Scotland to launch independence referendum

[dunedinman50]

@aden6312

I couldn't agree more, the man is a spineless , ignorant, moron, who isn't fit to be in any position of authority, mind you, that goes for most of those illiterate cunts in Fleet Street, who will write any drivel to sell their newspapers, ( why let the facts stand in the way of a good story?)

[JohnR1917]

Britts, is it because of the inevitable loss of Scotland that you are once again turning your attentions to Malvinas Islands? I see a decadent Empire collapsing...

[kztcsb]

Scotland, Argentina is with you!

[speedyreidy27]

Nutz



[PaulRamos1993]

I, a Portuguese citizen, independent, free, whose country was for centuries desired by foreign kings but managed to fight for our right to have a land of our own, am proud of my Homeland and History, proud of my Nation. Scottish, wouldn't you like to feel likewise?

[Fizzymagic]

@PaulRamos1993  Because its horrible Paul. Have you ever been there. Its dead cold and they talk funny. I went there once in 1983. Rained all day! Very dissapointed would be putting it mildly!

[PaulRamos1993]

@Fizzymagic I'm afraid I haven't been in Scotland, yet. Where are you from, Fizzymagic? Forgive me, but I don't quite get it, sir...Are you stating that Scotland shouldn't become an independent Nation because of its weather and funny accent? It would be awfully sad if the World was only made of exotic countries inhabitted by people with cloddish accents, don't you agree?

[BayAreaOrBust]

It's about time for Scotland to have full independence!

Greetings from a Frenchman!

[PhiloAmericana]

Well, I hope the best for the English people.

[ApplePotato]

Do you all seriously think independence will solve all of scotland's social and economic problem? The nationalist are simply using the grim economic situation to push their goals.

[jistaface]

@ApplePotato "o you all seriously think independence will solve all of scotland's social and economic problem?"

No, it will just allow people who give a damn and who understand those problems the chance to tackle them, and for the benfit of the nation instead of a tiny super-rich elite.

"The nationalist are simply using the grim economic situation to push their goals."

In 1979, all I heard was "The nationalists are just using oil wealth to push their goals".

Goal is DEMOCRACY.

[aden6312]

"England subsidises Scotland" Who started this bullshit term. Kevin McKenzie - an ex editor of The Sun newspaper. Leading economists have stated over and over that Scotland do more than their share to contribute. But because one dickless weasel of a man with a history of horse shit lies says it. The fake premise based on shit is taken more seriously than expert opinion or proven data. No wonder he had the best selling paper in Britain. This is a man who made lying his career.

[Fizzymagic]

There you go. Support from your first independant ally, Argentina! The Scots Guards will love that!

[pirucho33]

BE FREE

SCOTLAND FREE

Remember WILLIAM WALLACE

PIRATAS GO HOME!!!!!!!

MALVINAS ARGENTINAS SUPPORT SCOTTISH PEOPLE

[Hullawthere]

@pirucho33 so the malvanas people also can chose which country to be with?

UK I think!

[stuartyy90]

oh fuck off. independence would be shite for scotland any you all know it.

[Fizzymagic]

Is Scotland that cold bit at the top you see on the weather?

[scotchprofessor]

@Fizzymagic That's right. In an apparently 'United' Kingdom, it's the place above 'The North'. Language is everything, and it's been made clear for long enough that Scotland doesn't exist in this 'union'.

[sgtmcwallace]

as an american of Scottish ancestry this is very exciting news to see that independence is begin taken seriously as well as an understanding of how it would work in practice. Much respect and solidarity from across the pond.

[scotchprofessor]

@sgtmcwallace Thank you. For years the 'British' government has been signing 'Anglo'-American agreements, and 'Anglo'-US deals. We look forward to signing our first Scottish-American agreement.

All the best to you from Scotland, and thanks for your support.

[simonsrd100]

And the Welsh see them selves as Welsh not British

[SamianHQuazi]

No doubt the time has come for the Scottish people to have a free and sovereign nation of their own once more.

[StevenTalks1]

FUCK YEAH FREE WALES TOO! AND NORTHERN IRELAND!

[TransformedMan]

FREE THE WORLD!!!

