Very good point with the airplane over Washington and that no videos were recorded. Not a single little video, not any second with an airplane on it! Very strange and suspicious. I completely agree with you, to be critic with the official version of the happenings.
I read half way into the first comment. No energy for this anymore. Can't do it... You should look into common characteristics shown by conspiracy theorists, as well as the tendencies they exhibit in building their cases. You just might see a few similarities. Have a good one.
@vadimcream you should read what dictionary com and realize i don;t have a case I just stated why i feel warranted to not believe what was told to me. That isn't a conspiracy theory
Scratch my original low ball estimate of 20 people in the squad. To take down a plane and CLEAN IT UP, that would take at least 75 people. A plane creates a fuck-ton of wreckage that takes multiple machines/man power to take care of.
@vadimcream how do you disappear a plane. i don't know. I'm a business owner. Give me unlimited resources and years of planning time and I bet you I could find a way. Again you keep leading down this trail. I am NOT claiming to know what happened. Nor have I stated what I think happened. BECAUSE I DON"T KNOW. Henceforth the term Fence-Sitter. Maybe it was a plane. All i am saying is I am not convinced by the evidence and here are my reasons why.
No dude. You can't make a plane disappear. Anywhere you'd shoot it down in US airspace many people will potentially see it. There is no safe place to do this. There are multiple radar systems and tracking devices and such on 747s. There is also no way to know what the trajectory of the massive wreckage would be and a clean up of something like that would require massive manpower.
You would also need the participation of the FAA and all of the (cont)
You would also need the participation of the FAA and all of the all of the air-traffic controllers that were monitoring this situation (dozens upon dozens of them) to corroborate the story and take part in the staged events as they unfolded. And this is the only the lowest number of people that you would need to pull off JUST THE PENTAGON ATTACK. And for what? Just so that you can kill these people in a really inconvenient way when you could have just flown them into the building???
what air traffic controller would you need if the flight never took off? what air traffic controllers are there in mexico? where were the air traffic controllers when the flight was heading the wrong directon to hit the pentagon? since you think planes are constantly watched and picked up on radar. why don't they show the radar reports of them tracking the plane hitting the pentagon. THERE YOU GO. that would be proof I would like. where are those reports. what site and we can be done with this
@vadimcream why do you keep saying it has to be Shot Down. Maybe with your limited view you can't think of a way to do it but I bet there may be people on earth who are smarter then you and me who could figure it out. Hell i bet if I was posting about how arabs with box cutters are going to hijack planes and fly them into the pentagon bbefore 9-11 happened you'd sit there and type how IMPOSSIBLE that would be and point out all the ways it wouldn't work,
And lastly, WHY THE FUCK WOULD THEY DO THIS? HOW DOES THIS MAKE THINGS ANY EASIER? WHY NOT JUST USE THE PLANE TO RAM INTO THE PENTAGON LIKE THEY DID WITH THE TWIN TOWERS? WHY CREATE ALL THIS MESS AND INVOLVE WAY MORE PEOPLE THAN THEY NEED?
It doesn't make a lick of sense and you can continue believing it but you are only proving the fact that you are willing to believe some truly unbelievable shit in order to keep this ludicrous theory alive in your head. It's really quite strange, really.
@vadimcream Why? I'don't know. And if I guess you'll say ... you have no evidence for this and you are a conspiracy theorist. maybe they wanted to test the pentagon against a missle attack. maybe they wanted to test there own defense system. maybe they wanted to test the missle capablities in a highly populated area bc they knew an impending war was coming. You keep thinking I have this story in my head. I don't. thats what you don't get. please look up fence sitter.
@philosophyman76 Why do you insist that you are not a fence-sitter? It sounds like you just don't want to call it out because you are afraid to embrace all of the judgments that might come with labeling yourself this.
You are not the least bit neutral (i.e. a "fence-sittler") on the matter of whether or not there was foul play involved. This is the distinction here that clearly shows that you are NOT A FENCE-SITTER in the least.
@vadimcream One more time for the incredibly slow. You can call me what ever you want. you want to label me because I don't agree with you. thats fine. You have asked me hundreds of questions not relating to what my video is . My response is I don't know or here's what could have happened. These are not my theories or what I believe. Here I don't believe and earthquake knocked over the pentagon. why no evidence. My vid for the last time says i don't believe the govt story and here's why.
it doesnt say "Heres what I think happened at the pentagon." I don't create a theory. I asked questions. Thats how you get answers. If you would have said here is a site with video of a plane, or here's why there is no footage and emp went off and all electrical stuf went off... or anything valid then I would say ok i get it. But you haven't. You just asked me a lot of crap that i don't have answers for. I DON"T HAVE ANSWERS BC I DON"T KNOW WHAT TO BELIEVE AKA FENCE-SITTER
Conspiracy theorist - Someone who has a theory of an conspiracy
Fence-sitter - Someone who listens to both sides and is not convinced of either arguments.
you seem to think I am the former. And I am not. The only reason I am arguing the conspiracy is bc you are agruing against it. If you were arguing for the conspiracy I would probaly make the same agruements you are posing. my original problems still remain. where is the video or pictures
You ARE convinced that there was foul play. Just the fact that you do not believe the official story alone proves that you are not a fence-sitter. You believe lies were told and unknown wrong-doings were comitted. So you are NOT a fence-sitter. Get it?
And your definition of CT is broad, trite and severely under-defined.
The reason why this IS A CONSPIRACY theory is because this truly is an event that could not have been accomplished with out the participation of thousands.
@vadimnow your going to tell me what I am CONVINCED of? Wow thats amazing. you can read minds through a computer screen. No wonder you are so sure of the story you watched bush on tv read his mind and realized he was telling the truth. well damn it that's enough evidence for me. I am no longer on the fence.
my definition of CT is what the meaning is. Look up the word conspiracy then look up the word theory and put them together. you can go to dictionary . com. oh wait is that a CT website too
An entire plane of people can not disappear over the US. Every commercial airplane can be detected by multiple radar systems and there is simply no way we could lose track of an entire plane. If it was shot down anywhere it would leave a huge trace (I actually thought in your scenario they would have been flown somewhere else and THEN killed because I thought for sure you'd realize that what a problem/undertaking the cleanup of the wreckage would be... Your scenario fails...
