hahahahaha, republikans are like clowns, but instead of water guns they have real guns! Now on the real side of the issue, everything is valid during a war... if we'd had to torture Hitler himself to stop WW II we would have done it. So, I'm not OK with torture, but lets face it, every country does it! China Does it, Russia Does it England Does it and off course, ripping heads of prisoners is not exactly humane, right?
This is even more fascinating in retrospect, since we know how useless the torture was. Plus the detainees were in Gitmo well past the "ticking bomb" time frame.
That was actually a really great interview. Well done Cenk.
On the downside, this scares me. Until recently I didn't realise how openly advocated torture is in America. I just can't understand how it's allowed in a western, developed nation, especially one that is so vocal about their sense of justice and democracy.
How do we know no murder has happened at Guantanamo? Lets see some video of these suicides to be sure theres been no foul play. And in Hanoi, how many pows murdered other pows? Its a separate issue, I know.
I guess they need good medical staff at Gitmo due to the torture that they do there on a regular basis.
By the way, I guess he should be aware that the US ratified the Torture Convention, which prohibits toture under ALL circumstances. So yeah, let's just through out the law for political considerations.
Duncan Hunter thinks, he's above the law. During his campaigne, for prsident, he ran up a bill for food at a local restaurant and tried to walk off with out paying. Thank goodness he's out.
Oh great, they get free prayer beads and a torturer reads a book to them (as well as soccer and veggies between torture sessions)... Talk to the INNOCENT folks (like the muslim in Canada) who was tortured for nothing, he was innocent. Also search for Scott Loper a United States police officer sent to a Canandian prison to be tortured for 4 years and his young son is missing.
If they gave a shit about the people they wouldnt dump wallstreets debt on them or depleted uraniun on our own troops
Hunter=asshole. You have great food, and prisoner soccer-after we take out your teeth and waterboard you and keep you in stress positions for hours. Fuck his percentage, this moron quotes Fox news and uses the B.S. imminent danger "nuclear event" scenario-which NEVER HAPPENS. We'll never know if Kalid Sheik did plan 9/11, because once you torture someone, they say anything. F- him and his "marquis de queensbury rules" B.S. while he endorses Nazi and criminal behavior by our troops.
once again, another congressman that should be swept off in the middle of the night, bound and gagged, and then waterboarded. As he is waterboarded, he should be asked if it is torture - in between his gasping for breath.
The terrorist doesn't deserve anything. Torture away, I actually agree. We don't have to be soft on them. All I ask is put up the evidence. Just present the evidence, prove that they are terrorists and you can do what ever you want, cut of their fingers, whip em, waterboard. Just prove them guilty first.
Max - you are the first one to state correctly. They FIRST need to have a trial and be proven GUILTY. Then you can torture away for information. If they are found innocent, let them walk.
tastysalad - you would quickly change your mind if local law enforcement decided to strike you in your 'green zone' and waterboard you for information.
tasty - First of all, how do you define "terrorist"? We as a nation invaded another sovereign country that had not done anything to us - you don't think that is "terroristic" in any way? Second, how do you know that these people are in fact terrorists? 80% of them were handed over to us by Pakistanis for a BOUNTY, not captured on the battlefield. Of course they're going to take the money, regardless of innocence. Also, have you ever heard of Brown v. Mississippi? See my comment above.
What most right wing nuts don't realize is that most of the prisoners in Gitmo probably haven't committed any crimes. And we refuse to actually present "evidence" against them in a courtroom. How convenient.
How do you debate halfwits and atheists that haven't the brains to debate issues? Its like Obama. He talks really well from a teleprompter, but when he is asked questions that he is not up on the subject, he says "uhhhh, well uhhhh, uhhhhhhhhh...."
And Obama voted against the ban on partial birth abortion. and against the born alive infant act. You mass murders are worried about waterboarding. Oh!!!! lets worry about the other mass murderers, like you. I guess you mass murderers have to stick together.
No murder, rice pilaf, orange chicken, prisoners' weight gain - all excellent reasons for maintaining Gitmo. How cute! We should turn Washington DC (the murder capital of the world) into Gitmo. The only 'good reason'to torture is: you extract information that would save life. What if the suspect doesn't really know? You have tortured someone for nothing! There is a reason all civic societies throughtout history looked at torture as torture, not a 'tactic'. This is a bonanza for Alan Dershowitz.
But yet this same person that asked these questions and said waterboarding was wrong and probably votes for Democrats that want to keep partial birth abortion, that kills and then sucks the babies brain out. And if he's not a Democrat or liberal, scaring a prisoner into telling about events that could save lives, is not to far-fetched to use. None have been hurt phsyically by this procedure and when he compares the torture that McCain endured in Hanoi to Guantanamo, he is a fool.
History (and common sense) proves that information obtained from torture is unreliable, it is likely that in order to stop the suffering the victim will tell the person inflicting the pain anything they require (like a confession). This was quite popular in the middle ages.
Please watch this video all the way through and remember that the people in it are suspects and have not been convicted of any crimes.
watch?v=Ru0bxSqWMdo
This is not about patriotism it is about humanity.
You are really a bleeding heart liberal! You don't even know the amount of lives saved by these confessions. There is no pain inflicted. But there is mental stress that scares them. We use the method for training our troops.
This guy is another bleeding heart that votes for Democrats that killed 45 million babies. what a hypocrite!!! Just suspects? Caught fighting us on the battlefield!
If was so ineffective, then why would they keep using it? It's not like the CIA or whoever would do it for "fun" (in some cases maybe they do), they're intelligence gathering organisations so will only do what is most effective at getting them their "intel" and info...
I have never said that torture is ineffective, infact it is very effective, the problem is its effective in obtaining whatever information the person using it requires, whether it is true or not is irrelevant.
If someone had your balls in a vice and told you that when you admit you are a fairy on the top of a christmas tree they will stop turning the handle, what would you do?
Also I assume that you think this is only happening to terrorists, but if they had been proven guilty..
You make a good point if you look at it in the way that they need to meet "targets" (like, if they torure x-amount of people a month into being "guilty", they'll have met their "target", same as regular Police here have quotas to meet), but surely intel agencies are a bit above that, they'll actually want REAL info rather than just making up the numbers?
That's straying from the point somewhat and a whole other different issue. Of course I'd expect to be jailed if I went and tortured someone to, I dunno, tell me where my stolen bike was kept...
