why do you use the same N.t. that the PEOPLE THAT DEFENDED THE DOCTRINE OF THE TRINITY AND DIED DEFENDING INSTITUTED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Athanasius, cappadocian fathers, EVERY ONE THAT IS INFLUENCIAL
"Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist that denieth the father and the son." 1 John (2:22). "The only begotten son, which is in the bosom of the father, he hath declared him." John (1:18). Jesus Christ is truly God in the flesh and the scriptures prove this to be true! God dwelled inside of the man Christ, Amen...
I've heard it all and I've done the research, you're not telling me anything new. Perhaps you should look at both sides of the argument without any preconceptions and without an agenda except finding God's truth, rather than man's so called "truth".
As for responding to the video, I have a very long time ago. I am now just replying to your comments.
The Trinity doctrine is only man's attempt to explain the teachings that are found throughout scripture. Nowhere in the Bible is the concept clearly explained in a single statement. But that being said it doesn't make the concept void from biblical truth. I can show you many many scriptures where elements of the concept are spoken of, and just because you maybe able to put a different "interpretation" on them, that doesn't excuse them as evidences for the Trinity concept.
By me proving the Trinity concept to you from the Bible does not make it so. Just as you "proving" your beliefs to me doesn't make them so. Now unless YOU can DISPROVE the doctrine as a biblical teaching, then every objection you have to the doctrine is really just white noise.
So I challenge YOU to DISPROVE the Trinity doctrine from the Bible.
@sbgrox11 I will end with this, God created all things truth included. Your understanding is of a worldly truth. I repeat I speak of Godly truth which is only received through His Spirit. God tells me what is true not the other way around. Man from the beginning has corrupted this truth, to where people like you say truth can be found in many areas apart from God. Many have taken your view and listened to satan, disguised as truth, or to what they thought was true, but had no Spirit. Peace.
@sbgrox11 My friend truth is of God not men. It is not gathered by our worldly understanding, but understanding given us by God. There are hundreds of thousands of doctrines of men. Yet one God, and one way to God the man Jesus Christ. You say truth can come from demons what truth is that?
@sbgrox11 You speak of men. I speak of God has not God made the wisdom of this world foolishness? "Russel was right" Yet God tells us not to follow false prophets yet you do. Did you follow Hitler to?
@kopes13 I am always ready to make a reasoned defense of my faith, as the Bible exhorts. The fact is, the Trinity is indefensible. Most everyone knows that.
@ewatchmandotcom trinitariasn believe that jesus and the father are two different persons ..they are not the same. "so jesus didnt pray to himself ..HE PRAYED TO THE FATHER.. there is one eternal God but withing the being\essence of that one God there are three persons. makin relationship inherent whiting God himself. and since we are made in his image we also long for relationship:D so please accurately represent the believes you deny.
@ewatchmandotcom the Trinity means this and only this and nothing more - "There were 3 entities that were not created." I won't give the 3 entities labels or names here, but that can be objectively done.
@ewatchmandotcom one other point. When one talks about 'seeing' God or not, to have any meaning to this statement one has to define what they mean by 'see', and importantly not to change definitions sentence to sentence. 'Seeing' could mean 'comprehend / understand / consciously identify' or it could refer to 'photons exciting the retina and visual part of the brain'. These are different meanings. John 14:9 is the 1st meaning not the 2nd, John1:18 and Exodus is the 2nd meaning not the 1st etcetc
Jesus performed miracles with the authority of himself, apostles done it in the name of Jesus Christ. Jesus is the authority of every miracle, made by him or by apostles. But he is the source. All glory and praise goes to God and no one else, otherwise it is idolatry - elevating creation over creator. But Jesus is praised and glorified. He is either God or source of heresy and huge lair. And none besides God and God only deserves glory. You either mock his salvation or become idolater.
@qwaszasz You simply do not know the Scriptures. Jesus said that he did nothing of his own initiative, only his Father's will. Furthermore, Jesus stated that all authority had been given him. Jehovah gave him the power and authority he possess. Trinitarians have the amazing ability to see white and call it black, and vice-versa.
Trinitarian believers are the antichrist. Robert King, excellent video btw. I love all your videos and they made a lot of sense. I know some people on here does not accept the fact, the truth that trinitarians are the antichrist.
Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus; Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God; But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men; And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross. Where for God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name. (Immanuel) God with us.
@MrTimeinabottle This has got to be the dumbest translation of any verse. So, reading the context Paul was apparently exhorting the Phillippians to have the same attitude as Jesus and consider themselves to be God's equal too.
@ewatchmandotcom I find it sad that you cannot understand a single verse. Let this mind be in you, also in Christ Jesus, (comma) desribing who it is we should follow for we are not to follow mere men. (But made himself.....) showing us we are to follow God through Jesus the man.
No my friend we are not to think of ourselves as God, but are to follow God through the life and teachings of Jesus the man.
@MrTimeinabottle The passage in the version you cited says that Christians should have the mind of Christ, who thought it not robbery that he should be equal to God. You don't even have the slightest clue what you are implying. So, according to the KJV Christians should consider themselves equal to God. Not even the NIV mutilates the verse as badly as the King James. If you are going to read the Bible you should at least use one that is not so poorly translated.
@ewatchmandotcom I guess I should use your NWT, which your watchtower states as using a former catholc priest, who along with his wife a (spirit medium) got support for their translations.
Or lets look to what the founder of your watchtower stated in the july 1879 issue. "A truth presented by satan himself, is just as true as a truth stated by God. Accept truth wherever you find it no matter what it contradicts." I will stick with my translation, and not satan's.
I watched this video again... You are an OBVIOUS wolf in sheeps clothing. I would say a clueless dupe, but I believe you know exactly what you are doing.
Hey buddy boy... You aren't fooling anyone who's done their homework, pal. You are the antichrist here. And reading from a JW bible (New World Translation) holds NO water with with me. A version of the bible written by FOUR JW's, only one of which even CLAIMED to be a Greek Scholar, and WASN'T. The agenda of the New World Translation is the same agenda Satan has been pursuing from the beginning. To deny the divinity of the Lord Yahshua, which is CLEARLY depicted in most all bibles before 1900.
i pray that the Lord will one day unveil your eyes...the only reason we can be saved is because God himself became a man and died for our sins and drank the cup of His own wrath!
I found something interesting in Timothy 2:16-18, can you help me better explain how it may relate to possibly the Roman Catholic hierarchy, and other form of claims of following god's word, thanks :D
In the Bible "seven" signifies divine completeness or perfection in connection with God's purposes. Genesis 2:1-4. The number "six" signifies imperfection, something not normal, monstrous.
In Revelation there is SEVEN SPIRITS, SEVEN GOLDEN LAMPSTANDS, SEVEN STARS, SEVEN SEALS, SEVEN TRUMPET BLASTS, SEVEN THUNDERS, and SEVEN GOLDEN BOWLS = 7.
Currently there are over 7 million people soon to be in number 7,777,777 (7x7) who are a witness about God's name J-E-H-O-V-A-H 7 letters!
This is he that came by means of water and blood, Jesus Christ; not with the water only, but with the water and with the blood. And the spirit is that which is bearing witness, because the spirit is the truth. For there are three witness bearers, the spirit and the water and the blood, and the three are in agreement.
1st John 5:7-8 "For there are three that bear witness in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit, and these three are one."
That passage is NOT authentic. Those words only appear in five later manuscripts and are not found in any of the earlier New Testament texts. That verse is such an obvious forgery that even staunch Trinitarian scholars have been forced to admit as much. Among them are the publishers of the New King James translation and various study bibles.
