I went to bob jones from 2006-2009 and was literally 3 ft to the left of this video guy! I remember it like it was yesterday.. The last room closest to the library on the main floor of the alumni building.. I stayed for the whole speech, he also talked about Medicare an Medicaid and mentioned a little about our currency but not nearly as much as is mentioned today.. they should have given him a much larger room! It was packed at 50 people.. What a great man, still sanding behind the same values
Great point Dr. Paul, "what is the difference between 1 minute before a baby is born and 1 minute after the baby is born?" What insanity!!! A pregnant woman can have an abortion right up to and including the 9th month of pregnancy! That BABY can be legally murdered, [by medical procedures involving things like "saline" abortion] at full 9 months gestation! However, if the same woman gave birth to that same child and then tossed it out in the trash and it dies, she is then charged with MURDER!!!
the fact that he is speaking at BOB JONES UNIVERSITY, speaks volumns as to his stand on this. men have no part in the abortion discussion once they decide to not use a condom...sorry.
@laceydays1 Men should not get a say in abortion, but a woman should not be able to force a man into unwanted fatherhood either. Woman's Body, Woman's Choice, Woman's Responsibility.
@laceydays1 Hmmm...Let's see if we can re-gender that shall we? If she doesn't want to be a mother, she should have taken the pill. End of discussion, after that, none of her business.
@laceydays1 Instead of Ad-hominem attacks, I suggest you ask yourself; Why should a man care or defend a woman's reproductive right's when woman do not recognise, or respect men's reproductive rights? Unequal right's means unequal responsibilities.
I almost got aborted. I also could have been aborted five minutes before contractions because i was soooo early. I feel that freedom should come with choice. Not a chaotic society but what I mean is simple choices. Such as whether you want a child. Yes a person may not come into the world, but life is about responsibility and learning. I believe, even though i could have been aborted, i believe that abortion should not be a government responsibility, gov should not be in my life THAT much. yakno
People are selfish; that's the only justification. They want legal protection for themselves and their own, but the second that something is inconvenient or opposed to them, they want to take away its rights. I hate hypocrisy, and so does everyone else; you can't have it both ways. If babies don't have any value, then pretty soon NO ONE will have value. You're just opening the floodgates for genocide. Have fun with that...
@boredomstryks, until it can survive outside the mother on it's own, it is not a person. They are alive and may have all those survival INSTINCTS at that fetal stage of life, but that doesn't mean anything... they are not people yet. I value liberty above life, and according to that I'm not willing to take away the liberty of any people so you can sleep better at night. It's very possible that a beautiful human life may be taken, but liberty is more important.
No matter if you are for or against abortion, I'd have thought Ron Paul would recognize government doesn't work. Doesn't matter if it's against drugs, prostitution, imports, exports or abortions.
This will only bring back the black market of coat hangers
This is one of the few issues that I don't totally agree with Ron Paul. But I have a ton of respect of how he puts it. And I do agree that 3rd trimester abortion is wrong.
So for those that are not going to vote for Paul just because of this issue, you are really stupid. He is still the best candidate out there. Lets not forget that he said he would leave this issue to the states. So it would be the same thing if anyone else believes in abortion and lets it go to the states anyway.
Two points to be made, one, when you are born, you are given a birth certificate. Would we need to start making "conception certificates?" Also, if you're believing that life begins at conception, Mr. Ron Paul, "physician", how do you explain twins? The second twin doesn't come into play until almost FIVE weeks later...or did he miss that in medical school. Give me a legitimate argument now, please.
The legal rights of the unborn DO NOT EXIST. My life is more important than any batch of cells in my uterus. Ron Paul is a fucking cunt. He claims to be fighting for "liberty" but the reality is that he is only looking out for rich white men like himself.
LOL... that is me laughing at Ron Paul... he talks a good game about being for personal freedom... and then turns around and talks himself into telling a woman what to do with HER body. So basically he would be fine with forcing a woman to have a baby and then wouldn't require society to help with the unwanted child. What a fucking mixed up assclown.
@AnotherAgnostic Is me telling you you can't murder your baby outside of the womb intruding on your liberty? Actually, yes, it is. Because there are certain liberties we don't have. We don't have the liberty to take someone else's liberty away.
As an OB doctor, Ron Paul has a strong conviction that an unborn baby is alive and has rights inside the womb, as well as outside. Being pro-life is the most libertarian stance one can take, in Paul's opinion, and he is justified in thinking so.
@ebeatworld, you can twist it all you like but it doesn't change the facts. Ron Paul at the last republican debate showed he is fine if a 35 year old man is left to die because he doesn't have insurance... but somehow 'society' should be concerned for a clump of cells in some woman's abdomen??? That is just another example of how wacky libertarians really are... no logic. They want to go back to the old west. Sorry those days are over.
@AnotherAgnostic Way to change the subject. This has NOTHING to do with a healthcare debate. That is a separate issue. You are committing a total red herring. Protecting life is the only way you can protect liberty. People can make their own decisions in life, but they can't murder their child in the name of liberty.
@ebeatworld, it's not really changing the subject since the two points are related. What about the liberty of the woman? And you keep saying 'their child'... but it's not really a child. If your religious you probably think it's a child as soon as the sperm meets the egg... but if you're a reasonable person you know that there is a great difference between a child and a fetus.
@AnotherAgnostic Oh, okay. So if you call it a fetus, it makes it all right to kill it. As I already said, no one has the liberty to take another's liberty away. No mother has the right to kill her child. So the whole what about the mother's rights argument doesn't fly. You're just justifying it by calling it a fetus. Life does begin at conception. That's a scientific fact.
And Ron Paul's position about healthcare has nothing to do with whether it's okay to kill an unborn child.
@ebeatworld, you're mixing up the issue again... You said 'CHILD' before now your saying 'LIFE'... two separate things completely. Life has no liberty. We all consume life in order to live thus it's called the cycle of life. A child does have rights in our society but as a child and not a fetus. A child is different from a fetus. This is a fact, unless, like I said before you are religious and think a fetus is a person. Basically abortion is a religious issue for many people.
@AnotherAgnostic Whether you believe a "fetus" is a person or just a piece of trash is actually a separate issue. You were accusing Ron Paul of being a hypocrite about liberty. Ron Paul, being a OB doctor, believes a baby's life begins at conception. You can call it a fetus, you can call it a blob of jelly, you can call it whatever you want. But if Paul does believe it is a human life, then as a libertarian, he feels the obligation to protect its liberty, bottom line.
@ebeatworld, but in order for Mr. Paul to 'protect it's liberty' would require taking away a woman's liberty based on Mr. Paul's personal 'assumption'. So basically a person has limited liberty based on Mr. Paul's personal belief... interesting. Doesn't sound like liberty to me, sounds like tyranny.
That so called 'human life' cannot live outside the mother... so basically it is not a person but just another part of the mother. I think that gives the mother 100 percent of the rights.
@AnotherAgnostic Our liberty is always limited when it comes to taking another's life. Ron Paul believes a fetus is a person. If he believes it is a person, then how does it not make sense to you that nobody, not even its mother wouldn't have the right to kill it, in his opinion?
I love how you just determine a fetus as not human if it can't survive outside of the mother. Where are you getting this from? A three-month old can't survive without the care of a mother, either. So what!?
@ebeatworld, you are not understanding what I'm trying to say. Just because Ron Paul "believes" a fetus is a person doesn't make it so. But... because he "believes" it, he is willing to take liberty from a woman. Thus... Ron Paul doesn't either understand liberty or doesn't care about liberty. My personal belief is that if a fetus cannot survive without being inside the mother... then it is not a person. But even if I didn't believe that I would still respect a woman's right to choose.
@AnotherAgnostic I think it's okay to kill a baby up to five months out of the womb. According to my definition, it's not really a "person" until around then. I mean, come on. A baby just cries and is completely dependent on everyone else. It doesn't even have any real memories at that point. So therefore, don't tell me I can't kill my child at six weeks old if I decide I don't want it. How dare you interfere with my rights as a parent and tell me YOUR definition of a "person."
@ebeatworld Oh, right... so maybe by that logic, we can kill children who still haven't learned to speak, because all real people can talk, right? So maybe it should be legal to kill people who never develop certain abilities? Maybe we should just kill anyone who doesn't have an IQ of at least 90. Are you really that crazy? Or are you just trying to rile people up? Either way you're an asshole, and maybe YOU should be aborted from society.
@melbyRick@melbyRick It was from a discussion I was having with AnotherAgnostic. I was pointing out how his arguments in favor of abortion rights create a slippery slope. If you read the rest of our comments to each other, you will see my sarcasm. He was basically claiming that because some people don't believe a fetus is a person, they should have a right to abort it if they choose. And I was pointing out, by that terrible logic, I could kill my six-week old if I wanted.
@ebeatworld Some old folks can't survive without an oxygen machine or hospice to come in and take care of them. These folks apparently think we should just kill their parents or grandparents so they don't have to help take care of them, also. lol Sick.
