Past & Future Climate change pt 3 of 4

[xPHOENIX269x]

Why do the graphs show a '1970's cooling scare' when there never was one?

[RationalRoundtable]

@xPHOENIX269x

um... were you around in the 70's? I remember the scare very well. it was just as bad as the currant 'global warming' scare.

[xPHOENIX269x]

@RationalRoundtable No, that was media hype. Most papers written on climate change related to C02 emmissions were that a warming trend would happen if C02 was released into the atmosphere faster than its removle through natural cycles.

[RationalRoundtable]

@xPHOENIX269x

Dude... I do not know how old you are... but all the experts on climate in the 70's were quite convinced that we were about to enter into a new ice age, just like today many of the experts are saying that the world is going to overheat. Also can you explain why the CO2 levels were behind the warming trends of the past? should not the CO2 come first if CO2 is the cause as many global warming panic speakers state?

[xPHOENIX269x]

@RationalRoundtable I grew up in the 70's. I remember the made for t.v. movies on how the world was going to freeze and how the environment was going to have an upheavel then colapse buy the 90's but I was just a kid. But here look at this vid "XB3S0fnOr0M". By actually counting how many papers were written and what conclusions they came to, you can really tell what the scientists were thinking about. And "hWJeqgG3Tl8" this vid will answer the temp leads the C02 argument.

[RationalRoundtable]

@xPHOENIX269x

interesting videos, so your friend the cartoonist activist does a great job of quote-mining and strawmanning.

I laughed out loud when he said that nobody is saying that CO2 is the primary cause of warming, then spends the rest of the video explaining this... but if you watch some of his other videos he constantly is suggesting that CO2 is the primary problem.

also very good selective quote mining for the 70's video... this guy is a great propagandist. Top notch.

[xPHOENIX269x]

@RationalRoundtable You missed the point. The natural cycles of ice age and expansive temperate zones is due to axial wobble, orbital change, solar output and so on. But at this current time those factors are not in major effect. So based on the collection of all the data the best scientific explanation for air and sea temp rise is due to the atmospheric increase of C02. As for the other vid, go and look up all the papes written on climate change and count the conclusions your self......

[xPHOENIX269x]

@RationalRoundtable And as for your 'other' comments, I find it below you based on what your vids show. Ad hominem attacks are no place for a 'roundtable' discussion.

[RationalRoundtable]

@xPHOENIX269x

Well, I thank you for the back handed complement, but I must disagree... what ad hominem? This guy on his own page claims to be a cartoonist, and an activist, and his arguments boil down to strawman and quote-mining. I am not suggesting that CO2 emissions are a good thing if you look over my comments I never suggested that. I also do not suggest that climate change is not real, again look over my comments. Even if his 70's video is 100% accurate it does not change the facts...

[RationalRoundtable]

@Part 2

According to the cartoonist, C02 is not the cause of Global warming, but it MIGHT amplify the natural effects, this is contrary to almost every other video about Global Warming out there including Al Gore and the cartoonist's other videos.

But all that is beside the point, in the 70's there was a big trend suggesting that cooling was about to thrust us into an ice age, the cartoonist simply dismisses the primary report as being vague... it was not.

[RationalRoundtable]

@Part 3

Even if as you suggest it was all just media hype, one could say the same thing today... sure you can cite papers that suggest warming, but the scientific community is hardly monolithic about this, and has a very poor track record when it comes to predicting things of this nature. Also I find the simple dismissal of Sunspots as a factor to be someone arrogant.

but as they say, only time will tell.

[xPHOENIX269x]

@RationalRoundtable Who cares what the media decides to, and it puts for global climate change science and reports. Climate scientist mostly agree that increased C02 will affect the earth, but as to how is the major debate. As for sunspots, I say that because many of the climate-deniers claim this to be a major factor. The Sun has been at it's lowest activity beyond it's 11 yr cycle but the average global temp has been on the rise, with this summer to be extremely warmer than norm.

[xPHOENIX269x]

@RationalRoundtable I thought the term was 'left-handed pat on the back'? Anyway, you further try and discredit him, not my friend, by merely calling him a cartoonist. His description states that is only part of it. As for his 70's vid, if he is 100% accurate then there was no gobal cooling proposed by the majority of the scientific body at that time.

[RationalRoundtable]

@xPHOENIX269x

Well, the scare was real, even if the science was exaggerated. Also I would not say that I am trying to discredit him, rather point out that he is no more an 'expert' than you or I, he is as man with an agenda who created a YouTube channel, hardly unique. I am not saying he does not believe what he is saying... but while his videos are well produced, they are hardly proof of anything except that he knows how to created propaganda... again not an insult...

[RationalRoundtable]

@Part 2

propaganda is simply opinionated media that tries to sway your opinion... I mean it in the technical sense, not as a insult.

also you do realise that even he in his videos says that you cannot gauge the global trend based on short term events, so by his own standard, your statement, "...this summer to be extremely warmer than norm..." is meaningless.

[xPHOENIX269x]

@RationalRoundtable You are trying to dicredit him by calling him just a cartoonist, saying he strawmans and just quote mines. He is more of an expert than you or I because he actually reads the boring reports. You and I draw our conclusions from what trickles down to us from the many spigots of information. And calling his vids just propoganda is an insult since that word's connotation is a negative one. And forgive any mispellings, not a strong point here.

[RationalRoundtable]

@xPHOENIX269x

First, I am dyslexic so you could misspell every word and I likely will not notice :)

Second, The reason I use the term propaganda is because it accurately describes his videos, not because of the connotation. I tend to view all propaganda with a grain of salt because I know it is biased, unbiased documentary videos or films are very rare these days. Ray Comfort, Michael Moore, Al Gore and many others are skilled at producing propaganda.

Third

[RationalRoundtable]

@part 2

This video we are commenting on is NOT propaganda because the video makers do not seem to have an apparent agenda, however the man speaking is a propagandist as he is not just sating facts, but attempting to spin in the opposite direction.

[RationalRoundtable]

@Part 3

I tend to be quite skeptical of any and all 'science' videos that try to convince you of something especially if there is a political agenda behind it.

finaly, do not assume that I do not ever look at the 'boring reports' I have read several studies, in fact my sister works for the USGS in Alaska and we have had a few interesting conversations on things like permafrost melt and the ice caps.

[markcrisp07]

so he admits Co2 does increase tempertaure? Because all these other "anti GW" are saying Co2 has no effect on temperature at all....

"Increased Co2 is somethong we can only dream about..." He lost all credibility on this one...

[andharvey8]

We shoud make the entire US Congress sit down and watch this, and have the electorate give them a pop-quiz afterwards to make sure they were paying attention to the lecture.

[MarkusKellow]

The correlation between cloud cover and cosmic rays is interesting.

[Kellanon06]

this man isn't a scientist

[Bushvision]

Define a scientist & you might be surprised

[shire2005]

The man is a geologist and very qualified for the topic.

Liberals who believe in the GW fraud are mystified by people with no scientific credentials like Al Gore or Barry Obama who don't even have undergraduate courework in the sciences beyond the freshman level.

[DoubleJMG]

The graphic on CO2 levels and plant growth should be a kick in the crotch to greens. Shouldn't they know that?

[jhg3]

Finally the truth!!