God exists, that's the accepted claim by the majority of people, you want to challenge that, bring the evidence, the burden of proof is on YOU. Some narrow minded atheist proposed the wrong notion that atheism doesn't require evidence and many gullible atheists had run to foolishly embrace it. Philosophically the burden of proof is in the argument challenging the establishment. What evidence you have that atheism is true? None, zero, nada. Open your eyes, you're being deceived by an evil cult.
I have just been shocked by one religious nut bag saying that ‘man is born with an evil heart’ and that children have ‘a natural affection for cruelty and being bad’. I was absolutely taken aback; this is the mentality of someone who is so fucked up they are actually criminally insane. It was a horrible, horrible thought that a child ever be at their mercy.
Sin is the transgression of the law of God and if you don't believe in God then His law apparently was not transgressed and sin would not apply; for it would be as bogus as God Himself. What logic. Talk about cement head -- You deal with it your way; I'll stick with the Bible.
Yes. The Bible is the Ultimate and Unerring Word of God!
Unless you bow down and worship a God who supports the killing of innocent children in a murderous human sacrifice, you will burn in hell for eternity!
Christians often do not come to the table with an open mind and that is why this presenter cut this caller off. It is no good a person coming to the discussion claiming that they 'know' everything because it says so in their book. The Four Horsemen deal with this subject well in their discussion.
So much misunderstanding, so much, brother and sister read the Holy Quran and save your souls. Islam is moral; it is the wisdom of Allah the ruler of the universe. The lover of your souls, so seek him out, Allah will forgive you and bless you in this life and the next. Peace my friends
So much misunderstanding, so much, brother and sister read the Holy Quran and save your souls. Islam is moral; it is the wisdom of Allah the ruler of the universe. The lover of your souls, so seek him out, Allah will forgive you and bless you in this life and the next. Peace my friends
@Jason987262 Religion. The biggest load of bullshit humans ever invented
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Then how can you delude yourself and "invented" and believe that hydrogen and oxygen, electrons and protons, should first produce themselves, then be the source for all other beings, and finally decree the laws that regulate themselves and the rest of the material world?
@1tabligh Look, I could lay out the scientific process of how these particles came about, but it wouldnt matter because nothing I say will change your mind because you desperately want this stuff to be true. Its as simple as this: We evolved intelligence and self awareness, and because of that we became aware of our death. In order to ease the anxiety of that we invented religion that gave the concept of eternal afterlife from the 1st prehistoric shamans right up to all the stuff we have now.
@Jason987262 How can it be supposed that belief in the existence of God is the acceptance of contradiction, whereas belief in the uncaused nature of an effect such as matter is not contradictory?
How could it be believed that matter should itself be the origin of millions of attributes and characteristics and thus be the equivalent of the purposeful, wise and all-knowing Creator?
@1tabligh How do you know that it was an all knowing creator? because the bible says so? Thats a scientific book is it? It could of just been a fluke, it could be this universe is just the lastest big bang in a endless multiverse of big bangs, we dont know. There are several scientific theories about what caused the big bang, no of which involve a supernatural creator. But the only way we are going to find out the truth is through science, not a bronze age religion made up by goat herders
@Jason987262 ...theories about what caused the big bang,...
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If you will still persist in your ignorance at least assure me as to when this *big bang* created itself-whether it did it before it came into existence, or afterwards?
If you say afterwards, your assertion is absurd. Because it is impossible for a thing to create its own self when it was already created.
@1tabligh My ignorance? I'm not the one who believes in fairy tales. There are several scientific theories for might have caused the initial singularity to explode into the big bang. But they are only speculative theories. WE DONT KNOW what really happened. But at least science admits that. You religious people say that you do know for sure, despite the fact that you have no evidence to prove it. I suggest you read a science book instead of a book full of made up stories from the bronze age
@1tabligh In quantum physics there is something called quantum flucuations, in which particles come into existence out of the quantum vaccum, aka nothing. This is one of the leading theories for what brought the singularity into existence. Then the singularity exploded, that was the big bang. Please, go and look it up.
@1tabligh #Groan# Its obvious you have no scientific education. I told you to go and look it up, but you didnt even bother did you? You have no idea what im talking about and it's a waste of time trying to explain it.
I'd get more satisfaction talking to a brick wall.
@Jason987262 Its obvious you have no scientific education
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The atheist Delusion!
Your delusions that science has put out the notion of God is purely *rhetorical* and has nothing to do with logical method, because even thousands of scientific experiments could not possibly suffice to demonstrate that no non-material being or factor exists.
Your claim is nothing more than a *fanatical* illusion based on unproven theories. ...
@1tabligh Fanactical? I'm not the one that believes in a religion that makes people blow themselves in suicide bombings in the name of their god, or that non-believers, infidels, should be killed. When's the last time you saw a scientist do that. So don't call me fanactical.
Views such as these derive directly from a system of thought centered on materialism; within it, everything is defined and delimited with reference to materialism.
To interpret materialism in such a sense is in the final analysis strictly meaningless; it would be a superstitious notion involving the perversion of truth, and to regard it as scientific would, in fact, be *treason* to science.
Even if the followers of a religious school of thought had no proofs for their claim, ...
to conclude firmly and forcibly that non- being reigns beyond the sensory realm would be a non-scientific choice, based on imagination and speculation.
Some people try to propagate this *fantasy* in the garb of science and to present their choice as having been dictated by scientific thought. In the final analysis, however, the denial involved in such an assertion is unworthy of science and philosophy, and even *contradicts* empirical logic.
What is called science by the *science-worshippers* of the present age and regarded by them as equivalent to the sum total of *reality*, is simply a collection of laws applicable to a single dimension of the world. The result of all human effort and experimentation is a body of knowledge concerning a minute bright dot comparable to the dim light of a candle-surrounded by a dark night enveloping a huge desert of indefinite extent.
All praise is due to ALLAH, the Lord of the Universe.
Should the scientist, who is aware of the natural causes and of the factors determining each step of creation towards perfection, of mankind's evolution, of the minute accuracy and exactitude that rules every change in the nature that surrounds us, come to believe that these wondrous laws and amazing interactions have somehow *fortuitously* emerged out of *mindless* matter?
How could some of the scientists permit themselves to make a claim that would necessitate knowledge as extensive as the scheme of the universe, when their knowledge of the total scheme of being is *close* to zero, when confronted with a whole mass of unknowns concerning this very earth and tangible, lifeless matter, let alone the whole universe?
How is that for YOUR "I'd get more satisfaction talking to a brick wall." and answer the questions instead of quibbling in vain?!
@1tabligh And what hard scientific evidence do you have for your 'Allah' existing? None. There is as much evidence for that as there is for elves, fairies, the greek and egyptian gods or whatever mythical creature you want to make up. Using your 'logic' you could say that these could exist as well. Do you believe in them? No? Why not? All your giving me is philosophical religious stuff that dosent prove anything to me. I have directed you to look actual evidence based scientific data.
@Jason987262 Do scientific discoveries and knowledge cause such a scientist to conclude that matter, *** unknowing and unperceiving ***, is his creator and that of all beings?
@1tabligh If that is what the data tells us, than yes. In the lack of any evidence otherwise what other conclusion can we draw? We can only go on the evidence we have. Science tells us how things really are not how we want them to be, it's objective not subjective like religion is. Thats hard for some people to accept, but thats how it is. I guess thats why a lot of people turn to religion, because it gives a nice comforting view. Myself I want to know the truth about reality and the Universe.
@Jason987262 Science tells us how things really are not how we want them to be, it's objective not subjective like religion is.
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Concerning Experimentalists
Let us for a short while inquire about those who glorify experimentation and scientific understanding, and who declare with full pride that they do not adopt any view unless confirmed by experiments and demonstrated empirically. (They continue saying) that since the theological position is concerned with invisible things
If what is meant by their words is that they do not accept the existence of anything except if they have direct sense perception of chat thing, and they reject any idea except if they grasp its "objective" reality by one of their senses, then this will be a *blow* to the whole scientific edifice and a falsification of all the major truths that are demonstrated by the experiments they glorify.
A demonstration of a scientific truth by experimentation does not mean a direct sense perception of that truth in the scientific field.
When Newton, for example, put forth the law of general gravity in light of experimentation, did he perceived this gravity force by any of his five senses.?
@lucariofan508 When Newton, for example, put forth the law of general gravity in light of experimentation, he had *not* perceived this gravity force by any of his five senses.
Instead, he discovered it by way of another perceptible phenomenon for which he found no explanation except by supposing the gravity force. He noticed that the planets do not move in a straight line. Rather, they have a circular motion. According to Newton, this phenomenon ...
