My take is that the bible was written by man, so it contains error that man would put in it. We are all made sinners, and that would be no different for the authors of the book. I do practice belief in an omnipresent God, that is of the highest power, and created all things, but I believe that he does not need a book to contain him. He just is. Also believe in his feminine side, the divine mother. It guides me well, and fills me with acceptance for others. Inner truth, is divine truth.
The Bible tells us that there is only one God (Deuteronomy 4:35, 39; 6:4; Isaiah 43:10-11; 44:6-8; 45:5-6, 14, 18, 21-2; 46:9; 1 Timothy 1:17; James 2:19; Jude 25) and no other gods existed before God and none will exist after Him (Isaiah 43:10) nor do any exist alongside Him (Isaiah 44:6, 8; 45:5-6, 14, 21; 46:9) and although there is only one God (1 Corinthians 8:4-6) there are many false gods and goddesses (Galatians 4:8).
From the bible: In Romans 1 Paul expands his teaching on pagan worship: "They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator" (Rom 1:25).
From the bible "For this is the will of God your sanctification, that you keep away from sexual immorality, that each of you knows to get his own wife in holiness and honor, not in passionate lust, like the pagans who do not know God....
Notice it says "Like the pagans who do not know God."
Seems like someone greater than all 3 of us agrees with me. Paul the disciple of Christ said that. Now you knowing law know that I have more evidence to support the bible frowns on paganism. Truly
We are talking about what JESUS is alleged to have said, not what the Bible says. Of course, the Bible has all kinds of admonitions against Paganisms. In their day, the Isrealites were out slaughtering Pagans left and right, so, of ~course~ there are all ~kinds~ of admonitions.
Would you then admit that IF Jesus said those things and the bible said those things, if the bible is true then it frowns on paganism? I mean that is so obvious. A simple "Yes if the bible is true it does obviously frown on paganism" would satisfy me that you are unbias and looking at blatant facts. You don't have to say it's true although I believe it is, but IF the bible is true it obviously discourages paganism.
ok thanks for saying that. I enjoy talking to you more than most pagans as you can answer questions and converse rather than deny the bible frowns upon paganism. I am glad you admitted (and correctly so) that the bible frowns upon paganism as I can use this in my next video...all positive of course.
Yep, feel free to quote me as much as you like. :) I have never heard a Pagan deny that the Bible is anti-Pagan. That's a new one. We tend to argue that the Bible is simply not relevant to us.
Hey I have made a vow to all youtubers and it's pretty well known out there that I will never make a negative video about someone. Recently Shirotora admitted to me finally that he agrees wicca is evil. I made a positive video about him for doing so. Even my #1 fan pagan ron makes negative videos as he has admitted there is no good or evil to him. Once you admit there is no evil the downward progression pretty much is predictable in a man or woman.
I have not made such a vow. I have never made a "negative" video about someone, as I see that as, well, beneath me, really, but I do like to keep my options open. I reserve the right to make any kind of video I feel like. :) As far as Shirotora "admitting" that Wicca is evil, Shirotora is a Christian, so such a proclamation hardly surprises me. As for me, I see nothing evil about Wicca, but I don't consider it particularly Virtuous, either.
Who gives a rip shock! I know I don't. Is Shirotora some kind of pagan god or leader of a great pagan revolution? He's christian..that's what christians believe. Are shirotora's words supposed to somehow change the minds of people?
Judaism sees Christianity as an abomination because it sees the idea of G-d impregnating a woman blasphemy and do not see Christianity as valid or hold any truth. I guess Pagans are not Christians only enemy
Oh come on fiacharrey and paganron. Are you guys that foolish to believe that when all 3 of us stand before Christ that He is going to say you 2 pagans honored Him and loved Him and preached His word lol. If so I got a bridge to sell you guys.
Well God has an opinion on this matter that is totally different than yours. Since God is more powerful than you and I combined, no offense but I have to stick with God.
So in closing..Jesus was correct when he talked about people like you and of course the hateful PaganRon. Both of you hate Jesus Christ with a passion. Jesus spoke of this when he said "you cannot have 2 masters as you will love one and hate the other." You fellows hate Jesus Christ but love paganism. Quite unwise as Paganism will cause you to go to hell. Read John 3:18 where it says We are all condemned already. That means right now gentlemen. Read John 3:18 it is blatantly clear.
