Olbermann 2006-10-18

[GstateBALLER925]

*sigh* back in the day when scarborough country came after countdown... those must have been the days. i didnt watch back then.

:(

[scifipaladin]

oldhacks take a look at his Special Comment about the Democrats compromise with Bush. You'll find something completely different

[oldhacks]

olbermann is a payed liar that is shilling for the military industrial complex by spreading lies about Mike Gravel dropping out of the race. Mike is a fighter and is fighting for us. He's trying to end the war just like how he ended the vitnam war. we are truly blessed to have such ae leader dedicate his time and energy to waking up the American public and Olbermann is trying to stop him!

watch?v=noPklESrxnE

[pacificguitarist]

Umm. No. Plain and simply your wrong.

First off Olberrmanm Is not "shilling for the military industrial complex" as he is a vocal opponent of the current war. Second, Gravel has no chance of winning so their is no point in making up lies about him dropping out. Also it was just a mistake and msnbc apologized for it. Go see when Fox has ever apologized for any of their mistakes.

[fourcell911]

Impeace Cheney, Bush, Pilosi and Clinton and all the other AIPAC shills.

It's official - The US lost the War in Iraq, Iran won.

And it only cost you $1.2 TRILLION and a few thousand soldiers.

[AnnathGL]

All I heard was a lot of sensationalism. Someone correct me if I'm wrong as I may be thinking of a different treaty, but if I recall correctly the US never signed into the Geneva convention, so yes it is optional. Oh, and this isn't just neocons. It's more liberals than anyone who want to take away our freedoms. Bush is just a wuss who has no idea what he is. Although, I do agree that Bush is an idiot and the loss of habeus corpus is bad. I'm not going to contest that point.

[AnnathGL]

Erk, I misspelled habeas. Sorry.

[Erdles]

You are wrong; the USA signed both the Third & the Fourth Geneva Conventions in 1949. The fact that you perceive it to be 'optional' is rather frightening as it justifies the horrific treatment many American troops experienced in various countries' POW Camps during conflicts in the last century.

I don't quite see why you think liberals want to take away your liberties - could you present an example where that is the case?

[AnnathGL]

That's why I said correct me if I was wrong, because I wasn't sure. And, now that I know that, I agree that it isn't optional.(To clarify, I meant legally optional. I don't condone torture, et al).

(Gah, youtube has a length limit. I'll have to cut this into two parts.)

[AnnathGL]

As for liberals taking away liberties, for a small example try video game legislation. They are trying to override the first amendment in favor of false security. Or there is gun control, trying to override the second amendment for the same reason. These are just a couple of simple examples, of course. I don't deny that neocons are just as guilty, but don't say that it is ONLY neocons, because it isn't.

[Erdles]

Fair enough - seems liberals are just as bad when it comes to upholding libertarian ideals. I was just wondering because I live outside the US and wasn't too familiar with domestic policy, etc.

Glad I could be of assistance on the Geneva Convention issue, and I'm glad I did misunderstand what you were saying about it being optional.

[pacificguitarist]

Of course liberals try to hold up their beliefs. They put warnings on video games so that mothers don't by extremely violent games for their children. i see nothing wrong with this.

The U.S.A. also has the worlds highest gun deaths number and so liberals try to stop the spread of guns being bought.

[fourcell911]

Neocons and those who support them are like the retarded kid next door that puts his finger up his butt, then pulls it out and asks people to smell it.

If you like the fact US soldiers invaded a foriegn country based on a stack of lies, and the residents are willing to fight to the death to paint GI brains on the wall, then pull out your brown fingers and wave them here for all to see.

[padude64]

I like Keith Olbermann and I say what I want and If you repubs dont like it then go straight to hell! Thank you!

[22cmonkey22]

Today on Cmonkey Theater:

Watch "Money, Banking and the Federal Reserve" at google video

Good Luck America

[blahinhawaii]

What if someone wanted to make you disappear for what you think or say in public. All they have to do now is frame you for "terrorism" in some way. What then? Really, now whatcha gonna do? How you gonna prove you are being framed and are just a dissident? Call out and face your accuser? Nope not anymore. Talk to the press? not anymore. Talk to your lawyer? not anymore. Have your day in court? Have a timely hearing, a fair hearing? Anyone framed for terrorism now has no rights.