"intel agencies are a bit above that, they'll actually want REAL info"
This is the point, torture does not work in obtaining reliable information, take for example the Tipton Three who confessed to meeting Bin laden when held in Gitmo, it was later found that they where in the UK at the time:
tinyurl(.)com/MythsAboutTorture
CIA Director William Colby, Torture is ineffective:
Congressman Hunter is evidence that Hell is standing room only! Hunter's bought the ticket and watch him take the ride! BTW- I use to sell used cars (back in my drinking days)and the sales mgr. used the same mode of discourse.
This guy is calling everyone that thinks torture is not right as 'mass murderer'. Let's use that logic, everyone that voted in favor of Iraq war are mass murderers of Americans (4000+) and Iraqis (millions?)! Do we need to say more about the mental state of these Zio-Nazi fanatics - the kind Alan Dershowitz is trying to promote as true patriotic Americans?
You sir are a complete idiot and I would like to see you in person. You leftist communist baby killers think its alright to kill 45 million babies and then completely ignore that fact when you debate. Like your response!
Torture is not right, I agree. But babykilling is more wrong than torture , if youthinkwaterboarding is torture you are wrong. There is nothing in my statement that says people that torture is a mass murderer.So the stupidity of your argument proves your lack of intellect.
3LCZW - waterboarding is torture. Maybe you should have the luxury of experiencing it sometime to make an educated comment on it. Are you US military? WTF do YOU know about it? So if torture is not right, and waterboarding is torture, then it is NOT RIGHT, PERIOD.
I always love that constant argument that torture is perfect if the prisoner is evil enough! How can anyone believe that bull? Also, I think the fantastic record of Guantanamo clearly proves that everyone should be imprisoned there without any rights. They must be happier than anyone walking around in the U.S.
Another bleeding heart liberal. We are going to let you house one of these or maybe two. These are killers, how do you think they should be handled. What is your educated guess?
The overarching lie is that none of these guys at Guantanamo ever had a clue 911 was going to happen and they are "scapegoats" for the people that really did it. I can say that because i don't wear a suit and tie and make a propaganda living. If people tended to listen to me; i expect i would spend the rest of my days in federal pound in the ass prison. It is just hierarchal bullshit; if you don't go along with the story you get to ride under the bus.
What made America great was the fact that no matter the circumstances America had the higher moral ground. That no matter what was done to America...we would never stoop as low as these third world country tactics.
Excuse me, here's a person right here who believes that Bagram and Abu Ghraib WERE as bad as the N. Vietnamese. He's really out of touch if he doesn't think a lot of Americans believe this.
If hunter had his way, he would open more gulags all over Eastern Europe and through as many muslims in there as he could. Yes, those prisoners are not innocent people but here in America we have standards and laws we abide by. By Hunters own definition, it is the laws that separate civilization from savagery. Hunter is a self-aware fool
Yes, America sets the standard, but these scum are mostly responsible for killing our flesh and blood here and abroad.
They got it better in Gitmo than they've ever had it in Babylon. At least they're not sleeping in cave, wiping their asses with their hands and burning our flag while contemplating another suicide bombing.
you forget that most of the guys in GITMO, do not have the rights of those garunteed by the Geneva convention to ALL prisoners! These guys havent even been charged with any crime... The right of Habeas Corpus is garunteed by the Amerikan constitution, thats the right to be CHARGED when you're interned...
It's easy to assume someone's guilt when it isn't your testicles in the vice, unless you've been through such procedures and speak out of your out experience, but somehow i doubt that was the case!
Never had a murder?...there's only one gang - Al Qaeda. The majority inmate group is thinking "How the hell did i get caught?" and a smaller group is thinking "What the hell am i doing here? I'm innocent" 6 years+ waiting for trial is a long time compared to Neuremberg after WW2. Hustle up.
he treats fundamental rights as if they were a nice thing the state hands down to whom they like...You cant rationalize violating them even if its for the "greater good". Its a MATTER OF PRINCIPLE. Example: If some Hero agrees to sacrifice himself to rescue 1000 other people then thats good. But Nobody has the right to make that decision for him, not even our highest leaders or the worlds greatest commanders. I think many people dont realise what "MATTER OFPRINCIPLE" actually means...
"There's only one major prison in the world that's never had a murder." And just how exactly does this fuck-head know this to be true? Bullshit.
The republican idiot in this video only makes the U.S. look worse. Excellent food. Yummy. I'd trade my freedom any day to stay at Gitmo. I could play soccer, too. And water boarding? It's a prank!
Yeah but American people in prison have had a fair jury trial, with constitutional rights to fair representation and habeas corpus. The people in guantanamo bay HAVE NEVER HAD A TRIAL! JUST LOCKED UNDER SUSPICION!
In Israel, they treat their prisoners decently and respectfully, even having guard-inmate card games. This has been proven by experimentation to yield much better results.
Are these prisoners convicted of a crime? Are they there voluntarily? If there was a nuclear weapon planted in the US the US would not find it because they didn't do anything to prevent 911 even though their intel warned them months before it happened. It all boils down to skin color and religious background.
Isn't is really offensive that they read the Qu'ran (koran) over the loud speakers.. pretty much admitting that they are only interested in capturing Muslims.. Are there any non-muslims in Guantanimo bay?
another thing, didn't he say he disagrees on the ruling of the supreme court on hiatus corpus, then later saying he helped put in a military tribunal that includes a right to confront your accuser? wtf?
this great patriotic american duncan douchbag brags that alledged terrorists have better healthcare that the 47 million law abiding americans who healthcare he denies. waterboard this motherfucker, he'll say he's the mastermind of 9-11, too!
Hunter seemed kind of.. not extreme. I thought he made some good points.
All though I totally disagree with him and I would have catched him in a couple of lies right there, he did seem less of a loon than he did at the GOP convention.
At least Mr Hunter wasn't an enraged republican who got violent with Cenk. Poor dear being surrounded by all those nasty republicans. I wonder how he handles the yuckyness.
I would correct you Cenk: "suicides." If this guy thinks Guantanamo Bay is so great why hasn't he spent the night there with the prisoners? Can we waterboard him? Mr Hunter needs to come to my criminal justice classes and try to defend his bullshit.
Historically the "ticking time-bomb" senario is faulty. Because Torture has never been an effective way of extracting ACCURATE intelligence.