But he had to SEE it to notice it, didn't he? That's part of his observation which is that he had to actually witness it. "that hydrogen and oxygen, electrons and protons, should first produce themselves" Who said we did?
could not occur had there not been a gravity force. The reason is that the principle of essential deficiency requires chat a body move in a straight direction unless another manner [of movement] is imposed on it from an external force. From this, Newton obtained the law of gravity that asserts that the planets are subject to a central force, which is gravity. If these experimentalists who advocate and glorify experimentation intend the same method ...
by means of which the forces and secrets of the universe are discovered scientifically - namely, the study of a fixed perceptible phenomenon by experimentation and the rational inference of another thing from that phenomenon as the only explanation of the existence of that phenomenon - then this is *exactly* the method of demonstrating the *theological* position.
Then how can the atheists delude themselve and believe that hydrogen and oxygen, electrons and protons, should first produce themselves, then be the source for all other beings, and finally decree the laws that regulate themselves and the rest of the material world?
@1tabligh That's a strawman and has nothing to do with this argument. However, I don't think you'll find an atheist that thinks elections, protons, atoms and quarks just magically popped into existed. There is an explanation for it. But as of now, nobody knows the answer. Scientists are working on figuring out the answer to the origin of life, the universe, and just about everything we don't understand. The main answer you will here is "I don't know."
@EliteKiller07 How can it be supposed that belief in the existence of God is the acceptance of contradiction, whereas belief in the uncaused nature of an effect such as matter is not contradictory?
How could it be believed that matter should itself be the origin of millions of attributes and characteristics and thus be the equivalent of the purposeful, wise and all-knowing Creator?
Read my previous comment again, I'm not saying that. What I am saying is "I don't know". I'm not claiming that matter as we know it is the origin, i'm not claiming that God is the origin. Nobody knows right now so it would be foolish to make huge assumptions like that. There is no contradiction in this reason.
No hocus - pocus izzy - wizzy abracadabra TISHHHH!
Oh, LÖÖK! WOW! "quantum flucuations, in which particles come into existence out of the quantum vaccum, aka nothing." WITHOUT A MAGICIAN!
From NOTHING comes NOTHING!
Any supposable phenomenon in the universe was submerged in the darkness of non-being before it assumed the form of being. It cannot pierce the darkness of non-being and step forth on the plain of being as an existent thing until the powerful hand of causality sets to work.
The purpose of your assertion would be that the *big bang* made itself twice. It would mean that its first endeavours consisted in creating itself, and when it was quite ready and created, it created itself again. This is the most *absurd* and impossible theory-the acquisition of what is already acquired.
If you say that it created itself before it came into existence, it is really *stupid*. Because it was absolutely nothing before it came into existence.
How is it possible for a non-existing thing to create another thing (*big bang*) ? You consider my belief in an existing thing (God) that creates another non-existing thing (*big bang*) as absurd. But you do not consider your own, as to the non-existing thing having the power to create an already existing thing,(*big bang*) as absurd and stupid.
Be yourself the judge, and tell me whose theory is absurd and irrational.?
In the name of Allah, the Most Gracious, the Most Merciful.
"Do not the Unbelievers see that the heavens and the earth (Universe) were joined together as one unit (atom) of creation, before we clove (exploded) them asunder? We made from water every living thing. Will they not then believe?"
@1tabligh Christian, muslim you are all the same to me. Dont quote your religous texts because it dosen't mean anything to me. I am only interested in scientific theories and evidence.
But the only way we are going to find out the truth is through science,
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Before he enters the realm of science and knowledge with all its concerns, man is able to perceive certain truths by means of these innate perceptions. But after entering the sphere of science and philosophy and filling his *brain* with various proofs and deductions, he may forget his natural and innate perceptions or begin to doubt them. It is for this reason that when man moves beyond his innate nature to
One of the most destructive and misleading factors in thoughts concerning God is to restrict one's thought to the "logic" of the empirical sciences and to *fail* to recognize the *limits* and boundaries of that "logic".
Is that which is necessary in essence and which is considered the first source of existence matter itself or something else beyond the limits of matter?
Brilliant. Religion has shackled its believers into bondage...and like the elephant who was chained to a spike most of its life, finally is set free, remains chained emotionally and mentally not wanting to go forward in its new freedom...this is like most people, afraid to think for themselves. i look forward to the day when religion becomes the minority and practiced behind closed doors or locked up in mental institutions (j/p)
Man that caller just WOULDN'T SHUT UP would he? Matt was being courteous letting him finish his sentence (well most of the time) and that caller just kept talking even after he said to let him finish (most of the time). It's disappointing how the caller just couldn't answer that question without bringing up what his "God" would do.
ow can you judge morality whithout god if god dose not exist then there is no standerd of morality and if god dose not exist then someone like hitler is just as moral as mother taresa
@codyaustinpemberton No, what the fuck makes you say that? Our culture decides what morality is. We don't think Hitler is moral because in our culture, we look down on genocide. In Nazi Germany, Hitler would be considered good. All because of different cultural boundaries.
@Annulable if we are only the product of evolution then why is your cultures morality superior to the Nazis after all if we are just an advanced species of primates then morality is only an opinion
@codyaustinpemberton I think our culture is morally superior because it does not condone genocide. Mind you, I THINK our culture is superior, a Nazi would not think the same about it. That's the entire point, morality is subjective. Does this mean that anything goes? Of course not, otherwise society wouldn't work, we have based our society around the idea that you shouldn't do to others what you don't want them to do to you, and this has been proven to sustain a successful society.
@codyaustinpemberton Yes. Not raping, murdering and stealing simply because you get punished for it is not morality, it's looking after yourself. But when you avoid harming someone or stealing their belongings because you don't wish to cause harm to that person, that is a form of morality. In my opinion, raping, murdering and stealing is morally wrong.
@Annulable I do not observe the same thing as you did. I do not see how people avoid doing to others what they do not want to be done to themselves, despite most of their actions being legal.
@codyaustinpemberton "Morality" = things to do to not fuck up the human race. I do believe even dogs know not to go on rampages and rape every goddamn dog they see, or kill every dog. Wolves are smart enough to know that if they work together and not steal from that group/eachother, they will benefit more by the amount of work they put in = larger gain. It's not complicated.
"Limiting the rights and freedoms of others in order to make them abide by your standards - That's a sin".
Is this not a reasonable application of law? Do the uncertainty we have in our own moral values become less important as we have to implement "what works" for a concordant society? Surely this is an argument ad populum?
When GOD unleashed the Universe, I was there. When He started creating the world, I was there. And when He was working the trees and rocks and lakes and plants, I was there to see it.
As I look through the comments and ratings on videos with atheistic view points, compared to the theist videos, I Cant help to notice something odd. It seems for such a small minority of people, that the 5 star ratings for videos supporting atheistic view points, are far higher than that supporting theism.
This might be an induction of a large number of closet atheist. Has anyone else noticed this?
Many people dun realize that God is not sending you to hell, but satan is dragging you to hell, and there's nothing God can do about it, cuz he gave us free will. And the "God" I at least believe in is a loving God, so whatever "God" figure you sick ppl are thinking of isn't MY "God".
@LZKS So if there's nothing God can do about it, how is he all powerful? He's not, because omnipotence is a logical fallacy. Go and read your Bible, all of it, and you'll see many examples of your imaginary friend being a vindictive, uncaring, petty and spiteful creation.
There was a more recent episode with a caller who said that if "God" told him to kill his children, he would do it.
Theists see morality as coming from authority, not from what is right. If "God" tells you to do something, it is moral to do it, no matter how heinous the act is.
Well, Jesus came to forgive us of our sins, and surely he should forgive them all, not just some.
Also in Luke 23:39-43 he forgives one of the two that where crucified with him, and I assume his deeds where great (magnitude) and bad, but he was still forgiven.
If Christianity is true, then there can be serial killers and paedophiles in heaven, like some catholic priests would be there which have molested children.
One mistake with his rant.believing in god/jesus and accepting him as your lord isnt one of or the main one of Gods criteria, it is the ONLY one. You can freely go and kill, torture, lie, force someone to be your slave, cheat on someone, steal, etc, just so long as you accpet god, and jesus as your lord and saviour, and pray to him forgiveness every once in a while, you get to go to heaven.
No, he said that if people did wrong they would be punished, which isn't true. His children analogy was incorrect with god, if his kiddie murders someone, and then says please forgive me im sorry, he wouldnt get punished
more educated christians will take passages like that and create a defense out of it that actually holds SOME water, though it does often seem shaky. However there IS reason in it contrary to the popular athiest opinion that all theist are fucktards and atheism is the only rational belief in existence. Atheists should stop preaching to the dumbest ten percent of theists if they want any respect
i think jesus had a little cop out to cover all that slavery and killing in the old testament. He said something along the lines of god making those laws becaue the people wanted them. The basic idea was that the people had to be civilized slowly i thinkk, and that jesus brought the true message of how to live best. Also, the majority of jewish law was decided to not apply to christians in Acts of the Apostles.
