Good for you! My developing concept which this has brought to fuitiion. Now what?? How do we bring it about? The Powers That Be will fight tooth and nail; have npo compunction avout slaughtering off this opposition. How do you make it work?
Who ever think they are elite, for whatever reason, are mistaken. We all share common threads.. Jacque is speaking beyond our artificial separations.I BELIEVE WE WILL MAKE IT BEYOND THIS. We will evolve maybe quicker then most think...
He's so right. There has always been a hole in our soul of us here in the west and probably elsewhere too. Its when you see these starving children on TV and we close our eyes. Hoping it'll go away by itself but it never does. How can we be whole with this great injustice?
There are but two comments I would make. The first is: If we have a society based upon science, one has to ask whose science, for the incrdible explosion in psuedosciences being used in a silent wat against humanity (vaccines). The predominant sciences developing today, are those orientated towards millitary application, pharacides & mutagenic compounds.
The second. If we act now, to create abundance & teach innovative technological solutions that satisfy human need, then we can leave the banks
Making such accusations as ever, those ignorant of the progressive & creative forces that operate in life, remain in the dark when it comes to the incites at edges. If matter is energy, then the entire hypothesis of entropy based ideologues is redundant.
Life forces, even according the the fraudulent Darwinian mind, state that evolution occurs over time. Natural life forces operate through symbiosis rather than dominance. Only in the science of monotic order, do such perversities reside.
It is indeed, these very ideas that have brought into manifestation, corrupted agents that have destroyed that which they inheritied by assuming authority over it.
On one side, your hydroponics system will be reliant upon imported nutrients & machinery. What you are doing is attempting to replace a natural exchange of energies that occur at an optimum when the complexities of diverse living energies within the natural world.
You seem to be of the opinion that we should choose one or the other. This is not the case, there are other ways.
We can already thrive, without dependence upon sophisticated technologies that do not pay the utmost attention to the residual impacts.
Those civilisations that came before us had survived former planetary devastations, the legends tell us of amazing spectacles. Disasters ensue, when titanic entities emerge that attempt to act as the parent, dictating all energy.
That sir, is a proclamation, It is based upon what exactly. If it based upon modern agricultural practices, then perhaps you would be correct, since the quality & value of the majority of the food produced today is not fit for human consumption. You are correct, these systems are dependent on oil. But the method of producing food today, is an anathema, it too is crashing.
Interesting then, that whilst this occurs, productivity within the systems I work with has risen.
Rather than placing more of our dependence upon the machine, why not put it back onto deeper wisdoms as to what the garden of Eden may have looked like.
Imagine if you will, that you stand in a garden. The garden is filled with as many trees, shrubs, climbers, herbs and annual crops in what at 1st glance appears to be a jumble mess. But look more closely & you will find that each plant, relates to others around it, gaining from symbiosis. Such a system is with us already.
Okay, so your assertion must be, that there is insufficient land and resources to sustain higher population levels, correct?
Care to test out your hypothesis?
Accept, and I will show you that this planet is capable of supporting many times these values. The information you have extracted this from, I also suspect will have come out of the WHO or UN.
Either way, it is wrong to an incredibly perverse extent.
"that this planet is capable of supporting many times"
only religious nut would say this.
each human takes finite area of arable land to feed.
less if you use oil (more when oil runs out)
very dumb if you're using finite fossil fuels to eat
and there are other species too. of course if we wipe out their habitats .. chop down every single tree and replace with farmland down we could have more humans
but nature would have more opportunity to evolve a virus to destroy us..
how much land do you think it would take without using ANY fossil fuels. Modern agriculture is warfare based. But there are other ways that give far higher yealds.
Why rely upon arable crops! The forest edge has far more to offer.
So we are in agreement, I would not chop down trees, I would plant them. Loads of many species, including those that will provide crops.
It is not nature that is evolving these viruses, it is Science. Indeed, health is better when our diet is pure & unadulterated.
not through malice, viruses have a place in nature like an "immune system". they are species specific, and continually mutating. as any species becomes more numerous (and hence *dense* it gives viruses (and other pathogens) specific to that species more opportunities to spread.. and more copies = more mutations. eventually a more lethal form appears and cuts the species back down in number.
i'm malthusian - i firmly beleive the root of all human misery is human numbers
The problem with malthus in conjunction with the ruling entities that have in effect, farmed human populations for their own purpose by perpetuating slavery, depositing the poor & the renegade into foreign lands to boulster empire dominion, or cause them to live in slums hovels and camps. These are the triggers for pathogens to thrive. But the plagues & diseases we see these times are without doubt comprised of sophisticated design.
Communism is the creation of the pyramid, just as capitalism. It now approaches a condition where it believes it can dispense with the human, transforming a residue into GOLEM to serve.
Populations explode when required by the system. If you study the dynamics, you will find it appears when people are put into poverty through the herding off their lands & into cities.
The apex of the pyramid of control can be found this rogue group of bloodlines that continues to exhibit its parasitic ideology. Of assisting the ferment of dog eat dog & cut throat business.
The losers are always those that are not filled with avarice, or the innocent that just happens to have been born in the wrong place.
Current Swine Flu is a manmade bioweapon, courtesy of thinkers like you. The vaccine is RFID tagging combined with a sub lethal dose of immunotoxins.
walter0bz, you are discussing this subject with an ecologist who works with biological systems. Sure pathogens are ever present & always adapting to oppertunistically infect their host, but the present events are sourced from the bio-weapons/pharmacuetical corporate circles in conjunction with the United Nations.
>>"Sorry you are duped if you believe this is all occuring by >>chance."
Do you actually beleive in Evolution??
evolution created all organisms on this planet, viruses included.
Viruses&bacteria have extreme rapid replication rate - every new cell/particle is a new variant. each individual creates MILLIONS of variations per day in small space (your body)
wheras for humans, evolution is slow - you only create 2 new variants per 30 years
I belive the route to human happiness is to workk with life forces. I aid those forests & the wildlife, and will leave but ephemeral tracks.
This Zeitgheist will happily exterminate those of less scientific worth.
Freeing humanity from this fictional bondage, enabling autonomy where the creative comes to the for. The alternative is to become borg within the matrix.
Look at the scenery within these mindgames they programme the children with, this is part of the vision. Not for me & mine.
There can be no symbiosis in the pyramid. It was always about managing a livestock population to do the dirty work. But mistakes were made. We humans, regardless of nation, creed, or class are sentient, equal to all that come before us in all respects, save ofcourse our willingness to defile this place & the life forms.
The Venus Project is a dead duck if it seriously believes that humanity will kneel before the alter of the machine.
The Oil elite. You speak as though there are different elite globalist groups. This may be true, but as you acknowledge they are part of the pyramid. This structure comprises of entities that have risen through the tactics of war. They serve the money masters & elitists.
There is no symbiosis within system of slavery where the slave masters are the only party to gain. It is a system where one group comprising of the most ruthless exploit all resources within thier influence.
Thank you, you acknowledge that is a single system of domination.
I am more eco than you would believe. My sustenance comes from my work & my work is focused upon the creation of autonomy through food producing, water resource management & small scale renewable energy technologies that include biomass generation.
I have a large family covering several generations. We seek to produce our own or support local production to meet all our needs. We rarely visit your supermarkets.
It is one of my roles in this time, to teach and give the food that we generate in abundance. Our numbers are growing (excuse the pun). Those that do not alter thier ways, will become sick and be drawn into further dependence. This I witness occuring as I write.
You are right most people... but the seed of truth for ourselves, has the capacity to germinate in all places & climates. So I teach by communication, but also by example. The result is that we have a strong family.
A family that is not just of our blood, but extends to our street, our community, for any that want to be friends.
By the nature of our diversity, we optimise our creativity, no problem is insurmountable and the problem invariably is the solution. None of this will be by revolution, for that is repeating the circle, no this is inspiration the spiral that is the more accurate form of movements.
When you stimulate creativity, the organisms that you are surrounded with, provide feedback & assist.
The land was here before we came, it will be here after we have turned back into dust. Its control resides within the age of empires, the predation, invasions & occupations of the past. This was made possible by unlocking (discovering) technologies of warfare. This is the way the mystery school students have indoctrinated into building over an eon. In other words, the land was taken by force but the truth is, it cannot ever be owned by a living thing & we are all a part of it. This is the SCHISM
In a time that you have not been taught of, the human was allowed to exist free of the pyramid as we know this civilisation to be. Then, something changed, new entities appeared as gods. They are described by all ancient cultures across the globe.
These entities are still with us and believe they are approaching the completion of a task. This is why the blood glyphs are dominant & why eugenics figures so much in their strategies.
But others have also come to teach and awaken the human.
You may not be aware of this, but Jacque was on Larry King back in 1974 (long before Larry was nationally syndicated), and his dissertation was simply amazing! There is an effort to get him back on Larry King. I've signed the petition, and I hope it works!
You silly people, they are the same guys that allready rule the world. They are talking about earth with 500000 living humans, where machines would do everything. You are so naive...
I'm confused... Why couldn't it work for everyone? a scientific approach to humanism seems feasible. Where does your conspiracy theory come from anyways?