You claim this operation would not need many people to execute and yet this creates a scenario in which (AT LEAST) a whole squad of soldiers must have been needed. How do you even begin to trust that your soldiers would keep quiet about doing something so heinous? Do you think they use mind erasers like in "Men in Black" or something? You can go with this theory if you want, but it immediately reduces your "not many people knew about it" theory to shreds.
@vadimcream a squad of soldiers? To do what? kill people on a plane? shoot down a plane? Make a plane crash? this takes a squad??? let me see if I can think up a way to destroy a plane and not need a squad. And lets go with your Squad theory. CIA agents do the heinous things in other countries all the time in the name of freedom. Mercenaries do crap all the time for money (oh but the government doesnt have any money) If you did this thing and were paid off by the government would you come...
Oh, so now they shot an entire plane down with no one catching on or it showing up on radar charts. That's plausible! How many people do you think a squad consists of? No. A squad can consist of 20 soldiers. (AND yes it would take at least that to coordinate and CLEAN UP.... And I guess there was someone on the flight that forced some passengers to make 911 calls from their phones and lie to their loved ones about being hi-jacked minutes before they crashed... Yeah, thats what happened.
@vadimcream forward and say something??? Why. Your wealthy beyond belief and you would want to become one of the most hated people on the planet and probably be assassinated by the government while in jail. There are people on this planet who could care less about killing people. Hitmen, some solders, mercenaries, etc. you you have 10-15 ppl like this and you can fire a missle, crash a plane, and do the dirty work. then you just cover it up bc ppl say no way
@vadimcream let me ask you if you had the choice and you had to choose btwn 10 people dying or 100 which would you choose. They have to die. Most likely 100. You do understand that there are people who commit atrocities in the name of saving lies, or protecting the nation. Hell how many ppl have we killed in other countries bc they are a "threat" people can justify thingsand delude themselves. How did hitler get all those troops to kill thousands of innocent ppl? Delusion of what is right.
Your question sheds no light on things. Hitler's time was far different, as there was a deep seeded hatred for jews. In our day there is no climate to make these murders of so many innocents remotely acceptable. Like a Christian pushing the reliability of the Noahs Arc you are ignoring HUGE things that make this scenario completely implausible just to accomadate your hairbrained theory that has no basis in reality. The mental gymnastics you are doing to keep this BS alive are astounding.
It just creates a million more problems and for what? Why would they do this? It makes things SOOOOOO much harder and involves so many more people to do it that way. They obviously had no problem using this method with both the planes on the twin towers. So why would they, for the pentagon alone, decide to fly the passengers of flight 77 somewhere else and kill them, instead of using them and the plane in the crash itself? It makes no rational sense whatsoever. NONE.
@blackjerryboymetal i actually just watched the first 3 minutes. and I'm sorry I thought you were going to show me a vid of a plane hitting the building. but it seems you decided to send me a vid of crap. fine. I guess you should watch the vid you are commenting on and then go to the dictionary and find out what a fence sitter is. again in your mind things are black and white. either believe what i beleive or your an idiot. that's fine. Hey the FED is great for the economy. Govt says so.
@blackjerryboymetal yes i do know there is an airport in washington DC. hey i also know there are two in NYC and they are not far from Manhattan but you know what you can't see manhattan from those airports and if a plane is about to crash anywhere not near the airport I guarantee you people catch it on film.
@blackjerryboymetal the tsunami that hit indonesia by the way was travelling 620 mph. and tsunami waves make very little sound bc they dont crash like regular waves. yet an unexpected tsunami wave we have pictures and video of in the middle of back water third world country. Security cameras are ALWAYS on. you don't have to "whip them out." and washington dc is a tourist area with thousands of people with cameras watching their kids, school trips, people looking at bldgs
@blackjerryboymetal no i saw that vid. Which was released first as 4 separate shots. then was released as a short vid. of course you can't make anything really out (especially a 747 in that vid. So you're story is that one low level security camera is the ONLY camera near or around THE PENTAGON. That vid makes my point. There are hotels, banks, stores etc in that area and a 757 flying that low would have been caught by more then just that one camera somewhere in washington DC or a tourist
@blackjerryboymetal and this has what to do with nobody taking a picture? again why don't you watch my video one more time. I know what the "official story" was and my point that started everything is i have some problems with it and I think my skepticism is warranted. The problem is you and many ppl see the issue as white and black. either you belief the govt 100% or anyone who asks questions is a conspiracy tin foil hat person. And that simple isnt true.
@blackjerryboymetal so you're helping me make my point. Every airport has highways going to it. people kids, tourist etc seeing a plane going 500 mph so low to knock over light poles don't take a picture. No security camera anywhere has video footage. No cameras or video is watching the skies over our nations capital an hour after we are attacked in NYC??? this makes sense to you somehow.
Dude, you are shameful. You don't believe that people actually perished on flight 77? Google a list of victims from that flight for gods sake then look each one up. They all have obits and tributes all over the internet. Their poor families have been interviewed in countless news footage and docs. Are you saying this is all acted/fabricated? What a terrible way to treat the memory of those that died in such a tragic way.
@vadimcream Ok lets assume there is a conspiracy just for a moment. if there was do you think they were gonna have to kill people? Yep. So ppl being REALLY dead I get. yes those 64 are dead. Not questioning that. HOWdid they die? is that dishonoring their names? Pat tillman died in this stupid war. The govt made up this whole story. the family didnt beleive it and found it it was friendly fire. what jerks. they should hv just listened to the story and not dishonoured their son
Pat Tillman? That is so off topic. Pat Tillman died under friendly fire and therefore your theories are more credible how? The Pat Tillman thing actually proves my point more than yours. In the case of Pat Tillman PEOPLE CAME FORWARD AND SUPPLIED EVIDENCE. That was a much smaller scale cover-up, and yet they couldn't keep it under wraps.
@vadimcream yeah the evidence came forward AFTER the family kept asking and pursuing answers. it wasn't like people came to them and said "Hey you know the govt story isn't correct." I read their book. They had to keep following leads and interviewing ppl on their own. my point though was it's not an insult to ask questions about how someone died. It's a dishonor if they're are questions and ppl don't ask them and say shut up and believe the story
@philosophyman76 You clearly were asserting earlier that the passengers of flight 77 did not exist, and now you are so quickly flip-flopping on the matter because like all of your paranoid assertions it was a claim based on piss poor logic and research. All of your claims and connections are this off-base and shallow.
Why did you make this video? You are clearly not a "fence-sitter" but you are a total waste of time.