Which flies in the face of the notion of a perfect, absolutely immutable god and his divine law. If divine law can be changed then it's not perfect (or wasn't perfect in the past). If it's not perfect then it's not divine.
I dont know why people are bashing Jesus over this.. He didnt start any religion! It was the people who wrote the bible. Jesus didnt force you to worship him. He didnt threaten people with damnation and hellfire and things.. He was just a good person. Its the bible that is making up some things. Just like Gandhi was a good person so its not bad to like Gandhi. The bible wasn't written by Jesus..
You know what worries me most about this guy? He seems to think people have changed in the last 2-3 thousand years. People are as dumb and dependent as they ever were and many of them really do need someone to tell them basic things about how to be good people. We're going to have to resolve the question of who and how to tell them before we can cosider leaving religion behind, and thats totally aside of belief in God.
I know that I am a decent being. I have done nothing to deserve an eternity of torture. Do you really think that unless you say your Jesus prayer and worship an unseen God that you deserve such punishment? No. Our man-made laws are always being updated for a reason. It would be stupid for us to live according to the Bible's "morality": owning slaves, silencing our women, and murdering whoever we think God wants us to murder. That's not morality, QQOQQ, and you know it. You're better than that.
You know that the Bible specifies that eating Shellfish is an abomination, correct? I surely hope you haven't done that in your life. It also specifies that menstruating women can't enter church and that children who curse their parents names are to be stoned to death.
It's funny that you mention man-made laws are constantly being updated. They are done so because we are growing morally as a society. Many MANY verses of the bible are not applicable to modern day society. The bible says women should not speak in church, slaves should obey their human masters, women discovered not to be virgins on their wedding night are subject to stoning... I could go on, but the point is, claiming such a book as still being relevant in our society is absolutely absurd.
Oh yes, the "where do our morals come from?" question again. They are simply a by-product of human interaction. We essentially have to live with one another by a "do unto others" rule of thumb or we will all wipe each other out of existence. I don't want to rape, rob, or murder because I don't want anyone to rape, rob, or murder me, not because the bible says it's wrong. Cats don't typically go around killing each other for no reason, but I can assure you they didn't learn it from the bible.
Actually it is considered a golden rule that appears in The Eloquent Peasant, written over 1600 years before Jesus Christ even existed, and rephrased again over 300 years before Jesus existed. So no, it's not Biblical, and no, I am not a Christian.
And for the record, I absolutely do not care if those verses were for the Jews, that doesn't make them OKAY. They are bigoted, sexist verses written by the same set of men who supposedly wrote the moral code you claim is still applicable. Many people understood it was probably a good idea NOT to run around ruining other people's lives long before the Bible was written. Many people today are raised free of the bible and they understand those same principles. It's only hard for people like you
Okay... that's still not a response to anything. You do exactly what every other Christian does when faced with debate and dance around questions or change the subject. They ARE bigoted, and they ARE sexist, and if you agree that they are okay to apply to any sex or any ethnicity in modern day society, then you are a bigot and you are sexist, and I have no interest in debating you.
I'd go with the latter. The difference between an explanation and an excuse is an excuse only seems valid to two groups: the ones making it and the ones who were already convinced to begin with.
this is from your 5th line. maybe because if we're nice to someone their more likely to be nice to us.....& religion has no right to talk about morals since EVERY religion has done wrongs that they haven't really made up for yet
Children aren't responsible for what they do, until they grow old... how old by the way?
But when they reach that age, they're held accountable for the crime of being born? I probably shouldn't put it that way, but sin is inherited in the Biblical context, as "all" are held "guilty" for Adam's sin... which, sadly, is eating the wrong fruit. The fruit of the knowledge of right and wrong.
It´s hard for religious people to, trust me, I know.
Religion does not help you when you know that you might die very soon but you are just awake enough to know it, when the only family that is with you to say good bye is your husband because you are in another country, far away from your children and grandchildren.
If there is a god, be it yours or any other, he, she, it ,is a god damn asshole and is must certainly evil or atlest not very caring about us.
"When you have a personal relationship with someone, you want to physically spend time with them. Thats how I feel for Jesus".
Even though the internet can be a dodgy way to meet people, I'd stick with it. There's certainly a much better chance on here, than the fantasy your trying so hard to believe in.
Let it go M8, it doesn't matter how hard one tries, you know in the back of your mind how ridiculous it really all is. You know that it was written by primitive men when you think rationally.
"Have you actually went out into the world? Have you done any type of lab research?"
This would be a good argument, except that people test how chemistry works in schools every day, items such as heredity can be observed daily. If you doubt Einstein's equation, go right ahead, it's just worth noting that if Einstein was wrong, then the atom bomb should be nothing but a big dud.
Anyways, I want to note that faith in anecdotal evidence is not the same as understanding science.
Is "the scientist who's currently famous for having discovered e=mc2 believed in a god, than that means it's smart to believe in one" sort of the best argument you got? This is an old one, and just because Einstein was born in a Jewish family does NOT mean that him being religious early in life is what led him to his discovery. Also, Einstein's been outta the loop for several years now, so who's to judge? Besides, you're the one who believes that he's wrong.
No, granted I haven't personally done any of the research, ( I don't suppose you'de count am astronomy).
But you see, the scientific method being as rigorous as it is, means that we can generally trust it. (As far as one can trust anything). It's the reason our modern world works the way it does.
So when one reads about something that is trusted, one can be reasonably sure it's OK. Now when one reads others that agree, and yet others that back up yet others, Cont.---
As one reads more and more about the incredible efforts and achievements, a fuller and fuller picture builds up, and its getting more so all the time. Quite a large number will also back up another part of science in another area, there are a number of complementary fields to, like Cosmology/Physics.
I feel anyone not interested in these subjects, is simply missing out on getting a
"I have to eat to survive, so happens the food from the earth is delicious enough for me to eat.
I have a child growing in my belly, so happens that my breast produces milk for the child, that so happens to have all the nutritients my baby needs!"
Duh, it has to work if it's gonna reproduce and live (how natural selection works) and... I don't get how you could imagine that food was MADE for you to live. It's highly conceited. Not to mention that there's foods that kill you in nature.
No, no... to say "science" is responsible for the ozone layer hole (which religious extremists are ignoring for the sake of their own bloody profits) is retarded. And to pretend that all scientiffic advancement isn't that great (while using a computer, developed by science) while belief in God is supposedly better... ignores all medical science. Not to mention that, you have no tangible evidence for an afterlife. Or that your view of it is correct. It most likely isn't, if any were possible.
I can see how you eschew science, very clearly indeed.
How do you think the computer your now using, the internet, your mobile phone, just how do you imagine they happened? do you suppose your god poofed these into existance?
I wonder when you get ill, do you ignore medical advice, forego a trip to hospital, stay home and pray?
I somehow doubt it.
Words are very easy to say, especially when they're meaningless.
Wait wait, why did god put the tree of knowledge in the garden in the first place, and why did he let the talking snake be there? He had to know it was evil. Sound like god is a pretty messed up , I mean, he had to have made the snake, the snake was evil...
In the book of Numbers, the children of the Midianites were to be slaughtered in God's name... suddenly children aren't innocent. If you wanna say "all fall short of God's..." and such, then really... you're failing to understand what's going on. If a human wanted such genocide, you'd call him a monster. Unless you believed that if you even THOUGHT him to be wrong for even a second, you'd be given an unending punishment that is...
"Pharaoh tried to fight God. It cost him his honor, his people, his slaves, his army, his son, and his own life"
I know this... dude, why the hell do you think that these mentions which, basically are parts of some of the most absolutely immoral parts of the religion... the parts you wanna point to? I mean, God is killing CHILDREN, and for the actions of kings... according to you, such genocide and MURDER is perfectly acceptable in every way, shape, and form.
Proverbs 22:6 "Train up a child in the way he should go: and when he is old, he will not depart from it."
Train your children in the ways of God so when they get older, they will know not to fall into the temptations of the world. They will not desire to sin and disobey God's Word.
