Hmm what should I say to you. You are blind. Deaf. You lack knowledge. You are as Dead. Truly you have judged the inmates of the all highest paradise unjustly. Peering at them through the eyes of ignorance. I am a true wittness and you have indeed not even a dewdrop of understanding re: this topic. Repent for Baha u llah is truly who he proclaims to be. You will indeed lay down in Sorrow if you continue turning the seekers away from him Who is the All Glorious. Turn while there is still time or
@randallhoffman1 If I, a mere lowly human, can succeed in turning away followers of a god . . . . . with a single youtube video . . . . . then that's not much of a god.
@shaztekk an learn that Punjabi is different from Persian.
When he began his 1st video with the disgusting confusion about Punjabi and Persian,,, I wondered if anybody cares about his opinions !? Then I looked at the "dislikes" and it explained a loooooooooooooooooot :D :D :D
@kalin666 Exactly. :) Maybe one reason why God wouldn't force people not to deviate is similar to why teacher's don't give their students the answers to tests.
@Norge0000 the testing of acquired knowledge and the following of moral commandments are 2 entirely different things, especially when the failure to do so results in ETERNAL PUNISHMENT. Your analogy is specious and fundamentally flawed.
@shaztekk so they reneged the concept of judgment in the afterlife while simultaneously claiming a religious lineage with the abrahamic faiths . . . . . BULL SHIT
One thing that is testable about religions is prophecy...either they come true or they don't. There are many many prophecies that have come true, many regarding scientific discoveries, from the Baha'i Faith. That is the Biblical criterion of if a prophet is true or not. Many Baha'i prophecies are currently coming true, ex...Russia and China in '09 were pushing for a universal currency. Looking to see if they've come true would end purely philisophical debates. Look into them...
@aaronlee75 That's BS, China has been systematically undervaluing the worth of it's currency for decades. The europeans are light years ahead of both Russia and China in adopting a world currency with their use of the Euro. Prophecy FAIL
God would have it in His power to keep everyone within one religion. The reason for this deviation is to allow for free will. It is also due to a changing understanding of God as humanity's understanding and knowledge grows. The law of religion has 2 parts...social law which changes, and spiritual law which remains consitant. You are mentioning prophesy in this...what about Bahai prophecies about science that have come true? Nuclear power, using poisons to treat illness, space travel...etc
@kalin666 No, but others like the specific fall of Napoleon III, the rise and fall of Communism, warning the world about the dangers of nuclear power 120 years ago. *Shrug* but whatever. I didn't say that Baha'is were going to make things happen...I said that Baha'is knew that they were going to happen. Often it's an organic process. One world gvt...League of Nat->U.N. &NATO (maybe EU) ->world commonwealth...also made 120 years back durring age of empires. Well, disagreeing is ok. Peace
If the religious beliefs of mankind are contrary to science and opposed to reason, they are none other than superstitions and without divine authority,for the Lord God has endowed man with the faculty of reason in order that through its exercise he may arrive at the verities of existence. Reason is the discoverer of the realities of things, and that which conflicts with its conclusions is the product of human fancy and imagination.'Abdu'l-Bah'a Whats your opinion on this staement? rep with video
@jrandall1968 Sure, that sounds reasonable. But with reason being our tool to discover truth, what role does a deity have except to sit back and watch? A useless god is hardly a god at all, another term should be used to describe such a creature.
Reason is the first faculty of man, and the religion of God is in harmony with it. Baha'u'll'ah has removed this form of dissension and discord from among mankind and reconciled science with religion by revealing the pure teachings of the divine reality. This accomplishment is specialized to Him in this Day.- 'Abdu'l- Bah'a Whats your opinion on this staement?
I am noticing a lot in the way of claims and not a lot in the way of justification. You say "oh this sounds like bullshit" but all my logical training in philosophy tells me that you have no logical training. This is how it works. You state your premises, and from them you derive a claim of some kind. Don't get me wrong, most people both bahai and not bahai don't know their ass from their elbow when it comes to making a good argument, but in the future please try harder in your rebuttles
My foot it isn't a rigid logical argument! Seriously. My god man, without logical argument what do you have? You have a lot of assholes spewing bullshit. I like to think that the people arguing AGAINST god would at least pretend to be more than the so called morons they argue against. What I here coming from both sides is a lot of hot air, and not a lot of logical argument. Maybe thats why nothing seems to get accomplished. Leave the proper philosophy to the logicians.
There are ALOT of very reasonable people that beg to differ. But lets assume your premise, that ALL arguments for AND against are vacuous ( I take it you mean they hold no weight, not they they are in the typical "vacuous" sense of being true but that their truth is such that it makes no difference). Then I would ask why you even have a youtube channel and are even bothering with this, or any discussion. We call this being hoist by your own petard. Try again.
Well it's simple, I think people committing violent acts in the name of their god is a bad thing. I also think they do it for poorly justified reasons (aka blind faith). I think blind faith is a bad thing, ALWAYS. I also think that all concepts of deities from all religions rely on blind faith, as they have no real way of proving to be true without said god making a personal appearance. Therefore, my stance on religion happens to be atheist, I do not except their gods, period.
Hmm... I agree that blind faith is a bad thing (Im no fan of kierkegaard) but "think that all concepts of deities from all religions rely on blind faith" is a false premise. Kant gives alot of probabilistic reasons why faith in a higher power can be beneficial, or if Kant is a little heavy for you then I would recommend Pascal's Wager (sometimes called pascal's gambit). To truly be athiest, you have to KNOW that god doesn't exist, which is just as silly as claiming you know he does.
Belief being beneficial has NO BEARING on whether the claims are true or not. Pascal's wager is junk, the perfect example of a false dichotomy, which god Pascal, yours? Not to mention it claims that "faking it", rather than honest doubt, is better, like Yahweh wouldn't know the difference! I can't know god does not exist, just like I can't know that I'm not a brain in a jar, in this way being agnostic is trivially true, we're all without knowledge. It's BELIEF that matters, and our actions.
Ok, so given the premise that we are all without knowledge, where does that leave us? You have claimed to be atheistic though it sounds like you are more agnostic. Given the present doubt, why NOT go with a probabalistic style logic? Bearing in mind that your concept of god being a sentient guy, or an unknowable force that pervades the galaxy, is not what I am driving at. Why NOT believe in a higher power given the prime mover argument, the watch and the watchmaker argument etc etc
Atheist is about belief, I don't believe in a god. Agnostic is about knowledge, I am without knowledge. I am both, but being agnostic is like being alive, it's true by definition. Probability is an excellent way determine the likelihood of an idea with less than perfect knowledge, in fact, it's the only way we claim to know ANYTHING because we're not omniscient. If the prime mover argument and the watchmaker argument are convincing to you, I suggest further study into the physical sciences.