Perfect world? You people are ridiculous. You say that we should create a perfect world before we can expect women to be good, moral individuals? So I can assume that you mean you want MEN to create this utopia for you, as if we haven't already given you everything you want? Women talk about equality and freedom of choice, but what they really mean is entitlement and priveledge; they always want more without giving anything in return.
@melbyRick, LOL... sounds like you have been dating American women... you should get a foreign wife and see what relationship is supposed to be like. I created a site for guys like you (mistercupid ... com) ... I feel your pain because I went through it myself.
@AnotherAgnostic Huh... really? And it's not just another spam-site? What kinds of girls are we talking about here? I was thinking about looking for Philippine or Korean girls, or Russian ladies maybe... I don't know, but I guess I can check it out.
@melbyRick, I made it for fun really... I married a filipina 5 years ago and have talked a lot of my friends into doing it also. So I figured why not make a site to help people. I still haven't figured out the marketing of it though. It's easy to get girls to sign up using Facebook ads but it's real expensive to advertise for guys here in the U.S.
@melbyRick, oh, forgot to add... it mostly filipina's with a mix of all the others. It's only been up for about 3 months but it's starting to get a lot of new members lately (mostly girls).
People are selfish; that's the only justification. They want legal protection for themselves and their own, but the second that something is inconvenient or opposed to them, they want to take away its rights. I hate hypocrisy, and so does everyone else; you can't have it both ways.
Restricting late term abortions to only under certain circumstances might be reasonable. But, abortion can not be totally restricted to just the first term. A law like that would not address so many issues that the mother and child are facing. Problem WAS letting the states regulate abortions. Poor women had to go to another state to have an abortion, and they could not afford it. Women wanted use their own local doctors that they knew they could trust to do a safe procedure.
Other women cant speak on my BEHALF.. just beacuase they want abortion dosent mean we all do. Men should take more responsibility and wear CONDOMS. Abortions are physically invasive and Emotionally drianing. Its not something that should be avialable to everyone. It shouldn be there as a form of contraceptive.
The Morning After Pill and a Condom dose work.
Abortions are not fun and its should not be easily avialabe to people.
Some women can not take that "after" pill. There is not one SAFE AND completely EFFECTIVE contraceptive out there, but the men still EXPECT sex. Natural ways of removing an egg before it has a chance to implant into the uterus are not allowed to be taught or shared between women. There ARE herbal methods that work quite well and are SAFER and just as EFFECTIVE as the pill. You can't tell anyone about it or publish it because it is "practicing" without a license. Change this and less abortions.
RON PAUL, WE ARE STILL WAITING FOR AN ANSWER! TELL AMERICAN PEOPLE HOW EXACTLY RU GOING TO CREATE JOBS? OK LETS SAY ALL TROOPS CAME BACK AND THEN WHAT? THEY ARE GOING TO SELL IPHONES AND BLACKBERRIES? DUDE BE A MEN, HOW RU GOING TO CREATE JOBS? POPULATION OF CHINA IS 1.4 B CHINESE WORK LIKE ROBOTS, BE HONEST TELL AMERICAN PEOPLE TO BUY UR BOOK U NEED CASH , U LOVE POWER, U LOVE CASH, U WILL NEVER CREATE JOBS, U HAVE NO ANSWER!
Why to ask women to be perfect in imperfect world?...
.
This is so disgusting to see people putting own responsibility on shoulders of poor girls...First create the perfect world and then ask the same degree of perfectness from women. We all like life, but we also like that someone else will care about them.
Also what is worse? abortion or legal system going that far to control our lifes, who knows what is better for the society at the end, Ron Paul is inconsistent there with liberty protection
@yurigglutube I don't believe he is inconsistent if you roll back to 2:00 you will hear him speak how scientifically we cannot make the decision as to when life itself begins. Also he mentions how during his time of practice if he were to hurt a fetus in anyway they had legal rights to act on him and sue him. So wouldn't he be hurting the fetus by aborting the child. If as a physician you can physically remove a fetus knowing you are ending a life or process of life, you ARE doing harm.
HERE ARE REASONS WHY RON PAUL WILL NEVER BECOME US PRESIDENT;
1) AGE. (TOO OLD TO BE A PRESIDENT OF THE MOST POWERFUL COUNTRY IN THE WORLD)
2)DOESNT HAVE ENOUGH FUNDS( SELLS HIS BOOK AND USES WORDS CONSTITUTION AND LIBERTY), THAT WILL NOT PUT FOOD ON A TABLE FOR AMERICAN PEOPLE
3)DOESNT HAVE A REAL STRATEGY ON EXACTLY HOW HE IS GOING TO CREATE JOBS(OK, LETS SAY WE WILL BRING ALL TROOPS HOME, THEN WHAT?) THEY ARE GOING TO BECOME UNEMPLOYED AND COLLECT WELFARE?
Sperm are alive before conception. Eggs are alive before conception. You know when life began? Hundreds of millions of yeas ago, and that's just here. And life has been CONTINUING ever since! Where life flowers and where the flower doesn't bloom is just part of the life of the planet. And if a mother decides not to carry a baby, that's part of life. And .. it's none of your business.
@Corporations8MyBaby Yeah, okay, so maybe the predator-vs-prey phenomenon is part of life too, and maybe it's none of our business if a woman gets raped, kidnapped, beaten or killed. Maybe we shouldn't give a fuck about anybody's life, especially the life of a single mother. Maybe child support and welfare should be chucked out the window. How about that, you "rationalist"? Let's take your ideology and run with it. See how it works out for a *civilized* society.
It really bothers me when I hear you say that Littlewolf1971.... I wish people were more optimistic on the "idea" of liberty and freedom... He is not unelectable.... The hardest thing regarding that aspect is the very thing you have just said. The idea that only a "Mainstream candidate" can not win... Disgusting....
If doctors really wanted to preserve life (i.e. embryos, why dont we just remove the embryo and grow it in a facility until we can find responsible and moral parents for the baby verses the slaughterhouse method? If these abortioners are so moral why arnt they lobbying for a more humane means to culminate their child verses the lazy method of destruction and putting a value on life? It's a shame that irresponsibility is becoming so ingrained in American culture.
@DKWegley Are you a goon of the government? I bet you're one of those assholes paid to propagate non-sense in favor of Obama. Hows the Ministry of Truth these days? You're obviously completely ignorant, or just a blind cheerleader and you blantantly give it away with this wonderful logic of yours; "A friend of liberty, justice, and freedom ....... OBAMA 2012! " Need I say more?
I like Ron Paul and I hope he wins 2012. I don't personally agree with what seems his pro life ideas. But I do think he has a point it would be better at state law.
I keep thinking of the womens right to liberty, its her own body you cant get more personal than that and the govt. has no business telling people that they have to donate their bodies to sustain another life...
The govt cant tell me i have to donate blood to save someone else's life... should be the same with abortions.
The main arguements i hear from people who are for abortion are "why bring a baby to this world just to suffer". But logically speaking, that assumption cant be made because no one knows if the baby will actually suffer or not. The point is that my mother was a poor immigrant fleeeing from a civil war in her country, she arrived with no money and no education, had she took the abortion route i would never have got a chance to work with doctors and save lives.
@MrScottCRC The main argument for me would be, some times you should accept imperfectness of the reality,
and misunderstanding that could bring you too far with fighting it and at certain point you just get it worse then it was before you intervention ... if you are trying to be too pure and clean and too perfect you will make it worse then it was ... much worse. With the abortion you do not have a choice that you might think you have, women will just put dirty stick inside...do you like that?
This is sad, we should work together to change this problem in America, people should not have to go through this. With proper education and morals this wouldn't even be an issue. We all need to be more responsible.
Abortion has come down to a scientific and moral debate about when life begins. My view is that life only begins after the early trimesters are over, but I have many friends on both sides that differ on this issue. Why don't we both compromise to one another and allow abortion to be legal, for safety's sake (women will get abortions anyways, we have to accept this reality) but after the first few trimester place a heavier limit on it? It is not up to anyone to judge views on this issue.
WOAH WOAH WOAH Ron Paul, in the 50s women who wanted abortions did it themselves or got it done by unaccredited professionals. It was dangerous and destructive. In the 50s, women were often sedated to give birth and didn't allow their bodies to do their thang. The point is clean, safe abortion services have always been needed. ALWAYS. Legalizing abortion allows for people to have safe surgeries. It also puts the choice in the hands of the woman who carries the pregnancy, not society. Rightly so.
So because the method women who chose to murder their babies at home is unsafe for them we're going to legalize child murder to make it safe?
The protection of innocent babies against murder is good and certainly if the government should defend certain liberties and rights of the living it should defend their life
You should stop taking antibiotics in that case. You are murdering bacteria, which are nothing more then cells, just like a blastocyst, with no neural network, no thoughts.
