard yea i heard that they may make a movie about the battle of Shiloh
Irish8594 2 months ago in playlist Favorite videos
Long Live Dixie, and Fuck this Politically Corrupt Tyranny of a Government.
JJMNStar 2 months ago
Hail to all the irish who fought for a foreign nation!
Erín Go Brágh!
TheAverageProJoe 5 months ago in playlist TheAverageProJoe's Favorited Videos 4
Erin Go Bragh!
odonnell1218 6 months ago
To all you southern boys that wish to secede from the union, go ahead. Nobody is going to stop you this time. Us yankees learned our lesson. We'd have universal healthcare and you'd still have your hookworms and outhouses.
doggydimepicker 6 months ago
THE IRISH MAN IS THE BRAVEST HUMAN EVER !
wexfordboyful 6 months ago 5
I Live in Texas, and If the calll comes, that we have left the Union. I shall go.
mikew194 6 months ago
What's the name of the song that plays when the Irish Brigade is charging uphill just before this one?
360Nomad 6 months ago
@360Nomad I have not seen this movie. If you look up on a movie base data sometimes it will tell you all the songs. Can you watch this whole movie on youtube?
Ms2blackcats 6 months ago
What a terrible waste of the Irish brigade/ but I'm proud of them
Ms2blackcats 6 months ago
Really nice movie!But gettysburg is also good :D.
RoyalPikeman 6 months ago
Oh and I tell you what, because you're obvious a rabid English hater with your pro IRA bollocks and "hun slapping" shit, which most confederate americans would find offensive as most american southerners are protestant not catholic, well look here my irish friend:
List_of_Irish_inventions_and_discoveries
List_of_English_inventions_and_discoveries
Copy and paste the two things above to google and then wiki them!
Show's how much the Irish have done compared to us Anglo-Saxon Englishmen!
EnglishNationalist13 7 months ago
@EnglishNationalist13 I really don`t know where you are pulling these crazed facts from, Thousands upon thousands of Irishmen fought for both Union and Confederacy. And they surely weren`t "Ulster Scots" at Fredericksburg the Irish brigade, mostly all first generation immigrants from Leinster and Munster suffered 40% mortality.
1798Greenflag1916 7 months ago
@EnglishNationalist13 Of the five Irish men who commanded the Irish Brigade, three were killed and the other two wounded. Colonel Richard Byrne was mortally wounded at Cold Harbor; Colonel Patrick Kelly was killed at Petersburg. Major General Thomas A. Smyth died at Farmville. and Brigadier Generals Robert Nugent and Thomas Meagher were both wounded.
1798Greenflag1916 7 months ago
@EnglishNationalist13 Not to mention it was General Robert E Lee who referred to the Irish brigade as " Never were men so brave" And no I am not a Catholic I don`t see how a debate about war brings up anyones releigion but it is a common trait of the English to persecute others for their personal beliefs. I recomend that no one pay head to the Englishnationalist. As he is peddling lies half truths and frankly crazy statistics that he cannot back up with facts
1798Greenflag1916 7 months ago
Also, why all this shit about the "irish brigade" in the confederate war. Most of the people who immigrated to and settled in Americas deep south were English, Scottish, Ulster-scots, Germans and French. Most of the irish settled in the north-east in new jersey, boston, new york etc...
There were easily more Englishmen fighting for the confederate army than irishmen. I'm not having a go but come on, the irish trying to big yourselves up again. What have you done for the world thats so great?
EnglishNationalist13 7 months ago
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@EnglishNationalist13 Did you even read my previous posts ? And there you go again pulling more bollocks amde up facts out of thin air.
1798Greenflag1916 7 months ago
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Bolleriker 7 months ago
@jettrink60 Ok, many English people today have Germanic roots as our ancestors from 1000's of years ago were the saxons, angles, jutes etc, but there is still a large celtic presence in English blood today.
Admittedly our politically correct government are bending over backwards to muslim scumbags, but I am damn proud to be English, we controlled over half the whole world at one point, with the world's greatest ever empire, and all from one tiny Island. I'm damn proud. England till I die.
EnglishNationalist13 8 months ago
Oh and another thing americans, most of you southerners who have "scots-irish" ancestry, it means your ancestors were Ulster Scots from Northern Ireland, of a protestant background, not full blooded irish catholics. Most of the irish settled in the north anyway, it was Englishman, Scots and Ulstermen who settled in the deep south.