Hi, I am happy that you answered back my comment, the thing realy matters to me is 607bc, they changed the history in order to make it fit to their 1914 theory, I agree that the Jesus prophecy was about the future not the past as you said, How should I understand their falsehood on the dates? They even changed the time when Lamentation was written, and some of the kings' reign, as a truth seeker ,that matters to me, we look for truth not form the truth....
What many Trinitarians do throughout the Christian Greek Scriptures, is that they replace "God" with Father. So in this way, they can say nobody has seen the Father. Or, they say that there is a "personal" distinction instead of a distinction between beings when the Bible has phrases such as "God and Jesus."
Substituting "Father" for "God" is a huge difference made out of theological necessity.
@ChadTheBerean Sure. 1 Timothy 5:21 is a good example of where Trinitarianism is forced to substitute "God" for "Father" out of theological necessity.
"I charge you before God and the Lord Jesus Christ and the elect angels that you observe these things without prejudice, doing nothing with partiality."
KNJV
"I charge you, in the sight of God and Christ Jesus and the elect angels, to keep these instructions without partiality, and to do nothing out of favoritism."
@ChadTheBerean Let me rephrase what I meant. Trinitarians are forced to interpret the text in light of Trinitarianism rather than what the text actually says. For example in 1 Timothy 5:21 there's a distinction between God, Jehovah and Jesus Christ. Clearly two different entities and beings. However, in Trinitarianism these are merely two distinct "persons" in the "godhead."
That is what I meant by substituting "Father" for "God."
@ChadTheBerean There should be worries. This is a prime example of one's theology interpreting the text rather than letting God's Word speak for itself.
I do not claim to believe in the Trinity. I do not hold a dogmatic view on it. If Jesus is not God, I am totally okay with that. If He is God, I am totally okay with that as well. One thing I know withh 100% certainty... He is my Savior.
@ChadTheBerean So are angels and Christians in the New Covenant, so that doesn't really prove much. Whether he's Jehovah incarnate or God's firstborn matters. It matters a lot. Because one of them is a false Christ which cannot offer true salvation and the other is the Scriptural Christ, the one who has sayings of everlasting life. Which ever one you accept as "Savior" is significant. I say that because ultimately, people's salvation may depend on this.
Yes, the Scriptural Christ is God manifested in the flesh. I'm just saying that if the Scriptures taught that He wasn't God, I'd be okay with that. But they don't, they clearly teach that He is God.
No, I said I believe Jesus is God. I don't like the word "Trinity", it's not found in Scripture. Also, when I use the word Trinity, you JW's think I worship some 3 headed beast I call God.
I am currently studying the Scriptures regarding the idea of the Trinity, so as of right this second, I'm on the fence.
Robert, is it your conviction that it is consistent for a monotheistic Jew living in the first century, who woke up every morning reciting the Shema (Deut. 6:4), to refer to someone other than Jehovah (namely, an exalted angel) as "The Lord of me and the God of me?" (John 20:28, KIT)
Precisely! Jehovah appointed his Son as the heir of all things. Jesus is to sit upon Jehovah's throne. He is not a competing deity. He temporarily will occupy the throne of God because Jehovah exalted his son to that position. It is God's will that all creatures in heaven on on earth obey his Son just as they would obey Jehovah. Disobey the Son and you disobey Jehovah. Jesus explained all that to the Jews. They didn't accept Jesus as Lord because they did not love Jesus' father who sent him.
Robert, if you think Jesus is a competing deity then you really are clueless about the teaching that Jesus is God.
It's a shame how you regularly seem to fuse together the Watchtower's teaching that Jesus is a god, with the strangest misconception of what you think the trinity doctrine is. This wouldn't be such a problem if you had a heart to listen to what others believe, problem is you don't seem to care whether you misrepresent others as long as you can win the argument.
The fact is you imply that we believe he is a competing deity.
The basis of the trinity isn't very complicated. Jesus is the Word of God in flesh.
By the word of the Lord the heavens were made, and by the breath of his mouth all their host. - Psalm 33:6
...so shall my word be that goes out from my mouth; it shall not return to me empty, but it shall accomplish that which I purpose, and shall succeed in the thing for which I sent it. - Isaiah 55:11
I imply that trinitarians believe that Jesus is a competing deity with himself? You remind me of goofy pup chasing its tail. I hope you succeed in catching it.
The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned. The spiritual person judges all things, but is himself to be judged by no one. For who has understood the mind of the Lord so as to instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ. - 1 Corinthians 2:14-16
You have got to be kidding, right? You are saying that the nonsensical trinity you espouse is a product of God's spirit? The burden is on you to prove it. Good luck with that. LOL
You don't even know what the trinity doctrine is, so how can you judge it?
All the proof is within the pages of the Bible. Your problem with interpreting scripture is you rely to on your own worldly wisdom.
Trust in the Lord with all your heart, and do not lean on your own understanding. In all your ways acknowledge him, and he will make straight your paths. Be not wise in your own eyes; fear the Lord, and turn away from evil. - Proverbs 3:5-7
And we have something more sure, the prophetic word, to which you will do well to pay attention as to a lamp shining in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts, knowing this first of all, that no prophecy of Scripture comes from someones own interpretation. For no prophecy was ever produced by the will of man, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit. - 2 Peter 1:19-21
Sure I know what the trinity doctrine is. It is nonsense. Unscriptural. Not a Bible teaching. But, like I say, if you believe it to be true than you are stuck with explaining it - not me. Why keeping whining that I misrepresent your trinity. Get out there man and proclaim the trinity. LOL
My life doesn't start and end around commenting on your misrepresentations. The trinity doctrine is not the forefront of the Gospel, but when opposition comes against it then I will defend it. Not because I am duty bound by my pastor, but because I am duty bound by the Word of God, because this teaching came to me through reading the Bible.
You say the doctrine it un-scriptural, PROVE IT.
I say Jesus is the Word of God and the Holy Spirit is his breath, PROVE ME WRONG.
Far from it. The very reason I comment on your videos is not because you are debunking what I believe, but because you misrepresent what I believe. You don't seem to have a clue what we believe. Just who are you trying to convince? Yourself?
What you do is the equivalent to me debunking what you believe by saying you don't even believe in Jesus. Then I don't both to listen when you correct me. Who would I be trying to convince?
I've spent the time learning what it is you believe, the least you can do is return the compliment. I'm not asking you to agree with what we believe, but as long as you misrepresent what we teach then you are proving nothing but your own desire for ignorance.
Like I said, you are free to explain the trinity. If you think I have misrepresented it then you really should present what trinitarians really believe. Why don't you do up a video response and set the record straight? It would at the very least be entertaining.
You must be a loner Mr. King since I don't think there are people out there who agree with you outside the WT. Unless you are still in and biting your tongue on restrictions which I don't think you are. This is a problem in my situation if I stay in
To be honest man I'm not interested in endorcing the trinity. But just as you argue that the 1914 doctrine is False........you say the Trinity is false also. these two doctrines are intregal for these two belief systems. This is quite a parodox and a double standard. P.S Robert, who are you associating with now?
The central doctrine of Christendom is the trinity. For example, anytime you see someone make a declaration of faith they always affirm their belief in the trinity.
No. It is a true statement. I am talking about what millions of deluded trinitarians believe. Not about your personal belief. The jesus-is-god doctrine has always been the centerpiece of churchianity.
Man is their own Antichrist without Satan's influence. I wondered if all we are in now would not be with Satan not existing? But then I thought about how Satan a perfect angel could corrupt his self without a influencing force. So he goes then no bad influence but the thought of him once good turning himself into bad makes it as though he can always be created unless Jehovah stops the Badness in Angel or man which bbrings me to question, Why is wasn't like that in the first place?
