White is making a mockery of God's grace. Tit. 2:11 says that God's grace that brings salvation has appeared to ALL men.
Sproul says that true repentance requires a contrite heart. How does a corpse that is dead in sins and trespasses respond with a contrite repentance to the Gospel? If sinful man could respond in this way, God would not have had to save anyone monergistically. White and his friends are so bent on defending Calvinism that they are getting tangled in their own inconsistencies.
@lessingtom But salvation hasn't appeared to all men (every man without exception), has it? I was only reading the other day about a new Amazonian tribe photoed by a chopper. It has to all kinds of men (other tribes, Brits, Russians, Chinese, slaves, presidents...)
The unregenerate man doesn't [can't] respond in that way: reformed teaching is not that repentance activates salvation, but that man is regenerated by the Holy Spirit and his new heart responds immediately in repentance and faith.
The HG convicts not only of sin and righteousness but also of judgment. Can a sinner be convicted of judgment AFTER regeneration? Why would the HG convict someone that he/she is bound for hell when He has already regenerated them. That's preposterous.
@lessingtom I'll make one observation. These glorious doctrines have been held to by those regarded by all but the staunchest anticalvinists and Romanists as the greatest theologians the Church has ever been blessed with. I'd think twice before calling the beliefs of Edwards, Owen, Augustine etc. (which you misrepresent in that post) "preposterous" until you have an understanding of Scripture which actually enables you to interact with their views in any kind of meaningful way.
So the person/s to whom the grace of God that brings salvation does not appear is not part of a tribe, tongue, race, nation or ethnic group. They must be aliens.
@lessingtom No that doesn't follow, that'd be rightly absurd! Having said that, your interpretation of the word "all" seems very wooden. How would you interpret "all" in Acts 2:27? Everyone has the Spirit? Or, some of all kinds of men? How about Luke 11:42. Do the Pharisees tithe every single herb? Surely that's impossible!
If you don't mind, I'll continue my response in a message because our discussion has moved from the theme of the video =]
Post #1 The great preacher, Charles Spurgeon whom the Calvinists love to use as an example of puritan reformed theology, wrote:
What then? Shall we try to put another meaning into the text than that which it fairly bears? I trow not . . .. You must, most of you, be acquainted with the general method in which our older Calvinistic friends deal with the text. "All men" say they "that is, some men": as if the Holy Ghost could not have said "some men" if He meant some men. Cont. post #2
Post # 2 "All men," say they: "that is, some of all sorts of men": as if the Lord could not have said, "All sorts of men" if He had meant that. The Holy Ghost, by the apostle has written, "All men," and unquestionably He means all men . . .. My love of consistency with my own doctrinal views is not great enough to allow me knowingly to alter a single text of Scripture. (Metropolitan Tabernacle Pulpit, volume 26, pages 49-52).
We are born powerless to sin. I did not inherit Adam's sin but his powerless flesh to sin. Death came by sin so all flesh with or without sin is powerless to know God. Flesh and blood will not inherit the kingdom of God.All consummation results in flesh that will die because of sin. And all flesh can do nothing but sin.Adam pssed death by sin not sin but a nature to sin which is dead flesh powerless to know God.
Check out my YouTube channel/playlists and websites for present-truth materials, Three Angels' Messages and God's last-mercy warning to His people in these last days.
Papacy = Antichrist / Little Horn / Beast from the Sea
Roman Catholicism = Whore of Babylon
Investigative Judgement has commenced in 1844 (1st Angel’s Message)
Ellen G. White, 1827-1915 = End-time Prophet Sent of God
7th-day Sabbath = Seal of God
Sunday Worship to be Enforced as Mark of the Beast"
All does mean all. Jesus died for all. BUT if you don't accept the gift of Grace then you don't get the benefit of the redemtion of Jesus. God offers the gift, and humans must accept the gift. Or the gift is not bestowed on the ones who don't believe and come to faith. Yes, all mean all. We should pray for all. The ones who come to your mind, special intentions. ...
NO, Grace comes freely to us. However, We have a personal choice, does God come to us and help us, you bet, God chases us all to come and be with Him. God is persuing us with the vigor that is just right for each one of us. It is not up to us 100%, God gets us to a place to know him and then you choose. So it is by Grace, and God helps us understand and wanting the Grace. If you don't want to persue that Grace by your own godless life of sin, God will still persue until you greeve his HS
And to carry this postulate even further, in every case of election, there has to be an element in the elected that distinguishes him from those not elected; and to deny this is to make election to be a totally immoral and capricious thing, unworthy even of people, much less of God. I saw this. To make election not based on the person being elected by choice is to make God, immoral.
James white!!!!My role model.I watch all your vids.Wish I can actually meet you one day.My traditional beliefs have been shattered by the truth of the scriptures.Thank The Lord for giving us such a wise intelligent man like Dr white
the issue with this passage is not whether it refutes calvanism or not, this is totally irrelevant!!!....what is relevant is that it supports and PROVES universal reconciliation 100%,why is this man so blind,he is very educated and has studied the bible more than i have...yet he cannot see what is right in front of his eyes....AAARRGH whats wrong with these people?????..God will save evry1 in due time numbnuts
Oh wow dude, I can't agree with you. God will save those who choose to be saved. God will never force someone to worship him for eternity - he has given man the choice to live away from his presence forever if he chooses.
@agedude44 the bible is far from innerant, this can be proved, the mistranslation of a few key words causes all the confusion we have today, there is however enough truth in the bible to come to an understanding of certain things,look a little closer, study each word carefully and you may see...:¬)
@david1611kjv The original text is God breathed and innerant. Not the translations. But seeing as where not everyone speaks and reads Greek, Aramaic, and Hebrew, we're going to have to settle for english and other languages and then refer to the original Greek
If I had freewill, I would simply will myself to live forever and by the decree of my will, I would never die. If I had freewill, I would jump up and fly like superman by the decree of my will. If I had freewill, I would redeem myself apart from Christ, by the mere decree of my will. That is....if I had freewill. There is one little problem. Human will is not free. It has limitations. You see...if I had freewill, I would be sovereign. Only God has freewill.
@prn72271 Sorry...my statement was probably confussing- Our will is limited. By combining free with will and thus freewill, we are saying that we are sovereign, independent from sin in our will in our dead sinful state, before we are redeemed by Christ. Even the desire to serve Christ is a gift from God. Thus freewill equals sovereignty and only God is sovereign. I prefer to use the term self-will. The unbelievers will is to serve self and thus it is not free, it is under sin's control.
@VeryImagesozo since every person is born neutral with freewill, sin is a moral choice and rebellion against God's law. Sin is not a substance inherited through the bloodstream or semen. Your freewill can be used for good or evil. If we were born "sinners" would it be just for God to judge us for somenthing we were made to be? Pslam 139 says we were formed by God in our mother's womb and are fearfully and wonderfully made. Have a read through Ezekiel 18. It is a clear, laid out passage
@34craigjan It seems that King David has a problem with the idea of being born "neutral" and with "freewill"...Behold, I was shapen in iniquity; and in sin did my mother conceive me. Psalms 51:5.
@VeryImagesozo When Adam and Eve were placed in the garden, did they sin out of their freewill or by force or necessity? When we stand before God, we will be without excuse. We are responsible for our own sin(s). Psalm 51:5 states that he was "brought forth" in iniquity and in sin did my MOTHER conceive me.Who is the object of the verse?Where does it say David was born a sinner?To be a sinner you must have knowledge of sin and morality. If a baby dies, where does it go if that verse says that?
@34craigjan I believe the baby would go to heaven, but there are some who would disagree with me on that. That baby is not a sinner until as you stated there is knowledge of sin. That was not my point. My point was that we are born with a sin nature. Children don't have to be taught to sin. They sin naturally without instruction. Why? Because it is their nature. I don't know what you used for Psalms 51:5, but the verse clearly states that David was formed with a sin nature.
@VeryImagesozo you seem to be coming to these verses with a bias. Do you know "sinful nature" is not even translated from the greek. The greek word is sarcs and it means "flesh".Our flesh is neutral and only becomes how we choose to use it, for righteousness or sin.Babies are born free and learn quickly how to depend on others. When it cries, it is tended to.When it's hungry, food is provided. Life is great until they reach a point where it's will must be surrendered up. That's why they rebel.
@VeryImagesozo That's why it says in Proverbs to train children so they might walk on the strait path and not depart from the faith when they're older. Just because they do "sinful" acts, doesn't mean they're born that way. It has much to do with the parents. They will mirror what they say and do. They are not held accountable til they reach a state of accountability. You should check out a youtube video called "age of accountablity" by refuting calvinisim. It's very informative.
@chutubeme we are NOT born sinners. We are born neutral and corrupt ourselves. Sin is a moral choice and babies have no knowledge of right and wrong. Jesus said whoever "commits" sin is a slave to sin which means there's nothing involuntary making us sin. Romans 6 says,"do you not know that to whom you present yourselves as slaves for obedience, his slaves you are whom you obey, whether of sin unto death or obedience unto righteousness? You will be judged for YOUR sins only.
@34craigjan Paul answered the "is God unjust" question in Romans 9: "Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will? Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honor, and another unto dishonor?"
though this doctrine is sound, calling it "calvinist" is cardnal, cause 1st Paul Wrote it and gave the revelation by Christ and he didnt call it "Paulanist" Paul will call that carnal according to scripture only because it is.
Quote Part Two: The Bible gives us a theology which is more human than Calvinism and more divine that Arminianism, and more Christian than either of them." Phillip Schaff
Quote Part One: "Calvinism emphasized divine sovereignty and free grace; Arminianism emphasized human responsibility. The one restricts the saving grace to the elect; the other extends it to all men on the condition of faith. Both are right in what they assert; both are wrong in what they deny. If one important truth is pressed to the exclusion of another truth of equal importance, it becomes an error, and loses its hold upon the conscience.
This is excellent, calvinism is disgusting. Being depraved has nothing to do with humbling yourself to God or theological salvation through logic. Being depraved has nothing to do with the choice not to sin. Being depraved is back-to-back sinning, not normal, even if you are not saved. This morbid nonsense is Satans's doing.
@Gavinwr75 You may disagree with Calvin or Luther or who ever but that does not give you the right to redefine terms to "win" an argument. You state that "Being depraved is back-to-back sinning, not normal, even if you are not saved." and that is true as far as that goes. I agree. But the context of the Canons of Dort simply means that man, in and of himself cannot choose God because he is dead in his trespasses and sins. All I am urging anyone to do is to criticize based on historical context .
