Sabres were originally really, really blunt on the lower two-thirds of the blade. (Almost as blunt as your typical training sword.) That allowed them to take an edge to edge blow while prolonging the life of the weapon. Sure, static blocks aren't optimal, but keep in mind these swords were a little better adapted to resist notching. They were mass-produced, and (relatively) cheap to replace once it eventually wears out.
(If I'm blatantly wrong on any of this, criticism welcome.)
You're refering to XIX century military sabres, and yes, they were mass produced for mass trained military personnel. XVII century Polish sabres were just the opposite: hand manufactured pieces of art for individual, highly skilled customer.
Also, Polish sabre fencing of that era had to be much more sophisticated than XIX cookbook "fencing" (presented too by the gentlemen in the video above). Unfortunately there are no preserved sources on the subject.
"Edge on edge" there I said it too, can I get thumbs up now? Sheesh, guys: there are different schools of thought on edge to edge contact now, just like how there probably were back when the masters taught.
Traditional sabers were slashing weapon almost exclusively, and often employed on horse back...the curved blade creates a more efficient surface as it "rocks" into and through the cut and also prevents the weapon from sticking into the target as often by virtue of the same motion (a serious concern when on horseback LOL).
Thrusting was never the main focus of such weapons so as to justify the curve.
That would have been fantastic if they wore a full dress of the Commonwealth period, those long and large ones composed by the zupan, a delia, kolpak, a pair of Szarawary and something else, which made the nobleman's appearance.
@TheTrumpat You know dude that stuff will make you sth like Russian Soldat. Cause kołpak is old russian hat, and Szarawary were introduced from 1941 to 1955 to RKKA. And Żupan is large coat. You will boil yourself when you will fight in this shit. The Polish nobility wore different clothes than in the east or west. Breeches (designed by polish nobleman in 1700) rogatywka/konfederatka, high yellow boots and a linen shirt will be more national.
@TheTrumpat You are Welcome! The other typically Polish items we can include:
Gorget (Ryngraf) with the image of God mother of or with the cavalry cross, Kontusz (close to Żupan), Delia (large cape for the winter), the belt (Pas) - but who and how can wear it, it's too difficult to write it in few words. We can added that the outer representational clothing were fastened with large gold tumors. On the estern borderlands (farthest was Kursk) they worn more fur.
@TheTrumpat And of course in the East they wore hats similar to the Russian Papacha. At Papacha they often placed szkofia or some bird feathers. But of course the fashion was the fashion, and there were times when noblemen dressed like Spanishmans or Italian. However there has never been common, because the Polish nobility considered themselves as descendants of the Sarmatians, and they were proud that they could wear such a rich dress. And this low temperature ... uhhhh.
Some sabers are meant to be edge to edge. The strong 1/2 or 1/3 was not sharp and meant for this. They didn't care about their opponent's sharp edge, just their own. Too many sabers now are sharpened all the way and not good for this. Just an observation to some of the comments.
Fantastic. I'd like to see soem non-chroeagraphed sabre though. Both these guys look like they capable of exceptional free play with the sabre and I think that would be worth more to practioners than a pre-rehearsed sequence. Fantastic work though.
@GregorMar I believe this is a real school and I also believe that these guys are the real deal. I just think this particular piece is far to fluid and predictable to be "live" and not at least somewhat coordinated.
Masz ci los...tego od zawsze szukałem. Nie orientuje się ktoś z Was szanowni użytkownicy YT, czy na Pomorzu Środkowym nie ma podobnej grupy zajmującej się ćwiczeniami z szablą?
On behalf of that pair of fancing guys, please could you make your question much clear?
Your questions are really interested.
We are very interesting in providing you with all technical information of Polish way of fencing but we need to understand well your intention. If you kind to translate the former English questions in simple way we will be very pleased.
@74Damarina He is using terms that are used in Rapier Fencing. The Debole (otherwise known as the Foible) is the half of the blade that has the tip. In rapier fencing this is never used defensively (except against a thrust, even then it's not looked highly upon).
He is asking whether sabre fencing, particularly polish style, has a distinction between different parts of the blade and why they have that reasoning. he is also asking if parries are *allowed* with any part of the blade.
I have a question about the technique. It looked like you were doing some parries with the debole/foible of the blade. That feels off to me, but I have never worked with curved blades. Does the Polish system make any distinction on parrying with the forte or the debole, or does the curved natire of the blade make that less important?