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God exists, that's the accepted claim by the majority of people, you want to challenge that, bring the evidence, the burden of proof is on YOU. Some narrow minded atheist proposed the wrong notion that atheism doesn't require evidence and many gullible atheists had run to foolishly embrace it. Philosophically the burden of proof is in the argument challenging the establishment. What evidence you have that atheism is true? None, zero, nada. Open your eyes, you're being deceived by an evil cult.
dejesusluisx 3 months ago
I have just been shocked by one religious nut bag saying that ‘man is born with an evil heart’ and that children have ‘a natural affection for cruelty and being bad’. I was absolutely taken aback; this is the mentality of someone who is so fucked up they are actually criminally insane. It was a horrible, horrible thought that a child ever be at their mercy.
ritchloui 7 months ago
I worship Matt because he's the most rational person and can make powerful rebuttals to religitard's arguments. Plus I like his list of 'sins'!
FallofDarkness55 8 months ago 4
Sin is the transgression of the law of God and if you don't believe in God then His law apparently was not transgressed and sin would not apply; for it would be as bogus as God Himself. What logic. Talk about cement head -- You deal with it your way; I'll stick with the Bible.
angrydude net
pbatusa 8 months ago
@pbatusa did you even watch this video...if not, watch again.
artwdog 2 months ago
Yes. The Bible is the Ultimate and Unerring Word of God!
Unless you bow down and worship a God who supports the killing of innocent children in a murderous human sacrifice, you will burn in hell for eternity!
This is the Word of the Lord.
prosperomage 16 hours ago
racism is a sin
sexism is a sin
feminism is a sin
war is a sin
ThePeacefulAtheistt 8 months ago 2
What trustworthy person wants to be a politician anyway?
globalist1789 10 months ago
Christians often do not come to the table with an open mind and that is why this presenter cut this caller off. It is no good a person coming to the discussion claiming that they 'know' everything because it says so in their book. The Four Horsemen deal with this subject well in their discussion.
simpsonmark 11 months ago
A good program. Keep up the good work. Greetings from Germany.
simpsonmark 11 months ago
I've made this same point with other people, then they just tell me to pray about it. I feel like slapping them.
imnotthisoldlol 1 year ago
"If you don't think for yourself, that's why you believe in a god!" I think that assertion went too far...
nowayout001 1 year ago
So much misunderstanding, so much, brother and sister read the Holy Quran and save your souls. Islam is moral; it is the wisdom of Allah the ruler of the universe. The lover of your souls, so seek him out, Allah will forgive you and bless you in this life and the next. Peace my friends
IslamandQuran2trutha 1 year ago
So much misunderstanding, so much, brother and sister read the Holy Quran and save your souls. Islam is moral; it is the wisdom of Allah the ruler of the universe. The lover of your souls, so seek him out, Allah will forgive you and bless you in this life and the next. Peace my friends
IslamandQuran2trutha 1 year ago
Religion. The biggest load of bullshit humans ever invented
Jason987262 1 year ago
@Jason987262 Religion. The biggest load of bullshit humans ever invented
____
Then how can you delude yourself and "invented" and believe that hydrogen and oxygen, electrons and protons, should first produce themselves, then be the source for all other beings, and finally decree the laws that regulate themselves and the rest of the material world?
1tabligh 11 months ago
@1tabligh Look, I could lay out the scientific process of how these particles came about, but it wouldnt matter because nothing I say will change your mind because you desperately want this stuff to be true. Its as simple as this: We evolved intelligence and self awareness, and because of that we became aware of our death. In order to ease the anxiety of that we invented religion that gave the concept of eternal afterlife from the 1st prehistoric shamans right up to all the stuff we have now.
Jason987262 11 months ago
@Jason987262 How can it be supposed that belief in the existence of God is the acceptance of contradiction, whereas belief in the uncaused nature of an effect such as matter is not contradictory?
How could it be believed that matter should itself be the origin of millions of attributes and characteristics and thus be the equivalent of the purposeful, wise and all-knowing Creator?
1tabligh 11 months ago
@1tabligh How do you know that it was an all knowing creator? because the bible says so? Thats a scientific book is it? It could of just been a fluke, it could be this universe is just the lastest big bang in a endless multiverse of big bangs, we dont know. There are several scientific theories about what caused the big bang, no of which involve a supernatural creator. But the only way we are going to find out the truth is through science, not a bronze age religion made up by goat herders
Jason987262 11 months ago
@Jason987262 ...theories about what caused the big bang,...
____
If you will still persist in your ignorance at least assure me as to when this *big bang* created itself-whether it did it before it came into existence, or afterwards?
If you say afterwards, your assertion is absurd. Because it is impossible for a thing to create its own self when it was already created.
cont..
1tabligh 11 months ago
@1tabligh My ignorance? I'm not the one who believes in fairy tales. There are several scientific theories for might have caused the initial singularity to explode into the big bang. But they are only speculative theories. WE DONT KNOW what really happened. But at least science admits that. You religious people say that you do know for sure, despite the fact that you have no evidence to prove it. I suggest you read a science book instead of a book full of made up stories from the bronze age
Jason987262 11 months ago
@Jason987262
Let us see YOUR scientific understanding.
Go to the laboratory, and do an experiment with little of NOTHING, and then mix it with a LOT of NOTHING, and GUESS WHAT!
YOU WILL GET THIS SPECTACULAR UNIVERSE!
From NOTHING comes NOTHING!
What science is this?
What man of science are you?
Come back when you get something out of nothing!
1tabligh 11 months ago
@1tabligh In quantum physics there is something called quantum flucuations, in which particles come into existence out of the quantum vaccum, aka nothing. This is one of the leading theories for what brought the singularity into existence. Then the singularity exploded, that was the big bang. Please, go and look it up.
Jason987262 11 months ago
@Jason987262 quantum flucuations, in which particles come into existence....aka nothing."
____
Go to the laboratory, and do an experiment with little of NOTHING, and then mix it with a LOT of NOTHING, and GUESS WHAT!
YOU WILL GET THE SPECTACULAR "quantum flucuations, in which particles come into existence out of the quantum vaccum, aka nothing."
From NOTHING comes NOTHING!
What science is this?
What man of science are you?
Come back when you get something out of nothing!
1tabligh 11 months ago
@1tabligh #Groan# Its obvious you have no scientific education. I told you to go and look it up, but you didnt even bother did you? You have no idea what im talking about and it's a waste of time trying to explain it.
I'd get more satisfaction talking to a brick wall.
Jason987262 11 months ago
@Jason987262 Its obvious you have no scientific education
____
The atheist Delusion!
Your delusions that science has put out the notion of God is purely *rhetorical* and has nothing to do with logical method, because even thousands of scientific experiments could not possibly suffice to demonstrate that no non-material being or factor exists.
Your claim is nothing more than a *fanatical* illusion based on unproven theories. ...
1tabligh 11 months ago
@1tabligh Fanactical? I'm not the one that believes in a religion that makes people blow themselves in suicide bombings in the name of their god, or that non-believers, infidels, should be killed. When's the last time you saw a scientist do that. So don't call me fanactical.
Jason987262 11 months ago
Views such as these derive directly from a system of thought centered on materialism; within it, everything is defined and delimited with reference to materialism.
To interpret materialism in such a sense is in the final analysis strictly meaningless; it would be a superstitious notion involving the perversion of truth, and to regard it as scientific would, in fact, be *treason* to science.
Even if the followers of a religious school of thought had no proofs for their claim, ...
1tabligh 11 months ago
to conclude firmly and forcibly that non- being reigns beyond the sensory realm would be a non-scientific choice, based on imagination and speculation.
Some people try to propagate this *fantasy* in the garb of science and to present their choice as having been dictated by scientific thought. In the final analysis, however, the denial involved in such an assertion is unworthy of science and philosophy, and even *contradicts* empirical logic.
1tabligh 11 months ago
What is called science by the *science-worshippers* of the present age and regarded by them as equivalent to the sum total of *reality*, is simply a collection of laws applicable to a single dimension of the world. The result of all human effort and experimentation is a body of knowledge concerning a minute bright dot comparable to the dim light of a candle-surrounded by a dark night enveloping a huge desert of indefinite extent.
All praise is due to ALLAH, the Lord of the Universe.
1tabligh 11 months ago
Should the scientist, who is aware of the natural causes and of the factors determining each step of creation towards perfection, of mankind's evolution, of the minute accuracy and exactitude that rules every change in the nature that surrounds us, come to believe that these wondrous laws and amazing interactions have somehow *fortuitously* emerged out of *mindless* matter?
1tabligh 11 months ago
How could some of the scientists permit themselves to make a claim that would necessitate knowledge as extensive as the scheme of the universe, when their knowledge of the total scheme of being is *close* to zero, when confronted with a whole mass of unknowns concerning this very earth and tangible, lifeless matter, let alone the whole universe?
How is that for YOUR "I'd get more satisfaction talking to a brick wall." and answer the questions instead of quibbling in vain?!