@vadimcream please quote or show where i said. "the passengers of flight 77 never existed" you seem to have no problem quoting me in your other comments. I said a plane didnt hit the pentagon. if you watch my video again I am not claiming to know what happened nor am I saying here's what happened. i'm saying bc of these reasons I am justified in not believing all of the governments story thats what the vid says and you have given me no evidence or argument to change that stance
Please tell me, so there is no mistaking this time, what you are claiming happened. Are you saying they were murdered and their remains were spread at the crash scene? What are you asserting?
@vadimcream I have a 5:49 sec video that says exactly what I'm asking. I am not making a documentary nor am I writing a book and investigating 9-11. A question is not an assertion as much as you wish to make it one. if you wish to hear what my questions are again press play. as far as do I think the bodies were planted, evidence removed, how did they or could they pull it off? I don't have all those answers which is why the video is about 9-11 FENCE SITTERS
@blackjerryboymetal touchdown. yes. so they go 500 and then are instantly at 100 when they touch down? i got evidence go look at youtube and type plane crashes. you'll see a bunch of people not in tourist area, not in rush hour traffic and saw a plane doing something weird and videod it. amazing. again we have vid of the 1st plane hitting tat 500 mph at thousands of feet in the air. if no one really cares why are you commenting? you know nothing about me and what I have read or watched
@blackjerryboymetal There are highways and roads leading to the pentagon right? There are tourists that go to the pentagon and Washington DC right? If I see and HEAR (bc planes are noisy at 500 mph) a 747 plane flying even 200-500 feet above the ground , I may take a picture. I may turn my camera on. you are on a website of people who catch all kinds of stuff. this is a major event. NO ONE takes a piture, No surveilance cameras see this. Nothing except 4 fuzzy snap shots thats it? Really
@blackjerryboymetal so um how did we get video and pictures of a planes flying 500 mph into the first tower??? You do understand that in order to hit the pentagon a building that not a skyscraper on the side it would have been flying pretty low to the ground. I live right next to JFK airport. it is not hard a phone or camera and catch a plane going 500 mph as it comes in for landing. people do it all the time. if one is flying real low with no ariport around i think someone would catch it
"it is not hard a phone or camera and catch a plane going 500 mph as it coms in for landing. people do it all the time. if one is flying real low with no ariport around i think someone would catch it".
Yeah, except that it was 2001 at the time. Still cams were just starting to be the norm with cells. Video on phones were super rare (if they were around at all)... And they were very shitty, it would be very difficult to see something so far away on an old celvidcam from '01.
Correction. Cell phones with video were not around in 2001.
"Cell-phone cameras have been around for nearly five years. Nokia, the world's No. 1 cell-phone maker, was first to integrate a camera in 2001, said Nokia France spokesman Xavier des Horts. That initial model took only stills, but built-in video soon followed and is now near-standard."
Now that's from USA TODAY but they are probably in on the conspiracy too right?
@vadimcream why do you people think there has to be thousands of people involved to get stuff done? Did everyone in enron know what the directors were doing? How do bernard Madoff steall BILLIONS of dollars from corps, banks, people,etc and nobody found out about it for years? anyway they did have cameras in 2001 right? there was video in 2001 i remember. we are talking about the nations capitol during a time that a known attack was taking place. No security cameras, nobody has a camera?
The fact that you equate ENRON (a case where plenty of people actually DID COME FORWARD with EVIDENCE ) and 9/11 (a tremendous operation so much larger in scope than the ENRON debacle it's ridiculous) shows that you aren't thinking straight.
@vadimcream the point is they pulled it off. That is my point and they did a crappy job and got caught. you know what the problem is. we don't see all the ones that actually get pulled off we just see the failures and say well see it didnt work. How much more money, power, and influence can some key people in the US govenment use?
I suggest checking out the Atheist Experience's segments titled "Conspiracy Theories: Was 9-11 an inside Job?" posted on Ffreethinker's Youtube channel. Not just because of the main subject matter, but more because they elaborate on peer review and will probably give you a good idea of what I'm talking about...
I have to second the vadimcream's comment that the 'journal of 9/11 studies' is not a serious scientific journal. It is a blog that masquerades as a journal. It was created to fool people like you into believing that there is a veneer of academic plausability to their conspiracy theories.... sort of like the Intelligent design proponents in a world where evolution is a scientific fact.
@DrunkAtheist that's fine all i did was type in peer review pentagon crash and that came up first. I asked him for another paper and got nothing. I don't get the whole this thing is not reputable or this is not reputable so don't listen to that. it's like the attacks theist use on darwin. He was a racist and womanizer so his theory is wrong. No i don't care if the drunk on the street gives me the info if its right its right, if its wrong tell me what wrong with it.
@philosophyman76 The journal of 9/11 studies presents pro conspiracy articles reviewed by other conspiracy theorists in order to give the appearance of a peer reviewed scientific journal. It is only peer reviewed by other conspiracy theorists If you read some of the articles and compare them to actual scientific work done by skeptis regarding 9/11 you'll see the difference. It just trots out the same debunked stuff about the pentagon and tower 7 but it seems more convincing to the public.
" I don't get the whole this thing is not reputable or this is not reputable so don't listen to that. "
You don't fully understand the mechanism of peer review, how it works, and what makes it such a reliable standard for truth.
"it's like the attacks theist use on darwin"
Again, it's quite ironic that you say this because a phony PR journal gives a bogus stamp of authenticity, it's the EXACT tactic creationists often resort to. This supposed PR group is a wolf in sheep's clothing.
Also since you seem to think the pentagon attack is so fishy, what do you make of the fact that you can find a full list of those who perished in flight 77 on the internet along with several testimonials for each passenger. Do you think that these names and testimonies are all fabricated?... These are real people dude, and honestly I think it's an insult to their memory that nearly a decade later people such as your self act as though they probably didn't exist.
If you are going to post the Flying Circus vid then you should at least post the actual PM video as well so the viewer can disseminate the actual information from what is being imposed upon it. I'm kind of amazed that you made a deal of saying that you had a hard time taking PM's word for it and then exclusively post only some random youtubers video refuting PMs work as if that person is any more reputable...
Dude, again, the peer reviews that publish the journal for 911 studies are bullshit. They are the scientific equivalent of the types of places creationists go to get PHDs. To this day there has not been a single paper that has passed the scrutiny of a legitimate peer review process.
that is "To this day there has not been a single paper that has passed the scrutiny of a legitimate peer review process from the 9-11 truth movement."