Well it seems that those terms are NOT mutually exclusive. While I am grateful for having learned something new, I have to ask how much more about the physical sciences should I study? I spent 8 years in college (switching majors), and am currently working on a graduate level program that will put me in charge of running nuclear reactors. Dawkins and the like are excellent scientists but I am afraid they are terrible philosophers. If you think science is so anti-god, why claim agnosticism?
Evolution in a broad sense, how complex systems arise through blind processes over time and the natural laws of physics, whether applied biologically or astronomically or chemically pretty much answer any questions that beg a designer or creator. And of course first mover arguments conveniently fail to explain the nature of the mover, or how such a thing that defies the initial assumptions is a satisfactory answer without logically imploding the argument.
Ok, so you admit you don't know. Fair enough. But you think that science pretty much answers any questions that beg a designer or creator. I take it (correct me if I am wrong) that you mean it is entirely possible that the universe could exist sans deity, though it is just as likely that whatever deity exists (or whatever unknowable force) simply made the universe the way that it is such that it would be a self sustaining machine, with no "evidence trail" directly implicating him?
Yes, the hidden useless god is a concept that cannot be logically verified or disproved. That however, is not the god of any religion. It's a logical construct we made on the spot for no good reason EXCEPT to be beyond provability or disprovability. Now, would we have even bothered if we were ignorant of the abrahamic religions? I don't think so.
hhmm...the hidden useless god. So you would rather believe that the universe has always just been here, or that there was nothing....which exploded into something? I have always had a hard time believing that everything around me, even science itself, being SO well ordered and making SO much rational sense could have happened accidentally. This "hidden useless god" is as much a logical construct as any god or any scientific theory. It seems like you are playing fast and loose with terms here.
The hidden useless god is a logical construct, but not like a theory, which is tested and scrutinized and used to accurately understand reality. The steady state theory of the "always was" universe is not backed up by evidence. The Big Bang does conform to all the data, an expanding universe that started at a point. What caused that is currently in the real of speculation, we have no data from "before space and time started". Think about that, before time started . . . . it's nonsense.
if god reveals itself just like that... *bing*... then perhaps you can consider it like showing a student the answer to the maths problem they are working on. now, of course, it's useful to have the answer, but the practice in this case is more beneficial than the ultimate answer.
likewise, humans may benefit from following a religion that doesn't present easy answers and quick fixes, like (e.g.) jesus arriving in clouds. too easy. what benefit is this?
precisely, it *would* be a "great plus", as would be looking in the back of a text book for the answer. however, it still wouldn't meet another need. consider: a supervisor watches over your shoulder as you work... you therefore don't slack, don't steal, etc. does this show you're a good employee? no: it's only when you're given a real choice that you can demonstrate your trustworthiness. likewise, it's through lack of knowing that you can demonstrate your faith.
ultimately it depends on what you consider important... why demonstrate faith, etc? is it in any way useful?
this goes to the core of baha'i belief: which is that we're given a task in this life to develop spiritual qualities. it's through methods such like this (not having a supervisor observing your actions/believing in god due to what you see written and recognising that it's divinely inspired rather than making quick and easy decisions based on miracles), that we develop spiritually.
thanks for taking the time to look at the baha'i faith.
please note, if you were going to teach children in school, would you teach them in the first grade and consider the job done because you were capable of teaching perfectly? do you think that children can grasp advanced calculus in one year? therefore can you see the point of view that god teaches humanity and advances its civilization in stages, in accordance with its capacity? see the baha'i perspective on progressive revelation?
There is no exact place to fit this statement. So, I'm randomly placing it here.--
The Baha'i Faith teaches that "knowledge is the fruit of life".--
Fruits can be poisonous or life giving.
Knowledge can be right and it can be wrong.--
It is left to the individual to decide for himself or herself where a given tidbit of knowledge should be placed in their belief system. (the individual search after truth)--
For me, that puts a different light on; "Yea shall know them by their fruits".
Ok yes the Bahá'i Faith teaches that God is an Unknowable Essence, but is'nt that like the true nature of everything. Take the universe for example - I know a certain percentage of what it is about, the forces at work, the celestial bodies in it etc, but will I or indeed humanity ever really fully know it in its entirity? Just because I can't know it fully doesn't mean I have to give up trying to investigate and know it more.
that's a bit of a stupid comparison, the universe is apparently real . . . . unless of course this is all some sort of solipsistic illusion, but I find that quite unlikely.
It is no surprise then that Baha'i faith proclaims Baha'u'llah to be the second coming of Christ. Jesus Himself warned us in the gospel of Matthew concerning the end times: "Then if any one says to you, 'Lo, here is the Christ!' or 'There he is!' do not believe it. For false Christ's and false prophets will arise and show great signs and wonders, so as to lead astray, if possible, even the elect" (Matthew 24:23-24).
It is no surprise then that Baha'i faith proclaims Baha'u'llah to be the second coming of Christ. Jesus Himself warned us in the gospel of Matthew concerning the end times: "Then if any one says to you, 'Lo, here is the Christ!' or 'There he is!' do not believe it. For false Christ's and false prophets will arise and show great signs and wonders, so as to lead astray, if possible, even the elect" (Matthew 24:23-24).
If you take all religions literally, they will almost certainly be wrong. But truth has more than just a literal definition. I believe that, as an atheist, you place a high value on truth. It's the subjective nature of this truth that is bothersome. Maybe. But it doesn't make it wrong. Subjectively, I can find priceless spiritual truth in more than a handful of religious dispensations, even atheistic ones. You might find similar truths and call them philosophy or ethics.
Not to me. But I can understand that your need for truth is with a capital T. One snippet view of experience is not enough. I applaud that. Who wouldn't admire someone of principle seeking after truth? It seems a fundamental disagreement. But in the real, objective things, I doubt we disagree on much.
Jesus Christ is COMING SOON and Baha'is must REPENT of their blasphemy and false teachings.