Without Satan's over-riding influence it is inconceivable that anyone in their right mind would have ever come up with the nonsensical theology of the trinity.
I was really making the point of there would be less confusion and misinterpretation if........there was direct statements in the bible. If Satan can use God's own word against him and use it to misdirect people and in the end destroy the majority. This creates a high percentage of lost lives in the end that boils down one bad decision made in the beginning by a pair of humans who decieved theirself along with help from Satan.
Philippians 2 "...but gave no consideration to a seizure..."
Wow, very strange wording in the NWT.
Most translations I've seen say, "...did not consider it robbery to be equal with God", which basically says Jesus is EQUAL with God because he didn't consider it to be stealing from God in being equal with God.
Consider the context Richard. Paul is exhorting Christians to have the same attitude that Jesus had. If you accept the KJV then each Christian should strive to be God's equal. Obviously that is not what Paul was saying. Not even the NIV mutilates the verse the way the KJV has. check it out:
"Who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be grasped..."
Clearly, the NIV states that Jesus did not seek to be God's equal, even though being in natural like God.
Believing that Jesus is God equals denying that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh?
I have a better idea. How about this: Believing that Jesus pre-earthly nature was as Michael the Archangel equals denying that Jesus has come in the flesh!
Christians believe Jesus came in the flesh, but JWs believe Jesus didn't exist UNTIL he came in the flesh, since he was Michael before!
Am I misrepresenting the JWs when I say that they believe Jesus was Michael before he became human?
JW's believe that Jesus had a pre-human existence. He wasn't called Jesus, of course. He was the Word, God's chief angel, Michael. That entity forsook his place in heaven as God's preeminent son and became flesh. When Jesus was on the earth the spirit person he had previously been did not exist.
But Jesus did exist before. He just wasn't called Jesus. Jesus was the name given him when he was born in Bethlehem. Prior to that Jesus existed as a spirit.
Another thing that annoys me is the "Son of God" label. This creates more problems cause if Jesus is the Son of God but then he is a god of the God which has created the sons of God through the son of god which makes them his sons. The God beget the son who begets the sons while creates the flesh brothers
In my opinion, All Jesus had to do to make it known that he is not his father was to simply state that without coming back with other statements that he and his father are the same. He should have just said "I am Jesus and My father who is the God is Jehovah." But thanks to these stupid languages and translations, we have this problem.
The problem is not languages or translations. The real problem is that the world is greatly influenced by a powerful creature whom Jesus said was a liar and murderer.
Of course, no one thinks they could possibly be under the spell of his lies, which is a secondary problem.
Why do people continue to believe that Jesus is God?? Because they believe what they hear from men and ignore what Jesus said about himself and his heavenly Father!
Not one of those verses make any mention of three god's in one or anything remotely connected with a trinity. It does demonstrate, though, how easily some people are brainwashed by flimsy arguments and "proof."
It is not a question of whether Jesus is good or evil. Jesus was crediting Jehovah as the source of his goodness. God is love, right? Does that mean that no one else in the universe expresses love? No, it means God is the personification of love. The man called Jesus "good teacher." But elsewhere Jesus said that what he taught was not his own. It was from his Father. So, neither did Jesus take credit for the things he taught nor did he accept worshipful accolades that belong to God.
Come on, tell us, what are you afraid of? Do you believe Jesus is good? Yes or No. It can't get any easier than this.
I must say your doing a good job of evading. However, it is making you look bad.
You are making a good case for someone sitting on the fence to run away from you as fast as they can. Just the opposite of what your religion expects of you.
@axsimulate Actually, no. I am not duty bound to answer your insincere questions. The apostle Paul specifically instructed us to turn down foolish and ignorant questions. So, that is what I am doing. Your question to me, as to whether in my opinion Jesus was good, can certainly be classified as a foolish question, born from your own ignorance and devious nature.
I see it's you duty to spread FUD and when somebody questions it, you run from them.
How is my question whether is Jesus is good foolish? After all Jehovah Witnesses are Christians right? And Christianity is all about Jesus, right? It's a perfectly legit question, you should be able to answer it without hesitation, yet you run from it. Why? How is it possible one simple question has you running scared? Here is your chance to glorify Jehovah and his son Jesus.
Oh, I see, calling me names now. Belittle those who disagree with you. Is this what Jehovah teaches? I'm sorry, I thought Jehovah taught love, kindness and understanding.
Guess what? As an ambassador to Jehovah. You just brought shame on Him, because you have shown your intolerance, judgement, evasiveness, lack of kindness and understanding. This is what people will see when they read your posts. Proof people should avoid this religion at all costs. Hide your head in the sand.
@axsimulate you are such a child....here you are tell people to grow a pair of whoknowswhat and you call yourself a man. I always say, "When a stupid question is ask, why should there be an answer?" So why would he answers your quote to make a point that is put in a form of a question? You really are not sincere, but rather starting fight. Very very unchristian.
@axsimulate I thought you said you were sincere? Now you admit that you were not. You just are trying to bait me and I am not taking the bait. Now you are whining and pouting that I am not like other people who would go for the bait. You are not very smart man.
Sincere? Who is being sincere and who is not? If you were sincere and open and truthful about your religion then you wouldn't be running from my question. And your running like a scared rabbit.
Your the one crying that I'm trying to trap you. Next you'll be crying "Persecution!" That is the modus operendi of religion.
If you are sincere about finding the truth, you would answer. But you can't handle the truth.
@axsimulate I am not running. I told you already. I am not answering your foolish and ignorant questions. If you were sincere I would be more than happy to. It is just that I know it is a baited question. I been doing this a long time.
Call it what you will, it doesn't change the fact that your running from it.
If you were truly honest with yourself you would answer it no matter the consequences. But you choose to hide behind your thinly veiled disguise. Your mendacious stance only affects you not me.
@axsimulate You obviously are greatly mentally challenged and cannot comprehend basic concepts. Or, if you do understand, then you are simply a dishonest person.
I will explain myself once again. I refuse to be baited by someone whose motives are as transparent as tissue paper. I answer people's questions all the time. However, I refuse to answer your stupid question.
And by the way, I do get the last word on this. From now on anything further from you goes straight into the trash. Get it?
Sure, from that verse it is clear that Jehovah and Jesus are in union. JW's whole-heartedly believe that, without doubt. And at John 17:20 Jesus stated that his followers would eventually be one with them as well. Read it.
Well, if all of Jesus' followers are going to be one with God and Jesus than that is a lot more than three. God is apparently made of of thousands and thousands of different deities. LOL
Funny you would mention that, that is precisely the direction that the Ancient Greeks were heading with their belief is their Gods with Zeus being the one true God. It is believed that is how Judaism evolved which is the basis for Christianity and Islam.
With that said, do you believe that Jesus and Jehovah are both Gods?
John 1:1; 1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
John 1:14; And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us (and we beheld his glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father), full of grace and truth.
Again this is from the original Jehovah Wittness Bible.
So there are many antichrists, I agree, but Robert, don't you think that when the World Government (via UN / 8th King) arrives, there will be a single, powerful human leader of that world empire (someone like Nimrod or Nebuchadnezzar) - that person would surely be THE ANTICHRIST?
Yes. John referred to the coming antichrist (singular) and numerous antichrists that originated from within the congregation. The coming antichrist emerges as the man of lawlessness within the spiritual temple of God during the conclusion. That is ultimately what John was referring to when he wrote of the last hour.