@vadimcream so what paper would you like me to read. You say go look at peer review. i type that in and you don't like those peer reviews. instead you want me to watch a tv show and the writers of a magazine and take their word? so again you find me a peer review paper that you deem as credible and I'll read it. you only seem capable of giving me things that are just a illegit. I took the time to read the 20 pg paper and found no problems. If you provide me with a counter paper I'll read that 2
@philosophyman76 I never said to go look at a peer reviewed paper, it wouldn't hurt but when did I tell you to go look at one? I said that the truthers have not been able to publish one in a reputable peer review journal. And I don't decide what is legitimate, that has to do with the respect the PR has within the scientific community. If the findings of these truther papers were air tight they would be able to pass through the peer review process, but they don't because they can't.
Also Popular Mechanics did a rather extensive series of tests that replicated several aspects of the pentagon attack that was televised on the Nat geo channel I believe. You probably can find that special here on youtube. While it is not a peer reviewed study it is rather convincing in a number of aspects and lays to rest a number of problems most truthers have with the Pentagon attack...
@vadimcream first you said go look at peer review. I did and found papers that talked about how inconclusive it was and sent you the paper that is very very detailed. Then you want me to watch popular mechanics tv show. I watched that a loooong time ago and if you'd like watch popular mechanics pentagon flying circus and see why I am still not convinced.
@vadimcream just so you know i was not the one to flag or remove your comments. I looked up peer reviewed papers on the pentagon and found many saying it is inconclusive what hit the pentagon and how was it possible for it to be hit at all. Here's a link to the 20 page paper i just read.
I hadn't reached the middle of your vid when I left the first comment... You are totally underestimating the number of people that would have to be complicit in this operation. You can debate about the number of people that would have to be involved in the execution but there is no debating that the number of people involved in the COVER UP would be in the thousands. The number of scientists alone that have conducted PEER REVIEWED work, that has been accepted by other PR scientists is huge.
journalof911studies(dot)com/volume/2009/WhatHitPentagonDrLeggeAug(dot)pdf. If you have a peer reviewed paper that explains what happened at the pentagon then pass it on please.
I removed one of my comments because it was a duplicate... Your link does not go thru for me, maybe send it as a PM. Since you are siting something from the journal of 911 studies however I'm fairly certain that it will be, like others I've seen on this site, a study that was not passed through a REPUTABLE peer review journal... I recommend watching some of DPR Jones recent vids on thermite as they go explain a bit about these shady supposed peer review publishers.
@vadimcream Once again you don't need thousands. maybe the towers did fall because of the planes. I'm sure they had something to do with it. Thats not what I'm saying. all i'm saying is the rest of the story is odd and still not explained by our government. no vids, no plane, no explaination, which leads me to be a "fence sitter." all I am saying is there is reason to doubt and you don't need the help of thousands to pull this off.
When you factor in the people who made it happen, those who would have found out about it as they aided the anylization/coverup, on top of the random people who undoubtedly would have been told about it by some of the guilty participants along the way--- there are simply TOO MANY PEOPLE TO PAY OFF.
The only way that such a thing could be pulled off is if a supernatural element was involved, or if these people were brainwashed like stormtroopers into collusion, which of course is ridiculous.
@vadimcream again you seem to think that the only way to hide something is pay off everyperson in the world. let me see if I can hide a conspiracy. "alright I am the Big Man in charge. ok workers anything that looks even remotely suspicious i want brought directly to me for further investigation by my team. Don't analysis it or even pick it up let me and my team investigate. alright lets get this place cleaned up." So how many ppl in this scenario do I have to "pay off"
Not that simple dude. There are tons of people who were involved in the clean up process, who were involved in scrutinizing the debris, who were involved in conducting peer review studies on why the towers fell in the manner they did, and so on and so on.
Even if there were people who were told "don't anylize this" as you seem to think occurred, don't you think someone would have come forward and confessed that they were ordered not to investigate? Your ideas are ridiculously simplistic.
@vadimcream A clean up person is not an analysis. If A head department said we are trying to collect evidence and decipher what happened here. If you come across anything suspicious please don't touch it and contact an expert." That would sound fishy to you? As a person there to help that would sound really plausibel and in fact thats what they do in CSI. Tell the cops don't taouch the fin evidence and let experts do their job. I'm not tlaking about the towers. i'm talking about the pentagon
Yes, that sounds extremely suspicious, it'd be a huge red flag, but even if it wasn't, are you telling me anyone who had perpetrated that shit would take the chance of using people who just MIGHT see something and put two and two together??? And who is overseeing this plan? It still requires a large scale effort/man power just to coordinate and execute. Fail.
@vadimcream once again when ppl do ask questions or put some thing together they are called crack pots and disrespectful. again how does bernie madoff pull off a billion dollar ponzi scheme against bankers and millions of people? how did the enron directors do what they do? how do companies sell products with known defects and not get caught? I don't understand the it takes large scale man power. It takes a few ppl invested and a good plan
If the physics of the WTC fall was truly in question we would see leading scientists speaking out on the matter. To this day there hasn't been one scientist from a prestigious science journal that has come forward to challenge the official story. The govt couldn't pay off this many people. Issues related to this are the nail in the coffin in 9/11 CT's; if you think about the # of people it would take to pull a lie of this magnitude it becomes impossible to believe it could ever be perpetrated.
Very good point with the airplane over Washington and that no videos were recorded. Not a single little video, not any second with an airplane on it! Very strange and suspicious. I completely agree with you, to be critic with the official version of the happenings.
dugall1 11 months ago
I read half way into the first comment. No energy for this anymore. Can't do it... You should look into common characteristics shown by conspiracy theorists, as well as the tendencies they exhibit in building their cases. You just might see a few similarities. Have a good one.
vadimcream 1 year ago 2
@vadimcream you should read what dictionary com and realize i don;t have a case I just stated why i feel warranted to not believe what was told to me. That isn't a conspiracy theory
philosophyman76 1 year ago
Scratch my original low ball estimate of 20 people in the squad. To take down a plane and CLEAN IT UP, that would take at least 75 people. A plane creates a fuck-ton of wreckage that takes multiple machines/man power to take care of.