Do some research. Look around you, and very large reality is right at the tip of your fingers. Find the truth! But mostly, wake up and see our world has the potential we're not giving it!!
The other guy who believes that there's going to be some kind of extinction level event that wipes out all but the 500,000 richest people and everyone else gets replaced by robots. The guy who's afraid of technology and the scientific approach to advancing our species in other words. The guy I responded to in the first place. Unless your on his side... in which case, you're going to need to explain yourself a little more clearly.
I was big fan of zeitgeist 1, and thats because at the end of movie they spice it up with a little touch of spiritual. After that it was all machines, machines, machines. I do not want to say that earth cannot be a better place, but this is not the way. My opinion is formed from a large number of sources. Try to find Russian documentary named ''VODA'' (water). I'm more into those kind of things, and that kind of thinking. God bless you all!
Why can't spirituality be realistic? You believe that spirituality would be done away with in a technological age without money? I don't. People still need to be creative, and that's basically what spirituality is. You don't have believe in fairy tales to be spiritual, you just have to realize that we are beings that are constantly searching for knowledge and we always will be because perfection is unattainable. Combine that pursuit of knowledge with creativity and you have spirituality.
Machines already produce nearly everything, all we're talking about is a matter of degree. Besides, from a business standpoint, it is much more cost effective to employ a machine. All it takes is more corporate power, and machines will run everything they can, because profit is, and always has been, the bottom line.
Humans would be free to do whatever the fuck they wanted to, not waste 1/3 of their lives working for some douche bags. I know some people work in jobs they love, but they are the massive majority.
you're supposed to use partner selection & the decision to breed or not breed to create lives with good opportunity.
yes, if you have no property behind you, you're a guest on someone elses land and exploited like cattle for rent. it's worked like that for centuries.
so, women are supposed to marry land-owners & give them heirs.
or couples are supposed to concentrate resources into fewer/free-er offspring.
When you read more, as to how we came to be where we are in these traumatic times, apparently suffering under multifaceted crisis that now impact upon the lives of all humanity & all entities, it becomes very clear.
Your parents, just as you, even now, did only that which they were capable of. They too were victims of the society of their time.
We are trying to turn the key into our future, whilst being progressively placed under more draconian(reptillian) control.
we should respect all resources, especially those that are to hand. Energy is abundant, all we need do is to tap into it. The means to just that are already with us. Energy is matter, it is the 'e' in motion.
All matter manifest in this spectrum of dimensions comes to us, it is found in the winds of the cosmos. This planet, just as any other is not constant, but subjected to the musical harmonies of energy. Human populations left alone, do find equilibrium with the environ.
If rather than simply following the path of seeing humanity as a corrupt out of control organism that is diseasing this planet, should it not also be that the societal structures that are of the empire building type, are the drivers behind colonisation.
Today, the human is subjected to mind control. Historically we have been used as mere pawns in the grand chessboard.
The advent of technology has accelerated the destruction & as for consumption, people can only buy that which is made available
"people can only buy that which is made available"
[1]without petrochem fertilizers, the land can only feed 2billion.
66% must refrain from breeding to return to enviro-friendly agriculture.
[2] beleive it or not, the corps adapt quickly to market demands. if everyone stopped buying meat & only bought organic food, the corps would adjust to supply that... but then most people would have to starve.
The game of monopoly, is the conditioning of the banksters & multinational corporations that presently abuse this place, including human resources.
"66% must refrain from breeding!"
THE VENUS PROJECT INCLUDES EUGENICS ADVOCATES!
The corps a.k.a. corpse = living dead. Responding to market conditions is best done within your neighbourhoods & communities. In terms of food, its value can't be measured with money! Thats how we've become so diseased.
price signals give "the machine" a lot of feedback about people's preferences.
the market is a giant supercomputer
i'm not a venus project advocate.. i'm calling for population reduction to survive peak oil gracefully. I believe humanity has head in the sand over the issue. people think "someone else" will fix it. in reality any energy source will be used to enslave you. see the wealth in hands of oil-elite.
for freedom you need to grow own food.. but earth can only support 2bn that way
"i'm calling for population reduction to survive peak oil gracefully".
No disrespect, but I find this comment particularily askew. Firstly, since the established powers that govern communication, scientific research, economics, the media et al, do you really think it is sensible to believe the information they promote?
Question everything, if in doubt, do what research you can, but most importantly, remain skeptical.
I am also interested to know whether you would do the killing (gracefully)?
price signals are a pointless tool of competition. Only required because of induced scarcety. In this I agree wholeheartedly with Jacques. Suppose instead, as we increase production to the point it exceeds our need, we simply pass it on to those around us that would benefit. You know, sharing rather than hoarding.
People's preferences are lead, my friend, just as with elections, they vote from amongst the selected. Democracy is a farce.
can you not see that population growth causes scarcity. every peice of complexity in nature is a solution to finding energy. Once a creature evolves a temporary advantage (via new peice of design) it multiplies... until it's back to experiencing scarcity.
thats how nature works
". Democracy is a farce. "
true but i'd pick it over theocracy, dictatorship, mob-rule any day. What we have is rule by price signals
"Suppose instead, as we increase production to the point it exceeds our need, "
price signal *quantifies* benefit. You guys go on and on about "Scientific Method"...which requires *measurement* via *numbers*
price signals provide feedback mechanism incentivizing land-owner to grow whatever crop is most in demand. do i grow tomatoes or turnips? depends what everyone else wants & what everyone else is growing.
There is a great deal of difference between the mind control of today and religous influences of the past.
The key differences today, are manifest in those that believe they have the true word of god, or others that believe themselves to be chosen or have a divine right.
Ofcourse humans exposed to repeated trickery will adapt counter strategies. Those Simians you speak of are no relation of mine!
Bottom line, do some fucking research retard before you open your mouth and prove your an idiot and possibly deceive naive onlooker's. The "Elite" (mindset) thinks your forever all fucking dumb and evil terrorist, anti-christ(ian) and wants to kill most of the "dummys". However In my opinion you where conditioned by the culture to be "Dumb" (Asleep/Unaware) and if they/we can wake your stupid ass up (we have faith in you) and help you become smarter then we can support an even larger population
Bottom line, do some fucking research retard before you open your mouth and prove your an idiot and possibly deceive naive onlooker's. The "Elite" (mindset) thinks your forever all fucking dumb and evil terrorist, anti-christ ian and wants to kill most of the "dummys". However In my opinion you where conditioned by the culture to be "Dumb" (Asleep/Unaware) and if they/we can wake your stupid ass up (we have faith in you) and help you become smarter then we can support an even larger population
Bottom line, do some fucking research retard before you open your mouth and prove your an idiot and possibly deceive naive onlooker's. The "Elite" (mindset) thinks your forever all fucking dumb and evil terrorist, anti-christ ian and wants to kill most of the "dummys". However In my opinion you where conditioned by the culture to be "Dumb" (Asleep/Unaware) and if they/we can wake your stupid ass up (we have faith in you) and help you become smarter then we can support an even larger population
Bottom line, do some fucking research retard before you open your mouth and prove your an idiot and possibly deceive naive onlooker's. The "Elite" (mindset) thinks your forever all fucking dumb and evil terrorist, anti-christ ian and wants to kill most of the "dummys". However In my opinion you where conditioned by the culture to be "Dumb" (Asleep/Unaware) and if they/we can wake your stupid ass up (we have faith in you) and help you become smarter then we can support an even larger population
the main reson for this of course the fact that when you tell people to look up the Zietgist movement and they search zietgist they get the first movie which was just a huge consipiracy sabang. The consipiracyies were true that they are not socialy acceptable.
I berlieive you can be the richest fiancially person with all the power but if you dfon't have true riches of your spirit or true love in your liife. You your our the poorest person in the world and no amoiunt of money or power is going to fill that, gaping wound....
building a little commune would show the world there capabilities and prove your point. atleast until they destroy it. You cant Change everything at once, and you have to start somewhere.
Don't get me wrong, I am not saing it would b eperfect. There might still be violent people, but it would be much easier to address this problem scientifically, where they would be treated like patients not criminals.
Good point. But I wouldn't project today's mentality to that reality. Most of the crimes today are related to a system of values inherent to a scarcity-based economy. If you eliminate scarcity, many conditioned reactions to it desapear such as greed, social domination, humiliation and so on because they are no longer relevant. A new set of not violent values is originated.
They were not competing with anyone, they did not do it to prove something to the rest of the world, and most importantly they were not sick in the head. { to me they are sick, but they were not proven psycho or alike}. So you see, even in Frescos world of everyone living equal and having a home and food, etc. There will still be plenty of crime. WHat if the people dont want to study or go to museums, but want to kill, just like these fucking kids. Scary i think.
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There will still be crime. How can you tell. Because even now, the rulers of this world, the richest of the rich, they have all the power and money in the world, and they are still doing evil shit. Its in human nature to want more and more and more. Even when we are all equal, we will still want more and alike. I agree with this man, but no matter how good his idea is, we will still cheat and kill and alike. A perfect REAL example is this ===
Wrong. Money WAS needed because we lived in scarcity. Zimbabwe has some pretty scarce resources. It's obvious you have no idea what you're talking about.