I am simply a non-Christian. In that regard, I'm not that different from billions of other people in the world. If what you get from watching this video is that I "hate Jesus with a passion," I think you are dangerously delusional.
Actually Jesus Himself said you cannot have 2 masters as you will love one and hate the other. It is clear that you have Jesus in the hate category and paganism in the love category. On Judgment day you will be one of those folks that say Lord Lord..and He will say "I never knew you." I would get right with Christ before it's too late.
Except that we don't "serve two masters." We don't recognize Jesus or Yahweh as masters at all. (Nor, for that matter, do we serve our own Gods as masters. Ours is not a religion of slaves.) So, there is no hate, just indifference.
There are more passages then just the one you quoted. Go to my channel and in the search slot type in paganism and you'll see the passages. Also the video I did The benefits of Paganism has passages in the annotations. It is clear Jesus did not want us to be pagan. It is crystal clear. You have the right to reject Jesus Christ as the son of God which you have done. I believe it is unwise of you as now your sins are not paid for and covered.
If you want me to address specific passages, then just tell me what the passages are. I already met you more than half way once. I went and tried to find the passage myself, and it seems I found it. I'm not going to slog through dozens of your insipid videos just to find what you want to ask me.
You are in error as you call Jesus wise and good in this video. Yet Jesus claimed to be the son of God so how can you call him wise and good as you think Jesus is lying? You either have to deny he is the son of God therefore you call him,Jesus, a liar. So how can he be good? You could say "Well He thought he was but He really wasn't the son of God" well I would ask you then How could he be wise? Your video is in error in that Jesus was not a wise and good man. He is the son of God.
That book is full of lies and so is shock. And may I add that book also has been rewriten time and time again and has lost all it's meaning. And shock can't get anything right as you have shown here by his statement of "don't do as the Pagans". He only gave you knowing or unknowing half of the line. Good job on dealing with him. 5/5 stars.
Yes, it seems his reading comprehension skills are sadly lacking. But that seems to be the case with every fundamentalist Christian I've ever come across.
Shockandawe has edited my comments.He's a preacher Christian not really interested in discourse. He's already got all the answers. Kudos to you for bothering w/him.
I think the conversation here has less to do with shock and more to do with those on the fence and/or those who believe pagans are evil and can be persuaded differently with rational dialogue. Shock and those like him, their minds are probably not gonna be changed about us..but, we have to live with everyone. It is our duty to let others know shocks view of Paganism is wrong.
Hi Ladyof: I agree he's not going to change his mind and that the best you can do is give those who havn't taken a position yet the other side of the story.
I know. He lies so much, I think he has some kind of compulsive disorder. But this question seemed reasonable. I am always happy to tackle reasonable questions, whoever might send them. My responses really aren't for him, per say. That really would be a waste of time. They are for my viewers and for myself, as I do like to ponder and investigate these kinds of things.
in the NIV version it actually refers to the Catholic pray. Many Christian denominations see Catholicism as very Pagan influenced.
RivaWitch 3 years ago
As do I. In fact, I think Catholicism is an excellent source for Pagan ritual elements.
fiacharrey 3 years ago
My take is that the bible was written by man, so it contains error that man would put in it. We are all made sinners, and that would be no different for the authors of the book. I do practice belief in an omnipresent God, that is of the highest power, and created all things, but I believe that he does not need a book to contain him. He just is. Also believe in his feminine side, the divine mother. It guides me well, and fills me with acceptance for others. Inner truth, is divine truth.
Pressence101 3 years ago 2
continued evidence against paganism from the bible: Those who worship false gods and goddesses are denounced (Exodus 23:13; Deuteronomy 4:3, 19; 8:19-20; 16:21-2; Joshua 24:20; Judges 2:10-15; 3:7-8; 10:6-16; 1 Kings 11:32-3; Psalm 81:8-9; Jeremiah 11:9-17)
shockawenow 3 years ago
LOL! Quoting Jewish mythology again!
HergerSeamas 3 years ago
christian mythology!