[helix4811]

FREE ICE CREAM!!!!!!!

seriously, calm down people, the people in the video can't hear you, and no one on the internet cares.

[mechadamuramu]

As an outsider, isn't a "country" that which has ultimate independence? How can the UK be a block of countries if they don't have the right to self defense etc? America is made of 50 states, not a union of 50 small countries. How is the UK anything BUT a federal system?

[Injektilo7]

This is a report which shows remarkably poor understanding of many things. Scotland does not have autonomy from England because that implies that Scotland is a region of England, which it is not and never has been. Furthermore, Scotland is not the last vestiges of empire in any sense as rather than being some colony it was an integral part of the ruling imperial state itself. Finally, Scotland has previously had independent defense and foreign policy, history goes back beyond 1707 after all.

[aido92]

@Injektilo7 Scots were used as part of the imperial structure in the same way as the Irish, and similarly to the way in which the empire, as its predecessors had done, used "divide and rule" to promote one conquered people over others, in order to enable a small island nation to rule half the world. The Scots, as a people, had no input to that, were not responsible for it, and any benefit to them was coincidental. The repression of our native languages and culture was typically colonial.

[MrDeathlinger]

@aido92 Self determination is a joke. Hitler used self determination during 1936 to gain Austria and then later on to gain Czechoslovakia. Also the Scottish are from the British Isles, which would mean that they are British, so they are infact ruling themselves. Furthermore what does Scotland actually have to gain from independance, and is it really worth breaking a age old truce that unites a common people?

[aido92]

@MrDeathlinger Clearly, you don't have a clue what you're talking about. We are not a "common people"; we are a collection of nations, which share the same geographic area. The logic of your argument is that we should all become a federal states of Europe. We are all Europeans, after all, and we are united by a treaty ....

Your definition of self-determination is woefully inaccurate and the examples you quote are actually the polar opposite of what is at stake here.

[hogo1]

this is bullshit, anglos and scots should be sticking together to fight against the arab hoards invading the UK

[scotchprofessor]

@hogo1 Thank you for displaying one of the very reasons we demand independence. You have no idea how politically different we are.

[Scarletpooky]

I'll be voting for independence and I'll be hoping that Wales joins in, even if Wales will have a tougher time economically.

As for the nuke subs, don't send them back to england, SELL them back :p

[TVgeinus90sSim]

See, if the UK was a constitutional federal monarchy, there would be some more freedom and the UK would live a lil longer. Oh well. SCOTLAND!!!

[kennie922]

that‘s stupid.

[mathematics64]

England will be a great independent nation, alongside us Scots. But we are leaving the Union, like it or not the United Kingdom as a nation is finished.

[aquia80]

I wish Australia would strive for the same. Our current government is led by English born Julia Gillard. She is not our elected prime minister and she is the worst we have had in our history. Australians voted Kevin Rudd into office, but Gillard worked behind the scenes and made backroom deals to come into power. She cares little about Australians and she talks down to us as if we are inferior. We can do nothing until next election. If you can do it, Scotland, then maybe we can too.

[MrFattyfatfatboy]

@aquia80 she speaks with a proud aussie accent and will win the next election,im not happy either on Rudd but ill be stuffed like a haggis before i see the libs come to power and when lizzie dies (i hope she lives to 120 as we do love her)the republicans have got thier chance.Right now im working on fast tracking UK personal into the ADF wich is easy as were almost the exact same in all services though the Yanks are now sending thier people as well into the Navy mainly.

[TheUsuallSuspect]

Long live the great and glorious people of Scotland. This British kingdom has destroyed people and nations among them been my own native homeland Somalia.

I am happy to hear that the chicken have come home to roost. May the British empire disintegrate into fiefdoms. Just like they've turned so many countries into.

[Mjayiesm]

I don't think that's smart.

[davd1986]

Lower your flags and march straight back to England, stopping at every home you pass by to beg forgiveness for a hundred years of theft, rape, and murder. Do that and your men shall live. Do it not, and every one of you will die today.

[1scot4scotland]

As far as I'm concerned my first minister, Alex Salmond, knows what is best for Scotland.

Yes for Independence.