1tabligh 11 months ago
@1tabligh And what hard scientific evidence do you have for your 'Allah' existing? None. There is as much evidence for that as there is for elves, fairies, the greek and egyptian gods or whatever mythical creature you want to make up. Using your 'logic' you could say that these could exist as well. Do you believe in them? No? Why not? All your giving me is philosophical religious stuff that dosent prove anything to me. I have directed you to look actual evidence based scientific data.
Jason987262 11 months ago
@Jason987262 Do scientific discoveries and knowledge cause such a scientist to conclude that matter, *** unknowing and unperceiving ***, is his creator and that of all beings?
1tabligh 11 months ago
@1tabligh If that is what the data tells us, than yes. In the lack of any evidence otherwise what other conclusion can we draw? We can only go on the evidence we have. Science tells us how things really are not how we want them to be, it's objective not subjective like religion is. Thats hard for some people to accept, but thats how it is. I guess thats why a lot of people turn to religion, because it gives a nice comforting view. Myself I want to know the truth about reality and the Universe.
Jason987262 11 months ago
@Jason987262 Science tells us how things really are not how we want them to be, it's objective not subjective like religion is.
_______
Concerning Experimentalists
Let us for a short while inquire about those who glorify experimentation and scientific understanding, and who declare with full pride that they do not adopt any view unless confirmed by experiments and demonstrated empirically. (They continue saying) that since the theological position is concerned with invisible things
1tabligh 11 months ago
beyond the limits of the senses and experimentation,
we must case it aside, concentrating on the truths and knowledge that can be grasped in the experimental field.
We would ask the experimentalists, 'What do you intend by "experiment", and what do you mean by rejecting every doctrine not confirmed by the senses?'
1tabligh 11 months ago
If what is meant by their words is that they do not accept the existence of anything except if they have direct sense perception of chat thing, and they reject any idea except if they grasp its "objective" reality by one of their senses, then this will be a *blow* to the whole scientific edifice and a falsification of all the major truths that are demonstrated by the experiments they glorify.
1tabligh 11 months ago
A demonstration of a scientific truth by experimentation does not mean a direct sense perception of that truth in the scientific field.
When Newton, for example, put forth the law of general gravity in light of experimentation, did he perceived this gravity force by any of his five senses.?
1tabligh 11 months ago
@1tabligh
I believe he saw things stay (and fall) to the ground and felt an apple hit his head. But besides that, what exactly are you getting at?
lucariofan508 11 months ago
@lucariofan508 When Newton, for example, put forth the law of general gravity in light of experimentation, he had *not* perceived this gravity force by any of his five senses.
Instead, he discovered it by way of another perceptible phenomenon for which he found no explanation except by supposing the gravity force. He noticed that the planets do not move in a straight line. Rather, they have a circular motion. According to Newton, this phenomenon ...
1tabligh 11 months ago
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@1tabligh
But he had to SEE it to notice it, didn't he? That's part of his observation which is that he had to actually witness it. "that hydrogen and oxygen, electrons and protons, should first produce themselves" Who said we did?
lucariofan508 11 months ago
could not occur had there not been a gravity force. The reason is that the principle of essential deficiency requires chat a body move in a straight direction unless another manner [of movement] is imposed on it from an external force. From this, Newton obtained the law of gravity that asserts that the planets are subject to a central force, which is gravity. If these experimentalists who advocate and glorify experimentation intend the same method ...
1tabligh 11 months ago
by means of which the forces and secrets of the universe are discovered scientifically - namely, the study of a fixed perceptible phenomenon by experimentation and the rational inference of another thing from that phenomenon as the only explanation of the existence of that phenomenon - then this is *exactly* the method of demonstrating the *theological* position.
1tabligh 11 months ago
Then how can the atheists delude themselve and believe that hydrogen and oxygen, electrons and protons, should first produce themselves, then be the source for all other beings, and finally decree the laws that regulate themselves and the rest of the material world?
1tabligh 11 months ago
@1tabligh That's a strawman and has nothing to do with this argument. However, I don't think you'll find an atheist that thinks elections, protons, atoms and quarks just magically popped into existed. There is an explanation for it. But as of now, nobody knows the answer. Scientists are working on figuring out the answer to the origin of life, the universe, and just about everything we don't understand. The main answer you will here is "I don't know."
EliteKiller07 10 months ago
@EliteKiller07 How can it be supposed that belief in the existence of God is the acceptance of contradiction, whereas belief in the uncaused nature of an effect such as matter is not contradictory?
How could it be believed that matter should itself be the origin of millions of attributes and characteristics and thus be the equivalent of the purposeful, wise and all-knowing Creator?
1tabligh 10 months ago
@1tabligh
Read my previous comment again, I'm not saying that. What I am saying is "I don't know". I'm not claiming that matter as we know it is the origin, i'm not claiming that God is the origin. Nobody knows right now so it would be foolish to make huge assumptions like that. There is no contradiction in this reason.
EliteKiller07 10 months ago
@EliteKiller07 Is it at all feasible to regard all the geometry, functioning and movement of the universe as the outcome of matter in its ignorance?
1tabligh 10 months ago
No hocus - pocus izzy - wizzy abracadabra TISHHHH!
Oh, LÖÖK! WOW! "quantum flucuations, in which particles come into existence out of the quantum vaccum, aka nothing." WITHOUT A MAGICIAN!
From NOTHING comes NOTHING!
Any supposable phenomenon in the universe was submerged in the darkness of non-being before it assumed the form of being. It cannot pierce the darkness of non-being and step forth on the plain of being as an existent thing until the powerful hand of causality sets to work.
1tabligh 11 months ago
The purpose of your assertion would be that the *big bang* made itself twice. It would mean that its first endeavours consisted in creating itself, and when it was quite ready and created, it created itself again. This is the most *absurd* and impossible theory-the acquisition of what is already acquired.
If you say that it created itself before it came into existence, it is really *stupid*. Because it was absolutely nothing before it came into existence.
cont..
1tabligh 11 months ago
@1tabligh No, i did not say there were 2 big bangs. There was only one, the explosion of the singularity.
1. The singularity comes into existence, due to quantum flucuations (see above) - THIS WAS NOT THE BIG BANG.
2. The singularity then explodes - THIS WAS THE BIG BANG
I would also suggest that you look up string theory as well which offers a different cause for the big bang. Both are scientific theories.
Jason987262 11 months ago
How is it possible for a non-existing thing to create another thing (*big bang*) ? You consider my belief in an existing thing (God) that creates another non-existing thing (*big bang*) as absurd. But you do not consider your own, as to the non-existing thing having the power to create an already existing thing,(*big bang*) as absurd and stupid.
Be yourself the judge, and tell me whose theory is absurd and irrational.?
1tabligh 11 months ago
In the name of Allah, the Most Gracious, the Most Merciful.
"Do not the Unbelievers see that the heavens and the earth (Universe) were joined together as one unit (atom) of creation, before we clove (exploded) them asunder? We made from water every living thing. Will they not then believe?"
The Quran 21:30
"because the bible says so?" I am not a Christian!
I am a Shiite Muslim!
1tabligh 11 months ago
@1tabligh Christian, muslim you are all the same to me. Dont quote your religous texts because it dosen't mean anything to me. I am only interested in scientific theories and evidence.
Jason987262 11 months ago
But the only way we are going to find out the truth is through science,
_____
Before he enters the realm of science and knowledge with all its concerns, man is able to perceive certain truths by means of these innate perceptions. But after entering the sphere of science and philosophy and filling his *brain* with various proofs and deductions, he may forget his natural and innate perceptions or begin to doubt them. It is for this reason that when man moves beyond his innate nature to
1tabligh 11 months ago
delineate a belief, differences begin to appear.
God and Empirical Logic.
One of the most destructive and misleading factors in thoughts concerning God is to restrict one's thought to the "logic" of the empirical sciences and to *fail* to recognize the *limits* and boundaries of that "logic".
Is that which is necessary in essence and which is considered the first source of existence matter itself or something else beyond the limits of matter?
1tabligh 11 months ago
Brilliant. Religion has shackled its believers into bondage...and like the elephant who was chained to a spike most of its life, finally is set free, remains chained emotionally and mentally not wanting to go forward in its new freedom...this is like most people, afraid to think for themselves. i look forward to the day when religion becomes the minority and practiced behind closed doors or locked up in mental institutions (j/p)
ilindah 1 year ago
The guy can't think for himself he is brainwashed by the beliefs in Christianity, I don't really see why anybody believes in god.
sandcut1 1 year ago
The reason 7:00 was so funny, is because Don is .... ummmmm, I'll let him tell you.
sparky7718 1 year ago
Matt totally destroys that guy
antibulletdodger101 1 year ago
Man that caller just WOULDN'T SHUT UP would he? Matt was being courteous letting him finish his sentence (well most of the time) and that caller just kept talking even after he said to let him finish (most of the time). It's disappointing how the caller just couldn't answer that question without bringing up what his "God" would do.
