i guess you know xing yi was created in war times so the internal training is the soul and mind of the system. xing yi is a combat system, not a sport one. i hope you're doing the internal training, if you do you'll become a truly master.
@cesarfsaenz - No prob, we all have different views. Xingyi was created oin the North, Wing Chun in the south, i dont see any realation through history. The only thing close to xingyi even taught in shaolin was xinyiba and 1 its very different, 2 it again was in the North. Internal has many different meanings also, so im sure their was some internal stuff in the south, but not xingyi or bagua. Its all good though, great talkin with you. I teach Dai Xinyi and Che Xingyi as well as wing chun
@shifudan No stereotyping of any sorts intended here, just curious, what lineage of wing chun do you practice? The lineage from Yip Man draws some of its important principles for xingyi actually. I say this not to credit xing yi for the creation of wing chun, don't get me wrong, I'm just saying it has certain influence. Yip Man's disciples said it themselves. However, the two arts are still vastly different in many ways and are both good in their own ways.
@shifudan I hope we can put down our differences here and not feel offended by the notion that an art might have had influence from another, coz honestly I see no shame in this, it is in the spirit of martial arts to take in the best from others with an open heart. Xingyi itself was developed over a long period of time, it is not absolutely accurate to credit only li luo neng because he drew his knowledge from earlier skills. The animal forms in Xingyi actually come from shaolin.
Similarly Wing Chun drew its inspiration from various southern martial arts and later had internal art influence. The original wing chun did not have high kicks, chain punches or the notion of one-inch punch, these were all added in later. This just shows how important it is to exchange pointers and be open to learning new things all the time, even from other schools. Peace. :)
@1314nameless im not a guy to argue, but to share and exchange, im open to hearing things but simply feel your ideas are not correct on the history, Which of Yip mans disciples say xingyi has anything to do with wing chun, i will ask them, i have talked with several yip man disciples, none feel this is true at all. Where did "later wing chun get internal influence? " theirs alot of research these days, and again many wing chun systems differ greatly.
@cesarfsaenz I agree, it's important. But people act like it's going to make you hit as hard as Brock Lesnar. That delusional attitude demoralizes the art.
boy i dig the heard chigonig .But i bet if you did San Ti Shi for an hour every day you would not need to do all that stuff.have you ever done a 2 person xingyi set ,or something like taichi push hands or bagwa sticky hands ?
@randyds5 - xingyi was created by li louneng and che yizhai, had zero connection to wing chun, came from Dai Xinyi again no connection to wing chun at all.
@shifudan I dont know man. If you look at the history of wing chun, It would appear that Ng Mui was influenced by the internal martial arts, especially xingyi. just my opinion though
Thanks for the references. It looks they might be almost as good as our late Shi fu, Marcello Teixeira. Note that I said our system looked different. I never said it was worse.
Chen Xiao-wang is the 19th standard bearer of Chen style Taji and is a living national treasure of China. Li Tai-liang is the inheritor of Dai family Xingyi. Mike Sigman is perhaps the strongest internal guy in the US. All of them are very approachable and very willing to share what they have. Chen is in Australia, and both Li and Sigman are in the US.
Our style is a modified Che style, and I think that made it better. Brazil is fertile soil for martial arts today (Gracie Jiu Jitsu, Machida Karate). I think the same happened to Xing Yi here. Don't take me wrong, I respect Li Tai-Liang, especially because his style gave origin to my school's style, and he is really good, as far as I can see. But he doesn't have the kind of experience Marcello Teixeira had. Living in Rio de Janeiro has its advantages.
I have wanted to visit Brazil for about forty years to train in Capoeira. Alas I have yet to make it there.
I am not questioning the fighting prowess of your instructor, but is it Xingyi? I have seen Vince Black a number of times and there is no question the man can fight. What he does looks like Xingyi, but he lacks the internal qualities so I can't call what he does "Xingyi." Mike Patterson is someone whom I haven't seen but he has a good reputation for the internal. And he can fight.
