Oil-Based Finish Basics

[themfromspace]

link should be left handed...

[TheWoodWhisperer]

@themfromspace although in the cartoon, he was right-handed. :)

[Strykercom1]

if im doing a finish on pylwood, should i hit it with shellac first then an oil varnish blend?

[TheWoodWhisperer]

@Strykercom1 I wouldn't. The shellac can seal the wood preventing the oil from curing properly. If you want to pre-seal with shellac, I would just use varnish and not an oil/varnish blend.

[Strykercom1]

@TheWoodWhisperer i was thinking that the shellac would be needed to prevent blotching? would i be okay going right with the oil varnish blend? or a straight wiping varnish?

[TheWoodWhisperer]

@Strykercom1 depends on the species. But in most cases you'll probably be fine if its just a clear coat. but if its a blotch prone wood species, you can do the shellac coat but just leave the pure oil out of the top coat.

[Strykercom1]

@TheWoodWhisperer its a birch plywood with a maple faceframe

[TheWoodWhisperer]

@Strykercom1 yeah probably not a bad idea to give it a little washcoat of dewaxed shellac. Lightly sand the surface with 320, wipe off the dust, and then start with your topcoats of varnish or wiping varnish.

[Strykercom1]

@TheWoodWhisperer is there a way to de wax a waxed shellac

for some reason my home center doesnt carry dewaxed

[TheWoodWhisperer]

@Strykercom1 you can usually pour off the clear solution and leave the waxy stuff in the bottom. There will still be some wax in it but that's probably good enough.

[lordmetroid]

If I want to make kitchen cabinets, natural wood is hard to clean and wipe off as the dust and possible food stuff tend to curl up to the surface. What kind of varnish would be recommended for shelving or would it be better to add a sheet of melamine?

[TheWoodWhisperer]

@lordmetroid If frequent and somewhat aggressive cleaning is expected, then yes, you are probably better off with some sort of melamine or laminate. But if you do want to go with a varnish, just about any standard polyurethane would be quite protective and resistant to moisture and abrasion.

[shapein]

Nice video. The problem with linseed oil is the smell. Disgusting. Tung smells great.

[Strykercom1]

great video

could i do a varnish over an oil finish?

[TheWoodWhisperer]

@Strykercom1 Sure can. Just make sure the oil is cured well.

[beyonose]

Wow great video -

by the way what kind of Varnish should I have to use to make it my own oil+varnish blended Finisher.

Do I have to use water based varnish or oil based.

[TheWoodWhisperer]

@beyonose Any varnish or standard polyurethane will work for this. And this is referring to oil-based products only.

[vic7872]

i just emailed you, look forward to your reply

[vic7872]

do you have a direct email address i may send you an question regarding my last post?

[TheWoodWhisperer]

@vic7872 easiest thing to do is head to my website, and use the contact link in the footer.

[vic7872]

are you familiar with any "eco-friendly" varnishes or oil-varnish blends?

[TheWoodWhisperer]

@vic7872 One brand to check out is Tried & True. They make polymerized oils and varnish blends that are supposed to be more eco-friendly.

[ak99372]

You're videos are just amazing. I see a lot of DIY videos and I don't think I've seen anything close to yours when it comes to knowledge and quality. Kudos to you.

I have a question, maybe someone already asked or there is video. How do you remove the old stain? I know the best way would be to sand it but I have a high detailed cabinets which is almost impossible to sand and I tried all different varnish & stain removers but it just won't go. Do you have any advice, technique, product? Thanks!

[TheWoodWhisperer]

@ak99372 Thanks for the kind words. If you can't sand or strip the color out, the only thing I can think of would be to use bleach to neutralize the color. This may or may not work, but at least its worth a shot.

[ririshow]

Have you tried OSMO oil? Superb quality and a green product.

[TheWoodWhisperer]

@ririshow never heard of it. Its not Old Stinky Man Oil is it?  :)

[gawfdawg1]

Thanks

[gawfdawg1]

You mentioned blotching and Alder wood and applying a shellac as a first coat to prevent that. What do you mean by blotching?

[TheWoodWhisperer]

@gawfdawg1 blotching just means the uneven light and dark areas you sometimes see on stained woods. If you Google "blotchy wood", then look at the images, you'll see some examples.

[AlaskanEagle99688]

With any water-based finish, you can add a drop or two of vanilla extract. It will all but mask the orginal aroma of the product being used, and turn it into a very 'kitcheny' smell. Very good for those indoor projects.

[lykndamuzic]

Do you need UV lighting for oil/varnish finishes to cure properly?

[TheWoodWhisperer]

@lykndamuzic Nope. Just air. It cures by oxidation.

[BahenaLeo]

You can apply the "formula" 1/3 over stain? I mean, apply first the stain, and after to give little shinne, can I apply the formula 1/3?