Not to mention the fact that we the USA have signed into the Geneva Convention thereby making it a violation of international law for us to use torture.
plus ticking bomb scenarios where you have the right guy are so extremely rare that it doesnt justify general legislation (not even a serious debate), two of more reasons why this whole torture concept is not even a concern among criminologists
Yeah seriously... then when you point that out they say something stupid like "You want americans to die." its rediculas!
Not to mention the fact that telling your captures mis-information during a torture session further aids the terrorists. Especially if there is only limited time to act as ONE lie can de-rail the entire investigation and cost lives as opposed to save them.
Yep. I wish Cenk asked him about ACTUAL intelligence. All Hunter did was talk about getting info. Torture, no matter what it is, is designed to get info that you want to justify something not info that you need. Now the question to ask is how can those in Guantanamo Bay get justice for what has happened to them? I wish Cenk also asked him about CHILDREN being in the prison and being abused. It's been documented that children are sexually abused to get their parents to talk.
Thats not going to happen. I mean unless they are actual American Citizens at best they can hope for even under an Obama administration is to be released and minimal monetary compensation.
If what Hunter says about the present conditions in Guantanamo are true, (which i doubt, seemingly only evidenced by contrived, manufactured, specially timed visits by VIPs), It is only because it has been under the microscope of the world! Change if at all, has only occurred due to pressure from influential civilised parties. "No murders", is that due to good management, the 23 hour lock up regime, or the social and individual psyche of the detainees? The regime only bends to protect itself!
Its funny how Republicans are always the first to get up in arms about taxes yet they have no problem with spending tax payer dollars on Gitmo so that the prisoners can be read the Qur'an.
Oh and waterboarding CAN drown a person. It's called Dry Drowning. Basically, your body believes it is drowning and causes the laryngospasm reflex(which you have absolutely no control over) thus causing asphyxiation.
Rep. Hunter was so careful to say that there haven't been any murders. I wonder if its his lack of education or if he really was being careful to not mention homicide.
Very impressive Cenk,and a great interview all around
You kept focus on the issue and though the congressmen kept trying to support an acutality with a hypotheical (if you could save . . ),you didn't allow that to sway the point.The hypotheical argument is a fallacious tacit of rhetoric,torture is torture,if you gain information from one what about the hundreds subjected to it that don't have any.(see I can do it do).The real point is that the U.S shouldn't have any concentrations camps period
Torture is for Mel Gibson movies, not American prisoners of war. I'm glad that both of the major candidates for president are against torture and want to close Gitmo.
why do you give these people a forum for repeating the same nonsense again and again, the case for torture is the case for creationism - there is no rational case for these things, as good as all criminologists worldwide say its ineffective and almost completely irrelevant, asking like this is basically asking for a demagogic routine which you get (by hunter and in the comments here)
and finally. You claim Gitmo is so great because of the low murder rate. So if we took a random selection of 1000 people and killed one, would you be OK with that because it's only a 0.1% murder rate?
Hypothetical question #2: How many American lives are equal to torturing someone? You say we can save 'millions' but how many specifically till it's wrong? Is it OK to torture someone if it only saves 100,000 lives? 1000? 10? 1? How many people are you willing to torture to save a single American life? And, how many are you willing to torture to save a single non-American life?
Ok Congressman Hunter, here's a hypothetical for you: how would you like it if you were locked into a 'country club' for the rest of your life. You could never leave, never communicate with anyone outside, never do anything with your life but sit there and rot. Does that sound like a good deal to you?
That's all well IF you could prove that they have the right guy. But they are torturing people to SEE if they have the right guy which as McCain himself has said, creates false confessions. Not to mention that those innocents being tortured might not be so innocent the next time around.
who the hell said there was anything super about your country at the moment? If you excuse torture, then you`re complicit in it. Think about that for a moment. Then tell me how you know you have the right guy - the only way is to gather evidence, charge him and try him. It`s as bad as those who talk about "terrorist suspects". You wouldn`t say a "murderer suspect" or a "rapist suspect", but terrorist suspect is okay, because that absolves you of the responsibility for actually getting it right.
Torture is torture and is unacceptable anywhere, anytime, anyhow. There are no excuses. If you had someone who had information about a nuclear strike ... how the hell would you know that in the first place? It`s something called intelligence, it`s what real peacekeepers indulge in, not the fascist cowboys that this right wing jerk represents. There is no excuse, and what goes around comes around, and anyone trying to excuse torture is as guilty as those who indulge in it.
Isn't that a disgrace that inmates have better medical treatment than many Americans? That's not something to be proud of. Why are they proud of that?
The point is that many of the prisoners have been released, they were and are innocent yet were kept in the 'country club' Guantanamo. We have had several prisoners returned here to the UK after 5 years. Who has the right to detain anyone without trial or representation for 5 years. We invented Habeaus Corpus 700 years ago to stop anyone from the King down detaining anyone without due process you have thrown out the bedrock of liberty and have no right to preach to anyone about democracy.
Agreed polite. When they torture for any reason it sends a very clear message that when our troops or civilians are captured our people will go through hell thanks to this Bushit and Zion
Dorktastic. Man, and these people are running the country? I wish there was a God so someone could bitchslap some sense into every one of them, all at once.
Anyone noticed Republican convention looked like KKK rally, all whites, lot's of cowboy hats. No diversity whatsoever, it looked like 1950s white suburban rich neighborhood church gathering
Duncan Hunter admits that al-Qaeda receives better health care FROM THE GOVERNMENT than citizens do from private HMOs. There you are.
borjon23 1 year ago
Hey you could be feeding prisoners Marie Calendar chocolate pies every day but that does not make torturing them okay.
chineseconservative 1 year ago
lol "orange chicken time guys. hurry up now we gotta waterboard u in a lil"
jaylivinlifeful 1 year ago 3
hahahahaha, republikans are like clowns, but instead of water guns they have real guns! Now on the real side of the issue, everything is valid during a war... if we'd had to torture Hitler himself to stop WW II we would have done it. So, I'm not OK with torture, but lets face it, every country does it! China Does it, Russia Does it England Does it and off course, ripping heads of prisoners is not exactly humane, right?
phillipm1 2 years ago
Rep Hunter... what a scumbag.
curea229 2 years ago
Well done GWB jnr's administration for the furthering of abuse of humans in the world.
You know how it was done in the old days? If there was a dirty job to do you'd do it and take the consequences for your country by resigning.