[swordofisis]

yeah, and kick that invasive christian tradition of "patron saints!" Its what led to Scottland and Ireland being conquored by the saxons in the first place...because it just wasnt christian to kill the christian invaders who became their "brothers in christ." Get rid of their damm religion which has the royal family at the head of the church...because thats what christianity has always been, a religion of slavery for the slaves! sublime prince of the royal secret, indeed!

[bennlonelyboy]

FREE SCOTLAND, FREE IRELAND, FREE CORNISH

[2787mh]

@bennlonelyboy from the EU and capitalism????

[jistaface]

@bennlonelyboy

When was Cornwall a nation? What national institutions or other attributes of nationhood has it got? Have the Cornish people got a political party standing for independence? What are its policies? Has it stood for office? Has it won any seats?

[bennlonelyboy]

@jistaface Saint Piran's Flag. Mebyon Kernow, formed in 1951, and the Cornish Nationalist Party. Cornwall Council, Cornish Assembly. MPs:Candy Atherton, Paul Tyler, Colin Breed, Andrew George, Matthew Taylor.

[jistaface]

@bennlonelyboy

Great! Now all you (or they) need do is get ordinary folk off the couch; put up candidates for every seat. Work out what it is about Cornwall that makes it a viable unit, and tell people. Get an assembly with a mandate to hold a referendum.

It's been over 30 years since we first voted for devolution, and we still don't have what we voted for back then - a government with primary lawmaking powers. But 2 steps forward and 1 step back has still made us progress.

[LtSgt5]

FREE SCOTLAND!!! CUT THE TIES BETWEEN THE CROWN AND THE PEOPLE!

[2787mh]

@LtSgt5 The SNP want the queen as head of state, they have also stated we will always be British in the same way that the Swedish and Danish are Scandinavian.

So there policy is to create a British commonwealth called 'Scotland' which will be controlled by the EU, sell its land to the American business world (which means you're views won't be represented) and demand Scottish tax payers subsidize the Royal Families visits. Enjoy Walmart and Donald Trump!! Look it all up, you'll see it's true.

[LtSgt5]

@2787mh I never said that you all should march you policies to my political views. I don't live in your lands, so I can't make policy. I'm a Voluntarianist not an imperialist neocon.

[jistaface]

@LtSgt5

You didn't attend primary school in Scotland, I take it. As every Scottish schoolchild knows, Scotland had a monarch before the union and retains a monarch irrespective of whatever union we participate in.

Elizabeth Windsor remains Elizabeth i Queen of Scots unless we have a vote to sack her. That's the constitutional situation irrespective of independence.

[LtSgt5]

@jistaface I have read up on that, you all have had a monarchy, but back in the 1600s or so, the Queen of england had the Scottish Queen, her cousin, executed. Would that make her illegitimate or does that change absolutely nothing?

[jistaface]

@LtSgt5

"the Queen of england had the Scottish Queen, her cousin, executed"

Yes. The Queen of England then died without an heir and her executed cousin's son, King James vi of Scots, was asked to come down and be crowned James i of England.

The two countries essentially carried on as before, 2 separate, sometimes hostile neighbours.

After a century the Treaty of Union was signed. Each country passed an act suspending its own currency and parliament, and set up joint ones.

[jistaface]

@LtSgt5

The short answer is it changes nothing. Imagine the king of France had died childless and his cousin was king of Germany. Both are separate countries with separate laws, parliaments, armies, currencies, aristocracies; with some shared and some totally different language; they're still two countries who by accident share a king.

If they unite and separate again, the same dynasty, same person, remain kings of France and kings of Germany.

(Canada & Australia share a Queen!)

[jonahfox]

FREE SCOTLAND!!

[freesk8]

Free the Scots!

[lovetohate028]

FUCK YEAH

BREAK AWAY FROM THE DEGENERATE, SINKING SHIP!

[TheWhiterose1603]

I support Scotland. I am English and i say let England be its own country again. We had an empire it is now gone let China, Russia become the new superpower. Lets get out of the EU,NATO & look after our own. Let Scotland go but if they go they go fully, leave the stirling& take half the debt. Lets see our long free prescription & High education lasts. The scottish are racist & spitful people blaming all their problems on the English, it was THEIR own lords who sold them. Lets build that wall.