[TheWoodWhisperer]

@BahenaLeo Yes, this finish can be used over a cured stain. Just wipe on and wipe off the excess.

[rockonku]

Hi - I'm in the process of installing hardwood stairs and landing? I've got the treads and flooring made, now need to finish. Do you recommend Arm-R-Seal? If not, what would be the best?

[TheWoodWhisperer]

@rockonku Well the best finish is the one that you can apply properly and effectively. There are many finishes that will work for stairs. I do beileve Arm R Seal would be a decent choice, although most coating for flooring are made with a higher amount of solids, so that they stand up to the constant wear and tear. I yes you can use Arm-R-Seal, but I might also take a look at some specific flooring products.

[LightningBugSF]

When you say strip it, do you mean use a chemical stripper?

[TheWoodWhisperer]

@LightningBugSF yessir!

[LightningBugSF]

I've got VG doug fir windows (interior) that I conditioned first. Yesterday I stained with Zar (I mixed cherry with honey maple) and today under natural light it looks a little too dark. Can I lighten it? I've heard different opinions: bleach, mineral spirits, sanding. What do you think?

[TheWoodWhisperer]

@LightningBugSF Well if you got stain douglas fir to look good, even if a little dark, I hate to see you mess with it. But you gotta do what you gotta do right? Mineral spirits probably won't affect it. Bleach is hard to control. I would probably strip, sand, and try again with a different stain. if you just sand alone, that won't make it lighter. it will just make it look patchy.

[RenataDoes]

We put in Douglas Fir solid wood windows and have sanded, conditioned, stained, brushed one coat of a thinned out sanding sealer (Zar) and the brush strokes are visible. What do we do? What do we sand with steel wool or sand paper? Also, what final top coat product should I use to finish sealing the windows and trim. So far, I'm not happy with the Zar.

Thank you for the great information!

[TheWoodWhisperer]

@RenataDoes I would sand with 220 to knock down the brush strokes and smooth the surface. For a topcoat, you can use any topcoat you like. One of the easiest to apply is a wiping varnish. Minwax makes one that works well. The key is you use a cotton rag to apply it instead of a brush, so no brush strokes and not runs or sags.

[Mueiwark]

I have a question: Scratched Tung oil surfaces can be repaired easily by putting on another layer. But, what if you had a tung oil finish with wax (or other) on top of it? You can't just wipe on Tung oil or can you?

[TheWoodWhisperer]

Yes that's correct. The wax will prevent the oil from absorbing. So what you do depends on the severity of the scratch. Worse case scenario, you can scrape and wipe off the wax with mineral spirits. Sand to repair the scratch, then reapply oil and wax.

[Mueiwark]

Thx for the reply. So putting wax on oil finishes might not always be a good idea.. Sure it looks very nice, but that way it's only good for decorative objects, and not objects that get (ab)used frequently.

[TheWoodWhisperer]

Yup. And frankly, I wouldn't use a straight oil finish on anything that will see frequent use. That is with the exception of projects where abuse is likely, such as a workbench or cutting board.

[otto5656]

I am thinking about making a kitchen table. My wife wants the look of the tables you see at pottery barn or restoration hardware. That really dark finish, and not a high gloss. What do I use to get that finish? I have not really even decided on a wood just because I do not know what finish will take the best on what wood for that dark of a color. Any advise?

[TheWoodWhisperer]

That can be a tricky finish to replicate by hand. I would start by using a base color of dye to give a nice dark background, then hit it with General Finishes Java Gel stain. That will get you pretty darn close.

[otto5656]

When you say a base color of dye are you talking about something I mix myself or something already made? What do you think of making the table out of birch? I think it is hard enough, takes stain well and since I am going so dark, I do not see a reason to spend a bunch on expensive wood. Any thoughts? Lastly, I would just like to say that I appreciate your help. I have asked questions before and you always get back to me and are always very helpful. Thanks.

[TheWoodWhisperer]

Either one: pre-mixed or make your own. I like the General Finishes Water-Based dyes myself. Birch is a nice wood, but is notoriously difficult to stain evenly. might not matter though with the dark color you are going for. If you want to email me, we can get a little deeper into the process.

[otto5656]

I would appreciate that , I do not have your email address.

[TheWoodWhisperer]

They won't let me type an email address into the comments here. You can use the contact form on our site. There should be a link to our site on our Youtube page. They don't make it easy for us here, lol

[marcelly1300]

I just purchased a 2-1/2" thick 14' long slab of eastern walnut from North Carolina and brought it to florida to make a bar and finish the top ,how soon should I get it sanded and oiled I was going to do a either a boiled linseed oil and mineral spirits 50/50. or a tung oil. any suggestions. the bar will end up back in north carolina,under cover but outside.