EnglishNationalist13 8 months ago
@EnglishNationalist13 So English Nationalist keep the two below posts in mind and learn some history and stop pulling bollocks statistics out of your arse I I
V
1798Greenflag1916 7 months ago
The United States was and is a tyranny, governed by a few politicians in D.C. with their own interests at heart and complete disregard for the will of the people or the states. The federal government did not form the states. We the people formed the federal government. Therefore, the states are sovereign and the union is a VOLUNTARY alliance that should be dissolved if that be the wish of the people. The Southern states got screwed and simply wished to free themselves of this oppresive tyranny
ntheo93 8 months ago 25
@ntheo93 I don't know that at the time they thought that way specifically. But I do know that the Civil War was NOT about slavery. You just have to read history to know that.
However, I still believe that South shouldn't have tried to secede from the union because I believe that we as a nation must stand together and try to resolve our problems. To me, the Civil War was a failure in diplomacy, but it seems we still haven't learned from it or the Revolutionary War.
YoungTeufelhunden 5 months ago
@YoungTeufelhunden "You just have to read history" Actually young one, if you read the actual secessionist documents, you would see that slavery was the precise reason the South seceded. Don't trust the milquetoast history fed to you in school. Think for yourself
sutterbean1 5 months ago
@sutterbean1 Cute, but I didn't learn that in school; I actually came to that conclusion on my own through my own research. What I mean when I say that the war was not about slavery, is that slavery was not the "precise" reason for their secession. The war was more about states' rights and their own legislation of slavery rather than slavery itself. I didn't, nor do I, mean to suggest that slavery was not an issue, I'm merely stating that slavery, like I said, was not the "precise" reason.
YoungTeufelhunden 5 months ago
@sutterbean1: Now, I'm not going to argue against the fact that slavery was probably the most prominent or influential state right, but I still don't believe it was purely about slavery. I just have a differing opinion, maybe I'm wrong. If, or when, I am wrong, I gladly admit so. But yes, I do research anything I intend to argue for or against, and I do have my own thoughts and viewpoints, so I'd really appreciate it if you kept your "think for yourself," comments.....well......to yourself =p
YoungTeufelhunden 5 months ago
@sutterbean1 northern propagandist is nbullshit sir is what your being fed. Younteufelhunden is right. they dont teach what hes saying in school by far they dont. I live in stlouis. the only "Union" city in this "southern" state and we are tuaght in school that slavery was the reason for the war and like he says above. slavery was not the "precise" reason for the war. the war was over states rights, the right to secede, the idea of a voluntary union, and the right to withold or abolish slavery..
JJMNStar 2 months ago
@sutterbean1 ..as each state saw fit... if YOU read the constitution as written by the southern states (CSA) and the seccessionist documents you so prooudly present as your proof, i counter present the wording therein them. look at the wording and you'll see that they specifically dont state slavery, but rather the right to maintain slavery if the state so chooses. the civil war was not about lavery. it was about states rights and the north wanted to create a binding rather than voluntary union.
JJMNStar 2 months ago
@ntheo93 Although I agree with most of what you said, there is one thing we need to stop doing. We need to stop referring to the federal government as the United States. WE are the United States of America, not the federal government. I will salute, pledge allegiance, and die for this country and her flag if necessary..... not for the government, but for us, these United States. With all due respect I give you my reply.
NevadaWrangler 2 months ago
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@ntheo93 It means the history of this heroic struggle will be written by the enemy; that our youth will be trained by Northern schoolteachers; will learn from Northern school books their version of the war; will be impressed by the influences of history and education to regard our gallant dead as traitors, and our maimed veterans as fit objects for derision - Patrick Cleburne "Stonewall of the West"
AUG351 1 week ago
"we came across the sea to escape a tyranny, and end up shootin at one another in the land of the free."
dragonrider1098 9 months ago in playlist fun
hate to say it guys but the movie sucks. gettysburg was great though
raiders1815 9 months ago
@raiders1815 I respect your opinion, but the directors cut if far better. Though i loved this movie from the get go, the Directors cut made it worthy of a Gettysberg prequal, and it trley diserves to be on the list of Epics. The music was great, the acting was spot on, the screen play , though dull in a few parts, was realy good. The book was far different, but i saw this befor reading the book, and perhaps that is one reason why I love the movie so much.
chopperpilot5 8 months ago
I'm Irish American, and it is sad I had relatives on both sides so it hits home.
SocratesRulz 9 months ago
AROOOO AROOOOOO AROOOOOOO
dhouse4167 9 months ago
So many good men (mainly whites) died in that war and for what? Just so that the northern industrialists and Republicans could control the southern economy and because a few southern rich people (some of which were black) would not give up their slaves. (which isn't what the war was about anyways). Damn shame. I solute my ancestors that were Irish and fought for the Confederacy. I will never forget that they stood for my freedom from the US before I even existed.
shtony2717 10 months ago
The best movie ever! I can't forget the fight scenes.