[aido92]

@TheWhiterose1603 Was it racist for the Baltic states to wish to be free of the Russians? Was it racist for the Africans to resent their colonial exploitation? Was it racist for the Slovakians to wish to seek their own destiny, separate from the Czechs? Is it racist for any nation ruled by another to resent that rule, and to seek their freedom? And why should we take half the debt, when we are 8% of the population, and had little say in the accumulation of that debt? Racist? So you are!

[TheWhiterose1603]

@aido92 During the world cup people in scotland were burning the st George flad & cheering anyone but England, complained that the english flag was on mars bars, even US cheered us on. We cheered Wales during the Rugby. The SDL shout about Scotland it is alright the EDL shout about keeping our heritage it is racist. I have a friend form Glasgow & he as said that Scotland teaches them to hate the English. It is all the rich who want Scotland to remain the others dont care.

[aido92]

@TheWhiterose1603 You read too much propaganda from the London tabloids; there were a lot of lies printed down there. Some Scots cheered on England; some did not ( I'd put it about 60:40). Were any Belgians not cheering on France racist? Were any Finns not cheering on Sweden racist? You are our neighbours. We have no obligation to cheer you on, and are totally free to support the other side. As to being taught to hate England. Total BS! Watch the English coverage from here, and you might get it

[TheWhiterose1603]

@aido92 I am not saying that you should cheer other teams all i am saying that we should show more support to each othe. I support independence for all the countries in the UK but i would want a union for our military. We are one small country so we need to united on that. Scotland,Wales,Ireland all played a major part in WW2 & without them we would not have defeated Hitler. This shows how great we are when we are united but we all need our indpendence. I am Yorkshire 1st, English 2nd

[aido92]

@TheWhiterose1603 Isn't that what NATO is for? And if you don't like NATO, then there is nothing to prevent a common defence pact. I'm sorry, but that is a weak argument against independence. And if the English create difficulties for an independent Scotland, and for our aspirations to independence, then that would be a good way to bring about the end you fear. Look at how long it took for Ireland to regard England favourably after the mess they made there. The vote may well not go that way!

[aido92]

@TheWhiterose1603 The one thing you can be sure of is that the more English people, Scots exiles in England, and the Westminster government, try to tell Scotland which way we should vote, when we should vote, how we should vote, and the questions we should vote on, the the more likely it is that Scotland will vote for independence, as undecided voters will most certainly be pissed off by that interference. I'm afraid you simply don't get a say, and, in your own interests, should shut up.

[TheWhiterose1603]

@aido92 Wow how mature you are. Why dont you go and watch Braveheart and have a deep fried mars bar. At least when you go our builders will have work rebuilding that wall. Along with roads we now have something else to thank the Romans for. Fot the record a recent poll shown more English supported Indendence then Scotland. I wish we could have a vote on whether we want you to be part of us any more. Enjoy the Euro, lets see how long your free education last when u join the Euro. BYE

[aido92]

@TheWhiterose1603 I'll leave the readers to decide on the relative maturity of our comments. The fact is that you didn't get a say in the devolution referendum, and I'm sure that you would not expect other Europeans to vote in a referendum on the UK leaving the EU. Hadrian's Wall isn't on the border, btw, but that is typical of the stupidity and ignorance that characterises the average English attitude to Scotland. I stated the political reality; if the you are too stupid to realise, so be it.

[MrPilkman]

@aido92 Oh my goodness. I'm sorry but you're accusing us of going on about a 46 year old football match, when you still crap on about a 700 year old battle? Hypocirsy much?

[aido92]

@MrPilkman There's a bit of a difference between a sporting event and a battle which secured Scotland's liberty from English rule, imposed by a brutal conquest and occupation. The fact that you would even seek to equate the two is a little crass. And what about the little skirmish of 946 years ago that the English go on about? They're right to - it was a seminal moment in their history, as was Bannockburn in Scotland's history.

[aido92]

@TheWhiterose1603 People here support other teams, not because we hate the English, but because of the attitudes of a certain section of English society. Many of us do hate the English media, with their arrogance, their constant assumption of innate superiority, and their incessant prattling about 1966. It is a standing joke here. How long into an English football commentary before they mention 1966? No other nation who have won a world cup prattles on about it incessantly like England.