The reason we can be very sure that Jesus hasn't come yet is that biblical prophecies are unfolding before our eyes. The things that Jesus predicted would happen are happening now, but there are still more things to come. So Jesus couldn't be here yet, according to the Bible. Plus it says when He comes every eye will see Him returning to the Earth the way He left it - Acts 1:9-12
nice comments guys. so in your opinion, how wise it is to try to teach a 1 year old calculus? probably not wise on the teacher's part, probably even a waste of time. so is it safe to assume that IF we had a creator of this magnificently complex, yet seemingly fragile universe, that He/She/It might also be wise in how much we are ready to hear? Point being the idea of progressive revelation from a Baha'i perspective is along these same lines. Humanity can be likened to this 1 year old baby.
this analogy is flawed, this assumes that a 20 year old from 4000 years ago does not have the same mental capacity as a 20 year old from today, and that simply isn't the case.
No that simply isn't the case!! jsvantner is not talking about the mental capacity of humans, rather the spiritual understanding of the people back then, the world society(the one year old) 4000 years ago was not mature enough to comprehend and practice the laws and guidelines of moral conduct set down by God 2000 years ago hence the guidelines today. Therefore the only way for us to grasp these laws, with the fact that God has given us free will, is if we were to be Taught progressively!
Nonsense! This is nonsense. Actually, it's a desperate rationalization to make a religion conform to known data. Teaching a society about the correct form of religion quickly is too difficult for Yahwei? It's beyond his power? Hell, all he would have to do is show up and give a speech! Wait, that's too limited . . . Zap the knowledge into our ancestors heads with magic lasers! This notion is far less ridiculous than the limitations you've placed on him to make him make sense. Some god!
Hahaha nonsense!! nah i don't think so!! Life is about tests and learning from them by ourselves!! The fact that God hasn't zapped our brains with lasers in order to live the right life is another sign of His love!! You have two feet and you expect your Father to walk for you! No, God wants us to learn for our selves, the truth about His revelation and only then can you see with your own eyes and not through the eyes of others, His full glory!!
there is PLENTY of room for basic human moral failings left, don't change the subject. This isn't about morality, it's about truth. God is real or he isn't, a religion is right or it isn't, morality is a completely different subject.
Truth that you have to seek for yourself!! To learn the truth is a reward for your efforts!! if you wanna know truth heres one for you, 'All religions actually complement each other but people are bombarded with theologies of deception made up by man! Man is the blame! God sends messengers(prophets) to re-establish truth!
seeking truth is a noble pursuit, your idea however that all religions compliment each other is SHIT. That's like saying that the Aristotle idea of the 5 basic elements and the modern day periodic table actually compliment each other. They are in inherent conflict, as are religions.
In a literal sense, they are in conflict. Two differing creation myths, for example, seem to conflict. Just as relativity can create apparent contradictions. But when all the data is in, we see that the paradoxes are explained. These creation myths served their purpose. They enabled the people to connect with God in their own way. It doesn't matter at all if the story actually happened.
You are starting with your own assumptions about how God works. God MUST have this personality you describe, where he does things your way (which you presume to be more efficacious). Since he doesn't act like this, he cannot exist.
Let's use scientific principle here and say, look to the evidence. If there is a God, he certainly doesn't act like that. He's a God of process and mystery. There are a bunch of different religious messages. What are their common themes?
that people make up stupid shit to explain what the don't yet understand. That people see intention and agency where none exist. that superstition is universal as we fear what we don't control.
I'd be glad to teach you a bit about it; send me a message sometime.
By the way, that site is hardly a reliable source for accurate information. Eric Stetsen once claimed to be the fulfillment of a prophecy made by John Carré, another Baha'i deviant. Only read Baha'i sources, not those of "orthodox" sects. ;)
A lot of what you say pertaining to the non-existence of God has to do wih the fact that He doesn't "show" Himself. The belief behind this is that if God were to show Himself, then you woud not have to choose to worship Him; atheists would have their clear-cut physical proof and the whole concept of sin and salvation would become useless because everyone would have to believe.
I guess that depends on how much fear God instilled in you.
Analogy: if a man told you not to do something bad and that if you were to do this, he would strip the flesh from your body, dissect your muscles as slowly and painfully as possible, break every bone all while keeping you intact enough to live would you sin?
That is in no way a Bahai belief, but a physical analogy aiding our reason why people would not sin.
I'd argue that a religion that constantly revises itself is at least an honest attempt to update the Truth as it becomes available. Doesn't make it infallible etc. just progressive, and perhaps much more intelligent than most traditional forms of religion.
Pretty good. Although you never really explained WHAT the social function of religion is. I assume you would've said "to cope with death" (or something generally equivalent), but...did you have something else in mind?
I have a few ideas, but no real studies have been done on the subject, hence Daniel C. Dennet's book "Breaking the Spell". I would think group cohesion, certainty, direction, fear of the unknown including death, and attempt at moral population control, not to mention keeping the leaders both political and religious in power.
breaking the spell is great. check out daniel dennett, there is lots of stuff about him on youtube. he came up with the theory of memes / memetics, opened the whole field of research, and that enabled him to explain where religions come from. its an antitheistic science book, religion gets closely analyzed like doctors analyze a disease.
I'm not thru with it yet, it doesn't flow as well as some books do. I think Dawkins and Okaku are better authors, or maybe I secretly hate philosophers . . . any way 3 out of 5 so far, it might get better as I go. I'll let you know if I change my score.
Sure there are cults, and as an ex-Bahai I agree the Bahai Faith has elements who digress into cults like any other religion, but there plenty of dickhead scientists in academic ivory towers and quantitative objective cult leaders in corporations and industries doing the SAME FUCKING THING.
Let me rephrase that: It seems you are not getting the concept of "checks & balances" between religion & science being a means to ethical maintenance.
"dickhead scientists in academic ivory towers and quantitative objective cult leaders in corporations and industries doing the SAME FUCKING THING." What are you talking about? And the only difference between a cult and a religion is the number of members.
I'm saying science is not infallible alone. The end doesn't always justify the means in scientific investigation of truth. History is riddled with unethical practices in science for political ends or corporate greed, such as human experimentation or even animal experimentation. Some people need somekind of prayer or meditation to maintain a pure conscience of justice. If your milage is a bad experience growing up with relgion, all the more power to you for being unaffiliated with religion.
BUT FOR those who are convinced it is useful. It is a legitimate form of truth. (albeit exclusively for "those people") and if you furthermore look into some patterns with the religions throughout history, you just might find the concepts that DON'T deviate from the truth. (i.e. the golden rule cliche "wish unto others as you would have them wish unto you")
kalin666, you seem way too fixated on objective quantitative scientific experiments based on the five tangible perceptions (sight, smell, touch, taste, & sound), to be believe in any kind of religion having any redeeming values.
