Reps and corp jerks: The Obama plan hopes to offer a public option, it's called competition, the thing Republicans claim to support. It's what you have in a truly free market, you have choices, and if the people choose the public option the private Insurance companies will have to lower their prices to compete, or they go out of business. That's called a free market: what part of that do you not understand?
(1) LIMITATION ON NEW ENROLLMENT- (A) IN GENERAL- Except as provided in this paragraph, the individual health insurance issuer offering such coverage does not enroll any individual in such coverage if the first effective date of coverage is on or after the first day of Y1.
Real good option there. you can't get new insurance after the program starts.
I know it's a waste of time to talk to you, because you're irrational and you don't care about truth (or you wouldn't have made it to this age still adhering to your wrong philosophies). But for the benefit of others reading: When one "company" [the govt] has a monopoly on the use of force and can control all the other companies, it isn't a free market or competition. The govt is not allowed to compete with the private sector. Forcing some people to pay for others is SOCIALISM.
It takes a rocket scientist to do stitches? I think not a nurse is well capable. I don't know why you envy Socialized health car as I've said before I've had it and its crap.
Now you're claiming nurses can't do stitches in a socialized system?
Sigh, you clearly don't get it, and you probably never will, so this conversation is done. I've taken up way too much space with my comments already. And I hope for your sake you never end up in a situation where you need medical help but can't afford it.
I'm sorry you are on the wrong end of a defective system. But if you think your father would have gotten the quality of care from a socialized system your sorely mistaken. He would have been placed on a list in order of how bad his condition was and would only have gotten treated if it worsened drastically for many that decision comes to late. You may have big bills but at least he's still alive.
Removing federal regulations? You mean go back to the "good old days" when any quack could claim to be a doctor and there was no oversight? Encouraging competition? Right, let's shop around for the doctor who is willing to perform my gall bladder surgery the cheapest. Real choices? I don't know a thing about medicine. How would I be qualified to make a choice on what type of treatment is appropriate? Make our health care system the envy of the world? You mean like socialized ones?
thats quite a rant very little of which is making any sense. I'm sorry you think the government should over see health care considering the mess they've made of most everything else. I'm sorry you don't like competition thats whats driven America successful and is slowly being destroyed piece by piece. I don't even know where the cheapest doctor comment could come from but the fact that you think the world will end if we don't socialize medicine shows the state of mind you've been put in.
Competition is what made America successful? Really? Gee, here I thought it was things like liberty, justice, and equality.
I suppose I could tell you about how my parents almost lost their house (they still might) because my step-dad got laid off and lost his insurance when the company he worked for shut down, and later he had to get quintuple bypass surgery and there were complications, and the bills totaled over $100,000. But I'm sure you're fine with that, you know, free-market and all.
Here's how we fix this. 1.Make all medical expenses tax deductible. 2.Eliminating federal regulations that discourage small businesses from providing coverage. 3.Giving doctors the freedom to collectively negotiate with insurance companies and drive down the cost of medical care. 4. aking every American eligible for a Health Savings Account (HSA), and removing the requirement that individuals must obtain a high-deductible insurance policy before opening an HSA.
Or better yet, eliminate the profit motive. Get rid of advertising and marketing for drug companies and completely eliminate medical insurance companies, their PR and marketing departments, and all the administrators involved. Socialize drug companies and divert research toward cures, not chemical treatments. And last, but not least, allow doctors to make decisions based on what is best for the patient, not what the patient can afford or what the insurance company will allow.
Look few people realize that Congress forced Health Maintenance Organizations (HMOs) on us. Now, the Food and Drug Administration's bias toward large pharmaceutical companies enlarges their power. The federal government will not suddenly become efficient managers if universal health care is instituted. Government health care only means long waiting periods, lack of choice, poor quality, and frustration. I can attest to this first hand.