Jacque Fresco argues that humans are not naturally greedy, rather they are conditioned to be that way because of the scarcity-based monetary system, and the competition and self-interest based free enterprise system. If you eradicate the conditions in society (scarcity, competition, etc) that perpetuate greed and self-interest, then humans wouldn't be so greedy.
Some would use the greed and competition in animals to prove their point that humans are naturally greedy, but they do not take into account the scarcity of the environments that animals live in. Animals don't have the ingenuity we have to use technology to eliminate scarcity, so they must fight with one another.
We have very complex brains which allow us to use logic, forsight, and hindsight to generate solutions to scarcity. It is very primitive of us to look at other animal behavior and pattern our lives after animals.
90% of people don't even have a valid understanding of "survival of the fittest" due to our media's portrayal of it, and people who promote eugenics due to an inflated ego and neurosis developed from our environment, class hierarchy.
He claims there is no human nature - just human behaviour, a patently false statement. Human nature DOES exist. You cannot and will NEVER remove people's self interests as the primary driving force behind their behaviour. He is either ignorant or consciously lying. I will guess it is the former.
I'm not sure why, but I didnt receive your message response in my inbox.
Our human "nature" as we call it, is based on our environmental influences.
You may be confusing "nature" with attributes, don't you think?
Calling Fresco ignorant is well........
How do I say it nicely......ignorant. Sorry, you know it's true. The man is intelligent and humane. That's certainly scarce in our environment., but it doesn't have to be.
Got it. So my developmentally delayed friend smashes his head against his face and screams out loud at random times because of his environment and not genetics? Got it, thanks.
While I'm very rusty on behaviorism at the moment, there are many reasons your friend could be exhibiting that behavior. He may receive attention such as touch or be consoled after doing so, and has paired this response from people, with his behavior. Thus, he will act out the behavior b/c he likes the response that follows, and has formed a pattern for reinforcement.
I don't know for sure...I would have to observe his behavior for hours.
Again I'm rusty, so don't quote me on the terms I used in my response, such as "paired." It may be that your friend is simply being positively reinforced. Example: Your friend bangs his head. He receives attention, thus, your friend bangs his head more often. That would mean his behavior has been positively reinforced, and the attention is the reinforcer. Again, it would have to be observed.
bbpro, I didn't receive your response in my inbox, and I see that you posted this a month ago. I just happened to run across your comment as I rewatched this video.
I have no idea why I'm not receiving all responses. Your comment should have been in my inbox. Either youtube has glitches, or I I overlooked this post in my inbox, but this has happened a lot lately.
While I agree that you cannot change people's self interest, b/c that is about survival. However, changing the environment, where we are not pitted against each other for primary needs will change behavior. If a persons primary needs are met then there is not incentive to horde resources or fear of losing ones resources, you get very different behavior b/c you have a different environment.
i agree with you Blaziermissy..all miliion-billionaires should invest in the earths future before money becomes worthless....forget space projects and warfare, we cant get it right on earth yet.
Not a bad idea...use up what money there is solely for the purpose of starting up the Venus Project! One last hurrah for the monetary system before it is put to bed.
Long before I ever heard of the Venus Project or Zeitgeist, I had considered the notion of what our world might be like without a monetary system, and I imagine many of you may have had such fleeting thoughts as well. Facts aside, it feels like the right direction to go!
Star Trek actually got me thinking of how a society could work without money. The venus project showed me that we don't need replicators to create abundance. It really is a possibility.
how he explains things is the sane way of life. A man ahead of his time. His project is the venus project. If you look at the site, it looks really exciting. the possibilities, wow.
yeah, you are right. Its not like YouTube hasnt done this before...*hint* Ron Paul's campaign. Not that I think we should continue with politics, just what i remember.. Be safe
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I hate to be the buzz kill here, but all in all, 2012 needs to happen or if God exists, he needs to start over and maybe this time actually be the loving God he is supposed to be, or something.
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Of course its flawed to an extent. Perfection can never be attained. Ok, then lets up the price. If you steal anything in this country, they will cut both your hands and legs and nuts off. I think that will prevent ALOT of thiefs.lol People dont care about other people. They only care about money, so if you make a law that says well, if you drive drunk, not inly do you loose license for 5 years, you have to also pay 75% of your monthly check from work. Trust me, they will stop big time. no all.
From my understanding, I feel that the Venus Project is a proposal to develope a technologicaly advanced version of a subsistance economy but on a larger scale.
people born in to this near perfect world, that have fucked up genetics that make them sin or something. I can only see a few crimes done in a perfect world and those are of envy. If we are all equal to the way we live, we can only be Jealous to the person next to us who may have a prettier wife then you, or may have a girlfriend, but you are not prince charming and have no girl, so you go on a rape rampage, etc. Or you have no friends, but your neighbor has 20, so you see, its human nature.!
envy comes from the inability to get a certain object or the supression of having something that which they envy or their will to not task them selves with that which shall tribute them with what they envy
either say" damn, i fucked up and they never do it again, or alike" No matter how much better we make life for all, and as close to perfect, yes, there will always be crime. When you are equally living as the rest{ food, water,shelter,transportation,etc} What else can you want.{ you would envy the other person, not for their cars, or houses, but their freinds, and hot wives and alike. and that is what will make people commit crime in even perfect societies} and of course there will always be....
Take this as example. If the average cost of a speeding ticket is say $50,{everyone can afford to pay that i think}, but imagine they make a law that raises the regular speeding ticket from $50 to $5,000 dollars. { i dont think i would ever speed in my life, no matter what} Everyone would drive like a 90 year old granny. But there will always be that 2% of society that will say, il drive fast today, i will not get caught. So for those 2%, it can only stop them after they do teh crime and..
Your example is flawed. Me explain. There is a law that says if you drive while drunk you can lose your freedom. Not to mention you put yourself in a situation where you can lose your life or someone elses. Guess what? People still drive drunk. Whats more valiable to you? $5,000 or your freedom/life. They have laws in other countries if you steal, they will cut off your hand. People still steal. So making a $ amount larger may stop some but will not solve the problem in the end.
It might infringe "Peoples rights." But frankly, who ever said People were allowed to invent their own rights. The laws of Logic rule everything & if you pop babies out like cute toys and over grow your society v. its means of support the surplus have nots will always attack the haves if there has bene no conceptualised balance protocol.
The solution is there, but no one follows it because they dont want to because theyre stupid..
how will pyschotics, rapists, mental retarded, and pure manipulators (evil) live in this wonderful idea that he has created? Please someone try to explain this most obvious speculation to me. lol.
The idea is to research and develop solutions to such neurological problems with the scientific method. Instead of a criminal being executed, s/he would be studied to figure out what caused him/her to be that way, such that scientists could figure out a solution to try to prevent such problems in other people in the future.
Of course, this is being done today in some cases, but superstitions and politics still interfere with scientific method in many cases.
You seem to know more about the issue than I do. What do you think the best solution would be? It's my understanding that no part of the Venus Project is written in stone (that would sort of defeat the purpose of a society that accepts change and growth).
I think what you're talking about is a whole issue in itself. A relevant issue, certainly, but one that deserves a more in-depth discussion than a series of YouTube comments is likely to provide.
If you're interested, you might consider contacting the Venus Project's website about this issue. As Jacque Fresco himself has said, people should question the Venus Project and help to figure out ways to improve it.
Im sure that in this near perfect society of Fresko, that there will still be LAWS to govern and punish the criminals. He has a good concept and ideas, but he like all are never 100% in to making something perfect or close to. Id say, his ideas are incredible and will help the world so much that crime will decrease and alike, but in order to answer your question, we must first try an idea. If his Venus world will help us, we will then see by how much and deal or create new ways to deal withcrime
We wouldn't need laws. Just watch more and listen properly and you will understand it. He says there won't be any need for laws because crime will be gone because there's no need for crime because there's no money and everyone has equal opportunities etc. If someone is psycho in the literal sense. I'm sure there will be technology eventually to help them. Or every person could decide on whether this person should be subjected to medical experiments or something I guess.
let us all spread fresco's message! i started burning and giving copies of both zeitgeist and welcome to the future movies at college (for free) by the only condition of those who received them to do the same. it's working pretty well :) ! we are like rain drops, only together we can make the flood required to clean this messed up world
vandalism is a form of personal desperatation which can be caused by various reasons but mainly a lack of resource. i mean people who vandalate are most often poor people who need a relief so he`s basically right
that would be an example of enviroment influencing human behavior. What the Venus Project wants to do is to alter the enviroment so that behavior DOES NOT happen. Its good that you dont buy everything you hear, and you shouldnt. Maybe you understand this concept a little bit better considering its been 2 months since you posted this comment. Be safe..
Let's start changing the world...everyone start to spread this message of Jacques Fresco and Zeitgeist movement.If you haven't seen Zeitgeist movie better watch it, there is a pure true that every man on this planet need to hear about what's happening in this world now and why.Except the few of them who try to control the peoples on this planet,they will try to maintain they're power and in any way detain this project,just because of GREED.