I'm a calvinist but not a hyper calvinist. freewill and election can not be reconciled by the human mind. In Isaiah 1 God says come now let us reason together and He talks about being willing. And this vs in 1Tim that God wishes all men to be saved you can't explain it away either along with many other scriptures. I agree with many things you do but when will you ever say there are some things that you just don't understand. I don't understand it all but I still believe it.
One more.. Armineans always portray God as the" perfect gentlemen" NEVER forcing Himself on anyone... I just wonder what Bible portrays this. Pharoah, John the Baptist (saved before he was born!) Jacob I loved, Esau I hated (before they were born and had yet to do any good or evil), Judas.... and ALL prophecy hinges on God acting through mankind with NO choice on our part. Sheep dont choose their Sheppard. Bondslaves do not choose their masters. Romans 9... please read. Thank you God bless.
Well, there is still a choice on our part. For example, even though God predestined us according to His will, drew us to Christ, and granted us the gift of faith itself in order that we may believe, you still made a real choice when you first got saved, didn't you? You chose to believe, God didn't drag you to His Kingdom kicking and screaming :) Remember, Calvinism teaches Compatiblism, not Fatalism. ;) God bless!
Another problem with Armenian theology is that it renders God impotent to save anyone. Jesus dying on the cross was only potential salvation, not complete redemption at once. "It is finished" should have been "it has just started! Now keep your fingers crossed... gee I hope someone chooses me today!" Also, people gloss over the fact that if you can choose God, you can surely choose to reject Him later... most Armenians deny this to the inth...
If Armenians are correct, we must conclude the following: Some people who die before they commit a sin will enter Heaven having never accepted Christ. They never needed Christ because they managed to go from womb to tomb sinless. Also, most Armenians claim that God "foreknew" by essence who would choose Him. The question is, can God be wrong about what He knows? No! So, the conclusion is that only the ones He "knew" in essence would be saved... so it was STILL limited!
It is the height of arrogance to imagine standing before a Holy God one day, witnessing the majesty, hearing what human ears are not allowed to hear in praise and honor to the King, watching the Cherubim and Seraphim surrounding the glorious throne, as Christ is the light of the city, walking the streets of gold, seeing what would kill an ordinary man here on earth... and looking at God and uttering "So glad I chose you!". This is unbelievable arrogance.
For the Armenian, man DESERVES Hell if he "chooses" to reject Christ. That one "choice" = Hell. Really? But didn't he deserve Hell before he made that one "choice"?
What I am trying to get at is that Armenians justify the doctrine of eternal damnation by explaining: one choice = Hell. How could any unbeliever follow the logic and justice in that?
For Armenians: Sin = actions & Salvation = act of the will.
Truth: Sin = condition of heart & Salvation = re-creation of heart by God.
Armenians think that sin is an ACTION. Man deserves Hell if "he ever told a lie, ever stole a paper clip. . ." as their sin-minimizing alter calls profess.
How does this economy work in their minds. How would stealing a paperclip = Hell? In truth, Armenians dont really think that they deserve Hell. If sin is only an ACTION rather than an ever-increasing condition of man's heart, the doctrine of eternal damnation is refuted.
Universalism is linked with defining sin as an ACTION.
@RomansGalatians so what is better is to tell people that God has just reprobated them and that they will burn in hell for not be able to act any different to what they where designed to by God?
I am not an Arminian by the way but...
Arminians also dont believe what you say, they believe in man having a sinful nature.
How to overcome sin: Just indulge in it and get it out of your system. Like if you're a heroine addict, just get your fix and don't go back to it anymore after that.
Or maybe not.
Sin is the conditon of a heart, which is self-centered, and desires more and more and more. A sinful heart will never be full, and devouring more only creates a bigger appetite! Pr 27:20
THAT is why God condemns a sinful heart, because there is no limit to the wickedness. In man's heart is an eternity of sin!
But brother James, In Eph.1:4,5 the "choosing" and "predestination" is "in him," that is, in Christ. We are adopted as children to himself "by Jesus Christ." But if we reject Christ, we frustrate all these good purposes and promises, so far as our own cases are concerned.
I would like for any Calvinist to show me beyond a shadow of a doubt that freewill does not exist.I ve tried to debate some Calvanist on the issues like that but they seem to get frustrated and block me from their channel.I would like to hear your arguement and respond as well as you respond to my arguement.Larry Wessels has blocked me before I could explain my point.I guess he felt I was proving my case.I have also seen BAD examples used by James White,but you cant respond on his videos.
@theocratickingdom30 First I dont represent Calvinism, in fact I oppose it whole heartedly.If you mean interpretation , I understand Calvinism very well and it severely misrepresents Gods word.Larry Wessels ,James White as well as those who support Calvins interpretation has not yet responded to my challenge.The Questions White, Washer , Wessels and even LaneCh can be easily refuted but when some type of intellectual reasoning is given for THEIR questions they either ridicule you or block you.
Can any Cavinist show from scripture where someone is destined for hell because of Adams sin? By Adam sin but during the judgement each individual is judged by what they did not Adam.
Romans 5:12-17 Paul compares the condemnation of Adams sin to mankind with Christs grace and righteousness to mankind. Its very plain; if Adams sin only brought physical death, the according to the aforementioned verses, Christ was only able to cure of us of physical death. That just doesn't make much sense if you read the passages.
The idea that God, by his will created some to go to heaven and some to burn in hell by his will is not in keeping with the bible, and is an affront to His mercy as shown through out the bible. It is not "works Salvation" to say that God gives man a choice to receive or reject. It is Not God's will that any will parish (2 Peter 3:9). How can is not be His will that any perish while at the same time he purposely by His will made some to perish???....I could go on and on
@musicprodave Romans 9:19-23 My friend, if their is another way to translate these verse but to conclude that God has made some for glory, and others for destruction, I would consider it an honor to be your student and to learn a different rendering of this passage. I am looking forward to your response, and for an education.
@a211464 Go to Romans 8:29-30 "For whom he did FOREKNOW he did predestinate"..The ones he foreknew would receive him he made vessels of honor. The ones he foreknew would reject him he made vessels of dishonor. He did not make them to go to Hell. He foreknew they would reject Him and therefore they are vessels of dishonor and end up in hell for rejecting the Savior.
The word "foreknow" is an active verb, not a passive verb. In other words, God doesn't just passively see who will choose to believe in Him (no one can choose God on their own because of our sin nature anyway, but that's a different topic). The verb is an active verb, something that God does. God foreknows His elect whom He will save. And that this is how Paul uses it is even more clear in that he never says "God foreknows who will choose to believe" or anything like that. GBY!
@AgApE010 I have heard that argument over and over and with respect, it does not hold water. You are coming to that conclusion based on your desire to protect your proof text. The whole or scripture hermanutically fits this passage to be that God forknows. To take the verb and come to your conclution is conjecture, and reading into the text.
Actually, I come to that conclusion based on the fact that the Greek verb is indeed an active verb. So to take an active verb and to treat it as a passive verb is both grammatically and exegetically incorrect. So if the whole of Scripture agrees with your position that God elects based on foreseen faith, show me where it is stated that God chooses those whom He knows beforehand will choose to believe,or anything of the like. I think you'll find there's no such thing in Scripture.
@AgApE010 the numerouse passeges that state Jesus died for thwe whole world. the sins of all and on and on negate your interpretation based on attempting to use the verb in in this way. The verb still means to know something beforhand
We're not arguing about the extent of the atonement; we're arguing about election: is it based on God looking down time and seeing who will choose to believe(your definition of foreknowledge) or is election based on God's sovereign choice of who He wants to save? Provide Scripture for your position. And I'm not attempting to use the verb in any other way but the way Paul used it. You have no ground to stand on in regards to this word.
@AgApE010 When religion begins with circular arguments then apply 2 Thes 2:11 "....God sends upon them a strong delusion to make them believe what is false,...."
If God died for every person who ever lived upon the face of the earth then every person who ever lived upon the face of the earth is redeemed and will go to heaven. I do not believe that...I am not a universalist, but the question is...If everyone is redeemed, then what purpose is there in the great commission? James White, Jim Brown, A.W. Pink, Charles Spurgeon ect. are right. Its Context, Context, Context, and Exegete, Exegete, Exegete. Pure doctrine is very important for the Christian.
I love this Channel, and I love many of the speakers here (not James White so much tho) but the more I study openly, the more I realize I'm not a 5 point Calvinist.
Calvinism is the doctrines of men and its followers unwittingly follow the spirit of antichrist and will eventually prepare a nation for islamization. James White is a pre-muslim. Everyone joins the facebook group ==> Freedom From Calvinism - Entering God's Kingdom and Revival.
b) He then relates "Mediator" in V.5, to "Savior" in 4:10.
The problem is that in 4:10, "God is the Savior of all people" isnt suggesting that "God is the Savior of all KINDS of people." Rather, it is saying that "God is the Savior of EVERY person." But this is not what the Calvinist wants because in context, the "all" in V.6 should then mean "EVERY person," i.e. no limited atonement.
well im not going against that but if it means that every single person will ve saved won't that mean Jesus' saying that many are called few chosen made no sense?
I don't believe every person will be saved. In the same sense that Jesus is the mediator of every man, including unsaved men, is the sense that Jesus "gave himself as a ransom" for every man -including the unsaved. The inclusive scope of the ransom sacrifice of Christ is not restricted by the unbelief of men.
@jeannieso IF....God saves EVERY person, THEN.....every person goes to heaven.
IF....everyone does not go to heaven, THEN....God does not save EVERY person. The only way this equation does not work is if you say something other than sin sends a person to hell, which is a theory foreign to Scripture.
How does God's choice to deal with man conditionally subvert or even threaten His sovereignty at all? Anyone care to explain that one? If God's choice is to deal with mankind conditionally, what is your beef with that?
Calvinism goes against the entire theme of the Bible really. It is amazing how far James White will go to explain away the plain meaning of the Bible.
The fact that he does this sort of thing with so MANY verses should give ANYONE a clue that there is something seriously wrong with this theology.
Jesus Himself made it clear that He has a message which even a child can understand (See Matthew 18:3-4 and Luke 18:16-17). Please don't make things so complicated James. Truth is simple.