Who can honestly describe reality? GoogleVideo "Alan Watts - The Art Of Meditation" put it very cleverly in terms atheists like you should be able to appreciate: "Reality isn't material -- that's just an idea. Reality isn't spiritual --- that's just an idea [[[sound of a bell or gong]]]
You see? We all know what reality is but can't describe it. Just as we all know how we beat our hearts and shape our bones but cannot say how it is done. "
Truth is true whether we know what it is or not. Agents having knowledge of truth is irrelevant. Reality is like a play, we're all in different seats, we might remember different things, but we were all watching the same 1 thing.
Again, you contridict both yourself and the Bahai concept of the agreeance of science with religion. If truth is absolute, then the science we live by today would have to be named conclusion, but as you said yourself, it is progressive. There is more contriction I've found in your rebuttals than you believe exist between the religions Baha'is claim to be veritable.
science revises itself because it started from a point of ignorance and has progressed incrementally to "slightly less ignorant". What's the contradiction in that?
that's the whole point! a system made by us would be imperfect and need constant revising. a system made by a god would need no such revising, it would be ABSOLUTELY correct from it's creation. a god who can't even get his own religion right is not a god at all.
Exactly! We are imperfect! We cannot fully comprehend the magnitude of God's revelation, so there comes a point when we stop benefiting from His word usually because the people distort the laws to fit their own comprehension and deviate from the message's original intent and this is when God sends another Manifestation. He is not revising what's been revealed, but rather progressively revealing and elucidating on the points that mankind has misunderstood and thusly contorted.
he's all powerful but he can't get a book right? that's the stupidest thing I've ever heard. It's more likely that prophets hear voices because they're suffering from mental illness, either that or they are charlatans.
The Book is perfect, but after the passing of the Prophet, man gradually twists the meaning to fit his own limited understanding. So, to answer straightforewardly, no; the Book is right.
Hah, well.. I'm sure I will and would, but how about this: you tell me what problem(s) you have with the book and I'll do my best to explain it in light of the Baha'i writings. Or better yet, if you post a video with a few of your concerns then I'll respond.
Well let's start at the beginning, Genesis is a joke. The name of God Yahwei was taken from an earlier sumerian religion, Yahwei is one of seven children, the Tree of Life, Baal is his brother. He also creates women twice, the first time with Adam, the second time making Adam sleep then stealing one of his ribs to magically make Eve.
you're right, I was just assuming it would get approved right away, I'll change that. I made a video Bahai This! and this is a response to a response to that . . .
you are so right, i never even thought of that arguement. i can't go back, yeah i felt that today. apparently, i just never understood and i need to go back. i think i understand quite fine now actually.
Hmm what should I say to you. You are blind. Deaf. You lack knowledge. You are as Dead. Truly you have judged the inmates of the all highest paradise unjustly. Peering at them through the eyes of ignorance. I am a true wittness and you have indeed not even a dewdrop of understanding re: this topic. Repent for Baha u llah is truly who he proclaims to be. You will indeed lay down in Sorrow if you continue turning the seekers away from him Who is the All Glorious. Turn while there is still time or
randallhoffman1 9 months ago
@randallhoffman1 If I, a mere lowly human, can succeed in turning away followers of a god . . . . . with a single youtube video . . . . . then that's not much of a god.
kalin666 9 months ago
You sir, need to read a book.
shaztekk 10 months ago
@shaztekk an learn that Punjabi is different from Persian.
When he began his 1st video with the disgusting confusion about Punjabi and Persian,,, I wondered if anybody cares about his opinions !? Then I looked at the "dislikes" and it explained a loooooooooooooooooot :D :D :D
drparisa 2 months ago
School teachers failing students is nonsensical. They have the power to make sure their students never fail a test. ;)
Norge0000 1 year ago
@Norge0000 not true, if a child comes from an abusive, neglectful or otherwise bad home environment, I'm not sure there is much that a teacher can do
kalin666 1 year ago
@kalin666 But they could still give them the answers to the exam and see to it that they score an A+ every time. They don't have to fail them.
Norge0000 1 year ago
@Norge0000 cheating?!?!? what type of education is this!?!
kalin666 1 year ago
@kalin666 Exactly. :) Maybe one reason why God wouldn't force people not to deviate is similar to why teacher's don't give their students the answers to tests.
Norge0000 1 year ago
@Norge0000 the testing of acquired knowledge and the following of moral commandments are 2 entirely different things, especially when the failure to do so results in ETERNAL PUNISHMENT. Your analogy is specious and fundamentally flawed.
kalin666 1 year ago
@kalin666 the Baha'i faith says no such thing about eternal punishment, read a book.
shaztekk 10 months ago
@shaztekk so they reneged the concept of judgment in the afterlife while simultaneously claiming a religious lineage with the abrahamic faiths . . . . . BULL SHIT
kalin666 10 months ago
One thing that is testable about religions is prophecy...either they come true or they don't. There are many many prophecies that have come true, many regarding scientific discoveries, from the Baha'i Faith. That is the Biblical criterion of if a prophet is true or not. Many Baha'i prophecies are currently coming true, ex...Russia and China in '09 were pushing for a universal currency. Looking to see if they've come true would end purely philisophical debates. Look into them...
aaronlee75 1 year ago
@aaronlee75 That's BS, China has been systematically undervaluing the worth of it's currency for decades. The europeans are light years ahead of both Russia and China in adopting a world currency with their use of the Euro. Prophecy FAIL
kalin666 1 year ago
God would have it in His power to keep everyone within one religion. The reason for this deviation is to allow for free will. It is also due to a changing understanding of God as humanity's understanding and knowledge grows. The law of religion has 2 parts...social law which changes, and spiritual law which remains consitant. You are mentioning prophesy in this...what about Bahai prophecies about science that have come true? Nuclear power, using poisons to treat illness, space travel...etc
aaronlee75 1 year ago
@aaronlee75 those 3 examples have been mentioned in fiction by authors as well, was Jules Verne a prophet? He never claimed to be . . . . .