Jesus had various bodies after being resurrected. I don't remember that being taught by the FDS. I'm gonna look that up. He appear in a different body with similar marks from being impaled just to appease one person. Thinking about this stuff is quite perplexing. You really have to imply stuff cause it is not black and white. This stuff sounds like SciFi
Actually, scifi stole their idea from the Bible. Creatures being teleported trough space and materializing from another dimension. That's Bible To clear up your confusion why not take the time to read the 4 Gospel accounts of Jesus post-resurrection appearances. It is only a few pages altogether.
You are certain to take note of the fact that on several occasions the disciples did not even recognize Jesus. He looked different each time he materialized. And yes, the WT teaches this very thing.
No. You didn't quite get the message. Those who believe that Jesus was 100% flesh and !00% divine have been deceived by antichrists. If you teach such a doctrine you are an antichrist.
During Jesus time on earth he was a mere man. He had emptied himself of his divinity and became flesh. He was not a god/man. He was a godly man.
As for those resurrected in the spirit? Jesus is the only one raised in the spirit, so far anyway. That is why he is called the firstborn from the dead.
Jesus materialized various bodies on numerous occasions, all of them different from each other. Jesus materialized a body with wound marks because Thomas had declared that he would never believe unless he could see and feel the wounds. So, Jesus kindly accommodated him.
why do you use the same N.t. that the PEOPLE THAT DEFENDED THE DOCTRINE OF THE TRINITY AND DIED DEFENDING INSTITUTED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Athanasius, cappadocian fathers, EVERY ONE THAT IS INFLUENCIAL
Jesusisthetreeoflife 2 weeks ago
"Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up." John (2:19)
thediciple2011 2 months ago
"Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist that denieth the father and the son." 1 John (2:22). "The only begotten son, which is in the bosom of the father, he hath declared him." John (1:18). Jesus Christ is truly God in the flesh and the scriptures prove this to be true! God dwelled inside of the man Christ, Amen...
thediciple2011 2 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@sbgrox11
What exactly do you mean when you say Christ is not God?
lchiddle 7 months ago
@sbgrox11
I've heard it all and I've done the research, you're not telling me anything new. Perhaps you should look at both sides of the argument without any preconceptions and without an agenda except finding God's truth, rather than man's so called "truth".
As for responding to the video, I have a very long time ago. I am now just replying to your comments.
lchiddle 7 months ago
@sbgrox11
Where does the Bible disprove the Trinity?
lchiddle 7 months ago
@sbgrox11
Accepting Jesus as YOUR personal Lord and Savior goes far beyond simple doctrine, it is a way of life!
lchiddle 7 months ago
@sbgrox11
The word 'doctrine' is not exclusive to the Bible. The word means "A belief (or system of beliefs) accepted as authoritative by some group or school"
lchiddle 7 months ago
@sbgrox11
Eternal life does not rest on doctrines of any kind, but your acceptance of Jesus being your personal Lord and Savior.
lchiddle 7 months ago
@sbgrox11
The Trinity doctrine is only man's attempt to explain the teachings that are found throughout scripture. Nowhere in the Bible is the concept clearly explained in a single statement. But that being said it doesn't make the concept void from biblical truth. I can show you many many scriptures where elements of the concept are spoken of, and just because you maybe able to put a different "interpretation" on them, that doesn't excuse them as evidences for the Trinity concept.
[cont'd]
lchiddle 7 months ago
[cont'd]
By me proving the Trinity concept to you from the Bible does not make it so. Just as you "proving" your beliefs to me doesn't make them so. Now unless YOU can DISPROVE the doctrine as a biblical teaching, then every objection you have to the doctrine is really just white noise.
So I challenge YOU to DISPROVE the Trinity doctrine from the Bible.
lchiddle 7 months ago
@sbgrox11 I will end with this, God created all things truth included. Your understanding is of a worldly truth. I repeat I speak of Godly truth which is only received through His Spirit. God tells me what is true not the other way around. Man from the beginning has corrupted this truth, to where people like you say truth can be found in many areas apart from God. Many have taken your view and listened to satan, disguised as truth, or to what they thought was true, but had no Spirit. Peace.
MrTimeinabottle 7 months ago
@sbgrox11 My friend truth is of God not men. It is not gathered by our worldly understanding, but understanding given us by God. There are hundreds of thousands of doctrines of men. Yet one God, and one way to God the man Jesus Christ. You say truth can come from demons what truth is that?
MrTimeinabottle 7 months ago
@sbgrox11 You speak of men. I speak of God has not God made the wisdom of this world foolishness? "Russel was right" Yet God tells us not to follow false prophets yet you do. Did you follow Hitler to?
MrTimeinabottle 7 months ago
i know you are..and so am i. but what m saying is have to integrety to acurately represent the other side.
kopes13 9 months ago
@ewatchmandotcom im sure youd like others to do the same with your believes.
kopes13 9 months ago
@kopes13 I am always ready to make a reasoned defense of my faith, as the Bible exhorts. The fact is, the Trinity is indefensible. Most everyone knows that.
ewatchmandotcom 9 months ago
@ewatchmandotcom trinitariasn believe that jesus and the father are two different persons ..they are not the same. "so jesus didnt pray to himself ..HE PRAYED TO THE FATHER.. there is one eternal God but withing the being\essence of that one God there are three persons. makin relationship inherent whiting God himself. and since we are made in his image we also long for relationship:D so please accurately represent the believes you deny.
kopes13 9 months ago
you know robert i would ..but im pretty sure people have explained it to you in the past..yet you still continue to miss represent my faith.
kopes13 9 months ago
@kopes13 Yeah, sure LOL
ewatchmandotcom 9 months ago
you oviously dont understand the trinity
kopes13 9 months ago
@kopes13 Why don't you explain it? You would be the first person in the world to do so. LOL
ewatchmandotcom 9 months ago
@ewatchmandotcom the Trinity means this and only this and nothing more - "There were 3 entities that were not created." I won't give the 3 entities labels or names here, but that can be objectively done.
xamane5 4 months ago
@ewatchmandotcom one other point. When one talks about 'seeing' God or not, to have any meaning to this statement one has to define what they mean by 'see', and importantly not to change definitions sentence to sentence. 'Seeing' could mean 'comprehend / understand / consciously identify' or it could refer to 'photons exciting the retina and visual part of the brain'. These are different meanings. John 14:9 is the 1st meaning not the 2nd, John1:18 and Exodus is the 2nd meaning not the 1st etcetc
xamane5 4 months ago
Jesus performed miracles with the authority of himself, apostles done it in the name of Jesus Christ. Jesus is the authority of every miracle, made by him or by apostles. But he is the source. All glory and praise goes to God and no one else, otherwise it is idolatry - elevating creation over creator. But Jesus is praised and glorified. He is either God or source of heresy and huge lair. And none besides God and God only deserves glory. You either mock his salvation or become idolater.
qwaszasz 10 months ago
@qwaszasz You simply do not know the Scriptures. Jesus said that he did nothing of his own initiative, only his Father's will. Furthermore, Jesus stated that all authority had been given him. Jehovah gave him the power and authority he possess. Trinitarians have the amazing ability to see white and call it black, and vice-versa.
ewatchmandotcom 10 months ago
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for (ewatchmandotcom) you are an antichrist.
"WTS are False prophets" there is NO way AROUND THAT!!!!!
Oh wait I see "NEW LIGHT" nope thats "OLD LIGHT" Becomming new again and it just says
"WTS are False prophets" there is NO way AROUND THAT!!!!!
MaxsinIIII 1 year ago
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@ewatchmandotcom
i know you are an antichrist Why ???
"WTS are False prophets" there is NO way AROUND THAT!!!!!
Oh wait... "I SEE NEW LIGHT" and its brighter!!!!!!!
oh sorry it's "old light" becomming "new light" again and it says
"WTS are False prophets" there is NO way AROUND THAT!!!!!