Neither of those passages are referring to the proper interpretation of scripture. These passages are within the context of a manner of trust. Truth is simple but it does not negate the fact that the proper dividing of God's word still requires work and study. Peter points this out in 2 Peter 3:16
What about Judas? God chose him but He chose the world. If God choses and you experience irresistable Grace as White also teaches, then where is faith. If God does it all why witness. God has foreknowledge and knocks but it is still up to us to surrender our will for His. This is a heresy of old. God chose the disciples, the Jews were His elect chosen to bring the Gospel into the world first the Jew and then the Gentile. White over explains a very simple thing. That WHOSOEVER.
@brk49er Faith is a gift of God. Yes, God does it all. We witnes because we want to share the gospel with others, and God uses his elect to provide the means to the end. The Holy Spirit converts us and makes us want to hear the gospel.
So you just take the will of man totally out of the equation. That is proposterous. It says over and over that it is God's will that all be saved that none should perish. So if its all up to God and He wishes that all be saved then why doesnt He just give them all faith.Joh 3:18 He that believeth on him is not judged: he that believeth not hath been judged already, because he hath not believed on the name of the only begotten Son of God.
@brk49er Well either God selects the saved or man selects the saved. Man still has freewill, but not to override the will of God. If God has chosen an elect group of people to be saved and given mercy then we will not comnplain. The only ones who may complain are those not chosen, or, those chosen but silly enough to think that their own decision was the reason they are saved. Arminian doctrine that man chooses to be saved, that man makes the first move towards Christ, is heresy. God chooses.
Rom 5:18 So then as through one trespass the judgment came unto all men to condemnation; even so through one act of righteousness the free gift came unto all men to justification of life.
Rom 5:19 For as through the one man's disobedience the many were made sinners, even so through the obedience of the one shall the many be made righteous.
All means All, whosoever means who ever. The World means the world period. Grace is a gift of God because of your faith.
@brk49er Depending on the context, the words "all" and "world" have different meanings. For instance, John 3:16 says "God so loved the world...." and in another verse Jesus says: "I pray NOT for the world, but for those you (the Father) have given me for they are yours". John 17: 9. Jesus often spoke of the world as not being his sheep.
Its really just semantics, Its Gods will that all that will receive the Gospel message hears it. Thats all! No need for all talk. God made His message simple, no need to delve deeper than believe on Jesus Christ to save you, for it is by His rightousness not our own that we are able to stand before God. Rom 10:18 But I say, Did they not hear? Yea, verily, Their sound went out into all the earth, And their words unto the ends of the world. They just chose the darkness rather than the light.
@brk49er True, all who are chosen by the Father and given to the Son will hear the gospel and believe. We believe because we are chosen, Christ's sheep, and have received the Holy Spirit. God's Holy Spirit comes into us at an appointed time in our lives then we believe and repent. Those not chosen will never believe, and will continue to hate Christ and reject the gospel.
cont'd... The words of our lord Jesus are very clear and difficult for the Arminians to deal with. Jesus said: "All that the Father gives me shall come to me" and "I pray not for the world, but for those whom the Father has given to me". There are others, but as you can saa these present a real problem for the Arminian view that people choose their own salvation instead of the Father choosing us and Jesus doing it. God does indeed choose some and pass by others and it is His right to do so
so are we saved by faith in the gospel message or does God just choose us. Rom 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
Rom 1:17 For therein is revealed a righteousness of God from faith unto faith: as it is written, But the righteous shall live by faith.
Excellent sermon by Dr. White. Arminians do not have a lot of scripture to back up their idea that man choses God, instead of vice versa. The verses they do have are always taken out of context or misinterpreted. Calvinists have a lot more scripture verses to back up our view that God chooses the elect, that Christ accomplished it. Our verses are mostly by Paul and Jesus himself.
Cal view predestination as a personal foreloving or foreoardaining of an individual. whereas the Arm see it as the foreseeing of the action of that person. That would make election dependent on the recipient vs on the will of God. you can look up the greek on foreknew in vs such as Rom 8:28~31
I agree. If you are talking about the elect, once again, they would say the elect was so because of foreknowledge of the answer to the call, not the setting of love on the individual. Or that it is possible for that elect to be decieved, and lose their Salvation. The Arm position claims Bible sufficiency so when in a debate and faced with the overwhelming evidence to the contrary, if you have an honest Arm it puts them in a hard spot. God Bless
@bigbadwolff1 to which i would ask an arminian, why does it say that God's call is irrevocable and God's grace is irresistible? if it was based off of the individual's answer to the call then the individual could deny the call, thus God's grace could be resistible. it seems to me the Arminianistic view negates God's sovereignty. God Bless you too.
The more we study Gods Word the more it becomes blatantly obvious that Gods providence/sovreignty is seen throughout Scripture, which in turn comforts us that His will is carried out in His Childrens life
Your view negates faith. Im not a Cal or an Arm Im a blood bought child of God. If its all irresistable then its not faith. Rom 1:18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hinder the truth in unrighteousness;
Rom 1:19 because that which is known of God is manifest in them; for God manifested it unto them.
Says right here that God manifest himself to the unrightous, they choose their own will and not the fathers.
@brk49er Faith is a gift of God, bestowed on the elect. If the Holy Spirit were to leave the believer then there would be no convicting of sin so repentence would be even less likely if the Holy Spirit were to withdraw from the believer.
Matt 24:24 makes sense in that once they have believed, then the Holy spirit will not allow them to fully fall for a false teaching. John 10:28 explains that. Once your name is written in the Book of Life it cannot be erased. Bible says all men are without excuse, well if they are not part of the elect then they have an excuse.
White's solution: "all kinds., not all men" But there's more kinds of men than there are individual men. One man, Paul, is both a Jew and a Roman; hence three kinds for Paul- "JEW", "ROMAN", and "JEW & ROMAN", as well as "MAN", and "JEW & MAN", and "ROMAN & JEW & MAN", etc., ad infinitum. Not Q, ergo Not P. Or maybe the adjective "all" can be used to quantify over an entire class in the first place? "Assumptions not part of the text, [they] are coming from a theological system..."
Verse 1 says "I urge, then, first of all, that requests, prayers, intercession and thanksgiving be made for everyone" The context is everyone. We should pray for everyone. Then it talks about a specific group we should remember to pray for, those in authority. Why? So that with good rulers "we may live peaceful and quiet lives in all godliness and holiness." Then it says God desires all men to be saved. Note, "all men" not "all types of men". All are not saved because they reject Christ.
Nowhere in scripture does it say that to be able to pray for a person we need to pray for them by name & know them as an individual. We can pray for "all" people affected by an earthquake without knowing their name. God knows them all. If "all" actually meant all kinds then it wouldn't only list one "type" of men. Namely rulers. Surely you would give a big list of types of men if you wanted to show it means all kinds.
Why is it that only James White seemingly has the 'authority' to determine what the proper 'context' is in these verses. Not surprisingly, the 'context' is never the historical position of the Church, but the lens of 'reformation' era heretics.
His argument is ALWAYS the same. Anyone who disagrees with him is either ignorant or taking scripture 'out of context'.
No. In fact, the more I read and see of him, the more obvious it becomes to me that what he calls 'context' most rational people would call 'pretext'. Within the first few minutes he used the word 'context' about a dozen times. Someone that concerned with limiting the true voice of Scripture to fit his sectartian agenda cannot be trusted.
Now with you, there is that word...'context'. Far to often that word is being used in a sectatian way.
Brothers, the doctrine of Calvinism is man's doctrine. It has a man's name attached to it. Paul said, 'But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man. For I neither received it from man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ. (Gal 1:11) If we go directly to the source, our Lord Jesus Christ, and get our revelation from Him, we can all advance together and start focusing on the things that are important to His heart.
Lane, what patience you have! Things which are so obvious to me after studying the Bible for years seem not to register with many.
...And I know why. Men hate the truth, they always have and always will. There are many who profess Christ on Youtube and everywhere who don't know Him at all.
How terrible for them when they hear those words: "Depart from me... I never knew you!"
God will save the maximum number possible. But unlike Arminian/Calvinists say, the maximum number possible is ALL men. ALL men who have ever existed. That is what 1 Tim 2:4 is saying. Read Col 1:16-20, 1 John 2:2, Isaiah 26:9, etc. to see God's plan to save ALL mankind.
Luke 3:6 all mankind will see God's salvation.
Eternal hell is a pagan myth. Eternal is mistranslated.
Check out:
bible-truths(.)com
tentmaker(.)org
and prepare to have your faith challenged with the truth in the bible.
Do people have to be forgiven to obtain "eternal life"- to enter Heaven? Because you do know, don't you, that Christ said that there is sin that will never be forgiven- not in this life, nor in the one to come? And not everyone who calls Him "Lord" will enter- ONLY those who do the will of God. (Matt. 7:21).
If you want to be a fisher of men, it might be important to know what the hook is.
You do not trick the ungodly into being born again, it is a work of God. And God never, NEVER fails. He is able to save to the uttermost.
Why it is important is because it helps us understand other scriptures, God, His plan, why missions sometimes fails, and why His methods are the ONLY methods we should use.
Plus, it is how He will get "ALL" the glory and we will get none.
WELL said--i'm "struggling" now to frame my point to those refuting those evil calvinists. . . I often thought to myself the Biblical truth of SO-CALLED calvinism or reformed view, (the reason why it is so often refuted, rejected, despised, etc) is bc it gives God *ALL* the glory indeed and we will get none, just like you mentioned.
Is Pragmatism (results=worth) a viable attutude towards missions? (Consider Noah and Jeremiah)
Will psychology, philosophy, strong arguement, emotionalism, mood lighting, music, sinner's prayers, relavence to culture, or walking an aisle bring about rebirth?!
Or is it as the Word says, that the Holy Spirit works in a man's heart and mind as the Gospel is preached, and this prompts them to repentance of sin, and a turning to Christ?!
Stop wasting your life arguing with fellow believers(Arminianism-Calvinism) People....just read your bible, and pray. Realize that you need Jesus, and that he his the only one that can save you from the wrath of God. Turn to Jesus, turn away from your sins and be fishers of men.
Yet you just "wasted your life arguing with fellow believers" to not argue with fellow believers. Um... yeah. It just shows why this issue is still debated among believers in spite of such "convincing argumentation" from others who don't want it to be discussed like yourself.