kalin666 1 year ago
@kalin666 No, but others like the specific fall of Napoleon III, the rise and fall of Communism, warning the world about the dangers of nuclear power 120 years ago. *Shrug* but whatever. I didn't say that Baha'is were going to make things happen...I said that Baha'is knew that they were going to happen. Often it's an organic process. One world gvt...League of Nat->U.N. &NATO (maybe EU) ->world commonwealth...also made 120 years back durring age of empires. Well, disagreeing is ok. Peace
aaronlee75 1 year ago
If the religious beliefs of mankind are contrary to science and opposed to reason, they are none other than superstitions and without divine authority,for the Lord God has endowed man with the faculty of reason in order that through its exercise he may arrive at the verities of existence. Reason is the discoverer of the realities of things, and that which conflicts with its conclusions is the product of human fancy and imagination.'Abdu'l-Bah'a Whats your opinion on this staement? rep with video
jrandall1968 1 year ago
@jrandall1968 Sure, that sounds reasonable. But with reason being our tool to discover truth, what role does a deity have except to sit back and watch? A useless god is hardly a god at all, another term should be used to describe such a creature.
kalin666 1 year ago
Reason is the first faculty of man, and the religion of God is in harmony with it. Baha'u'll'ah has removed this form of dissension and discord from among mankind and reconciled science with religion by revealing the pure teachings of the divine reality. This accomplishment is specialized to Him in this Day.- 'Abdu'l- Bah'a Whats your opinion on this staement?
jrandall1968 1 year ago
I am noticing a lot in the way of claims and not a lot in the way of justification. You say "oh this sounds like bullshit" but all my logical training in philosophy tells me that you have no logical training. This is how it works. You state your premises, and from them you derive a claim of some kind. Don't get me wrong, most people both bahai and not bahai don't know their ass from their elbow when it comes to making a good argument, but in the future please try harder in your rebuttles
Imjustsumdude01 2 years ago
oh COME ON! Speculation about the nature of a GOD isn't a rigid logical argument.
kalin666 2 years ago
My foot it isn't a rigid logical argument! Seriously. My god man, without logical argument what do you have? You have a lot of assholes spewing bullshit. I like to think that the people arguing AGAINST god would at least pretend to be more than the so called morons they argue against. What I here coming from both sides is a lot of hot air, and not a lot of logical argument. Maybe thats why nothing seems to get accomplished. Leave the proper philosophy to the logicians.
Imjustsumdude01 2 years ago
Arguments for are vacuous and arguments against are vacuous, so where then does that leave us?
kalin666 2 years ago
There are ALOT of very reasonable people that beg to differ. But lets assume your premise, that ALL arguments for AND against are vacuous ( I take it you mean they hold no weight, not they they are in the typical "vacuous" sense of being true but that their truth is such that it makes no difference). Then I would ask why you even have a youtube channel and are even bothering with this, or any discussion. We call this being hoist by your own petard. Try again.
Imjustsumdude01 2 years ago
Well it's simple, I think people committing violent acts in the name of their god is a bad thing. I also think they do it for poorly justified reasons (aka blind faith). I think blind faith is a bad thing, ALWAYS. I also think that all concepts of deities from all religions rely on blind faith, as they have no real way of proving to be true without said god making a personal appearance. Therefore, my stance on religion happens to be atheist, I do not except their gods, period.
kalin666 2 years ago
Hmm... I agree that blind faith is a bad thing (Im no fan of kierkegaard) but "think that all concepts of deities from all religions rely on blind faith" is a false premise. Kant gives alot of probabilistic reasons why faith in a higher power can be beneficial, or if Kant is a little heavy for you then I would recommend Pascal's Wager (sometimes called pascal's gambit). To truly be athiest, you have to KNOW that god doesn't exist, which is just as silly as claiming you know he does.
Imjustsumdude01 2 years ago
Belief being beneficial has NO BEARING on whether the claims are true or not. Pascal's wager is junk, the perfect example of a false dichotomy, which god Pascal, yours? Not to mention it claims that "faking it", rather than honest doubt, is better, like Yahweh wouldn't know the difference! I can't know god does not exist, just like I can't know that I'm not a brain in a jar, in this way being agnostic is trivially true, we're all without knowledge. It's BELIEF that matters, and our actions.
kalin666 2 years ago
Ok, so given the premise that we are all without knowledge, where does that leave us? You have claimed to be atheistic though it sounds like you are more agnostic. Given the present doubt, why NOT go with a probabalistic style logic? Bearing in mind that your concept of god being a sentient guy, or an unknowable force that pervades the galaxy, is not what I am driving at. Why NOT believe in a higher power given the prime mover argument, the watch and the watchmaker argument etc etc
Imjustsumdude01 2 years ago
Atheist is about belief, I don't believe in a god. Agnostic is about knowledge, I am without knowledge. I am both, but being agnostic is like being alive, it's true by definition. Probability is an excellent way determine the likelihood of an idea with less than perfect knowledge, in fact, it's the only way we claim to know ANYTHING because we're not omniscient. If the prime mover argument and the watchmaker argument are convincing to you, I suggest further study into the physical sciences.
kalin666 2 years ago
Well it seems that those terms are NOT mutually exclusive. While I am grateful for having learned something new, I have to ask how much more about the physical sciences should I study? I spent 8 years in college (switching majors), and am currently working on a graduate level program that will put me in charge of running nuclear reactors. Dawkins and the like are excellent scientists but I am afraid they are terrible philosophers. If you think science is so anti-god, why claim agnosticism?
Imjustsumdude01 2 years ago
Evolution in a broad sense, how complex systems arise through blind processes over time and the natural laws of physics, whether applied biologically or astronomically or chemically pretty much answer any questions that beg a designer or creator. And of course first mover arguments conveniently fail to explain the nature of the mover, or how such a thing that defies the initial assumptions is a satisfactory answer without logically imploding the argument.
I'm agnostic because I'm not omniscient
kalin666 2 years ago
Ok, so you admit you don't know. Fair enough. But you think that science pretty much answers any questions that beg a designer or creator. I take it (correct me if I am wrong) that you mean it is entirely possible that the universe could exist sans deity, though it is just as likely that whatever deity exists (or whatever unknowable force) simply made the universe the way that it is such that it would be a self sustaining machine, with no "evidence trail" directly implicating him?
Imjustsumdude01 2 years ago
Yes, the hidden useless god is a concept that cannot be logically verified or disproved. That however, is not the god of any religion. It's a logical construct we made on the spot for no good reason EXCEPT to be beyond provability or disprovability. Now, would we have even bothered if we were ignorant of the abrahamic religions? I don't think so.
kalin666 2 years ago
hhmm...the hidden useless god. So you would rather believe that the universe has always just been here, or that there was nothing....which exploded into something? I have always had a hard time believing that everything around me, even science itself, being SO well ordered and making SO much rational sense could have happened accidentally. This "hidden useless god" is as much a logical construct as any god or any scientific theory. It seems like you are playing fast and loose with terms here.