DeathsWill228 1 year ago
Shit Dude. Total pwnt.
sandorski55 1 year ago
Shouldn't there be a movie on Matt's life be done by now? I'd go watch it....
bodeezy 1 year ago
Matt fuckin' rocks the truth.
bodeezy 1 year ago
@codyaustinpemberton you missed the point completely, I'm sorry you believe that our morals come from that Prick you call GOD
MrNightShadowX 1 year ago
ow can you judge morality whithout god if god dose not exist then there is no standerd of morality and if god dose not exist then someone like hitler is just as moral as mother taresa
codyaustinpemberton 1 year ago
@codyaustinpemberton No, what the fuck makes you say that? Our culture decides what morality is. We don't think Hitler is moral because in our culture, we look down on genocide. In Nazi Germany, Hitler would be considered good. All because of different cultural boundaries.
Annulable 1 year ago
@Annulable if we are only the product of evolution then why is your cultures morality superior to the Nazis after all if we are just an advanced species of primates then morality is only an opinion
codyaustinpemberton 1 year ago
@codyaustinpemberton I think our culture is morally superior because it does not condone genocide. Mind you, I THINK our culture is superior, a Nazi would not think the same about it. That's the entire point, morality is subjective. Does this mean that anything goes? Of course not, otherwise society wouldn't work, we have based our society around the idea that you shouldn't do to others what you don't want them to do to you, and this has been proven to sustain a successful society.
Annulable 1 year ago
@Annulable ok let me ask you this if someone can escape society's punishment is rape murder steeling ect wrong
codyaustinpemberton 1 year ago
@codyaustinpemberton Yes. Not raping, murdering and stealing simply because you get punished for it is not morality, it's looking after yourself. But when you avoid harming someone or stealing their belongings because you don't wish to cause harm to that person, that is a form of morality. In my opinion, raping, murdering and stealing is morally wrong.
Annulable 1 year ago
@Annulable I do not observe the same thing as you did. I do not see how people avoid doing to others what they do not want to be done to themselves, despite most of their actions being legal.
nowayout001 1 year ago
@codyaustinpemberton "Morality" = things to do to not fuck up the human race. I do believe even dogs know not to go on rampages and rape every goddamn dog they see, or kill every dog. Wolves are smart enough to know that if they work together and not steal from that group/eachother, they will benefit more by the amount of work they put in = larger gain. It's not complicated.
TomRaphaelWolf 1 year ago
All hail the mighty Don!
ishtar0171 1 year ago 2
that...is.....awesome!!
mikekoz68 1 year ago
"Limiting the rights and freedoms of others in order to make them abide by your standards - That's a sin".
Is this not a reasonable application of law? Do the uncertainty we have in our own moral values become less important as we have to implement "what works" for a concordant society? Surely this is an argument ad populum?
Grothbar 1 year ago
When GOD unleashed the Universe, I was there. When He started creating the world, I was there. And when He was working the trees and rocks and lakes and plants, I was there to see it.
Airlightf 1 year ago
As I look through the comments and ratings on videos with atheistic view points, compared to the theist videos, I Cant help to notice something odd. It seems for such a small minority of people, that the 5 star ratings for videos supporting atheistic view points, are far higher than that supporting theism.
This might be an induction of a large number of closet atheist. Has anyone else noticed this?
4me2cclearly 1 year ago 13
Many people dun realize that God is not sending you to hell, but satan is dragging you to hell, and there's nothing God can do about it, cuz he gave us free will. And the "God" I at least believe in is a loving God, so whatever "God" figure you sick ppl are thinking of isn't MY "God".
LZKS 1 year ago
@LZKS Well, didnt God create Satan? If so, he would know this too happend - God judge us to live in hell for eternity?
larsiemannen 1 year ago
@LZKS So if there's nothing God can do about it, how is he all powerful? He's not, because omnipotence is a logical fallacy. Go and read your Bible, all of it, and you'll see many examples of your imaginary friend being a vindictive, uncaring, petty and spiteful creation.
Morriusvids 1 year ago
"I'd rather worship Don!" hahaha
SourcesAreEverything 2 years ago
this is such a great video!!!
whitemisa 2 years ago 3
got a version where the volume isn't so low ?
sarcasmagasm 2 years ago 2
There was a more recent episode with a caller who said that if "God" told him to kill his children, he would do it.
Theists see morality as coming from authority, not from what is right. If "God" tells you to do something, it is moral to do it, no matter how heinous the act is.
ProgressiveAction10 2 years ago 2
LOL I remember that caller, at the end he got so stressed he just said "Shut up bitch"
RJElite 2 years ago
Matt knows how to make a point!
Powerful stuff.
LtZerge 2 years ago 29
Albiet, his big "counter-points" are frequently ridiculous, foundationless "lalalala I'm right you're wrong, lalalalala" callers.
LtZerge 2 years ago
Agreed. Granted, I'm very confident Matt could hold his own with *anyone*.
pokerslut530 2 years ago 2
Well, Jesus came to forgive us of our sins, and surely he should forgive them all, not just some.
Also in Luke 23:39-43 he forgives one of the two that where crucified with him, and I assume his deeds where great (magnitude) and bad, but he was still forgiven.
If Christianity is true, then there can be serial killers and paedophiles in heaven, like some catholic priests would be there which have molested children.
blackjeffrey1 2 years ago 3
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@blackjeffrey1 So, do you believe in Heaven and Hell? If there is Heaven, who do you want to be in it?
nowayout001 1 year ago
One mistake with his rant.believing in god/jesus and accepting him as your lord isnt one of or the main one of Gods criteria, it is the ONLY one. You can freely go and kill, torture, lie, force someone to be your slave, cheat on someone, steal, etc, just so long as you accpet god, and jesus as your lord and saviour, and pray to him forgiveness every once in a while, you get to go to heaven.
blackjeffrey1 2 years ago 3
Thats what he is saying. If that is God's only rule the God is very Immoral,
jbiemans77 2 years ago
No, he said that if people did wrong they would be punished, which isn't true. His children analogy was incorrect with god, if his kiddie murders someone, and then says please forgive me im sorry, he wouldnt get punished
blackjeffrey1 2 years ago
So you are telling me that all you have to do is say: " I am sorry, I beleive in you Jesus, please forgive me"
and you will be allowed eternal bliss in heaven?
All those people actually living a good self sacrificing life, are going about it the hard way.
A serial killer and a nun are equal in the eyes of God, as long as the serial killer repents?
There are serial killers and petophiles in heaven??
Please tell me that I missunderstood you....
jbiemans77 2 years ago 2
Just in case ur waiting to get emailed that ive replied, i accedently posted it as a new comment, so read the new comment by me.
blackjeffrey1 2 years ago
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@jbiemans77 So, do you believe in Heaven and Hell? Who do you want to be in Heaven?
nowayout001 1 year ago
clearly nobody can sound more stupid than religious bigots.. atleast this video has convinced me.
tarun1982 2 years ago
more educated christians will take passages like that and create a defense out of it that actually holds SOME water, though it does often seem shaky. However there IS reason in it contrary to the popular athiest opinion that all theist are fucktards and atheism is the only rational belief in existence. Atheists should stop preaching to the dumbest ten percent of theists if they want any respect
JustThink00 2 years ago
i think jesus had a little cop out to cover all that slavery and killing in the old testament. He said something along the lines of god making those laws becaue the people wanted them. The basic idea was that the people had to be civilized slowly i thinkk, and that jesus brought the true message of how to live best. Also, the majority of jewish law was decided to not apply to christians in Acts of the Apostles.
JustThink00 2 years ago
Which flies in the face of the notion of a perfect, absolutely immutable god and his divine law. If divine law can be changed then it's not perfect (or wasn't perfect in the past). If it's not perfect then it's not divine.
shinstabber 2 years ago
I dont know why people are bashing Jesus over this.. He didnt start any religion! It was the people who wrote the bible. Jesus didnt force you to worship him. He didnt threaten people with damnation and hellfire and things.. He was just a good person. Its the bible that is making up some things. Just like Gandhi was a good person so its not bad to like Gandhi. The bible wasn't written by Jesus..
tarun1982 2 years ago
The other thing is, Tarun, these really is no historical evidence (other than the Bible) that Jesus even existed in the first place.
JackinOffJesus 2 years ago
Yeah exactly, look up the Zeitgeist movie (the section on religion in particular)
shinstabber 2 years ago
At 3:01 Matt reminds me of Oliver Hardy telling Stan Laurel off.