[PointsOfAuthority]

The war is pointless, for the terrorists of 911 weren't even Iraqi, nor any faction we take offense to. This war is for mere oil. And for a president to be that greedy...is fascist. And now, today, we look at ourselves with shame, for electing this man, this man who is the reason for deaths on both sides. A man of no intelligence, no heart, no sole purpose or wit.

[PointsOfAuthority]

Guess who has the most nuclear weapons? We do, right behind germany. Guess who doesn't allow people just like us entering our country or getting married? We do. Guess who kills innocent civilians, proven right by video and subject, we do! Guess what law enforcement killed hundreds of african americans back in the 50's and still do? We do. We have the great threat. We are the terrorists.

[decepticon37]

You really can't fuck with Olbermann. You can't pick him apart point by point, it's impossible. So right-wingers just make lame and incorrect generalizations to justify their side of the argument. Bush has you all scared, begging for him to protect you, willing to give up all your rights because you are sissys. Keep sticking to your guns you fanatics, thanks for helping script the fuckin' apocolypse you ignorant shits

[beverly555]

Brilliant. I am going to start watching this show.

[skearn1]

ahh after having to listen to Bush for so long, it's so nice hearing somebody who's actually eloquent! (on top of the whole having respect for democracy thing)

[lilgrasshoppah]

It bothers me when a journalist is attacked for being a journalist, and a tyrant is protected for being a tyrant. Anybody who advocates abandoning the constitution is advocating tyranny. Instead of taking swipes @ Olbermann;s character, why not address what he actually said? Or is that too frightening for you to do?

[lab8985]

Bush is a d!ck.

[SabiaCDO]

Finally, someone said it out loud on american television...

Well said, took some guts to do it...Olbermann is a man who's not afraid to take a stand, against THE fascist that "rules" USA. Good luck america, you'll need it.

[EnvoyofDarkness]

It's so sad but so true. It's a shame to see how this country this has fallen

[metalwar83]

Section 948b of title 10 of the United States Code, as enacted by the Act, provides (in part): (a) Purpose.--This chapter establishes procedures governing the use of military commissions to try alien unlawful enemy combatants engaged in hostilities against the United States for violations of the law of war and other offenses triable by military commission.

- with "alien" defined in section 948a(3) as "a person who is not a citizen of the United States".

[Moeswow]

that is true but unlawful enemy combatant isnt... if u are labeled as one then u are not a citizen and Bush insists that he has the authority to dismiss someones citizenship....

[CF2006UK]

F*ckin well said.

[may1boycott]

Anyone that still thinks that Bush is not the Anti-christ has bought in to Bush propoganda from his hate monger media pals at Fox and Clear channel. When marshall law is called to hold the THINKERS down. The Bush supporters will be waving thier flags from a cave trying to get away from the heat that the Bush policys created by distroying the earth. Whats sad is that Bush has a house fitted for solor power and other netural energy.

[pannicatack]

I personally prefer the "funny" Olberman. Quite effective at conveying it, but a tad bit melodramatic. I also notice that everyone who disagrees just says "that's BS" without actually refuting the statements. >_>

[fuyb]

Everyone? I think I clearly refuted his statements? You can disagree with the USSC and the constitutional community (which I myself sometimes do) but if I have to take someone's word for it, I'll take the USSC word over Olbermann's any day.

[Von506]

good night n good luck...

[Devilboy4685]

He scares me! by the way he talks!

[NativeAlien]

"Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country." -- Hermann Goering

[MurasakiYugata]

Quite possibly the best speech I've ever heard.

[scotchscotch]

you gotta be kidding!

[MadMadMedusasSoul]

this is sad. :-(

[Lensei]

This restores my faith in the American press while at the same time eliminates my final shred of faith in the Bush Administration.

[AngryOmen]

I doubt half you mongoloids even know what habeas corpus is, or how monumentally bad (or at the very least important) it is that it's been revoked.