Imjustsumdude01 2 years ago
The hidden useless god is a logical construct, but not like a theory, which is tested and scrutinized and used to accurately understand reality. The steady state theory of the "always was" universe is not backed up by evidence. The Big Bang does conform to all the data, an expanding universe that started at a point. What caused that is currently in the real of speculation, we have no data from "before space and time started". Think about that, before time started . . . . it's nonsense.
kalin666 2 years ago
also,
if god reveals itself just like that... *bing*... then perhaps you can consider it like showing a student the answer to the maths problem they are working on. now, of course, it's useful to have the answer, but the practice in this case is more beneficial than the ultimate answer.
likewise, humans may benefit from following a religion that doesn't present easy answers and quick fixes, like (e.g.) jesus arriving in clouds. too easy. what benefit is this?
drRamore 3 years ago
Oh I don't know, I would think verifiability in the face of objective skepticism would be a great plus for a deity . . .
kalin666 3 years ago
precisely, it *would* be a "great plus", as would be looking in the back of a text book for the answer. however, it still wouldn't meet another need. consider: a supervisor watches over your shoulder as you work... you therefore don't slack, don't steal, etc. does this show you're a good employee? no: it's only when you're given a real choice that you can demonstrate your trustworthiness. likewise, it's through lack of knowing that you can demonstrate your faith.
drRamore 3 years ago
ultimately it depends on what you consider important... why demonstrate faith, etc? is it in any way useful?
this goes to the core of baha'i belief: which is that we're given a task in this life to develop spiritual qualities. it's through methods such like this (not having a supervisor observing your actions/believing in god due to what you see written and recognising that it's divinely inspired rather than making quick and easy decisions based on miracles), that we develop spiritually.
drRamore 3 years ago
thanks for taking the time to look at the baha'i faith.
please note, if you were going to teach children in school, would you teach them in the first grade and consider the job done because you were capable of teaching perfectly? do you think that children can grasp advanced calculus in one year? therefore can you see the point of view that god teaches humanity and advances its civilization in stages, in accordance with its capacity? see the baha'i perspective on progressive revelation?
drRamore 3 years ago
There is no exact place to fit this statement. So, I'm randomly placing it here.--
The Baha'i Faith teaches that "knowledge is the fruit of life".--
Fruits can be poisonous or life giving.
Knowledge can be right and it can be wrong.--
It is left to the individual to decide for himself or herself where a given tidbit of knowledge should be placed in their belief system. (the individual search after truth)--
For me, that puts a different light on; "Yea shall know them by their fruits".
davidh715 3 years ago
Ok yes the Bahá'i Faith teaches that God is an Unknowable Essence, but is'nt that like the true nature of everything. Take the universe for example - I know a certain percentage of what it is about, the forces at work, the celestial bodies in it etc, but will I or indeed humanity ever really fully know it in its entirity? Just because I can't know it fully doesn't mean I have to give up trying to investigate and know it more.
TheWarab 3 years ago
that's a bit of a stupid comparison, the universe is apparently real . . . . unless of course this is all some sort of solipsistic illusion, but I find that quite unlikely.
kalin666 3 years ago
It is no surprise then that Baha'i faith proclaims Baha'u'llah to be the second coming of Christ. Jesus Himself warned us in the gospel of Matthew concerning the end times: "Then if any one says to you, 'Lo, here is the Christ!' or 'There he is!' do not believe it. For false Christ's and false prophets will arise and show great signs and wonders, so as to lead astray, if possible, even the elect" (Matthew 24:23-24).
copacetic5 3 years ago
Baha'u'allah does not say he is the return of christ he says hes message is the beggining of a new era.
deenz00 3 years ago
It is no surprise then that Baha'i faith proclaims Baha'u'llah to be the second coming of Christ. Jesus Himself warned us in the gospel of Matthew concerning the end times: "Then if any one says to you, 'Lo, here is the Christ!' or 'There he is!' do not believe it. For false Christ's and false prophets will arise and show great signs and wonders, so as to lead astray, if possible, even the elect" (Matthew 24:23-24).
meaculpa9r 3 years ago
If you take all religions literally, they will almost certainly be wrong. But truth has more than just a literal definition. I believe that, as an atheist, you place a high value on truth. It's the subjective nature of this truth that is bothersome. Maybe. But it doesn't make it wrong. Subjectively, I can find priceless spiritual truth in more than a handful of religious dispensations, even atheistic ones. You might find similar truths and call them philosophy or ethics.
eniuquine 3 years ago
A "subjective truth" isn't a truth at all.
kalin666 3 years ago
Not to me. But I can understand that your need for truth is with a capital T. One snippet view of experience is not enough. I applaud that. Who wouldn't admire someone of principle seeking after truth? It seems a fundamental disagreement. But in the real, objective things, I doubt we disagree on much.
eniuquine 3 years ago
Jesus Christ is COMING SOON and Baha'is must REPENT of their blasphemy and false teachings.
The reason we can be very sure that Jesus hasn't come yet is that biblical prophecies are unfolding before our eyes. The things that Jesus predicted would happen are happening now, but there are still more things to come. So Jesus couldn't be here yet, according to the Bible. Plus it says when He comes every eye will see Him returning to the Earth the way He left it - Acts 1:9-12
meaculpa9r 3 years ago
nice comments guys. so in your opinion, how wise it is to try to teach a 1 year old calculus? probably not wise on the teacher's part, probably even a waste of time. so is it safe to assume that IF we had a creator of this magnificently complex, yet seemingly fragile universe, that He/She/It might also be wise in how much we are ready to hear? Point being the idea of progressive revelation from a Baha'i perspective is along these same lines. Humanity can be likened to this 1 year old baby.
jsvantner 3 years ago
this analogy is flawed, this assumes that a 20 year old from 4000 years ago does not have the same mental capacity as a 20 year old from today, and that simply isn't the case.
kalin666 3 years ago
No that simply isn't the case!! jsvantner is not talking about the mental capacity of humans, rather the spiritual understanding of the people back then, the world society(the one year old) 4000 years ago was not mature enough to comprehend and practice the laws and guidelines of moral conduct set down by God 2000 years ago hence the guidelines today. Therefore the only way for us to grasp these laws, with the fact that God has given us free will, is if we were to be Taught progressively!