Mz93123 11 months ago 17
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@Mz93123 you should read the book ,if u haven't already. It's way better than the movie, much more detailed.
OPDEADHEAD82 4 months ago in playlist civil war songs
He is basically fine with propaganda, in other words .No genuine concern for true history.
Faxe90Swe 1 year ago
@Faxe90Swe Why dont you talk TO me instead of to someone else, when you say He is basically fine, I get pissed off because I dont like people talking about me when their not talking to me. And hell yes Im for propaganda, I'll support my country until the last man. God Bless The USA! As for true history, I know mine. I never said I buy everything willingly like those who may watch movies or read books, I just think movies give you a better visual.
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago
@RevBillyRayCollins
Well I kind of give up a serious debate when the guy start acting like a fanatic bigot. I mean, what is the point discussing the historical value of film when you obviously don`t care in the first place - all you want is for America to look as good as possible. And I find that strange because America look good enough without fabrications, but you don´t think so, apparently.
Faxe90Swe 1 year ago
@Faxe90Swe As for you I dont like you, I maybe able to reconcile with Darth but not you. And once again you dont talk to me directly, when the guy... That really pisses me off, and I dont quite get how I act like a fanatic bigot, its you who think people shouldnt be appreciative of past events while watching a simple film. And yes I want America to look good, were the greatest country in the world. I dont see anything wrong in being patriotic.
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago
@RevBillyRayCollins I understand your point of view. I do not entirely agree with it but I understand it. I just wanted to clear uo what I had said and make sure that I didn't accidently offend you. Btw, if you, like me, are a fan of this film, you may be interested to know that the Extended Director's Cut is being released on May 24! (I'm trying to spread the word to as many fans as I can :P).
DarthMercanto 1 year ago
@DarthMercanto Yes I am a fan of Gods And Generals but what exactly is included in the extended directors cut? Sounds interesting, but are they adding any new scenes to the movie? Or just behind the scenes stuff?
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago
@DarthMercanto I am a fan of G & G but what exactly is in the extended directors cut?
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago
@RevBillyRayCollins The Extended Director's Cut is the print of the film that the audience was meant to see. It is approximatley 1 hour longer then the original. It contains several camp scenes from both sides, a sub plot involving Abraham Lincoln, John Wilkes Booth, and Harrison from Gettysburg, and, perhaps best of all, the Battle of Antietam, which was cut from the original film. If your a fan of the film its a must have (the Director's Cut of Gettysburg is also being released).
DarthMercanto 1 year ago
@DarthMercanto Very interesting, now whats included in the directors cut of Gettysburg?
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago
@RevBillyRayCollins The Director's Cut of Gettysburg will include 17 minutes of footage previously seen only on the TNT broadcasts of the film and the Special Edition released in 1994 on VHS. It will also be the first time the film will be remastered and released on Blu-Ray.
DarthMercanto 1 year ago
@RevBillyRayCollins Oh I forgot to mention that if you want to see the scenes cut from Gettysburg they are available on this site. Just look up deleted Gettysburg scenes.
DarthMercanto 1 year ago
@DarthMercanto Thanks
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago
@RevBillyRayCollins My pleasure, friend. Would you mind spreading the word if you run into anyone else on YouTube? Some of us on the forums are hopping that if these editions sell well enough Turner may finally reconsider his decision regarding LFM.
DarthMercanto 1 year ago
@DarthMercanto I'll tell who I can, I already told a few of my friends at work and my brother, I certainly plan on getting them.
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago
@RevBillyRayCollins Awesome! Thanks for the help in spreading the word :D!
DarthMercanto 1 year ago
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@RevBillyRayCollins My pleasure, friend. Would you mind spreading the word if you run into anyone else on YouTube? Some of us on the forums are hopping that if these editions sell well enough Turner may finally reconsider his decision regarding LFM.
DarthMercanto 1 year ago
@RevBillyRayCollins I understand your point of view. I do not entirely agree with it but I understand it. I just wanted to clear up what I had said and make sure that I didn't accidently offend you. Btw, if you, like me, are a fan of this film, you may be interested to know that the Extended Director's Cut is being released on May 24! (I'm trying to spread the word to as many fans as I can :P).
DarthMercanto 1 year ago
@RevBillyRayCollins
Ohh dear, you can´t reconcile with me! Too bad.
I´ve only written about you behind your back once, as i recall, and you´ve already bashed me for it. Did I do it again? Personally I agree fully in that respect: it`s pretty annoying when people backtalk you. I can stretch to an apology on that one.
Furthermore, I call you a bigot because you quite plainly embrace, even promote, untruthful propaganda.