@SSTTEEAALLTTHH and is bacteria human? No it's not. How about reading a biogenisis book. Human beings only procreate human beings not bacteria, not parasites, HUMAN BEINGS. And your other comment you made on dumpster babies, people would be tried and jailed for that for murder and abandonment That's against the law weather abortion is legal or not. That is a very sick comment. Why would you even say something like that?
I notice that everyone on this forum has a beating heart, are discussing origins (when life begins),who is responsible for keeping certain hearts beating, etc. Now the fact that everyone has a beating heart should give us some clues as to the overall big story going on here. We are as far as we know the only species in the vast universe that ponders origins,destinies,and grief. We can contemplate these things because our hearts are beating. Life is a gift given with every beat of our hearts.
@asleeperj You're right life begins at cellular division but I was trying(badly I'mafraid)to point to the IMPORTANCE&UNIQUENESS of the heart compared to the rest of the body parts.It's NECCESITY. We,after being born, can lose an arm or an eye,and we're still considered human. Seeing is believing;this is why ultrasound changes hearts. But hearing a heartbeat can be pretty convincing2.You don't look lie much at 3wks, but you SOUND human,cuz you ARE human.A beating heart allows us to keep on living
@finishstrongdoc Can't argue with that...I find it so funny that all of our god given rights start at conception, except the right to life, unless of course it fit's the mood of some politician, bureaucrat, or prosecutor...
To see the sheer brutality & violence imposed on unborn helpless babies during abortion please visit the websites that pop up when you type this into your search engine:
1) abortioninstruments
2) abortionNo
3) Abort73 - look under tab “Abort73 Videos" - scroll down & watch 13th video title "This is Abortion"
7 week old embryo has beating heart, legs & arms.
Embyro & fetus are human, not just "a blob of tissue" as commonly believed
@walterygor life may begin after conception. but AFTER they're born, i'd be damned if my tax dollars go to helping these kids get free medical care.
i'm pro life. but AFTER they're born i could care less if they die. UNTIL they turn 18. THEN their life becomes precious to me again. because THEN they can join the army and fight wars for oil and gold and land for me :)
@failblorg you worthless sack of shit. You pride yourself on one of the blaring examples of hypocrisy that typify conservatives in this country. Pro-life/Pro-war, protect unborn life but you don't want to lift a finger to help a kid who should have been aborted get the medical care because his parents are fuckups.
@rjholling A true conservative does NOT believe in interventionist's wars of aggression. That is a NEOCON view. It's not hypocrisy to say that life begins at conception.
It is hypocrisy for a prosecutor to charge double murder, on a case, where a drunk driver kills a pregnant woman headed for an abortion.
Hmm. As a libertarian I cannot outright object to abortion. However, I dislike the taking of any sentient life, whether it is fetal or not (not including those who choose to die, their choice, though I would hope friends would talk people out of suicide if problems were temporary, but that is a different subject). My argument is it makes no sense for a fetus to be a person depending on the mother's opinion. It is also stupid to not promote honest birth control practices, as most antiaborts do.
wrong. "The State's purpose is to protect the life, liberty, and property/pursuit of happiness of an individual."
it has nothing to be with happiness. the 14th is suppose to protect persons, a fetus is not person...so it has no rights, but the woman is and you can't take her libberty to her body w/o due process.
since abortion was found legal under the constitution under the fed. all states must comply.
the only part when morality comes into play with law is viability.
the sole purpose of the state is to protect life, libert, adn he pursuit of happiness. its not a moral question, its a life question. even the most hardcore libertarian believes the government should make killing illegal.
No, actually according to law. Regardless of what one's moral views on abortion are, no rights according to law accrue to a person until that person is born. Reason? Most conceptions do NOT result in live births. Most conceptions end up in miscarriage, and very early in pregnancy you'd never know it happened.
And before you try the standard rebuttal, my mom is pro-choice. She's seen what happens when abortion's illegal.
no one is debating that the law states that life begins at birth. I must be confused...did you just say that conceptions do not result in live births?
If i read that you ar mentally deranged. Every living person was conceived...how can you say conceptions do not result in live births. Do you know what conception is? Its when the sperm hits the egg and a new life begins.
Everyone knows what will happen if abortions are made illegal. Millions of lives will be saved,
Conceptions result in one of three things: live births, miscarriages or abortions. If you don't understand what the word "most" means, you're in trouble. And the simple fact is, MOST conceptions never make it to nine months--and of the ones that don't, most of those are miscarried.
Getting rid of Roe wouldn't get rid of abortion. We both know that. Rich people would still have their discreet family doctors, and they'd be able to go overseas for abortions--this happened a lot back then. The non-rich would be left to healers, backalley joints, and douching with Lysol.
where are you getting this? Most conceptions result in births, not miscarriages. Unless a baby is aborted, most conceptions result in birth. I understand what you meant, its just ridiculous.
According to Georgia Perimeter College's textbook on fetal development (used in their medical science courses), 58 percent of all natural conceptions fail to implant. They never get a chance to become pregnancies. 10.5 percent of all conceptions miscarry by week 6, 3.36 percent miscarry after week 6. Total: 71.86 percent of all conceptions do not result in either birth or induced abortion.
IVF is worse: 75 percent of IVF attempts don't implant.
You need to read this: Wang X, Chen C, Wang L, Chen D, Guang W, French J (2003). "Conception, early pregnancy loss, and time to clinical pregnancy: a population-based prospective study.". Fertil Steril 79 (3): 57784.
Prospective studies using very sensitive early pregnancy tests have found that 25% of pregnancies are miscarried by the sixth week LMP (since the woman's Last Menstrual Period).Clinical miscarriages (those occurring after the sixth week LMP) occur in 8% of pregnancies.
The risk of miscarriage decreases sharply after the 10th week LMP, i.e. when the fetal stage begins.
The loss rate THEY use is calculated based on pregnancies--not conceptions. (You're not pregnant until it implants.) My rate is based on conceptions--25 percent of 42 percent is 10.5 percent of 100 percent.
To see the sheer brutality & violence imposed on unborn helpless babies during abortion please visit the websites that pop up when you type this into your search engine:
1) abortioninstruments
2) abortionNo
3) Abort73 - look under tab “Abort73 Videos" - scroll down & watch 13th video title "This is Abortion"
7 week old embryo has beating heart, legs & arms.
Embyro & fetus are human, not just "a blob of tissue" as commonly believed
Rock on, you frauds...sure, you can turn your back on the important issues of the world, but one day, conservative's selfish agenda will inevitably bite America, nay, the planet right in the ass.
sooo a woman wants a abortion and a doctor is willing to do the operation ... so tell me you pro lifers why its your fucking buisness to but your little religious beleifs and tell them NO cuz you say so
Because it's not about a woman's choice anymore once she is pregnant, it's about another human being! If she wanted to excercise "pro choice" she should have chosen to either NOT have unprotected sex OR not have sex at all!
it doesnt matter the lady getting a abortion does not think its murder the doctor does not think its murder the courts dont think its murder the only people who do ussually are religious people trying to force their religion on everybody sooo tell me why you think its not the court,s doctors, or the ladys choice but why its Your choice???
As I said previously, it does not matter what the lady, doctor, myself, nor the courts think about abortion. It ONLY matters what God thinks. Abortion is cold blooded murder not according to anyone's opinion but according to GOD'S commandments.
@rhv201 hey guess what not every one is a christian not everyone beleives in the ten commandments not everyone beleives that their even is a god.... you cant even proove that god exists but your going to force these religious beleifs on everyone else because you only care about Your beleifs
There are some who have chosen blindness. They don't "see" God because they don't want to. Their arrogance, selfishness, and lack of responsibility prevent them from the truth. That isn't my problem, it's theirs.
WOW ... next are you going to tell me that GOD is speaking through you ha 10% of americans dont beleive that there is a god and your telling me that everyone single last one of them are ingnorant fucks becasue they dont beleive what you beleive?Yes or No
First off, I don't have to "shut it", you have not authority over me whatsoever. If you had any sort of Biblical knowledge you'd know that it's not about MY opinion, it's about GOD'S commandments. You cannot bully nor intimidate me as I am not afraid of anyone.
how worried about the legal rights of small children was the god of the old testament when he either sent his holy angels or the israelites to wipe them out? just curious...
God has the right to choose when life ends, be it old age at 85, a car wreck, a miscarriage, or anything. He NEVER gives us the option to kill on a whim.
And by the way, capital punishment is NOT "on a WHIM." God has COMMANDED the execution of murderers. He has made that decision as well.
I think abortion should be illegal. Exceptions for crimes like rape.. We need to teach our kids much better in their youth and use commen sense on issues like this. Life is the greatest gift we could get. Its unimaginable to kill something i created, people got to step up and do the right thing. I look at my son and Thank God.