@xxRANMANxx A great portion of the Bible is dedicated to refuting false doctrine,Christ himself devoted a great deal of words to it. I think the way we (Christians) go about it is certainly flawed. As we have little grace to show one another while conversing. If we "just read your bible, and pray.", we will eventually get up and converse with others that have done the same. My point is this, the debate is not wothless but very important it is just the way we carry it out.
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.Its sad how far calvinist and armenians run when it comes to the topic of salvation ,to them Christ is the savior of the world that will not save the world, the wrath of God was satisfied for all but not all,every tong confessing and knee bowing is not believing at all,God so loved the world but He will loose most of them because Christ couldn't save the world.election without a purpose?Hell is necessary ?
I am a follower of Christ,I believe what the scriptures plainly teaches, the rest is man made theology, don't know anyone around me that is universalist if believing that Christ will save all make me one OK I am a universalist,I don,t really know if they believe in election which I do cause the bible teaches it,don't believe in free will, but believe we all are responsible for our actions,but responsibility to save men is His alone,He made the wound, He will heal us.God bless.
do you mean Hades/Sheol where everyone is dead waiting judgment?in order for you to be resurrected you must be dead don't you think?What I believe is that there is punishment for the wicked but not eternal,everyone pays according to what they done in this lifetime,Christ saves men through judgment and it must start with us the house of the lord than the rest of the world.What do you believe hell is?I believe the world is saved after they are judged.
yea, at this very moment we're having stake baked in a 400 degrees oven ,I can imagine people even children having their flash baked in the eternalssss fires of Dantes infernus,and when million year have gone,they will have to endure another gazillions of ages and all this for the GLORY OF THE FATHER, because God causes the salvation of the elect but according to Calvin he causes not the perdition of the lost, common grace?when you have hell ahead of you ,for what? ah let me eat...
I think he meant Tartarus, where angels are bound with chains in everlasting judgement, where those who follow the beast and his false prophet will be cast for eternity...
Do they disagree with the interpretations or with Christ? Being a Baptist or a Calvinist, etc. doesn't save you. Calvin or anyone else didn't die for you. Only Jesus Christ did. Call yourself a christian if that is what you truly are.
The death and resurrection of christ is what saves all of us, not only a few. Christ didn't force anyone to follow him. People chose and still choose whether or not to follow him.
Well, you're an Arminian, but you're probably just ignorant to it. That's the default argument for Arminians really: "I'm not Calvinist, I'm not Arminian; I'm just a Christian." Do some research, and you'll find this is true.
I'm not the sharpest knife in the drawer but your last comment sounded condescending to me. It also sounded more like pride than it did humility. You must be a young person. I say this because the older I get the more I realize I'm don't know as much as I thought I did. Have a good day and God bless.
Let no one καταφρονέω (look down upon, discredit, disesteem) you for your youth, but set the believers an example in speech, in conduct, in love, in faith, in purity. Until I come, devote yourself to the public reading of Scripture, to exhortation, to teaching.
According to Paul, your argument that a young person must be ignorant and the older person must be wiser is worldly and opposed to Scripture. Per Paul's commandment, I do not accept the criticism you've set forth.
Ahistorical? Is that why your cult was started by a Roman Catholic that wanted to REFORM Romanism? Calvinism is the joke here, too bad you're too educated to catch that part.
Also it's not me that has the same belief as the religion of islam, they as you believe that some people are made just to be destroyed. But then again no one blamed neither calvinist or muslims to be intelligent, just themselves.
Luther was a Romanist who went out from them. To go out means to separate from. Since he went out from them, he was no longer a Roman Catholic. That's pretty basic logic that two year olds can identify with when one takes away their lollipop. They understand that it is no longer under their possession the same as the RC church did with Luther in pronouncing him anathema. As far as addressing your other points... I cannot. Why? Because you present none, just pejorative language.
Well, to take issue with your comment, Mormons and Roman Catholics are not Christians. Aside from that, people disagree with different interpretations of the Bible hence the different names. You don't hold that a brain surgeon and a dentist should both just be called "doctor", do you? It's the same principle.
"We only use the term "Calvinism" for shortness. That doctrine which is called "Calvinism" did not spring from Calvin; we believe that it sprang from the great founder of all truth.
Perhaps Calvin himself derived it mainly from the writings of Augustine. Augustine obtained his views, without doubt, through the Spirit of God, from the diligent study of the writings of Paul, and Paul received them of the Holy Ghost, from Jesus Christ, the great founder of the Christian dispensation.
We use the term then, not because we impute any extraordinary importance to Calvin's having taught these doctrines. We would be just as wiling to call them by any other name, if we could find one which would be better understood, and which on the whole would be as consistent with fact."
can any Calvinist out there answer why God offers irresistible grace to some and not all?
Or why Him being SOVEREIGN aloud so manny people to be born to be eternally lost just for the sake of the elect?context,context,context what about creation yearns for the manifestation of the redeemed sons of God? were we elected for the purpose of being in the bliss of heaven or to us was given the word(ministry)of reconciliation of ALL ?Is HE the propitiation to our sins only or to the whole world?
White is making a mockery of God's grace. Tit. 2:11 says that God's grace that brings salvation has appeared to ALL men.
Sproul says that true repentance requires a contrite heart. How does a corpse that is dead in sins and trespasses respond with a contrite repentance to the Gospel? If sinful man could respond in this way, God would not have had to save anyone monergistically. White and his friends are so bent on defending Calvinism that they are getting tangled in their own inconsistencies.
lessingtom 2 weeks ago
@lessingtom But salvation hasn't appeared to all men (every man without exception), has it? I was only reading the other day about a new Amazonian tribe photoed by a chopper. It has to all kinds of men (other tribes, Brits, Russians, Chinese, slaves, presidents...)
The unregenerate man doesn't [can't] respond in that way: reformed teaching is not that repentance activates salvation, but that man is regenerated by the Holy Spirit and his new heart responds immediately in repentance and faith.
m4ttieE 2 weeks ago
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lessingtom 1 week ago
@m4ttieE
The HG convicts not only of sin and righteousness but also of judgment. Can a sinner be convicted of judgment AFTER regeneration? Why would the HG convict someone that he/she is bound for hell when He has already regenerated them. That's preposterous.
lessingtom 1 week ago
@lessingtom I'll make one observation. These glorious doctrines have been held to by those regarded by all but the staunchest anticalvinists and Romanists as the greatest theologians the Church has ever been blessed with. I'd think twice before calling the beliefs of Edwards, Owen, Augustine etc. (which you misrepresent in that post) "preposterous" until you have an understanding of Scripture which actually enables you to interact with their views in any kind of meaningful way.
m4ttieE 1 week ago
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lessingtom 1 week ago
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@m4ttieE
So the person/s to whom the grace of God that brings salvation does not appear is not part of a tribe, tongue, race, nation or ethnic group. They must be aliens.
lessingtom 1 week ago
@lessingtom No that doesn't follow, that'd be rightly absurd! Having said that, your interpretation of the word "all" seems very wooden. How would you interpret "all" in Acts 2:27? Everyone has the Spirit? Or, some of all kinds of men? How about Luke 11:42. Do the Pharisees tithe every single herb? Surely that's impossible!
If you don't mind, I'll continue my response in a message because our discussion has moved from the theme of the video =]
m4ttieE 1 week ago
@m4ttieE
So, because "all" in those passages does not mean "all" as in "entire," the "all" must always be interpreted as not being "all." That's preposterous.
lessingtom 1 week ago
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@m4ttieE
Post #1 The great preacher, Charles Spurgeon whom the Calvinists love to use as an example of puritan reformed theology, wrote:
What then? Shall we try to put another meaning into the text than that which it fairly bears? I trow not . . .. You must, most of you, be acquainted with the general method in which our older Calvinistic friends deal with the text. "All men" say they "that is, some men": as if the Holy Ghost could not have said "some men" if He meant some men. Cont. post #2
lessingtom 1 week ago
@m4ttieE
Post # 2 "All men," say they: "that is, some of all sorts of men": as if the Lord could not have said, "All sorts of men" if He had meant that. The Holy Ghost, by the apostle has written, "All men," and unquestionably He means all men . . .. My love of consistency with my own doctrinal views is not great enough to allow me knowingly to alter a single text of Scripture. (Metropolitan Tabernacle Pulpit, volume 26, pages 49-52).
lessingtom 1 week ago
We are born powerless to sin. I did not inherit Adam's sin but his powerless flesh to sin. Death came by sin so all flesh with or without sin is powerless to know God. Flesh and blood will not inherit the kingdom of God.All consummation results in flesh that will die because of sin. And all flesh can do nothing but sin.Adam pssed death by sin not sin but a nature to sin which is dead flesh powerless to know God.
polopowers1 5 months ago
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Check out my YouTube channel/playlists and websites for present-truth materials, Three Angels' Messages and God's last-mercy warning to His people in these last days.
Papacy = Antichrist / Little Horn / Beast from the Sea
Roman Catholicism = Whore of Babylon
Investigative Judgement has commenced in 1844 (1st Angel’s Message)
Ellen G. White, 1827-1915 = End-time Prophet Sent of God
7th-day Sabbath = Seal of God
Sunday Worship to be Enforced as Mark of the Beast"
SeventhDayRemnant 7 months ago
All does mean all. Jesus died for all. BUT if you don't accept the gift of Grace then you don't get the benefit of the redemtion of Jesus. God offers the gift, and humans must accept the gift. Or the gift is not bestowed on the ones who don't believe and come to faith. Yes, all mean all. We should pray for all. The ones who come to your mind, special intentions. ...
MRGV7373 9 months ago
NO, Grace comes freely to us. However, We have a personal choice, does God come to us and help us, you bet, God chases us all to come and be with Him. God is persuing us with the vigor that is just right for each one of us. It is not up to us 100%, God gets us to a place to know him and then you choose. So it is by Grace, and God helps us understand and wanting the Grace. If you don't want to persue that Grace by your own godless life of sin, God will still persue until you greeve his HS
MRGV7373 9 months ago
And to carry this postulate even further, in every case of election, there has to be an element in the elected that distinguishes him from those not elected; and to deny this is to make election to be a totally immoral and capricious thing, unworthy even of people, much less of God. I saw this. To make election not based on the person being elected by choice is to make God, immoral.