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream how do you disappear a plane. i don't know. I'm a business owner. Give me unlimited resources and years of planning time and I bet you I could find a way. Again you keep leading down this trail. I am NOT claiming to know what happened. Nor have I stated what I think happened. BECAUSE I DON"T KNOW. Henceforth the term Fence-Sitter. Maybe it was a plane. All i am saying is I am not convinced by the evidence and here are my reasons why.
philosophyman76 1 year ago
@philosophyman76
No dude. You can't make a plane disappear. Anywhere you'd shoot it down in US airspace many people will potentially see it. There is no safe place to do this. There are multiple radar systems and tracking devices and such on 747s. There is also no way to know what the trajectory of the massive wreckage would be and a clean up of something like that would require massive manpower.
You would also need the participation of the FAA and all of the (cont)
(cont)
vadimcream 1 year ago
(cont)
You would also need the participation of the FAA and all of the all of the air-traffic controllers that were monitoring this situation (dozens upon dozens of them) to corroborate the story and take part in the staged events as they unfolded. And this is the only the lowest number of people that you would need to pull off JUST THE PENTAGON ATTACK. And for what? Just so that you can kill these people in a really inconvenient way when you could have just flown them into the building???
vadimcream 1 year ago
what air traffic controller would you need if the flight never took off? what air traffic controllers are there in mexico? where were the air traffic controllers when the flight was heading the wrong directon to hit the pentagon? since you think planes are constantly watched and picked up on radar. why don't they show the radar reports of them tracking the plane hitting the pentagon. THERE YOU GO. that would be proof I would like. where are those reports. what site and we can be done with this
philosophyman76 1 year ago
@vadimcream why do you keep saying it has to be Shot Down. Maybe with your limited view you can't think of a way to do it but I bet there may be people on earth who are smarter then you and me who could figure it out. Hell i bet if I was posting about how arabs with box cutters are going to hijack planes and fly them into the pentagon bbefore 9-11 happened you'd sit there and type how IMPOSSIBLE that would be and point out all the ways it wouldn't work,
philosophyman76 1 year ago
And lastly, WHY THE FUCK WOULD THEY DO THIS? HOW DOES THIS MAKE THINGS ANY EASIER? WHY NOT JUST USE THE PLANE TO RAM INTO THE PENTAGON LIKE THEY DID WITH THE TWIN TOWERS? WHY CREATE ALL THIS MESS AND INVOLVE WAY MORE PEOPLE THAN THEY NEED?
It doesn't make a lick of sense and you can continue believing it but you are only proving the fact that you are willing to believe some truly unbelievable shit in order to keep this ludicrous theory alive in your head. It's really quite strange, really.
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream Why? I'don't know. And if I guess you'll say ... you have no evidence for this and you are a conspiracy theorist. maybe they wanted to test the pentagon against a missle attack. maybe they wanted to test there own defense system. maybe they wanted to test the missle capablities in a highly populated area bc they knew an impending war was coming. You keep thinking I have this story in my head. I don't. thats what you don't get. please look up fence sitter.
philosophyman76 1 year ago
@philosophyman76 Why do you insist that you are not a fence-sitter? It sounds like you just don't want to call it out because you are afraid to embrace all of the judgments that might come with labeling yourself this.
You are not the least bit neutral (i.e. a "fence-sittler") on the matter of whether or not there was foul play involved. This is the distinction here that clearly shows that you are NOT A FENCE-SITTER in the least.
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream One more time for the incredibly slow. You can call me what ever you want. you want to label me because I don't agree with you. thats fine. You have asked me hundreds of questions not relating to what my video is . My response is I don't know or here's what could have happened. These are not my theories or what I believe. Here I don't believe and earthquake knocked over the pentagon. why no evidence. My vid for the last time says i don't believe the govt story and here's why.
philosophyman76 1 year ago
it doesnt say "Heres what I think happened at the pentagon." I don't create a theory. I asked questions. Thats how you get answers. If you would have said here is a site with video of a plane, or here's why there is no footage and emp went off and all electrical stuf went off... or anything valid then I would say ok i get it. But you haven't. You just asked me a lot of crap that i don't have answers for. I DON"T HAVE ANSWERS BC I DON"T KNOW WHAT TO BELIEVE AKA FENCE-SITTER
philosophyman76 1 year ago
Let me help you with definitions-
Conspiracy theorist - Someone who has a theory of an conspiracy
Fence-sitter - Someone who listens to both sides and is not convinced of either arguments.
you seem to think I am the former. And I am not. The only reason I am arguing the conspiracy is bc you are agruing against it. If you were arguing for the conspiracy I would probaly make the same agruements you are posing. my original problems still remain. where is the video or pictures
philosophyman76 1 year ago
@pman76
You ARE convinced that there was foul play. Just the fact that you do not believe the official story alone proves that you are not a fence-sitter. You believe lies were told and unknown wrong-doings were comitted. So you are NOT a fence-sitter. Get it?
And your definition of CT is broad, trite and severely under-defined.
The reason why this IS A CONSPIRACY theory is because this truly is an event that could not have been accomplished with out the participation of thousands.
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimnow your going to tell me what I am CONVINCED of? Wow thats amazing. you can read minds through a computer screen. No wonder you are so sure of the story you watched bush on tv read his mind and realized he was telling the truth. well damn it that's enough evidence for me. I am no longer on the fence.
my definition of CT is what the meaning is. Look up the word conspiracy then look up the word theory and put them together. you can go to dictionary . com. oh wait is that a CT website too
philosophyman76 1 year ago
An entire plane of people can not disappear over the US. Every commercial airplane can be detected by multiple radar systems and there is simply no way we could lose track of an entire plane. If it was shot down anywhere it would leave a huge trace (I actually thought in your scenario they would have been flown somewhere else and THEN killed because I thought for sure you'd realize that what a problem/undertaking the cleanup of the wreckage would be... Your scenario fails...
vadimcream 1 year ago
You claim this operation would not need many people to execute and yet this creates a scenario in which (AT LEAST) a whole squad of soldiers must have been needed. How do you even begin to trust that your soldiers would keep quiet about doing something so heinous? Do you think they use mind erasers like in "Men in Black" or something? You can go with this theory if you want, but it immediately reduces your "not many people knew about it" theory to shreds.
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream a squad of soldiers? To do what? kill people on a plane? shoot down a plane? Make a plane crash? this takes a squad??? let me see if I can think up a way to destroy a plane and not need a squad. And lets go with your Squad theory. CIA agents do the heinous things in other countries all the time in the name of freedom. Mercenaries do crap all the time for money (oh but the government doesnt have any money) If you did this thing and were paid off by the government would you come...
philosophyman76 1 year ago
Oh, so now they shot an entire plane down with no one catching on or it showing up on radar charts. That's plausible! How many people do you think a squad consists of? No. A squad can consist of 20 soldiers. (AND yes it would take at least that to coordinate and CLEAN UP.... And I guess there was someone on the flight that forced some passengers to make 911 calls from their phones and lie to their loved ones about being hi-jacked minutes before they crashed... Yeah, thats what happened.