[TheWoodWhisperer]

Personally, I don't think oils alone offer enough protection for an outdoor bar top.  I would go with an exterior grade varnish, like Epifanes.

[marcelly1300]

@TheWoodWhisperer do I have to worry about checking or warping when the finish is applied?and I am not familiar with Epifanes is this a film?

[marcelly1300]

@TheWoodWhisperer should I cut it with mineral spirits and do thin coats over a longer term?

[TheWoodWhisperer]

Yes it is a film. I would definitely thin with mineral spirits and you might just follow the instructions on the can.

And the only reason to worry about checking and warping is if the wood is still wet. That would be a concern no matter what finish you use.

[marcelly1300]

@TheWoodWhisperer thanks for your help!

[cornflakesnwater]

Can I apply Clear Hardner over a tung oil finish...????? and thanks for the videos

[TheWoodWhisperer]

What do you mean by "clear hardener"? Are you talking about something like a polyurethane? If so, yes. The finishes are compatible. Just give the pure tung oil a few days to cure.

[ronwagen]

I'm a beginner, i've just made a table. The legs are made from 4x4 soft wood. It has already started to crack! What can i apply to stop it cracking further?

[TheWoodWhisperer]

You may not be able to depending on how severe the cracking is and why its happening. Where did you get the wood? Was it construction lumber from a big box store?

[ronwagen]

Yeh just cheap construction lumber, basically i was just making a prototype, so if theres nothing i can do i'll just go out and by a better grade of 4x4 (any suggestions on what kind of wood they make in 4x4?)

[TheWoodWhisperer]

Yeah unfortunately what you are seeing is cracking as a result of the wood drying. The key is to use kiln-dried stock for your projects. You'll have to see if anyone in your area carries 16/4 stock. you should be able to find some fir or southern yellow pine depending on where you live.  Otherwise, call some local hardwood dealers and see what they carry in the thicker sticks.

[crustycrayon]

oh no!!! dont ruin your Legend Of Zelda shirt!

[zfair3850]

How much would it cost to assemble the basic wood working tools new and/or used.

[TheWoodWhisperer]

Honestly, that's a question I can't really answer. There is just too much variability in tool quality, prices and preferences. Not to mention most folks setup as they go, buying one tool at a time as needed, starting with the most important ones first (depends on your type of woodworking).

[shon9514]

I've spent about $2500 so far, but I buy garbage, ..well... box store tools, bought them all on sale, so add another thousand at full price, and I still need sanders of most kinds......good luck. Peace.

[Ludo9627]

what i meant to say was that i tried to mix lacquer with mineral spirits... it looked like egg drip soup!

[TheWoodWhisperer]

Ahh yes. Sounds delicious! lol. Mineral spirits for oil based finishes and lacquer thinner for lacquer. Should keep the soup away. :)

[otto5656]

I am finishing up a maple workbench. Are you saying you would use linseed rather than tung? Is that linseed on your bench? It looks light in color. I think I am like most guys here. I will work really hard to make sure every cut and mortise is perfect and the I will just destroy the whole thing by putting the wrong finish or the right finish the wrong way on it.

[TheWoodWhisperer]

On my bench I would probably use BLO, simply because its cheaper. No reason to waste tung oil on a bench. And I would likely just add a little varnish to the mix for a bit of extra protection. And that's really about it.

[otto5656]

Sorry to be a pest but what kind of varnish and when you say a little?

[TheWoodWhisperer]

Any polyurethane will do. And a typical oil/varnish blend would be 1/3 varnish, 1/3 linseed oil, and 1/3 mineral spirits. I would make a similar mixture, but add a little less varnish to the mix.

[GamingDrummer89]

I like how you bring up the reality of varnish finishes appearing "plastic-y" in this video. One thing that's worked for me before when I want a visible film (especially with a high gloss so you can see yourself in the finish when you look in it) but still want some grain to come through clearly, I apply the first coat really lightly so the grain still is apparently coming through, and then I apply the rest normally (i.e. medium-light thickness).

Awesome Zelda shirt, too! Best games ever! :)

[rsidntevil]

nice shirt. are you a gamer?

[TheWoodWhisperer]

Sure am!

[bkraz333]

This was really informative. Thanks very much for posting!

[TheLumberjackass]

hi marc,

for me, this is most informative video you have made.

like alot of other people, im in the category of " being able to make nice wood projects that look good, but adding a finish is where it all goes wrong ".

i blame manufacturers for this. they process products that tell you their item is what you need, but upon use, looks utterly horrible.

in the end, its a personal thing, as well as experience. you have to find a finish that works for you by trying all of them out lol :)

[Jkelquedi]

good video, I want to stain different things, and your videos are very helpful, thanks