Oh well. Go watch a video of a cat do something silly instead. Look at him tackle that kid! Ha ha ha, that crazy cat!

[fuyb]

Instead of name calling why don't do some research. You will find that you can not trust Olbermann one bit. For example: Bush hasn't revoked habeas corpus at all (U.S. Supreme Court, EX PARTE QUIRIN 317 U.S. 1 1942 USSC unanimous ruling) and if he did he has the constitutional right to do so.

Boy don't you feel stupid for listening to olbermann.

[scotchscotch]

fuyb, thank you, I would like to research this further. In a sentence, how would you suggest I proceed?

[fuyb]

On this issue: The US Courts are for US Citizens and constitutional law gets a little tricky when some try to extend the rights of US citizens to military combatants and terrorists that choose to work outside all accepted civilized codes of conduct. Try the case I mentioned, it goes directly to the subject at hand, it is a unanimous USSC ruling and has over six decades of precedence. If you follow constitutional law it is hard to disagree with.

[scotchscotch]

Thanks - I will check it out..

[bbv001]

hjh

[bbv001]

I hate guys like you. All you do is sit around on the computer all day and make queer, sarcastic comments to a web-site that people love and enjoy. You are probably some fat, lazy, lonely piece of crap who has no job and has nothing better to do than sit around looking at people's comments on youtube. Get a like prick

[scotchscotch]

After all, after everything, all the propoganda, the spin, media bs, everything.. Momma didn't raise no dummy and I STILL like Bush. He was right about more stuff than the dem alternatives.. Kerry, Gore, et al. Keep or lose congress, it doesn't matter. Didn't vote for him but glad he's our Pres.

[Johnny6666]

"Momma didn't raise no dummy..."

Heh. :)

[scotchscotch]

sorry, I was channeling that old Zucker comedy "Airplane"; that scene where the white lady translates jive and gets into a jive arguement w/ the black guy..(was that Samuel L. Jackson?)

[tedbroken]

did you vote at all?

[scotchscotch]

Yes, Libertarian. I'm born and raised American. I love this country but more the principles it was founded on. I don't take ANY right I have in this society for granted and I can derive all the ones I cherish using simple logic. Honest question: Has habeas corpus really been REVOKED here or has it been properly refined to suit a savvy enemy?

[shiznick90210]

First they put away the dealers, keep our kids safe and off the street. Then they put away the prostitutes, keep married men cloistered at home. Then they shooed away the bums, then they beat and bashed the queers,

turned away asylum-seekers, fed us suspicions and fears. We didn't raise our voice, we didn't make a fuss. It's funny there was no one left to notice, when they came for us. -- punk band NOFX

[bbv001]

punk music sucks ass

[shiznick90210]

If any of you majored in history and law you would know this development is a bad thing for us. Well, the neoconservatives always wanted to turn back the clock ...back to the Dark Ages. The terrorists would be proud.

[WILLYPOWER]

how does anybody watch this guy on his soap box telling lies to get ratings,never beat oreilly

[GWBsux]

Telling lies? What lies is he telling? This is the truth...the rethugs are slowly taking away the rights of Americans.  Try doing some reading instead of listening to Rush Dipshit and Foxed news.

[fuyb]

It is amazing that the people following Olbermann are so uninformed. For example in this case of habeas corpus, Bush hasn't suspended Habeas corpus at all (U.S. Supreme Court, EX PARTE QUIRIN 317 U.S. 1 1942 USSC unanimous ruling) and if he did he has the constitutional right to do so.

[Xoryc]

The comments here make me sick. Have any of you miscreants actually read the bill in it's entirity before spouting your pro-state views? Voting won't change this, supporting the war won't change this. 

Wake up folks, the problem isn't left or right, it's the state; the ruling class; the government! Don't vote - live free.

[Lensei]

How is not voting in a democracy living free? The way I understand it, not voting in a democracy merely indicates your consent to live under a dictatorship chosen by those who do vote.

[Xoryc]

Voting along any spot in the political spectrum is essentially sanctioning the system of government in place -- democracy, in this case. If you're able to recognize the state as nothing more than a coercive monopoly of force over a given territory, then it's rather plain to see that absolving yourself from that system is the only morally consistent thing to do.