I agree that HMOs are bad. But the beauty of having socialized health care is that we can change it. With a private, free-market system, we're stuck with whatever is available. And there are certain things that the free market won't do, such as researching treatments and cures for rare diseases, because it's not cost-effective. So that means people will needlessly suffer and die.
And don't get me started on the whole issue of vertical monopolies.
As for the poor. Driving down the price of health care is the first step in getting the poor access to the health system. Nothing should be free. Giving people things makes them lazy and they begin to expect hand outs. The 15-20 million immigrants you seem to be in favor of are a part of the problem. Already receiving treatment on a whim due to current rules they are taxing the system and help drive prices up.
Right. Because the 50 million Americans without insurance and those 100 million Americans with inadequate insurance are "lazy" and simply want a "hand out".
Have it your way. The next time your house is on fire, get out there with a garden hose and put out your own damn fire. Nothing should be free, right? You wouldn't want the socialized, government-run fire department to interfere with the free market, right?
BTW, scapegoating immigrants for the cost of health care is a pretty low move.
3. Health care is not a right nor should it be. You can only believe that if you want to socialize health care and give it to everyone. Health care can be made much more affordable if we a) Only use catastrophic insurance and pay for things like doctors visits ourselves. b) allow nurses to perform many of the procedures they have to observe and are well capable of doing i.e I don't have to pay a surgeon $3000 for 10 stitches. c) Allow more doctors into the field (currently highly resricted)
When did i say let poor people die? Your assumption that Health care needs to be a right for poor people to get health care is quite a leap in logical thinking.
I'd be surprised if you knew anything about Ron Paul and no pointing out that I am a supporter of his simply isn't good enough to win a debate. At least not when there are sensible people around.
Ron Paul wants to round up 15-20 million "illegals"; is against NAFTA and WTO but hypocritically embraces domestic free market policies including gutting wage, safety, and environmental protections; plans on doing nothing about climate change; wants to cut corporate tax (I guess CEOs don't earn enough); is anti-choice, anti-gay marriage, and anti-separation of church and state.
Can we get back to discussing health care? Specifically, what about people who can't afford it? Too bad for them?
First off... Eh? Theres a whole load of information selectively left out of your description of Ron Paul on every single topic you posted. But as an example lets take one. Ron Paul is not anti-choice he's Pro-life. While I disagree with him on this subject I think he's right in that it should be the states that make the decision on this. Why should people in the Bible Belt be forced to live in states where the majority want abortion?
"Why should people in the Bible Belt be forced to live in states where the majority want abortion?"
Because the majority can be wrong. Not too long ago a majority in the Bible Belt wanted segregation. Before that, those states wanted slavery, and we ended up fighting a civil war.
Besides, claiming states rights is a way to get out of taking a stand on anything controversial.
Regardless, I'm done discussing Ron Paul. Let's stick with health care.
You want to give the power hungry wealthy the opportunity to run more of your life. Common sense says that if you give this government control of health care they will run it into the ground just like they have done with the school system. Everyone will have health care but it will be poor health care. Doesn't it make more sense to keep the standard of health care we have and find a way for everyone to have it? If so socialized health care ain't the way to go.
The "power hungry wealthy" already run the health care insurance and pharmaceutical companies. We already have "poor health care" with 50 million uninsured and 100 million under-insured Americans, yet we still pay more per capita.
Government is what we make it (for the people, by the people). If we elect people who are incompetent (Bush) or want to underfund government programs to justify privatization (Bush), we'll get mismanagement and incompetence (e.g. the FEMA response to Katrina).
"Power hungry and Wealthy" Do not run healthcare they as you've pointed out run specific areas of it. People "not having healthcare" and "People having poor healthcare" are two seperate issues. There are many reasons health care costs so much all of which are fixable without moving to socialized health care.
If you believe that this government is by the people you're deluded. 70% of Americans want out of Iraq yet the government persists. Who did cheney work for before becomig Vp? Bush? etc.
Whenever there's profit to be made, there's going to be "power hungry wealthy" involved. At least with socialized medicine, we have some say in it (our vote).