Now these cowards hide behind the troops who are taking the fall for their stupidity.
Rumsfeld, Bush and Cheeny are scum.
ipxzor 2 years ago
This is even more fascinating in retrospect, since we know how useless the torture was. Plus the detainees were in Gitmo well past the "ticking bomb" time frame.
rcevey2 2 years ago
And we know that there have been 100 deaths 34 of which were determined to be homicides.
tubby6t9 2 years ago
That was actually a really great interview. Well done Cenk.
On the downside, this scares me. Until recently I didn't realise how openly advocated torture is in America. I just can't understand how it's allowed in a western, developed nation, especially one that is so vocal about their sense of justice and democracy.
Englishdosser86 2 years ago 4
you can get a person to say they are an ardvark if you waterboard them enough.
REALLYIMAGINARY 2 years ago 3
That is the purpose of it... Thank you for stating the obvious.
tommysch 2 years ago
its hard to murder someone with a flashlight in your anus
REALLYIMAGINARY 2 years ago
Reallyignoranty: You sound like you speak from experience. Have the batteries run out yet?
Silberdachs 2 years ago
....and this freakin idiot U.S. Rep. who supports waterboarding has a son now serving in Iraq???
tubechill 3 years ago
Not any more...he has a son WHO JUST WON HIS SEAT IN CONGRESS and is now spouting the same bullshit!
throwback2now 3 years ago
if you can call raping people with flashlights dippe din battery acid, serving.
REALLYIMAGINARY 2 years ago
I do.
tommysch 2 years ago
How do we know no murder has happened at Guantanamo? Lets see some video of these suicides to be sure theres been no foul play. And in Hanoi, how many pows murdered other pows? Its a separate issue, I know.
brumac44 3 years ago 2
Watch at 9:15 WTF was the guy in back doing? lol
potter651 3 years ago
ahahaha
econchick 3 years ago
I spy with my little two eyes Ana at 4:28 lol
potter651 3 years ago
I guess they need good medical staff at Gitmo due to the torture that they do there on a regular basis.
By the way, I guess he should be aware that the US ratified the Torture Convention, which prohibits toture under ALL circumstances. So yeah, let's just through out the law for political considerations.
suneku78 3 years ago
Hunter has a point though.
samudra8O 3 years ago
Again, why would the CIA keep using it then? They're not gonna keep doing something that doesn't get proper info...
cl998 3 years ago
What's really scary is that there is a Waterboard at a museum in Toronto along with other 'outdated torture devices'
riotriotriot55 3 years ago
Duncan Hunter thinks, he's above the law. During his campaigne, for prsident, he ran up a bill for food at a local restaurant and tried to walk off with out paying. Thank goodness he's out.
08maggie 3 years ago 3
Oh great, they get free prayer beads and a torturer reads a book to them (as well as soccer and veggies between torture sessions)... Talk to the INNOCENT folks (like the muslim in Canada) who was tortured for nothing, he was innocent. Also search for Scott Loper a United States police officer sent to a Canandian prison to be tortured for 4 years and his young son is missing.
If they gave a shit about the people they wouldnt dump wallstreets debt on them or depleted uraniun on our own troops
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oligiruni 3 years ago
Hunter=asshole. You have great food, and prisoner soccer-after we take out your teeth and waterboard you and keep you in stress positions for hours. Fuck his percentage, this moron quotes Fox news and uses the B.S. imminent danger "nuclear event" scenario-which NEVER HAPPENS. We'll never know if Kalid Sheik did plan 9/11, because once you torture someone, they say anything. F- him and his "marquis de queensbury rules" B.S. while he endorses Nazi and criminal behavior by our troops.
bestinhouse 3 years ago
once again, another congressman that should be swept off in the middle of the night, bound and gagged, and then waterboarded. As he is waterboarded, he should be asked if it is torture - in between his gasping for breath.
rarelibra 3 years ago 2
The terrorist doesn't deserve anything. Torture away, I actually agree. We don't have to be soft on them. All I ask is put up the evidence. Just present the evidence, prove that they are terrorists and you can do what ever you want, cut of their fingers, whip em, waterboard. Just prove them guilty first.
MaxMackan 3 years ago
MaxMackan is a terrorist. I'm reporting you to the DHS right now.
juancho420 3 years ago
Max - you are the first one to state correctly. They FIRST need to have a trial and be proven GUILTY. Then you can torture away for information. If they are found innocent, let them walk.
rarelibra 3 years ago 2
who cares what humans feel they are stupid and weak
yahyahtoopy 3 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
as far as im concerned,torture is better than terrorists deserve.its completely justified.
tastysalad 3 years ago
tastysalad - you would quickly change your mind if local law enforcement decided to strike you in your 'green zone' and waterboard you for information.
rarelibra 3 years ago
more new world order shit
tastysalad 3 years ago
tasty - First of all, how do you define "terrorist"? We as a nation invaded another sovereign country that had not done anything to us - you don't think that is "terroristic" in any way? Second, how do you know that these people are in fact terrorists? 80% of them were handed over to us by Pakistanis for a BOUNTY, not captured on the battlefield. Of course they're going to take the money, regardless of innocence. Also, have you ever heard of Brown v. Mississippi? See my comment above.
technicschic 3 years ago
Ducan hunter for Pres. thats all i have to say.
blackjet22 3 years ago
What most right wing nuts don't realize is that most of the prisoners in Gitmo probably haven't committed any crimes. And we refuse to actually present "evidence" against them in a courtroom. How convenient.
led4acs 3 years ago 3
How do you debate halfwits and atheists that haven't the brains to debate issues? Its like Obama. He talks really well from a teleprompter, but when he is asked questions that he is not up on the subject, he says "uhhhh, well uhhhh, uhhhhhhhhh...."
3LCZW 3 years ago
As opposed to highly intelligent intellectuals like yourself. Right...
juancho420 3 years ago
I Dont Care That The food is good in the prison
I Dont Care That They get to hear the koran
I Dont Care That They get to play soccer
I CARE That the law has been broken there, and thats the only thing that should matter
ejzejzejzejz 3 years ago 2
And Obama voted against the ban on partial birth abortion. and against the born alive infant act. You mass murders are worried about waterboarding. Oh!!!! lets worry about the other mass murderers, like you. I guess you mass murderers have to stick together.
.