Faxe90Swe 1 year ago
@Faxe90Swe The only thing Im going to say is about remembering the dead, personally I never understood why people want to see the dead at their burial place, whenever my wife goes to lay wreaths at the graves during Christmas I never go with her, I cant say why because I dont know why but I dont like it. I remember the dead through my thoughts and a good song, something I can help flow my thoughts with, as for military a good way is to go to a battlefield and honor them there. To See where and
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago
@Faxe90Swe and it gives you a why as to fighting. And I wouldnt say G&G was low budget since it was fairly expensive.
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago
@RevBillyRayCollins
It was a high-budget movie if compared to Gettysburg, but if compared to other, more generally celebrated movies, as Gladiator, which had a budget of 105, 000,000 $, Gods and Generals, with 56,000,000 $, is a low-budget movie.
Anyway, I just wanted to correct Darth: the Directors Cut of G&G is almost two and a half hours longer than the theatrical, nearly six hours in total.
Faxe90Swe 1 year ago
@Faxe90Swe Thats still preety expensive, considering all the time that went into making G&G and Gettysburg, I consider them to be great films. Now Gladiator is a whole different story... Personally I like Ben Hur better, which if you think about it, and you rearrange some of the plot line, there basically the same story.
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago
@RevBillyRayCollins
I too consider Gettysburg and G&G great films, if I take them for what they is - entertainment.
About Ben Hur and Gladiator, I think The Fall of the Roman Empire, with Christopher Plummer as Commodus, is more reminiscent of Gladiator than Ben Hur. Again, all these movies are great entertainment, but devoid of accuracy. Commodus, for example, did not get killed in the arena, he was strangled in his sleep.
Btw was your latest post to Darth meant for me?
Faxe90Swe 1 year ago
@Faxe90Swe I've never seen The Fall of the Roman Empire so I wouldn't know. And yes they are devoid of accuracy but I at least enjoy Ben Hur, because Charlton Heston is the greatest actor of all time. And no my last post wasnt meant for you but if you know the answer then feel free to tell me.
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago
@Faxe90Swe Although the working print that has been screened in the past was 5 1/2 to 6 hours, the Extended release will onl be 1 hour longer with a total running time of 280 minutes instead of 220. No one is really sure why this is. It may be because some of the shots were incomplete or redundant. It could also be that Warner Brothers made a mistake in their announcement but as it stands the official annoucnement and all other press releases state the film at 280 minutes, not the rumourd 323.
DarthMercanto 1 year ago
@DarthMercanto
I stand corrected, sorry.
Too bad. It seems as too little time to fully include a whole new plot as well as a battle.
Faxe90Swe 1 year ago
@Faxe90Swe No problem. Apparently its all there. The Antietam battle is supposedly a bit shorter then Manassas Junction. However the footage is supposed to be incredible.
DarthMercanto 1 year ago
Gotta love the Uilleann pipes, so much better than the Bagpipes.
HarlequinWolf 1 year ago
anybody have this soundtrack and the soundtrack of Gettysburg in mp3 format?
BibleJoker2Face 1 year ago
I learned awile ago that one of my great grandmothers, however far back, on my fathers side lived in Fredericksburg at the time of the war, her house was not far from the stone wall, I visited Fredericksburg National Battlefield Park over the summer and went to where the wall stood, it was very emotional to see where the battle actually took place, the CSA probably had one of their greatest victories there, Im proud to be a southernor!
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago
No problem, mate. I'd suggest reading the book about the battalion by James Alexander Thom called "Saint Patrick's Battalion." Mr. Thom's a good guy.
fishsama999 1 year ago
i like to push the green thumb up to this
SCBB07 1 year ago
Union and Confederate. I honor both. All died for what they thought was right. All must be remembered.
Ryuu501st 1 year ago 2
God bless those Irish man and thank you for fighting with us in the Union. Your bravery will never forgotten :(
boerenyoghurt 1 year ago
@boerenyoghurt What, the Irish in the Confederacy don't get your gratitude? They don't count?
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago 2
@boerenyoghurt, Being both an Irish-American and a southerner i would say that both sides of north and south of Irishmen deserves respect and gratitude due to their bravery and loyalty to their cause not because of which side they happend to be on because both only wanted freedom and a new start in America.
TheDemondragonking 1 year ago
@boerenyoghurt @
billyhunchback 1 year ago
1 Dislike .... 1 Person is English
1798Greenflag1916 1 year ago 19
@1798Greenflag1916 Scars on my head to prove it.Go Ireland!
billyhunchback 1 year ago
@1798Greenflag1916 OR A FUCKING MUSLIM!
LongliveSnak2e 11 months ago
@LongliveSnak2e What?