If you think that a zygote is a truly sacred entity, then you should be doing everything in your power to prevent the continuation of sexual reproduction. The majority of zygotes are naturally flushed from a woman's system without her even knowing. In vitro fertilization would be much more effective at saving these precious lives. Or, another way of looking at it, you should be having sex every chance you get. Think of all the lives you're denying every time you refrain from natural urges.
This question of whether you own your body and all bodies that depends on your body, or whether you only own your life and all lives within your body have an equal right to it is so important that I think the decision needs to be enshrined in a constitutional amendment.
Until the issue can be properly debated and a result produced, then yes, let the states decide. I don't think a court should have the power to make this decision alone and Roe V. Wade should be overturned.
Conceptually it is simple, a sperm by itself is nothing egg by itself nothing happens but when that sperm and egg meet you are going to get a baby. I think rape shouldn't be an exception. the only exception there should be is when another persons _physical_ (not social) life is in danger. A life for a life it's pretty simple. Rape is unfortunate but babies aren't.
The liberals force THEIR "morals" (or lack their of) on us why is that any better? BTW, it has nothing to do with religious beliefs, it has to do with God's commandments.
wtf if you beleive the ten commandments is gods word then thats your religious beleifs duh.... and how can you force your morals on someone if you dont have any, to be liberal is do be free and have no restraints... just cuz this is ur opinion that does not make it right...serousily just think about what your saying
I don't "believe" that the ten commandments are God's word, THEY ARE. That is a FACT not a belief regardless of how you try to say otherwise. It's not about my opinion nor anyone else's, it's about GOD'S will for mankind.
The Bible says that evidence (ie. proof) of God is EVERYWHERE so that men are without excuse. I don't have to point God out to anyone. You cannot see beyond your own selfishness and ego. Go back under the rock you crawled out from.
Yeah, said the self-righteous imperialist prick. Abortion isn't yet a life. It's a parasite. Yes, the little bastard is alive but abolishing abortion won't solve anything. It'll only bring about more teen pregnancies, more children born into unloving families and so on. I'm all for abortion (and licensed pregnancy for that matter) for the greater good. Whose selfish now, asswipe?
Wow, are one sick and sad individual. You have to accuse people that you don't even know of the stuff that you actually do! I personally wish that you would just leave children alone. I also think that punks like yourself TALK big and bad when they are on the internet and annonymous. It's just soo sad that you are too cowardly and don't have the testicular fortitude to actually deal with REAL people in person. Soo sad....
These are some very good points! Inheritance rights, and other legal rights (including being able to be considered victims of homicide) apply to unborn babies from conception on! So the law in fact recognizes that life begins at conception! Time to restore some clear thinking and rational consistency--not to mention moral responsibility!
Ron Paul has a great point; an especially unbiased point given that he is an OBGYN. However, morality is defined by the mean actions of a group of people and 800K+ abortions are happening every year in the US, so one could say that it is moral to have abortions. He is right in regard to the terms to when they happen. I hope that the individual states can implement a more streamline abortion process so that people aren't waitng until the fetus is viable.
I went to bob jones from 2006-2009 and was literally 3 ft to the left of this video guy! I remember it like it was yesterday.. The last room closest to the library on the main floor of the alumni building.. I stayed for the whole speech, he also talked about Medicare an Medicaid and mentioned a little about our currency but not nearly as much as is mentioned today.. they should have given him a much larger room! It was packed at 50 people.. What a great man, still sanding behind the same values
jtaylo74 1 week ago
Great point Dr. Paul, "what is the difference between 1 minute before a baby is born and 1 minute after the baby is born?" What insanity!!! A pregnant woman can have an abortion right up to and including the 9th month of pregnancy! That BABY can be legally murdered, [by medical procedures involving things like "saline" abortion] at full 9 months gestation! However, if the same woman gave birth to that same child and then tossed it out in the trash and it dies, she is then charged with MURDER!!!
Redeemedflowerchild1 2 weeks ago
the fact that he is speaking at BOB JONES UNIVERSITY, speaks volumns as to his stand on this. men have no part in the abortion discussion once they decide to not use a condom...sorry.
laceydays1 3 weeks ago
@laceydays1 Men should not get a say in abortion, but a woman should not be able to force a man into unwanted fatherhood either. Woman's Body, Woman's Choice, Woman's Responsibility.
MRA4LIFE 2 weeks ago
@MRA4LIFE if he doesn't want to be a father, he should wear a condom. end of discussion. after that, none of his business.
laceydays1 2 weeks ago
@laceydays1 Hmmm...Let's see if we can re-gender that shall we? If she doesn't want to be a mother, she should have taken the pill. End of discussion, after that, none of her business.
MRA4LIFE 2 weeks ago
@MRA4LIFE you are an idiot.
laceydays1 2 weeks ago
@laceydays1 Instead of Ad-hominem attacks, I suggest you ask yourself; Why should a man care or defend a woman's reproductive right's when woman do not recognise, or respect men's reproductive rights? Unequal right's means unequal responsibilities.
MRA4LIFE 2 weeks ago
ron paul 100% right, fuck the haters and murders of babies
writertrump 3 weeks ago
@writertrump Lol abortion is murder of babies lol, that's complete ignorance.
MrFordDoesNotLikeU 3 weeks ago
1. Inheritance rights happen at conception = false. Iy happens after a birth certificate is signed and legal identity established.
2. I could be held liable for injuring the unborn = true, but not liable to the foetus. Misleading.
The "legal status" is property, not person. Don't run with that argument, you won't like where it goes.
3. "What about the privacy of the unborn?" . . . Pardon?
4. Double homicide. Best argument for legal status of foetus. Which law is wrong? Debate.
tedtrash 4 weeks ago
@tedtrash shut up tedtrash.
writertrump 3 weeks ago
tedtrash is a moron
writertrump 3 weeks ago
I almost got aborted. I also could have been aborted five minutes before contractions because i was soooo early. I feel that freedom should come with choice. Not a chaotic society but what I mean is simple choices. Such as whether you want a child. Yes a person may not come into the world, but life is about responsibility and learning. I believe, even though i could have been aborted, i believe that abortion should not be a government responsibility, gov should not be in my life THAT much. yakno
SmileyPsycho1 1 month ago
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People are selfish; that's the only justification. They want legal protection for themselves and their own, but the second that something is inconvenient or opposed to them, they want to take away its rights. I hate hypocrisy, and so does everyone else; you can't have it both ways. If babies don't have any value, then pretty soon NO ONE will have value. You're just opening the floodgates for genocide. Have fun with that...
melbyRick 1 month ago
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@boredomstryks, until it can survive outside the mother on it's own, it is not a person. They are alive and may have all those survival INSTINCTS at that fetal stage of life, but that doesn't mean anything... they are not people yet. I value liberty above life, and according to that I'm not willing to take away the liberty of any people so you can sleep better at night. It's very possible that a beautiful human life may be taken, but liberty is more important.
AnotherAgnostic 1 month ago
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AnotherAgnostic 1 month ago
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Check this out! Great introduction to Ron Paul! Spread it around! WhyRonPaul (dot) com
brycesteinhoff 2 months ago
No matter if you are for or against abortion, I'd have thought Ron Paul would recognize government doesn't work. Doesn't matter if it's against drugs, prostitution, imports, exports or abortions.
This will only bring back the black market of coat hangers
Vitringur 2 months ago
This is one of the few issues that I don't totally agree with Ron Paul. But I have a ton of respect of how he puts it. And I do agree that 3rd trimester abortion is wrong.
So for those that are not going to vote for Paul just because of this issue, you are really stupid. He is still the best candidate out there. Lets not forget that he said he would leave this issue to the states. So it would be the same thing if anyone else believes in abortion and lets it go to the states anyway.
REDRAPIST 3 months ago
Two points to be made, one, when you are born, you are given a birth certificate. Would we need to start making "conception certificates?" Also, if you're believing that life begins at conception, Mr. Ron Paul, "physician", how do you explain twins? The second twin doesn't come into play until almost FIVE weeks later...or did he miss that in medical school. Give me a legitimate argument now, please.
kaydunk11 3 months ago
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FreedomPeace1 4 months ago in playlist More videos from HighlandMediaworks
The legal rights of the unborn DO NOT EXIST. My life is more important than any batch of cells in my uterus. Ron Paul is a fucking cunt. He claims to be fighting for "liberty" but the reality is that he is only looking out for rich white men like himself.
kodapix 4 months ago
LOL... that is me laughing at Ron Paul... he talks a good game about being for personal freedom... and then turns around and talks himself into telling a woman what to do with HER body. So basically he would be fine with forcing a woman to have a baby and then wouldn't require society to help with the unwanted child. What a fucking mixed up assclown.
AnotherAgnostic 4 months ago
@AnotherAgnostic Is me telling you you can't murder your baby outside of the womb intruding on your liberty? Actually, yes, it is. Because there are certain liberties we don't have. We don't have the liberty to take someone else's liberty away.