I never said this particular administration is by the people. But this only because we keep electing people who don't care about us or this country, not because government itself is flawed.
Health care should be a right, not a luxury for those who can afford it or are lucky enough to have good coverage. Do you disagree with that?
1. We can have our say by spending OUR money at the payment counter as opposed to them deciding who OUR money should go to.
2. In the past century psychology gained great credibility and once discovered has been used to manipulate the public. With the emergence of the TV it gave the few with a very clear agenda the chance to push the masses in the direction they want to go. The strong preying on the weak if you will. The have the knowledge and are abusing it.
I like the message, I like the bill. I like one less thing that makes people wage slaves. I like being able to say "fuck you" to an awful boss without worrying about my health insurance.
That was one of the best fusions of humor with politics that I've seen since, well last night when I watched "The Daily Show" with Jon Stewart. This commercial is right up there with the best of them!
Reps and corp jerks: The Obama plan hopes to offer a public option, it's called competition, the thing Republicans claim to support. It's what you have in a truly free market, you have choices, and if the people choose the public option the private Insurance companies will have to lower their prices to compete, or they go out of business. That's called a free market: what part of that do you not understand?
clusterfacker 2 years ago
(1) LIMITATION ON NEW ENROLLMENT- (A) IN GENERAL- Except as provided in this paragraph, the individual health insurance issuer offering such coverage does not enroll any individual in such coverage if the first effective date of coverage is on or after the first day of Y1.
Real good option there. you can't get new insurance after the program starts.
damascis 2 years ago
I know it's a waste of time to talk to you, because you're irrational and you don't care about truth (or you wouldn't have made it to this age still adhering to your wrong philosophies). But for the benefit of others reading: When one "company" [the govt] has a monopoly on the use of force and can control all the other companies, it isn't a free market or competition. The govt is not allowed to compete with the private sector. Forcing some people to pay for others is SOCIALISM.
DominicMetal1979 2 years ago
An interesting take.
thelyniezian 3 years ago
It takes a rocket scientist to do stitches? I think not a nurse is well capable. I don't know why you envy Socialized health car as I've said before I've had it and its crap.
Mazz1916 3 years ago
Now you're claiming nurses can't do stitches in a socialized system?
Sigh, you clearly don't get it, and you probably never will, so this conversation is done. I've taken up way too much space with my comments already. And I hope for your sake you never end up in a situation where you need medical help but can't afford it.
subtlefuge 3 years ago
I'm sorry you are on the wrong end of a defective system. But if you think your father would have gotten the quality of care from a socialized system your sorely mistaken. He would have been placed on a list in order of how bad his condition was and would only have gotten treated if it worsened drastically for many that decision comes to late. You may have big bills but at least he's still alive.
Mazz1916 3 years ago
By removing federal regulations, encouraging competition, and presenting real choices, we can make our health care system the envy of the world.
Let me ask you a question. How do you think this government is doing? Do you think these guys are looking out for us?
Mazz1916 3 years ago
Removing federal regulations? You mean go back to the "good old days" when any quack could claim to be a doctor and there was no oversight? Encouraging competition? Right, let's shop around for the doctor who is willing to perform my gall bladder surgery the cheapest. Real choices? I don't know a thing about medicine. How would I be qualified to make a choice on what type of treatment is appropriate? Make our health care system the envy of the world? You mean like socialized ones?
subtlefuge 3 years ago
thats quite a rant very little of which is making any sense. I'm sorry you think the government should over see health care considering the mess they've made of most everything else. I'm sorry you don't like competition thats whats driven America successful and is slowly being destroyed piece by piece. I don't even know where the cheapest doctor comment could come from but the fact that you think the world will end if we don't socialize medicine shows the state of mind you've been put in.
Mazz1916 3 years ago
Competition is what made America successful? Really? Gee, here I thought it was things like liberty, justice, and equality.