I am very impressed with your video's, could you tell me where the style of szabla that you practice comes from, is it a handed down system or one that has had to be re-constructed from old fencing manuals?
Thank you, I mostly pracice the style of sabre fencing of the 19th century swordsman Alfred Hutton. There are a lot of simularities with the Polish style, although it is not exactly the same. I really like the fencing that you guys are doing. I wish that we had some Polish instructors here in England.
To say more this is a freestyle fancing training based on Polish military tradition. Compare with theatre way of fencing that is completely free and non-arranged.
I know it because I have some practise with that fencing together with these guys.
@KissakiSan
Sabres were originally really, really blunt on the lower two-thirds of the blade. (Almost as blunt as your typical training sword.) That allowed them to take an edge to edge blow while prolonging the life of the weapon. Sure, static blocks aren't optimal, but keep in mind these swords were a little better adapted to resist notching. They were mass-produced, and (relatively) cheap to replace once it eventually wears out.
(If I'm blatantly wrong on any of this, criticism welcome.)
HipposHateWater 3 months ago
@HipposHateWater
You're refering to XIX century military sabres, and yes, they were mass produced for mass trained military personnel. XVII century Polish sabres were just the opposite: hand manufactured pieces of art for individual, highly skilled customer.
Also, Polish sabre fencing of that era had to be much more sophisticated than XIX cookbook "fencing" (presented too by the gentlemen in the video above). Unfortunately there are no preserved sources on the subject.
BrodatyOlo 1 week ago
"Edge on edge" there I said it too, can I get thumbs up now? Sheesh, guys: there are different schools of thought on edge to edge contact now, just like how there probably were back when the masters taught.
mrmanzyguy 3 months ago
Polska ręka !
Piotr92NR 4 months ago
@KissakiSan with a sabre it's only the very last few inches that are sharpened
DaveDangerous74 5 months ago
@DaveDangerous74 It is not ;) If the whole wouldn't be sharpened, curved blade would lost it's sense with the circular cut.
Oskareczekeczek 4 months ago
@Oskareczekeczek The blade is curved so that you can thrust it around the other persons defence.
Search youtube for a video called "Cold Steel: (1 of 3) Basic Self Defense With Saber and Cutlass"
It will give you a good idea of how to use a sabre.
DaveDangerous74 4 months ago
@DaveDangerous74
I don't think that's quite correct
Traditional sabers were slashing weapon almost exclusively, and often employed on horse back...the curved blade creates a more efficient surface as it "rocks" into and through the cut and also prevents the weapon from sticking into the target as often by virtue of the same motion (a serious concern when on horseback LOL).
Thrusting was never the main focus of such weapons so as to justify the curve.
lowenklee 4 months ago 4
Prawie jak Kmicic i Wołodyjowski :)!
hitek9000 7 months ago
Dobra walka :D
yamato1496 7 months ago
My compliments to the fencers.
That would have been fantastic if they wore a full dress of the Commonwealth period, those long and large ones composed by the zupan, a delia, kolpak, a pair of Szarawary and something else, which made the nobleman's appearance.
TheTrumpat 9 months ago
@TheTrumpat You know dude that stuff will make you sth like Russian Soldat. Cause kołpak is old russian hat, and Szarawary were introduced from 1941 to 1955 to RKKA. And Żupan is large coat. You will boil yourself when you will fight in this shit. The Polish nobility wore different clothes than in the east or west. Breeches (designed by polish nobleman in 1700) rogatywka/konfederatka, high yellow boots and a linen shirt will be more national.
Koza727 7 months ago
@Koza727 I see; totally different in few words.
Thank you for the names of the equipments you told about, they are always interesting to me.
TheTrumpat 7 months ago
@TheTrumpat You are Welcome! The other typically Polish items we can include:
Gorget (Ryngraf) with the image of God mother of or with the cavalry cross, Kontusz (close to Żupan), Delia (large cape for the winter), the belt (Pas) - but who and how can wear it, it's too difficult to write it in few words. We can added that the outer representational clothing were fastened with large gold tumors. On the estern borderlands (farthest was Kursk) they worn more fur.
Koza727 7 months ago
@TheTrumpat And of course in the East they wore hats similar to the Russian Papacha. At Papacha they often placed szkofia or some bird feathers. But of course the fashion was the fashion, and there were times when noblemen dressed like Spanishmans or Italian. However there has never been common, because the Polish nobility considered themselves as descendants of the Sarmatians, and they were proud that they could wear such a rich dress. And this low temperature ... uhhhh.