MRGV7373 9 months ago
James white!!!!My role model.I watch all your vids.Wish I can actually meet you one day.My traditional beliefs have been shattered by the truth of the scriptures.Thank The Lord for giving us such a wise intelligent man like Dr white
ctsfinestjon 10 months ago
the issue with this passage is not whether it refutes calvanism or not, this is totally irrelevant!!!....what is relevant is that it supports and PROVES universal reconciliation 100%,why is this man so blind,he is very educated and has studied the bible more than i have...yet he cannot see what is right in front of his eyes....AAARRGH whats wrong with these people?????..God will save evry1 in due time numbnuts
david1611kjv 10 months ago
@david1611kjv
Oh wow dude, I can't agree with you. God will save those who choose to be saved. God will never force someone to worship him for eternity - he has given man the choice to live away from his presence forever if he chooses.
agedude44 10 months ago
@agedude44 not so my man, no1 can choose to be saved, it is done!
david1611kjv 10 months ago
@david1611kjv
have you ever read the bible dude? what you're saying just isn't there.
agedude44 10 months ago
@agedude44 read Romans ch9(verse 11-25) and Ephesians ch1 as well as Galatians ch1 and 2 peter ch1
Submittedtochrist 10 months ago
@agedude44 the bible is far from innerant, this can be proved, the mistranslation of a few key words causes all the confusion we have today, there is however enough truth in the bible to come to an understanding of certain things,look a little closer, study each word carefully and you may see...:¬)
david1611kjv 10 months ago
@david1611kjv The original text is God breathed and innerant. Not the translations. But seeing as where not everyone speaks and reads Greek, Aramaic, and Hebrew, we're going to have to settle for english and other languages and then refer to the original Greek
JKTPerry 9 months ago
If I had freewill, I would simply will myself to live forever and by the decree of my will, I would never die. If I had freewill, I would jump up and fly like superman by the decree of my will. If I had freewill, I would redeem myself apart from Christ, by the mere decree of my will. That is....if I had freewill. There is one little problem. Human will is not free. It has limitations. You see...if I had freewill, I would be sovereign. Only God has freewill.
VeryImagesozo 11 months ago
@VeryImagesozo huh?
prn72271 8 months ago
@prn72271 Sorry...my statement was probably confussing- Our will is limited. By combining free with will and thus freewill, we are saying that we are sovereign, independent from sin in our will in our dead sinful state, before we are redeemed by Christ. Even the desire to serve Christ is a gift from God. Thus freewill equals sovereignty and only God is sovereign. I prefer to use the term self-will. The unbelievers will is to serve self and thus it is not free, it is under sin's control.
VeryImagesozo 8 months ago
@VeryImagesozo since every person is born neutral with freewill, sin is a moral choice and rebellion against God's law. Sin is not a substance inherited through the bloodstream or semen. Your freewill can be used for good or evil. If we were born "sinners" would it be just for God to judge us for somenthing we were made to be? Pslam 139 says we were formed by God in our mother's womb and are fearfully and wonderfully made. Have a read through Ezekiel 18. It is a clear, laid out passage
34craigjan 8 months ago
@34craigjan It seems that King David has a problem with the idea of being born "neutral" and with "freewill"...Behold, I was shapen in iniquity; and in sin did my mother conceive me. Psalms 51:5.
VeryImagesozo 8 months ago
@VeryImagesozo When Adam and Eve were placed in the garden, did they sin out of their freewill or by force or necessity? When we stand before God, we will be without excuse. We are responsible for our own sin(s). Psalm 51:5 states that he was "brought forth" in iniquity and in sin did my MOTHER conceive me.Who is the object of the verse?Where does it say David was born a sinner?To be a sinner you must have knowledge of sin and morality. If a baby dies, where does it go if that verse says that?
34craigjan 8 months ago
@34craigjan I believe the baby would go to heaven, but there are some who would disagree with me on that. That baby is not a sinner until as you stated there is knowledge of sin. That was not my point. My point was that we are born with a sin nature. Children don't have to be taught to sin. They sin naturally without instruction. Why? Because it is their nature. I don't know what you used for Psalms 51:5, but the verse clearly states that David was formed with a sin nature.
VeryImagesozo 8 months ago
@VeryImagesozo you seem to be coming to these verses with a bias. Do you know "sinful nature" is not even translated from the greek. The greek word is sarcs and it means "flesh".Our flesh is neutral and only becomes how we choose to use it, for righteousness or sin.Babies are born free and learn quickly how to depend on others. When it cries, it is tended to.When it's hungry, food is provided. Life is great until they reach a point where it's will must be surrendered up. That's why they rebel.
34craigjan 8 months ago
@VeryImagesozo That's why it says in Proverbs to train children so they might walk on the strait path and not depart from the faith when they're older. Just because they do "sinful" acts, doesn't mean they're born that way. It has much to do with the parents. They will mirror what they say and do. They are not held accountable til they reach a state of accountability. You should check out a youtube video called "age of accountablity" by refuting calvinisim. It's very informative.
34craigjan 8 months ago
@34craigjan,we were born SINNERS
chutubeme 7 months ago
@chutubeme we are NOT born sinners. We are born neutral and corrupt ourselves. Sin is a moral choice and babies have no knowledge of right and wrong. Jesus said whoever "commits" sin is a slave to sin which means there's nothing involuntary making us sin. Romans 6 says,"do you not know that to whom you present yourselves as slaves for obedience, his slaves you are whom you obey, whether of sin unto death or obedience unto righteousness? You will be judged for YOUR sins only.
34craigjan 7 months ago
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@34craigjan Paul answered the "is God unjust" question in Romans 9: "Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will? Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honor, and another unto dishonor?"
VeryImagesozo 8 months ago
there has been18 mins already and he is just setting up his answer so far... let's see.
Nephtali1981 1 year ago
though this doctrine is sound, calling it "calvinist" is cardnal, cause 1st Paul Wrote it and gave the revelation by Christ and he didnt call it "Paulanist" Paul will call that carnal according to scripture only because it is.
PRAYERWARRIORKING 1 year ago
Brilliantly exegesis.
unicrankflip 1 year ago
Just not used to seeing a Tequila commercial on a Christian's site.
1kyboard 1 year ago
You seriously spent an hour in this video? Wow go do something with your life that will add souls to the kingdom.
You waste time with these theological debates.
TheOkstate2012 1 year ago
No, it is the other way.. Calvinism refutes 1 Timothy!
thelettersofpaul 1 year ago
Know who else pulls the little "all doesn't mean all" trick? Catholics when they want to argue that mary was without sin.
TheCarydal 1 year ago
Quote Part Two: The Bible gives us a theology which is more human than Calvinism and more divine that Arminianism, and more Christian than either of them." Phillip Schaff
lambsev 1 year ago
Quote Part One: "Calvinism emphasized divine sovereignty and free grace; Arminianism emphasized human responsibility. The one restricts the saving grace to the elect; the other extends it to all men on the condition of faith. Both are right in what they assert; both are wrong in what they deny. If one important truth is pressed to the exclusion of another truth of equal importance, it becomes an error, and loses its hold upon the conscience.
lambsev 1 year ago
This is excellent, calvinism is disgusting. Being depraved has nothing to do with humbling yourself to God or theological salvation through logic. Being depraved has nothing to do with the choice not to sin. Being depraved is back-to-back sinning, not normal, even if you are not saved. This morbid nonsense is Satans's doing.
Gavinwr75 1 year ago
@Gavinwr75 You may disagree with Calvin or Luther or who ever but that does not give you the right to redefine terms to "win" an argument. You state that "Being depraved is back-to-back sinning, not normal, even if you are not saved." and that is true as far as that goes. I agree. But the context of the Canons of Dort simply means that man, in and of himself cannot choose God because he is dead in his trespasses and sins. All I am urging anyone to do is to criticize based on historical context .
daddysapp1111 6 months ago
I'm a calvinist but not a hyper calvinist. freewill and election can not be reconciled by the human mind. In Isaiah 1 God says come now let us reason together and He talks about being willing. And this vs in 1Tim that God wishes all men to be saved you can't explain it away either along with many other scriptures. I agree with many things you do but when will you ever say there are some things that you just don't understand. I don't understand it all but I still believe it.
66evansblue 1 year ago
@66evansblue
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Did you watch the video and listen to the exegesis of 1 Tim. 2?
AgApE010 1 year ago
@AgApE010 Yes but I was not satisfied with the explanation.
66evansblue 1 year ago
One more.. Armineans always portray God as the" perfect gentlemen" NEVER forcing Himself on anyone... I just wonder what Bible portrays this. Pharoah, John the Baptist (saved before he was born!) Jacob I loved, Esau I hated (before they were born and had yet to do any good or evil), Judas.... and ALL prophecy hinges on God acting through mankind with NO choice on our part. Sheep dont choose their Sheppard. Bondslaves do not choose their masters. Romans 9... please read. Thank you God bless.
a211464 1 year ago
@a211464
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@a211464
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Well, there is still a choice on our part. For example, even though God predestined us according to His will, drew us to Christ, and granted us the gift of faith itself in order that we may believe, you still made a real choice when you first got saved, didn't you? You chose to believe, God didn't drag you to His Kingdom kicking and screaming :) Remember, Calvinism teaches Compatiblism, not Fatalism. ;) God bless!
AgApE010 1 year ago
Another problem with Armenian theology is that it renders God impotent to save anyone. Jesus dying on the cross was only potential salvation, not complete redemption at once. "It is finished" should have been "it has just started! Now keep your fingers crossed... gee I hope someone chooses me today!" Also, people gloss over the fact that if you can choose God, you can surely choose to reject Him later... most Armenians deny this to the inth...
a211464 1 year ago
If Armenians are correct, we must conclude the following: Some people who die before they commit a sin will enter Heaven having never accepted Christ. They never needed Christ because they managed to go from womb to tomb sinless. Also, most Armenians claim that God "foreknew" by essence who would choose Him. The question is, can God be wrong about what He knows? No! So, the conclusion is that only the ones He "knew" in essence would be saved... so it was STILL limited!
a211464 1 year ago
It is the height of arrogance to imagine standing before a Holy God one day, witnessing the majesty, hearing what human ears are not allowed to hear in praise and honor to the King, watching the Cherubim and Seraphim surrounding the glorious throne, as Christ is the light of the city, walking the streets of gold, seeing what would kill an ordinary man here on earth... and looking at God and uttering "So glad I chose you!". This is unbelievable arrogance.
a211464 1 year ago
For the Armenian, man DESERVES Hell if he "chooses" to reject Christ. That one "choice" = Hell. Really? But didn't he deserve Hell before he made that one "choice"?