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream forward and say something??? Why. Your wealthy beyond belief and you would want to become one of the most hated people on the planet and probably be assassinated by the government while in jail. There are people on this planet who could care less about killing people. Hitmen, some solders, mercenaries, etc. you you have 10-15 ppl like this and you can fire a missle, crash a plane, and do the dirty work. then you just cover it up bc ppl say no way
philosophyman76 1 year ago
@vadimcream let me ask you if you had the choice and you had to choose btwn 10 people dying or 100 which would you choose. They have to die. Most likely 100. You do understand that there are people who commit atrocities in the name of saving lies, or protecting the nation. Hell how many ppl have we killed in other countries bc they are a "threat" people can justify thingsand delude themselves. How did hitler get all those troops to kill thousands of innocent ppl? Delusion of what is right.
philosophyman76 1 year ago
Your question sheds no light on things. Hitler's time was far different, as there was a deep seeded hatred for jews. In our day there is no climate to make these murders of so many innocents remotely acceptable. Like a Christian pushing the reliability of the Noahs Arc you are ignoring HUGE things that make this scenario completely implausible just to accomadate your hairbrained theory that has no basis in reality. The mental gymnastics you are doing to keep this BS alive are astounding.
vadimcream 1 year ago
It just creates a million more problems and for what? Why would they do this? It makes things SOOOOOO much harder and involves so many more people to do it that way. They obviously had no problem using this method with both the planes on the twin towers. So why would they, for the pentagon alone, decide to fly the passengers of flight 77 somewhere else and kill them, instead of using them and the plane in the crash itself? It makes no rational sense whatsoever. NONE.
vadimcream 1 year ago
@blackjerryboymetal i actually just watched the first 3 minutes. and I'm sorry I thought you were going to show me a vid of a plane hitting the building. but it seems you decided to send me a vid of crap. fine. I guess you should watch the vid you are commenting on and then go to the dictionary and find out what a fence sitter is. again in your mind things are black and white. either believe what i beleive or your an idiot. that's fine. Hey the FED is great for the economy. Govt says so.
philosophyman76 1 year ago
@blackjerryboymetal yes i do know there is an airport in washington DC. hey i also know there are two in NYC and they are not far from Manhattan but you know what you can't see manhattan from those airports and if a plane is about to crash anywhere not near the airport I guarantee you people catch it on film.
philosophyman76 1 year ago
@blackjerryboymetal the tsunami that hit indonesia by the way was travelling 620 mph. and tsunami waves make very little sound bc they dont crash like regular waves. yet an unexpected tsunami wave we have pictures and video of in the middle of back water third world country. Security cameras are ALWAYS on. you don't have to "whip them out." and washington dc is a tourist area with thousands of people with cameras watching their kids, school trips, people looking at bldgs
philosophyman76 1 year ago
@blackjerryboymetal no i saw that vid. Which was released first as 4 separate shots. then was released as a short vid. of course you can't make anything really out (especially a 747 in that vid. So you're story is that one low level security camera is the ONLY camera near or around THE PENTAGON. That vid makes my point. There are hotels, banks, stores etc in that area and a 757 flying that low would have been caught by more then just that one camera somewhere in washington DC or a tourist
philosophyman76 1 year ago
@blackjerryboymetal and this has what to do with nobody taking a picture? again why don't you watch my video one more time. I know what the "official story" was and my point that started everything is i have some problems with it and I think my skepticism is warranted. The problem is you and many ppl see the issue as white and black. either you belief the govt 100% or anyone who asks questions is a conspiracy tin foil hat person. And that simple isnt true.
philosophyman76 1 year ago
@blackjerryboymetal so you're helping me make my point. Every airport has highways going to it. people kids, tourist etc seeing a plane going 500 mph so low to knock over light poles don't take a picture. No security camera anywhere has video footage. No cameras or video is watching the skies over our nations capital an hour after we are attacked in NYC??? this makes sense to you somehow.
philosophyman76 1 year ago
@philosophyman76
Dude, you are shameful. You don't believe that people actually perished on flight 77? Google a list of victims from that flight for gods sake then look each one up. They all have obits and tributes all over the internet. Their poor families have been interviewed in countless news footage and docs. Are you saying this is all acted/fabricated? What a terrible way to treat the memory of those that died in such a tragic way.
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream Ok lets assume there is a conspiracy just for a moment. if there was do you think they were gonna have to kill people? Yep. So ppl being REALLY dead I get. yes those 64 are dead. Not questioning that. HOWdid they die? is that dishonoring their names? Pat tillman died in this stupid war. The govt made up this whole story. the family didnt beleive it and found it it was friendly fire. what jerks. they should hv just listened to the story and not dishonoured their son
philosophyman76 1 year ago
@philosophyman76
Pat Tillman? That is so off topic. Pat Tillman died under friendly fire and therefore your theories are more credible how? The Pat Tillman thing actually proves my point more than yours. In the case of Pat Tillman PEOPLE CAME FORWARD AND SUPPLIED EVIDENCE. That was a much smaller scale cover-up, and yet they couldn't keep it under wraps.
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream yeah the evidence came forward AFTER the family kept asking and pursuing answers. it wasn't like people came to them and said "Hey you know the govt story isn't correct." I read their book. They had to keep following leads and interviewing ppl on their own. my point though was it's not an insult to ask questions about how someone died. It's a dishonor if they're are questions and ppl don't ask them and say shut up and believe the story
philosophyman76 1 year ago
@philosophyman76 You clearly were asserting earlier that the passengers of flight 77 did not exist, and now you are so quickly flip-flopping on the matter because like all of your paranoid assertions it was a claim based on piss poor logic and research. All of your claims and connections are this off-base and shallow.
Why did you make this video? You are clearly not a "fence-sitter" but you are a total waste of time.