MaxsinIIII 1 year ago
"WTS are False prophets" there is NO way AROUND THAT!!!!! drop the cult hand book and start by getting a real bible.
MaxsinIIII 1 year ago
does not want to accept the fact...the truth I meant
raqyrose 1 year ago
Trinitarian believers are the antichrist. Robert King, excellent video btw. I love all your videos and they made a lot of sense. I know some people on here does not accept the fact, the truth that trinitarians are the antichrist.
raqyrose 1 year ago
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@axsimulate I can glorify Jehovah and Jesus by refusing to be baited by fools like you.
ewatchmandotcom 9 months ago
Matthew 5:22
But whosoever shall say, thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.
MrTimeinabottle 1 year ago
Philippians 2:5-8
Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus; Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God; But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men; And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross. Where for God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name. (Immanuel) God with us.
MrTimeinabottle 1 year ago
@MrTimeinabottle This has got to be the dumbest translation of any verse. So, reading the context Paul was apparently exhorting the Phillippians to have the same attitude as Jesus and consider themselves to be God's equal too.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
Comment removed
MrTimeinabottle 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom I find it sad that you cannot understand a single verse. Let this mind be in you, also in Christ Jesus, (comma) desribing who it is we should follow for we are not to follow mere men. (But made himself.....) showing us we are to follow God through Jesus the man.
No my friend we are not to think of ourselves as God, but are to follow God through the life and teachings of Jesus the man.
For Jesus the man was God.
Take care.
MrTimeinabottle 1 year ago
@MrTimeinabottle The passage in the version you cited says that Christians should have the mind of Christ, who thought it not robbery that he should be equal to God. You don't even have the slightest clue what you are implying. So, according to the KJV Christians should consider themselves equal to God. Not even the NIV mutilates the verse as badly as the King James. If you are going to read the Bible you should at least use one that is not so poorly translated.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom I guess I should use your NWT, which your watchtower states as using a former catholc priest, who along with his wife a (spirit medium) got support for their translations.
Or lets look to what the founder of your watchtower stated in the july 1879 issue. "A truth presented by satan himself, is just as true as a truth stated by God. Accept truth wherever you find it no matter what it contradicts." I will stick with my translation, and not satan's.
MrTimeinabottle 1 year ago
I watched this video again... You are an OBVIOUS wolf in sheeps clothing. I would say a clueless dupe, but I believe you know exactly what you are doing.
DelusionTerminator 1 year ago
Hey buddy boy... You aren't fooling anyone who's done their homework, pal. You are the antichrist here. And reading from a JW bible (New World Translation) holds NO water with with me. A version of the bible written by FOUR JW's, only one of which even CLAIMED to be a Greek Scholar, and WASN'T. The agenda of the New World Translation is the same agenda Satan has been pursuing from the beginning. To deny the divinity of the Lord Yahshua, which is CLEARLY depicted in most all bibles before 1900.
DelusionTerminator 1 year ago
Saying that Christ is not God is Antichrist.
Kenbird1 1 year ago
@Kenbird1 Anyone saying Christ is God does not walk with the true God!
monteindamiddle7 1 year ago
i pray that the Lord will one day unveil your eyes...the only reason we can be saved is because God himself became a man and died for our sins and drank the cup of His own wrath!
elimelech12 1 year ago
JW are antichrist.
thorthor42 1 year ago
I found something interesting in Timothy 2:16-18, can you help me better explain how it may relate to possibly the Roman Catholic hierarchy, and other form of claims of following god's word, thanks :D
TheRevenantStudios 1 year ago
Robert, thank you for your video. Please explain the bible teaching on hell fire.
vulcan550 1 year ago
no you are
morrislyle1983 1 year ago
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Anyone who denies Jesus Christ is anti-christ.
1 John 2:22 Who is a liar but he that denieth the Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son
selec21 1 year ago
great teaching robert
lovelylady8998 1 year ago
In the Bible "seven" signifies divine completeness or perfection in connection with God's purposes. Genesis 2:1-4. The number "six" signifies imperfection, something not normal, monstrous.
In Revelation there is SEVEN SPIRITS, SEVEN GOLDEN LAMPSTANDS, SEVEN STARS, SEVEN SEALS, SEVEN TRUMPET BLASTS, SEVEN THUNDERS, and SEVEN GOLDEN BOWLS = 7.
Currently there are over 7 million people soon to be in number 7,777,777 (7x7) who are a witness about God's name J-E-H-O-V-A-H 7 letters!
Whois-GodDotcom
ReligionOrTruth 1 year ago
The correct wording for 1st John 5:6-8 is;
This is he that came by means of water and blood, Jesus Christ; not with the water only, but with the water and with the blood. And the spirit is that which is bearing witness, because the spirit is the truth. For there are three witness bearers, the spirit and the water and the blood, and the three are in agreement.
Visit: CanWeKnowDotcom and click on;
HOW CAN YOU CHOOSE A GOOD BIBLE TRANSLATION?
Whois-GodDotcom
ReligionOrTruth 1 year ago
1st John 5:7-8 "For there are three that bear witness in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit, and these three are one."
That passage is NOT authentic. Those words only appear in five later manuscripts and are not found in any of the earlier New Testament texts. That verse is such an obvious forgery that even staunch Trinitarian scholars have been forced to admit as much. Among them are the publishers of the New King James translation and various study bibles.
CanWeKnowDotcom
ReligionOrTruth 1 year ago
Hi, I am happy that you answered back my comment, the thing realy matters to me is 607bc, they changed the history in order to make it fit to their 1914 theory, I agree that the Jesus prophecy was about the future not the past as you said, How should I understand their falsehood on the dates? They even changed the time when Lamentation was written, and some of the kings' reign, as a truth seeker ,that matters to me, we look for truth not form the truth....
Lois1914 1 year ago
What many Trinitarians do throughout the Christian Greek Scriptures, is that they replace "God" with Father. So in this way, they can say nobody has seen the Father. Or, they say that there is a "personal" distinction instead of a distinction between beings when the Bible has phrases such as "God and Jesus."
Substituting "Father" for "God" is a huge difference made out of theological necessity.
IvanDefendingTruth 1 year ago
@IvanDefendingTruth
Can you show me a verse in which this was done?
ChadTheBerean 1 year ago
@ChadTheBerean Sure. 1 Timothy 5:21 is a good example of where Trinitarianism is forced to substitute "God" for "Father" out of theological necessity.
IvanDefendingTruth 1 year ago
@IvanDefendingTruth
"I charge you before God and the Lord Jesus Christ and the elect angels that you observe these things without prejudice, doing nothing with partiality."
KNJV
"I charge you, in the sight of God and Christ Jesus and the elect angels, to keep these instructions without partiality, and to do nothing out of favoritism."
NIV
"I solemnly charge you in the presence of God..."
NASB
Are these incorrect?
ChadTheBerean 1 year ago
@ChadTheBerean Let me rephrase what I meant. Trinitarians are forced to interpret the text in light of Trinitarianism rather than what the text actually says. For example in 1 Timothy 5:21 there's a distinction between God, Jehovah and Jesus Christ. Clearly two different entities and beings. However, in Trinitarianism these are merely two distinct "persons" in the "godhead."
That is what I meant by substituting "Father" for "God."
IvanDefendingTruth 1 year ago
@IvanDefendingTruth
I see. No worries.
ChadTheBerean 1 year ago
@ChadTheBerean There should be worries. This is a prime example of one's theology interpreting the text rather than letting God's Word speak for itself.