Why cant every leader in the world think like this man, why does he make so much sense yet apart from a selected few no one listens, we all need to spread the word and tell anyone who'll listen, thats the key. Most people don't know who jacque fresco is and it's up to us who are passionate about his work to help spread the word.
This comment has received too many negative votesshow
Jacque Fresco, is talking about water for people with none. The only one here talking about a lack of sex is denny599. That leads me to think that he might be in need of a hooker him self. Which would make him a... well you do the math. Most brain doctors say that rape is not form lack of sex, anyway; it is caused by the need of someone to have power over another person.
Good for you! My developing concept which this has brought to fuitiion. Now what?? How do we bring it about? The Powers That Be will fight tooth and nail; have npo compunction avout slaughtering off this opposition. How do you make it work?
WolfeBear 10 months ago
I love this guy and his vision&Ideas . I hope that I and my family live in such a society one day. We all should
TIGITOE 1 year ago
Who ever think they are elite, for whatever reason, are mistaken. We all share common threads.. Jacque is speaking beyond our artificial separations.I BELIEVE WE WILL MAKE IT BEYOND THIS. We will evolve maybe quicker then most think...
MsBolz 1 year ago 11
He's so right. There has always been a hole in our soul of us here in the west and probably elsewhere too. Its when you see these starving children on TV and we close our eyes. Hoping it'll go away by itself but it never does. How can we be whole with this great injustice?
jockejocke80 1 year ago
There are but two comments I would make. The first is: If we have a society based upon science, one has to ask whose science, for the incrdible explosion in psuedosciences being used in a silent wat against humanity (vaccines). The predominant sciences developing today, are those orientated towards millitary application, pharacides & mutagenic compounds.
The second. If we act now, to create abundance & teach innovative technological solutions that satisfy human need, then we can leave the banks
pondman27 2 years ago
One thing is certain, this "federal" reserve and central bank scamfest needs to end, we're letting a bunch of criminals rob future generations.
GtheMVP 2 years ago
abundance tech is BS
science ? science tells us the world is finite
CONSERVATION OF ENERGY
ENTROPY ... any complexity or order is a temporary state balanced by FUEL being BURNED creating net increase in DISORDER
there is the root cause of misery, encoded in the laws of nature! you can't engineer your way around it.
VPers want the world ruled by science, but they are SCIENTIFICALLY ILLITERATE!!
walter0bz 2 years ago
Making such accusations as ever, those ignorant of the progressive & creative forces that operate in life, remain in the dark when it comes to the incites at edges. If matter is energy, then the entire hypothesis of entropy based ideologues is redundant.
Life forces, even according the the fraudulent Darwinian mind, state that evolution occurs over time. Natural life forces operate through symbiosis rather than dominance. Only in the science of monotic order, do such perversities reside.
pondman27 2 years ago
It is indeed, these very ideas that have brought into manifestation, corrupted agents that have destroyed that which they inheritied by assuming authority over it.
On one side, your hydroponics system will be reliant upon imported nutrients & machinery. What you are doing is attempting to replace a natural exchange of energies that occur at an optimum when the complexities of diverse living energies within the natural world.
pondman27 2 years ago
are you pro-vp or pro-population control
walter0bz 2 years ago
You seem to be of the opinion that we should choose one or the other. This is not the case, there are other ways.
We can already thrive, without dependence upon sophisticated technologies that do not pay the utmost attention to the residual impacts.
Those civilisations that came before us had survived former planetary devastations, the legends tell us of amazing spectacles. Disasters ensue, when titanic entities emerge that attempt to act as the parent, dictating all energy.
This is NOW.
pondman27 2 years ago
well i beleive humans must acheive balance because energy is finite
root cause of human problems is excessive reproduction
no species can tripple in number without displacing something else
walter0bz 2 years ago
"We can already thrive, without dependence upon sophisticated technologies that do not pay the utmost attention to the residual impacts."
not at 6.7billion. 2billion max
fundemental fact that VP fans ignore
today oil machines make humans, not the other way round
walter0bz 2 years ago
That sir, is a proclamation, It is based upon what exactly. If it based upon modern agricultural practices, then perhaps you would be correct, since the quality & value of the majority of the food produced today is not fit for human consumption. You are correct, these systems are dependent on oil. But the method of producing food today, is an anathema, it too is crashing.
Interesting then, that whilst this occurs, productivity within the systems I work with has risen.
pondman27 2 years ago
Rather than placing more of our dependence upon the machine, why not put it back onto deeper wisdoms as to what the garden of Eden may have looked like.
Imagine if you will, that you stand in a garden. The garden is filled with as many trees, shrubs, climbers, herbs and annual crops in what at 1st glance appears to be a jumble mess. But look more closely & you will find that each plant, relates to others around it, gaining from symbiosis. Such a system is with us already.
"Permaculture"
pondman27 2 years ago
permaculture requires population reduction.
"green revolution" created huge surge in human numbers
1800(?) 1billion
1945 2billion (pre ww2- doubling time =150years)
1975 4billion (post ww2- doubling time=30 years)
2009 6.7billion
60years to tripple.
it's not hard to see this is the root problem
blame the humans, not the machine. they want too many babies.
walter0bz 2 years ago
Okay, so your assertion must be, that there is insufficient land and resources to sustain higher population levels, correct?
Care to test out your hypothesis?
Accept, and I will show you that this planet is capable of supporting many times these values. The information you have extracted this from, I also suspect will have come out of the WHO or UN.
Either way, it is wrong to an incredibly perverse extent.
pondman27 2 years ago
"Okay, so your assertion must be, that there is insufficient land and resources to sustain higher population levels, correct?"
no thats the exact opposite of my point.
we have a temporary boom based on finite fossil fuels. when these are exhausted, billions will starve.
it is fundementally stupid to turn a finite energy source into food (via petrochem farming)
under organic farming, theres enough land to sustain 2billion not 6billion+
I do not want to starve, nor kids or grandkids to starve
walter0bz 2 years ago
"that this planet is capable of supporting many times"
only religious nut would say this.
each human takes finite area of arable land to feed.
less if you use oil (more when oil runs out)
very dumb if you're using finite fossil fuels to eat
and there are other species too. of course if we wipe out their habitats .. chop down every single tree and replace with farmland down we could have more humans
but nature would have more opportunity to evolve a virus to destroy us..
walter0bz 2 years ago
how much land do you think it would take without using ANY fossil fuels. Modern agriculture is warfare based. But there are other ways that give far higher yealds.
Why rely upon arable crops! The forest edge has far more to offer.
So we are in agreement, I would not chop down trees, I would plant them. Loads of many species, including those that will provide crops.
It is not nature that is evolving these viruses, it is Science. Indeed, health is better when our diet is pure & unadulterated.
pondman27 2 years ago
100% agree on diet.
not through malice, viruses have a place in nature like an "immune system". they are species specific, and continually mutating. as any species becomes more numerous (and hence *dense* it gives viruses (and other pathogens) specific to that species more opportunities to spread.. and more copies = more mutations. eventually a more lethal form appears and cuts the species back down in number.
i'm malthusian - i firmly beleive the root of all human misery is human numbers
walter0bz 2 years ago
The problem with malthus in conjunction with the ruling entities that have in effect, farmed human populations for their own purpose by perpetuating slavery, depositing the poor & the renegade into foreign lands to boulster empire dominion, or cause them to live in slums hovels and camps. These are the triggers for pathogens to thrive. But the plagues & diseases we see these times are without doubt comprised of sophisticated design.
pondman27 2 years ago
elite-middle-proletariat
-elite are too powerfull/manipulative/rich
-proletariat are too numerous (using rapid-breeding, strength in numbers)
-middle are just right :)
-communist revolutions show toppling the pyramid just produces a new elite :)
-stable society has healthy middle. but elite/proles both want to crush it
I do beleive pathogens are *natural* .. happens thruout nature (i also accept bioweapons have been used)
-it is true Elite have mechanisms (eg religion) to perpetuate slavery
walter0bz 2 years ago
Communism is the creation of the pyramid, just as capitalism. It now approaches a condition where it believes it can dispense with the human, transforming a residue into GOLEM to serve.
Populations explode when required by the system. If you study the dynamics, you will find it appears when people are put into poverty through the herding off their lands & into cities.
pondman27 2 years ago
The apex of the pyramid of control can be found this rogue group of bloodlines that continues to exhibit its parasitic ideology. Of assisting the ferment of dog eat dog & cut throat business.
The losers are always those that are not filled with avarice, or the innocent that just happens to have been born in the wrong place.
Current Swine Flu is a manmade bioweapon, courtesy of thinkers like you. The vaccine is RFID tagging combined with a sub lethal dose of immunotoxins.
This is the machine
pondman27 2 years ago
100% convinced swineflu=natural - we had similar pandemics in past prior to biotech(& i've explained natural mechanism)
"bloodlines" - i do beleive that elite use eugenics for manipulation ability, vs mainstream culture filters masses for gullible genes.
know why Eugenics isn't used in society today? - because the elite want their slaves.. not INTELLIGENT population.