What I am trying to get at is that Armenians justify the doctrine of eternal damnation by explaining: one choice = Hell. How could any unbeliever follow the logic and justice in that?
For Armenians: Sin = actions & Salvation = act of the will.
Truth: Sin = condition of heart & Salvation = re-creation of heart by God.
RomansGalatians 1 year ago
Armenians think that sin is an ACTION. Man deserves Hell if "he ever told a lie, ever stole a paper clip. . ." as their sin-minimizing alter calls profess.
How does this economy work in their minds. How would stealing a paperclip = Hell? In truth, Armenians dont really think that they deserve Hell. If sin is only an ACTION rather than an ever-increasing condition of man's heart, the doctrine of eternal damnation is refuted.
Universalism is linked with defining sin as an ACTION.
RomansGalatians 1 year ago
@RomansGalatians so what is better is to tell people that God has just reprobated them and that they will burn in hell for not be able to act any different to what they where designed to by God?
I am not an Arminian by the way but...
Arminians also dont believe what you say, they believe in man having a sinful nature.
prn72271 8 months ago
How to overcome sin: Just indulge in it and get it out of your system. Like if you're a heroine addict, just get your fix and don't go back to it anymore after that.
Or maybe not.
Sin is the conditon of a heart, which is self-centered, and desires more and more and more. A sinful heart will never be full, and devouring more only creates a bigger appetite! Pr 27:20
THAT is why God condemns a sinful heart, because there is no limit to the wickedness. In man's heart is an eternity of sin!
RomansGalatians 1 year ago
But brother James, In Eph.1:4,5 the "choosing" and "predestination" is "in him," that is, in Christ. We are adopted as children to himself "by Jesus Christ." But if we reject Christ, we frustrate all these good purposes and promises, so far as our own cases are concerned.
1CHRIST1LORD 1 year ago
I would like for any Calvinist to show me beyond a shadow of a doubt that freewill does not exist.I ve tried to debate some Calvanist on the issues like that but they seem to get frustrated and block me from their channel.I would like to hear your arguement and respond as well as you respond to my arguement.Larry Wessels has blocked me before I could explain my point.I guess he felt I was proving my case.I have also seen BAD examples used by James White,but you cant respond on his videos.
bluetew37 1 year ago
@bluetew37 They probably block you because of your calvinist misrepresentations.
theocratickingdom30 1 year ago
@theocratickingdom30 First I dont represent Calvinism, in fact I oppose it whole heartedly.If you mean interpretation , I understand Calvinism very well and it severely misrepresents Gods word.Larry Wessels ,James White as well as those who support Calvins interpretation has not yet responded to my challenge.The Questions White, Washer , Wessels and even LaneCh can be easily refuted but when some type of intellectual reasoning is given for THEIR questions they either ridicule you or block you.
bluetew37 1 year ago
Can any Cavinist show from scripture where someone is destined for hell because of Adams sin? By Adam sin but during the judgement each individual is judged by what they did not Adam.
kelark 1 year ago
Romans 5:12-17 Paul compares the condemnation of Adams sin to mankind with Christs grace and righteousness to mankind. Its very plain; if Adams sin only brought physical death, the according to the aforementioned verses, Christ was only able to cure of us of physical death. That just doesn't make much sense if you read the passages.
a211464 1 year ago
The idea that God, by his will created some to go to heaven and some to burn in hell by his will is not in keeping with the bible, and is an affront to His mercy as shown through out the bible. It is not "works Salvation" to say that God gives man a choice to receive or reject. It is Not God's will that any will parish (2 Peter 3:9). How can is not be His will that any perish while at the same time he purposely by His will made some to perish???....I could go on and on
musicprodave 1 year ago
@musicprodave Romans 9:19-23 My friend, if their is another way to translate these verse but to conclude that God has made some for glory, and others for destruction, I would consider it an honor to be your student and to learn a different rendering of this passage. I am looking forward to your response, and for an education.
a211464 1 year ago
@a211464 Go to Romans 8:29-30 "For whom he did FOREKNOW he did predestinate"..The ones he foreknew would receive him he made vessels of honor. The ones he foreknew would reject him he made vessels of dishonor. He did not make them to go to Hell. He foreknew they would reject Him and therefore they are vessels of dishonor and end up in hell for rejecting the Savior.
musicprodave 1 year ago
@musicprodave
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The word "foreknow" is an active verb, not a passive verb. In other words, God doesn't just passively see who will choose to believe in Him (no one can choose God on their own because of our sin nature anyway, but that's a different topic). The verb is an active verb, something that God does. God foreknows His elect whom He will save. And that this is how Paul uses it is even more clear in that he never says "God foreknows who will choose to believe" or anything like that. GBY!
AgApE010 1 year ago
@AgApE010 I have heard that argument over and over and with respect, it does not hold water. You are coming to that conclusion based on your desire to protect your proof text. The whole or scripture hermanutically fits this passage to be that God forknows. To take the verb and come to your conclution is conjecture, and reading into the text.
musicprodave 1 year ago
@musicprodave
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Actually, I come to that conclusion based on the fact that the Greek verb is indeed an active verb. So to take an active verb and to treat it as a passive verb is both grammatically and exegetically incorrect. So if the whole of Scripture agrees with your position that God elects based on foreseen faith, show me where it is stated that God chooses those whom He knows beforehand will choose to believe,or anything of the like. I think you'll find there's no such thing in Scripture.
AgApE010 1 year ago
@AgApE010 the numerouse passeges that state Jesus died for thwe whole world. the sins of all and on and on negate your interpretation based on attempting to use the verb in in this way. The verb still means to know something beforhand
musicprodave 1 year ago
@musicprodave
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"state that Jesus died for the whole world"
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We're not arguing about the extent of the atonement; we're arguing about election: is it based on God looking down time and seeing who will choose to believe(your definition of foreknowledge) or is election based on God's sovereign choice of who He wants to save? Provide Scripture for your position. And I'm not attempting to use the verb in any other way but the way Paul used it. You have no ground to stand on in regards to this word.
AgApE010 1 year ago
@AgApE010 When religion begins with circular arguments then apply 2 Thes 2:11 "....God sends upon them a strong delusion to make them believe what is false,...."
yarrw 1 year ago
@musicprodave In Pauline doctrine Jesus is called the 'life-giving SPIRIT" and so in
Jn 6:63 "It is the SPIRIT that gives LIFE. The flesh is useless"
yarrw 1 year ago
Have you ever listened to Keith Daniel - The Tightrope Walker Calvinism vs. Arminianism? One of the best sermons ever!
soulwarrior77 1 year ago
If God died for every person who ever lived upon the face of the earth then every person who ever lived upon the face of the earth is redeemed and will go to heaven. I do not believe that...I am not a universalist, but the question is...If everyone is redeemed, then what purpose is there in the great commission? James White, Jim Brown, A.W. Pink, Charles Spurgeon ect. are right. Its Context, Context, Context, and Exegete, Exegete, Exegete. Pure doctrine is very important for the Christian.
proginosko 1 year ago
I love this Channel, and I love many of the speakers here (not James White so much tho) but the more I study openly, the more I realize I'm not a 5 point Calvinist.
God Bless you all either way.
TheSevnthWarrior 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Calvinism is the doctrines of men and its followers unwittingly follow the spirit of antichrist and will eventually prepare a nation for islamization. James White is a pre-muslim. Everyone joins the facebook group ==> Freedom From Calvinism - Entering God's Kingdom and Revival.
prffsrx 1 year ago
Exactly, jean i thought the same thing, it looks as if yes salvation is open to all but not all will come to it.
Automatic25 1 year ago
James' response here is completely inadequate.
a) He argues that "all" in V.1 means "all kinds."
b) He then relates "Mediator" in V.5, to "Savior" in 4:10.
The problem is that in 4:10, "God is the Savior of all people" isnt suggesting that "God is the Savior of all KINDS of people." Rather, it is saying that "God is the Savior of EVERY person." But this is not what the Calvinist wants because in context, the "all" in V.6 should then mean "EVERY person," i.e. no limited atonement.
jeannieso 1 year ago
well im not going against that but if it means that every single person will ve saved won't that mean Jesus' saying that many are called few chosen made no sense?
Automatic25 1 year ago
@Automatic25
I don't believe every person will be saved. In the same sense that Jesus is the mediator of every man, including unsaved men, is the sense that Jesus "gave himself as a ransom" for every man -including the unsaved. The inclusive scope of the ransom sacrifice of Christ is not restricted by the unbelief of men.
jeannieso 1 year ago
@jeannieso IF....God saves EVERY person, THEN.....every person goes to heaven.
IF....everyone does not go to heaven, THEN....God does not save EVERY person. The only way this equation does not work is if you say something other than sin sends a person to hell, which is a theory foreign to Scripture.
MrSuperchicken1 1 year ago
Comment removed
jeannieso 1 year ago
How does God's choice to deal with man conditionally subvert or even threaten His sovereignty at all? Anyone care to explain that one? If God's choice is to deal with mankind conditionally, what is your beef with that?
cjk9013 1 year ago
Amen! Calvinists defend God's right to do what ever God wants, but apparently God is not allowed to deal with man conditionally.
shteve77 1 year ago
Calvinism goes against the entire theme of the Bible really. It is amazing how far James White will go to explain away the plain meaning of the Bible.
The fact that he does this sort of thing with so MANY verses should give ANYONE a clue that there is something seriously wrong with this theology.
Jesus Himself made it clear that He has a message which even a child can understand (See Matthew 18:3-4 and Luke 18:16-17). Please don't make things so complicated James. Truth is simple.