IvanDefendingTruth 1 year ago
@IvanDefendingTruth
I do not claim to believe in the Trinity. I do not hold a dogmatic view on it. If Jesus is not God, I am totally okay with that. If He is God, I am totally okay with that as well. One thing I know withh 100% certainty... He is my Savior.
ChadTheBerean 1 year ago
@ChadTheBerean How can he be one's Savior if one does not know who he is? I don't think that's possible.
IvanDefendingTruth 1 year ago
@IvanDefendingTruth
I do know who He is. He is the Son of God.
ChadTheBerean 1 year ago
@ChadTheBerean So are angels and Christians in the New Covenant, so that doesn't really prove much. Whether he's Jehovah incarnate or God's firstborn matters. It matters a lot. Because one of them is a false Christ which cannot offer true salvation and the other is the Scriptural Christ, the one who has sayings of everlasting life. Which ever one you accept as "Savior" is significant. I say that because ultimately, people's salvation may depend on this.
IvanDefendingTruth 1 year ago
@IvanDefendingTruth
Yes, the Scriptural Christ is God manifested in the flesh. I'm just saying that if the Scriptures taught that He wasn't God, I'd be okay with that. But they don't, they clearly teach that He is God.
ChadTheBerean 1 year ago
@ChadTheBerean Interesting, even though just 30 minutes ago you said "I do not claim to believe in the Trinity" and now 30 minutes later you do.
IvanDefendingTruth 1 year ago
@IvanDefendingTruth
No, I said I believe Jesus is God. I don't like the word "Trinity", it's not found in Scripture. Also, when I use the word Trinity, you JW's think I worship some 3 headed beast I call God.
I am currently studying the Scriptures regarding the idea of the Trinity, so as of right this second, I'm on the fence.
ChadTheBerean 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
Do you believe that God is omnipresent?
axsimulate 1 year ago
Robert, is it your conviction that it is consistent for a monotheistic Jew living in the first century, who woke up every morning reciting the Shema (Deut. 6:4), to refer to someone other than Jehovah (namely, an exalted angel) as "The Lord of me and the God of me?" (John 20:28, KIT)
entrsnm3 1 year ago
Precisely! Jehovah appointed his Son as the heir of all things. Jesus is to sit upon Jehovah's throne. He is not a competing deity. He temporarily will occupy the throne of God because Jehovah exalted his son to that position. It is God's will that all creatures in heaven on on earth obey his Son just as they would obey Jehovah. Disobey the Son and you disobey Jehovah. Jesus explained all that to the Jews. They didn't accept Jesus as Lord because they did not love Jesus' father who sent him.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
Robert, if you think Jesus is a competing deity then you really are clueless about the teaching that Jesus is God.
It's a shame how you regularly seem to fuse together the Watchtower's teaching that Jesus is a god, with the strangest misconception of what you think the trinity doctrine is. This wouldn't be such a problem if you had a heart to listen to what others believe, problem is you don't seem to care whether you misrepresent others as long as you can win the argument.
lchiddle 1 year ago
I have not stated that Jesus is a competing deity. I have said he is NOT a competing deity. Jesus is what he is because Jehovah has made him such.
As far as explaining the trinity, you are free to have at it. Stop whining and explain your version of the trinity.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
The fact is you imply that we believe he is a competing deity.
The basis of the trinity isn't very complicated. Jesus is the Word of God in flesh.
By the word of the Lord the heavens were made, and by the breath of his mouth all their host. - Psalm 33:6
...so shall my word be that goes out from my mouth; it shall not return to me empty, but it shall accomplish that which I purpose, and shall succeed in the thing for which I sent it. - Isaiah 55:11
lchiddle 1 year ago
I imply that trinitarians believe that Jesus is a competing deity with himself? You remind me of goofy pup chasing its tail. I hope you succeed in catching it.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned. The spiritual person judges all things, but is himself to be judged by no one. For who has understood the mind of the Lord so as to instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ. - 1 Corinthians 2:14-16
You mock me rather than prove what I say wrong.
lchiddle 1 year ago
You have got to be kidding, right? You are saying that the nonsensical trinity you espouse is a product of God's spirit? The burden is on you to prove it. Good luck with that. LOL
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
You don't even know what the trinity doctrine is, so how can you judge it?
All the proof is within the pages of the Bible. Your problem with interpreting scripture is you rely to on your own worldly wisdom.
Trust in the Lord with all your heart, and do not lean on your own understanding. In all your ways acknowledge him, and he will make straight your paths. Be not wise in your own eyes; fear the Lord, and turn away from evil. - Proverbs 3:5-7
lchiddle 1 year ago
And we have something more sure, the prophetic word, to which you will do well to pay attention as to a lamp shining in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts, knowing this first of all, that no prophecy of Scripture comes from someones own interpretation. For no prophecy was ever produced by the will of man, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit. - 2 Peter 1:19-21
lchiddle 1 year ago
Sure I know what the trinity doctrine is. It is nonsense. Unscriptural. Not a Bible teaching. But, like I say, if you believe it to be true than you are stuck with explaining it - not me. Why keeping whining that I misrepresent your trinity. Get out there man and proclaim the trinity. LOL
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
My life doesn't start and end around commenting on your misrepresentations. The trinity doctrine is not the forefront of the Gospel, but when opposition comes against it then I will defend it. Not because I am duty bound by my pastor, but because I am duty bound by the Word of God, because this teaching came to me through reading the Bible.
You say the doctrine it un-scriptural, PROVE IT.
I say Jesus is the Word of God and the Holy Spirit is his breath, PROVE ME WRONG.
lchiddle 1 year ago
Watch my videos. They debunk the trinity and other fundy nonsense.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
Far from it. The very reason I comment on your videos is not because you are debunking what I believe, but because you misrepresent what I believe. You don't seem to have a clue what we believe. Just who are you trying to convince? Yourself?
What you do is the equivalent to me debunking what you believe by saying you don't even believe in Jesus. Then I don't both to listen when you correct me. Who would I be trying to convince?
lchiddle 1 year ago
I've spent the time learning what it is you believe, the least you can do is return the compliment. I'm not asking you to agree with what we believe, but as long as you misrepresent what we teach then you are proving nothing but your own desire for ignorance.
lchiddle 1 year ago
Like I said, you are free to explain the trinity. If you think I have misrepresented it then you really should present what trinitarians really believe. Why don't you do up a video response and set the record straight? It would at the very least be entertaining.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
where are the apostles today? sleeping???
crudehauler 1 year ago
Yes.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
Also Robert, it is inconcievable that a perfect man would be decieved without Satan's overriding influence.
whathehadas 1 year ago
You must be a loner Mr. King since I don't think there are people out there who agree with you outside the WT. Unless you are still in and biting your tongue on restrictions which I don't think you are. This is a problem in my situation if I stay in
whathehadas 1 year ago
To be honest man I'm not interested in endorcing the trinity. But just as you argue that the 1914 doctrine is False........you say the Trinity is false also. these two doctrines are intregal for these two belief systems. This is quite a parodox and a double standard. P.S Robert, who are you associating with now?
whathehadas 1 year ago
Read Philippians 2 in a different translation. The NWT is a perverted and twisted translation.
ChadTheBerean 1 year ago
The NWT is a "perverted and twisted translation"? Really? On what basis do you make this assertion?
IvanDefendingTruth 1 year ago
@IvanDefendingTruth
Just read your Kingdom Interlinear. You'll see for yourself.
ChadTheBerean 1 year ago
@ChadTheBerean
While not perfect, the NWT is one of the better literal Bible translations. It is only your bias and ignorance that makes you think otherwise.
M.
mikepaulsummers 1 year ago
Robert, the central doctrine of Christianity is Jesus Christ resurrection, not that He is God. Where did you come up with that?