YoungTeufelhunden 9 months ago
@1798Greenflag1916 Ah piss off you bloody irishman. I don't understand why you Americans with Irish ancestry are so keen to celebrate your supposed "irishness" despite the fact you may be about 12.5% irish and 25% English. Like Obama going to Ireland and having a Guinness, making a public show of his irishness when he's 3% irish and about 20% English. What have you irish ever fucking done eh? The English made the USA what it is today, most of the founding fathers were English. Read your history.
EnglishNationalist13 8 months ago
@EnglishNationalist13 Where the hell are you pulling those statistics out of ?. What have we Irish ever done ?. Built the American nation on the back of our sweat blood and tears as well as inventing some of the most important inventions that are key to the survivial of humanity every single day, from the foundation of the principle of chemistry and anti biotics to the syringe, something every world navy prides themselves on is too an Irish invention that being the submarine.
1798Greenflag1916 7 months ago
@EnglishNationalist13 Not to mention you seem to forget that while the English were running around naked playing in the mud beating each other shitless with sticks and stones and the egyptians hadn`t even envisioned the great Pyramids and occupied themselves building sand castles . The Irish were a highly organized race making the greats monuments the world had ever seen and would see for centuries to come . I suppose your English school never thought you about Newgrange Knowth or Dowth
1798Greenflag1916 7 months ago
@1798Greenflag1916 Yeah ok. Look I have nothing against the irish, I don't hate irish people or the Catholicism. It just annoys me how the irish seem to take great pride in claiming things which they're not responsible for as their own. Ok a few hundred years ago us English may have oppressed your people, i'm sorry, but I had no say in that. Africa is a mess without our colonial rule and we built India, the USA and other countries...we controlled more than half the world from one tiny island....
EnglishNationalist13 7 months ago
@EnglishNationalist13 This is about something that happened a hundred and fifty years ago. I've not seen this movie . But I do know the Irish Brigade was canon fodder at Frederickburg. as most soldiers are. Look at Robert E. Lee's hell bent decision that he was right and ordered Pickett's Charge! War is a nasty pitiful thing that is controlled my big fat men usually a thousand miles away acting like children. What the English get out of Gallipoli that wasn't a smart move
Ms2blackcats 6 months ago
Comment removed
Bolleriker 7 months ago
@1798Greenflag1916 I'm German and I like it too!^^
Bolleriker 7 months ago
God bless you Irishmen!!! If i ever fight a battle I wouldn't do it unless I had an Irishman by my side and by the way you fellows make the best damn beer in the whole fucked up world. God love yah!!!
jhowse762 1 year ago
@jhowse762 Hell yea
northernlights12345 1 year ago
This song is very moving and melancholy. I've watched the scene from Gods and Generals in which this score is played, and it has made me cry on several occasions.
Sisyphus27 1 year ago
what is the soundtrack called? or the album
romanking50 1 year ago
@romanking50 I want to say its just Gods and Generals Original Motion Picture Soundtrack by John Frizzel and Randy Edleman
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago
@RevBillyRayCollins thanks
romanking50 1 year ago
If this scene doesn't make every Irish American or Irish in the audience tear up or plain old bawl their eyes out, they don't deserve their heritage.
fishsama999 1 year ago 22
@fishsama999 This was the first scene in a movie, ever, to make me cry like a small child.
Ryuu501st 1 year ago
@fishsama999 im not irish, but it made my eyes water almost every time
jabames 1 year ago
@fishsama999 I know! I had Irish in my family 7 generations ago, and even though it's been that long, that scene hit me hard. That Irish blood is where I get my unusual hair color, and fair skin. Many on my Mom's of the family is very light skinned. Unusual for Hispanics. Also unusual for me to have natural auburn highlights and strawberry blond facial hair and stand at 6'3" where other than two male cousins on my mom's side are under 5'9". They both stand over 6'5". One is 6'9"! 0_o
GeneralKenobiSIYE 1 year ago
@GeneralKenobiSIYE Research the San Patricio Battalion. I think you'll find out where that comes from. I'm third generation.
fishsama999 1 year ago
@fishsama999 Holy crap! I got a strange feeling in the pit of my stomach when I found it. Oddly proud as well. I had family on both my mom and dad's side who fought in that war. My Mom told me a long time ago that a member of the family fought in it. I never would have connected the two though. They had always been spoken about separately. The fact there was Irish in the family was pretty much mentioned in passing. Never did they say they was Irish family in the Mexican Army. Thank you so much!
GeneralKenobiSIYE 1 year ago
@GeneralKenobiSIYE Sorry. I meant third generation American. lol Still love what the country's /meant/ to stand for, despite the current situation and divisions.
fishsama999 1 year ago
@fishsama999
Or they have an eye for detecting superficial hero-worship, and realize that their forebears deserved better than become the object for entertainment to be enjoyed by bloodthirsty audiences who don`t actually care about what they did or why they did it, they just want a good war movie with lots of death and human tragedy so that they can then go to youtube and testify to how their emotions were so touched and how they respect the deeds of these men and get a thumbs up...