I suppose I could tell you about how my parents almost lost their house (they still might) because my step-dad got laid off and lost his insurance when the company he worked for shut down, and later he had to get quintuple bypass surgery and there were complications, and the bills totaled over $100,000. But I'm sure you're fine with that, you know, free-market and all.
subtlefuge 3 years ago
Here's how we fix this. 1.Make all medical expenses tax deductible. 2.Eliminating federal regulations that discourage small businesses from providing coverage. 3.Giving doctors the freedom to collectively negotiate with insurance companies and drive down the cost of medical care. 4. aking every American eligible for a Health Savings Account (HSA), and removing the requirement that individuals must obtain a high-deductible insurance policy before opening an HSA.
Mazz1916 3 years ago
Or better yet, eliminate the profit motive. Get rid of advertising and marketing for drug companies and completely eliminate medical insurance companies, their PR and marketing departments, and all the administrators involved. Socialize drug companies and divert research toward cures, not chemical treatments. And last, but not least, allow doctors to make decisions based on what is best for the patient, not what the patient can afford or what the insurance company will allow.
subtlefuge 3 years ago
Look few people realize that Congress forced Health Maintenance Organizations (HMOs) on us. Now, the Food and Drug Administration's bias toward large pharmaceutical companies enlarges their power. The federal government will not suddenly become efficient managers if universal health care is instituted. Government health care only means long waiting periods, lack of choice, poor quality, and frustration. I can attest to this first hand.
Mazz1916 3 years ago
I agree that HMOs are bad. But the beauty of having socialized health care is that we can change it. With a private, free-market system, we're stuck with whatever is available. And there are certain things that the free market won't do, such as researching treatments and cures for rare diseases, because it's not cost-effective. So that means people will needlessly suffer and die.
And don't get me started on the whole issue of vertical monopolies.
subtlefuge 3 years ago
As for the poor. Driving down the price of health care is the first step in getting the poor access to the health system. Nothing should be free. Giving people things makes them lazy and they begin to expect hand outs. The 15-20 million immigrants you seem to be in favor of are a part of the problem. Already receiving treatment on a whim due to current rules they are taxing the system and help drive prices up.
Mazz1916 3 years ago
Right. Because the 50 million Americans without insurance and those 100 million Americans with inadequate insurance are "lazy" and simply want a "hand out".
Have it your way. The next time your house is on fire, get out there with a garden hose and put out your own damn fire. Nothing should be free, right? You wouldn't want the socialized, government-run fire department to interfere with the free market, right?
BTW, scapegoating immigrants for the cost of health care is a pretty low move.
subtlefuge 3 years ago
3. Health care is not a right nor should it be. You can only believe that if you want to socialize health care and give it to everyone. Health care can be made much more affordable if we a) Only use catastrophic insurance and pay for things like doctors visits ourselves. b) allow nurses to perform many of the procedures they have to observe and are well capable of doing i.e I don't have to pay a surgeon $3000 for 10 stitches. c) Allow more doctors into the field (currently highly resricted)
Mazz1916 3 years ago
"Health care is not a right nor should it be."
Great idea! Let's let poor people die if they can't afford surgery!
A Ron Paul supporter. I should have known.
subtlefuge 3 years ago
When did i say let poor people die? Your assumption that Health care needs to be a right for poor people to get health care is quite a leap in logical thinking.
I'd be surprised if you knew anything about Ron Paul and no pointing out that I am a supporter of his simply isn't good enough to win a debate. At least not when there are sensible people around.
So lets have it. What are Ron Pauls Policies?
Mazz1916 3 years ago
Ron Paul wants to round up 15-20 million "illegals"; is against NAFTA and WTO but hypocritically embraces domestic free market policies including gutting wage, safety, and environmental protections; plans on doing nothing about climate change; wants to cut corporate tax (I guess CEOs don't earn enough); is anti-choice, anti-gay marriage, and anti-separation of church and state.