Jesse859 2 years ago
Neither of those passages are referring to the proper interpretation of scripture. These passages are within the context of a manner of trust. Truth is simple but it does not negate the fact that the proper dividing of God's word still requires work and study. Peter points this out in 2 Peter 3:16
gtrjunky 2 years ago
What about Judas? God chose him but He chose the world. If God choses and you experience irresistable Grace as White also teaches, then where is faith. If God does it all why witness. God has foreknowledge and knocks but it is still up to us to surrender our will for His. This is a heresy of old. God chose the disciples, the Jews were His elect chosen to bring the Gospel into the world first the Jew and then the Gentile. White over explains a very simple thing. That WHOSOEVER.
brk49er 2 years ago
@brk49er Faith is a gift of God. Yes, God does it all. We witnes because we want to share the gospel with others, and God uses his elect to provide the means to the end. The Holy Spirit converts us and makes us want to hear the gospel.
NewDirection4us 2 years ago
So you just take the will of man totally out of the equation. That is proposterous. It says over and over that it is God's will that all be saved that none should perish. So if its all up to God and He wishes that all be saved then why doesnt He just give them all faith.Joh 3:18 He that believeth on him is not judged: he that believeth not hath been judged already, because he hath not believed on the name of the only begotten Son of God.
brk49er 2 years ago
@brk49er Well either God selects the saved or man selects the saved. Man still has freewill, but not to override the will of God. If God has chosen an elect group of people to be saved and given mercy then we will not comnplain. The only ones who may complain are those not chosen, or, those chosen but silly enough to think that their own decision was the reason they are saved. Arminian doctrine that man chooses to be saved, that man makes the first move towards Christ, is heresy. God chooses.
NewDirection4us 2 years ago
Rom 5:18 So then as through one trespass the judgment came unto all men to condemnation; even so through one act of righteousness the free gift came unto all men to justification of life.
Rom 5:19 For as through the one man's disobedience the many were made sinners, even so through the obedience of the one shall the many be made righteous.
All means All, whosoever means who ever. The World means the world period. Grace is a gift of God because of your faith.
brk49er 2 years ago
@brk49er Depending on the context, the words "all" and "world" have different meanings. For instance, John 3:16 says "God so loved the world...." and in another verse Jesus says: "I pray NOT for the world, but for those you (the Father) have given me for they are yours". John 17: 9. Jesus often spoke of the world as not being his sheep.
NewDirection4us 2 years ago
Its really just semantics, Its Gods will that all that will receive the Gospel message hears it. Thats all! No need for all talk. God made His message simple, no need to delve deeper than believe on Jesus Christ to save you, for it is by His rightousness not our own that we are able to stand before God. Rom 10:18 But I say, Did they not hear? Yea, verily, Their sound went out into all the earth, And their words unto the ends of the world. They just chose the darkness rather than the light.
brk49er 2 years ago
@brk49er True, all who are chosen by the Father and given to the Son will hear the gospel and believe. We believe because we are chosen, Christ's sheep, and have received the Holy Spirit. God's Holy Spirit comes into us at an appointed time in our lives then we believe and repent. Those not chosen will never believe, and will continue to hate Christ and reject the gospel.
NewDirection4us 2 years ago
cont'd... The words of our lord Jesus are very clear and difficult for the Arminians to deal with. Jesus said: "All that the Father gives me shall come to me" and "I pray not for the world, but for those whom the Father has given to me". There are others, but as you can saa these present a real problem for the Arminian view that people choose their own salvation instead of the Father choosing us and Jesus doing it. God does indeed choose some and pass by others and it is His right to do so
NewDirection4us 2 years ago
so are we saved by faith in the gospel message or does God just choose us. Rom 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
Rom 1:17 For therein is revealed a righteousness of God from faith unto faith: as it is written, But the righteous shall live by faith.
brk49er 2 years ago
Excellent sermon by Dr. White. Arminians do not have a lot of scripture to back up their idea that man choses God, instead of vice versa. The verses they do have are always taken out of context or misinterpreted. Calvinists have a lot more scripture verses to back up our view that God chooses the elect, that Christ accomplished it. Our verses are mostly by Paul and Jesus himself.
NewDirection4us 2 years ago
Cal view predestination as a personal foreloving or foreoardaining of an individual. whereas the Arm see it as the foreseeing of the action of that person. That would make election dependent on the recipient vs on the will of God. you can look up the greek on foreknew in vs such as Rom 8:28~31
bigbadwolff1 2 years ago
i see too many flaws with the arminianistic view of this. how would matthew 24:24 make sense if their view was true?
0Beanz0 2 years ago
I agree. If you are talking about the elect, once again, they would say the elect was so because of foreknowledge of the answer to the call, not the setting of love on the individual. Or that it is possible for that elect to be decieved, and lose their Salvation. The Arm position claims Bible sufficiency so when in a debate and faced with the overwhelming evidence to the contrary, if you have an honest Arm it puts them in a hard spot. God Bless
bigbadwolff1 2 years ago
@bigbadwolff1 to which i would ask an arminian, why does it say that God's call is irrevocable and God's grace is irresistible? if it was based off of the individual's answer to the call then the individual could deny the call, thus God's grace could be resistible. it seems to me the Arminianistic view negates God's sovereignty. God Bless you too.
0Beanz0 2 years ago
The more we study Gods Word the more it becomes blatantly obvious that Gods providence/sovreignty is seen throughout Scripture, which in turn comforts us that His will is carried out in His Childrens life
bigbadwolff1 2 years ago
Your view negates faith. Im not a Cal or an Arm Im a blood bought child of God. If its all irresistable then its not faith. Rom 1:18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hinder the truth in unrighteousness;
Rom 1:19 because that which is known of God is manifest in them; for God manifested it unto them.
Says right here that God manifest himself to the unrightous, they choose their own will and not the fathers.
brk49er 2 years ago
@brk49er Faith is a gift of God, bestowed on the elect. If the Holy Spirit were to leave the believer then there would be no convicting of sin so repentence would be even less likely if the Holy Spirit were to withdraw from the believer.
NewDirection4us 2 years ago
Matt 24:24 makes sense in that once they have believed, then the Holy spirit will not allow them to fully fall for a false teaching. John 10:28 explains that. Once your name is written in the Book of Life it cannot be erased. Bible says all men are without excuse, well if they are not part of the elect then they have an excuse.
brk49er 2 years ago
Comment removed
0Beanz0 2 years ago
hi everyone i like to throw my two cent interpretation of
God's willl and man's will
i'm not sure where i would catorgorize myself in this subject
but in reading the Bible i see scriptures that definitely state that it s solely in God s power and will to make us His son.
saying that i also see scriptures that gives the formula to be saved
or is it stating that those that make such confession and genuine belief s are demostrating God s election?
noelmojica70 2 years ago
White's solution: "all kinds., not all men" But there's more kinds of men than there are individual men. One man, Paul, is both a Jew and a Roman; hence three kinds for Paul- "JEW", "ROMAN", and "JEW & ROMAN", as well as "MAN", and "JEW & MAN", and "ROMAN & JEW & MAN", etc., ad infinitum. Not Q, ergo Not P. Or maybe the adjective "all" can be used to quantify over an entire class in the first place? "Assumptions not part of the text, [they] are coming from a theological system..."
ExMachNna 2 years ago
this is one of the worst exegesis' ever done by James White
LOLFunny687 2 years ago
How so?
APSOC38 1 year ago
Oh no,God only says men can be saved,not women,not children! (sarcasm).God chose us before time to be saved.
CBALLEN 2 years ago
James White explains this very logically and scripturally in my opinion. It makes sense to me.
bmd200 2 years ago
Verse 1 says "I urge, then, first of all, that requests, prayers, intercession and thanksgiving be made for everyone" The context is everyone. We should pray for everyone. Then it talks about a specific group we should remember to pray for, those in authority. Why? So that with good rulers "we may live peaceful and quiet lives in all godliness and holiness." Then it says God desires all men to be saved. Note, "all men" not "all types of men". All are not saved because they reject Christ.
shteve77 2 years ago
Nowhere in scripture does it say that to be able to pray for a person we need to pray for them by name & know them as an individual. We can pray for "all" people affected by an earthquake without knowing their name. God knows them all. If "all" actually meant all kinds then it wouldn't only list one "type" of men. Namely rulers. Surely you would give a big list of types of men if you wanted to show it means all kinds.
shteve77 2 years ago
Why is it that only James White seemingly has the 'authority' to determine what the proper 'context' is in these verses. Not surprisingly, the 'context' is never the historical position of the Church, but the lens of 'reformation' era heretics.
His argument is ALWAYS the same. Anyone who disagrees with him is either ignorant or taking scripture 'out of context'.
LothairOfLorraine 2 years ago
Does James White know what he's talking about, and does he read the Bible in context?
LaneCh 2 years ago
No. In fact, the more I read and see of him, the more obvious it becomes to me that what he calls 'context' most rational people would call 'pretext'. Within the first few minutes he used the word 'context' about a dozen times. Someone that concerned with limiting the true voice of Scripture to fit his sectartian agenda cannot be trusted.
Now with you, there is that word...'context'. Far to often that word is being used in a sectatian way.
LothairOfLorraine 2 years ago
Brothers, the doctrine of Calvinism is man's doctrine. It has a man's name attached to it. Paul said, 'But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man. For I neither received it from man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ. (Gal 1:11) If we go directly to the source, our Lord Jesus Christ, and get our revelation from Him, we can all advance together and start focusing on the things that are important to His heart.
mikaelstoneface 2 years ago
Brothers, the doctrine mikaelstoneface has put forth is man's doctrine because it has a Youtube user's name attached to it.
(Now see how inane that reasoning is?)
LaneCh 2 years ago
Lane, what patience you have! Things which are so obvious to me after studying the Bible for years seem not to register with many.
...And I know why. Men hate the truth, they always have and always will. There are many who profess Christ on Youtube and everywhere who don't know Him at all.
How terrible for them when they hear those words: "Depart from me... I never knew you!"
silmalila 2 years ago
God will save the maximum number possible. But unlike Arminian/Calvinists say, the maximum number possible is ALL men. ALL men who have ever existed. That is what 1 Tim 2:4 is saying. Read Col 1:16-20, 1 John 2:2, Isaiah 26:9, etc. to see God's plan to save ALL mankind.
Luke 3:6 all mankind will see God's salvation.
Eternal hell is a pagan myth. Eternal is mistranslated.
Check out:
bible-truths(.)com
tentmaker(.)org
and prepare to have your faith challenged with the truth in the bible.
boom72erang 2 years ago
Is "eternal life" also mistranslated?