Faxe90Swe 1 year ago
@Faxe90Swe Maybe they actually are touched by this film and this peice of history. Had they of not seen this movie many people may have not known what these soldiers went through, it gives them a good visual. Now I had family fight in this war, so I do care. Its people like you who have no respect for remembering their ancestors.
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago
@RevBillyRayCollins
Me too, I had an ancestor fight in this war. And i remember him by finding out where he fought, his service-record, and if possible his reasons for fighting. And about respect, I think we have two totally different definitions of it.
"This piece of history"... well, here we got a very common problem: that people think movies are a source of learning, a way of masseducation for those too lazy or indifferent to read a book.
Faxe90Swe 1 year ago
@Faxe90Swe I still dont see whats wrong with movies, they give people better visuals of what happened. Although books are great they usually give a biased view of what happened. Documentaries are very educational and easier to follow than books since they usually cut out all the personal opinion crap.
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago
@RevBillyRayCollins And movies aren`t biased!!? Watch The Patriot, then read a book on the subject, even a biased book, and you`ll see how truthful that movie was. Documentaries ususally give ONE perspective for simplicity and viewer convenience, while a book, any book, will at least list the different theories and opinions on the matter. "The story of the US" or what´s its name is perfect example of crap documentaries.
Faxe90Swe 1 year ago
@Faxe90Swe Not necessarily true, most books are usually written by one person and they tend to not bother writing about someones elses opinion, the book The South Was Right is a prime example, a good book yes but only one opinion, where as the documentary Gettysburg The Battle gave both perspectives of the battle not just one side. Movies are made to entertain and inform people about subjects, gods and generals and gettysburg arent biased films because they give both views. The only books I know
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago
@RevBillyRayCollins
What is both perspectives of a battle worth? At best the honor of individuals, like commanders. Your comparison is not fair. The book you mention deals with the very loaded subject of who was right politically and ideologically, the documentary is about a three-day battle with a purely military perspective. Find a better example. Military and political history are not compareable.
Faxe90Swe 1 year ago
@Faxe90Swe
Of course history books display personal opinion, but a very qualified opinion, opinions formulated by men who may have devoted their whole lives to the study of the subject. Can you say that about the author of the novel and the director of this movie? And I think you might have read the wrong books, given your stance. If you exclude obviously biased works (sometimes revealed by the very title, "The South Was Right", for example) I think you would have another opinion.
Faxe90Swe 1 year ago
@Faxe90Swe of that try to tell both sides are usually text books, so I really hope your not reading books like those considering most of the material in there is biased anyway. Now the Patriot was meant to tell the story of The Swamp Fox and thats what it did, it wasnt meant to be the most accurate portrayl of The American Revolutionary War. It just focused on his little part. Books should be fair to both sides if they are to give an accurate description, but most arent because it involves
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago
@RevBillyRayCollins " it wasnt meant to be the most accurate portrayl of The American Revolutionary War. It just focused on his little part." His little part didn`t involve winning the battle of Guilford Courthouse, the end battle of the movie, since the Americans actually lost that battle. The Swamp Fox was a man named Marion, not Martin. As I recall it, he wasn`t even present at the battle of Guilford Courthouse.
Faxe90Swe 1 year ago
@Faxe90Swe someone looking back on the subject and giving their opinion as to what happened. Onw good book that didnt do that was Brutal Journey about and expedition gone wrong. The author however wrote the book as a story with characters and they didnt say well what they meant by this was or any of that crap, sort of like the novel The Killer Angels, they had a plot. But most other books that try to teach us something are pure opinion.
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago
@RevBillyRayCollins
And damn right it wasn`t accurate - it was downright distortive. Tavington, presumably based on real-life legion commander Banastre Tarleton, never burned a church full of civilians. He did possibly order the killing of war prisoners, POSSIBLY, but even then it is a hell of a difference from killing civilians. The British are demonized beyond justifiable reason. Cornwallis is depicted as a rear-stationed old general, when he in fact was in his thirties and was at the
Faxe90Swe 1 year ago
@RevBillyRayCollins
Posted wrong, but I´m sure you`ll read that post as well and understand it was intended for you. Anyway, I recommend James McPherson`s book "Battle Cry of Freedom" for an outstanding work that takes all possible angles of the conflict into account.