As an OB doctor, Ron Paul has a strong conviction that an unborn baby is alive and has rights inside the womb, as well as outside. Being pro-life is the most libertarian stance one can take, in Paul's opinion, and he is justified in thinking so.
ebeatworld 4 months ago
@ebeatworld, you can twist it all you like but it doesn't change the facts. Ron Paul at the last republican debate showed he is fine if a 35 year old man is left to die because he doesn't have insurance... but somehow 'society' should be concerned for a clump of cells in some woman's abdomen??? That is just another example of how wacky libertarians really are... no logic. They want to go back to the old west. Sorry those days are over.
AnotherAgnostic 4 months ago
@AnotherAgnostic Way to change the subject. This has NOTHING to do with a healthcare debate. That is a separate issue. You are committing a total red herring. Protecting life is the only way you can protect liberty. People can make their own decisions in life, but they can't murder their child in the name of liberty.
ebeatworld 4 months ago
@ebeatworld, it's not really changing the subject since the two points are related. What about the liberty of the woman? And you keep saying 'their child'... but it's not really a child. If your religious you probably think it's a child as soon as the sperm meets the egg... but if you're a reasonable person you know that there is a great difference between a child and a fetus.
AnotherAgnostic 4 months ago
@AnotherAgnostic Oh, okay. So if you call it a fetus, it makes it all right to kill it. As I already said, no one has the liberty to take another's liberty away. No mother has the right to kill her child. So the whole what about the mother's rights argument doesn't fly. You're just justifying it by calling it a fetus. Life does begin at conception. That's a scientific fact.
And Ron Paul's position about healthcare has nothing to do with whether it's okay to kill an unborn child.
ebeatworld 4 months ago
@ebeatworld, you're mixing up the issue again... You said 'CHILD' before now your saying 'LIFE'... two separate things completely. Life has no liberty. We all consume life in order to live thus it's called the cycle of life. A child does have rights in our society but as a child and not a fetus. A child is different from a fetus. This is a fact, unless, like I said before you are religious and think a fetus is a person. Basically abortion is a religious issue for many people.
AnotherAgnostic 4 months ago
@AnotherAgnostic Whether you believe a "fetus" is a person or just a piece of trash is actually a separate issue. You were accusing Ron Paul of being a hypocrite about liberty. Ron Paul, being a OB doctor, believes a baby's life begins at conception. You can call it a fetus, you can call it a blob of jelly, you can call it whatever you want. But if Paul does believe it is a human life, then as a libertarian, he feels the obligation to protect its liberty, bottom line.
ebeatworld 4 months ago
@ebeatworld, but in order for Mr. Paul to 'protect it's liberty' would require taking away a woman's liberty based on Mr. Paul's personal 'assumption'. So basically a person has limited liberty based on Mr. Paul's personal belief... interesting. Doesn't sound like liberty to me, sounds like tyranny.
That so called 'human life' cannot live outside the mother... so basically it is not a person but just another part of the mother. I think that gives the mother 100 percent of the rights.
AnotherAgnostic 4 months ago
@AnotherAgnostic Our liberty is always limited when it comes to taking another's life. Ron Paul believes a fetus is a person. If he believes it is a person, then how does it not make sense to you that nobody, not even its mother wouldn't have the right to kill it, in his opinion?
I love how you just determine a fetus as not human if it can't survive outside of the mother. Where are you getting this from? A three-month old can't survive without the care of a mother, either. So what!?
ebeatworld 4 months ago
@ebeatworld, you are not understanding what I'm trying to say. Just because Ron Paul "believes" a fetus is a person doesn't make it so. But... because he "believes" it, he is willing to take liberty from a woman. Thus... Ron Paul doesn't either understand liberty or doesn't care about liberty. My personal belief is that if a fetus cannot survive without being inside the mother... then it is not a person. But even if I didn't believe that I would still respect a woman's right to choose.
AnotherAgnostic 4 months ago
@AnotherAgnostic I think it's okay to kill a baby up to five months out of the womb. According to my definition, it's not really a "person" until around then. I mean, come on. A baby just cries and is completely dependent on everyone else. It doesn't even have any real memories at that point. So therefore, don't tell me I can't kill my child at six weeks old if I decide I don't want it. How dare you interfere with my rights as a parent and tell me YOUR definition of a "person."
ebeatworld 4 months ago
@ebeatworld Oh, right... so maybe by that logic, we can kill children who still haven't learned to speak, because all real people can talk, right? So maybe it should be legal to kill people who never develop certain abilities? Maybe we should just kill anyone who doesn't have an IQ of at least 90. Are you really that crazy? Or are you just trying to rile people up? Either way you're an asshole, and maybe YOU should be aborted from society.
melbyRick 1 month ago
@melbyRick @melbyRick It was from a discussion I was having with AnotherAgnostic. I was pointing out how his arguments in favor of abortion rights create a slippery slope. If you read the rest of our comments to each other, you will see my sarcasm. He was basically claiming that because some people don't believe a fetus is a person, they should have a right to abort it if they choose. And I was pointing out, by that terrible logic, I could kill my six-week old if I wanted.
ebeatworld 1 month ago
@ebeatworld Hmmm... I got ahead of myself it seems... carry on then...
melbyRick 1 month ago
@ebeatworld Some old folks can't survive without an oxygen machine or hospice to come in and take care of them. These folks apparently think we should just kill their parents or grandparents so they don't have to help take care of them, also. lol Sick.
boredomstryks 1 month ago
If abortion is murder then what is the problem? We should never murder, so don't murder children. How is this complicated?
DavidUmstattd 5 months ago
@DavidUmstattd, because abortion isn't murder.
AnotherAgnostic 4 months ago
Perfect world? You people are ridiculous. You say that we should create a perfect world before we can expect women to be good, moral individuals? So I can assume that you mean you want MEN to create this utopia for you, as if we haven't already given you everything you want? Women talk about equality and freedom of choice, but what they really mean is entitlement and priveledge; they always want more without giving anything in return.
melbyRick 5 months ago
@melbyRick, LOL... sounds like you have been dating American women... you should get a foreign wife and see what relationship is supposed to be like. I created a site for guys like you (mistercupid ... com) ... I feel your pain because I went through it myself.
AnotherAgnostic 1 month ago
@AnotherAgnostic Huh... really? And it's not just another spam-site? What kinds of girls are we talking about here? I was thinking about looking for Philippine or Korean girls, or Russian ladies maybe... I don't know, but I guess I can check it out.
melbyRick 1 month ago
@melbyRick, I made it for fun really... I married a filipina 5 years ago and have talked a lot of my friends into doing it also. So I figured why not make a site to help people. I still haven't figured out the marketing of it though. It's easy to get girls to sign up using Facebook ads but it's real expensive to advertise for guys here in the U.S.
AnotherAgnostic 1 month ago
@melbyRick, oh, forgot to add... it mostly filipina's with a mix of all the others. It's only been up for about 3 months but it's starting to get a lot of new members lately (mostly girls).
AnotherAgnostic 1 month ago
People are selfish; that's the only justification. They want legal protection for themselves and their own, but the second that something is inconvenient or opposed to them, they want to take away its rights. I hate hypocrisy, and so does everyone else; you can't have it both ways.
melbyRick 5 months ago
Restricting late term abortions to only under certain circumstances might be reasonable. But, abortion can not be totally restricted to just the first term. A law like that would not address so many issues that the mother and child are facing. Problem WAS letting the states regulate abortions. Poor women had to go to another state to have an abortion, and they could not afford it. Women wanted use their own local doctors that they knew they could trust to do a safe procedure.
iceni6 5 months ago
Other women cant speak on my BEHALF.. just beacuase they want abortion dosent mean we all do. Men should take more responsibility and wear CONDOMS. Abortions are physically invasive and Emotionally drianing. Its not something that should be avialable to everyone. It shouldn be there as a form of contraceptive.
The Morning After Pill and a Condom dose work.
Abortions are not fun and its should not be easily avialabe to people.
diyonisha 6 months ago
Some women can not take that "after" pill. There is not one SAFE AND completely EFFECTIVE contraceptive out there, but the men still EXPECT sex. Natural ways of removing an egg before it has a chance to implant into the uterus are not allowed to be taught or shared between women. There ARE herbal methods that work quite well and are SAFER and just as EFFECTIVE as the pill. You can't tell anyone about it or publish it because it is "practicing" without a license. Change this and less abortions.
iceni6 5 months ago
@iceni6
I know you are right
Men do make a big deal about sex
They think that we should open our legs even after a short while
this is the main problem really
however A CONDOM can be very effective
so my statement is correct
diyonisha 5 months ago
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RON PAUL, WE ARE STILL WAITING FOR AN ANSWER! TELL AMERICAN PEOPLE HOW EXACTLY RU GOING TO CREATE JOBS? OK LETS SAY ALL TROOPS CAME BACK AND THEN WHAT? THEY ARE GOING TO SELL IPHONES AND BLACKBERRIES? DUDE BE A MEN, HOW RU GOING TO CREATE JOBS? POPULATION OF CHINA IS 1.4 B CHINESE WORK LIKE ROBOTS, BE HONEST TELL AMERICAN PEOPLE TO BUY UR BOOK U NEED CASH , U LOVE POWER, U LOVE CASH, U WILL NEVER CREATE JOBS, U HAVE NO ANSWER!
democratsaresmart 6 months ago
Why to ask women to be perfect in imperfect world?...