3LCZW 3 years ago
No murder, rice pilaf, orange chicken, prisoners' weight gain - all excellent reasons for maintaining Gitmo. How cute! We should turn Washington DC (the murder capital of the world) into Gitmo. The only 'good reason'to torture is: you extract information that would save life. What if the suspect doesn't really know? You have tortured someone for nothing! There is a reason all civic societies throughtout history looked at torture as torture, not a 'tactic'. This is a bonanza for Alan Dershowitz.
rislam1991 3 years ago
But yet this same person that asked these questions and said waterboarding was wrong and probably votes for Democrats that want to keep partial birth abortion, that kills and then sucks the babies brain out. And if he's not a Democrat or liberal, scaring a prisoner into telling about events that could save lives, is not to far-fetched to use. None have been hurt phsyically by this procedure and when he compares the torture that McCain endured in Hanoi to Guantanamo, he is a fool.
3LCZW 3 years ago
History (and common sense) proves that information obtained from torture is unreliable, it is likely that in order to stop the suffering the victim will tell the person inflicting the pain anything they require (like a confession). This was quite popular in the middle ages.
Please watch this video all the way through and remember that the people in it are suspects and have not been convicted of any crimes.
watch?v=Ru0bxSqWMdo
This is not about patriotism it is about humanity.
swiftysmithuk 3 years ago
You are really a bleeding heart liberal! You don't even know the amount of lives saved by these confessions. There is no pain inflicted. But there is mental stress that scares them. We use the method for training our troops.
This guy is another bleeding heart that votes for Democrats that killed 45 million babies. what a hypocrite!!! Just suspects? Caught fighting us on the battlefield!
3LCZZ 3 years ago
I will ignore your childish attacks and present you with some facts.
"You don't even know the amount of lives saved by these confessions"
Top Interrogators Declare Torture Ineffective in Intelligence Gathering
tinyurl(.)com/ExpertsAgainstTorture
tinyurl(.)com/SENATE-APPROVES-DELAHUNT-NADLE
Continued...
swiftysmithuk 3 years ago
"There is no pain inflicted"
Watch this video: watch?v=Ru0bxSqWMdo
"Caught fighting on us battlefield"
Google "Extraordinary Rendition"
swiftysmithuk 3 years ago
If was so ineffective, then why would they keep using it? It's not like the CIA or whoever would do it for "fun" (in some cases maybe they do), they're intelligence gathering organisations so will only do what is most effective at getting them their "intel" and info...
cl998 3 years ago
I have never said that torture is ineffective, infact it is very effective, the problem is its effective in obtaining whatever information the person using it requires, whether it is true or not is irrelevant.
If someone had your balls in a vice and told you that when you admit you are a fairy on the top of a christmas tree they will stop turning the handle, what would you do?
Also I assume that you think this is only happening to terrorists, but if they had been proven guilty..
why do it?
swiftysmithuk 3 years ago
You make a good point if you look at it in the way that they need to meet "targets" (like, if they torure x-amount of people a month into being "guilty", they'll have met their "target", same as regular Police here have quotas to meet), but surely intel agencies are a bit above that, they'll actually want REAL info rather than just making up the numbers?
cl998 3 years ago
How are Intel agencies any different from individuals, should there be two laws, one for agencies and another for you and me?
Is it OK for you to torture to gain Intel or would you have to join some organisation to attain that right?
Do you think that torture is the way forward?
The link below has nothing to do with torture but I feel it shows just how much we have drifted away from the rule of law in recent times.
Remove Brackets:
tinyurl(.)com/TheLawByFredericBastiat
swiftysmithuk 3 years ago
That's straying from the point somewhat and a whole other different issue. Of course I'd expect to be jailed if I went and tortured someone to, I dunno, tell me where my stolen bike was kept...
cl998 3 years ago
"intel agencies are a bit above that, they'll actually want REAL info"
This is the point, torture does not work in obtaining reliable information, take for example the Tipton Three who confessed to meeting Bin laden when held in Gitmo, it was later found that they where in the UK at the time:
tinyurl(.)com/MythsAboutTorture
CIA Director William Colby, Torture is ineffective:
watch?v=DkanFveaCn0
BRIEFING TO THE UN COMMITTEE AGAINST TORTURE USA:
tinyurl(.)com/Breifing-On-US-Torture
swiftysmithuk 3 years ago
Remove Brackets and spaces from the links in my last comment
swiftysmithuk 3 years ago
Congressman Hunter is evidence that Hell is standing room only! Hunter's bought the ticket and watch him take the ride! BTW- I use to sell used cars (back in my drinking days)and the sales mgr. used the same mode of discourse.
grrcrl 3 years ago
This announcer will see you in hell, no matter what you don't believe, you will love your room with him there.
3LCZW 3 years ago
This guy is calling everyone that thinks torture is not right as 'mass murderer'. Let's use that logic, everyone that voted in favor of Iraq war are mass murderers of Americans (4000+) and Iraqis (millions?)! Do we need to say more about the mental state of these Zio-Nazi fanatics - the kind Alan Dershowitz is trying to promote as true patriotic Americans?
rislam1991 3 years ago 2
You sir are a complete idiot and I would like to see you in person. You leftist communist baby killers think its alright to kill 45 million babies and then completely ignore that fact when you debate. Like your response!
Torture is not right, I agree. But babykilling is more wrong than torture , if youthinkwaterboarding is torture you are wrong. There is nothing in my statement that says people that torture is a mass murderer.So the stupidity of your argument proves your lack of intellect.
3LCZW 3 years ago
3LCZW - waterboarding is torture. Maybe you should have the luxury of experiencing it sometime to make an educated comment on it. Are you US military? WTF do YOU know about it? So if torture is not right, and waterboarding is torture, then it is NOT RIGHT, PERIOD.
rarelibra 3 years ago 2
I always love that constant argument that torture is perfect if the prisoner is evil enough! How can anyone believe that bull? Also, I think the fantastic record of Guantanamo clearly proves that everyone should be imprisoned there without any rights. They must be happier than anyone walking around in the U.S.
eliseannville 3 years ago
Another bleeding heart liberal. We are going to let you house one of these or maybe two. These are killers, how do you think they should be handled. What is your educated guess?