Faxe90Swe 1 year ago
@RevBillyRayCollins heat of the battle, driving his men forward, being physically dragged from the frontline by his ADC:s. Any man with the least knowledge of the American Revolutionary War (and I´m Swedish!!!) will know to completely disregard The Patriot as instructive of history, unless he himself is a fanatic bent on glorifying American history. American history doesn`t require glorification, it is well enough glorious and honorable as it is.
Faxe90Swe 1 year ago
@Faxe90Swe I'm not entirely sure what your debating, but I whole-heartedly agree that "The Patriot" is astounding jingonistic travesty! I also agree that all historical works are somewhat biased. I very much enjoyed this film and I am eagerly awaiting the Director's Cut this May, but it is still biased. I think its best to take multiple perspectives, sift through them, and come to your own conclusion. How is McPherson btw? I'm planning on tackling Battle Cry after I finish with Shelby Foote.
DarthMercanto 1 year ago
@DarthMercanto
Agreed on the multiple perspectives. The debate is about me not thinking this movie, or any movie or novel, is to be considered historically instructive, and above all not to be considered as "honoring" the men who fought and died.
McPherson is very objective, and very exhaustive, describing every aspect of the conflict in detail. It is THE standard one-volume work on the Civil War, in my opinion. And it has a very good bibliography for further reading.
Faxe90Swe 1 year ago
@Faxe90Swe I think historical novels and films can be instructive, they just shouldn't be taken for Gospel. Gods and Generals gave me a better understanding of battles like Chancellorsville and Fredricksburg, however I certainly wouldn't rely upon them as my only source of information on those engagements. As for the political opinions, I think it is instructive in so far as it demonstrates the Southern Perspective. I think that perspective is wrong but it is a great way to understand it.
DarthMercanto 1 year ago
@DarthMercanto
It scratches the surface, but is in no way sufficient for anyone to base an opinion on, like you basically said. But people do tend to view movies as an easy access to knowledge.
Faxe90Swe 1 year ago
@Faxe90Swe This is can be very true unfortunatley. I've always thought Birth of a Nation was the best example of that.
DarthMercanto 1 year ago
@Faxe90Swe Personally I dont think it matters if they demonized Cornwalis, Im an American and he waged war against us, so I already dont care for him. And as I said the book The South Was Right was very good but clearly biased, you wrote a lot and Im not responding to it all so I'll end with movies give people a visual, they can here and see depictions of what happened. Im not going to keep this up other than saying if you hate movies for this aspect so much then dont bother watching them.
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago
@RevBillyRayCollins I don't think that makes it fair to demonize him. General Lee technically bore arms against the United States, and I think it would be unfair to demonize him. The film not only fails to give the British time to explain their point of view, not only is it one sided, but it also completely invents fictional events. For example Tavington burning down a church filled with civilians. That never happened. I believe America had the right to secede, but there's no need to demonize.
DarthMercanto 1 year ago
@DarthMercanto Oh I see, all the assholes are against me now just because something is out of my control, I dont make these movies but since I watch them I guess that makes me less of a person. I feel real appreciated. Dont get me wrong I love Lee and the South and I strongly support seccesion but if someone wants to 'hate' on him, then do so, its their opinion. I have mine and all I was saying is that movies give you a better visual.
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago
@RevBillyRayCollins I didn't mean to be offensive and I don't think anything I said justifies that kind of language. To be honest I was hoping to have a civil discussion like the one you had with mark (:P). If you read my comments to Faxe you'll find that I actually argue for historical validity in film and historical fiction, I merely argue that it should be taken with a grain of salt. Also when did I say liking this film made you less of a person? Personally I love this film.
DarthMercanto 1 year ago
@DarthMercanto I dont think you were being offensive its just me venting out anger, and if you go way back on me and marks conversations on multiple videos there was 'foul' language exchanged, from me anyway I usually only use it when Im frustrated, but eventually we achieved each others respect. I'll admit back then I didnt like the guy but now I would say we are somewhat friends. Personally I dont give a damned, Im frustrated, about inaccuracy in films because film is an art, the directors
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago
@RevBillyRayCollins
Now, I can only refer to my original post to you for an explanation of my hesitation towards movies as "honoring" of past events and men. In my book the Washington Monument and others such as it, Military graveyards and scholarly works are the best ways of remembering. Such things triggers my emotions, not low-budget films - it frustrated me that you ascribed, or at least implied, such value to simple movies.
Faxe90Swe 1 year ago
@DarthMercanto vision, if they dont want the true story to be only whats in the film then they have the right to change it, no one is requiring the story to be told on screen and to be absolutely true, the directors in charge. And making me less of a person is also a common phrase I use when someone is dead set against me, just mindless words that really have no menaing to me.