I see your point. But as you pointed, it does look like Xing Yi. So, instead of giving it another name, we just say it's a different style. It certainly doesn't look like anything else, as far as I know. There's already too much fragmentation in the chinese martial arts community. We try not to create more.
Hmm. Is Xingyi without the internal principles actually "Xingyi?" My original Xingyi teacher taught me something that looked like the real thing, but then I was exposed to someone who had something beyond what I was getting before. I was able to see the rather large gaps in my instructor's knowledge. Previously I had thought he was the real thing. Now I know better. I am not saying that he did not impart something of value, just that it wasn't internal.
Let me get something clear: my school doesn't ignore the internal principles. The students (me included) don't focus on it because we're having less two hours of training per week, without our teacher (he's been busy). There are more important things to do, It's far more important to be able to fight, even if we lack internal training. The way I see it, Xing Yi is a combat system, all that internal stuff is complementary. The forms and their applications define the art.
@maxingyi Hey! Don't get caught up in all those intellectual theories. Just do your Art and let the techniques speak for themselves. Chi will come if you stay persistent in your training. Above all what is more important is that You practice with the right mind-set and a good heart.
@maxingyi you know what.... I actually agree with you! Iam a xingyi practioner. In order to reach the highest pinnacle of xingyi, you have to train the internal aspect of soft power, and vitalizing your health. But, if you are limited on time, it is of far more value to focus on the external principles of being able to defend oneself. Ask any western boxer. If he is lacking in time. he will always work on his basics, instead of specialty techqniues.Tellur students to train qigong on their own
@maxingyi There is nothing mystical about the internal principles. And this statement means you don't really understand them. It's all body mechanics. Sure, you can fight without them. But it's the difference between giving someone a punch that stings and knocking them senseless. Why? Body alignment and power generation. Coming from the feet and through the body. And there's no point to bashing on walls. In fact it's detrimental to practice, as you eventually start flinching away.
@SsehKalai Technically, they aren't wrong to practice in such a way, because the xingyi training is meant to go from hard to soft, this is because softness without strength still means no power, it is also required because the xingyi style is meant to be dominating and practical. However, you are definitely right in your understanding of internal power. Newtonian mechanics, not magic, is key. Without it, no amount of hard training is effective because you are strong but unable to unleash power.
@maxingyi Focus on acceleration, not stiffness. I notice your fists are the same speed throughout. That means you use strength right from the beginning, but then you are wasting strength, furthermore muscles work in pairs, one relaxes while the other contracts. by stiffening, you are fighting your own muscles. Instead release your strength in a short burst only in the last inch or less. That way you have maximum energy transference, rather than wasting it before you reach your target.
Great conditioning and basic technique training, but I'm noticing a lot of winding up and relying almost purely on strength for the attacks. I've been taking Xing-Yi for over 6 years and one of the 1st things our Shrfu explains is the "internal aspects" of the art; using your body to generate force not just your muscles. Do you guys practice the whipping motions of the body (some refer to as Dragon Body)? Ex. "popping the hips" as you strike to generate more force. Good video overall though!
You're right. My teacher keeps saying I'm using too much force. In my defense, those videos are old, so I'm probably a little better now. We practice whipping motions, but maybe we should put more work on it. I'll think about it. Our teacher is not always available, so our training has been a little chaotic lately.
My point is that the kicks we use in Xing Yi usually don't require extensive work in toughening our feet, although it surely helps. It amounts to how much time one has to practice.
That was by far the worst demonstration for the training I have witnessed. Part of Xing Yi is intent to move an object. It looks like you have a really bad teacher or you don't understand the linear concept.
Because that's part of our training, and we do Xing Yi. Just because it's different from what you're used to doesn't mean it's bad. It works remarkably well in combat, so our teacher can't be bad, can he?