3LCZW 3 years ago
The overarching lie is that none of these guys at Guantanamo ever had a clue 911 was going to happen and they are "scapegoats" for the people that really did it. I can say that because i don't wear a suit and tie and make a propaganda living. If people tended to listen to me; i expect i would spend the rest of my days in federal pound in the ass prison. It is just hierarchal bullshit; if you don't go along with the story you get to ride under the bus.
hypnofan35 3 years ago
Duncan Hunter is a fag that literally gets a boner when he thinks about torturing people. People like him should be removed from society.
AnonymousBChurch 3 years ago
What made America great was the fact that no matter the circumstances America had the higher moral ground. That no matter what was done to America...we would never stoop as low as these third world country tactics.
We were once better than "torture."
I will miss you America...
theparadox813 3 years ago 2
This is just stupid. If it really is such a country club, why are we coddling terrorists that way?
GrownupPhan 3 years ago
hunter is such a fake
mohammadmurtaza 3 years ago
Excuse me, here's a person right here who believes that Bagram and Abu Ghraib WERE as bad as the N. Vietnamese. He's really out of touch if he doesn't think a lot of Americans believe this.
GrownupPhan 3 years ago
If hunter had his way, he would open more gulags all over Eastern Europe and through as many muslims in there as he could. Yes, those prisoners are not innocent people but here in America we have standards and laws we abide by. By Hunters own definition, it is the laws that separate civilization from savagery. Hunter is a self-aware fool
mohammadmurtaza 3 years ago
duncan's been watching too much 24. really he thinks jack bauer is an american hero. jk
theloniousmonkus 3 years ago 2
He'd change his tune when HIS testicles are in a vise. Soprano, in high 'C'.
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ppiuaaaak 3 years ago
Gee lets open the Guantanamo resort.This jerk off could be the General Manager
humaner 3 years ago
5:00 - I've got a better answer: Firing off a gun next to someone's ear to scare them is not torture. Waterboarding is.
sonisisuper 3 years ago
Scaring someone shooting around you, compared to Physical contact and pain. This is once again, "Do as I say!Not as I do!
bfum 3 years ago
You guys are fucking cowards.
GET YOUR FUCKING HEAD SCREWED ON STRAIGHT!
Stop this masochistic theme of self-loathing!
Yes, America sets the standard, but these scum are mostly responsible for killing our flesh and blood here and abroad.
They got it better in Gitmo than they've ever had it in Babylon. At least they're not sleeping in cave, wiping their asses with their hands and burning our flag while contemplating another suicide bombing.
gregmarlett 3 years ago
you forget that most of the guys in GITMO, do not have the rights of those garunteed by the Geneva convention to ALL prisoners! These guys havent even been charged with any crime... The right of Habeas Corpus is garunteed by the Amerikan constitution, thats the right to be CHARGED when you're interned...
VanTheKraut 3 years ago
It's easy to assume someone's guilt when it isn't your testicles in the vice, unless you've been through such procedures and speak out of your out experience, but somehow i doubt that was the case!
Antoshik81 3 years ago
Karma will eventually take back the ignorance he imposes on society. No one can hide from karmatic retribution.
defektev 3 years ago
clown... i wonder if he ever served in the military
press1500 3 years ago
Could anyone be worse than McCain?
Okay, okay...maybe Hunter!
DillonX 3 years ago 2
what a ass-hole...
I would like to water-board him!!
wldk38 3 years ago
This asshole scares me.
amigoamen 3 years ago
Never had a murder?...there's only one gang - Al Qaeda. The majority inmate group is thinking "How the hell did i get caught?" and a smaller group is thinking "What the hell am i doing here? I'm innocent" 6 years+ waiting for trial is a long time compared to Neuremberg after WW2. Hustle up.
BorisTHEgypsy 3 years ago
... Taxi to the Dark Side... They murdered that innocent man.
RedPandaBoy 3 years ago
he treats fundamental rights as if they were a nice thing the state hands down to whom they like...You cant rationalize violating them even if its for the "greater good". Its a MATTER OF PRINCIPLE. Example: If some Hero agrees to sacrifice himself to rescue 1000 other people then thats good. But Nobody has the right to make that decision for him, not even our highest leaders or the worlds greatest commanders. I think many people dont realise what "MATTER OFPRINCIPLE" actually means...
EngineerFromGermany 3 years ago
"There's only one major prison in the world that's never had a murder." And just how exactly does this fuck-head know this to be true? Bullshit.
The republican idiot in this video only makes the U.S. look worse. Excellent food. Yummy. I'd trade my freedom any day to stay at Gitmo. I could play soccer, too. And water boarding? It's a prank!
nicogum 3 years ago 2
Yeah but American people in prison have had a fair jury trial, with constitutional rights to fair representation and habeas corpus. The people in guantanamo bay HAVE NEVER HAD A TRIAL! JUST LOCKED UNDER SUSPICION!
MaNarchicDRAKE 3 years ago 3
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Hunter ROCKS!!
MadBadVoodo 3 years ago
In Israel, they treat their prisoners decently and respectfully, even having guard-inmate card games. This has been proven by experimentation to yield much better results.
cockroach2 3 years ago
mommy this idiot,this traitor,this coward ,bitch motherfucker scares me
Fox1in20CopsHaveSTDs 3 years ago
yeah im suuuurrree they were playing soccer!
jdemont3397 3 years ago
Are these prisoners convicted of a crime? Are they there voluntarily? If there was a nuclear weapon planted in the US the US would not find it because they didn't do anything to prevent 911 even though their intel warned them months before it happened. It all boils down to skin color and religious background.
jazzyjimbryant 3 years ago 2
Keep talking buddy, torture is a war crime!
kimintexas 3 years ago
Isn't is really offensive that they read the Qu'ran (koran) over the loud speakers.. pretty much admitting that they are only interested in capturing Muslims.. Are there any non-muslims in Guantanimo bay?
GabrielGZNH 3 years ago 2
mommy that man hunter scares me
Fox1in20CopsHaveSTDs 3 years ago
in Canada on oct 1 /2008 the supreme court of Canada ruled anyone can sue a cop in civil cops because one person might be denied justice
Fox1in20CopsHaveSTDs 3 years ago
another thing, didn't he say he disagrees on the ruling of the supreme court on hiatus corpus, then later saying he helped put in a military tribunal that includes a right to confront your accuser? wtf?
MojoJuana 3 years ago
Its like Butlins!!! :-)
ChrisMeerkat 3 years ago
this great patriotic american duncan douchbag brags that alledged terrorists have better healthcare that the 47 million law abiding americans who healthcare he denies. waterboard this motherfucker, he'll say he's the mastermind of 9-11, too!