stevenmasua 3 years ago
Nonsense! This is nonsense. Actually, it's a desperate rationalization to make a religion conform to known data. Teaching a society about the correct form of religion quickly is too difficult for Yahwei? It's beyond his power? Hell, all he would have to do is show up and give a speech! Wait, that's too limited . . . Zap the knowledge into our ancestors heads with magic lasers! This notion is far less ridiculous than the limitations you've placed on him to make him make sense. Some god!
kalin666 3 years ago
Hahaha nonsense!! nah i don't think so!! Life is about tests and learning from them by ourselves!! The fact that God hasn't zapped our brains with lasers in order to live the right life is another sign of His love!! You have two feet and you expect your Father to walk for you! No, God wants us to learn for our selves, the truth about His revelation and only then can you see with your own eyes and not through the eyes of others, His full glory!!
maaelopa 3 years ago
there is PLENTY of room for basic human moral failings left, don't change the subject. This isn't about morality, it's about truth. God is real or he isn't, a religion is right or it isn't, morality is a completely different subject.
kalin666 3 years ago
Truth that you have to seek for yourself!! To learn the truth is a reward for your efforts!! if you wanna know truth heres one for you, 'All religions actually complement each other but people are bombarded with theologies of deception made up by man! Man is the blame! God sends messengers(prophets) to re-establish truth!
stevenmasua 3 years ago
seeking truth is a noble pursuit, your idea however that all religions compliment each other is SHIT. That's like saying that the Aristotle idea of the 5 basic elements and the modern day periodic table actually compliment each other. They are in inherent conflict, as are religions.
kalin666 3 years ago
In a literal sense, they are in conflict. Two differing creation myths, for example, seem to conflict. Just as relativity can create apparent contradictions. But when all the data is in, we see that the paradoxes are explained. These creation myths served their purpose. They enabled the people to connect with God in their own way. It doesn't matter at all if the story actually happened.
eniuquine 3 years ago
yeah, why would anyone worship a god that was honest with them? We need more manipulation, less honesty.
kalin666 3 years ago
Just not true, as the many different creation myths have very different meanings and entirely different purposes.
IMO, the pagan accounts copied the beliefs of Abraham - 2,000 B.C.
meaculpa9r 3 years ago
You are starting with your own assumptions about how God works. God MUST have this personality you describe, where he does things your way (which you presume to be more efficacious). Since he doesn't act like this, he cannot exist.
Let's use scientific principle here and say, look to the evidence. If there is a God, he certainly doesn't act like that. He's a God of process and mystery. There are a bunch of different religious messages. What are their common themes?
eniuquine 3 years ago
that people make up stupid shit to explain what the don't yet understand. That people see intention and agency where none exist. that superstition is universal as we fear what we don't control.
kalin666 3 years ago
I would like some clarification on this article.
I have been told that Baha�is are told to think and not to follow. I find that very beautiful and I need your help.
Thank you.
3W(dot)bahai-faith(dot)com
TomSolivin 4 years ago
why are you typing this everywhere?
musikfann 4 years ago
because I am getting no answers that are logical. I am really looking for an answer! but..
TomSolivin 4 years ago
I'd be glad to teach you a bit about it; send me a message sometime.
By the way, that site is hardly a reliable source for accurate information. Eric Stetsen once claimed to be the fulfillment of a prophecy made by John Carré, another Baha'i deviant. Only read Baha'i sources, not those of "orthodox" sects. ;)
LordAdib 3 years ago
I realized that all metaphysics was almost certainly 100% wrong all of the time. Cheers to those who continue to argue.
hobojoe3000000 4 years ago
A lot of what you say pertaining to the non-existence of God has to do wih the fact that He doesn't "show" Himself. The belief behind this is that if God were to show Himself, then you woud not have to choose to worship Him; atheists would have their clear-cut physical proof and the whole concept of sin and salvation would become useless because everyone would have to believe.
jchanceh9 4 years ago
believe yes, but not behave, so sin would still be intact.
kalin666 4 years ago
I guess that depends on how much fear God instilled in you.
Analogy: if a man told you not to do something bad and that if you were to do this, he would strip the flesh from your body, dissect your muscles as slowly and painfully as possible, break every bone all while keeping you intact enough to live would you sin?
That is in no way a Bahai belief, but a physical analogy aiding our reason why people would not sin.
jchanceh9 4 years ago
I think I would try to kill that man, he's a monster.
kalin666 4 years ago
Haha.. yeah, it's not a great analogy.
jchanceh9 4 years ago
I'd argue that a religion that constantly revises itself is at least an honest attempt to update the Truth as it becomes available. Doesn't make it infallible etc. just progressive, and perhaps much more intelligent than most traditional forms of religion.
saadaya 4 years ago
Pretty good. Although you never really explained WHAT the social function of religion is. I assume you would've said "to cope with death" (or something generally equivalent), but...did you have something else in mind?
opmbb 4 years ago
I have a few ideas, but no real studies have been done on the subject, hence Daniel C. Dennet's book "Breaking the Spell". I would think group cohesion, certainty, direction, fear of the unknown including death, and attempt at moral population control, not to mention keeping the leaders both political and religious in power.
kalin666 4 years ago
I keep hearing about "Breaking the Spell". I suppose I should go out and buy it....How highly would you recommend it (say, on a scale of 1 to 5)?
I hate how expensive books are...
opmbb 4 years ago
breaking the spell is great. check out daniel dennett, there is lots of stuff about him on youtube. he came up with the theory of memes / memetics, opened the whole field of research, and that enabled him to explain where religions come from. its an antitheistic science book, religion gets closely analyzed like doctors analyze a disease.
kurtilein3 4 years ago
I'm not thru with it yet, it doesn't flow as well as some books do. I think Dawkins and Okaku are better authors, or maybe I secretly hate philosophers . . . any way 3 out of 5 so far, it might get better as I go. I'll let you know if I change my score.
kalin666 4 years ago
Sure there are cults, and as an ex-Bahai I agree the Bahai Faith has elements who digress into cults like any other religion, but there plenty of dickhead scientists in academic ivory towers and quantitative objective cult leaders in corporations and industries doing the SAME FUCKING THING.
sk9utube 4 years ago
It seems you are not getting the concept of "checks & balances" between how religion can for some people be an ethical-maintenance means.
sk9utube 4 years ago
Let me rephrase that: It seems you are not getting the concept of "checks & balances" between religion & science being a means to ethical maintenance.