[Lensei]

A monopoly, perhaps, but one that we are given shares in. I would submit that there are only two morally consistent options - either exercising one's power as a shareholder or attempting to break the monopoly in a given area. I see non-participation as a step towards the second goal, not an end in itself. That would not be taking a stand - it would be retreating from one.

[Xoryc]

You operate under the false premise that I have given my consent to this form government. The social contract is a myth.

However, that is beside the point. How can I given the "power" to chose between your alternative when I have never given my consent to be apart of the system in the first place? Can I sell you a car without your consent? How about a loaf of bread?

[sbostedor]

99% of what this guy said is untrue. Do some real homework.

[Lisa2001]

EXACTLY!!

[molasky]

99% of your comment is untrue.

[Method9]

such as

[fuyb]

Such as habeas corpus has not been suspended.

[IndieRock13]

sbostedor... hyperbole and dramatic words fill this speech but none of it is untrue.

I've found that almost all Bush supporters are as shortsighted and blindly biased as yourself. I only hope you actually watched the video before making an ass of yourself.

[ColonelWarden]

Good speech.

[Zexion5]

It would be nice if people were smart enough to understand what's at stake here. Ignorance and stupidity are what allow habeas corpus to be suspended without protest...How sad.

[ArsonDPI]

well at least some people speak their mind rather than indulge in the style of non-style ("oh, I don't like nothing, nothing expresses me, I prefer being cynical than to be passionate"etc etc)

[WILLYPOWER]

why is this guy all over utube,does post his own vids,nobody watches that shit show.carry on!

[jabba64]

Actually, Countdown has started to beat The Great Big Head from 8 to 8:30 among the 25-49 Demographic consistently.

[oldhacks]

keith olbermann is a shill for the military industrial complex which just happens to be his boss. General Electric. Same as O'Rielly. two sides of the same coin. Spin doctors brainwashing the public into trusting politicians

[GstateBALLER925]

keith dispises most politicans... wtf are you talking about?

[molasky]

nobody? look it up.

[jabba64]

WOW, how incredibly original. In fact, you posted EXACTLY the same comment on the other Olbermann videos! Troll!

[buckaroo21]

What a bunch of hooey. He cites "fear mongering", and the uses historical examples that don't match circumstances to fear monger! The "prophecy" he refers to that he says "was attributed to Ben Franklin" was said not said by Franklin, and I'm sick and tired of people waving misinformation around like it means something. He insinuates that habeas corpus is suspended for you and me and everyday Americans. Not true

[debck]

You need to stop listening to what pundits tell you and go read the damn law for yourself. The only people who continue to wave the misinformation flag these days seem to sit themselves in front of Fox News and never check the stories or the laws or the actions of congress and an increasingly corrupt adminsitration for themselves.

[ash81052]

Habeas corpus either applies to all or to none. I'm reminded of the old Pogo quote: "We have met the enemy and he is us."

[moulingalette]

Now look who is spreading misinformation "buckaroo21". That quote is correct and is attributed to Ben Franklin. I would agree that it should not be called a "prophesy" though because it is not a prediction, just an opinion.

As for "everday Americans" not being persecuted, I think that is for the most part true. What people worry about though, or at least me, is the whole idea of the slippery slope and "big brother" monitoring everything in secret and carrying out their judgement in secret.

[Wired2boot]

Wake UP! This, (our 43 President)has done more in this term to hurt and suspend or destroy more of our civil liberties than most Americans even relise they have! Get your head out of the sand!

[buckaroo21]

Wired2boot: Explain how you have been affected. Please give examples.

[Wired2boot]

I sat down and wrote a reply to your inquiry. however, the response here can't be over 500 char. If you would like to discuss this in detail. please e mail me.

[Lensei]

Three words, friend: Vivian Alvarez Solon. Look it up. Granted, it's an Australian case, but it's a case where a citizen was affected by laws that shouldn't have applied. Never underestimate a bureaucratic mistake - the bigger the mistake is, the more priority is placed on covering it up rather than fixing it.