"thinkers like me" - face being crushed by superior numbers (proles) and superior power (elite)- we are first in firing line!
walter0bz 2 years ago
You have not explained the mechanisms by which this virus emerged. Sorry you are duped if you believe this is all occuring by chance.
Oh but Eugenics is alive & well today, & you are an advocate of it.
The slaves are preferred docile & unable to answer back through ignorance & poisonous food & water. Look around you, do you not have any family!
You are not a thinker that has done more than repeat an inchantment thats been spun before you. You deserve to be crushed with such insanities.
pondman27 2 years ago
"mechanisms by which virus emerged"
maybe haven't read enough biology books
viruses = natural and continually mutating/evolving.
Continual arms-race between Hosts evolving immunity & the Virus evolving
To the VIRUS we are FOOD.
whenever a FOOD supply increases, so does the Virus.. and hence it has more chances to mutate.
we just multiplied in number by *3* in one lifetime..
Virus's function is to DIVERSIFY nature because they reduce any species that is too NUMEROUS
it's a NATURAL cycle
walter0bz 2 years ago
walter0bz, you are discussing this subject with an ecologist who works with biological systems. Sure pathogens are ever present & always adapting to oppertunistically infect their host, but the present events are sourced from the bio-weapons/pharmacuetical corporate circles in conjunction with the United Nations.
pondman27 2 years ago
@ pondman27
if you have superior scientific analysis to me then please educate
present events are DUE TO HUMAN POPULATION EXPLOSION
you are not "ECOLOGIST" if you defend SIX BILLION HUMANS
no species can multiply so fast.
you are selfish anti-elitist.
please, fight elite, fight proletariant, but leave middle alone
walter0bz 2 years ago
>>"Sorry you are duped if you believe this is all occuring by >>chance."
Do you actually beleive in Evolution??
evolution created all organisms on this planet, viruses included.
Viruses&bacteria have extreme rapid replication rate - every new cell/particle is a new variant. each individual creates MILLIONS of variations per day in small space (your body)
wheras for humans, evolution is slow - you only create 2 new variants per 30 years
did NWO make the black death?
plagues are NATURAL
walter0bz 2 years ago
I belive the route to human happiness is to workk with life forces. I aid those forests & the wildlife, and will leave but ephemeral tracks.
This Zeitgheist will happily exterminate those of less scientific worth.
Freeing humanity from this fictional bondage, enabling autonomy where the creative comes to the for. The alternative is to become borg within the matrix.
Look at the scenery within these mindgames they programme the children with, this is part of the vision. Not for me & mine.
pondman27 2 years ago
working with the system, #1 concentrate resources in fewer offpsring. (in my case ZERO!). voluntary Eugenics=more freedom
#2 avoid becoming *dependant* on anything you can't create.
to a large extent, the slavery is *symbiosis*
of course economies of scale give elites power.. freedom is hard work... there is a symbiotic element to the pyramid.
e.g. elites give proles the superior numbers they want by creating the tech that ALLOWS them to multiply so much. proles give elite their power-base.
walter0bz 2 years ago
slavery is symbiosis!!!
There can be no symbiosis in the pyramid. It was always about managing a livestock population to do the dirty work. But mistakes were made. We humans, regardless of nation, creed, or class are sentient, equal to all that come before us in all respects, save ofcourse our willingness to defile this place & the life forms.
The Venus Project is a dead duck if it seriously believes that humanity will kneel before the alter of the machine.
pondman27 2 years ago
Yes beleive it or not there is symbiotic element to slavery
pyramid also divides horizontally with different competing collectives those at top are merely survivors of the last revolution or conflict.
and take oil..
OIL elite are too powerful
but OIL elite also *CREATED* 4 billion lives. that is symbiosis.
so if you want to breed "free" of oil elite you can only do so if you already have enough land to *not need industrial farming methods*
walter0bz 2 years ago
The Oil elite. You speak as though there are different elite globalist groups. This may be true, but as you acknowledge they are part of the pyramid. This structure comprises of entities that have risen through the tactics of war. They serve the money masters & elitists.
There is no symbiosis within system of slavery where the slave masters are the only party to gain. It is a system where one group comprising of the most ruthless exploit all resources within thier influence.
It is predatory.
pondman27 2 years ago
>>"The Oil Elite"
correct. there are different competing elites
religious.. racial/ethnic.. energy.. media.. national/statist..
you claim to be eco.. i dont think you are.
do you have babies?
how do they survive
were did their land come from
walter0bz 2 years ago
Thank you, you acknowledge that is a single system of domination.
I am more eco than you would believe. My sustenance comes from my work & my work is focused upon the creation of autonomy through food producing, water resource management & small scale renewable energy technologies that include biomass generation.
I have a large family covering several generations. We seek to produce our own or support local production to meet all our needs. We rarely visit your supermarkets.
The land......
pondman27 2 years ago
great. if you're self sufficient then thats fine
most people can't feed their kids without oil-elite feeding them
so, to dis-empower oil elite they must refrain from breeding
i'm leading by example - zero kids
walter0bz 2 years ago
It is one of my roles in this time, to teach and give the food that we generate in abundance. Our numbers are growing (excuse the pun). Those that do not alter thier ways, will become sick and be drawn into further dependence. This I witness occuring as I write.
You are right most people... but the seed of truth for ourselves, has the capacity to germinate in all places & climates. So I teach by communication, but also by example. The result is that we have a strong family.
pondman27 2 years ago
A family that is not just of our blood, but extends to our street, our community, for any that want to be friends.
By the nature of our diversity, we optimise our creativity, no problem is insurmountable and the problem invariably is the solution. None of this will be by revolution, for that is repeating the circle, no this is inspiration the spiral that is the more accurate form of movements.
When you stimulate creativity, the organisms that you are surrounded with, provide feedback & assist.
pondman27 2 years ago
@walter0bz So no next generation? Just end it here, let the stupid breed. Not to be comical but isn't that what happened in Idiocracy? Lol.
Jonisapsuedonym 1 year ago
@Jonisapsuedonym -
to avoid idiocracy, the best way is to use IQ based breeding licence.
only top 50% of IQ's permitted to reproduce.
Unfortunately people always start calling you "hitler" when you suggest that.
also, Quantity (not Quality) is the bigger problem, by far.
walter0bz 1 year ago
The land was here before we came, it will be here after we have turned back into dust. Its control resides within the age of empires, the predation, invasions & occupations of the past. This was made possible by unlocking (discovering) technologies of warfare. This is the way the mystery school students have indoctrinated into building over an eon. In other words, the land was taken by force but the truth is, it cannot ever be owned by a living thing & we are all a part of it. This is the SCHISM
pondman27 2 years ago
In a time that you have not been taught of, the human was allowed to exist free of the pyramid as we know this civilisation to be. Then, something changed, new entities appeared as gods. They are described by all ancient cultures across the globe.
These entities are still with us and believe they are approaching the completion of a task. This is why the blood glyphs are dominant & why eugenics figures so much in their strategies.
But others have also come to teach and awaken the human.
pondman27 2 years ago
elite are masters of manipulation of proletariat
not PREDATORY but EMPOWERERS
and elites compete with eachother
root of elite power is .. POPULATION GROWTH
walter0bz 2 years ago
Comment removed
walter0bz 2 years ago
we evolved arable crops (and later petrochem methods) simply because they fed more humans using less land
i beleive we can only return to methods you mention with lower human numbers.
(i know from we haven't properly evolved to eat arable/beef etc)
r.e. pesticides etc.. you must measure "num humans created" vs "num humans destroyed".
if something increases yeild 2x but poisons 10% of population, thats still 90% increase in humans!
the problem was that petrochem methods were TOO effective
walter0bz 2 years ago
You may not be aware of this, but Jacque was on Larry King back in 1974 (long before Larry was nationally syndicated), and his dissertation was simply amazing! There is an effort to get him back on Larry King. I've signed the petition, and I hope it works!
ahoog69 2 years ago
You silly people, they are the same guys that allready rule the world. They are talking about earth with 500000 living humans, where machines would do everything. You are so naive...
filipsosu 2 years ago 3
I'm confused... Why couldn't it work for everyone? a scientific approach to humanism seems feasible. Where does your conspiracy theory come from anyways?
seanotube85 2 years ago
Do some research. Look around you, and very large reality is right at the tip of your fingers. Find the truth! But mostly, wake up and see our world has the potential we're not giving it!!
kenaization 2 years ago
ok then... tell that to the other guy.
seanotube85 2 years ago
what "other" guy?
kenaization 2 years ago
The other guy who believes that there's going to be some kind of extinction level event that wipes out all but the 500,000 richest people and everyone else gets replaced by robots. The guy who's afraid of technology and the scientific approach to advancing our species in other words. The guy I responded to in the first place. Unless your on his side... in which case, you're going to need to explain yourself a little more clearly.
seanotube85 2 years ago
I was big fan of zeitgeist 1, and thats because at the end of movie they spice it up with a little touch of spiritual. After that it was all machines, machines, machines. I do not want to say that earth cannot be a better place, but this is not the way. My opinion is formed from a large number of sources. Try to find Russian documentary named ''VODA'' (water). I'm more into those kind of things, and that kind of thinking. God bless you all!
filipsosu 2 years ago
Why can't spirituality be realistic? You believe that spirituality would be done away with in a technological age without money? I don't. People still need to be creative, and that's basically what spirituality is. You don't have believe in fairy tales to be spiritual, you just have to realize that we are beings that are constantly searching for knowledge and we always will be because perfection is unattainable. Combine that pursuit of knowledge with creativity and you have spirituality.
seanotube85 2 years ago
Machines already produce nearly everything, all we're talking about is a matter of degree. Besides, from a business standpoint, it is much more cost effective to employ a machine. All it takes is more corporate power, and machines will run everything they can, because profit is, and always has been, the bottom line.
hoagly 2 years ago
"machines already produce nearly everything".
thats right. humans are nearly obsolete.
and in VP utopia where machines produce EVERYTHING, humans would be COMPLETELY obsolete.
hahaha
walter0bz 2 years ago
Humans would be free to do whatever the fuck they wanted to, not waste 1/3 of their lives working for some douche bags. I know some people work in jobs they love, but they are the massive majority.