Haha! No no no... "combat" is not against ground trained and mma combatants.... Its against your own students. So basicly when you "FIGHT" its just to see whos better at being terrible. Your training is sooo lacking its ridiculous. I do Xing Yi too and I cant even defend it. This makes the style look terrible. Your teacher must be terrible too....
Hey. Great to see that you are training for power and effectiveness in your techniques... many schools of traditional Chinese styles will never hit a bag, practice ground-and-pound, kick posts etc... I would recommend investing in some better equipment such as large hanging bags, punching bags, focus mits, Thai pads, etc, simply to add more to the quality of your training.
The reason to do sparring without kicks is to focus our training on our hands. It doesn't mean we don't do sparring with kicks. I can guarantee we have a lot more experience with real fights where we live than you'll have in your entire lifetime.
Isn't it always a big laugh that the people who talk the most crap never have nothing to show themselves and most of them are under 30 yrs old.You guys are doing a good job.
I've noticed that too, I always check the profiles of people who comment like this, I don't think I've seen one yet who has videos of themselves doing something better. Meanwhile looks like good conditioning work you're doing there, what is the wall made of (brick, plaster, etc)?
The wall is made of brick. The guy who is having fun shoulder striking the wall is our Laoshi.
I don't expect that people who make negative comments have videos to show, they have the right to express their opinion. But I can't understand why they think they are so much more enlightened about fights without rules than people who live in a very violent neighborhood in Brazil. :)
he really wants to break that wall O.O lolz sarcasim is fun^^
blacknatedog 7 months ago
taht is good for the cqc right??
AndersonConnection 11 months ago
this is not xing yi. this is a normal training for to damage your body.
change master.
kkienn 1 year ago
never train agaist wall!
peterwing 1 year ago
i guess you know xing yi was created in war times so the internal training is the soul and mind of the system. xing yi is a combat system, not a sport one. i hope you're doing the internal training, if you do you'll become a truly master.
cesarfsaenz 1 year ago
@cesarfsaenz Following your reasoning, every martial art created in war times would be internal.
maxingyi 1 year ago
@cesarfsaenz - No prob, we all have different views. Xingyi was created oin the North, Wing Chun in the south, i dont see any realation through history. The only thing close to xingyi even taught in shaolin was xinyiba and 1 its very different, 2 it again was in the North. Internal has many different meanings also, so im sure their was some internal stuff in the south, but not xingyi or bagua. Its all good though, great talkin with you. I teach Dai Xinyi and Che Xingyi as well as wing chun
shifudan 1 year ago
@shifudan No stereotyping of any sorts intended here, just curious, what lineage of wing chun do you practice? The lineage from Yip Man draws some of its important principles for xingyi actually. I say this not to credit xing yi for the creation of wing chun, don't get me wrong, I'm just saying it has certain influence. Yip Man's disciples said it themselves. However, the two arts are still vastly different in many ways and are both good in their own ways.
1314nameless 5 months ago
@shifudan I hope we can put down our differences here and not feel offended by the notion that an art might have had influence from another, coz honestly I see no shame in this, it is in the spirit of martial arts to take in the best from others with an open heart. Xingyi itself was developed over a long period of time, it is not absolutely accurate to credit only li luo neng because he drew his knowledge from earlier skills. The animal forms in Xingyi actually come from shaolin.
1314nameless 5 months ago
Similarly Wing Chun drew its inspiration from various southern martial arts and later had internal art influence. The original wing chun did not have high kicks, chain punches or the notion of one-inch punch, these were all added in later. This just shows how important it is to exchange pointers and be open to learning new things all the time, even from other schools. Peace. :)
1314nameless 5 months ago
@1314nameless im not a guy to argue, but to share and exchange, im open to hearing things but simply feel your ideas are not correct on the history, Which of Yip mans disciples say xingyi has anything to do with wing chun, i will ask them, i have talked with several yip man disciples, none feel this is true at all. Where did "later wing chun get internal influence? " theirs alot of research these days, and again many wing chun systems differ greatly.