EASYTIGER10 2 years ago
lol... "oh god, go away!" fun.
TehCybernerd 2 years ago
woops i rudely interuped a conversation
curiositygun93 2 years ago
You know what worries me most about this guy? He seems to think people have changed in the last 2-3 thousand years. People are as dumb and dependent as they ever were and many of them really do need someone to tell them basic things about how to be good people. We're going to have to resolve the question of who and how to tell them before we can cosider leaving religion behind, and thats totally aside of belief in God.
Synaps4 2 years ago
I know that I am a decent being. I have done nothing to deserve an eternity of torture. Do you really think that unless you say your Jesus prayer and worship an unseen God that you deserve such punishment? No. Our man-made laws are always being updated for a reason. It would be stupid for us to live according to the Bible's "morality": owning slaves, silencing our women, and murdering whoever we think God wants us to murder. That's not morality, QQOQQ, and you know it. You're better than that.
BoyGringo 2 years ago 2
This comment has received too many negative votes show
We need an absolute authority to give us boundaries for life.
The Bible give's us this boundary, their's no other book like it, we all know that tman made law is an ass, it's always being up dated.
The Bible was written over 3.5 thousand year's, it was relavent then and it still is today.
It's not going any where, thousand's of people a day are giving their lives to Christ, and are being saved from a literal hell.
QQOQQ 2 years ago
You know that the Bible specifies that eating Shellfish is an abomination, correct? I surely hope you haven't done that in your life. It also specifies that menstruating women can't enter church and that children who curse their parents names are to be stoned to death.
You call that relevance?
thepsion5 2 years ago
It's funny that you mention man-made laws are constantly being updated. They are done so because we are growing morally as a society. Many MANY verses of the bible are not applicable to modern day society. The bible says women should not speak in church, slaves should obey their human masters, women discovered not to be virgins on their wedding night are subject to stoning... I could go on, but the point is, claiming such a book as still being relevant in our society is absolutely absurd.
halonone 2 years ago
Do u think we r more moral now or 30 yrs ago? You sed: Many MANY verses of the bible are not applicable to modern day society.
And we can c the affect it has had on the world.
The further you walk away from the Bible, the worse we as a race will be.
Where do our morals then come from?
he bible says women should not speak in church, slaves should obey their human masters, This was 4 the Jews.
QQOQQ 2 years ago
Oh yes, the "where do our morals come from?" question again. They are simply a by-product of human interaction. We essentially have to live with one another by a "do unto others" rule of thumb or we will all wipe each other out of existence. I don't want to rape, rob, or murder because I don't want anyone to rape, rob, or murder me, not because the bible says it's wrong. Cats don't typically go around killing each other for no reason, but I can assure you they didn't learn it from the bible.
halonone 2 years ago
"do unto others" Thats Biblical (u a christian?)
LOL!
QQOQQ 2 years ago
Actually it is considered a golden rule that appears in The Eloquent Peasant, written over 1600 years before Jesus Christ even existed, and rephrased again over 300 years before Jesus existed. So no, it's not Biblical, and no, I am not a Christian.
halonone 2 years ago
I have great hope in you.
You could be the next pope! lol!!
QQOQQ 2 years ago
Only if I get to wear the hat!
halonone 2 years ago
What colour wud u like? Red one...
QQOQQ 2 years ago
And for the record, I absolutely do not care if those verses were for the Jews, that doesn't make them OKAY. They are bigoted, sexist verses written by the same set of men who supposedly wrote the moral code you claim is still applicable. Many people understood it was probably a good idea NOT to run around ruining other people's lives long before the Bible was written. Many people today are raised free of the bible and they understand those same principles. It's only hard for people like you
halonone 2 years ago
They are bigoted, sexist,
now your sounding like an REDherringALIST (evolutonist)
And I had such high hopes!
QQOQQ 2 years ago
Okay... that's still not a response to anything. You do exactly what every other Christian does when faced with debate and dance around questions or change the subject. They ARE bigoted, and they ARE sexist, and if you agree that they are okay to apply to any sex or any ethnicity in modern day society, then you are a bigot and you are sexist, and I have no interest in debating you.
halonone 2 years ago
I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent. (1 Timothy 2:12)
Wives, submit to your husbands as to the Lord. (Ephesians 5:22)
Slaves, submit yourselves to your masters with all respect, not only to the good and gentle but also to the cruel. (1 Peter 2:18)
That's the New Testament, so there's no room to waffle over "oh Jesus came to update Mosaic law blah blah"
shinstabber 2 years ago 27
well i'm no theologian. i'm sure the vatican has come up with an explanation or excuse though.
JustThink00 2 years ago
I'd go with the latter. The difference between an explanation and an excuse is an excuse only seems valid to two groups: the ones making it and the ones who were already convinced to begin with.
shinstabber 2 years ago
Excellent stuff shinstabber
porterwake 2 years ago
Why thank you :)
shinstabber 2 years ago
Thanks for those quotes, shin. I keep a highlighted Bible for the event that I have to debate with a Christian family member.
JackinOffJesus 2 years ago
@shinstabber Halleluyah!!
Bismarkd34 1 year ago
@shinstabber But did you see Jesus saying any of these things in the Gospels???
nowayout001 1 year ago
this is from your 5th line. maybe because if we're nice to someone their more likely to be nice to us.....& religion has no right to talk about morals since EVERY religion has done wrongs that they haven't really made up for yet
curiositygun93 2 years ago
1) God will not be doing the torturing.
2) God doesn't want any one 2 go to hell.
3) God doesn't send us to hell, we do it ourselves.
4) We have all been contaminated by the original sin (adam/eve) thats why Jesus had to die to take sin out of the world. (He was the second Adam)
5) Everything in this life is a test as soon as your born, and we have been given life by God to if we pass the ultimate test.
QQOQQ 2 years ago
god created the laws that send us to hell so he is directly responceible this was mention erler
darkblood626 2 years ago
Just to say that heaven is a paradise, all children that have died in the world, will be with GOD in Heaven.
They are not accountable for their sinful nature untill they become of udult age.
chris2446229 2 years ago
Children aren't responsible for what they do, until they grow old... how old by the way?
But when they reach that age, they're held accountable for the crime of being born? I probably shouldn't put it that way, but sin is inherited in the Biblical context, as "all" are held "guilty" for Adam's sin... which, sadly, is eating the wrong fruit. The fruit of the knowledge of right and wrong.
sonic8005 2 years ago
Big thing about the garden of Eden. IT'S A METAPHORE for being a sheep.
joeyjoejoe17 2 years ago
It will be hard to be a Athiest on yr death bed.
chris2446229 2 years ago
It´s hard for religious people to, trust me, I know.
Religion does not help you when you know that you might die very soon but you are just awake enough to know it, when the only family that is with you to say good bye is your husband because you are in another country, far away from your children and grandchildren.
If there is a god, be it yours or any other, he, she, it ,is a god damn asshole and is must certainly evil or atlest not very caring about us.
stefansv 2 years ago
As Christians we are promised the Kingdom of Heaven forever so I'm not afraid.
When you have a personal relationship with someone, you want to physically spend time with them. Thats how I feel for Jesus. I can't wait!!
Plus my grandpa's and my cousin are there so I can't wait to see them again!
Get to know Christ people, he's awesome!!!
chris2446229 2 years ago
"Innocent life is not taken by GOD."
Uh, the Flood?
gbCerberus37 2 years ago
Knew him for about 15 years, realized he man made, god is man made, and the bible is full of vile, evil and inmoral things i would never ever follow.
stefansv 2 years ago
"When you have a personal relationship with someone, you want to physically spend time with them. Thats how I feel for Jesus".
Even though the internet can be a dodgy way to meet people, I'd stick with it. There's certainly a much better chance on here, than the fantasy your trying so hard to believe in.
Let it go M8, it doesn't matter how hard one tries, you know in the back of your mind how ridiculous it really all is. You know that it was written by primitive men when you think rationally.
martiangrundy 2 years ago
Its called having faith!
How come you believe what you believe?
Have you actually went out into the world? Have you done any type of lab research?
Probably not, you have put your trust into what others have found out or discovered.
Like I, I have put my faith, trust into the Word of GOD.
I didn't exist back in the bible days but I'm believing that those events happened.
chris2446229 2 years ago
"Have you actually went out into the world? Have you done any type of lab research?"
This would be a good argument, except that people test how chemistry works in schools every day, items such as heredity can be observed daily. If you doubt Einstein's equation, go right ahead, it's just worth noting that if Einstein was wrong, then the atom bomb should be nothing but a big dud.