[Lensei]

Well, the Japanese-Americans during WWII weren't considered everyday Americans either. Last time I checked, they felt differently.

[LordQwert]

It's funny. I see so much more ignorance on the internet than I do in real life. Maybe it's because I'm at college, where intelligent people tend to gravitate.

Note: This comment isn't about Olbermann, but about the clearly well thought out comments of users like "DaRealSki" and "tgrisier".

[GDUcommander]

Wow what Olbermann says is so true there is no denying it.

[jesserclarke]

YES! YES! YES!

VOTE NOVEMBER 7!

[DaRealSki]

Ko can suck my balls. That ginger jew rat newscaster.

[debck]

You really are a moron. Go back to Fox and drink the Kool Aid - The talking points spewed by radical right wing fruitcakes like Sean Hannity is obviously all your tiny little brain can handle.

[elementc]

No one will change their mind if you can only insult them. Instead of simply shouting insults people should at least try to back up their points. Even if you do a poor job it's still better than alienating people who could potentially change their minds.

[mthai66]

holy mother of god... W Pwns liberty. Olb Pwns W

[neapster]

FINALLY Someone has the guts and vision to say it as it is. The Bush administration is as dangerous, deadly, crazy, and ideological as any terrorist group out there. They should all be impeached. How is it that the radical right theocrats hounded our best president in a generation (Clinton) for private indiscretion to the point of impeachment, yet Bush is taking away our constitutional rights and making disastrous decisions that kill our soldiers (pre-emptive strike on Iraq)?

[CCCW]

FDR: "We have nothing to fear but fear itself"

George Bush: "We have nothing but fear"

Nobody is denying that the threat posed by muslim extremists is real, but destroying your way of life to protect it? That doesn't sound like a reasonable course of action. Think about it. Destroying something, to protect it.

[synthum]

staggering! totally mind-blowing! How can this be on TV?

[oldladybluejeans]

Keith Olbermann is a hero.

[ther0ver]

Why does anyone take the time to post a video of this guy?

[fitchlives]

You're calling HIM sanctimonious!?! Isn't there a "threat" in any extremist group? In any group in opposition to the government? What we have here is McCarthyism of the highest degree and so much arrogance to think America is an innocent victim. Abandoning civil liberties represents a masked fascism or a new type of despotism even Tocqueville couldn't have predicted.

[scotchscotch]

Can you admit some extremist groups are more threatening than others - like ones who vow to kill us, not for things we've done, but because we've not converted to extremist Islam? This group has been duped into trading martyrdom for eternal heaven. Have you any idea the number? 10k?, 100k? 1000000? I've lived thru a holocaust and McCarthyism. The US right & left both pose threats to freedom. Rad Islam's far worse.

[hodensaft]

Dude, they're not after us because we won't convert.

Most of the people Bush refers to as "the terrorists" want us dead because we're occupying their country. He can harp on that "foriegn fighter" and al-Qeada bullshit all he wants, but study after study (most conducted by our military) have proven that 99% of the people fighting us in Iraq are homegrown.

As for the guys who planned and executed 9/11? There were a whole host of complaints they had made quite public.

(cont'd)

[hodensaft]

Our stationing of troops in Saudi Arabia, our continued military and financial support of men like Saddam and Hosni Mubarek, etc. Nothing can justify what they did, but arguing that we were attacked because "they hate our freedoms" is wrong.

As for the guys who are going to be hitting us left and right for the next 30 years? Well, they hate us because we dropped a cluster bomb on their cousin's wedding. Or we took their father in the middle of the night and sent him to Abu Ghraib.

[hodensaft]

Or we opened fire on their car when they were speeding down the highway to escape the violence of Baghdad.

If George Bush's war has accomplished anything, it has been to end once and for all the plausibility of the argument that these people attack us for no reason.

But put all that aside for a moment. No one - not Keith Olbermann, not any Democrats in office, and not me - is saying that we need to give up fighting people who truly do want to kill us.