ChadTheBerean 1 year ago
The central doctrine of Christendom is the trinity. For example, anytime you see someone make a declaration of faith they always affirm their belief in the trinity.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
"The central doctrine of Christendom is the trinity"
Sorry Robert, but that a false statement. I could care less about the Trinity doctrine. The risen Christ is the center.
ChadTheBerean 1 year ago
No. It is a true statement. I am talking about what millions of deluded trinitarians believe. Not about your personal belief. The jesus-is-god doctrine has always been the centerpiece of churchianity.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
"The jesus-is-god doctrine has always been the centerpiece of churchianity"
So you admit that Jehovah Witness is not Christianity.
axsimulate 1 year ago
Man is their own Antichrist without Satan's influence. I wondered if all we are in now would not be with Satan not existing? But then I thought about how Satan a perfect angel could corrupt his self without a influencing force. So he goes then no bad influence but the thought of him once good turning himself into bad makes it as though he can always be created unless Jehovah stops the Badness in Angel or man which bbrings me to question, Why is wasn't like that in the first place?
whathehadas 1 year ago
Without Satan's over-riding influence it is inconceivable that anyone in their right mind would have ever come up with the nonsensical theology of the trinity.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
I was really making the point of there would be less confusion and misinterpretation if........there was direct statements in the bible. If Satan can use God's own word against him and use it to misdirect people and in the end destroy the majority. This creates a high percentage of lost lives in the end that boils down one bad decision made in the beginning by a pair of humans who decieved theirself along with help from Satan.
whathehadas 1 year ago
Philippians 2 "...but gave no consideration to a seizure..."
Wow, very strange wording in the NWT.
Most translations I've seen say, "...did not consider it robbery to be equal with God", which basically says Jesus is EQUAL with God because he didn't consider it to be stealing from God in being equal with God.
jrichard1977 1 year ago
Consider the context Richard. Paul is exhorting Christians to have the same attitude that Jesus had. If you accept the KJV then each Christian should strive to be God's equal. Obviously that is not what Paul was saying. Not even the NIV mutilates the verse the way the KJV has. check it out:
"Who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be grasped..."
Clearly, the NIV states that Jesus did not seek to be God's equal, even though being in natural like God.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
Your statements make no sense.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
Believing that Jesus is God equals denying that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh?
I have a better idea. How about this: Believing that Jesus pre-earthly nature was as Michael the Archangel equals denying that Jesus has come in the flesh!
Christians believe Jesus came in the flesh, but JWs believe Jesus didn't exist UNTIL he came in the flesh, since he was Michael before!
Am I misrepresenting the JWs when I say that they believe Jesus was Michael before he became human?
jrichard1977 1 year ago
Your statements do not make any sense.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom I just read my statements again. They make perfect sense. Please read them slow. I'm sorry if they sound like tongue twisters! :)
jrichard1977 1 year ago
@jrichard1977 Haha, they don't? What I'm saying is that the JWs are the ones who deny that Jesus came in the flesh.
JWs believe that Michael the Archangel came in the flesh. To them, it would appear that Jesus didn't come in the flesh. Does that make more sense?
jrichard1977 1 year ago
JW's believe that Jesus had a pre-human existence. He wasn't called Jesus, of course. He was the Word, God's chief angel, Michael. That entity forsook his place in heaven as God's preeminent son and became flesh. When Jesus was on the earth the spirit person he had previously been did not exist.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom Great. That is my understanding. Jesus did not come in the flesh, since he didn't exist before he came in the flesh.
According to JWs, Michael is the one who came in the flesh, which is the unbiblical view.
Christians, however, would say that Jesus HIMSELF came in the flesh.
jrichard1977 1 year ago
But Jesus did exist before. He just wasn't called Jesus. Jesus was the name given him when he was born in Bethlehem. Prior to that Jesus existed as a spirit.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@jrichard1977 OK, fair. Question: Was the nature of Jesus BEFORE he was born as a human the same as his nature AFTER he was born?
jrichard1977 1 year ago
Nope. Spirits and flesh are two different natures. Like Jesus said to Nicodemus: 'What is flesh is flesh and what is spirit is spirt.'
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
Another thing that annoys me is the "Son of God" label. This creates more problems cause if Jesus is the Son of God but then he is a god of the God which has created the sons of God through the son of god which makes them his sons. The God beget the son who begets the sons while creates the flesh brothers
whathehadas 1 year ago
In my opinion, All Jesus had to do to make it known that he is not his father was to simply state that without coming back with other statements that he and his father are the same. He should have just said "I am Jesus and My father who is the God is Jehovah." But thanks to these stupid languages and translations, we have this problem.
whathehadas 1 year ago
The problem is not languages or translations. The real problem is that the world is greatly influenced by a powerful creature whom Jesus said was a liar and murderer.
Of course, no one thinks they could possibly be under the spell of his lies, which is a secondary problem.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Why do people continue to believe that Jesus is God?? Because they believe what they hear from men and ignore what Jesus said about himself and his heavenly Father!
Will you LISTEN to Jesus???
John 4:21-24
John 14:28
John 20:17
Jesus accepted worship because he is a god in the sense of being divine, but he is NOT the Almighty Father.
I believe that Jesus died as a ransom sacrifice for our sins and is now a heavenly King because his Father exulted him.
Whois-GodDotcom
False-ReligionDotcom
ReligionOrTruth 1 year ago
@ReligionOrTruth
Why do people continue to believe that Jesus is God???
Read these from the KJV/NIV or NLT not NWT.
Isaiah 9:6
1 Timothy 3:16
Mark 10:18
John 10:30
John 1:1
John 1:14
These all back up the trinity.
axsimulate 1 year ago
Not one of those verses make any mention of three god's in one or anything remotely connected with a trinity. It does demonstrate, though, how easily some people are brainwashed by flimsy arguments and "proof."
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom\
Mark 10:18; And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God.
Do you believe Jesus is good or evil?
axsimulate 1 year ago
It is not a question of whether Jesus is good or evil. Jesus was crediting Jehovah as the source of his goodness. God is love, right? Does that mean that no one else in the universe expresses love? No, it means God is the personification of love. The man called Jesus "good teacher." But elsewhere Jesus said that what he taught was not his own. It was from his Father. So, neither did Jesus take credit for the things he taught nor did he accept worshipful accolades that belong to God.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
Sure it is, again I'll ask, do you believe Jesus is good?
axsimulate 1 year ago
Why do you care about my personal opinion as to whether Jesus is good?
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
Why do you refuse to answer the question?
axsimulate 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
You obviously wanted to share your personal opinion, other wise you wouldn't have posted a YouTube video. Did you not expect questions?
You wanted to share, share some more.
Do you believe Jesus is good?
axsimulate 1 year ago
@axsimulate Come on man. I have seen that card trick a dozen times before. Get some new material.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
Card trick? What card trick?
Come on, tell us, what are you afraid of? Do you believe Jesus is good? Yes or No. It can't get any easier than this.
I must say your doing a good job of evading. However, it is making you look bad.
You are making a good case for someone sitting on the fence to run away from you as fast as they can. Just the opposite of what your religion expects of you.
axsimulate 1 year ago
@axsimulate I called you hand. Give it up.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
Isn't that your duty as a Jehovah Witness, to talk about it and answer questions? To spread the Word? To offer Jehovah's salvation to all?
Maybe I'm sitting on the fence and your answer to my question will help me come to your cause. But yet you run and hide. Why? What are you afraid of?