HergerSeamas 3 years ago
The Bible tells us that there is only one God (Deuteronomy 4:35, 39; 6:4; Isaiah 43:10-11; 44:6-8; 45:5-6, 14, 18, 21-2; 46:9; 1 Timothy 1:17; James 2:19; Jude 25) and no other gods existed before God and none will exist after Him (Isaiah 43:10) nor do any exist alongside Him (Isaiah 44:6, 8; 45:5-6, 14, 21; 46:9) and although there is only one God (1 Corinthians 8:4-6) there are many false gods and goddesses (Galatians 4:8).
shockawenow 3 years ago
From the bible: In Romans 1 Paul expands his teaching on pagan worship: "They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator" (Rom 1:25).
shockawenow 3 years ago
From the bible "For this is the will of God your sanctification, that you keep away from sexual immorality, that each of you knows to get his own wife in holiness and honor, not in passionate lust, like the pagans who do not know God....
Notice it says "Like the pagans who do not know God."
Seems like someone greater than all 3 of us agrees with me. Paul the disciple of Christ said that. Now you knowing law know that I have more evidence to support the bible frowns on paganism. Truly
shockawenow 3 years ago
We are talking about what JESUS is alleged to have said, not what the Bible says. Of course, the Bible has all kinds of admonitions against Paganisms. In their day, the Isrealites were out slaughtering Pagans left and right, so, of ~course~ there are all ~kinds~ of admonitions.
fiacharrey 3 years ago
Would you then admit that IF Jesus said those things and the bible said those things, if the bible is true then it frowns on paganism? I mean that is so obvious. A simple "Yes if the bible is true it does obviously frown on paganism" would satisfy me that you are unbias and looking at blatant facts. You don't have to say it's true although I believe it is, but IF the bible is true it obviously discourages paganism.
shockawenow 3 years ago
I thought I ~did~ just say that. In fact, whether the Bible is true or not, it certainly does "frown" on paganism.
fiacharrey 3 years ago
ok thanks for saying that. I enjoy talking to you more than most pagans as you can answer questions and converse rather than deny the bible frowns upon paganism. I am glad you admitted (and correctly so) that the bible frowns upon paganism as I can use this in my next video...all positive of course.
shockawenow 3 years ago
Yep, feel free to quote me as much as you like. :) I have never heard a Pagan deny that the Bible is anti-Pagan. That's a new one. We tend to argue that the Bible is simply not relevant to us.
fiacharrey 3 years ago
Hey I have made a vow to all youtubers and it's pretty well known out there that I will never make a negative video about someone. Recently Shirotora admitted to me finally that he agrees wicca is evil. I made a positive video about him for doing so. Even my #1 fan pagan ron makes negative videos as he has admitted there is no good or evil to him. Once you admit there is no evil the downward progression pretty much is predictable in a man or woman.
shockawenow 3 years ago
I have not made such a vow. I have never made a "negative" video about someone, as I see that as, well, beneath me, really, but I do like to keep my options open. I reserve the right to make any kind of video I feel like. :) As far as Shirotora "admitting" that Wicca is evil, Shirotora is a Christian, so such a proclamation hardly surprises me. As for me, I see nothing evil about Wicca, but I don't consider it particularly Virtuous, either.
fiacharrey 3 years ago
Who gives a rip shock! I know I don't. Is Shirotora some kind of pagan god or leader of a great pagan revolution? He's christian..that's what christians believe. Are shirotora's words supposed to somehow change the minds of people?
HergerSeamas 3 years ago
Gee shock you seen to do that though!
RivaWitch 3 years ago
Judaism sees Christianity as an abomination because it sees the idea of G-d impregnating a woman blasphemy and do not see Christianity as valid or hold any truth. I guess Pagans are not Christians only enemy
RivaWitch 3 years ago
Ditto for Islam. The Quaran associates the Trinity with polytheism. Three is not one.
rdsanchez1966 2 years ago
Oh come on fiacharrey and paganron. Are you guys that foolish to believe that when all 3 of us stand before Christ that He is going to say you 2 pagans honored Him and loved Him and preached His word lol. If so I got a bridge to sell you guys.
shockawenow 3 years ago
No, we are not so foolish to believe that the three of us will "stand before Christ."
fiacharrey 3 years ago
Well God has an opinion on this matter that is totally different than yours. Since God is more powerful than you and I combined, no offense but I have to stick with God.