GtheMVP 2 years ago
you're right most jobs suck
BLAME YOUR PARENTS.
they knew what the world was like.
you're supposed to use partner selection & the decision to breed or not breed to create lives with good opportunity.
yes, if you have no property behind you, you're a guest on someone elses land and exploited like cattle for rent. it's worked like that for centuries.
so, women are supposed to marry land-owners & give them heirs.
or couples are supposed to concentrate resources into fewer/free-er offspring.
walter0bz 2 years ago
When you read more, as to how we came to be where we are in these traumatic times, apparently suffering under multifaceted crisis that now impact upon the lives of all humanity & all entities, it becomes very clear.
Your parents, just as you, even now, did only that which they were capable of. They too were victims of the society of their time.
We are trying to turn the key into our future, whilst being progressively placed under more draconian(reptillian) control.
pondman27 2 years ago
Calculate again, I think you'll find it to be much more than that.
The present system is both predatory & its power not human.
We face the living dead in that these corporations that are fictional persons rather than human.
But to submit ourselves to a Venus matrix, is to place the choice of life, into a machine. This too, may be what we are witnessing, transhumanism.
The living creative forms of life, have within them, more exquisite geometries in terms of multifaceted function.
pondman27 2 years ago
er.. ok.
do you beleive in conservation of energy or do you think abundance is possible.
can humans multiply or do they need to acheive balance
walter0bz 2 years ago
we should respect all resources, especially those that are to hand. Energy is abundant, all we need do is to tap into it. The means to just that are already with us. Energy is matter, it is the 'e' in motion.
All matter manifest in this spectrum of dimensions comes to us, it is found in the winds of the cosmos. This planet, just as any other is not constant, but subjected to the musical harmonies of energy. Human populations left alone, do find equilibrium with the environ.
pondman27 2 years ago
no they do not.
they move to an area and they Multiply..
they Multiply until every natural resource is consumed...
and then the only way they can survive is to spread to another area
walter0bz 2 years ago
If rather than simply following the path of seeing humanity as a corrupt out of control organism that is diseasing this planet, should it not also be that the societal structures that are of the empire building type, are the drivers behind colonisation.
Today, the human is subjected to mind control. Historically we have been used as mere pawns in the grand chessboard.
The advent of technology has accelerated the destruction & as for consumption, people can only buy that which is made available
pondman27 2 years ago
"people can only buy that which is made available"
[1]without petrochem fertilizers, the land can only feed 2billion.
66% must refrain from breeding to return to enviro-friendly agriculture.
[2] beleive it or not, the corps adapt quickly to market demands. if everyone stopped buying meat & only bought organic food, the corps would adjust to supply that... but then most people would have to starve.
walter0bz 2 years ago
Your assertions are becoming more extreme.
The game of monopoly, is the conditioning of the banksters & multinational corporations that presently abuse this place, including human resources.
"66% must refrain from breeding!"
THE VENUS PROJECT INCLUDES EUGENICS ADVOCATES!
The corps a.k.a. corpse = living dead. Responding to market conditions is best done within your neighbourhoods & communities. In terms of food, its value can't be measured with money! Thats how we've become so diseased.
pondman27 2 years ago
price signals give "the machine" a lot of feedback about people's preferences.
the market is a giant supercomputer
i'm not a venus project advocate.. i'm calling for population reduction to survive peak oil gracefully. I believe humanity has head in the sand over the issue. people think "someone else" will fix it. in reality any energy source will be used to enslave you. see the wealth in hands of oil-elite.
for freedom you need to grow own food.. but earth can only support 2bn that way
walter0bz 2 years ago
"i'm calling for population reduction to survive peak oil gracefully".
No disrespect, but I find this comment particularily askew. Firstly, since the established powers that govern communication, scientific research, economics, the media et al, do you really think it is sensible to believe the information they promote?
Question everything, if in doubt, do what research you can, but most importantly, remain skeptical.
I am also interested to know whether you would do the killing (gracefully)?
pondman27 2 years ago
price signals are a pointless tool of competition. Only required because of induced scarcety. In this I agree wholeheartedly with Jacques. Suppose instead, as we increase production to the point it exceeds our need, we simply pass it on to those around us that would benefit. You know, sharing rather than hoarding.
People's preferences are lead, my friend, just as with elections, they vote from amongst the selected. Democracy is a farce.
pondman27 2 years ago
"only required because of induced scarcety"!
THis induced scarcity thing is so funny.
can you not see that population growth causes scarcity. every peice of complexity in nature is a solution to finding energy. Once a creature evolves a temporary advantage (via new peice of design) it multiplies... until it's back to experiencing scarcity.
thats how nature works
". Democracy is a farce. "
true but i'd pick it over theocracy, dictatorship, mob-rule any day. What we have is rule by price signals
walter0bz 2 years ago
price signals are a feedback mechanism proven to be the most effective mechanism to drive progress.
demand exceeds supply -> price goes up. entrepeneurs can profit by increasing *supply* this is the bit you're missing :)
or people can modify behaviour to reduce demand
(eg can't make more land, so people are supposed to STOP MULTIPLYING when cost of land rises)
had era of cheap food due to abundant oil energy. as oil becomes scarce, food price will rise, and we will starve
need pop control now
walter0bz 2 years ago
"Suppose instead, as we increase production to the point it exceeds our need, "
price signal *quantifies* benefit. You guys go on and on about "Scientific Method"...which requires *measurement* via *numbers*
price signals provide feedback mechanism incentivizing land-owner to grow whatever crop is most in demand. do i grow tomatoes or turnips? depends what everyone else wants & what everyone else is growing.
money is just refined,advanced barter
walter0bz 2 years ago
>>"Today, the human is subjected to mind control."
in past we had religion.
in jungle we had lions trying to eat us :)
resisting corporate advertizing is quite easy by comparison
there's actually a theory that human intelligence evolved via process of deceiving/detecting deception r.e. competitors in social contexts.
e.g. female ape only wants alpha male seed, but also tricks other males into providing for the alpha's offspring. bitches!
humans are inherently corrupt.. can't blame the corps
walter0bz 2 years ago
There is a great deal of difference between the mind control of today and religous influences of the past.
The key differences today, are manifest in those that believe they have the true word of god, or others that believe themselves to be chosen or have a divine right.
Ofcourse humans exposed to repeated trickery will adapt counter strategies. Those Simians you speak of are no relation of mine!
pondman27 2 years ago
advertizing is a complex business.. people become immune very quickly. constant battle between advertizer & public
plus side to it? Google & youtube are fantastically powerfull tool... they're funded by *advertizing* hence the energy expenditure running them.
walter0bz 2 years ago
Bottom line, do some fucking research retard before you open your mouth and prove your an idiot and possibly deceive naive onlooker's. The "Elite" (mindset) thinks your forever all fucking dumb and evil terrorist, anti-christ(ian) and wants to kill most of the "dummys". However In my opinion you where conditioned by the culture to be "Dumb" (Asleep/Unaware) and if they/we can wake your stupid ass up (we have faith in you) and help you become smarter then we can support an even larger population
SetTruthFree 1 year ago
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Bottom line, do some fucking research retard before you open your mouth and prove your an idiot and possibly deceive naive onlooker's. The "Elite" (mindset) thinks your forever all fucking dumb and evil terrorist, anti-christ ian and wants to kill most of the "dummys". However In my opinion you where conditioned by the culture to be "Dumb" (Asleep/Unaware) and if they/we can wake your stupid ass up (we have faith in you) and help you become smarter then we can support an even larger population
SetTruthFree 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Bottom line, do some fucking research retard before you open your mouth and prove your an idiot and possibly deceive naive onlooker's. The "Elite" (mindset) thinks your forever all fucking dumb and evil terrorist, anti-christ ian and wants to kill most of the "dummys". However In my opinion you where conditioned by the culture to be "Dumb" (Asleep/Unaware) and if they/we can wake your stupid ass up (we have faith in you) and help you become smarter then we can support an even larger population
SetTruthFree 1 year ago
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Bottom line, do some fucking research retard before you open your mouth and prove your an idiot and possibly deceive naive onlooker's. The "Elite" (mindset) thinks your forever all fucking dumb and evil terrorist, anti-christ ian and wants to kill most of the "dummys". However In my opinion you where conditioned by the culture to be "Dumb" (Asleep/Unaware) and if they/we can wake your stupid ass up (we have faith in you) and help you become smarter then we can support an even larger population
SetTruthFree 1 year ago
@filipsosu You don't know what you are talking about. You are just afraid of CHANGE.