sk9utube 4 years ago
We do what we feel is right, and then attempt to justify it later. Never underestimate your gut feeling.
kalin666 4 years ago
"dickhead scientists in academic ivory towers and quantitative objective cult leaders in corporations and industries doing the SAME FUCKING THING." What are you talking about? And the only difference between a cult and a religion is the number of members.
kalin666 4 years ago
I'm saying science is not infallible alone. The end doesn't always justify the means in scientific investigation of truth. History is riddled with unethical practices in science for political ends or corporate greed, such as human experimentation or even animal experimentation. Some people need somekind of prayer or meditation to maintain a pure conscience of justice. If your milage is a bad experience growing up with relgion, all the more power to you for being unaffiliated with religion.
sk9utube 4 years ago
BUT FOR those who are convinced it is useful. It is a legitimate form of truth. (albeit exclusively for "those people") and if you furthermore look into some patterns with the religions throughout history, you just might find the concepts that DON'T deviate from the truth. (i.e. the golden rule cliche "wish unto others as you would have them wish unto you")
sk9utube 4 years ago
such commonalities don't require supernatural sources. if something works well, we'll see it manifest in self-revising systems naturally.
kalin666 4 years ago
kalin666, you seem way too fixated on objective quantitative scientific experiments based on the five tangible perceptions (sight, smell, touch, taste, & sound), to be believe in any kind of religion having any redeeming values.
sk9utube 4 years ago
Whether it's useful or not is unrelated to whether it's true or not.
kalin666 4 years ago
GOOD USE = TRUTH
sk9utube 4 years ago
truth is the accurate description of reality, stop making up your own definitions, it's the same as lying
kalin666 4 years ago
Who can honestly describe reality? GoogleVideo "Alan Watts - The Art Of Meditation" put it very cleverly in terms atheists like you should be able to appreciate: "Reality isn't material -- that's just an idea. Reality isn't spiritual --- that's just an idea [[[sound of a bell or gong]]]
You see? We all know what reality is but can't describe it. Just as we all know how we beat our hearts and shape our bones but cannot say how it is done. "
sk9utube 4 years ago
Truth is true whether we know what it is or not. Agents having knowledge of truth is irrelevant. Reality is like a play, we're all in different seats, we might remember different things, but we were all watching the same 1 thing.
kalin666 4 years ago
truth is not absolute
sk9utube 4 years ago
it is by definition
kalin666 4 years ago
Again, you contridict both yourself and the Bahai concept of the agreeance of science with religion. If truth is absolute, then the science we live by today would have to be named conclusion, but as you said yourself, it is progressive. There is more contriction I've found in your rebuttals than you believe exist between the religions Baha'is claim to be veritable.
jchanceh9 4 years ago
science revises itself because it started from a point of ignorance and has progressed incrementally to "slightly less ignorant". What's the contradiction in that?
kalin666 4 years ago
There is none and that's how progressive Religion works :)
jchanceh9 4 years ago
that's the whole point! a system made by us would be imperfect and need constant revising. a system made by a god would need no such revising, it would be ABSOLUTELY correct from it's creation. a god who can't even get his own religion right is not a god at all.
kalin666 4 years ago
Exactly! We are imperfect! We cannot fully comprehend the magnitude of God's revelation, so there comes a point when we stop benefiting from His word usually because the people distort the laws to fit their own comprehension and deviate from the message's original intent and this is when God sends another Manifestation. He is not revising what's been revealed, but rather progressively revealing and elucidating on the points that mankind has misunderstood and thusly contorted.
jchanceh9 4 years ago
he's all powerful but he can't get a book right? that's the stupidest thing I've ever heard. It's more likely that prophets hear voices because they're suffering from mental illness, either that or they are charlatans.
kalin666 4 years ago
The Book is perfect, but after the passing of the Prophet, man gradually twists the meaning to fit his own limited understanding. So, to answer straightforewardly, no; the Book is right.
jchanceh9 4 years ago
hahaha, you read that book again and tell me with that it's correct with a straight face, I dare you!
kalin666 4 years ago
Hah, well.. I'm sure I will and would, but how about this: you tell me what problem(s) you have with the book and I'll do my best to explain it in light of the Baha'i writings. Or better yet, if you post a video with a few of your concerns then I'll respond.
jchanceh9 4 years ago
Well let's start at the beginning, Genesis is a joke. The name of God Yahwei was taken from an earlier sumerian religion, Yahwei is one of seven children, the Tree of Life, Baal is his brother. He also creates women twice, the first time with Adam, the second time making Adam sleep then stealing one of his ribs to magically make Eve.
kalin666 4 years ago
Lol, you don't need a beer if everything is good...lol
Deadbirdcheese 4 years ago
The opinion that it is not possible to have access to evidence of god is agnosticism.
pdoeman 4 years ago
notice I don't call myself an agnostic
kalin666 4 years ago
i couldnt figure out what video you are responding to.
another youtube-atheist made a video about the baha'i some days ago, but i cant find the video. i guess you are responding to a response there.
you should always link the videos you are talking about in the text box ^^ always. even if your video later gets accepted as a response.
but i like your video
- kurtilein3
kurtilein3 4 years ago
you're right, I was just assuming it would get approved right away, I'll change that. I made a video Bahai This! and this is a response to a response to that . . .
kalin666 4 years ago
I really appreciate your videos. They are easily the most cogent athiest videos on youtube.
terry585 4 years ago
cogent? awesome!
kalin666 4 years ago
The exact argument I use. How do they not understand that?
Gihaal 4 years ago
"Nonsense"... that should be your catch phrase...
BlasphemyBaby 4 years ago
you are so right, i never even thought of that arguement. i can't go back, yeah i felt that today. apparently, i just never understood and i need to go back. i think i understand quite fine now actually.
thequestionmarkofGod 4 years ago
Kalin, like Kahless, is a powerful warrior for strong, Klingon valus like truth! =0
For serious, though; this was a great vid. Faved. I really hope you post more often, I missed this. =)
AtheistAaron 4 years ago
I'm usually not this energetic, must be the halloween candy. I should keep snickers handy at all times. FEAST!!!!!
kalin666 4 years ago
Kalin, powered by sugar.
Kinda like Kodocha, or Azumanga. =0
AtheistAaron 4 years ago
Yahweh is just a sick fuck, that's all. He loves to see everyone running around all confused-like.
AtheistAaron 4 years ago
Religious deviation! YES!
mwest1234 4 years ago