shockawenow 3 years ago
So in closing..Jesus was correct when he talked about people like you and of course the hateful PaganRon. Both of you hate Jesus Christ with a passion. Jesus spoke of this when he said "you cannot have 2 masters as you will love one and hate the other." You fellows hate Jesus Christ but love paganism. Quite unwise as Paganism will cause you to go to hell. Read John 3:18 where it says We are all condemned already. That means right now gentlemen. Read John 3:18 it is blatantly clear.
shockawenow 3 years ago
I am simply a non-Christian. In that regard, I'm not that different from billions of other people in the world. If what you get from watching this video is that I "hate Jesus with a passion," I think you are dangerously delusional.
fiacharrey 3 years ago
Actually Jesus Himself said you cannot have 2 masters as you will love one and hate the other. It is clear that you have Jesus in the hate category and paganism in the love category. On Judgment day you will be one of those folks that say Lord Lord..and He will say "I never knew you." I would get right with Christ before it's too late.
shockawenow 3 years ago
Except that we don't "serve two masters." We don't recognize Jesus or Yahweh as masters at all. (Nor, for that matter, do we serve our own Gods as masters. Ours is not a religion of slaves.) So, there is no hate, just indifference.
fiacharrey 3 years ago
There are more passages then just the one you quoted. Go to my channel and in the search slot type in paganism and you'll see the passages. Also the video I did The benefits of Paganism has passages in the annotations. It is clear Jesus did not want us to be pagan. It is crystal clear. You have the right to reject Jesus Christ as the son of God which you have done. I believe it is unwise of you as now your sins are not paid for and covered.
shockawenow 3 years ago
If you want me to address specific passages, then just tell me what the passages are. I already met you more than half way once. I went and tried to find the passage myself, and it seems I found it. I'm not going to slog through dozens of your insipid videos just to find what you want to ask me.
fiacharrey 3 years ago
You are in error as you call Jesus wise and good in this video. Yet Jesus claimed to be the son of God so how can you call him wise and good as you think Jesus is lying? You either have to deny he is the son of God therefore you call him,Jesus, a liar. So how can he be good? You could say "Well He thought he was but He really wasn't the son of God" well I would ask you then How could he be wise? Your video is in error in that Jesus was not a wise and good man. He is the son of God.
shockawenow 3 years ago
Trotting out the old trilemma "liar/madman/son-of-God" argument? It amazes me that people really fall for that line of claptrap.
fiacharrey 3 years ago
Right on!
HergerSeamas 3 years ago
Great response!
LadyofHergerSeamas 3 years ago
That book is full of lies and so is shock. And may I add that book also has been rewriten time and time again and has lost all it's meaning. And shock can't get anything right as you have shown here by his statement of "don't do as the Pagans". He only gave you knowing or unknowing half of the line. Good job on dealing with him. 5/5 stars.
PaganRon 3 years ago
Yes, it seems his reading comprehension skills are sadly lacking. But that seems to be the case with every fundamentalist Christian I've ever come across.
fiacharrey 3 years ago
Ya shock seems to fit that streotype vary well.
PaganRon 3 years ago
Great answer Fiacharrey!
sarasuperid 3 years ago
Shockandawe has edited my comments.He's a preacher Christian not really interested in discourse. He's already got all the answers. Kudos to you for bothering w/him.
owheydusoapsk 3 years ago 2
I think the conversation here has less to do with shock and more to do with those on the fence and/or those who believe pagans are evil and can be persuaded differently with rational dialogue. Shock and those like him, their minds are probably not gonna be changed about us..but, we have to live with everyone. It is our duty to let others know shocks view of Paganism is wrong.
LadyofHergerSeamas 3 years ago
Hi Ladyof: I agree he's not going to change his mind and that the best you can do is give those who havn't taken a position yet the other side of the story.
owheydusoapsk 3 years ago
I know. He lies so much, I think he has some kind of compulsive disorder. But this question seemed reasonable. I am always happy to tackle reasonable questions, whoever might send them. My responses really aren't for him, per say. That really would be a waste of time. They are for my viewers and for myself, as I do like to ponder and investigate these kinds of things.
fiacharrey 3 years ago