ShittyAccount 9 months ago 4
the main reson for this of course the fact that when you tell people to look up the Zietgist movement and they search zietgist they get the first movie which was just a huge consipiracy sabang. The consipiracyies were true that they are not socialy acceptable.
lennaylennay 2 years ago
Damn Colonists!
Ignore their patronising!
Tear off their blind-fold!
Open their eyes!
brentoneccles 2 years ago 2
BJORK :)
ueberhannes 2 years ago
Yesum.
brentoneccles 2 years ago
Jacque even said it himself - its not a perfect system, its just a WHOLE lot better than what we have now. we can never achieve perfection
HMSwarrior 2 years ago 3
Thank you Jacque for pointing out what is important. /Mike, Sweden
shaglord 2 years ago 3
I berlieive you can be the richest fiancially person with all the power but if you dfon't have true riches of your spirit or true love in your liife. You your our the poorest person in the world and no amoiunt of money or power is going to fill that, gaping wound....
gardenspook 2 years ago 3
building a little commune would show the world there capabilities and prove your point. atleast until they destroy it. You cant Change everything at once, and you have to start somewhere.
mythros1 2 years ago 3
Exactly, I guess they are trying to build one. I guess its call the new z-land project or something
batata01 2 years ago
Untrue batata. The so-called "New Z-Land" project has nothing to do with us.
If we build anything it'll be an international city with the most up-to-date technology, transportation, etc available at the time.
brentoneccles 2 years ago
Don't get me wrong, I am not saing it would b eperfect. There might still be violent people, but it would be much easier to address this problem scientifically, where they would be treated like patients not criminals.
batata01 2 years ago 2
Good point. But I wouldn't project today's mentality to that reality. Most of the crimes today are related to a system of values inherent to a scarcity-based economy. If you eliminate scarcity, many conditioned reactions to it desapear such as greed, social domination, humiliation and so on because they are no longer relevant. A new set of not violent values is originated.
batata01 2 years ago
They were not competing with anyone, they did not do it to prove something to the rest of the world, and most importantly they were not sick in the head. { to me they are sick, but they were not proven psycho or alike}. So you see, even in Frescos world of everyone living equal and having a home and food, etc. There will still be plenty of crime. WHat if the people dont want to study or go to museums, but want to kill, just like these fucking kids. Scary i think.
Arcane1Soldier 2 years ago
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There will still be crime. How can you tell. Because even now, the rulers of this world, the richest of the rich, they have all the power and money in the world, and they are still doing evil shit. Its in human nature to want more and more and more. Even when we are all equal, we will still want more and alike. I agree with this man, but no matter how good his idea is, we will still cheat and kill and alike. A perfect REAL example is this ===
Arcane1Soldier 2 years ago
Actually the reason they do crime is for money. Power corrupts, money is power.
cogar48 2 years ago
other way round.
people crave *power*
money is just a "symptom"
look at Zimbabwe... it's a "money-free utopia" since they ditched the concept of "property-rights" and hyperinflation reduced them back to barter??
walter0bz 2 years ago
Wrong. Money WAS needed because we lived in scarcity. Zimbabwe has some pretty scarce resources. It's obvious you have no idea what you're talking about.
cogar48 2 years ago
cool insights!
SpamAnn 2 years ago
We have to fight for whats wright.
Arcane1Soldier 2 years ago
wright
FredDeluca 2 years ago 2
RIGHT lol
Arcane1Soldier 2 years ago
Jacque Fresco argues that humans are not naturally greedy, rather they are conditioned to be that way because of the scarcity-based monetary system, and the competition and self-interest based free enterprise system. If you eradicate the conditions in society (scarcity, competition, etc) that perpetuate greed and self-interest, then humans wouldn't be so greedy.
GameandWatch19 2 years ago 5
Some would use the greed and competition in animals to prove their point that humans are naturally greedy, but they do not take into account the scarcity of the environments that animals live in. Animals don't have the ingenuity we have to use technology to eliminate scarcity, so they must fight with one another.
GameandWatch19 2 years ago 3
Agreed. Very important point.
We have very complex brains which allow us to use logic, forsight, and hindsight to generate solutions to scarcity. It is very primitive of us to look at other animal behavior and pattern our lives after animals.
90% of people don't even have a valid understanding of "survival of the fittest" due to our media's portrayal of it, and people who promote eugenics due to an inflated ego and neurosis developed from our environment, class hierarchy.
blaziermissy 2 years ago
Fresco has the most "common sense" approach to human behavior and the environment interaction in regard to our sociology that I've ever encountered.
What are we waiting for?
blaziermissy 2 years ago
Just because it's "common sense" doesn't make him correct.
bbpro 2 years ago
In what regard is he not correct in?
Please elaborate.
I'm interested in what you have to say.
blaziermissy 2 years ago
He claims there is no human nature - just human behaviour, a patently false statement. Human nature DOES exist. You cannot and will NEVER remove people's self interests as the primary driving force behind their behaviour. He is either ignorant or consciously lying. I will guess it is the former.
bbpro 2 years ago
I'm not sure why, but I didnt receive your message response in my inbox.
Our human "nature" as we call it, is based on our environmental influences.
You may be confusing "nature" with attributes, don't you think?
Calling Fresco ignorant is well........
How do I say it nicely......ignorant. Sorry, you know it's true. The man is intelligent and humane. That's certainly scarce in our environment., but it doesn't have to be.
blaziermissy 2 years ago 2
Got it. So my developmentally delayed friend smashes his head against his face and screams out loud at random times because of his environment and not genetics? Got it, thanks.
bbpro 2 years ago
Nice try, using retardation to try and prove human nature.
ShavaShav 2 years ago 4
While I'm very rusty on behaviorism at the moment, there are many reasons your friend could be exhibiting that behavior. He may receive attention such as touch or be consoled after doing so, and has paired this response from people, with his behavior. Thus, he will act out the behavior b/c he likes the response that follows, and has formed a pattern for reinforcement.
I don't know for sure...I would have to observe his behavior for hours.
There are ways to counter this behavior, btw.
blaziermissy 2 years ago
Again I'm rusty, so don't quote me on the terms I used in my response, such as "paired." It may be that your friend is simply being positively reinforced. Example: Your friend bangs his head. He receives attention, thus, your friend bangs his head more often. That would mean his behavior has been positively reinforced, and the attention is the reinforcer. Again, it would have to be observed.
blaziermissy 2 years ago
bbpro, I didn't receive your response in my inbox, and I see that you posted this a month ago. I just happened to run across your comment as I rewatched this video.
I have no idea why I'm not receiving all responses. Your comment should have been in my inbox. Either youtube has glitches, or I I overlooked this post in my inbox, but this has happened a lot lately.
blaziermissy 2 years ago
While I agree that you cannot change people's self interest, b/c that is about survival. However, changing the environment, where we are not pitted against each other for primary needs will change behavior. If a persons primary needs are met then there is not incentive to horde resources or fear of losing ones resources, you get very different behavior b/c you have a different environment.
blaziermissy 2 years ago
it's common sense, it's humane, it's logical, it's caring, it's smart, it's scientific, it's a lot better than anything ever tried.
inabear3 2 years ago 3
i agree with you Blaziermissy..all miliion-billionaires should invest in the earths future before money becomes worthless....forget space projects and warfare, we cant get it right on earth yet.
2012Aquarius 2 years ago 5
Thanks..
It's a no brainer if we're to be intellectually honest and rational.
blaziermissy 2 years ago
Not a bad idea...use up what money there is solely for the purpose of starting up the Venus Project! One last hurrah for the monetary system before it is put to bed.
Long before I ever heard of the Venus Project or Zeitgeist, I had considered the notion of what our world might be like without a monetary system, and I imagine many of you may have had such fleeting thoughts as well. Facts aside, it feels like the right direction to go!
ahoog69 2 years ago
Star Trek actually got me thinking of how a society could work without money. The venus project showed me that we don't need replicators to create abundance. It really is a possibility.
GtheMVP 2 years ago
how he explains things is the sane way of life. A man ahead of his time. His project is the venus project. If you look at the site, it looks really exciting. the possibilities, wow.
judyrusso 2 years ago 3
not even 10,000 views.... very sad to see such powerful and logical message being ignored.... SEND THIS TO EVERYONE YOU KNOW~
yianki1020 2 years ago 2
I wouldn't be so sure that this has only a little over 10,000 views. Sometimes these counts are wrong, for whatever reasons....
blaziermissy 2 years ago
yeah, you are right. Its not like YouTube hasnt done this before...*hint* Ron Paul's campaign. Not that I think we should continue with politics, just what i remember.. Be safe
yianki1020 2 years ago
Which is why his ideas will never work - nobody cares. So unless you can change this, his ideas will never work.
bbpro 2 years ago
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HUH?