(cont'd)

[hodensaft]

(damn youtube and it's 500 character limit)

We're just arguing that there's a smarter way to go about it. A way that doesn't make us look like hypocrites and killers to the rest of the world, and won't produce 10 new generations of terrorists to replace the one we're fighting now.

It's simple: we hold ourselves up as a beacon of freedom and human rights, a nation of laws, not men.

(cont'd)

[hodensaft]

The way to stay true to that would simply be to try every terrorist we can catch in open court.

Right-wingers always say this is fantasy, but we've already done it. Remember the WTC bombing of 1993? Well, instead of being martyrs, Ramzi Yousef and his co-conspirators are rotting in a Supermax prison in Colorado. Why? Because a federal jury in New York put them there.

Terrorists locked away, US constitution protected, and our reputation intact. What about that is so hard to understand?

[wawul]

The staleness of your gray matter explains your inability to comprehend what is truly happening. Or perhaps you are so pure of spirit you have no choice but to exhibit blind trust. Either way, I pity us both.

[scotchscotch]

wawul, you are right - my gray matter is a bit stale. Stop pitying us and educate me: What is happening? Do you agree with and admire KO?

[elementc]

The threat that remains hidden is far more insidious and dangerous. Do you think Hitler immediately started sending people to the death camps? NO!! He got the laws passed that allowed him to do what he wanted FIRST. Just because those in power SAY they won't do something doesn't mean they won't. If they can do something there is a good chance they will.

[Lensei]

Yep, radical Islam is dangerous. Just how dangerous, though? At the end of the day, what do the Islamists have in terms of assets? How many tank divisions? How many nuclear weapons?

Conversely, what does the US government have at its fingertips, as the world's greatest power? Personally, I find the thought of the US becoming less of a democracy more threatening than some crackpot in Iran, because the crackpot in Iran doesn't hold the world together.

[scotchscotch]

..thus continues the debate: several hundred thou fanatics on a mission f/ god to kill the infidel frosts me. Hell, 1 armed fanatic could screw up a city. I just witnessed 4k katushas lobbed into Israel. Dmake no mistake - what scares me is also our inevitable response to Nuke 'em next time (& WE WOULD if katushas start raining into CA from TJ, Mex.

[prahamadudas]

well, without any tanks or weapons the 9-11 conspirators got their point across pretty effectively, while with the world's largest military we're stumbling all over ourselves in Iraq and at this point noone knows what the hell the point even is.

[corybantic]

bless you, KO.

[scotchscotch]

KO "Sir", do you deny that radical Islam poses any threat? Any? This denial is exactly why, although I am tempted, I cannot take you seriously. Those who call this "powerful stuff" have no idea of the implications of such denial.

Sanctimonious ass.

[wawul]

Aren't you oblivious of the state of affairs in the world. Your ignorance is so glaring, I doubt you'll be able to appreciate the reality unless it's spoonfed to you the same way the neo-con misinformation that you're spilling here was. Nevermind, your puny mind will never reach beyond the ultra-simplistic stories of good and evil. And don't use prodigious words. You're not fooling anyone.

[hodensaft]

Terrorists can only kill me, and maybe you. They can't kill us all, they can't shred our constitution, and they can't take away everything our country has stood for for over 200 years. Only we can do that. And this week, we did.

[garethcn2]

I think you misunderstand the point. This has nothing to do with denial - no one would deny radical Islam poses a threat, the point is that threat should not make America weaken it's own citizens' rights, especially one's so obviously important.

[scotchscotch]

What "right" specifically has been compromised? I ask not out of facetiousness but in earnest. The "right" to privacy? The right that an accused criminal be subject to due process of law? If its the second then how has this compromised it? No name calling like wawul. Please educate me.

[garethcn2]

Ok, e.g habeas corpus, the right not to be imprisoned indefinitely without trial. The clamp down on the right to question government now deemed un-American - this rings of McCarthyism. Amending the freedom of information act and withholding information from the public/congress/courts etc.. The nullification of the Whistleblower Protection Act for employees of the new department. These are all examples of important individual rights and they ort to be safeguarded

[scotchscotch]

Gareth, I took your challenge & researched this. While important, habeas corpus may be an anachronism that should be REFINED TO COUNTER A SAVVY & RUTHLESS ENEMY. Although I love America, our system of government is not yet perfect - we're still a young country. Moreover, we have imperfect & shifting definitions of words like "war", "enemy combatant" etc.