Do people have to be forgiven to obtain "eternal life"- to enter Heaven? Because you do know, don't you, that Christ said that there is sin that will never be forgiven- not in this life, nor in the one to come? And not everyone who calls Him "Lord" will enter- ONLY those who do the will of God. (Matt. 7:21).
Everyone going to Heaven is a pagan myth.
Check out: The Bible
Vaekkrinhart 2 years ago 2
Zingh!
jaharrison1663 2 years ago
If you want to be a fisher of men, it might be important to know what the hook is.
You do not trick the ungodly into being born again, it is a work of God. And God never, NEVER fails. He is able to save to the uttermost.
Why it is important is because it helps us understand other scriptures, God, His plan, why missions sometimes fails, and why His methods are the ONLY methods we should use.
Plus, it is how He will get "ALL" the glory and we will get none.
bereansearch 2 years ago
omgosh bereansearch,
WELL said--i'm "struggling" now to frame my point to those refuting those evil calvinists. . . I often thought to myself the Biblical truth of SO-CALLED calvinism or reformed view, (the reason why it is so often refuted, rejected, despised, etc) is bc it gives God *ALL* the glory indeed and we will get none, just like you mentioned.
GreenCures 2 years ago
Is Pragmatism (results=worth) a viable attutude towards missions? (Consider Noah and Jeremiah)
Will psychology, philosophy, strong arguement, emotionalism, mood lighting, music, sinner's prayers, relavence to culture, or walking an aisle bring about rebirth?!
Or is it as the Word says, that the Holy Spirit works in a man's heart and mind as the Gospel is preached, and this prompts them to repentance of sin, and a turning to Christ?!
bereansearch 2 years ago
It is good to know how God works and what His Word actually means. This is one reason to address this question.
The other reason is to answer the question, "why do some believe, and some do not?" Saul was not willing to believe until the Damascus Road.
What you believe will influence the means you are trusting in for people to be saved.
Do they believe because of my impressive words? Do they believe because they are smarter? Because they are better people?
bereansearch 2 years ago
Stop wasting your life arguing with fellow believers(Arminianism-Calvinism) People....just read your bible, and pray. Realize that you need Jesus, and that he his the only one that can save you from the wrath of God. Turn to Jesus, turn away from your sins and be fishers of men.
xxRANMANxx 2 years ago 3
Yet you just "wasted your life arguing with fellow believers" to not argue with fellow believers. Um... yeah. It just shows why this issue is still debated among believers in spite of such "convincing argumentation" from others who don't want it to be discussed like yourself.
LaneCh 2 years ago
@xxRANMANxx A great portion of the Bible is dedicated to refuting false doctrine,Christ himself devoted a great deal of words to it. I think the way we (Christians) go about it is certainly flawed. As we have little grace to show one another while conversing. If we "just read your bible, and pray.", we will eventually get up and converse with others that have done the same. My point is this, the debate is not wothless but very important it is just the way we carry it out.
xibjou 1 year ago
@xxRANMANxx So we are given teachers by God- why? Ephesians 4:11 and 1 Cor. 12 are to be ignored then according to your formula.
MrSuperchicken1 1 year ago
The best exegesis of this text that I have come across comes from Augustine. Read his treatises on the doctrine of predestination.
strangerindakosmos23 3 years ago
Good clip
testskriftene 3 years ago
Great video Lane....
kamaujackson811 3 years ago
Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.Its sad how far calvinist and armenians run when it comes to the topic of salvation ,to them Christ is the savior of the world that will not save the world, the wrath of God was satisfied for all but not all,every tong confessing and knee bowing is not believing at all,God so loved the world but He will loose most of them because Christ couldn't save the world.election without a purpose?Hell is necessary ?
flavmusicman 3 years ago
Are you a universalist, flavmusicman?
LaneCh 3 years ago
I am a follower of Christ,I believe what the scriptures plainly teaches, the rest is man made theology, don't know anyone around me that is universalist if believing that Christ will save all make me one OK I am a universalist,I don,t really know if they believe in election which I do cause the bible teaches it,don't believe in free will, but believe we all are responsible for our actions,but responsibility to save men is His alone,He made the wound, He will heal us.God bless.
flavmusicman 3 years ago
Universalists believe that no one is going to hell; everyone is getting saved. Are you a universalist?
LaneCh 3 years ago
do you mean Hades/Sheol where everyone is dead waiting judgment?in order for you to be resurrected you must be dead don't you think?What I believe is that there is punishment for the wicked but not eternal,everyone pays according to what they done in this lifetime,Christ saves men through judgment and it must start with us the house of the lord than the rest of the world.What do you believe hell is?I believe the world is saved after they are judged.
flavmusicman 3 years ago
You should really READ your bible, and not listen to heretics.
biggmoneyme 2 years ago
@flavmusicman
You said, "I believe the world is saved after they are judged."
I have no clue whatsoever where you got that from Scripture because that is taught NOWHERE in the Bible. With all due respect, you are out to lunch.
APSOC38 1 year ago
yea, at this very moment we're having stake baked in a 400 degrees oven ,I can imagine people even children having their flash baked in the eternalssss fires of Dantes infernus,and when million year have gone,they will have to endure another gazillions of ages and all this for the GLORY OF THE FATHER, because God causes the salvation of the elect but according to Calvin he causes not the perdition of the lost, common grace?when you have hell ahead of you ,for what? ah let me eat...
flavmusicman 1 year ago
you notice he never responded.
JesusFishMinistries 3 years ago
I think he meant Tartarus, where angels are bound with chains in everlasting judgement, where those who follow the beast and his false prophet will be cast for eternity...
petemillner 3 years ago
Actually Calvinism doesnt teach that Jesus dies for all, or died to save all. But your logic conclusion is correct as far as arminianism goes.
hasani42 3 years ago
Awsome!
whitedragonawa 3 years ago
Do they disagree with the interpretations or with Christ? Being a Baptist or a Calvinist, etc. doesn't save you. Calvin or anyone else didn't die for you. Only Jesus Christ did. Call yourself a christian if that is what you truly are.
tastreetman 3 years ago
Do you believe that man has a free will and that his free will decision for Christ is what makes him born again?
LaneCh 3 years ago
The death and resurrection of christ is what saves all of us, not only a few. Christ didn't force anyone to follow him. People chose and still choose whether or not to follow him.
tastreetman 3 years ago
Well, you're an Arminian, but you're probably just ignorant to it. That's the default argument for Arminians really: "I'm not Calvinist, I'm not Arminian; I'm just a Christian." Do some research, and you'll find this is true.
LaneCh 3 years ago
Thanks for the assumption. I am sure it was done with gentleness and respect.
tastreetman 3 years ago
Oh, it was respectful to you, just not to your ignorance.
Arminianism soteriology: Free will decision for Christ
Calvinism soteriology: God predestines according to His own purpose
I've prayed for God to help you; not your ignorance. Make sure that you know the difference between the two.
LaneCh 3 years ago
I'm not the sharpest knife in the drawer but your last comment sounded condescending to me. It also sounded more like pride than it did humility. You must be a young person. I say this because the older I get the more I realize I'm don't know as much as I thought I did. Have a good day and God bless.
tastreetman 3 years ago
Let no one καταφρονέω (look down upon, discredit, disesteem) you for your youth, but set the believers an example in speech, in conduct, in love, in faith, in purity. Until I come, devote yourself to the public reading of Scripture, to exhortation, to teaching.
(1Ti 4:12-13)
According to Paul, your argument that a young person must be ignorant and the older person must be wiser is worldly and opposed to Scripture. Per Paul's commandment, I do not accept the criticism you've set forth.
LaneCh 3 years ago
LaneCh You're a Reformed Roman Catholic and your attitude reeks of the spirit of Romanism.
Calvinism = Roman Catholicism.
blueblue1891 3 years ago
lol.... thanks for the ahistorical evaluation.
LaneCh 3 years ago
Ahistorical? Is that why your cult was started by a Roman Catholic that wanted to REFORM Romanism? Calvinism is the joke here, too bad you're too educated to catch that part.
Also it's not me that has the same belief as the religion of islam, they as you believe that some people are made just to be destroyed. But then again no one blamed neither calvinist or muslims to be intelligent, just themselves.
blueblue1891 3 years ago
Luther was a Romanist who went out from them. To go out means to separate from. Since he went out from them, he was no longer a Roman Catholic. That's pretty basic logic that two year olds can identify with when one takes away their lollipop. They understand that it is no longer under their possession the same as the RC church did with Luther in pronouncing him anathema. As far as addressing your other points... I cannot. Why? Because you present none, just pejorative language.
LaneCh 3 years ago
wow blueblue1891 study some history and you might then understand the difference between Roman Catholics and Reformation theology
lozersk8er 3 years ago
People call themselves Calvinists, Baptists, Lutherians, Methodists, Catholics, Mormons and on and on.
What about just Christian?
tastreetman 3 years ago
Well, to take issue with your comment, Mormons and Roman Catholics are not Christians. Aside from that, people disagree with different interpretations of the Bible hence the different names. You don't hold that a brain surgeon and a dentist should both just be called "doctor", do you? It's the same principle.
LaneCh 3 years ago
Who wants to be a Calvinist or any other "title" besides a Christian?
tastreetman 3 years ago
I think Spurgeon said it best:
"We only use the term "Calvinism" for shortness. That doctrine which is called "Calvinism" did not spring from Calvin; we believe that it sprang from the great founder of all truth.
(cont...)
LaneCh 3 years ago
Perhaps Calvin himself derived it mainly from the writings of Augustine. Augustine obtained his views, without doubt, through the Spirit of God, from the diligent study of the writings of Paul, and Paul received them of the Holy Ghost, from Jesus Christ, the great founder of the Christian dispensation.
(cont...)
LaneCh 3 years ago
We use the term then, not because we impute any extraordinary importance to Calvin's having taught these doctrines. We would be just as wiling to call them by any other name, if we could find one which would be better understood, and which on the whole would be as consistent with fact."
- C.H. Spurgeon
LaneCh 3 years ago
can any Calvinist out there answer why God offers irresistible grace to some and not all?
Or why Him being SOVEREIGN aloud so manny people to be born to be eternally lost just for the sake of the elect?context,context,context what about creation yearns for the manifestation of the redeemed sons of God? were we elected for the purpose of being in the bliss of heaven or to us was given the word(ministry)of reconciliation of ALL ?Is HE the propitiation to our sins only or to the whole world?
flavmusicman 3 years ago