MojoJuana 3 years ago
yeah, douchbag! this moron spins it like gitmo is some kinda club med. fuck outta here!
MojoJuana 3 years ago
Cenk is going to need a three-day shower when this convention is over.
fishbonebuba 3 years ago 2
That would fly(no pun intended) in the face liberal hippy doctrine.
patsagainstrats 3 years ago
Hunter seemed kind of.. not extreme. I thought he made some good points.
All though I totally disagree with him and I would have catched him in a couple of lies right there, he did seem less of a loon than he did at the GOP convention.
Visfen 3 years ago
Hunter is tough. If he wasn't considered for veep, he must have some MAJOR skeletons in his closet. 'cuz he's pretty slick.
TracyInsomiac 3 years ago
At least Mr Hunter wasn't an enraged republican who got violent with Cenk. Poor dear being surrounded by all those nasty republicans. I wonder how he handles the yuckyness.
LittlePinky82 3 years ago
I would correct you Cenk: "suicides." If this guy thinks Guantanamo Bay is so great why hasn't he spent the night there with the prisoners? Can we waterboard him? Mr Hunter needs to come to my criminal justice classes and try to defend his bullshit.
LittlePinky82 3 years ago
CEEEEEEEEEEEEEEENKKKKKKKKKKK, toe to fuckin toe with the hunter!!! WHY can somebody please tell me, is Cenk NOT on national Television
degraffs 3 years ago 2
Historically the "ticking time-bomb" senario is faulty. Because Torture has never been an effective way of extracting ACCURATE intelligence.
Not to mention the fact that we the USA have signed into the Geneva Convention thereby making it a violation of international law for us to use torture.
UltimoLatino 3 years ago
plus ticking bomb scenarios where you have the right guy are so extremely rare that it doesnt justify general legislation (not even a serious debate), two of more reasons why this whole torture concept is not even a concern among criminologists
random0815 3 years ago 2
Thank you! I'm glad you mentioned that. These republicans act like the show "24" is real. It's ridiculous!
LittlePinky82 3 years ago
Yeah seriously... then when you point that out they say something stupid like "You want americans to die." its rediculas!
Not to mention the fact that telling your captures mis-information during a torture session further aids the terrorists. Especially if there is only limited time to act as ONE lie can de-rail the entire investigation and cost lives as opposed to save them.
UltimoLatino 3 years ago
Yep. I wish Cenk asked him about ACTUAL intelligence. All Hunter did was talk about getting info. Torture, no matter what it is, is designed to get info that you want to justify something not info that you need. Now the question to ask is how can those in Guantanamo Bay get justice for what has happened to them? I wish Cenk also asked him about CHILDREN being in the prison and being abused. It's been documented that children are sexually abused to get their parents to talk.
LittlePinky82 3 years ago
Thats not going to happen. I mean unless they are actual American Citizens at best they can hope for even under an Obama administration is to be released and minimal monetary compensation.
UltimoLatino 3 years ago
fucking republicans...uhh
dlacc187 3 years ago
this hunter guy is disgusting.
123476543278 3 years ago 2
This Rep. Hunter fucker is EXACTLY what wrong with our country.
A piece of shit fear mongering neocon apologist who will ALWAYS find some justification for torture NO MATTER WHAT.
He'll play on our fears with some BS hypothetical situation and ignore the fact that torture produces FALSE CONFESSIONS.
If I were to waterboard his dumb ass I would be able to get him to tell me he was plotting murder in no time flat.
Neocons promote torture bcuz it makes us all complicit in their crimes.
pwg357 3 years ago 3
Why isn't Rep. Hunter the presidential nominee? He is so much more qualified than John McCain.
yougiberishtube 3 years ago
If what Hunter says about the present conditions in Guantanamo are true, (which i doubt, seemingly only evidenced by contrived, manufactured, specially timed visits by VIPs), It is only because it has been under the microscope of the world! Change if at all, has only occurred due to pressure from influential civilised parties. "No murders", is that due to good management, the 23 hour lock up regime, or the social and individual psyche of the detainees? The regime only bends to protect itself!
door2yourheart 3 years ago
Men of the Representatives generation must be voted out.
katey1dog 3 years ago
Its funny how Republicans are always the first to get up in arms about taxes yet they have no problem with spending tax payer dollars on Gitmo so that the prisoners can be read the Qur'an.
HopelessIndecision 3 years ago
Oh and waterboarding CAN drown a person. It's called Dry Drowning. Basically, your body believes it is drowning and causes the laryngospasm reflex(which you have absolutely no control over) thus causing asphyxiation.
Rep. Hunter was so careful to say that there haven't been any murders. I wonder if its his lack of education or if he really was being careful to not mention homicide.
Homicide: the killing of another human being.
Murder: the intent to kill.
Just a thought.
HopelessIndecision 3 years ago 3
What a great point!
JudahKhan 3 years ago
Very impressive Cenk,and a great interview all around
You kept focus on the issue and though the congressmen kept trying to support an acutality with a hypotheical (if you could save . . ),you didn't allow that to sway the point.The hypotheical argument is a fallacious tacit of rhetoric,torture is torture,if you gain information from one what about the hundreds subjected to it that don't have any.(see I can do it do).The real point is that the U.S shouldn't have any concentrations camps period
JudahKhan 3 years ago 2
cenk, i'm very impressed with your sense of calm and patience with this morally retarded representative
MayorOfTown 3 years ago 3
Oh, they have excellent food? Gourmet? Is the next Iron Chef gonna be in Gitmo?
DblOSmith 3 years ago
How do u do it Turk, talk to these asses and not reach over and slit their throat.
jerrydoubleu 3 years ago
GITMO is pure evil. Let's waterboard Hunter & put him in stress positions. Then let's see how he likes it.
willywonka1207 3 years ago
and they cut them until they give them info
kcpalooza 3 years ago
Torture is for Mel Gibson movies, not American prisoners of war. I'm glad that both of the major candidates for president are against torture and want to close Gitmo.
oooooDisgruntledMonk 3 years ago
GitMo has never had a murder? Ler's see here..
they're muslim brothers with a common enemy.
they're seriously garded.