[scotchprofessor]

@TheWhiterose1603 Football is interesting as a point where the clear division between Scotland and England in the UK can be seen. At the last World Cup, there were 64 games played. In Scotland, every single game on the 'B'BC and ITV carried an English commentator.

On a Saturday night in Scotland, there are no highlights of Scottish football on the 'B'BC. Instead, there are almost three hours of English league football highlights: Match of the Day and The Football League Show.

[scotchprofessor]

Might I remind you that the Scots are paying for this service. We pay 8.4% of the BBC licence fee, yet receive only 4% of networked representation. Tell me another country in the world that has foreign football, to the negation of its own, on their televisions.

'UK'-wide 5 Live and the World Service are also Scottish-free zones. There's only group of racists here, and it most certainly isn't the Scots.

[TheWhiterose1603]

@scotchprofessor How many managers are scottish in the premier league at least 6. Alex Ferguson is the manager of the greatest team. If an English manager was at Celtic or Ranger he would be shot dead, look how they react when you have a cathlic manager. Also English football makes money and is known around the world, Also you only have Celtic & Rangers at the top. BBC is shit, it shows repeats so dont bother paying your fee.Scotlands made good programmes look at Taggart.

[scotchprofessor]

@TheWhiterose1603 I have no idea what point your trying to make. Terry Butcher is a coach up here, if that's of any bearing on the debate you're conducting... He's been here for 25 years, and hasn't yet been shot dead.

You've produced a tirade of opinion and supposition rather than any facts, nothing bearing any import to the points I made. Are you saying Scots give so much to English football, and the English give nothing to Scotland? Pertinent indeed.

[scotchprofessor]

@TheWhiterose1603 Are you saying that because Scottish football is "shit", we shouldn't have it on our television in Scotland, but should have a foreign football league instead? On the national broadcaster? Slovaks watch Slovak football, Swedes watch Swedish, Dutch watch Dutch football etc. Why should Scotland pay money to English football? Why should Scots have a foreign league on tv, to the exclusion of their own?

[scotchprofessor]

@TheWhiterose1603 Taggart? Name another.

Rather tellingly, when the 'British' named their Top 100 Sitcoms of All TIme, only one came from Scotland... in over seventy years of BBC tv, how many Scottish sitcoms, soaps, documentaries, dramas, newsreaders, presenters can you name? Scotland pays for a state broadcaster that is institutionally racist against its people.

[ChildofYeshua777]

Alba Gu Brath!!!

[MrDeathlinger]

If Scotland was to declare independance, they would be breaking the treaty of Union.(Which I think would grant England the right to go to war without the intervention of the UN.)

[aido92]

@MrDeathlinger England has broken the treaty dozens of times over the centuries. The treaty was between two equal parties, and one of those parties can end it without the consent of the other. Scotland had the right to self-determination, as any other nation.

[marco39120]

haggis? that looks like a pig's stomach.

[aido92]

@marco39120 Sheep's stomach, pal, sheep's.

[commando2224]

Erm i dont think so........ just make things more complicated.

[13elsyd13]

do it scotland! support from Philippines! you dont deserve to support their militart actions in the middle east.

[waranish]

They definately deserve this for centuries they have divided nations and tribes. I'm glad that the same thing has come back to them.

[user201120122013]

The English will never let this happen. Scotland can try but in the end it will not be free. Just talk to the Irish Catholics in Ulster and you'll see why.

[sionnyn]

@user201120122013 The Catholics in Ulster are breeding their way into a majority, and very soon now, that majority will be of voting age. There will be little the English or the Prods can do when that happens.

[Ilovejews18]

Free Scotland Free ireland Free Wales

[TheWhiterose1603]

@Ilovejews18 Free England from all the scroungers who blame their sad lives on England. Please tell me how a little country like England managed to "enslave" all of you. It says alot about your countries. Look at the mess Ireland is in, they are leaving in their 1000s. Wales has the highest teenage suicides in Europe, Glasgow has the highest heroin addicts in europe, people in Iraq live longer then people in Glasgow. Yes i agree Freedom for all.England will be better.