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago
@RevBillyRayCollins
And propaganda is not patriotism, and in the American case completely unnecessary to begin with. And I think directors have a responsibility to be truthful in their films, for the same reasons I don`t approve of photographers (also an artist) manipulating pictures and then publish them. I´m all for obscure perspectives, angling and bias, that´s natural in all human affairs, but pure fabrications are a crime to the memory of past men.
Faxe90Swe 1 year ago
@Faxe90Swe To bad there isnt a whole lot that is glorious and honorable about American history. America has proved to be as imperialistic and genocidal as Europe even worse because at least Europe has learned from those mistakes over the years while America continues to make those same blunder.
Im not arguing that American has'nt done glorious or honorable things but we've got a hell of a lot of blood on our hands.
oqwehttam19 1 year ago
@oqwehttam19
Yes, you do, every people and every nation do. But America is no where near to have the same "guilt" as Europe. No European country can indict America of something that that country hasn`t made itself guilty of sometime in its history. And America continues to make these blunders because America is still young. America have a somewhat casual attitude to war, as opposed to Europe, because they haven`t had a war fought on home terf for 150 years.
Faxe90Swe 1 year ago
@oqwehttam19
The American nation still have a lot of lessons to learn, but I have no doubt they will learn them and consolidate that knowledge in the most appropriate way. Worth mention also: Americas dubious role as world police was forced upon them by the power vacuum in Europe after ww2, a vacuum filled by the Soviet Union. America paid a heavy price besides actual casualties in ww2 - that of becoming militarized and un-American.
Faxe90Swe 1 year ago
0:43 to 1:55 is absolutely beautiful and poignant.
jrs689 1 year ago 2
Faugh-a-Ballaugh!
Scatmanfi 1 year ago
HAROO!! HAROO!! God bless the sons and daughters of the fallen Irish who died to preserve the Union
AssualtgruppeVeir 1 year ago 2
@AssualtgruppeVeir fuck the union, god bless all of the fallen irish, cos we have died all over this world for a cause, and usually for freedom
LucasD1985 1 year ago
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I went to Fredericksburg this summer and laid my hand on the piece of the original wall and I just collapsed crying thinking of all blood shed to try and take and keep that wall, it just hit home. It didn’t take much to see the Irish Bridge huddling against the low dip the wall, as Cobb’s Confederate Irishmen littered their own countrymen with volley after volley. Ná déan dearmad orth!
MrCopperhead1861 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
I went to Fredericksburg this summer and laid my hand on the piece of the original wall and I just collapsed crying thinking of all blood shed to try and take and keep that wall, it just hit home. It didn’t take much to see the Irish Bridge huddling against the low dip the wall, as Cobb’s Confederate Irishmen littered their own countrymen with volley after volley. Ná déan dearmad orth!
MrCopperhead1861 1 year ago
Comment removed
MrCopperhead1861 1 year ago
My great grandpa thomas loughlin was with the 158th new york regiment in the civil war he was an irish imergrant like the res who fought im proud of my heritiage
dtkelly1990 1 year ago
To me this is by far the most haunting piece of the Gods and Generals soundtrack, especially in conjunction with the image of the men of the Irish brigade getting cut to pieces in that murderous frontal assault.
antred11 1 year ago
"I must side either with or against my section or country. I cannot raise my hand against my birthplace, my home, my children. I should like, above all things, that our difficulties might be peaceably arranged.... Whatever may be the result of the contest, I foresee that the country will have to pass through a terrible ordeal, a necessary expiation perhaps for our national sins" - Robert E. Lee
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago 3
My God be with those men who fought and died in the American Civil war to bring a better Ireland, but went on to bring a better America.
Never forget who you are and where you come from
McIntosh1413 1 year ago
@McIntosh1413 May God be....
McIntosh1413 1 year ago
the roaad to hell was paved with good intintions. sorry for any miss spelling
shadowoel 1 year ago
Now, gentlemen, let tomorrow be their Waterloo! - P.G.T. Beauregard, First Battle of Manassas, 1861
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago
@RevBillyRayCollins Good vs. Evil? Bro that's just dumb. Come on man these aren't nazis we're talking about, this is the United States Federal government. And whether you would like to admit it or not both the States and the Feds have the best interest of America at heart, they just have different views and methods of achieving said goals.
Generally both sides in this war we're overly hasty and stubborn, this war could've been avoided but neither side was willing to compromise.
JB1528 1 year ago
@JB1528 I guess your right there isnt good vs evil in a war between brothers but what the C.S.A. was fighting for was a lot better cause than the union, this country was founded on individual states coming together to create a country, with this the govt back then created a few national laws and allowed the states to do the rest, since thats how it has always been, but in the mid 1800s the natl govt wanted to have more authority than the states and the southern states said no since the national
RevBillyRayCollins 1 year ago