GitMo is not as old as other prisons.. What else?
lestliness 3 years ago
why do you give these people a forum for repeating the same nonsense again and again, the case for torture is the case for creationism - there is no rational case for these things, as good as all criminologists worldwide say its ineffective and almost completely irrelevant, asking like this is basically asking for a demagogic routine which you get (by hunter and in the comments here)
random0815 3 years ago
They had the Koran read to them at taxpayers expense! LOL
eStick1 3 years ago
and finally. You claim Gitmo is so great because of the low murder rate. So if we took a random selection of 1000 people and killed one, would you be OK with that because it's only a 0.1% murder rate?
james2968 3 years ago
Hypothetical question #2: How many American lives are equal to torturing someone? You say we can save 'millions' but how many specifically till it's wrong? Is it OK to torture someone if it only saves 100,000 lives? 1000? 10? 1? How many people are you willing to torture to save a single American life? And, how many are you willing to torture to save a single non-American life?
james2968 3 years ago
Ok Congressman Hunter, here's a hypothetical for you: how would you like it if you were locked into a 'country club' for the rest of your life. You could never leave, never communicate with anyone outside, never do anything with your life but sit there and rot. Does that sound like a good deal to you?
james2968 3 years ago
The Hanoi Hilton also had no inmates killing each other.
HeathenRage 3 years ago
@stolenrepublic
That's all well IF you could prove that they have the right guy. But they are torturing people to SEE if they have the right guy which as McCain himself has said, creates false confessions. Not to mention that those innocents being tortured might not be so innocent the next time around.
amir8500 3 years ago
who the hell said there was anything super about your country at the moment? If you excuse torture, then you`re complicit in it. Think about that for a moment. Then tell me how you know you have the right guy - the only way is to gather evidence, charge him and try him. It`s as bad as those who talk about "terrorist suspects". You wouldn`t say a "murderer suspect" or a "rapist suspect", but terrorist suspect is okay, because that absolves you of the responsibility for actually getting it right.
kabukiagent 3 years ago
Torture is torture and is unacceptable anywhere, anytime, anyhow. There are no excuses. If you had someone who had information about a nuclear strike ... how the hell would you know that in the first place? It`s something called intelligence, it`s what real peacekeepers indulge in, not the fascist cowboys that this right wing jerk represents. There is no excuse, and what goes around comes around, and anyone trying to excuse torture is as guilty as those who indulge in it.
kabukiagent 3 years ago
Cenk should have asked him about the inmates kept indefinitely without trial. Some of them are no doubt innocent.
FinnHawk 3 years ago
Heh. "A Defend-ANT, uh a gnat-c"
beriukay 3 years ago
Isn't that a disgrace that inmates have better medical treatment than many Americans? That's not something to be proud of. Why are they proud of that?
FinnHawk 3 years ago
Duck and cover..duncan hunter...neocon ass!
blackbart99 3 years ago
i saw the fifteen year old kid
with displaced sholder
i bet the quran displaced it
siavash89 3 years ago
and few peices of vegetables......that 5 star medical treatment is something.
9Aldin 3 years ago
Maybe there arn't as many murders in Guantanamo as there are in state prisons because state prisons actually hold real murderers.
vajdaOptima 3 years ago
ahahhaah i was thinkin same thing.......was waiting for cenk to say it.....
9Aldin 3 years ago
"You do what you have to do for you country to survive."
Thats the ideology of "we are allways right, because we are superior, no matter what."
Thats not fascism exactly, but how much closer to fascism should the U.S. get?
13otany13ay 3 years ago 2
Hunter is NOT a Republican, he's a neocon flying a Republican flag. Its people like this that gives traditional conservative Republicans a bad rap!
ElCapitan1985 3 years ago 2
The point is that many of the prisoners have been released, they were and are innocent yet were kept in the 'country club' Guantanamo. We have had several prisoners returned here to the UK after 5 years. Who has the right to detain anyone without trial or representation for 5 years. We invented Habeaus Corpus 700 years ago to stop anyone from the King down detaining anyone without due process you have thrown out the bedrock of liberty and have no right to preach to anyone about democracy.
xLakshmex 3 years ago 3
Duncan Hunter represents the betrayal of everything we stand for as Americans.
The greatest country in the world, reduced to the same moral standing as Nazi Germany.
politicalfarce 3 years ago 5
Agreed polite. When they torture for any reason it sends a very clear message that when our troops or civilians are captured our people will go through hell thanks to this Bushit and Zion
cycimian 3 years ago
Pilau rice and orange chicken?! Now that's a tasty way to recover from torture...
hausland 3 years ago
Dorktastic. Man, and these people are running the country? I wish there was a God so someone could bitchslap some sense into every one of them, all at once.
thpt 3 years ago
But we want them to murder each other.
RUKiddinMeHuh 3 years ago
Anyone noticed Republican convention looked like KKK rally, all whites, lot's of cowboy hats. No diversity whatsoever, it looked like 1950s white suburban rich neighborhood church gathering
ferrariModenas 3 years ago
Lets see they read the Qouran over the loud speaker 5 times a day??? so they only lockup muslims??? Good to know.
Aquestadona 3 years ago
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA
No one could be that oblivious Aquestadona.
What the hell kind of organization do you think Al Qaeda is?
AngrySkeptic 3 years ago
Al Qaeda is a self proclaimed savior of the muslims,the same way the US is the self proclaimed leader of the free world.
Both are dead wrong,ones for killing even their own people and the others by acting in the exact same way.Guantanamo is a national disgrace.
Wire taps,kidnapping,torture,bait and switching to justify their crimes yet still, they want to get respect for that,shameles pack of thugs they are.
Aquestadona 3 years ago
OMG If he is not bullsh**ing I WANT to go to Guantanamo!
Taatoon2142 3 years ago
This guy is an asshole! People like hunter are ruining America.
keithrockerboblewis 3 years ago
OMG If he is not bullsh**ing I WANT go Guantanamo!
Taatoon2142 3 years ago
Anyone who votes McCain is either:
Racist(like Hunter), Rich or a very fucking un-educated voter.
... another one has being added Racist Sexist Ex-Hillary Supporters.
they talk about Unity while they have separates conventions one in one side of the city and the other on the other.
The Republican Party, Party of Divisions of race, social economics, religions, and Ideas,
...are they running for The Divided States of Amerikkka???
gallomex13 3 years ago 2
So we should send Bush there for his safety? Rove can keep him company
Plutonwolf 3 years ago
How can you defend gitmo? The good medical facilities are surley just to keep the victims from dying. This man is scum.