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream please quote or show where i said. "the passengers of flight 77 never existed" you seem to have no problem quoting me in your other comments. I said a plane didnt hit the pentagon. if you watch my video again I am not claiming to know what happened nor am I saying here's what happened. i'm saying bc of these reasons I am justified in not believing all of the governments story thats what the vid says and you have given me no evidence or argument to change that stance
philosophyman76 1 year ago
@vadimcream
Please tell me, so there is no mistaking this time, what you are claiming happened. Are you saying they were murdered and their remains were spread at the crash scene? What are you asserting?
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream I have a 5:49 sec video that says exactly what I'm asking. I am not making a documentary nor am I writing a book and investigating 9-11. A question is not an assertion as much as you wish to make it one. if you wish to hear what my questions are again press play. as far as do I think the bodies were planted, evidence removed, how did they or could they pull it off? I don't have all those answers which is why the video is about 9-11 FENCE SITTERS
philosophyman76 1 year ago
@blackjerryboymetal touchdown. yes. so they go 500 and then are instantly at 100 when they touch down? i got evidence go look at youtube and type plane crashes. you'll see a bunch of people not in tourist area, not in rush hour traffic and saw a plane doing something weird and videod it. amazing. again we have vid of the 1st plane hitting tat 500 mph at thousands of feet in the air. if no one really cares why are you commenting? you know nothing about me and what I have read or watched
philosophyman76 1 year ago
@blackjerryboymetal There are highways and roads leading to the pentagon right? There are tourists that go to the pentagon and Washington DC right? If I see and HEAR (bc planes are noisy at 500 mph) a 747 plane flying even 200-500 feet above the ground , I may take a picture. I may turn my camera on. you are on a website of people who catch all kinds of stuff. this is a major event. NO ONE takes a piture, No surveilance cameras see this. Nothing except 4 fuzzy snap shots thats it? Really
philosophyman76 1 year ago
@blackjerryboymetal so um how did we get video and pictures of a planes flying 500 mph into the first tower??? You do understand that in order to hit the pentagon a building that not a skyscraper on the side it would have been flying pretty low to the ground. I live right next to JFK airport. it is not hard a phone or camera and catch a plane going 500 mph as it comes in for landing. people do it all the time. if one is flying real low with no ariport around i think someone would catch it
philosophyman76 1 year ago
@philosophyman76
"it is not hard a phone or camera and catch a plane going 500 mph as it coms in for landing. people do it all the time. if one is flying real low with no ariport around i think someone would catch it".
Yeah, except that it was 2001 at the time. Still cams were just starting to be the norm with cells. Video on phones were super rare (if they were around at all)... And they were very shitty, it would be very difficult to see something so far away on an old celvidcam from '01.
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream
Correction. Cell phones with video were not around in 2001.
"Cell-phone cameras have been around for nearly five years. Nokia, the world's No. 1 cell-phone maker, was first to integrate a camera in 2001, said Nokia France spokesman Xavier des Horts. That initial model took only stills, but built-in video soon followed and is now near-standard."
Now that's from USA TODAY but they are probably in on the conspiracy too right?
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream why do you people think there has to be thousands of people involved to get stuff done? Did everyone in enron know what the directors were doing? How do bernard Madoff steall BILLIONS of dollars from corps, banks, people,etc and nobody found out about it for years? anyway they did have cameras in 2001 right? there was video in 2001 i remember. we are talking about the nations capitol during a time that a known attack was taking place. No security cameras, nobody has a camera?
philosophyman76 1 year ago
@philosophyman76
The fact that you equate ENRON (a case where plenty of people actually DID COME FORWARD with EVIDENCE ) and 9/11 (a tremendous operation so much larger in scope than the ENRON debacle it's ridiculous) shows that you aren't thinking straight.
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream the point is they pulled it off. That is my point and they did a crappy job and got caught. you know what the problem is. we don't see all the ones that actually get pulled off we just see the failures and say well see it didnt work. How much more money, power, and influence can some key people in the US govenment use?
philosophyman76 1 year ago
Actually those are good vids worth watching but the one I actually meant for you to check out is "Atheists vs. 9/11 Truther" from PiroNiro.
vadimcream 1 year ago
I suggest checking out the Atheist Experience's segments titled "Conspiracy Theories: Was 9-11 an inside Job?" posted on Ffreethinker's Youtube channel. Not just because of the main subject matter, but more because they elaborate on peer review and will probably give you a good idea of what I'm talking about...
vadimcream 1 year ago
@philosophyman76
I have to second the vadimcream's comment that the 'journal of 9/11 studies' is not a serious scientific journal. It is a blog that masquerades as a journal. It was created to fool people like you into believing that there is a veneer of academic plausability to their conspiracy theories.... sort of like the Intelligent design proponents in a world where evolution is a scientific fact.
DrunkAtheist 1 year ago 2
@DrunkAtheist that's fine all i did was type in peer review pentagon crash and that came up first. I asked him for another paper and got nothing. I don't get the whole this thing is not reputable or this is not reputable so don't listen to that. it's like the attacks theist use on darwin. He was a racist and womanizer so his theory is wrong. No i don't care if the drunk on the street gives me the info if its right its right, if its wrong tell me what wrong with it.
philosophyman76 1 year ago
@philosophyman76 The journal of 9/11 studies presents pro conspiracy articles reviewed by other conspiracy theorists in order to give the appearance of a peer reviewed scientific journal. It is only peer reviewed by other conspiracy theorists If you read some of the articles and compare them to actual scientific work done by skeptis regarding 9/11 you'll see the difference. It just trots out the same debunked stuff about the pentagon and tower 7 but it seems more convincing to the public.
DrunkAtheist 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@p76
" I don't get the whole this thing is not reputable or this is not reputable so don't listen to that. "
You don't fully understand the mechanism of peer review, how it works, and what makes it such a reliable standard for truth.
"it's like the attacks theist use on darwin"
Again, it's quite ironic that you say this because a phony PR journal gives a bogus stamp of authenticity, it's the EXACT tactic creationists often resort to. This supposed PR group is a wolf in sheep's clothing.
vadimcream 1 year ago
Also since you seem to think the pentagon attack is so fishy, what do you make of the fact that you can find a full list of those who perished in flight 77 on the internet along with several testimonials for each passenger. Do you think that these names and testimonies are all fabricated?... These are real people dude, and honestly I think it's an insult to their memory that nearly a decade later people such as your self act as though they probably didn't exist.
vadimcream 1 year ago
If you are going to post the Flying Circus vid then you should at least post the actual PM video as well so the viewer can disseminate the actual information from what is being imposed upon it. I'm kind of amazed that you made a deal of saying that you had a hard time taking PM's word for it and then exclusively post only some random youtubers video refuting PMs work as if that person is any more reputable...
vadimcream 1 year ago
Dude, again, the peer reviews that publish the journal for 911 studies are bullshit. They are the scientific equivalent of the types of places creationists go to get PHDs. To this day there has not been a single paper that has passed the scrutiny of a legitimate peer review process.
vadimcream 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@vadimcream
that is "To this day there has not been a single paper that has passed the scrutiny of a legitimate peer review process from the 9-11 truth movement."