[aido92]

@TheWhiterose1603 How could England enslave us? You outnumber us more than 10 to 1, you moron! You have had control of the economic, social, and military power since our parliament was dissolved in 1707. We got our voice back in 1999, and now many of us want our full heritage back. Tell me, if Scotland is such a burden, why are the Westminster government so desperate to keep hold of us? Could it be that they are lying to you about Scotland's claimed dependence on you? Is it the other way around?

[alawevans]

Wales to follow!!! 

[HeavyMetalCanuck]

reminds me of when Quebec had the referendum to leave Canada.

[Abbadon380]

@HeavyMetalCanuck is Quebec planning on becoming a country any time soon

[waterlizardz123]

@Abbadon380 The seperatists are saying the movement is more than alive, but thriving. I beg to differ, the seperatists should look at the latest election results and see whether the majority of people in Quebec want to seperate.

[Abbadon380]

@HeavyMetalCanuck independent from Canada

[MrPilkman]

I hate the way Salmond is demanding that Scotland only receive 8% of the national debt, but 100% of the north sea oil... Where's the fairness in that? Also if Scotland become independent it would cost the UK billions for new facilities, such as deep sea docks for our submarines. The independence of Scotland would be the biggest disaster to afflict the British Isles in hundreds of years.

[aido92]

@MrPilkman Why should England get any of Scotland's oil? In lies in Scotland's territorial waters, not England's. And what proportion of the national debt should we accept? We are 8% of the UK population - why should we accept more? Indeed, as much of that debt was incurred without Scotland's democratic participation, and in pursuit of priorities that Scotland did not support, there would be an argument for less. Alex is being generous accepting 8%.

[MrPilkman]

@aido92 Why should the Scottish people receive on average £400 more in NHS care than English people? Having industrialised and supported your nation (for instance free universities and elderly care) for 300 years it is well within our rights to keep the north sea oil, besides it's mainly depleted now and will soon be too risky to extract anyway so it's not as if it's a viable economic solution for your nation.

[aido92]

@MrPilkman Spending is determined on need, not a per capita basis. The recent higher spending in Scotland does little to mitigate the decades of neglect from direct rule which left Scotland with poorer housing, poorer health and a decimated economy. The oil revenues, which are Scotland's, by right, should have been spent on alleviating those problems far earlier, and would have left Scotland one of the wealthiest nations in the world. Instead, it has been squandered on war and London's vanity.

[MrPilkman]

@aido92 So you are suggesting to me a nation with a population of just 5 million could one of the world's greatest powers? It's not just an argument of the economic repercussions on Scotland either, to replace the facilities currently present in Scotland would cost the UK government billions of pounds, surely it isn't the right of the Scottish people to impose further hardships on the British?

[aido92]

@MrPilkman The UK government chose to place those facilities here, against the Scots people's wishes. Tough! Do you believe that Ukraine, Belarus, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania etc etc should have compensated the Russians for their loss of bases? Perhaps the Croatians, Bosnians, Slovenes and other former Yugoslav countries should have paid Serbia?

[aido92]

@MrPilkman And what about all the costs of Westminster policies foisted on to the Scots people against their democratically expressed wishes over decades?

[MrPilkman]

@aido92 I'll confess that Thatcher and her poll tax being introduced in Scotland first was an ill conceived idea, but whilst Scotland has faced financial woes from Westminster you've received enough financial support too. As I previously mentioned Scotland couldn't bail out the British taxpayer-controlled bank Bank of Scotland, the NHS is supported though UK funds and couldn't feasibly be funded by the Scottish.

[aido92]

@MrPilkman a) an independent Scotland might well not have allowed the absurd deregulation of the banking system - that was a Westminster policy. b) you're buying into the assumption that the public should be bailing out banks in the first place c) countries that refused to bail out their banks have not experienced disaster. d) our spending priorities are up to us, not you! Let us go, and you won't have to worry about us any more ...... It's our right to self-determination, and no-one else's!

[MrPilkman]

@aido92 Also diplomatically Scotland would be a vastly reduced nation, it wouldn't be represented on the UN security council as it is now through the UK, nor it would have as much of a say in the EU due to it's diminished power. Both of nations would be weaker were Scotland to break free of the union.