The technology to change this towards pure logic may be soon at hand. KO is nothing but a demagogue.

[jayraskin]

Wow, powerful stuff.

[nesterhaus]

This guy is whack-Paranoid and fearful

[Barnekkid]

Takes one to know one.

[ayajedi]

What he said was quite profound and quite scary!

[aprilawz]

I'm not a legal scholar by any stretch of the imagination, but could't it be taken to the courts and struck down that way?

I'm also a long-time fan, and this guy just keeps getting better and better. It's a shame that so few journalists have the testicular fortitude to do what he's doing...what needs to be done! Of course, it's so much easier to hide behind stories about Madonna buying a baby...ugh!

[skevimc]

Keith Olbermann has become my favorite news editorialist.

My question though is, so what can we do about it? Seriously, what can we do about it? Anything? A march on Washington? Impeachment?

[debck]

Vote. As a democratic nation, (while we still are) that is our last recourse.

[themerrill]

Not much. Go for the courts, my bet is the ACLU is already working on it. Just hope the new Supreme Court doesn't back Bush

[robopad]

themerrill: The ACLU is a joke, there the ones that protect all those terrorist, every ACLU card carrying idiot should be sent to club gitmo.

[themerrill]

robopad: Funny you should phrase it like that, because with the military commissions act that would be possible. Maybe if you were able to pull your eyes away from Fox (Faux) News for a couple of minutes and think for yourself, you would see how much trouble we are in right now. The ACLU protects the liberties of everyone because if liberties can be taken from one person, they could be taken from anyone. I wonder what your position would be if you ended up water-borded at Gitmo...

[robopad]

themerrill: Before the 9/11 terrorist attacks, I bet you never heard of waterboarding.

[themerrill]

robopad: No I hadn't, but I have my doubts that you had either. And if that is your only response to the several points I brought up in my last comment, thats sad

[robopad]

themerrill: maybe if you open your eyes ,you would see how much trouble the terrrorist pose, outside of the terrorist everyones rights are still entact. I think the odds are much better of you being beheaded by terrorist, then I ending up at gitmo.

[themerrill]

Part 2-My eyes are open and I am aware of the threat the terrorists pose. The odds of me being killed in a terrorist act are about 1 in 88,000 (odds for a car crash: 1 in 81)(source: CDC/National Safety Council.). I couldn't find the odds for being beheaded by terrorists. If I flew once a month the odds of me being killed in a 9/11 style attack would be about 1 in 55,000,000. But I would agree with your statement, as long as you continue to worship this administration you aren't going to Gitmo.

[themerrill]

Part 1-Robopad: First off, you are actually not responding to the points I bring up, you are inventing new ones and throwing the word 'terrorist' often. May I start calling you Tony Snow?

Even if one is not a terrorist, their liberties are still infringed. Our CIA had kidnapped several innocent people off the streets of Europe and sent them to other countries for interrogation. They were released with no charges. So tell me, were they terrorists or not? Did they have any rights infringed upon?

[blahinhawaii]

I'm sorry but discussing that or any other government wrongdoing would violate the "state secrets" protections invoked by the CIA, NSA, FBI, Homeland Security and the Bush Administration. The ACLU attempted to take the government to court for the kidnapping and torture of "HE WHO MUST NOT BE NAMED" and found that the courts support the feds right to abduct and torture innocents with impunity if they invoke the "state secrets" protection.

[blahinhawaii]

The terrorists PLAN was to rob america of her most cherished freedoms and destroy the cornerstones of democracy.

The targets were always privacy, habeus corpus, oversight, accountability, checks and balances, warrants, the bill of rights...we have handed them their victory...that was all they wanted.

Every "lost Padilla interrogation video," every "state secret" invocation to coverup wrongdoing quickens the fall of the republic.

[pacerman2010]

haha i would be first in line in the march on washington! vote to impeach the president!