.
This is so disgusting to see people putting own responsibility on shoulders of poor girls...First create the perfect world and then ask the same degree of perfectness from women. We all like life, but we also like that someone else will care about them.
Also what is worse? abortion or legal system going that far to control our lifes, who knows what is better for the society at the end, Ron Paul is inconsistent there with liberty protection
yurigglutube 6 months ago
@yurigglutube I don't believe he is inconsistent if you roll back to 2:00 you will hear him speak how scientifically we cannot make the decision as to when life itself begins. Also he mentions how during his time of practice if he were to hurt a fetus in anyway they had legal rights to act on him and sue him. So wouldn't he be hurting the fetus by aborting the child. If as a physician you can physically remove a fetus knowing you are ending a life or process of life, you ARE doing harm.
insatiablegenius 5 months ago
@DKWegley You call Ron Paul a bigot but Obama went to perhaps the most bigoted and racist church in the United States.
Fu50popo 7 months ago
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HERE ARE REASONS WHY RON PAUL WILL NEVER BECOME US PRESIDENT;
1) AGE. (TOO OLD TO BE A PRESIDENT OF THE MOST POWERFUL COUNTRY IN THE WORLD)
2)DOESNT HAVE ENOUGH FUNDS( SELLS HIS BOOK AND USES WORDS CONSTITUTION AND LIBERTY), THAT WILL NOT PUT FOOD ON A TABLE FOR AMERICAN PEOPLE
3)DOESNT HAVE A REAL STRATEGY ON EXACTLY HOW HE IS GOING TO CREATE JOBS(OK, LETS SAY WE WILL BRING ALL TROOPS HOME, THEN WHAT?) THEY ARE GOING TO BECOME UNEMPLOYED AND COLLECT WELFARE?
4) UNDERESTIMATES CHINESE POPULATION
democratsaresmart 7 months ago
Sperm are alive before conception. Eggs are alive before conception. You know when life began? Hundreds of millions of yeas ago, and that's just here. And life has been CONTINUING ever since! Where life flowers and where the flower doesn't bloom is just part of the life of the planet. And if a mother decides not to carry a baby, that's part of life. And .. it's none of your business.
Corporations8MyBaby 7 months ago
@Corporations8MyBaby if you eat a dick and swallow some sperm....it's none of my business. =)
dviewer247 7 months ago
@Corporations8MyBaby Yeah, okay, so maybe the predator-vs-prey phenomenon is part of life too, and maybe it's none of our business if a woman gets raped, kidnapped, beaten or killed. Maybe we shouldn't give a fuck about anybody's life, especially the life of a single mother. Maybe child support and welfare should be chucked out the window. How about that, you "rationalist"? Let's take your ideology and run with it. See how it works out for a *civilized* society.
melbyRick 1 month ago
It really bothers me when I hear you say that Littlewolf1971.... I wish people were more optimistic on the "idea" of liberty and freedom... He is not unelectable.... The hardest thing regarding that aspect is the very thing you have just said. The idea that only a "Mainstream candidate" can not win... Disgusting....
ProVeritas11 7 months ago
If doctors really wanted to preserve life (i.e. embryos, why dont we just remove the embryo and grow it in a facility until we can find responsible and moral parents for the baby verses the slaughterhouse method? If these abortioners are so moral why arnt they lobbying for a more humane means to culminate their child verses the lazy method of destruction and putting a value on life? It's a shame that irresponsibility is becoming so ingrained in American culture.
SuperFifthwheel 8 months ago
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@DKWegley Are you a goon of the government? I bet you're one of those assholes paid to propagate non-sense in favor of Obama. Hows the Ministry of Truth these days? You're obviously completely ignorant, or just a blind cheerleader and you blantantly give it away with this wonderful logic of yours; "A friend of liberty, justice, and freedom ....... OBAMA 2012! " Need I say more?
cucumbersalad2 8 months ago
You can gauge the moral caliber of a people by the way they treat their children. Our country is well on its way to being morally bankrupt.
montanagranny 8 months ago
Life begins at conception. By way of example: When you mix 2 parts hydrogen with 1 part oxygen, when does it become water?
TheMgyster 8 months ago
I like Ron Paul and I hope he wins 2012. I don't personally agree with what seems his pro life ideas. But I do think he has a point it would be better at state law.
I keep thinking of the womens right to liberty, its her own body you cant get more personal than that and the govt. has no business telling people that they have to donate their bodies to sustain another life...
The govt cant tell me i have to donate blood to save someone else's life... should be the same with abortions.
LittleWolf1971 8 months ago
@LittleWolf1971 Ron Paul has an ice cube's chance in hell of becoming president. Period.
rcharding 7 months ago
The main arguements i hear from people who are for abortion are "why bring a baby to this world just to suffer". But logically speaking, that assumption cant be made because no one knows if the baby will actually suffer or not. The point is that my mother was a poor immigrant fleeeing from a civil war in her country, she arrived with no money and no education, had she took the abortion route i would never have got a chance to work with doctors and save lives.
MrScottCRC 9 months ago
@MrScottCRC The main argument for me would be, some times you should accept imperfectness of the reality,
and misunderstanding that could bring you too far with fighting it and at certain point you just get it worse then it was before you intervention ... if you are trying to be too pure and clean and too perfect you will make it worse then it was ... much worse. With the abortion you do not have a choice that you might think you have, women will just put dirty stick inside...do you like that?
yurigglutube 6 months ago
Legal rights don't start at conception. He doesn't know the law.
wildgift2 9 months ago
@wildgift2 It's a figure of speech
AsILayDyingOWNS77 8 months ago
This is sad, we should work together to change this problem in America, people should not have to go through this. With proper education and morals this wouldn't even be an issue. We all need to be more responsible.
Ziofag 11 months ago
Great video - thanks for posting!
Please check out (and pass along) my video Abortion Debate 2011 - Let's help make 2011 the third pro-life year in a row!
EdificationNetwork 1 year ago
Abortion has come down to a scientific and moral debate about when life begins. My view is that life only begins after the early trimesters are over, but I have many friends on both sides that differ on this issue. Why don't we both compromise to one another and allow abortion to be legal, for safety's sake (women will get abortions anyways, we have to accept this reality) but after the first few trimester place a heavier limit on it? It is not up to anyone to judge views on this issue.
Gardeniasaur 1 year ago
I don't know, I think abortion is kind of a necessary evil but that it should only be done in the earlier stages.
dubified89 1 year ago
WOAH WOAH WOAH Ron Paul, in the 50s women who wanted abortions did it themselves or got it done by unaccredited professionals. It was dangerous and destructive. In the 50s, women were often sedated to give birth and didn't allow their bodies to do their thang. The point is clean, safe abortion services have always been needed. ALWAYS. Legalizing abortion allows for people to have safe surgeries. It also puts the choice in the hands of the woman who carries the pregnancy, not society. Rightly so.
Abolutin 1 year ago
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je24t2 1 year ago
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je24t2 1 year ago
@Abolutin
So because the method women who chose to murder their babies at home is unsafe for them we're going to legalize child murder to make it safe?
The protection of innocent babies against murder is good and certainly if the government should defend certain liberties and rights of the living it should defend their life
je24t2 1 year ago
@je24t2
Would you rather have dumpster-babies then?
SSTTEEAALLTTHH 1 year ago
@SSTTEEAALLTTHH /watch?v=kUwnMX8ht3U
SeeProfileForDetails 1 year ago
@je24t2
You should stop taking antibiotics in that case. You are murdering bacteria, which are nothing more then cells, just like a blastocyst, with no neural network, no thoughts.
SSTTEEAALLTTHH 1 year ago
@SSTTEEAALLTTHH and is bacteria human? No it's not. How about reading a biogenisis book. Human beings only procreate human beings not bacteria, not parasites, HUMAN BEINGS. And your other comment you made on dumpster babies, people would be tried and jailed for that for murder and abandonment That's against the law weather abortion is legal or not. That is a very sick comment. Why would you even say something like that?