Can we get back to discussing health care? Specifically, what about people who can't afford it? Too bad for them?
subtlefuge 3 years ago
First off... Eh? Theres a whole load of information selectively left out of your description of Ron Paul on every single topic you posted. But as an example lets take one. Ron Paul is not anti-choice he's Pro-life. While I disagree with him on this subject I think he's right in that it should be the states that make the decision on this. Why should people in the Bible Belt be forced to live in states where the majority want abortion?
Mazz1916 3 years ago
"Why should people in the Bible Belt be forced to live in states where the majority want abortion?"
Because the majority can be wrong. Not too long ago a majority in the Bible Belt wanted segregation. Before that, those states wanted slavery, and we ended up fighting a civil war.
Besides, claiming states rights is a way to get out of taking a stand on anything controversial.
Regardless, I'm done discussing Ron Paul. Let's stick with health care.
subtlefuge 3 years ago
-- USA is ready for Universal Health CARE ....
aviomaster 3 years ago
Affordable health care yes. Socialized Helathcare no f***ing way.
Mazz1916 3 years ago
Why not?
subtlefuge 3 years ago
You want to give the power hungry wealthy the opportunity to run more of your life. Common sense says that if you give this government control of health care they will run it into the ground just like they have done with the school system. Everyone will have health care but it will be poor health care. Doesn't it make more sense to keep the standard of health care we have and find a way for everyone to have it? If so socialized health care ain't the way to go.
Mazz1916 3 years ago
The "power hungry wealthy" already run the health care insurance and pharmaceutical companies. We already have "poor health care" with 50 million uninsured and 100 million under-insured Americans, yet we still pay more per capita.
Government is what we make it (for the people, by the people). If we elect people who are incompetent (Bush) or want to underfund government programs to justify privatization (Bush), we'll get mismanagement and incompetence (e.g. the FEMA response to Katrina).
subtlefuge 3 years ago
"Power hungry and Wealthy" Do not run healthcare they as you've pointed out run specific areas of it. People "not having healthcare" and "People having poor healthcare" are two seperate issues. There are many reasons health care costs so much all of which are fixable without moving to socialized health care.
If you believe that this government is by the people you're deluded. 70% of Americans want out of Iraq yet the government persists. Who did cheney work for before becomig Vp? Bush? etc.
Mazz1916 3 years ago
Whenever there's profit to be made, there's going to be "power hungry wealthy" involved. At least with socialized medicine, we have some say in it (our vote).
I never said this particular administration is by the people. But this only because we keep electing people who don't care about us or this country, not because government itself is flawed.
Health care should be a right, not a luxury for those who can afford it or are lucky enough to have good coverage. Do you disagree with that?
subtlefuge 3 years ago
1. We can have our say by spending OUR money at the payment counter as opposed to them deciding who OUR money should go to.
2. In the past century psychology gained great credibility and once discovered has been used to manipulate the public. With the emergence of the TV it gave the few with a very clear agenda the chance to push the masses in the direction they want to go. The strong preying on the weak if you will. The have the knowledge and are abusing it.
Mazz1916 3 years ago
great commercial
phlezk 3 years ago
Wage Slaves unite!
notque 3 years ago 2
I like the message, I like the bill. I like one less thing that makes people wage slaves. I like being able to say "fuck you" to an awful boss without worrying about my health insurance.
pumajones1983 3 years ago 5
That was one of the best fusions of humor with politics that I've seen since, well last night when I watched "The Daily Show" with Jon Stewart. This commercial is right up there with the best of them!
p911sux 3 years ago 3
This is an exceptional video. Will share it with all our Sheila Kuehl - SB 840 supporters here in the Pasadena, CA area!
pbriggsiam 3 years ago 3
Awesome - this has been needed for so phucking long!!!!!!!!!
Guaranteed every Rethuglican goat phucker will be against it.
bigringabuser 3 years ago 4
That is the coolest commercial I have seen in a long time! Ron Wyden, you rule! Thank you for serving us here in Oregon so well.
macman851 3 years ago 3