shifudan 5 months ago
Comment removed
cesarfsaenz 1 year ago
Comment removed
cesarfsaenz 1 year ago
xing yi without internal training it.s not xing yi
cesarfsaenz 1 year ago
@cesarfsaenz I agree, it's important. But people act like it's going to make you hit as hard as Brock Lesnar. That delusional attitude demoralizes the art.
maxingyi 1 year ago
do you guys practice heavy arm training as well?
lonegroable 1 year ago
@lonegroable By heavy arm training, do you mean workout, like weightlifting? When this video was recorded, we didn't.
maxingyi 1 year ago
Remember I was here.Thai
universetechnique 1 year ago
想学功夫..先从中文学起吧....
shixin82 1 year ago
Personally I would rather be doing piquans than kicking a wooden post with sneakers on.
But I give you props, you seem dedicated to your training.
Just don't neglect the softness of the style, as that's where the power comes from...not waigong conditioning.
RenegadeRows 2 years ago
use the head 0:59
ALEdoublebackflip 2 years ago
boy i dig the heard chigonig .But i bet if you did San Ti Shi for an hour every day you would not need to do all that stuff.have you ever done a 2 person xingyi set ,or something like taichi push hands or bagwa sticky hands ?
transmoongoddess 2 years ago
looks a little more like wing chun than xing yi
rAFiCoRe 2 years ago
@rAFiCoRe they have similar roots. The creater or Wing Chun, had extensive training in the Wudang arts (including xing yi)
randyds5 1 year ago
@randyds5 - xingyi was created by li louneng and che yizhai, had zero connection to wing chun, came from Dai Xinyi again no connection to wing chun at all.
shifudan 1 year ago
@shifudan I dont know man. If you look at the history of wing chun, It would appear that Ng Mui was influenced by the internal martial arts, especially xingyi. just my opinion though
randyds5 1 year ago
@randyds5 i dont see any v alidity to this idea. Im open to viewing some history if you have some
shifudan 5 months ago
Where is the peng? How about the dan tian? It looks something like Xingyi but without the core conditioning and principles.
steve0281 2 years ago
You mean it doesn't look like an internal martial art? Our school has some influence from Choy Lay Fut, so maybe that's why it looks different.
maxingyi 2 years ago
Look at Chen Xiao-wang, Li Tai-liang, Mike Sigman for people who have an excellent internal system.
steve0281 2 years ago
Thanks for the references. It looks they might be almost as good as our late Shi fu, Marcello Teixeira. Note that I said our system looked different. I never said it was worse.
maxingyi 2 years ago
Chen Xiao-wang is the 19th standard bearer of Chen style Taji and is a living national treasure of China. Li Tai-liang is the inheritor of Dai family Xingyi. Mike Sigman is perhaps the strongest internal guy in the US. All of them are very approachable and very willing to share what they have. Chen is in Australia, and both Li and Sigman are in the US.
steve0281 2 years ago
Our style is a modified Che style, and I think that made it better. Brazil is fertile soil for martial arts today (Gracie Jiu Jitsu, Machida Karate). I think the same happened to Xing Yi here. Don't take me wrong, I respect Li Tai-Liang, especially because his style gave origin to my school's style, and he is really good, as far as I can see. But he doesn't have the kind of experience Marcello Teixeira had. Living in Rio de Janeiro has its advantages.
maxingyi 2 years ago
I have wanted to visit Brazil for about forty years to train in Capoeira. Alas I have yet to make it there.