FamousDave2186 1 year ago 2
Bob Jones University? What an unaccredited bullshit school
MarathonVeteran 1 year ago
I notice that everyone on this forum has a beating heart, are discussing origins (when life begins),who is responsible for keeping certain hearts beating, etc. Now the fact that everyone has a beating heart should give us some clues as to the overall big story going on here. We are as far as we know the only species in the vast universe that ponders origins,destinies,and grief. We can contemplate these things because our hearts are beating. Life is a gift given with every beat of our hearts.
finishstrongdoc 1 year ago
@finishstrongdoc Beating heart does NOT matter. Life begins at cellular division. That's all there is to it, ask any biologist.
asleeperj 1 year ago
@asleeperj You're right life begins at cellular division but I was trying(badly I'mafraid)to point to the IMPORTANCE&UNIQUENESS of the heart compared to the rest of the body parts.It's NECCESITY. We,after being born, can lose an arm or an eye,and we're still considered human. Seeing is believing;this is why ultrasound changes hearts. But hearing a heartbeat can be pretty convincing2.You don't look lie much at 3wks, but you SOUND human,cuz you ARE human.A beating heart allows us to keep on living
finishstrongdoc 1 year ago
@finishstrongdoc Can't argue with that...I find it so funny that all of our god given rights start at conception, except the right to life, unless of course it fit's the mood of some politician, bureaucrat, or prosecutor...
asleeperj 1 year ago
Everyone is pro-life and pro-choice, the argument is about abortion. -penn jilette
HappyGestapo 1 year ago
Pro-Choice.
USAFFountain 1 year ago
@USAFFountain
Ever wonder what abortion looks like?
To see the sheer brutality & violence imposed on unborn helpless babies during abortion please visit the websites that pop up when you type this into your search engine:
1) abortioninstruments
2) abortionNo
3) Abort73 - look under tab “Abort73 Videos" - scroll down & watch 13th video title "This is Abortion"
7 week old embryo has beating heart, legs & arms.
Embyro & fetus are human, not just "a blob of tissue" as commonly believed
ProLifeHelp 1 year ago
Yes,
life does begin at conception
walterygor 1 year ago
@walterygor life may begin after conception. but AFTER they're born, i'd be damned if my tax dollars go to helping these kids get free medical care.
i'm pro life. but AFTER they're born i could care less if they die. UNTIL they turn 18. THEN their life becomes precious to me again. because THEN they can join the army and fight wars for oil and gold and land for me :)
failblorg 1 year ago
@failblorg I think that was George Carlin
USAFFountain 1 year ago
@failblorg you worthless sack of shit. You pride yourself on one of the blaring examples of hypocrisy that typify conservatives in this country. Pro-life/Pro-war, protect unborn life but you don't want to lift a finger to help a kid who should have been aborted get the medical care because his parents are fuckups.
rjholling 1 year ago
@rjholling lol it was sarcasm :P
failblorg 1 year ago
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asleeperj 1 year ago
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@rjholling A true conservative does NOT believe in interventionist's wars of aggression. That is a NEOCON view. It's not hypocrisy to say that life begins at conception.
It is hypocrisy for a prosecutor to charge double murder, on a case, where a drunk driver kills a pregnant woman headed for an abortion.
asleeperj 1 year ago
@walterygor Life begins as cellular division... That is the way i describe it to my baby hating progressive friends.
Ron Paul has it right, again. This man ceases to amaze me in his libertarian perspective.
Thanks to Ron Paul for being a TRUE Liberal, in the Jeffersonian sense...
asleeperj 1 year ago
"its a delightful thing to bring new life into the world..." but once they are in this world they are on their own, right shithead?
jbond5150 1 year ago
@jbond5150 yeah, good argument. You can't provide for your children, just kill them!
w6p7a 1 year ago
Hmm. As a libertarian I cannot outright object to abortion. However, I dislike the taking of any sentient life, whether it is fetal or not (not including those who choose to die, their choice, though I would hope friends would talk people out of suicide if problems were temporary, but that is a different subject). My argument is it makes no sense for a fetus to be a person depending on the mother's opinion. It is also stupid to not promote honest birth control practices, as most antiaborts do.
MrHambergator 1 year ago
@HisAbsolutism
wrong. "The State's purpose is to protect the life, liberty, and property/pursuit of happiness of an individual."
it has nothing to be with happiness. the 14th is suppose to protect persons, a fetus is not person...so it has no rights, but the woman is and you can't take her libberty to her body w/o due process.
since abortion was found legal under the constitution under the fed. all states must comply.
the only part when morality comes into play with law is viability.
FREEAMERICANOW69 1 year ago
i was teetering on this subject for awhile. he just helped me establish my view.
fisharecoming 1 year ago
so then what pupose does the federal gov't serve?
tonygmilan7 1 year ago
the federal gov't cannot make stealing and murder legal. that violates life, liberty, poh.
tonygmilan7 1 year ago
so can a state make murder legal?
tonygmilan7 1 year ago
the sole purpose of the state is to protect life, libert, adn he pursuit of happiness. its not a moral question, its a life question. even the most hardcore libertarian believes the government should make killing illegal.
tonygmilan7 2 years ago
Ron Paul's a crackhead. Inheritance and all the other things he talked about accrue to the child at BIRTH, not conception.
jmowreader 2 years ago
according to you
ZakBrownrigg123 2 years ago
No, actually according to law. Regardless of what one's moral views on abortion are, no rights according to law accrue to a person until that person is born. Reason? Most conceptions do NOT result in live births. Most conceptions end up in miscarriage, and very early in pregnancy you'd never know it happened.
And before you try the standard rebuttal, my mom is pro-choice. She's seen what happens when abortion's illegal.
jmowreader 2 years ago
@jmowreader
no one is debating that the law states that life begins at birth. I must be confused...did you just say that conceptions do not result in live births?
If i read that you ar mentally deranged. Every living person was conceived...how can you say conceptions do not result in live births. Do you know what conception is? Its when the sperm hits the egg and a new life begins.
Everyone knows what will happen if abortions are made illegal. Millions of lives will be saved,
ZakBrownrigg123 2 years ago
Conceptions result in one of three things: live births, miscarriages or abortions. If you don't understand what the word "most" means, you're in trouble. And the simple fact is, MOST conceptions never make it to nine months--and of the ones that don't, most of those are miscarried.
jmowreader 2 years ago
your right on
tonygmilan7 2 years ago
@jmowreader
and a minority of women will commit unsafe abortions on themselves. Millions of lives vs hundreds, maybe thousands over an extended period of tiem?
If you argument is that more damage is done when abortion is illegal, than basic numbers are clearly stacked against you.
ZakBrownrigg123 2 years ago
Oh my.
Prior to Roe v. Wade, there are good estimates of about 1.2 million abortions per year. There were three ways to get one.
If you were rich and had a discreet family physician, you could go to him for a "menstrual extraction." Illegal but safe.
People who lived in rural areas where "healers" rather than doctors worked could use them.
People who lived in urban areas had to go to backalley, unsafe practitioners.
If Roe was overturned, that system would come back.
jmowreader 2 years ago
Addition:
Getting rid of Roe wouldn't get rid of abortion. We both know that. Rich people would still have their discreet family doctors, and they'd be able to go overseas for abortions--this happened a lot back then. The non-rich would be left to healers, backalley joints, and douching with Lysol.
jmowreader 2 years ago
@jmowreader
where are you getting this? Most conceptions result in births, not miscarriages. Unless a baby is aborted, most conceptions result in birth. I understand what you meant, its just ridiculous.
ZakBrownrigg123 2 years ago
According to Georgia Perimeter College's textbook on fetal development (used in their medical science courses), 58 percent of all natural conceptions fail to implant. They never get a chance to become pregnancies. 10.5 percent of all conceptions miscarry by week 6, 3.36 percent miscarry after week 6. Total: 71.86 percent of all conceptions do not result in either birth or induced abortion.
IVF is worse: 75 percent of IVF attempts don't implant.
jmowreader 2 years ago
@jmowreader
You need to read this: Wang X, Chen C, Wang L, Chen D, Guang W, French J (2003). "Conception, early pregnancy loss, and time to clinical pregnancy: a population-based prospective study.". Fertil Steril 79 (3): 57784.
ZakBrownrigg123 2 years ago
@jmowreader
Prospective studies using very sensitive early pregnancy tests have found that 25% of pregnancies are miscarried by the sixth week LMP (since the woman's Last Menstrual Period).Clinical miscarriages (those occurring after the sixth week LMP) occur in 8% of pregnancies.
The risk of miscarriage decreases sharply after the 10th week LMP, i.e. when the fetal stage begins.
ZakBrownrigg123 2 years ago
@jmowreader
The loss rate between 8.5 weeks LMP and birth is about two percent; loss is "virtually complete by the end of the embryonic period.
ZakBrownrigg123 2 years ago
The loss rate THEY use is calculated based on pregnancies--not conceptions. (You're not pregnant until it implants.) My rate is based on conceptions--25 percent of 42 percent is 10.5 percent of 100 percent.
jmowreader 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@jmowreader
Ever wonder what abortion looks like?
To see the sheer brutality & violence imposed on unborn helpless babies during abortion please visit the websites that pop up when you type this into your search engine:
1) abortioninstruments
2) abortionNo
3) Abort73 - look under tab “Abort73 Videos" - scroll down & watch 13th video title "This is Abortion"
7 week old embryo has beating heart, legs & arms.