[aido92]

@MrPilkman We aren't represented. England serves England's interests. We have no say. We would have a far stronger voice, and would speak far differently from the UK government. As to England being diminished - what concern is that of ours? Should they have preserved the USSR to preserve Russia's voice? How selfish of all their former colonies to abandon them! And how selfish of all England's other former colonies not to preserve England's empire ....

[MrPilkman]

@aido92 Also likening us to the totalitarian dictatorship of the USSR is an unfair comparison. Surely we should be striving to build links between nations and find positive comparisons? Unlike Mr. Salmond is doing by digging out differences and causing strife.

[aido92]

@MrPilkman We're happy to build links between nations; nations who stand as equals. And we should be free to choose which nations we wish to stand beside, and not have that choice made for us. We should have the right not to take part in Westminster's wars, or to be used as a dumping ground for the weapons and waste which no English community would allow in their midst. Or must we continue to have them forced upon us by governments we didn't vote for? Westminster causes the strife, not us!

[aido92]

@MrPilkman the comparison with the USSR is not so unfair, in structural terms. If you choose to take an implied political comparison, so be it, but that was not what I was referring to.

[aido92]

@MrPilkman Btw, why would you think that Scotland would have any ambition to be one of the "great powers"? We leave that kind of vanity and delusion to our colonial overlords in London. Norway, Finland, Denmark, and Sweden would be our role models. Some of the wealthiest, most egalitarian, most educated and peaceable nations on the planet.

[MrPilkman]

@aido92 Scotland isn't a colony, were you speaking from a Welsh standpoint which is a technically a province of England I would hear you out, but Scotland chose to join the union in 1701. The only delusional person here is Mr. Salmond if he believes Scotland would be able to financially support itself.

[aido92]

@MrPilkman 1707! I think you're confusing it with the union with Ireland in 1801, which also technically had the same status as Scotland now, but was still a colony. And the Scots people rioted against the Union, if you do your research. The Scots people were not consulted. Our independence was sold to pay off the aristocracy's debts. And independent analysis shows Scotland can stand just fine on its own two feet. If we're such a burden, why do you want to hold on so badly?

[MrPilkman]

@aido92 Because both nations would lose massive amounts of prestige, we'd both have less of a say in global politics, neither would be represented on the UN security council, and our position in the EU would be diminished. What possible good could come from Scottish independence? You'd still have the queen as your monarch, all that would change is foolish Mr. Salmond would be allowed to be called "Prime Minister". A prize hardly worth coveting. Also I got a date wrong, my apologies.

[mathematics64]

@MrPilkman Sorry pal, but the union is over. Time to move on.

[MrPilkman]

@mathematics64 What makes you so certain? 43% of people support the union and 40% support independence. That sounds like a majority to me.

[aido92]

@MrPilkman There are also structural reasons why Scotland has to have an apparent higher per capita spending than England. We have far greater road mileage per head than England, our population is more dispersed, we have many dozens of inhabited islands to service etc etc. If your argument is economic unfairness, then you should be only too glad to see the back of us! If, that is, the argument is true, which it clearly is not; it is crooked accounting. We have subsidised you for years.

[aido92]

@MrPilkman And if you were paying any attention at all to the debate, you would know that Scotland sees its future in renewable energy, in which we should be a world leader, not in oil. The oil money would be useful, but it is the principle that is important. You've robbed us blind for the past 40 years of our rightful resources, so youse can f.r.o. if you think you're getting your hands on a penny more than is necessary, especially as you will just squander it anyway, as you have so far.

[Reyrocksall]

Freeeeedoooooooooom! (had to)

[ThePayola123]

Beautiful Scottsmen with Strong Legs in Kilts.

What a Beautiful Contribution to Humanity.

[superfisto]

Chris Hoy?!

[theindiekidable]

I'm off Scottish ancestry, like many people south of the Hadrian's Wall, and I think Scotland will be much worse off.

Alex Salmond is as slippery as his name suggests - he's not interested in independence, he's interested in having his name carved in stone. He's clearly not interested because he's so keen on including devo-max.