I am not questioning the fighting prowess of your instructor, but is it Xingyi? I have seen Vince Black a number of times and there is no question the man can fight. What he does looks like Xingyi, but he lacks the internal qualities so I can't call what he does "Xingyi." Mike Patterson is someone whom I haven't seen but he has a good reputation for the internal. And he can fight.
steve0281 2 years ago
I see your point. But as you pointed, it does look like Xing Yi. So, instead of giving it another name, we just say it's a different style. It certainly doesn't look like anything else, as far as I know. There's already too much fragmentation in the chinese martial arts community. We try not to create more.
maxingyi 2 years ago
Hmm. Is Xingyi without the internal principles actually "Xingyi?" My original Xingyi teacher taught me something that looked like the real thing, but then I was exposed to someone who had something beyond what I was getting before. I was able to see the rather large gaps in my instructor's knowledge. Previously I had thought he was the real thing. Now I know better. I am not saying that he did not impart something of value, just that it wasn't internal.
steve0281 2 years ago
Let me get something clear: my school doesn't ignore the internal principles. The students (me included) don't focus on it because we're having less two hours of training per week, without our teacher (he's been busy). There are more important things to do, It's far more important to be able to fight, even if we lack internal training. The way I see it, Xing Yi is a combat system, all that internal stuff is complementary. The forms and their applications define the art.
maxingyi 2 years ago
@maxingyi Hey! Don't get caught up in all those intellectual theories. Just do your Art and let the techniques speak for themselves. Chi will come if you stay persistent in your training. Above all what is more important is that You practice with the right mind-set and a good heart.
masterbakari 2 years ago
@maxingyi you know what.... I actually agree with you! Iam a xingyi practioner. In order to reach the highest pinnacle of xingyi, you have to train the internal aspect of soft power, and vitalizing your health. But, if you are limited on time, it is of far more value to focus on the external principles of being able to defend oneself. Ask any western boxer. If he is lacking in time. he will always work on his basics, instead of specialty techqniues.Tellur students to train qigong on their own
randyds5 1 year ago
@maxingyi There is nothing mystical about the internal principles. And this statement means you don't really understand them. It's all body mechanics. Sure, you can fight without them. But it's the difference between giving someone a punch that stings and knocking them senseless. Why? Body alignment and power generation. Coming from the feet and through the body. And there's no point to bashing on walls. In fact it's detrimental to practice, as you eventually start flinching away.
SsehKalai 1 year ago 2
@SsehKalai Technically, they aren't wrong to practice in such a way, because the xingyi training is meant to go from hard to soft, this is because softness without strength still means no power, it is also required because the xingyi style is meant to be dominating and practical. However, you are definitely right in your understanding of internal power. Newtonian mechanics, not magic, is key. Without it, no amount of hard training is effective because you are strong but unable to unleash power.
1314nameless 5 months ago
@maxingyi Focus on acceleration, not stiffness. I notice your fists are the same speed throughout. That means you use strength right from the beginning, but then you are wasting strength, furthermore muscles work in pairs, one relaxes while the other contracts. by stiffening, you are fighting your own muscles. Instead release your strength in a short burst only in the last inch or less. That way you have maximum energy transference, rather than wasting it before you reach your target.
1314nameless 5 months ago
Very nice Xing Yi training! Thank you! What style might I ask?
KCMO2NDTWIN 2 years ago
Thank you! It's a modified Che style.
maxingyi 2 years ago
Great conditioning and basic technique training, but I'm noticing a lot of winding up and relying almost purely on strength for the attacks. I've been taking Xing-Yi for over 6 years and one of the 1st things our Shrfu explains is the "internal aspects" of the art; using your body to generate force not just your muscles. Do you guys practice the whipping motions of the body (some refer to as Dragon Body)? Ex. "popping the hips" as you strike to generate more force. Good video overall though!
JWski59 2 years ago
You're right. My teacher keeps saying I'm using too much force. In my defense, those videos are old, so I'm probably a little better now. We practice whipping motions, but maybe we should put more work on it. I'll think about it. Our teacher is not always available, so our training has been a little chaotic lately.
Thanks for your comment.
maxingyi 2 years ago
DONT LISTEN TO THESE GUYS. You all are training great excellent video!!!!!!!!!
randyds5 2 years ago
Good shit, I like it. Their are no substitute for reality training. Keep up the good work.