Arcane1Soldier 2 years ago
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I hate to be the buzz kill here, but all in all, 2012 needs to happen or if God exists, he needs to start over and maybe this time actually be the loving God he is supposed to be, or something.
Arcane1Soldier 2 years ago
God?
No. Society.
phreaksterman 2 years ago 5
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Of course its flawed to an extent. Perfection can never be attained. Ok, then lets up the price. If you steal anything in this country, they will cut both your hands and legs and nuts off. I think that will prevent ALOT of thiefs.lol People dont care about other people. They only care about money, so if you make a law that says well, if you drive drunk, not inly do you loose license for 5 years, you have to also pay 75% of your monthly check from work. Trust me, they will stop big time. no all.
Arcane1Soldier 2 years ago
Comment removed
theinsane102 2 years ago
From my understanding, I feel that the Venus Project is a proposal to develope a technologicaly advanced version of a subsistance economy but on a larger scale.
charbonelle 2 years ago
Habla Ingles?
Arcane1Soldier 2 years ago
people born in to this near perfect world, that have fucked up genetics that make them sin or something. I can only see a few crimes done in a perfect world and those are of envy. If we are all equal to the way we live, we can only be Jealous to the person next to us who may have a prettier wife then you, or may have a girlfriend, but you are not prince charming and have no girl, so you go on a rape rampage, etc. Or you have no friends, but your neighbor has 20, so you see, its human nature.!
Arcane1Soldier 2 years ago
envy comes from the inability to get a certain object or the supression of having something that which they envy or their will to not task them selves with that which shall tribute them with what they envy
TheGooberment 2 years ago
you're embedding today's problems on a world that isn't conditioned to be that way. Jealousy is also a part of scarcity.
inabear3 2 years ago
either say" damn, i fucked up and they never do it again, or alike" No matter how much better we make life for all, and as close to perfect, yes, there will always be crime. When you are equally living as the rest{ food, water,shelter,transportation,etc} What else can you want.{ you would envy the other person, not for their cars, or houses, but their freinds, and hot wives and alike. and that is what will make people commit crime in even perfect societies} and of course there will always be....
Arcane1Soldier 2 years ago
Take this as example. If the average cost of a speeding ticket is say $50,{everyone can afford to pay that i think}, but imagine they make a law that raises the regular speeding ticket from $50 to $5,000 dollars. { i dont think i would ever speed in my life, no matter what} Everyone would drive like a 90 year old granny. But there will always be that 2% of society that will say, il drive fast today, i will not get caught. So for those 2%, it can only stop them after they do teh crime and..
Arcane1Soldier 2 years ago
Your example is flawed. Me explain. There is a law that says if you drive while drunk you can lose your freedom. Not to mention you put yourself in a situation where you can lose your life or someone elses. Guess what? People still drive drunk. Whats more valiable to you? $5,000 or your freedom/life. They have laws in other countries if you steal, they will cut off your hand. People still steal. So making a $ amount larger may stop some but will not solve the problem in the end.
moety2 2 years ago 2
Has anyone ever read "Brave New World."?
It might infringe "Peoples rights." But frankly, who ever said People were allowed to invent their own rights. The laws of Logic rule everything & if you pop babies out like cute toys and over grow your society v. its means of support the surplus have nots will always attack the haves if there has bene no conceptualised balance protocol.
The solution is there, but no one follows it because they dont want to because theyre stupid..
ChineseCalligraphy 2 years ago
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sign the VENUS Project Petition online!
we can make it happen!
jrgoku1000 2 years ago
how will pyschotics, rapists, mental retarded, and pure manipulators (evil) live in this wonderful idea that he has created? Please someone try to explain this most obvious speculation to me. lol.
MekaGabe 2 years ago
The idea is to research and develop solutions to such neurological problems with the scientific method. Instead of a criminal being executed, s/he would be studied to figure out what caused him/her to be that way, such that scientists could figure out a solution to try to prevent such problems in other people in the future.
Of course, this is being done today in some cases, but superstitions and politics still interfere with scientific method in many cases.
holycow818181 2 years ago
studying? humans will be used for testing, animals? plants? will we use artificial life to simulate human biology?
alot of research and science involves trial and error and making sacrafices. what is our stance on this?
MekaGabe 2 years ago
You seem to know more about the issue than I do. What do you think the best solution would be? It's my understanding that no part of the Venus Project is written in stone (that would sort of defeat the purpose of a society that accepts change and growth).
holycow818181 2 years ago
An example then.
I created a vaccine that would make us immune to all disease.
Who are we going to test it on? Are we going to say, "who wants to go first" or are we going to grab a monkey?
MekaGabe 2 years ago
I think what you're talking about is a whole issue in itself. A relevant issue, certainly, but one that deserves a more in-depth discussion than a series of YouTube comments is likely to provide.
If you're interested, you might consider contacting the Venus Project's website about this issue. As Jacque Fresco himself has said, people should question the Venus Project and help to figure out ways to improve it.
holycow818181 2 years ago
and im not saying no to change or growth...im more prepared to say,"where do we draw a line"?
MekaGabe 2 years ago
i just question the methods of the scientific process. im a vegan if youd like to know that also.
MekaGabe 2 years ago
Im sure that in this near perfect society of Fresko, that there will still be LAWS to govern and punish the criminals. He has a good concept and ideas, but he like all are never 100% in to making something perfect or close to. Id say, his ideas are incredible and will help the world so much that crime will decrease and alike, but in order to answer your question, we must first try an idea. If his Venus world will help us, we will then see by how much and deal or create new ways to deal withcrime
Arcane1Soldier 2 years ago
We wouldn't need laws. Just watch more and listen properly and you will understand it. He says there won't be any need for laws because crime will be gone because there's no need for crime because there's no money and everyone has equal opportunities etc. If someone is psycho in the literal sense. I'm sure there will be technology eventually to help them. Or every person could decide on whether this person should be subjected to medical experiments or something I guess.
d0md0mt0mt0m 2 years ago
let us all spread fresco's message! i started burning and giving copies of both zeitgeist and welcome to the future movies at college (for free) by the only condition of those who received them to do the same. it's working pretty well :) ! we are like rain drops, only together we can make the flood required to clean this messed up world
BloodyInsane 3 years ago
me too!
xXRejuvenateXSoulXx 2 years ago
Welcome to the future.... is that Future By Design? Just diferent titles? Never heard of wlecome to the future.
I was thinking about doing the same thing too.
d0md0mt0mt0m 2 years ago
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So people only break the law because they are lacking some physical resource... apparently vandalism is a figment of my imagination.
Sepero1 3 years ago
very articulate teach me
Sm0KeNHaZe 3 years ago
vandalism is a form of personal desperatation which can be caused by various reasons but mainly a lack of resource. i mean people who vandalate are most often poor people who need a relief so he`s basically right
Baarz 3 years ago 4
that would be an example of enviroment influencing human behavior. What the Venus Project wants to do is to alter the enviroment so that behavior DOES NOT happen. Its good that you dont buy everything you hear, and you shouldnt. Maybe you understand this concept a little bit better considering its been 2 months since you posted this comment. Be safe..
yianki1020 2 years ago
Let's start changing the world...everyone start to spread this message of Jacques Fresco and Zeitgeist movement.If you haven't seen Zeitgeist movie better watch it, there is a pure true that every man on this planet need to hear about what's happening in this world now and why.Except the few of them who try to control the peoples on this planet,they will try to maintain they're power and in any way detain this project,just because of GREED.
Spljofo 3 years ago 5
Why cant every leader in the world think like this man, why does he make so much sense yet apart from a selected few no one listens, we all need to spread the word and tell anyone who'll listen, thats the key. Most people don't know who jacque fresco is and it's up to us who are passionate about his work to help spread the word.
mrbush2nd 3 years ago 3
im from germany, and i want to say, i think absolutly like him. please let us change our world. we only have to tell others.
fndFreaker 3 years ago 5
why dont more people think like Fresco, look where our monetary system and politics have brought us, the futur looks grim if nothing is done
zic32 3 years ago 15
read and listen all you can find of this man
get the word out, to everyone.
chemchert 3 years ago 12
This man has great ideas, myself have never been too fond of bearocrocy - or however you spell it.
HimmiJoe 3 years ago 5
insert[applause]
packleader87 3 years ago 9
No more divide and rule.
Fived, faved and shared. :-)
"You will be invaded by the minorities if they dont have enough food, water or means to live."
US fences and Israel walls dont solve any problem in this world.
result321 3 years ago 7
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Jacque Fresco, is talking about water for people with none. The only one here talking about a lack of sex is denny599. That leads me to think that he might be in need of a hooker him self. Which would make him a... well you do the math. Most brain doctors say that rape is not form lack of sex, anyway; it is caused by the need of someone to have power over another person.