Embyro & fetus are human, not just "a blob of tissue" as commonly believed
ProLifeHelp 1 year ago
Life and liberty! Well said!
I hope either Ron Paul or Pat Buchanan will run in 2012.
unknownkingdom 2 years ago
*shakes head solemnly*
Rock on, you frauds...sure, you can turn your back on the important issues of the world, but one day, conservative's selfish agenda will inevitably bite America, nay, the planet right in the ass.
You'll see, little people.
SirGomezAdams 2 years ago
sooo a woman wants a abortion and a doctor is willing to do the operation ... so tell me you pro lifers why its your fucking buisness to but your little religious beleifs and tell them NO cuz you say so
IIIArrow711 2 years ago
Because it's not about a woman's choice anymore once she is pregnant, it's about another human being! If she wanted to excercise "pro choice" she should have chosen to either NOT have unprotected sex OR not have sex at all!
rhv201 2 years ago
it doesnt matter the lady getting a abortion does not think its murder the doctor does not think its murder the courts dont think its murder the only people who do ussually are religious people trying to force their religion on everybody sooo tell me why you think its not the court,s doctors, or the ladys choice but why its Your choice???
IIIArrow711 2 years ago
As I said previously, it does not matter what the lady, doctor, myself, nor the courts think about abortion. It ONLY matters what God thinks. Abortion is cold blooded murder not according to anyone's opinion but according to GOD'S commandments.
rhv201 2 years ago
@rhv201 hey guess what not every one is a christian not everyone beleives in the ten commandments not everyone beleives that their even is a god.... you cant even proove that god exists but your going to force these religious beleifs on everyone else because you only care about Your beleifs
IIIArrow711 2 years ago
There are some who have chosen blindness. They don't "see" God because they don't want to. Their arrogance, selfishness, and lack of responsibility prevent them from the truth. That isn't my problem, it's theirs.
rhv201 2 years ago
WOW ... next are you going to tell me that GOD is speaking through you ha 10% of americans dont beleive that there is a god and your telling me that everyone single last one of them are ingnorant fucks becasue they dont beleive what you beleive?Yes or No
IIIArrow711 2 years ago
Shut it, old man. Just because you were born in a time full of frigid Christ-fags doesn't mean you're to push your shallow opinions down our throats.
SirGomezAdams 2 years ago
First off, I don't have to "shut it", you have not authority over me whatsoever. If you had any sort of Biblical knowledge you'd know that it's not about MY opinion, it's about GOD'S commandments. You cannot bully nor intimidate me as I am not afraid of anyone.
rhv201 2 years ago
If an honest man ever runs for high office he will be denounced as scoundre by the common manl-Mencken
358Liberty 2 years ago
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therebelwaltz 2 years ago
man! this man tells the truth...........a liberal
stephenville100 2 years ago
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schwarzfalk 2 years ago
how worried about the legal rights of small children was the god of the old testament when he either sent his holy angels or the israelites to wipe them out? just curious...
richsuga 2 years ago
You wold have to ask God. That was a different dispensation
StinkyBammerHater 2 years ago
God has the right to choose when life ends, be it old age at 85, a car wreck, a miscarriage, or anything. He NEVER gives us the option to kill on a whim.
And by the way, capital punishment is NOT "on a WHIM." God has COMMANDED the execution of murderers. He has made that decision as well.
dbhma7 2 years ago
Amen! Well said.
rhv201 2 years ago
I think abortion should be illegal. Exceptions for crimes like rape.. We need to teach our kids much better in their youth and use commen sense on issues like this. Life is the greatest gift we could get. Its unimaginable to kill something i created, people got to step up and do the right thing. I look at my son and Thank God.
dannyana92 2 years ago
If you think that a zygote is a truly sacred entity, then you should be doing everything in your power to prevent the continuation of sexual reproduction. The majority of zygotes are naturally flushed from a woman's system without her even knowing. In vitro fertilization would be much more effective at saving these precious lives. Or, another way of looking at it, you should be having sex every chance you get. Think of all the lives you're denying every time you refrain from natural urges.
ivanmikhailov 2 years ago
If abortion is murder, why does being raped give you the right to commit murder?
teak43 2 years ago
I dont think theres any right but in a situation like that i could maybe understand
dannyana92 2 years ago
You understand murder? Sorry, does not make sense.
teak43 2 years ago
This question of whether you own your body and all bodies that depends on your body, or whether you only own your life and all lives within your body have an equal right to it is so important that I think the decision needs to be enshrined in a constitutional amendment.
Until the issue can be properly debated and a result produced, then yes, let the states decide. I don't think a court should have the power to make this decision alone and Roe V. Wade should be overturned.
I'm pro-choice.
GuerrillaSauce 2 years ago
If you think your so important princess then get an abortion cuz your too good for babys.
AEVautomatic 2 years ago
ya i know you. Your one of those. "im pro-choice but pro choice people sure do suck."
AEVautomatic 2 years ago
pro choice = pro murder
Conceptually it is simple, a sperm by itself is nothing egg by itself nothing happens but when that sperm and egg meet you are going to get a baby. I think rape shouldn't be an exception. the only exception there should be is when another persons _physical_ (not social) life is in danger. A life for a life it's pretty simple. Rape is unfortunate but babies aren't.
finefinefine 2 years ago
AMEN!
rhv201 2 years ago
yep ... Forcing your morals on other ppl because of Your religious beleifs
IIIArrow711 2 years ago
The liberals force THEIR "morals" (or lack their of) on us why is that any better? BTW, it has nothing to do with religious beliefs, it has to do with God's commandments.
rhv201 2 years ago
wtf if you beleive the ten commandments is gods word then thats your religious beleifs duh.... and how can you force your morals on someone if you dont have any, to be liberal is do be free and have no restraints... just cuz this is ur opinion that does not make it right...serousily just think about what your saying
IIIArrow711 2 years ago
I don't "believe" that the ten commandments are God's word, THEY ARE. That is a FACT not a belief regardless of how you try to say otherwise. It's not about my opinion nor anyone else's, it's about GOD'S will for mankind.
rhv201 2 years ago
What God? Care to point him out, gramps?
SirGomezAdams 2 years ago
The Bible says that evidence (ie. proof) of God is EVERYWHERE so that men are without excuse. I don't have to point God out to anyone. You cannot see beyond your own selfishness and ego. Go back under the rock you crawled out from.
rhv201 2 years ago
Yeah, said the self-righteous imperialist prick. Abortion isn't yet a life. It's a parasite. Yes, the little bastard is alive but abolishing abortion won't solve anything. It'll only bring about more teen pregnancies, more children born into unloving families and so on. I'm all for abortion (and licensed pregnancy for that matter) for the greater good. Whose selfish now, asswipe?
SirGomezAdams 2 years ago
Ummm, you're still the selfish jerk whether you want to admit it or not.
rhv201 2 years ago
Religion: the placebo of the masses.
SirGomezAdams 2 years ago
Since I'm not religious and in fact don't even like religion, your comment (like all your comments), is totally wasted on me.
rhv201 2 years ago
Yeah, hearing the God-related ramblings of a sad elderly piece of human trash isn't productive now that I think about it.
SirGomezAdams 2 years ago
If you think I'm a piece of human trash, you should look in the mirror scooter.
rhv201 2 years ago
Arrogance, the placebo of the arrogant and Godless.
rhv201 2 years ago
Sorry, it doesn't work when some random old bastard tries to deliver zingers. Get your own schtick.
Oh wait, creativity not mentioned enough in the Bible? Sad...now go molest some kids you prick.
SirGomezAdams 2 years ago
Wow, are one sick and sad individual. You have to accuse people that you don't even know of the stuff that you actually do! I personally wish that you would just leave children alone. I also think that punks like yourself TALK big and bad when they are on the internet and annonymous. It's just soo sad that you are too cowardly and don't have the testicular fortitude to actually deal with REAL people in person. Soo sad....
rhv201 2 years ago
Pff...keep telling yourself that.
SirGomezAdams 2 years ago
Arrogance: the placebo of the godless and witless.
rhv201 2 years ago
blah blah blah
peppermint23 2 years ago
These are some very good points! Inheritance rights, and other legal rights (including being able to be considered victims of homicide) apply to unborn babies from conception on! So the law in fact recognizes that life begins at conception! Time to restore some clear thinking and rational consistency--not to mention moral responsibility!
Enoch2 2 years ago 7
Ron Paul has a great point; an especially unbiased point given that he is an OBGYN. However, morality is defined by the mean actions of a group of people and 800K+ abortions are happening every year in the US, so one could say that it is moral to have abortions. He is right in regard to the terms to when they happen. I hope that the individual states can implement a more streamline abortion process so that people aren't waitng until the fetus is viable.
canaanav