If your not prepared to answer tough questions, then I suggest you quit plastering your opinion on YouTube for all to see.
axsimulate 1 year ago
@axsimulate Actually, no. I am not duty bound to answer your insincere questions. The apostle Paul specifically instructed us to turn down foolish and ignorant questions. So, that is what I am doing. Your question to me, as to whether in my opinion Jesus was good, can certainly be classified as a foolish question, born from your own ignorance and devious nature.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
I see it's you duty to spread FUD and when somebody questions it, you run from them.
How is my question whether is Jesus is good foolish? After all Jehovah Witnesses are Christians right? And Christianity is all about Jesus, right? It's a perfectly legit question, you should be able to answer it without hesitation, yet you run from it. Why? How is it possible one simple question has you running scared? Here is your chance to glorify Jehovah and his son Jesus.
axsimulate 1 year ago
@axsimulate I can glorify Jehovah and Jesus by refusing to be baited by fools like you.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
Oh, I see, calling me names now. Belittle those who disagree with you. Is this what Jehovah teaches? I'm sorry, I thought Jehovah taught love, kindness and understanding.
Guess what? As an ambassador to Jehovah. You just brought shame on Him, because you have shown your intolerance, judgement, evasiveness, lack of kindness and understanding. This is what people will see when they read your posts. Proof people should avoid this religion at all costs. Hide your head in the sand.
axsimulate 1 year ago
@axsimulate I smoked you out didn't I? LOL
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
Not at all. Since when did this start being a competition?
The really sad part of it all, is you don't even realize how bad you made yourself look to any that may read this blog.
You run away from my questions, then claim victory. How sleazy.
axsimulate 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
My question still stands for whenever you grow a pair and answer.
Do you believe Jesus is good.
What are you afraid of?
axsimulate 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
And to think I was having a conversation with a grown man. Guess I was wrong.
axsimulate 1 year ago
@axsimulate I am sure you are used to being wrong. Right? ;-)
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
At least I'm man enough to admit when I'm wrong.
Let me know when you finally grow a pair and answer my question.
axsimulate 1 year ago
@axsimulate you are such a child....here you are tell people to grow a pair of whoknowswhat and you call yourself a man. I always say, "When a stupid question is ask, why should there be an answer?" So why would he answers your quote to make a point that is put in a form of a question? You really are not sincere, but rather starting fight. Very very unchristian.
Lally980 1 year ago
@Lally980
Why not criticize him for calling me names?
He is the one that is not sincere, otherwise he wouldn't be running from my simple question.
What's so difficult about asking "Do you believe Jesus is good?"
A true Christian, Jewish or Muslim would answer without hesitation.
There is no such thing as a stupid question, only a stupid answer.
The truth is, he is running because his faith in his religion is a house of cards. Easily destroyed
Who said I was a Christian?
axsimulate 1 year ago
@axsimulate I thought you said you were sincere? Now you admit that you were not. You just are trying to bait me and I am not taking the bait. Now you are whining and pouting that I am not like other people who would go for the bait. You are not very smart man.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
Sincere? Who is being sincere and who is not? If you were sincere and open and truthful about your religion then you wouldn't be running from my question. And your running like a scared rabbit.
Your the one crying that I'm trying to trap you. Next you'll be crying "Persecution!" That is the modus operendi of religion.
If you are sincere about finding the truth, you would answer. But you can't handle the truth.
axsimulate 1 year ago
@axsimulate If you think I am scared of you or your silly questions you are delusional.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
Then why do you run?
Do you think Jesus is good?
Prove your not scared, answer the question.
axsimulate 1 year ago
@axsimulate I am not running. I told you already. I am not answering your foolish and ignorant questions. If you were sincere I would be more than happy to. It is just that I know it is a baited question. I been doing this a long time.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
Call it what you will, it doesn't change the fact that your running from it.
If you were truly honest with yourself you would answer it no matter the consequences. But you choose to hide behind your thinly veiled disguise. Your mendacious stance only affects you not me.
axsimulate 1 year ago
@axsimulate You obviously are greatly mentally challenged and cannot comprehend basic concepts. Or, if you do understand, then you are simply a dishonest person.
I will explain myself once again. I refuse to be baited by someone whose motives are as transparent as tissue paper. I answer people's questions all the time. However, I refuse to answer your stupid question.
And by the way, I do get the last word on this. From now on anything further from you goes straight into the trash. Get it?
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
LOL! your in complete denial! Admitting you have a problem is the first step to recovery.
axsimulate 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
John 10:30; I and my Father are one.
It don't get any clearer than that, and that is from the American Standard Version, you know, the original Jehovah Wittness Bible.
axsimulate 1 year ago
Sure, from that verse it is clear that Jehovah and Jesus are in union. JW's whole-heartedly believe that, without doubt. And at John 17:20 Jesus stated that his followers would eventually be one with them as well. Read it.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
Than why do you deny Jesus's divinity?
You just admitted to 2/3 of the Trinity.
The last 1/3 is the Word or (Holy Ghost/Spirit)
and John 1:14 proves the Word and Jesus are one.
That is if you read any Bible other than the NWT, even the original JW Bible don't change the wording.
axsimulate 1 year ago
Well, if all of Jesus' followers are going to be one with God and Jesus than that is a lot more than three. God is apparently made of of thousands and thousands of different deities. LOL
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
Funny you would mention that, that is precisely the direction that the Ancient Greeks were heading with their belief is their Gods with Zeus being the one true God. It is believed that is how Judaism evolved which is the basis for Christianity and Islam.
With that said, do you believe that Jesus and Jehovah are both Gods?
axsimulate 1 year ago
Comment removed
axsimulate 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
John 1:1; 1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
John 1:14; And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us (and we beheld his glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father), full of grace and truth.
Again this is from the original Jehovah Wittness Bible.
axsimulate 1 year ago
@ewatchmandotcom
Shall I keep going?
axsimulate 1 year ago
So there are many antichrists, I agree, but Robert, don't you think that when the World Government (via UN / 8th King) arrives, there will be a single, powerful human leader of that world empire (someone like Nimrod or Nebuchadnezzar) - that person would surely be THE ANTICHRIST?
mikepaulsummers 1 year ago
Yes. John referred to the coming antichrist (singular) and numerous antichrists that originated from within the congregation. The coming antichrist emerges as the man of lawlessness within the spiritual temple of God during the conclusion. That is ultimately what John was referring to when he wrote of the last hour.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
Second Edition
mikepaulsummers 1 year ago
Jesus had various bodies after being resurrected. I don't remember that being taught by the FDS. I'm gonna look that up. He appear in a different body with similar marks from being impaled just to appease one person. Thinking about this stuff is quite perplexing. You really have to imply stuff cause it is not black and white. This stuff sounds like SciFi
whathehadas 1 year ago
Actually, scifi stole their idea from the Bible. Creatures being teleported trough space and materializing from another dimension. That's Bible To clear up your confusion why not take the time to read the 4 Gospel accounts of Jesus post-resurrection appearances. It is only a few pages altogether.
You are certain to take note of the fact that on several occasions the disciples did not even recognize Jesus. He looked different each time he materialized. And yes, the WT teaches this very thing.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
No. You didn't quite get the message. Those who believe that Jesus was 100% flesh and !00% divine have been deceived by antichrists. If you teach such a doctrine you are an antichrist.
During Jesus time on earth he was a mere man. He had emptied himself of his divinity and became flesh. He was not a god/man. He was a godly man.
As for those resurrected in the spirit? Jesus is the only one raised in the spirit, so far anyway. That is why he is called the firstborn from the dead.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago
Jesus materialized various bodies on numerous occasions, all of them different from each other. Jesus materialized a body with wound marks because Thomas had declared that he would never believe unless he could see and feel the wounds. So, Jesus kindly accommodated him.
ewatchmandotcom 1 year ago