Koza727 7 months ago
Some sabers are meant to be edge to edge. The strong 1/2 or 1/3 was not sharp and meant for this. They didn't care about their opponent's sharp edge, just their own. Too many sabers now are sharpened all the way and not good for this. Just an observation to some of the comments.
ezraa123 9 months ago 2
All the edge on edge makes me cry inside...
WitheringintheDark 10 months ago 16
@WitheringintheDark thank you, sir.
Yakzur 2 months ago
where can i get these practice sabers?
janosnyc 1 year ago
@janosnyc This is fencing shool in Warsaw .
GregorMar 11 months ago
Dobrze!
DrakeRD1 1 year ago
This is Thrand!!!
Nice video!!!
ThegnThrand 1 year ago
@ThegnThrand Look yet this:
/watch?v=oo0z_R59P8M
/watch?v=LzHYqehsAYA
GregorMar 11 months ago
Fantastic. I'd like to see soem non-chroeagraphed sabre though. Both these guys look like they capable of exceptional free play with the sabre and I think that would be worth more to practioners than a pre-rehearsed sequence. Fantastic work though.
Quillons1 1 year ago
@Quillons1 Look yet on this samples below it is non-choreographed this is real fencing school not some show:
/watch?v=oo0z_R59P8M
/watch?v=LzHYqehsAYA
GregorMar 11 months ago
@GregorMar I believe this is a real school and I also believe that these guys are the real deal. I just think this particular piece is far to fluid and predictable to be "live" and not at least somewhat coordinated.
Quillons1 11 months ago
Masz ci los...tego od zawsze szukałem. Nie orientuje się ktoś z Was szanowni użytkownicy YT, czy na Pomorzu Środkowym nie ma podobnej grupy zajmującej się ćwiczeniami z szablą?
VanDenSimonen 1 year ago
Widac ze polska krew;D
smok2999 1 year ago
Wonderfull!!!
Gladiusludius 1 year ago
Besser als Kendo
Pepe87ms 1 year ago
Iarroganti
On behalf of that pair of fancing guys, please could you make your question much clear?
Your questions are really interested.
We are very interesting in providing you with all technical information of Polish way of fencing but we need to understand well your intention. If you kind to translate the former English questions in simple way we will be very pleased.
74Damarina 1 year ago
@74Damarina He is using terms that are used in Rapier Fencing. The Debole (otherwise known as the Foible) is the half of the blade that has the tip. In rapier fencing this is never used defensively (except against a thrust, even then it's not looked highly upon).
He is asking whether sabre fencing, particularly polish style, has a distinction between different parts of the blade and why they have that reasoning. he is also asking if parries are *allowed* with any part of the blade.
CruelSculpture 1 year ago
Very nice, I really like your videos.
I have a question about the technique. It looked like you were doing some parries with the debole/foible of the blade. That feels off to me, but I have never worked with curved blades. Does the Polish system make any distinction on parrying with the forte or the debole, or does the curved natire of the blade make that less important?
iarroganti 1 year ago
there is a sword foe slashing from horse-back which has the weight at the point end...i bought some in Poland...
POLMAZURKA 1 year ago
you can see that these are not the swords with there mass at the end of the blade...
POLMAZURKA 1 year ago
@POLMAZURKA what sword has mass on its end? i would say saber has center of mass waaay further than typical swords.
perdurabo1 1 year ago
very impressive indeed!
rmckim 1 year ago
I am very impressed with your video's, could you tell me where the style of szabla that you practice comes from, is it a handed down system or one that has had to be re-constructed from old fencing manuals?
TheDRACOMUNDI 2 years ago
@TheDRACOMUNDI
This is re-constructed from old Polish fencing manuals as well as based on the step-by-step practices with old kinds of sabres while training seasons.
74Damarina 2 years ago
Thank you, I mostly pracice the style of sabre fencing of the 19th century swordsman Alfred Hutton. There are a lot of simularities with the Polish style, although it is not exactly the same. I really like the fencing that you guys are doing. I wish that we had some Polish instructors here in England.
TheDRACOMUNDI 2 years ago
@TheDRACOMUNDI
To say more this is a freestyle fancing training based on Polish military tradition. Compare with theatre way of fencing that is completely free and non-arranged.
I know it because I have some practise with that fencing together with these guys.
74Damarina 2 years ago