[aido92]

@theindiekidable Dubious that you're of Scots descent, since you call it Scottish, not Scots, you refer to it as "the Hadrian's Wall", don't seem to know that Hadrian's Wall is not the border, and that you seem to have the impression that Alex Salmond is a glory seeker and not interested in independence. He is a realistic politician, who sacrificed much of his life to a cause that nobody could have predicted would come this close to fruition in his lifetime.

[aido92]

@theindiekidable Alex knows that independence is far from certain in a referendum, but if devo-max is not included then Westminster will use any defeat of independence to justify a denial of any further powers to Scotland any time in the foreseeable future. All nations have the right to self-determination; it's guaranteed in the UN charter to which the UK is a signatory. If the people of Scotland choose independence it is their right, and I'm afraid nobody else has a say in that.

[dammee]

Do it!

[infidel1978]

Their head of state will still be the Queen and their currency would still be the pound run by the Bank of England so we'd dictate their economy plus how would they of coped with the bail out of Banks like the Royal Bank of Scotland on their own??

[hanford65]

@infidel1978 We'd never have been able to bail out our banks.We'd be another Iceland.

[sionnyn]

@hanford65 Iceland didn't bail out its banks, and is recovering nicely now, thank you. Instead of rewarding its bankers with knighthoods and obscene pensions, it is prosecuting them in the courts. The English way is not the only way to do things.

[aido92]

@hanford65 Are you aware of the current economic status of Iceland? They did OK out of not bailing out their banks.

[ThePolerbearproducts]

Proud to be Scot-Irish!!! All the whiskey and badass relatives i want

[hanford65]

No thanks.I'm scottish and voting against it.I just don't trust Salmond.He's hardly an inspiring figure either.As for all those of Scots ancestry,well,keep your noses out of it 'cos you're not the ones who'll have to live with the consequences if it happens.And you don't live here either so you've got no right to interfere.This ain't Brigadoon you know.

[aido92]

@hanford65 If your sole reason for voting against independence is the personality of one of its proponents, then you are a buffoon. If you have any rational reasons not to support it, then that is your right, and I wholeheartedly respect any decision you make on such a basis, whether I agree with it or not. You are right that non-residents, whatever their ancestry, have no right to participate. There is no precedent for them to do so; they did not participate in the devolution referendum either.

[TheBarnebus]

Good on you scotland, break up and shake up the union.. Just as how the british broke up countless of nations into enemies among each other.. Especialy somalia.

[theindiekidable]

@TheBarnebus You blame the British for the break up of Somalia...ROTFL

[hastious]

@TheBarnebus

Scots are Brits too !!

[MrPilkman]

@TheBarnebus You mean Somalia which wasn't even our colony? The Islamic court union and the various Islamist groups it spawned (such as Al Shabab) broke up Somalia, it had nothing to do with us.

[TheUsuallSuspect]

@TheBarnebus ...ive addressed this at my blog...Im somaly by the way...myhajj.blogspot.com

[Redfingers]

Fuck yes.

[TheRacistsMustDie]

I will have such Schadenfreude when it happens.

[ps3beatswii]

My ancestral homeland deserves to be free!

[theindiekidable]

@ps3beatswii It deserves better than to be 'free'

[hanford65]

@ps3beatswii Oh really? So you don't live here? This ain't Brigadoon!

[pvtjamesryan3]

ewww

Sheep's stomach....that's fucking disgusting!!

I don't remember William Wallace eating a sheep's stomach in Braveheart...

People do travel to different areas for delicacies, like Italy for pizza, USA for steak, Japan for sushi...

No one is lining up for sheep's stomach.

It's no question why Scotland has issues with tourism.

[infidel1978]

@pvtjamesryan3 It's sheep's bollocks

[PrecisePuncher]

I hope it happens!

[TheDrfoxx]

Go Scotland go! You don't need them! Good for you! Inspirational!!

[TheArabSultan]

Scotland should gain its independance and aquire nuclear weapons

[davd1986]

@TheArabSultan  LOL, and use them! Haha

[TheArabSultan]

@davd1986 yes exatly. Oh and sell them also lolol

[FullSwagSyceGame507]

Free Scotland!