Anyways, I want to note that faith in anecdotal evidence is not the same as understanding science.
sonic8005 2 years ago
Einstien believed that God exist, I guess your smarter than him?
chris2446229 2 years ago
Is "the scientist who's currently famous for having discovered e=mc2 believed in a god, than that means it's smart to believe in one" sort of the best argument you got? This is an old one, and just because Einstein was born in a Jewish family does NOT mean that him being religious early in life is what led him to his discovery. Also, Einstein's been outta the loop for several years now, so who's to judge? Besides, you're the one who believes that he's wrong.
sonic8005 2 years ago
No, granted I haven't personally done any of the research, ( I don't suppose you'de count am astronomy).
But you see, the scientific method being as rigorous as it is, means that we can generally trust it. (As far as one can trust anything). It's the reason our modern world works the way it does.
So when one reads about something that is trusted, one can be reasonably sure it's OK. Now when one reads others that agree, and yet others that back up yet others, Cont.---
martiangrundy 2 years ago
---Cont.
a coherent picture builds up.
As one reads more and more about the incredible efforts and achievements, a fuller and fuller picture builds up, and its getting more so all the time. Quite a large number will also back up another part of science in another area, there are a number of complementary fields to, like Cosmology/Physics.
I feel anyone not interested in these subjects, is simply missing out on getting a
Cont.---
martiangrundy 2 years ago
---Cont.
glimpse how our universe really works. And science is THE only reliable method weve yet come up with to define how the universe actually works.
Science works. Thinking about things, and what seems common sense, doesnt necessarily.
Common sense once told us the Earth was flat, didnt move, and the Sun orbited the Earth.
Now if you want to call it faith? OK. But dont try to equate it in the same league as blind faith. In dogma and an old book.
There is all the difference in the world.
martiangrundy 2 years ago
Explain a conscious, good or bad, wrong or right? The universe obeys order!
Who or whatever created me knew what they were doing, because like us humans, it has a mind.
I have to eat to survive, so happens the food from the earth is delicious enough for me to eat.
I have a child growing in my belly, so happens that my breast produces milk for the child, that so happens to have all the nutritients my baby needs!
Intelliengence! Smart! All from a big bang?! Sum freak accident! NOWAY!
chris2446229 2 years ago
"Explain a conscious, good or bad, wrong or right? The universe obeys order!"
Not at all the way it would've been if made by a "perfect" entity.
"Who or whatever created me knew what they were doing, because like us humans, it has a mind"
Your parents have a mind. You assert that you need a divine source to exist... based on no tangible evidence.
sonic8005 2 years ago 2
"I have to eat to survive, so happens the food from the earth is delicious enough for me to eat.
I have a child growing in my belly, so happens that my breast produces milk for the child, that so happens to have all the nutritients my baby needs!"
Duh, it has to work if it's gonna reproduce and live (how natural selection works) and... I don't get how you could imagine that food was MADE for you to live. It's highly conceited. Not to mention that there's foods that kill you in nature.
sonic8005 2 years ago
A God makes perfect sense!
I give props to science, yeah, putting a whole in the atmosphere and all, good for science.
People can live without science. It has been done. But can we live without God?
Sure,maybe, filling our lives with work, other people, television, gadgets,money, 401k's,life insurance,vacations etc...
But what about the after life? Eternity? Are you prepare to face it? ...
chris2446229 2 years ago
No, no... to say "science" is responsible for the ozone layer hole (which religious extremists are ignoring for the sake of their own bloody profits) is retarded. And to pretend that all scientiffic advancement isn't that great (while using a computer, developed by science) while belief in God is supposedly better... ignores all medical science. Not to mention that, you have no tangible evidence for an afterlife. Or that your view of it is correct. It most likely isn't, if any were possible.
sonic8005 2 years ago
How does "a god make perfect sense", exactly?
Just saying it doesn't make it true.
I can see how you eschew science, very clearly indeed.
How do you think the computer your now using, the internet, your mobile phone, just how do you imagine they happened? do you suppose your god poofed these into existance?
I wonder when you get ill, do you ignore medical advice, forego a trip to hospital, stay home and pray?
I somehow doubt it.
Words are very easy to say, especially when they're meaningless.
martiangrundy 2 years ago
You can be a so called deceit human being after killing someone!
People get away with murder all the time, and they go and live productive lives, Wives,children,careers!
GOD is a perfect GOD! He does not forget your sin! You are not GOD! You don't make the rules!
If you are not saved, your sins or not forgiven!
When you die you will be judge by everything you have done in your life.
YOU WILL BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE!!!!!!
chris2446229 2 years ago
so we are created sick and commanded to be well? what the hell kind of moral stand point is that to take
FenriX123 2 years ago
We were created well,good,right.
Because Adam and Eve disobeyed GOD and ate of the forbidden fruit, sin entered in us and the land,(sickness,disease,murder,lies,etc..)
We all have a sinful nature.
We all have broken at least one of the ten commandments in our lives because were sinners.
chris2446229 2 years ago
Wait wait, why did god put the tree of knowledge in the garden in the first place, and why did he let the talking snake be there? He had to know it was evil. Sound like god is a pretty messed up , I mean, he had to have made the snake, the snake was evil...
stefansv 2 years ago
GOD didn't want us to be robots, he wanted to test us, he wanted us to make the choice to be obedient.
The snake was Satan. Satan can change into many things.
Satan was actually a Angel in Heaven first. But instead of worshiping and loving GOD he wanted to be a god himself.
GOD knew and kicked Satan and he's followers out of Heaven.
When GOD destroys the earth, Satan and all who have rejected GOD and his Word will perish in HELL for all eternity.
chris2446229 2 years ago
Actually, satan is most likley not the snake so why was the snake there in the first place, why not just the tree.
Why does your god say murder is wrong but then he does it himself (kills 27000 with a wall) is that a test too?
Why did god make a rule only to breaki it himself?
Do you think murder, rape and slavery is ok since it´s ok in the bible?
stefansv 2 years ago
God did say that murder is wrong, but at times, killings must be done.
Throughout the old testament, GOD calls on the Israelites to take up arms agaisn't a nation.
At times the battle were to defend a nation, other times they were sent out by GOD to punish a sinful nation.
In either situation, killing was approved by GOD.
The answer is no. Innocent life is not taken by GOD.
As far as rape and slavery goes, if you actually read the Bible, God uses his servants 2 stop such suffering.
chris2446229 2 years ago
God killed 27000 people with a wall, killed first born, the flood, pretty sure there are some innocent life that were killed.
What about the rules about rape and slavery? What two servants?
stefansv 2 years ago
When Adam and Eve sinned, the Earth was cursed ok? Earthquakes, Hurricanes etc...
When disasters happen in the world, its only because of the curse from sin.
When theirs hatred in man's heart to kill others, it's not from GOD, its from man's sinful nature.
Satan's purpose-To kill, steal, and destroy. Evil and wrong doing comes from him.
chris2446229 2 years ago
Like I said before, GOD approves killings only if it needs to be done..protecting a nation or for a sinful nation.
When GOD sent the flood, Noah was the only righteous one that was alive.
When GOD destroyed the city Sodom and Gormorah with fire, Lot was the only righteous man there.
Yes, there were probably children that died but GOD knew those children didn't have a chance to live a righteous life because of the parents.
GOD HATES SIN!
chris2446229 2 years ago
In the book of Numbers, the children of the Midianites were to be slaughtered in God's name... suddenly children aren't innocent. If you wanna say "all fall short of God's..." and such, then really... you're failing to understand what's going on. If a human wanted such genocide, you'd call him a monster. Unless you believed that if you even THOUGHT him to be wrong for even a second, you'd be given an unending punishment that is...
sonic8005 2 years ago
God has a long history in the Old Testament of all the kings who tried to fight him and what happened to them
Pharaoh tried to fight God. It cost him his honor, his people, his slaves, his army, his son, and his own life.
The Midianites fought God. God slew all the Midianite males and took the five Midian kings and slew them.
It goes on and on.
chris2446229 2 years ago
"Pharaoh tried to fight God. It cost him his honor, his people, his slaves, his army, his son, and his own life"
I know this... dude, why the hell do you think that these mentions which, basically are parts of some of the most absolutely immoral parts of the religion... the parts you wanna point to? I mean, God is killing CHILDREN, and for the actions of kings... according to you, such genocide and MURDER is perfectly acceptable in every way, shape, and form.
sonic8005 2 years ago 2
Proverbs 22:6 "Train up a child in the way he should go: and when he is old, he will not depart from it."
Train your children in the ways of God so when they get older, they will know not to fall into the temptations of the world. They will not desire to sin and disobey God's Word.
chris2446229 2 years ago