Do you do any qi qong to augment the physical training?
masterbakari 3 years ago
Thank you. We usually do Qi Gong before or after the kind of training you see on this video.
maxingyi 3 years ago
i do the same training but with the bus stop, the lights of the street and the walls of many places... yeah i know, i'm insane
cineural 3 years ago
First of all your not suppose to use anything to guard yourself...the point is to tuffen your body. REMOVE THE SHOES!!!
TheStylesOfSin 3 years ago
Why remove the shoes? We don't walk on the street barefoot. If we were training for mma, then we would take off our shoes, but that's not the case.
maxingyi 3 years ago
Of course you don't walk on the street without shoes. But if your going to read a book don't go half way finish it.
TheStylesOfSin 3 years ago
My point is that the kicks we use in Xing Yi usually don't require extensive work in toughening our feet, although it surely helps. It amounts to how much time one has to practice.
maxingyi 3 years ago
Man, you're too old for trolling. I was about to reply when I checked your page. It shows this comment, by Daledugas67:
"Anytime you want to share with us your skills feel free to post videos of yourself duplicating the same thing.
You seem to be nothing but another internet nobody who feels they have the knowledge and skills to critique but you show nothing.
...
Train harder as you are going to need some serious skills to back up that mouth of yours."
Get a girlfriend. Seriously. Now!
maxingyi 3 years ago
...... Why did you name this Xing Yi Training??
That was by far the worst demonstration for the training I have witnessed. Part of Xing Yi is intent to move an object. It looks like you have a really bad teacher or you don't understand the linear concept.
BaguaStudent1 3 years ago
Because that's part of our training, and we do Xing Yi. Just because it's different from what you're used to doesn't mean it's bad. It works remarkably well in combat, so our teacher can't be bad, can he?
maxingyi 3 years ago
Haha! No no no... "combat" is not against ground trained and mma combatants.... Its against your own students. So basicly when you "FIGHT" its just to see whos better at being terrible. Your training is sooo lacking its ridiculous. I do Xing Yi too and I cant even defend it. This makes the style look terrible. Your teacher must be terrible too....
BaguaStudent1 3 years ago
Hey. Great to see that you are training for power and effectiveness in your techniques... many schools of traditional Chinese styles will never hit a bag, practice ground-and-pound, kick posts etc... I would recommend investing in some better equipment such as large hanging bags, punching bags, focus mits, Thai pads, etc, simply to add more to the quality of your training.
TimRedfern 3 years ago
Haha, dont tickle it cut its heart out and murder it!!
o0Cigarettes0o 3 years ago
You guys suck at this style, please don't name this useless crap Xing Yi. Also Don't do 'sparring without kicks'. Your enemies won't have rules
Scalier 3 years ago
The reason to do sparring without kicks is to focus our training on our hands. It doesn't mean we don't do sparring with kicks. I can guarantee we have a lot more experience with real fights where we live than you'll have in your entire lifetime.
maxingyi 3 years ago
Isn't it always a big laugh that the people who talk the most crap never have nothing to show themselves and most of them are under 30 yrs old.You guys are doing a good job.
shengchenfan 3 years ago
It surely is a big laugh. Thanks for your compliment.
maxingyi 3 years ago
I've noticed that too, I always check the profiles of people who comment like this, I don't think I've seen one yet who has videos of themselves doing something better. Meanwhile looks like good conditioning work you're doing there, what is the wall made of (brick, plaster, etc)?
Shindai 3 years ago
The wall is made of brick. The guy who is having fun shoulder striking the wall is our Laoshi.
I don't expect that people who make negative comments have videos to show, they have the right to express their opinion. But I can't understand why they think they are so much more enlightened about fights without rules than people who live in a very violent neighborhood in Brazil. :)
maxingyi 3 years ago
hell yeah, well said
randyds5 3 years ago
live training! GOOD stuff!
cubgrumpz 3 years ago