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream so what paper would you like me to read. You say go look at peer review. i type that in and you don't like those peer reviews. instead you want me to watch a tv show and the writers of a magazine and take their word? so again you find me a peer review paper that you deem as credible and I'll read it. you only seem capable of giving me things that are just a illegit. I took the time to read the 20 pg paper and found no problems. If you provide me with a counter paper I'll read that 2
philosophyman76 1 year ago
@philosophyman76 I never said to go look at a peer reviewed paper, it wouldn't hurt but when did I tell you to go look at one? I said that the truthers have not been able to publish one in a reputable peer review journal. And I don't decide what is legitimate, that has to do with the respect the PR has within the scientific community. If the findings of these truther papers were air tight they would be able to pass through the peer review process, but they don't because they can't.
vadimcream 1 year ago
The best way to tell a good lie is to mix in a lot of truth
philosophyman76 1 year ago
Also Popular Mechanics did a rather extensive series of tests that replicated several aspects of the pentagon attack that was televised on the Nat geo channel I believe. You probably can find that special here on youtube. While it is not a peer reviewed study it is rather convincing in a number of aspects and lays to rest a number of problems most truthers have with the Pentagon attack...
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream first you said go look at peer review. I did and found papers that talked about how inconclusive it was and sent you the paper that is very very detailed. Then you want me to watch popular mechanics tv show. I watched that a loooong time ago and if you'd like watch popular mechanics pentagon flying circus and see why I am still not convinced.
philosophyman76 1 year ago
@vadimcream just so you know i was not the one to flag or remove your comments. I looked up peer reviewed papers on the pentagon and found many saying it is inconclusive what hit the pentagon and how was it possible for it to be hit at all. Here's a link to the 20 page paper i just read.
philosophyman76 1 year ago
I hadn't reached the middle of your vid when I left the first comment... You are totally underestimating the number of people that would have to be complicit in this operation. You can debate about the number of people that would have to be involved in the execution but there is no debating that the number of people involved in the COVER UP would be in the thousands. The number of scientists alone that have conducted PEER REVIEWED work, that has been accepted by other PR scientists is huge.
vadimcream 1 year ago
journalof911studies(dot)com/volume/2009/WhatHitPentagonDrLeggeAug(dot)pdf. If you have a peer reviewed paper that explains what happened at the pentagon then pass it on please.
philosophyman76 1 year ago
@philosophyman76
I removed one of my comments because it was a duplicate... Your link does not go thru for me, maybe send it as a PM. Since you are siting something from the journal of 911 studies however I'm fairly certain that it will be, like others I've seen on this site, a study that was not passed through a REPUTABLE peer review journal... I recommend watching some of DPR Jones recent vids on thermite as they go explain a bit about these shady supposed peer review publishers.
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream
*Correction* - I meant citing, not siting...
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream Once again you don't need thousands. maybe the towers did fall because of the planes. I'm sure they had something to do with it. Thats not what I'm saying. all i'm saying is the rest of the story is odd and still not explained by our government. no vids, no plane, no explaination, which leads me to be a "fence sitter." all I am saying is there is reason to doubt and you don't need the help of thousands to pull this off.
philosophyman76 1 year ago
When you factor in the people who made it happen, those who would have found out about it as they aided the anylization/coverup, on top of the random people who undoubtedly would have been told about it by some of the guilty participants along the way--- there are simply TOO MANY PEOPLE TO PAY OFF.
The only way that such a thing could be pulled off is if a supernatural element was involved, or if these people were brainwashed like stormtroopers into collusion, which of course is ridiculous.
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream again you seem to think that the only way to hide something is pay off everyperson in the world. let me see if I can hide a conspiracy. "alright I am the Big Man in charge. ok workers anything that looks even remotely suspicious i want brought directly to me for further investigation by my team. Don't analysis it or even pick it up let me and my team investigate. alright lets get this place cleaned up." So how many ppl in this scenario do I have to "pay off"
philosophyman76 1 year ago
Not that simple dude. There are tons of people who were involved in the clean up process, who were involved in scrutinizing the debris, who were involved in conducting peer review studies on why the towers fell in the manner they did, and so on and so on.
Even if there were people who were told "don't anylize this" as you seem to think occurred, don't you think someone would have come forward and confessed that they were ordered not to investigate? Your ideas are ridiculously simplistic.
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream A clean up person is not an analysis. If A head department said we are trying to collect evidence and decipher what happened here. If you come across anything suspicious please don't touch it and contact an expert." That would sound fishy to you? As a person there to help that would sound really plausibel and in fact thats what they do in CSI. Tell the cops don't taouch the fin evidence and let experts do their job. I'm not tlaking about the towers. i'm talking about the pentagon
philosophyman76 1 year ago
@philosophyman76
Yes, that sounds extremely suspicious, it'd be a huge red flag, but even if it wasn't, are you telling me anyone who had perpetrated that shit would take the chance of using people who just MIGHT see something and put two and two together??? And who is overseeing this plan? It still requires a large scale effort/man power just to coordinate and execute. Fail.
vadimcream 1 year ago
@vadimcream once again when ppl do ask questions or put some thing together they are called crack pots and disrespectful. again how does bernie madoff pull off a billion dollar ponzi scheme against bankers and millions of people? how did the enron directors do what they do? how do companies sell products with known defects and not get caught? I don't understand the it takes large scale man power. It takes a few ppl invested and a good plan
philosophyman76 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
If the physics of the WTC fall was truly in question we would see leading scientists speaking out on the matter. To this day there hasn't been one scientist from a prestigious science journal that has come forward to challenge the official story. The govt couldn't pay off this many people. Issues related to this are the nail in the coffin in 9/11 CT's; if you think about the # of people it would take to pull a lie of this magnitude it becomes impossible to believe it could ever be perpetrated.
vadimcream 1 year ago
Comment removed
vadimcream 1 year ago
good stuff. no theories from you, just info
floatingtater 1 year ago